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Nick Caserio - New GM

SnakeEyes

Under NRG
A bit of how we work the draft according to Nick C.

 

OptimisticTexan

2022 Rebuilding Block 2 / Go Texans
Yeah….I’d call it, “chumming the water” before the shark fest. Caserio is letting it be known before the draft that his 3rd pick is there for the taking…..of course, for the right price. Texans may have a good position based on how Thibodeaux, Hutchinson, or Neal are picked by the Jaguars and Lions.
 
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steelbtexan

King of the W. B. Club
Contributor's Club
If the over/under on the number of snaps Cannon gets in 2022 is this year's total (213), I'm taking the under.
I'm thinking 0

He's going to be a cap casualty. Saves 6 mil against the cap. That $$$$ will be better spent elsewhere. I would spend that money on De Earnest Johnson or Mack and Mo Allie Cox. Are these the type of cheaper young ascending FA's that you want Caserio to bring in?

They would be 2 starters added in FA. (Still looking for 1 more starter in FA)

Then hopefully add 4 starters in the draft including 2 difference makers.

I'm hoping for (Neal/Salyers/Pickens/Goodrich) Even if I have to trade pick #114 to get these guys. 3 difference makers and 1 guy that has a good chance to be a difference maker.
 
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steelbtexan

King of the W. B. Club
Contributor's Club
Should be. Should have never been traded for, too. But, he's a Friend of Jack. So all bets are off.
I had no problem trading a late pick swap for a starting RT. He got hurt, it happens. Luckily if he gets cut he will create the cap space that you seem to value so much. You should be happy, but for some reason I've got the feeling that you're not.

Possible starting level RT

Doesn't workout you save 6 mil

Win/Win
 

steelbtexan

King of the W. B. Club
Contributor's Club
I'm sorry, but it gets tiresome when you call Caserio's losses wins. It was a bad trade then. It's a bad trade now.
Injuries happen.

How is saving 6 mil on the cap a loss?

I'll tell you what's tiresome is the bean counters hard at work. All the while knowing no top tier FA's will be entering the doors on Kirby anytime sonn. Like within at least a couple of yrs. But I'm really looking forward to you explaining how trading for Cannon and his 6 mil cap space was a bad idea?
 

Lucky

Trust Me. I Know What I'm Doing.
Staff member
But I'm really looking forward to you explaining how trading for Cannon and his 6 mil cap space was a bad idea?
Really? I mean you have to be joking? I explained why this was a ridiculous move when it was made. And, I've been proven 100% correct.
The worst part is that Cannon was going to be cut. Belichick had already picked up Trent Brown. No way he was keeping a $7 million backup. And no one was paying Cannon $7 million on the open market. No one but the Texans, anyway.
Because Cannon was about to be cut.
I will disagree. One, he's a very old RT who is coming off a year's absence. Very, very few teams that would give him a starter's job + a starter's salary. Two, most teams would wait for him to be cut, then offer one of these lowball deals Caserio has been handing out for 2nd and 3rd stringers.

Three, I quoted an article that had sources close to Cannon that thought he would be cut.

Jack and Nick to the rescue! There were no other saviors.
The picks reported to be traded to New England in the Cannon deal were incorrect. These are the actual picks involved.


This trade just went from dumb to dumber.

From the same article:


Very favorably from New England's point of view? No kidding.
I don't know it for a fact. I just know that he would have signed with his best buddy Jack for the same money he got as a Patriot. Who else was going top offer a starting job to a 33 year old, oft injured RT who hadn't played since 2019? Can we please get real?
This is my last preseason post about Marcus Cannon. Because it's really not about Marcus Cannon.

The narrative is that Cannon had to be traded for. Due to his status on the free agent market could price the Texans out of his market. I guess Cannon would be pretty upset at missing his big payday, right?




"Only positives". "Wherever they want to use me, I’m ready to play." "I’m just happy to be a Texan.”

I'm surprised. Cannon doesn't sound like a guy upset about missing one last big payday in free agency. Which he surely would have been if Nick the Quick (to trade draft picks away) had not made the brilliant move to trade with the Patriots. Right?

