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Texans Offensive Line

Number19 said:
Won't know the playbook at all. He'll have one responsibility, keeping Highsmith or Watt away from CJ.
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Just let him know that the blocking playbook will be very simple....KISS. Make sure the man in front of you doesn't see the light of day of meeting CJ. Lineup a TE next to Christian to take some of the blitzes that would certainly be coming over the left side.
 
Number19 said:
Deculus hasn't been brought up from the PS.

The Texans have also signed Geron Christian to the PS who played LT for Texans in 2021. Playing in 14 games, starting 8, he had an excellant pass blocking grade of 78.8. With his long arms, he seems very good in pass blocking. Christian is the one I 'd like to see brought up and started at LT.
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Thanks for the info on Christian. Don’t know why but I just have no memory of him ever playing for the Texans.
 
If both Tunsil and Jones are ruled out, we don't have anyone else on the 53 to play LT, if Fant stays at RT. Deiter and Broeker are the only two OLmen remaining on the 53 and they are G/C's.

They may have to elevate off the PS both Deculus and new hire, Christian, one to start and one to be the swing tackle in reserve.

I goggled PS rules and players to be elevated are announced before they announce the inactives, 90 minutes before the start of the game.

It's just stats, but I took a look at Fant. He's actually been doing pretty good at RT. In the three games played, he's got a run block grade of 71.6 and a pass block grade of 74.4. He's given up 1 sack and 1 hit.

So if Fant remains at RT, we then have Mason, Patterson and Green2...and either Christian or Deculus at LT. I would prefer Christian because he's an excellant pass blocker (if he's in shape and has the rust knocked off).
 
Yeah, I say why shuffle the deck when the right side as been doing well...its now the left side of the line that needs tuning. And I still think we should keep it to quick 3 step drops, quick slants, and leave TE's in helping the Tackles out and Rb's in chipping anyone who beats their man
 
badboy said:
My understanding is Jones is out for the Steelers game.
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And mine. But is this official? Aaron Wilson's report has an update date of yesterday and does not mention Jones being out. If true, this would certainly impact his news story and the LT position for the Steelers' game. We may not have a definitive answer until game day. Frustrating.
 
sprtsfanatic said:
...Does anyone know whats up with Tunsil's knee?? As this team comes together I dont want to go thru another (hurt finger) fiasco from a few years ago w/ him...especially after giving him a new contract.
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What's been reported here on TT is he has swelling in his knee. I don't believe anything more has been reported.
 
Generic Fan said:
What do you guys think about Houston signing La'el Collins?
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I would have concerns. He's always been something of a headcase, surrounded by lots of drama, and on top of that, he's had injuries and health problems.

Although he played some at guard early in his career, he's mostly been an RT. At this point, that's not our big problem (knock on wood.)

I mean he fits our MO with his health issues, so we'll probably sign him, but I doubt he'd help fix anything.
 
The Pencil Neck said:
I would have concerns. He's always been something of a headcase, surrounded by lots of drama, and on top of that, he's had injuries and health problems.

Although he played some at guard early in his career, he's mostly been an RT. At this point, that's not our big problem (knock on wood.)

I mean he fits our MO with his health issues, so we'll probably sign him, but I doubt he'd help fix anything.
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talented headcase though...maybe a players coach, new team, and a veteran locker room could help...change of scenery could do him some good but idk if he plays anything other than RT. Talent wise probably better than Fant...question would be can fant play anywhere else on the line or would he become swing tackle now that we had a T go on the injury list.
 
sprtsfanatic said:
talented headcase though...maybe a players coach, new team, and a veteran locker room could help...change of scenery could do him some good but idk if he plays anything other than RT. Talent wise probably better than Fant...question would be can fant play anywhere else on the line or would he become swing tackle now that we had a T go on the injury list.
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Going to the Bengals didn't seem to help.
 
With KGreen2 going down today, is there a summary anywhere of when we might expect some of O-Linemen to return?
 
FireBOB said:
With KGreen2 going down today, is there a summary anywhere of when we might expect some of O-Linemen to return?
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Tytus is ready to go.
Juice is eligible to come off of IR
Jones sounded like he could almost play this week, so I expect he is back
Tunsil seems to be surprising folks, he actually practiced and had a knee setback
Deiter was suited up I think today, but thought he was banged up.
Anyway, likely three guys back. The way Bobby is doing game plans though, he is scheming around the O-line, but would be nice if he did not have to do that
 
Patterson had an efficient game; I'd give him a B-.
Taking into consideration that he's a rookie that hadn't seen much time with the one, that grade could be bumper up to a B+.

