PHILLYTEXANFAN
Saddle Up Partner
Houston was supposed to be a first rounder who stock fell due to a failed drug test at the combine IIRC.
Last edited:
Keep Texans Talk Google Ad Free!
Venmo Tip Jar | Paypal Tip Jar
Thanks for your support! 🍺😎👍
Selection 4.135: Tom Savage QB
- Thread starter pappy
- Start date
- Status
Houston was supposed to be a first rounder who stock fell due to a failed drug test at the combine IIRC.
Technically, the Texans traded down from 2/51 BEFORE moving back up later to 2/58 to take Tate.
Harris has worked out worse than Babin (something I didn't think possible).
Nix was a few weeks ago.
Tell me more about that history of moving up in drafts.
EllisUnit
Vote RED!!!
You just answered why we did not pick Houston then.
Don't get me wrong, most of that history is BAD, there just isn't much of it to go on. Babin is on Casserly. Smith's early rounds include only Harris and Nix. (as stated earlier, Tate was a trade back THEN up scenario).
PHILLYTEXANFAN
Saddle Up Partner
Oh , I know that was why. Roll the dice from time to time. Don't only draft good Ol boys. Some guys can change their lives and not be a "pacman Jones".
EllisUnit
Vote RED!!!
I agree but that is just how the texans have always been, we dont usually draft or sign people with character concerns/issues.
infantrycak
Hall of Fame
Or so the fan story goes. Cushing, Travis Johnson, Okoye, Jerome Mathis say otherwise.
Ole Miss Texan
Hall of Fame
I'm certain the Texans were not interested in Teddy or Manziel. Im sure the Seahawks called the Texans saying they were trading down, were we interested and we said nope we're good. If we really wanted Teddy, if we thought that highly of him the smart move would be to trade up regardless. The thought is he's a first round calibre talent that had immediate starting potential. Second fold due to being a 1st rounder we would have had an additional year option on his contract at 32 vs 33. That's worth it if he turns out to be a franchise QB (in this case for he Vikes).
Again I think that the Texans were not very interested in these 2 QBs (OB's words ring accurate that he doesn't see a lot of separation between the "top tiers")... AND I think there was so much talent in this draft that we got some "steals" considering where they were picked. The 50th ranked player in this draft could be considered comparable to a 30th ranked prospect in previous years - potentially.
Love these selections that were made instead of reaching for a QB need that OB or Smith werent overly excited about. Really looking forward to Savage developing
Technically, the Texans traded down from 2/51 BEFORE moving back up later to 2/58 to take Tate.
Harris has worked out worse than Babin (something I didn't think possible).
Nix was a few weeks ago.
Tell me more about that history of moving up in drafts.
I am not saying we did a good job at trading up. What I was saying is: when we had a guy we wanted, we made sure we get him by trading up. Now QB is clearly the most important position and we did not move up 1 space. That wouldn`t even have been that expensive. I think it is pretty clear, that we didn`t think highly enough of Bridgewater and he probably wouldn`t even have been our pick if he was there at #33.
Goldensilence
hipster elite
The moment Fitz signed, they knew they wouldn't have to rush a rookie to start. Either way it's looking Manziel or Bortles will not likely start and Bridgewater might have an outside shot at starting day one in Minn based on the way things are looking.
My guess is much like Pencilneck, I think Bortles was prolly number one QB on this staff's list and had he fallen more like Manziel they would've moved for him. If the were that high on Teddy they would've made a move to secure him. As it stands I am willing to bet even IF available they still pick Xavier top of second.
The good thing here is they don't have to start Savage day one and based on how the roster rounds out... I still think later in season they could be pushing for a playoff spot.
My guess is much like Pencilneck, I think Bortles was prolly number one QB on this staff's list and had he fallen more like Manziel they would've moved for him. If the were that high on Teddy they would've made a move to secure him. As it stands I am willing to bet even IF available they still pick Xavier top of second.
The good thing here is they don't have to start Savage day one and based on how the roster rounds out... I still think later in season they could be pushing for a playoff spot.
EllisUnit
Vote RED!!!
But these guys didnt have character issues before we drafted them did they ? I thought they all appeared after they were in the NFL.
infantrycak
Hall of Fame
There were rumors of Cushing using steroids since HS. TJ has several altercations in college as did Mathis with one or both even being arrested. Okoye was reported to have failed a drug test at the combine.
