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What is Laremy Tunsil's worth in a trade?

steelbtexan said:
Per Adam Scheftner twitter

To Cincy

Texans- Trey Waynes/2022 2nd/2023 4th

Cincy- Tunsil/2023 4th

Thoughts
Click to expand...

like the draft picks…but trae Wayne’s has been injury prone and a bust…don’t see him playing a significant role in our future on defense despite his relatively young age.

I think this tells us where we are leaning draft wise tho…Neal/Ikewonu
 
Texian said:
Sounds like your boy The File Clerk got hosed once again.
Click to expand...
If there's any way this is correct then the defacto troll is right about this because getting only a 30-year-old defensive back along with what is nothing more than virtually an early 3rd round pick for Tunsil is a terrible deal for the Texans, and it really wouldn't be too far from a GM Bill O'Brien caliber type trade.
 
No trades until the new league year, I think 3/16. Rumor at best, although like I said nobody wants a lazy selfish guy who lacks toughness in the run game, isn’t a good locker room guy, isn’t a leader type and is entirely overrated and overpaid. Maybe another team can motivate him but for me he is a classic under-achiever. The injury and his lack of want-to to bust his butt to get back to the field was last straw for me. Uber-talented guy that doesn’t want it bad enough and his fake pro bowls don’t change that.

this team needs some surly, mean, dudes on that line looking to smash some people. All I see is finesse technique just trying to get in the way. When’s the last time this line really moved the opposing D and imposed their will on the opposition?
 
I haven't seen any comment on Tunsil's fit in an o-line coached by George Warhop. I've heard numerous commentary on 610 that unless a player can play a physical brand of ball, then that player can't play on a Warhop line. This is going to be a drastic shift in the Texans style of play we can expect to see, but to the present point, does this describe Tunsil's play?

I'm not up on "cap space", but what I gather, the Texans don't have much available currently. A quick google says Tunsil has a cap hit of a bit more than $26M, so trading Tunsil would help. Correct?

Another question I heard asked was who, currently on the roster, could be coached up to play a physical game. Heck was mentioned as the most likely. If Howard could make the transition, and this is still questionable, then this is another factor making a Tunsil trade more favorable for the Texans.

So, over breakfast this morning, I was thinking what was the least I would take. Everyone is talking about 1st round picks, but I began thinking, maybe a 2nd and a 3rd this year. And a 1st next year. And if I could wrangle it, another 2nd in 2024.

The point is, with the hiring of Warhop and the change in offensive line blocking this will bring, Tunsil doesn't look like a good fit and should be traded. If we can get a 1st in this year's draft, great. But we need to approach this realistically and get what we can. So what's the least we can accept in trade for Tunsil?

(Dang, I wish auto correct would stop changing Warhop to Warhol. It just did it again. Hope I got them all fixed)
 
Number19 said:
I haven't seen any comment on Tunsil's fit in an o-line coached by George Warhop. I've heard numerous commentary on 610 that unless a player can play a physical brand of ball, then that player can't play on a Warhop line. This is going to be a drastic shift in the Texans style of play we can expect to see, but to the present point, does this describe Tunsil's play?

I'm not up on "cap space", but what I gather, the Texans don't have much available currently. A quick google says Tunsil has a cap hit of a bit more than $26M, so trading Tunsil would help. Correct?

Another question I heard asked was who, currently on the roster, could be coached up to play a physical game. Heck was mentioned as the most likely. If Howard could make the transition, and this is still questionable, then this is another factor making a Tunsil trade more favorable for the Texans.

So, over breakfast this morning, I was thinking what was the least I would take. Everyone is talking about 1st round picks, but I began thinking, maybe a 2nd and a 3rd this year. And a 1st next year. And if I could wrangle it, another 2nd in 2024.

The point is, with the hiring of Warhop and the change in offensive line blocking this will bring, Tunsil doesn't look like a good fit and should be traded. If we can get a 1st in this year's draft, great. But we need to approach this realistically and get what we can. So what's the least we can accept in trade for Tunsil?

(Dang, I wish auto correct would stop changing Warhop to Warhol. It just did it again. Hope I got them all fixed)
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I’m onboard with Warhop (name didn’t change to Warhol Which in turn didnt change to Warhop). The ZBS scheme is just too much finesse for me And it would seem to me to add another obstacle to shift players along the line.
 
Porky said:
No trades until the new league year, I think 3/16. Rumor at best, although like I said nobody wants a lazy selfish guy who lacks toughness in the run game, isn’t a good locker room guy, isn’t a leader type and is entirely overrated and overpaid. Maybe another team can motivate him but for me he is a classic under-achiever. The injury and his lack of want-to to bust his butt to get back to the field was last straw for me. Uber-talented guy that doesn’t want it bad enough and his fake pro bowls don’t change that.

this team needs some surly, mean, dudes on that line looking to smash some people. All I see is finesse technique just trying to get in the way. When’s the last time this line really moved the opposing D and imposed their will on the opposition?
Click to expand...
Clarification NFL trades can be made before March 16 but not official until Commish signs off.
 