I'm just confused about the unwavering support of Caserio, regardless of the facts. Do you have that much confidence in Kyle McNair's decision making? Or just trusting that his handler (Captain Jack Easterby) will lead Kyle in the right direction?

I'm not trashing every move Caserio makes. When he makes a good one, I've acknowleded it. And I don't have a clue if Nick can build this team into a winner. Or not. In that regard, I'm like everyone else. I just admit it.

But trading for Cannon was stupid and completely unnecessary. Just like trading for the QB that he cut before ever seeing the guy take a snap. And the people who refuse to admit that are total Caserio homers. How Caserio obtained this kind of fan adulation is puzzling. Other than the fact that Nick Caserio is not Bill O'Brien.
We don't know that. Not until these picks play out.

But, let's assume these moves to trade for players about to be cut are non-consequential. What about the next time Caserio does it? Or the next time? Eventually, a pick is going to bite the Texans in the arse. For no reason. It's bad practice and makes Caserio look like the rookie GM he is. Caserio was supposed to be groomed for this. He looks like a novice on moves like this.
Caserio should have let Cannon hit the free agent market and found out. Feiler is 28 and has started 12 more games over the past 3 seasons. Of course, he's going to get more $$$. So yeah, Caserio wasted cap space & draft picks. It's Nick's calling cards thus far in his brief GM tenure.
They aren't the worst moves. Those were extending contracts into future years in order to sign special teamers. But these were not good moves and indicate Caserio doesn't understand how to acquire players as cheaply as possible.

The big decisions come when Caserio has premium draft choices and a big chunk of cap room. If he doesn't get the little things right, how can you have confidence he gets the big things right?
I think I was pretty clear when the trade happened. Let the Pats cut Cannon, then sign him as a free agent for less than the $7 million on his Pats contract. Less money spent, no draft picks dealt.
The question was, what can be expected from Cannon next season? The answer: As much as the Texans got this season. A $7 million bag of nothing.
 

steelbtexan

King of the W. B. Club
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Really? I mean you have to be joking? I explained why this was a ridiculous move when it was made. And, I've been proven 100% correct.











The question was, what can be expected from Cannon next season? The answer: As much as the Texans got this season. A $7 million bag of nothing.
Things you don't know for sure, like he would have been cut. He would be hurt etc ..

That 7 mil cap hit and 6 mil cap savings for a late Rd pick swap is hardly a big old bag of nothing.

Let's see who Caserio can use that 6 mil on in fa and I will be able to tell you exactly what that trade was worth and that's without Cannon doing anything on the field due to injury.

Did Cannon help them on the field last yr? Nope, will his cap space be able to help them this year? I hope so and I'm glad he has a bigger cap number rather than signing him on the cheap like you wanted last off-season. Why because that cap space can be used to sign 2 upgrades like Mack and Mo Allie Cox in fa.
 

Lucky

Trust Me. I Know What I'm Doing.
Staff member
I moved our Cannon discussion to the Caserio thread. Because, this is really about Nick Caserio and the decisions he made last offseason.

Things you don't know for sure, like he would have been cut. He would be hurt etc ..

That 7 mil cap hit and 6 mil cap savings for a late Rd pick swap is hardly a big old bag of nothing.
I said last year that Cannon was an 33 year old injury prone player that hadn't played in 2 years. No I didn't know for sure Cannon would be hurt. But I did point out the likelihood that he would be hurt.

What in the wide world of sports are you talking about in terms of cap savings? Had Cannon not been traded for, there would be no contract to cut. And if you remember (I know, it's been almost a year), Caserio had to renegotiate a lot of contracts (like Mercilus, Cunningham, Cooks, Tunsil, etc.) in order to acquire contracts like Cannon's. There is no net savings. The deal was bad for the cap. It was bad for building the team. And in my opinion, bad for the team culture. Let me explain:

Your argument at the time of the trade was that the pick swap was inconsequential. The Texan had pick #122 and moved down to #158. Now we know whom could have been selected and what the Texans missed out on.

Chubba Hubbard RB Carolina Panthers pick# 126 - Hubbard rushed for 612 yards and 6 TDs, playing 41% of offensive snaps. Both numbers would have led the 2021 Texans.