EllisUnit
Vote RED!!!
hmmm guess i missed all those, of course that is what 4 out of how many draftees....70-80 ?
infantrycak
Hall of Fame
Yeah, but 3 of them are 1st round draft picks. That's 3 out of 12. I'm not saying they are riverboat gamblers but I think the fan meme is a little off base.
I love Troy Aikman & don't mean to berate his legacy in any way.
But...
He had Mark Tuinei, Nate Newton, & Emmit Smith (not to mention or take anything away from Stepnowski, Gogan, & Williams). They'll make any QBs job a whole lot easier. Emmit may not have been as flashy as Barry Sanders, but he's the best closer the NFL has ever seen.
Babin.
I think more people would be upset if Bridgewater was there at 33 because I don't think the Texans were going to take him.
Honoring Earl 34
Something Witty !
Aikman and Terry Bradshaw are alike in they were on loaded teams . Judge them as you may but they had an advantage .
xtruroyaltyx
Hall of Fame
I think the texans would've taken him. I just don't think they were going to trade up for him.
& there was a reason Brady was a 6th, Romo & Arian went undrafted.
IMO, the only reason Savage was a 4th round pick was because he did that little college shuffle that had him sitting for two years. Schiano even as much as admitted that he probably should have stuck with Savage at Rutgers & this whole thing would have been avoided (maybe).
The kid looks good, for only having two years of starting under his belt. Kinda like that Bortles kid, or that Manziel kid both who went in the first round, neither, imo, look as ready to start as Savage.
Last edited:
If the Texans were interested in a QB at 1,1. he would've been drafted there. The name doesn't matter. GTFOI. Damn.
Post not directed at you.
The Pencil Neck
Hall of Fame
You mean, 4th.
dalemurphy
Hall of Fame
My point was that Aikman was NFL ready as a prospect. He could've come into almost any NFL situation and been successful. Of course the quality of the team around him mattered. I'm not arguing that Aikman was a greater pro QB than Bret Favre. My point is that Aikman was going to be a deadly accurate NFL QB with quite leadership and toughness in the pocket no matter who drafted him. Favre, on the other hand, would not have become the player he did if he was not traded from Atlanta to Green Bay, where he learned and developed under one of the greatest offensive coaching staffs ever assembled.
EllisUnit
Vote RED!!!
We assume he was the most NFL ready QB and we assume he would of been successful anywhere. We do not know that for sure, we have all seen MANY QBs who were NFL ready flop. Given Aikmans situation they to may have been very good, never know.
Aikman should have been cut after 8 games.
He was shut out in 3 games; reaching 50% completion in just one of those games, with 6 INTs.
He was 6-21 for 83 yards with 2 INTS in a 7-30 loss and 1-6 for 11 yards in a 13-20 loss.
No TD either.
In the 11th loss, he threw no TD and 4 INTs.
Talk about the opponents having game tape on him.
The guy regressed big time, LOL.
That guy can never be an NFL QB.
At least the Cowgirls won a game with Steve Waslh.
PHILLYTEXANFAN
Saddle Up Partner
Which WR do you guys think Savage will "gel" with first?
Mr teX
Hall of Fame
I believe so as well. People are making too much out of this potential trade up thingy...it was literally 1 spot before they were supposed to pick in the 2nd round. I think they called Seattle's bluff and they lost is all. I firmly believe however that if Teddy had been there at 32 they would've taken him...unless an offer they recieved blew them away.
beerlover
Hall of Fame
classic example of letting the draft come to you. pretty sure if Bridgewater had just used gloves during Louisville Pro Day this wouldn't even be close, which makes me wonder if Texans/O'Brian brought him in for a private workout? Does anyone know? If they didn't would suggest they took him off their board so why bother trading up?
Savage we know was worked out & on O'Brian radar for at least couple years. I'm a big Teddy fan & was willing to go with him #1 overall after his bowl game but the process really seemed to undermine his actual game film, then he may have simply been a victim of bad advisers recommendations. Despite all of Savages baggage moving around programs in the end he was all alone & stood out because of growth as person through hardship with plus size & strength for position.
Aikman wasn't a great QB. He was an average QB on a great team. Super Bowls put him in the HOF, which is a shame.you forgot something...