Porky said:
No trades until the new league year, I think 3/16. Rumor at best, although like I said nobody wants a lazy selfish guy who lacks toughness in the run game, isn’t a good locker room guy, isn’t a leader type and is entirely overrated and overpaid. Maybe another team can motivate him but for me he is a classic under-achiever. The injury and his lack of want-to to bust his butt to get back to the field was last straw for me. Uber-talented guy that doesn’t want it bad enough and his fake pro bowls don’t change that.

this team needs some surly, mean, dudes on that line looking to smash some people. All I see is finesse technique just trying to get in the way. When’s the last time this line really moved the opposing D and imposed their will on the opposition?
Click to expand...

How many fake pro bowls did Derrick go to?

The entire OL sucks, although Tunsil deserves 1/5 of the blame, he's the least of their OL issues. It's amazing to me he made pro bowls with the trash at LG and no TE worth a bleep at blocking next to him.
 
Number19 said:
I haven't seen any comment on Tunsil's fit in an o-line coached by George Warhop. I've heard numerous commentary on 610 that unless a player can play a physical brand of ball, then that player can't play on a Warhop line. This is going to be a drastic shift in the Texans style of play we can expect to see, but to the present point, does this describe Tunsil's play?

I'm not up on "cap space", but what I gather, the Texans don't have much available currently. A quick google says Tunsil has a cap hit of a bit more than $26M, so trading Tunsil would help. Correct?

Another question I heard asked was who, currently on the roster, could be coached up to play a physical game. Heck was mentioned as the most likely. If Howard could make the transition, and this is still questionable, then this is another factor making a Tunsil trade more favorable for the Texans.

So, over breakfast this morning, I was thinking what was the least I would take. Everyone is talking about 1st round picks, but I began thinking, maybe a 2nd and a 3rd this year. And a 1st next year. And if I could wrangle it, another 2nd in 2024.

The point is, with the hiring of Warhop and the change in offensive line blocking this will bring, Tunsil doesn't look like a good fit and should be traded. If we can get a 1st in this year's draft, great. But we need to approach this realistically and get what we can. So what's the least we can accept in trade for Tunsil?

(Dang, I wish auto correct would stop changing Warhop to Warhol. It just did it again. Hope I got them all fixed)
Click to expand...
Good thoughts! First Texans have ~ $17 million this season but $125 million in 2023 so contracts can be reworked if needed but I don't see why now. Trade offers $9.5 m cap space and removes his base of almost $18 m. I saw another article last night from a Dolphins fan that X Howard may stir up for more GTD $. Ross ok'd that for 2021 and agreed to open negotiations this off season. 1.19 and 2.50 is what I want for Tunsil and I'd "grudgingly" take X off their hands for Lonnie Johnson and Blacklock?

2nd I wished I knew more about how Warhop is going to do; his visit with Jags didn't impress me. If he is a true power coach I think Heck and maybe Howard could fit? Let's say War is that coach and is a true developer (big leap I know). That would most likely changes my view of draft. I now have Hamilton 1.3 but would switch to Okwonu whom I like and hope I could get either Green later or even better Charles Cross. I salivate at 1.3 Okwonu LG, Cross LT Green RG Heck RT.

For safety I'd go Lewis Cine or Daxton Hill round 2 and maybe both depending on trade surplus. Howard would look really good across from Tavierre Thomas.

Hope someone can convince me on Warhop.
 
steelbtexan said:
How many fake pro bowls did Derrick go to?

The entire OL sucks, although Tunsil deserves 1/5 of the blame, he's the least of their OL issues. It's amazing to me he made pro bowls with the trash at LG and no TE worth a bleep at blocking next to him.
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‘Watson deserved the pro bowl and accolades. Tunsil was living on his reputation. He isn’t the first fake pro bowler. We all know when a guy didn’t deserve the accolades. He is average and isn’t living up to his physical talent. If he wakes up and decides he wants to kick ass, I think he can. But I’m in favor of trading him and getting a lesser talent that is a mean dog. I remember the hogs in Washington. Average talent but they were mean and tenacious. Give me 5 of those guys and get rid of the prima donnas, the softies, and the rag dolls. This line needs a mean streak and some dawg pound mentality.

when your most talented guy acts like he can’t be bothered that’s a huge issue. As per usual we see this differently my friend. Have a good one.
 