Marco Wilson CB Arizona Cardinals pick# 136 - Wilson started 13 games and played 87% of defensive snaps for a playoff team. At a position the Texans have no depth and little youth.

Royce Newman - OG - Green Bay Packers pick# 142 - Newman started 16 games, playing 97% of offensive snaps for the #1 seed in the NFC. At another position the Texans have little depth and will likely look to address in the offseason.

Dan Moore - LT - Pittsburgh Steelers pick# 128 - Moore started 16 games, playing 99% of offensive snaps at LT for the AFC Wild Card team. I shouldn't have to go over the revolving door the Texans endured at LT this season.

So yes, the pick swap had consequences. I'm not saying Caserio would have selected one of these players at #122. But, he could have had an opportunity. An opportunity he missed on by trading unnecessarily for a washed up lineman.

How was the trade for Cannon bad for team culture, you may ask? Because it was a blatant move to get a buddy of Jack's paid. The Texans already had a history of paying players for their relationships with the coaches and administration, rather than performance. Whitney Mercilus was a prime example. One of the first moves Caserio makes is to trade for a buddy of his and Easterby? What does that look like to a rebuilding team? It's who you know, not what you do that gets you paid. Had Cannon been brought in on a lesser salary after the Patriots cut him, it would have been a different story. Cannon would likely have been cut in camp, not being to get on the field.

I don't just bang Caserio for bad moves. When he does well, I applaud him. I thought he did a solid job with the picks he had. He should have had more. His signing of Thomas as a street free agent was outstanding. Keep that up. Sign young guys that have a future. My main problem is with fans (like yourself). Don't try to tell me that Caserio's mistake don't count. They count. When the emperor is not wearing clothes, I will say so and won't be convinced otherwise. Caserio has pissed away picks on player who can't play and mismanaged the cap signing mediocre talent. He made a ludicrous selection as head coach, and a year later is back at the plate. He has several more years on his contract, so he will get plenty of more chances. I hope Nick gets a lot of them right. And when he does, I will acknowledge that. And when Caserio screws up, I'll acknowledge those, too.
 
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steelbtexan

King of the W. B. Club
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I moved our Cannon discussion to the Caserio thread. Because, this is really about Nick Caserio and the decisions he made last offseason.


I said last year that Cannon was an 33 year old injury prone player that hadn't played in 2 years. No I didn't no for sure Cannon would be hurt. But I did point out the likelihood that he would be hurt.

What in the wide world of sports are you talking about in terms of cap savings? Had Cannon not been traded for, there would be no contract to cut. And if you remember (I know, it's been almost a year), Caserio had to renegotiate a lot of contracts (like Mercilus, Cunningham, Cooks, Tunsil, etc.) in order to acquire contracts like Cannon's. There is no net savings. The deal was bad for the cap. It was bad for building the team. And in my opinion, bad for the team culture. Let me explain:

Your argument at the time of the trade was that the pick swap was inconsequential. The Texan had pick #122 and moved down to #158. Now we know whom could have been selected and what the Texans missed out on.

Chubba Hubbard RB Carolina Panthers pick# 126 - Hubbard rushed for 612 yards and 6 TDs, playing 41% of offensive snaps. Both numbers would have led the 2021 Texans.

Marco Wilson CB Arizona Cardinals pick# 136 - Wilson started 13 games and played 87% of defensive snaps for a playoff team. At a position the Texans have no depth and little youth.

Royce Newman - OG - Green Bay Packers pick# 142 - Newman started 16 games, playing 97% of offensive snaps for the #1 seed in the NFC. At another position the Texans have little depth and will likely look to address in the offseason.

Dan Moore - LT - Pittsburgh Steelers pick# 128 - Moore started 16 games, playing 99% of offensive snaps at LT for the AFC Wild Card team. I shouldn't have to go over the revolving door the Texans endured at LT this season.

So yes, the pick swap had consequences. I'm not saying Caserio would have selected one of these players at #122. But, he could have had an opportunity. An opportunity he missed on by trading unnecessarily for a washed up lineman.