Shaq Mason is probably the best Olineman so far.
He's coming on with a good game.
B+
if not for that illegal downfield block, he could have gotten an A-
 
Fant was battling out there.
Especially considering how he had to go against TJ on a number of plays; that was probably as much as you can ask for.

With a good game plan and some nice variations of plays, Slowick really helped out his Olinemen, Fant included.

But CJ was the key.
His abiltity to maneuver the pocket and just getting the ball out quickly made a big difference.

A healthy Howard might (and should) be better than Fant

This offense can be even more dangerous when both OTs come back healthy.
I can't wait.
 
The PFF grades for our OL for the Steeler game:

Deculus.......PB 53.6.....RB 64.7
..............(38 snaps)
Christian.....PB 63.8.....RB 67.8
..............(33 snaps)
Morrissey....PB xxxx.....RB xxxx
Green2........PB 80.5.....RB 59.6
Patterson....PB 77.1.....RB 61.0
Mason.........PB 86.6.....RB 54.6
Fant.............PB 54.5.....RB 51.9

Run blocking is an obvious concern.

edit: fixed Morrissey/Green2 and Deculus/Christian....Morrissey played only 3 snaps
 
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Number19 said:
The PFF grades for our OL for the Steeler game:

Deculus.......PB 53.6.....RB 64.7
Morrissey....PB 73.8.....RB 60.0
Patterson....PB 77.1.....RB 61.0
Mason.........PB 86.6.....RB 54.6
Fant.............PB 54.5.....RB 51.9

Run blocking is an obvious concern.
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Something is wrong there.

Morrisey only played a few snaps.

Green 2 played most of the snaps at LG

Deculus and Christian split time at LT.

www.pro-football-reference.com

Pittsburgh Steelers at Houston Texans - October 1st, 2023 | Pro-Football-Reference.com

Pittsburgh Steelers 6 at Houston Texans 30 on October 1st, 2023 - Full team and player stats and box score
www.pro-football-reference.com www.pro-football-reference.com
 
76Texan said:
Something is wrong there.

Morrisey only played a few snaps.

Green 2 played most of the snaps at LG

Deculus and Christian split time at LT.

www.pro-football-reference.com

Pittsburgh Steelers at Houston Texans - October 1st, 2023 | Pro-Football-Reference.com

Pittsburgh Steelers 6 at Houston Texans 30 on October 1st, 2023 - Full team and player stats and box score
www.pro-football-reference.com www.pro-football-reference.com
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Yeh, Morrissey was announced on the TV as starting. I simply was not aware that he was replaced after only 3 snaps.

I've updated my post upthread.
 
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From my revised PFF grades upthread, Christian had been signed to the PS for, what, 3 or 4 days and, not by much, but his RB grade was higher than anyone else. And again not by much, but his PB grade was better than Deculus'.

Green2, another recent addition, performed decently in pass blocking. His run blocking was on par with the others - not good.
 
mussop said:
Exactly. Let’s examine that. Nick signed two players to big money from arguably the worst OLs of the last two or three years. He drafted an OG with a top 15 pick last year that was horrible all year. Instead of accepting he just wasn’t good he replaced the better (but not good) OG with a veteran who’s been absolutely horrible this year, so far. In a draft loaded with good Centers he traded into the second round, sending the 65, 188 and 230 overall picks for a guy who just a couple of years ago had major back surgery. Obviously he learned nothing from the Singltary pick. Then he traded a six round pick for the other Green who was horrible in Pittsburg. There’s spending a lot of money and draft capital smartly and then there’s what Nick has done the last couple of years. You’re right, injuries happen and we’re decimated by them right now. We will see eventually, hopefully, what we have but man these sure don’t look like good moves right now.
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Yet they hung 30 on the Steelers and haven't allowed a sack in 2 games.
 
Number19 said:
From my revised PFF grades upthread, Christian had been signed to the PS for, what, 3 or 4 days and, not by much, but his RB grade was higher than anyone else. And again not by much, but his PB grade was better than Deculus'.

Green2, another recent addition, performed decently in pass blocking. His run blocking was on par with the others - not good.
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Blocking is so difficult to "grade".

In the zone scheme, I would say only the coaches with a deep level of understanding of how the coaches on a certain team want the players to perform a certain task.