Number19 said:
I haven't seen any comment on Tunsil's fit in an o-line coached by George Warhop. I've heard numerous commentary on 610 that unless a player can play a physical brand of ball, then that player can't play on a Warhop line. This is going to be a drastic shift in the Texans style of play we can expect to see, but to the present point, does this describe Tunsil's play?

I'm not up on "cap space", but what I gather, the Texans don't have much available currently. A quick google says Tunsil has a cap hit of a bit more than $26M, so trading Tunsil would help. Correct?

Another question I heard asked was who, currently on the roster, could be coached up to play a physical game. Heck was mentioned as the most likely. If Howard could make the transition, and this is still questionable, then this is another factor making a Tunsil trade more favorable for the Texans.

So, over breakfast this morning, I was thinking what was the least I would take. Everyone is talking about 1st round picks, but I began thinking, maybe a 2nd and a 3rd this year. And a 1st next year. And if I could wrangle it, another 2nd in 2024.

The point is, with the hiring of Warhop and the change in offensive line blocking this will bring, Tunsil doesn't look like a good fit and should be traded. If we can get a 1st in this year's draft, great. But we need to approach this realistically and get what we can. So what's the least we can accept in trade for Tunsil?

(Dang, I wish auto correct would stop changing Warhop to Warhol. It just did it again. Hope I got them all fixed)
Click to expand...

They need better players on the OL. They will never have a good OL with Howard/McCray/Britt/Scharping on it. Not saying Tunsil is the greatest, but he's by far the best OL they've got and if he wants to be here then Caserio should keep him. Yes he's expensive but you pay top dollar for pro bowl level guys. (The Texans need more of these type guys not less)

Yes they dont have alot of $$$$ to go after premier FA's, but they have enough cap room to sign 7-8 upgrades in FA. Looking at guys like RB's Mac/Jeff Wilson, TE's Mo Aliie Cox/Ross Dwelley WR James Washington and S Jabril Peppers/Malik Hooker. Caserio could probably sign all of these guys with the 11 mil he would save just by cutting Cannon/Murray. If he needed to cut a couple of more guys to make more cap space he has the ability to do it. No premier FA's want to play on Kirby to begin with at this time.

The cap space is only an issue to the bean counters on here that didn't like the Tunsil trade to begin with. (Dont be fooled by their rhetoric) We dont know if Tunsil didn't want to comeback from injury or if Caserio held him out to help the tank and keep him healthy for an offseason trade.

The only reason to trade Tunsil is if he truly doesn't wantto be here. I wouldn't accept less than whatever Caserio wants in trade for Tunsil. (We dont know what that is) It's not like they have to trade him because they're over the cap. In short unless Caserio can get what he wants for Tunsil he should hold onto Tunsil and draft his replacement at 1-3 this yr, train the guy up, hope Tunsil plays well next yr, improves his value back to what it should be with a full healthy season then in the2023 off season trade him so you can get full value for him. Ask Miami what happens to your OL when you trade a Pro Bowl LT, they've gone through 5 LT's and are still looking for their next LT that's even an above avg LT.

Just remember when you see the posters that say Howard can play LT, some of these same posters said Davenport was the LT of the future. So you should take that into account when reading their posts.
 
I'm really liking this rumor of Tunsil possibly going to Cincy for their 1/31 pick. Cincy has a serious need for a LT to keep Burrow from getting killed. They have the cap space to absorb his contract and who, at #31, could they draft who would be better? This trade would really make sense for both clubs. How much more than #31 could the Texans get? But this makes too much sense not to get it done.
 
steelbtexan said:
They need better players on the OL. They will never have a good OL with Howard/McCray/Britt/Scharping on it. Not saying Tunsil is the greatest, but he's by far the best OL they've got and if he wants to be here then Caserio should keep him. Yes he's expensive but you pay top dollar for pro bowl level guys. (The Texans need more of these type guys not less)

Yes they dont have alot of $$$$ to go after premier FA's, but they have enough cap room to sign 7-8 upgrades in FA. Looking at guys like RB's Mac/Jeff Wilson, TE's Mo Aliie Cox/Ross Dwelley WR James Washington and S Jabril Peppers/Malik Hooker. Caserio could probably sign all of these guys with the 11 mil he would save just by cutting Cannon/Murray. If he needed to cut a couple of more guys to make more cap space he has the ability to do it. No premier FA's want to play on Kirby to begin with at this time.

The cap space is only an issue to the bean counters on here that didn't like the Tunsil trade to begin with. (Dont be fooled by their rhetoric) We dont know if Tunsil didn't want to comeback from injury or if Caserio held him out to help the tank and keep him healthy for an offseason trade.