How was the trade for Cannon bad for team culture, you may ask? Because it was a blatant move to get a buddy of Jack's paid. The Texans already had a history of paying players for their relationships with the coaches and administration, rather than performance. Whitney Mercilus was a prime example. One of the first moves Caserio makes is to trade for a buddy of his and Easterby? What does that look like to a rebuilding team? It's who you know, not what you do that gets you paid. Had Cannon been brought in on a lesser salary after the Patriots cut him, it would have been a different story. Cannon would likely have been cut in camp, not being to get on the field.

I don't just bang Caserio for bad moves. When he does well, I applaud him. I thought he did a solid job with the picks he had. He should have had more. His signing of Thomas as a street free agent was outstanding. Keep that up. Sign young guys that have a future. My main problem is with fans (like yourself). Don't try to tell me that Caserio's mistake don't count. They count. When the emperor is not wearing clothes, I will say so and won't be convinced otherwise. Caserio has pissed away picks on player who can't play and mismanaged the cap signing mediocre talent. He made a ludicrous selection as head coach, and a year later is back at the plate. He has several more years on his contract, so he will get plenty of more chances. I hope Nick gets a lot of them right. And when he does, I will acknowledge that. And when Caserio screws up, I'll acknowledge those, too.

CnD at the time disagreed with your injury evaluation. I will continue to use his medical evals as a guide over yours. Like I said, Caserio gambled on a starting RT at a small cost and lost because of injury.

The cap stuff didn't and still doesn't matter to me until the 2024 offseason.

Tell me who did Caserio pick at 158? I'm sure I can cherry pick other bad picks as well within the range you listed.

Caserio brought in the guys he wanted o help set the culture HE wanted down on Kirby. They weren't necessarily who I or you for that matter would've brought in but this is his rebuild. When Kubiak got here he brought in Salaam/Myers etc... from Denver through FA and trades. I didn't here you b!tching when Kubiak brought in his guys. I believe Myers was brought in for one of those vaunted 5th rd picks.

Team culture? There was no team culture, Caserio signed 30 some odd FA's there was no team culture. Caserio's trying to build a new team culture and afer 7 yrs of Sexual Predators/Baby Mamma Drama/Clowney's I practice when I want too/Swearinger car stereo theft/DB/AF's wokeness/ FO Sexual Harassment and not surprisingly not being a contender, it was far past time to burn the boardroom to be burnt to the ground. Time to get some guys who are all about football down on Kirby instead of a bunch of South Carolina/Clemson trash down on Kirby. Some of the guys that didn't buy in this season were moved by trade and others will move on in FA this offseason. Cunningham and his being late for meetings. Omenihu got outplayed by guys on the current roster and was traded. Reid and his woke azz will be gone soon. All of these guys are easily replaceable. In fact I can make a case that the defense played better without their half azzing it last yr.

I say all of this to say when you flush the toilet on the way things were done for the last 7 yrs and start doing things differently players feelings are going to get hurt. It happened with Luhnow, Cosart/Pence/Lee etc.. he flushed the toilet and the Stros came out much better for it and I hope the same thing happens with Caserio running the show.

While I dont agree with some of what Caserio did last yr either re-signing DJ/Not moving Reid at the deadline/ etc... as a GM you take your shots and trading a 5th rd pick for a young starting NFL WR is a gamble I would take every time I could get a shot. That's really the only pick missing from this yrs draft and Caserio does have 3, 6ths to move up to the 5th if he want too. So he's really not out any picks.

We have a different philosophy on how to build a team, for instance I didn't have an issue trading up to get Collins. Give me quality over quantity. Let me give you a scenario in the upcoming draft, would you trade 3-68 and 4-114 to move up to 2-45 and draft Pickens? I would. I would also use those a couple of the 6th's to move into the 5th

My draft would look like this. Neal/Salyer/Pickens/Goodrich/Allgeier/Calcaterra Give me quality over quantity.


Like I've said the cap wont matter until the 2024 offseason because no top tier FA's will want to come to Kirby until then anyways. Good news is Cunningham/Mercilus/Tunsil if Caserio wants will be off of the books by then and there will be plenty of cap space available.