Troy Aikman
dalemurphy
Hall of Fame
He was a great QB (not an all-time great) but a below average fantasy QB, which injured his reputation as a great QB among fans... His numbers would have been much better in a different system with a lesser team. He is the most accurate intermediate passer in the history of the NFL.
dalemurphy
Hall of Fame
And, Aikman was fighting for his job his sophomore season... They were patient with Aikman, because he had all the tools to be a great QB, lacking only experience... If he had a limited arm, or lacked the measureables, the Cowboys would have moved on from him like the Texans have with Keenum.
dalemurphy
Hall of Fame
I'm saying that Aikman was an NFL-ready QB coming out of college... I'm not arguing whether or not he belongs in the HOF. My point is that those college QBs that have all the pieces in place entering the draft are few and far between... and, the Texans have never had the opportunity to grab one of them, despite the fact that they have had the 1st pick three times.
Ain't no fun speaking from hindsight. LOL.
What if we change name from Aikman to Russell the Giant.
Didn't he have a great arm and great measurables.
You're picking and choose stories to make your point.
Yes, a big arm is good.
Good measurables is an asset.
They don't necessarily make a good or great QB.
Sure, a QB may get a longer look due to measurables; doesn't mean it's the try and true formula.
Didn't Carr have the arm?
Didn't he have the measurables?
I'm not sure whether VY had a big arm or not, but he sure had the measurables?
What are you suggesting here?
EllisUnit
Vote RED!!!
I think what the conclusion here is that college stats, arm strength, size, what round you were drafted in means NOTHING in the NFL. People who have everything needed to succeed sometimes don't, and others who shouldn't make it sometimes thrive and go on to the HOF.
What we should all take from this is that nothing is a guarantee with any draft pick regardless of where they were picked or whom they played for.
What we should all take from this is that nothing is a guarantee with any draft pick regardless of where they were picked or whom they played for.
infantrycak
Hall of Fame
No, they mean the odds of success are greater and perhaps the leeway given but that there are no guarantees. Cherry picking some flukes like Brady does not render everything a crap shoot.
dalemurphy
Hall of Fame
I'm suggesting that if Keenum had the tools that those you mentioned (carr, vy), the organization would invest more of its time and resources towards his develop, just like the Texans did with Carr and the Titans did with Young... Since Keenum has huge question marks in the minds of every NFL GM, it is unlikely a team will be willing to commit to him in any role other than a backup QB.
Disagree.
Carr had all the tools but the Texans let him down. On many levels, they let him down. I'm not saying Carr would've been a superstar, but he could've been very good. Gets back to right player/right team/right coach thing.
What would P. Mannings career look like if he played for Marty Schottenhiemer? Probably still very good but maybe not GOAT level of good.
Except heart and brains.
Two very important requirements for that position.
Blake
MMQB
Agreed. While he was behind the 8 ball; Carr definitely did not care about being the best. He was the first to leave, and more interested in playing golf than studying his playbook.
Honoring Earl 34
Something Witty !
Yep ... physical tools .
No, it was because where they were drafted that teams invested more time in those first round QBs.
On the other hand, if you find a QB in a later round, the franchise can spend more resources, ie. Higher draft picks elsewhere.
It works both ways as an average.
The Pats haven't had to spend a first round draft picks for a long time now; they were able to afford the resources somewhere else.
It can be argued that because the Texans spent a number on Carr, they lacked the resources to find protection for him, up to a certain point.
infantrycak
Hall of Fame
No it cannot given the resources they expended to give him protection. It just didn't work out.
You probably know I never meant to argue that point; merely putting it out there.
In those 11 games (or whatever it was way back then) Aikman was sacked 19 times (like Keenum) but only gave up 155 sack yards. He wasn't running the wrong way like Keenum. (201 sack yards on 19 sacks).
Some guys have the gnads to play QB in the NFL. Some people should stay home & take care of their cats.
How often do you see more than one UDFA become stars on the same NFL team?
Remember Tony Romo? He came to the league as an UDFA. The Cowboys "knew" they had a star in the making. They groomed him for three years (similar to Case) then when he finally got his chance to play, he showed the league that he belonged.
He had made an instant connection with Jason Witten... but who wouldn't? Jason Witten can make almost any QB look competent by providing a big body, strong hands, & the ability to get up field quick, of course he is going to be a young QB's best friend.
Then Miles Austin blew up.
If I were Tom Savage & they've got me running with the second/third team, I'm going to find the "best" second/third team WRs & work, work, work. The goal is that we're going to blow the top off the league together.
I don't have a knack with cats.
With a different kind of cats, maybe.
& if the Texans picked up Keenum & found out he has the heart & the brains to be a champion, then his lack of size would mean even less. They would invest what they need to develop him.
So we'll see. I still think Fitz was brought in for Keenum to beat.
- Status