The only reason to trade Tunsil is if he truly doesn't wantto be here. I wouldn't accept less than whatever Caserio wants in trade for Tunsil. (We dont know what that is) It's not like they have to trade him because they're over the cap. In short unless Caserio can get what he wants for Tunsil he should hold onto Tunsil and draft his replacement at 1-3 this yr, train the guy up, hope Tunsil plays well next yr, improves his value back to what it should be with a full healthy season then in the2023 off season trade him so you can get full value for him. Ask Miami what happens to your OL when you trade a Pro Bowl LT, they've gone through 5 LT's and are still looking for their next LT that's even an above avg LT.

Just remember when you see the posters that say Howard can play LT, some of these same posters said Davenport was the LT of the future. So you should take that into account when reading their posts.
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I've been on board for just about everything you say. But since the hiring of Warhop and hearing his style of coaching and his preferences for the type of player he likes, I'm questioning whether he fits into Warhop's scheming. I've also heard it it reported that he, among others, are already watching film and evaluating the players already under contract. So we'll see what happens between now and the draft.
 
badboy said:
Good thoughts! First Texans have ~ $17 million this season but $125 million in 2023 so contracts can be reworked if needed but I don't see why now. Trade offers $9.5 m cap space and removes his base of almost $18 m. I saw another article last night from a Dolphins fan that X Howard may stir up for more GTD $. Ross ok'd that for 2021 and agreed to open negotiations this off season. 1.19 and 2.50 is what I want for Tunsil and I'd "grudgingly" take X off their hands for Lonnie Johnson and Blacklock?

2nd I wished I knew more about how Warhop is going to do; his visit with Jags didn't impress me. If he is a true power coach I think Heck and maybe Howard could fit? Let's say War is that coach and is a true developer (big leap I know). That would most likely changes my view of draft. I now have Hamilton 1.3 but would switch to Okwonu whom I like and hope I could get either Green later or even better Charles Cross. I salivate at 1.3 Okwonu LG, Cross LT Green RG Heck RT.

For safety I'd go Lewis Cine or Daxton Hill round 2 and maybe both depending on trade surplus. Howard would look really good across from Tavierre Thomas.

Hope someone can convince me on Warhop.
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I would love to add X. Howard.

We all would like to add that much OL talent in this draft. Tell me how you're going to get three 1st rd picks in this draft to be able to add Ikwonu (Top 5) Cross (Top 10) Green (Top 20) in one draft?

With this said, I would give up my entire draft to draft these guys, then add FA skill position guys and a couple of S also in FA. (The cap space would definitely be there after trading Tunsil) The defense would suck but I would work on that in the 2023 offseason after a solid foundation was built with an OL like this. I dont think it will ever happen but I like the out of the box thinking

Just to give you an idea of what the team would look like if these trades/FA signings were to happen.

QB- Mills
RB's- Jeff Wilson/Marlon Mack/Burkhead/UDFA
WR's- Cooks/Collins/James Washington/Amendola/Camp/UDFA
TE's Allie Cox- Jordan- Dwelley
LT- Cross- Christian
LG- Ikwonu- Taylor
C- Britt- Morrisey
RG- Green- McCray
RT- Heck- Steckler

DE- Greenard-Rivers-Harris
DT- Collins- Dwumfour
DT- Lopez- Taylor
DE- Kingsley- Jenkins- RonDell Carter-Chris Smith
SLB- KGH- Louis Pierre
MLB- Kirksey- Wilson
WLB- Hewitt- Wallow
LCB- Howard-Mitchell-Tremon Smith
Nickle CB - Thomas- Moreland
SS- Peppers- AJ Moore
FS- Hooker- Brooks

If you needed to create cap space you could Cut guys like Jenkins/Pierre-Louis/Moreland/Mitchell and go with UDFA as depth pieces.

The offense would be much better and you could work on the defense in the 2023 draft/FA. When the Mercilus/Cunningham contracts come off of the books and after Trading Tunsil there should be plenty of cap space available to rebuild the defense and add depth.

I'm not saying this is what I would do, but there's definitely a case to be made for this. If we're throwing out wild crazy things that will never happen, like most of the crazy trade scenario's that have been thrown out there.
 
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badboy said:
yeah if I get a vet I want him around a while.
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I wouldn’t have a problem with it if the payout/cap hit is within range of his performance. If I’ve got 2 years to decide if I want to extend him, or could move on after one year, I’m ok with that.

but in Wayne’s case, hearing he may be a cap casualty, I don’t think I’d value him as high as a 2nd/3rd round pick. So you’re basically getting a 2nd, 3rd, & 4th/5th for Tunsil.

I’d do it.
 