I remember watching Alex Gibbs once talking about how he came up with a new concept and so he taught his players to do certain thing(s) from the previous year.
It has something to do with how the lineman should take the first step on certain play(s).

In that regard alone, a Coach from another zone team, may watch the tape and say that "OK, this guy took a false step", but he didn't realize that Gibbs was wanting his guys to do things differently.

I had watched a number of his coaching tapes where Gibbs talked about how he continued to look for new ways to do things every year so he can get a leg up on the opponents.

I used to love watching/studying how the guys block in All22.

Some guys don't look good at times (sometimes down right ugly), but they can be quite efficient. They sacrificed their bodies to help make the play happen.
I call those guys warriors.

Especially in the zone scheme, how the guys work together (this include the TEs, the FBs, the RBs) can be difficult to measure.
The double team, for example, could be thought of as how the guys exchange the baton in a relay race.
How do you grade which guy is in the most optimum position at the point of exchange?

Then there’s the matter of game planning and play design.

Let's take for an example, to the max.
That the LT always get help from a TE, or a FB, or a RG, or even a G.
He has a very small possibility to look bad.

This is why I often said PFF grades are closer when looking at team performance rather than individuals.
 
Zbs depends on your center. Patterson is ok. Anyone with a pulse is better than quess. If you had positive from his play last year, please check your prescription. Watching him play I wanted nick Martin back.
 
So do we even have any o-linemen left that aren't injured? This is eventually going to catch up with us, and CJ. And the RBs.
 
sprtsfanatic said:
As for the Oline and the ? of where Scruggs goes when he comes back; I believe next to intelligence the biggest thing for a C is the ability to anchor. With Scruggs they had reported that his lateral movement wasnt the best but his ability to grab his defender and anchor was elite. That there was no bullrushing him and he would stonewall pressure up the front.

Patterson has played surprisingly well at C, but Scruggs had him beat at C during training camp and I have no reason to believe that when Juice comes back that that will not be the case again. Neither lack in intelligence.

IMHO Scruggs has the better ability to anchor and Patterson has the better lateral movement. Those are my reasons for wanting Juice at C and Patterson at LG.

In reality its a great and unexpected problem to have. Who would have thought that we would find a gem in the 6th round for the Oline?!? Either way when everyone gets back from injury and our Oline is set with the pieces we originally projected to start it will be far better off than the patchwork we have right now...and Im not taking anything away from the play we have gotten out of them for the last 2 games. It has been nothing short of amazing, but I will be happy to see the protection CJ gets and the holes that will open up for our Rb's by our starting Oline.

*** This probably should be in another thread but it was brought up a few responses up so I replied. If need be, please move to correct thread Mods. Thank you***
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It is amazing to probably have Scruggs and Patterson starting on rookie contracts. Usually, I would be leery of rookies on oline but I have confidence in both maturing with rookie Stroud.

Deculus as a backup at 63 % PFF doesn't scare me. I am leaning towards drafting a offensive guard.
 
Thorn said:
So do we even have any o-linemen left that aren't injured? This is eventually going to catch up with us, and CJ. And the RBs.
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Will it though?

Tunsil should be back in the next two games I would think.

Tytus will be back possibly next game or the following.

Scruggs is coming back in the next two weeks.

Jones is coming back in the next two weeks.

Mason and Patterson are good.

Kenyon and Kendrick Green are out for the year.

The next three games are Falcons, Saints, and Panthers.
 
Can someone explain the O-line to me? They have been playing really well these past two weeks - yet most of those guys are either career backups, really young or even fringe roster players. They also have no continuity with each other.

I was always under the impression, that there is a lot of skill/physique involved in these positions - a subpar lineman can benefit from a really good one next to him, but overall you get exposed easily, if you are a weak link. And I was under the impression, that these players need time to get comfortable with each other to really gel. Why is all this seemingly not true for our guys?

Is it the zone blocking? I remember back in the Kubiak days people saying stuff like „for a ZBS you don‘t really need to invest high draft picks.“ Well, if that is true and if the scheme is the reason for our recent success - why isn‘t everybody using a scheme like that, that isn‘t as reliant on high talented guys that you need to use high draft picks on and a big chunk of the cap space?
 
LikeMike said:
Can someone explain the O-line to me? They have been playing really well these past two weeks - yet most of those guys are either career backups, really young or even fringe roster players. They also have no continuity with each other.