I didn't like the Culley hire either. But being 65 yrs old how long did you expect Culley to be the HC? I expected 2 yrs, he only lasted 1 yr. no big deal to me. However, this coming yr with a new hopefully long term HC and a full compliment of draft picks Caserio's time on the clock has officially begun for me.
 

Texian

Hall of Fame
Lots of talk about the File Clerk trading Tunsil. If that happens dead money for 2022 (incl DW4 trade) goes to $68MM ($16.6MM for Tunsil). If Texans end up paying portions of DW4 and Tunsil's 2022 salary which is highly likely if they want to trade DW4 and Tunsil, dead money could approach $90MM. Dave Gettlemen has nothing on the File Clerk.
 

OptimisticTexan

2022 Rebuilding Block 2 / Go Texans
Lots of talk about the File Clerk trading Tunsil. If that happens dead money for 2022 (incl DW4 trade) goes to $68MM ($16.6MM for Tunsil). If Texans end up paying portions of DW4 and Tunsil's 2022 salary which is highly likely if they want to trade DW4 and Tunsil, dead money could approach $90MM. Dave Gettlemen has nothing on the File Clerk.
Dave Gettlemen didn't inherit the Texans situation. Gettlemen's shot as NY Giants GM finished with a 19-46 record (worst in the NFL from 2018-2021) during his run and no playoff appearances. He's also left the team with a projected -6.4M dollar cap hole. Like OB....the Giants just gave the wrong guy too much time in the GM chair.

If Caserio stays the course....he'll be out of cap hell when the team should be rounding the corner of his rebuild....starting with the 2024 season's green flag.
 

OptimisticTexan

2022 Rebuilding Block 2 / Go Texans
But will that be because he's managed the cap well? Or because the Texans won't have any players worth giving a good contract to?
I believe Caserio has done a good job at closing up some of the distance to the top of the hole he was thrown into when he took over the team. Some of the first moves was probably made in the event Watson decided he wanted to play for the Texans. When the Watson situation escalated Caserio had to make moves that started preparing the team for a full blown rebuild. Sure, some of his moves were questionable in my mind but unless I'm at the conference table listening in on all the rationale presented....it'll just remain questionable. He had a good to better than expected draft which was a must have for the 2021 season.

It's still going to be an ugly process as he cleans up what has been left behind and what he's facing going into the 2022 NFL season. It'll be a young and somewhat ugly team during this process but I'm game to see it through. The good thing, Caserio won't need to give any contracts to good FA's until most of this is gone and he's added solid talent via the draft, UDFA's, and maybe some more pillaging through other teams PS's.
 
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Texian

Hall of Fame
Dave Gettlemen didn't inherit the Texans situation. Gettlemen's shot as NY Giants GM finished with a 19-46 record (worst in the NFL from 2018-2021) during his run and no playoff appearances. He's also left the team with a projected -6.4M dollar cap hole. Like OB....the Giants just gave the wrong guy too much time in the GM chair.

If Caserio stays the course....he'll be out of cap hell when the team should be rounding the corner of his rebuild....starting with the 2024 season's green flag.
Texans started 2021 season with 54 contracts and $6MM OVER the cap.

If the File Clerk had made the following moves listed below, the Texans would've been $48MM UNDER the cap to start 2021. The Clerk would not have had to resort to mortgaging the future to the tune of OVER $37MM by restructuring every contract he could. He wouldn't have had to restructure a single contract, saving millions.

If the File Clerk had made the moves below, he would have had $13MM more to spend in 2021 and $37MM more to spend in 2022. A fiduciary the File Clerk is not and I'm not sure you and @steelbtexan are either. This is gross incompetence and complete fiscal irresponsibility. This is likely to continue, there is no reason why it wouldn't, it's The File Clerk's PROCESS. This FUBAR is bigger than the Culley FUBAR because Culley is gone. Being fiscally irresponsible and an absent fiduciary is not going anywhere. If Caserio stays the course, and there is no reason to think it won't, Salary Cap mismanagement will be standard operating procedure as long as the File Clerk has the keys to the GM's office.