Number19 said:
I've been on board for just about everything you say. But since the hiring of Warhop and hearing his style of coaching and his preferences for the type of player he likes, I'm questioning whether he fits into Warhop's scheming. I've also heard it it reported that he, among others, are already watching film and evaluating the players already under contract. So we'll see what happens between now and the draft.
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We will see what Caserio/Lovie/Warhop thinks.

Read my Badboy type solution above.

This could happen. Adding an extra 2nd by trading down to 5 for Ikwonu.

Trading #31 and two 2nds to move up to say Cross fell to 10-12. Trade the extra 3's (I'm trying to trade Howard for an extra 3rd. and the rest of the draft for the 20-25 pick for Green. You might have to trade a future 2nd/4th to make this happen.
 
Porky said:
‘Watson deserved the pro bowl and accolades. Tunsil was living on his reputation. He isn’t the first fake pro bowler. We all know when a guy didn’t deserve the accolades. He is average and isn’t living up to his physical talent. If he wakes up and decides he wants to kick ass, I think he can. But I’m in favor of trading him and getting a lesser talent that is a mean dog. I remember the hogs in Washington. Average talent but they were mean and tenacious. Give me 5 of those guys and get rid of the prima donnas, the softies, and the rag dolls. This line needs a mean streak and some dawg pound mentality.

when your most talented guy acts like he can’t be bothered that’s a huge issue. As per usual we see this differently my friend. Have a good one.
Click to expand...

Watson deserving a pro bowl and Tunsil not deserving a pro bowl is one mans opinion. Speaking of making a pro bowl, How do you make your 1st pro bowl off of reputation? I could see getting a 2nd pro bowl nod but not the 1st off of reputation. Although I thought the2nd pro bowl nod was deserved also.
 
steelbtexan said:
I would love to add X. Howard.

We all would like to add that much OL talent in this draft. Tell me how you're going to get three 1st rd picks in this draft to be able to add Ikwonu (Top 5) Cross (Top 10) Green (Top 20) in one draft?

With this said, I would give up my entire draft to draft these guys, then add FA skill position guys and a couple of S also in FA. (The cap space would definitely be there after trading Tunsil) The defense would suck but I would work on that in the 2023 offseason after a solid foundation was built with an OL like this. I dont think it will ever happen but I like the out of the box thinking

Just to give you an idea of what the team would look like if these trades/FA signings were to happen.

QB- Mills
RB's- Jeff Wilson/Marlon Mack/Burkhead/UDFA
WR's- Cooks/Collins/James Washington/Amendola/Camp/UDFA
TE's Allie Cox- Jordan- Dwelley
LT- Cross- Christian
LG- Ikwonu- Taylor
C- Britt- Morrisey
RG- Green- McCray
RT- Heck- Steckler

DE- Greenard-Rivers-Harris
DT- Collins- Dwumfour
DT- Lopez- Taylor
DE- Kingsley- Jenkins- RonDell Carter-Chris Smith
SLB- KGH- Louis Pierre
MLB- Kirksey- Wilson
WLB- Hewitt- Wallow
LCB- Howard-Mitchell-Tremon Smith
Nickle CB - Thomas- Moreland
SS- Peppers- AJ Moore
FS- Hooker- Brooks

If you needed to create cap space you could Cut guys like Jenkins/Pierre-Louis/Moreland/Mitchell and go with UDFA as depth pieces.

The offense would be much better and you could work on the defense in the 2023 draft/FA. When the Mercilus/Cunningham contracts come off of the books and after Trading Tunsil there should be plenty of cap space available to rebuild the defense and add depth.

I'm not saying this is what I would do, but there's definitely a case to be made for this. If we're throwing out wild crazy things that will never happen, like most of the crazy trade scenario's that have been thrown out there.
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The thing is, we don't have to go crazy with impossible scenarios. This draft is developing into a deep draft with good talent at the offensive positions the Texans need to target. With one or two smart moves trading down, which is intirely reasonable, we can still land one , or maybe two, elite players, and several more almost as good, in the 1st and 2nd rounds. Then in the 3rd round add quality skill players. I've been saying for the past two months that addressing the defense could be postponed until the 2023 draft, but even so, I think we could still add some defensive help on the second and third day. I really like the potential of this draft.
 
Number19 said:
The thing is, we don't have to go crazy with impossible scenarios. This draft is developing into a deep draft with good talent at the offensive positions the Texans need to target. With one or two smart moves trading down, which is intirely reasonable, we can still land one , or maybe two, elite players, and several more almost as good, in the 1st and 2nd rounds. Then in the 3rd round add quality skill players. I've been saying for the past two months that addressing the defense could be postponed until the 2023 draft, but even so, I think we could still add some defensive help on the second and third day. I really like the potential of this draft.
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I'm all about getting as many great players as possible. I just threw out an avenue to get 3 of the best players in this draft.