I was always under the impression, that there is a lot of skill/physique involved in these positions - a subpar lineman can benefit from a really good one next to him, but overall you get exposed easily, if you are a weak link. And I was under the impression, that these players need time to get comfortable with each other to really gel. Why is all this seemingly not true for our guys?

Is it the zone blocking? I remember back in the Kubiak days people saying stuff like „for a ZBS you don‘t really need to invest high draft picks.“ Well, if that is true and if the scheme is the reason for our recent success - why isn‘t everybody using a scheme like that, that isn‘t as reliant on high talented guys that you need to use high draft picks on and a big chunk of the cap space?
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It's a mystery.

And some really good-assed coaching.

This coaching staff is taking players and putting them in positions to be successful. I don't know that we've ever seen that much before this. Instead of leaving Fant out there to get pants and embarrassed by TJ Watt, Slowick schemed up chips and help for him. They came up with plays where CJ could get the ball out quickly if and when he needed to so the line wouldn't have to hold up as long.

But, yeah, they've made guys like Kendrick Green look fairly decent even though he was a pariah at Pittsburgh. Before the game, all the Pittsburgh chatter was they were going to have a field day with DTs running over and past Kendrick Green, but after the game, they were saying things like, "Does our coaching staff suck? Was Kendrick Green actually a good player and we didn't know how to use him right?"

Like I said, it's a mystery.

I like it. Let's keep it going.
 
LikeMike said:
Can someone explain the O-line to me? They have been playing really well these past two weeks - yet most of those guys are either career backups, really young or even fringe roster players. They also have no continuity with each other.

I was always under the impression, that there is a lot of skill/physique involved in these positions - a subpar lineman can benefit from a really good one next to him, but overall you get exposed easily, if you are a weak link. And I was under the impression, that these players need time to get comfortable with each other to really gel. Why is all this seemingly not true for our guys?

Is it the zone blocking? I remember back in the Kubiak days people saying stuff like „for a ZBS you don‘t really need to invest high draft picks.“ Well, if that is true and if the scheme is the reason for our recent success - why isn‘t everybody using a scheme like that, that isn‘t as reliant on high talented guys that you need to use high draft picks on and a big chunk of the cap space?
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Lots of NFL team use the ZBS (including the Steelers).
What TPN said. On top of the individual coaching, it was also the scheme and Stroud's ability to maneuver the pocket and/or to get the ball out quickly that helped out the linemen.

And it was just one, two games.
We don't know how well that will hold up in the future.
 
I wonder if Titus Howard would feel better at his regular position at right tackle or safer at left guard next to tonsil?
 
sprtsfanatic said:
I would leave him at RT, he's was coming into his own there and just keep Fant as swing T
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Maybe when we have a LG, we lost our backup LG last week, so plopping Tytus there for now seems sane. When Scruggs comes back, should see how he can play LG at practice, and then maybe you move Tytus back out. Today they had the best five healthy guys playing in spots they know, and actually leaving three guys together who have been playing ok is also sound.
 
Rich Schmidt said:
Maybe when we have a LG, we lost our backup LG last week, so plopping Tytus there for now seems sane. When Scruggs comes back, should see how he can play LG at practice, and then maybe you move Tytus back out. Today they had the best five healthy guys playing in spots they know, and actually leaving three guys together who have been playing ok is also sound.
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When Scruggs comes back Id have patterson at LG, Scruggs at C, and Id prefer Tytus at RT. But in the meantime...we arent playing explosive DE's in the next couple of games so sure why not fill Tytus at LG until bodies recover....I guess...
 
Haven't heard anything about Nick Broeker.

Howard hasn't been activated to the 53, although could be later this week. I would think he needs a week or two.

A bit confusing that PS guard Morrissey, elevated on Sunday, came in after Green2 got injured, rather than Broeker.
 
TexansBull said:
Will it though?

Tunsil should be back in the next two games I would think.

Tytus will be back possibly next game or the following.

Scruggs is coming back in the next two weeks.

Jones is coming back in the next two weeks.

Mason and Patterson are good.

Kenyon and Kendrick Green are out for the year.

The next three games are Falcons, Saints, and Panthers.
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Both Greens are out for the year? Doesn't say much for our environmental movement.
 
Yes, he's been released from IR. He's now allowed to practice for 3 weeks without being activated to the 53. Of course he can be activated at any time. While on IR a player may not practice, so he has 4 weeks + of rust to knock off and get into playing shape.
 
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