I would be so happy if Caserio comes out of this draft with

Neal/Hamilton/Gardner/Hutch/Thibs

Pickens/Watson/Metchie/Best edge/best CB

Salyer/TylerSmith/Kinnard/Pierce
 
Number19 said:
I'm really liking this rumor of Tunsil possibly going to Cincy for their 1/31 pick. Cincy has a serious need for a LT to keep Burrow from getting killed. They have the cap space to absorb his contract and who, at #31, could they draft who would be better? This trade would really make sense for both clubs. How much more than #31 could the Texans get? But this makes too much sense not to get it done.
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I don't see a pic 31 mentioned in the original tweet which turned out to be a fake. It was for a cornerback, a 2022 second-round pick and a 2023 pick for tunsil and a fourth-rounder in the future.
 
thunderkyss said:
I wouldn’t have a problem with it if the payout/cap hit is within range of his performance. If I’ve got 2 years to decide if I want to extend him, or could move on after one year, I’m ok with that.

but in Wayne’s case, hearing he may be a cap casualty, I don’t think I’d value him as high as a 2nd/3rd round pick. So you’re basically getting a 2nd, 3rd, & 4th/5th for Tunsil.

I’d do it.
Click to expand...
To clarify you would not be getting that second, third, fourth/ fifth in this draft.
 
Number19 said:
The thing is, we don't have to go crazy with impossible scenarios. This draft is developing into a deep draft with good talent at the offensive positions the Texans need to target. With one or two smart moves trading down, which is intirely reasonable, we can still land one , or maybe two, elite players, and several more almost as good, in the 1st and 2nd rounds. Then in the 3rd round add quality skill players. I've been saying for the past two months that addressing the defense could be postponed until the 2023 draft, but even so, I think we could still add some defensive help on the second and third day. I really like the potential of this draft.
Click to expand...
1.1 Jags Hutch
1.2 Lions Thib
1.3 Denver Pickett
for 9+40+64
1.4 NYJ Hamilton
1.5 NYG Neal
1.6 Panthers 2nd best QB
1.7 NYG Linderbaum
1.8 Falcons Karlaftis
1.9 Texans Okwonu
1.10 NYJ Stingley
1.11 Wash 3rd QB
1.12 Vikings Gardner
1.13 Texans Cross=

2.40+2.50[Tunsil]+2.64

Texans 1.15 Green for 1.29 +3.68 +3.80

2.37 ours Safety Lewis Cine
Round 4 best RB
 
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badboy said:
I don't see a pic 31 mentioned in the original tweet which turned out to be a fake. It was for a cornerback, a 2022 second-round pick and a 2023 pick for tunsil and a fourth-rounder in the future.
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Not referring to the tweet, but the discussion in the media whether a trade is advantageous to all parties.
 
The Bengals would be a prime destination for Tunsil b/c they’re not going to get that type of LT talent at the 31 spot and they’re just coming off a SB visit where once again their OL was okay but still got their QB killed. The Bengals window is wide open, now! They’re a young team that could enjoy that open window ride for a good period of time, but if they want to see that window slam shut just as fast as it opened…keep getting Burrow hit like that and his potential injuries could prematurely end what had looked so promising.

The Eagles could come knocking as well since they’ve decided to stay the course with Hurts and giving him a better LT, if available might be difficult to pass up. The have the assets to obtain Tunsil without sacrificing all their RD1 capital….that in itself could make it hard not to invest. The Eagles are building as well, but they got close to making the playoffs last season which means Tunsil would represent a veteran plug-n-play trade while they use rest of that draft capital to fill holes. Eagles could get a Wild Card spot next season with Tunsil and 2 or 3 hits in the draft.

For Caserio, having at least 2 teams bidding for Tunsil’s services could certainly sweeten the return potential.
 
ArlingtonTexan said:
bleacherreport.com

Top Potential NFL Trade Packages, Landing Spots for Texans LT Laremy Tunsil

In consecutive years, one of the biggest offseason transactions may involve a two-time Pro Bowl tackle. In April, the Baltimore Ravens received a package of draft picks for Orlando ...
bleacherreport.com bleacherreport.com

more trade spitballing
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Mentions Cincinnati as the most logical trade destination. If Warhop, after watching film, thinks Tunsil will fit on his o-line, then obviously no trade. But otherwise, a trade with Cincy seems a no brainer.
 
OptimisticTexan said:
The Bengals would be a prime destination for Tunsil b/c they’re not going to get that type of LT talent at the 31 spot and they’re just coming off a SB visit where once again their OL was okay but still got their QB killed. The Bengals window is wide open, now! They’re a young team that could enjoy that open window ride for a good period of time, but if they want to see that window slam shut just as fast as it opened…keep getting Burrow hit like that and his potential injuries could prematurely end what had looked so promising.

The Eagles could come knocking as well since they’ve decided to stay the course with Hurts and giving him a better LT, if available might be difficult to pass up. The have the assets to obtain Tunsil without sacrificing all their RD1 capital….that in itself could make it hard not to invest. The Eagles are building as well, but they got close to making the playoffs last season which means Tunsil would represent a veteran plug-n-play trade while they use rest of that draft capital to fill holes. Eagles could get a Wild Card spot next season with Tunsil and 2 or 3 hits in the draft.

For Caserio, having at least 2 teams bidding for Tunsil’s services could certainly sweeten the return potential.
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For the Eagles to bring tinsel on board they have to do something with their current tackles. In a trade they would still eat 28 million dollars dead money for Lane Johnson and approximately 24 million for left tackle Mailata. Both have recently signed extensions.https://www.pff.com/news/nfl-eagles-sign-left-tackle-jordan-mailata-to-a-four-year-64-million-extension

Mailata 3rd best NFL per PFF 87%
 
Number19 said:
Mentions Cincinnati as the most logical trade destination. If Warhop, after watching film, thinks Tunsil will fit on his o-line, then obviously no trade. But otherwise, a trade with Cincy seems a no brainer.
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Still thinking about it but I don't think I would have made that trade for Orlando Brown
 
badboy said:
Good thoughts! First Texans have ~ $17 million this season but $125 million in 2023 so contracts can be reworked if needed but I don't see why now. Trade offers $9.5 m cap space and removes his base of almost $18 m. I saw another article last night from a Dolphins fan that X Howard may stir up for more GTD $. Ross ok'd that for 2021 and agreed to open negotiations this off season. 1.19 and 2.50 is what I want for Tunsil and I'd "grudgingly" take X off their hands for Lonnie Johnson and Blacklock?

2nd I wished I knew more about how Warhop is going to do; his visit with Jags didn't impress me. If he is a true power coach I think Heck and maybe Howard could fit? Let's say War is that coach and is a true developer (big leap I know). That would most likely changes my view of draft. I now have Hamilton 1.3 but would switch to Okwonu whom I like and hope I could get either Green later or even better Charles Cross. I salivate at 1.3 Okwonu LG, Cross LT Green RG Heck RT.

For safety I'd go Lewis Cine or Daxton Hill round 2 and maybe both depending on trade surplus. Howard would look really good across from Tavierre Thomas.

Hope someone can convince me on Warhop.
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Just another thought after re-read: laremy tunsil base salary in a trade for Howard would allow a new contract for one of the best shutdown cornerbacks and still leave almost ten million dollars in cap space. That is very significant especially if we can get a draft pick or two.
 
badboy said:
Just another thought after re-read: laremy tunsil base salary in a trade for Howard would allow a new contract for one of the best shutdown cornerbacks and still leave almost ten million dollars in cap space. That is very significant especially if we can get a draft pick or two.
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Texans ended 2021 season with 28 players under contract in 2022. So you're going to sign an additional 25 players to fill out the roster with only $10 million? Let me know how that works out. BTW because Caserio restructured Tunsil's contract last year, trading Tunsil this year offers no salary relief. The dead money vs the salary is a wash.
 
Texian said:
Texans ended 2021 season with 28 players under contract in 2022. So you're going to sign an additional 25 players to fill out the roster with only $10 million? Let me know how that works out. BTW because Caserio restructured Tunsil's contract last year, trading Tunsil this year offers no salary relief. The dead money vs the salary is a wash.
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I heard that cutting Cannon/Murray/Jenkins/Mitchell I cant remember them all but you can listen to the Texans Cap podcast and trading Tunsil can create 49 mil in total cap space. So say Caserio has 49 mil and 22 roster spots to fill.

Say he fills 8 of these spots with draft picks and another 2 with UDFA's and this costs 10 mil. (This means you've got 32 roster spots filled) So now you've got 39 mil to fill 21 roster spots. Actually about 35 mil when you take into account money needed for the PS and injury replacements. But I dont think it will be that hard to fill 21 roster spots with 35 mil available. Will Caserio be able to go after top tier FA's? Nope, but none of those guys want to come to Kirby at this time anyways.

You can add guys like Mack/Wilson/Hooker/Dwelley/Allie Cox/Washington etc.. for the vet min. To make ends meet you may have to have say 5-6 UDFA ST's type guys to fill out the roster. Yes money will be tight but upgrading the roster is very doable. After next yr the cap will be cleaned and Caserio can be a player in FA. But knowing the McNair's history they never spend in FA anyways, so this wont matter.
 
Texian said:
Texans ended 2021 season with 28 players under contract in 2022. So you're going to sign an additional 25 players to fill out the roster with only $10 million? Let me know how that works out. BTW because Caserio restructured Tunsil's contract last year, trading Tunsil this year offers no salary relief. The dead money vs the salary is a wash.
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The cap savings would be additional $10<> plus we ended season with<> $18. Other moves like cutting Cannon $5 m.

My plan is to use trade for picks cheaper on cap and UDFAs. I see no reason to go for high price vets. Getting 3 time pri bowler Howard would be amazing and shut down his side of field.
 
badboy said:
...My plan is to use trade for picks cheaper on cap...
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This.

Driving back home from breakfast in town, I was thinking this had not been mentioned in the comments about trading down, and was going to mention this point.

Give us another month to see how things shake out on the big boards, but trading back to the 16 range saves a lot on the cap ... and we can still get, hopefully, OG Green and lots of extra picks in the 2nd and 3rd rounds.

Caserio will be earning his salary in this years draft.
 
steelbtexan said:
I heard that cutting Cannon/Murray/Jenkins/Mitchell I cant remember them all but you can listen to the Texans Cap podcast and trading Tunsil can create 49 mil in total cap space. So say Caserio has 49 mil and 22 roster spots to fill.

Say he fills 8 of these spots with draft picks and another 2 with UDFA's and this costs 10 mil. (This means you've got 32 roster spots filled) So now you've got 39 mil to fill 21 roster spots. Actually about 35 mil when you take into account money needed for the PS and injury replacements. But I dont think it will be that hard to fill 21 roster spots with 35 mil available. Will Caserio be able to go after top tier FA's? Nope, but none of those guys want to come to Kirby at this time anyways.

You can add guys like Mack/Wilson/Hooker/Dwelley/Allie Cox/Washington etc.. for the vet min. To make ends meet you may have to have say 5-6 UDFA ST's type guys to fill out the roster. Yes money will be tight but upgrading the roster is very doable. After next yr the cap will be cleaned and Caserio can be a player in FA. But knowing the McNair's history they never spend in FA anyways, so this wont matter.
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If you made those 4 to 5 cuts it would save about $14MM in cap space. (Something Caserio sould've done last year, would've saved $58MM last and added $0 dead money this year) but that is 4 to 5 more positions that have to be filled. Now approx 30. You're going to get your biggest cap savings when DeSaun is traded, Approx $18mm. Current space $18MM + $14MM players cut/traded (another $5MM if Cooks is traded) + $18MM trading DW4 will add up to approx $50MM - $55MM in available cap space.
 
Texian said:
If traded, salary is $17.8 vs dead money is $16.6 = Cap savings of $1.2
Laremy Tunsil Contract Breakdowns, Salary Cap Figures, Salaries, Bonuses | Spotrac
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Not how it works. The Texans are already paying the bonus allocation of $8.3 million in 2022. Whether Tunsil stays or goes. If he's traded prior to June 1st, they would also be on the hook for the 2023 allocation of $8.3 million. But, would not be on the hook for the $17.8 million salary. So the savings equals:

Cap Savings = 2022 Salary - 2023 Bonus Allocation
 
Lucky said:
Not how it works. The Texans are already paying the bonus allocation of $8.3 million in 2022. Whether Tunsil stays or goes. If he's traded prior to June 1st, they would also be on the hook for the 2023 allocation of $8.3 million. But, would not be on the hook for the $17.8 million salary. So the savings equals:

Cap Savings = 2022 Salary - 2023 Bonus Allocation
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When a player is cut or traded all signing and restructuring bonuses become due immediately as Dead Money. In the case of Tunsil that is $16.6MM. They no longer are spread over future years. Yes, some cost can be spread to the next year with a post June 1 trade, but why in the heck do you want to do that? That kind of fiscal irresponsibility and immaturity is what got you into this mess in the first place.
 
Texian said:
When a player is cut or traded all signing and restructuring bonuses become due immediately as Dead Money. In the case of Tunsil that is $16.6MM. They no longer are spread over future years. Yes, some cost can be spread to the next year with a post June 1 trade, but why in the heck do you want to do that? That kind of fiscal irresponsibility and immaturity is what got you into this mess in the first place.
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What? I'm not advocating anything. I didn't push this $$$ forward. I'm just explaining how the salary cap works. All the money other than Tunsil's salary has been spent. The only thing left is when it shows up on the books. Of the 2021 salary that was pushed forward, half is due this fiscal year, half next fiscal year. If Tunsil is traded by the draft, all of that money that was pushed forward is due this fiscal year. But....the Texans do not have to pay Tunsil's salary.

That's why trading Tunsil opens up some room on the cap. While also increasing the dead cap space. Both things can happen simultaneously.
 
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