B. McKinneyRelease$7.00m
D. JohnsonRelease$6.90m
Z. FultonRelease$3.00m
Du. JohnsonRelease$5.15m
B. DunnRelease$3.25m
B. CooksTrade$12.00m
J. WattRelease$17.50m
Total Saved$54.80m
 

OptimisticTexan

2022 Rebuilding Block 2 / Go Texans
Texans started 2021 season with 54 contracts and $6MM OVER the cap.

If the File Clerk had made the following moves listed below, the Texans would've been $48MM UNDER the cap to start 2021. The Clerk would not have had to resort to mortgaging the future to the tune of OVER $37MM by restructuring every contract he could. He wouldn't have had to restructure a single contract, saving millions.

If the File Clerk had made the moves below, he would have had $13MM more to spend in 2021 and $37MM more to spend in 2022. A fiduciary the File Clerk is not and I'm not sure you and @steelbtexan are either. This is gross incompetence and complete fiscal irresponsibility. This is likely to continue, there is no reason why it wouldn't, it's The File Clerk's PROCESS. This FUBAR is bigger than the Culley FUBAR because Culley is gone. Being fiscally irresponsible and an absent fiduciary is not going anywhere. If Caserio stays the course, and there is no reason to think it won't, Salary Cap mismanagement will be standard operating procedure as long as the File Clerk has the keys to the GM's office.

B. McKinneyRelease$7.00m
D. JohnsonRelease$6.90m
Z. FultonRelease$3.00m
Du. JohnsonRelease$5.15m
B. DunnRelease$3.25m
B. CooksTrade$12.00m
J. WattRelease$17.50m
Total Saved$54.80m

Not arguing your point...just saying there was probably more going on than met the eye. Let's see how 2022 and 2023 seasons play out and then re-visit this conversation.
 

steelbtexan

King of the W. B. Club
Contributor's Club
Texans started 2021 season with 54 contracts and $6MM OVER the cap.

If the File Clerk had made the following moves listed below, the Texans would've been $48MM UNDER the cap to start 2021. The Clerk would not have had to resort to mortgaging the future to the tune of OVER $37MM by restructuring every contract he could. He wouldn't have had to restructure a single contract, saving millions.

If the File Clerk had made the moves below, he would have had $13MM more to spend in 2021 and $37MM more to spend in 2022. A fiduciary the File Clerk is not and I'm not sure you and @steelbtexan are either. This is gross incompetence and complete fiscal irresponsibility. This is likely to continue, there is no reason why it wouldn't, it's The File Clerk's PROCESS. This FUBAR is bigger than the Culley FUBAR because Culley is gone. Being fiscally irresponsible and an absent fiduciary is not going anywhere. If Caserio stays the course, and there is no reason to think it won't, Salary Cap mismanagement will be standard operating procedure as long as the File Clerk has the keys to the GM's office.

B. McKinneyRelease$7.00m
D. JohnsonRelease$6.90m
Z. FultonRelease$3.00m
Du. JohnsonRelease$5.15m
B. DunnRelease$3.25m
B. CooksTrade$12.00m
J. WattRelease$17.50m
Total Saved$54.80m
Do they need the 37 mil this yr? Are premium FA's busting down the doors to join the crew down on Kirby. The cap isn't a big deal for me this yr or next yr either. Now in the 2024 offseason if Caserio needs cap space to add premium FA's at that time and he doesn't have the cap space to sign a premium FA that wants to join the crew down on Kirby, then you can believe that I'm going to be very critical of Caserio. Until then I'm going to give him the benefit of the doubt. Obviously you've already made up your mind.
 

thunderkyss

Just win baby!!!
Staff member
Contributor's Club
Do they need the 37 mil this yr?
Even if they don’t they could roll it to when they do need it.

It would be different if there was something to show for the $37M. But to just dump $37M for nothing in return should at the very least get the alert up.

I wanted Caserio. I was excited when we finally got him. A few of his moves I liked, a few I questioned, but the questionable outweigh the good ones so far & im not seeing the pay off.
 

Speedy

Former Yeller Dweller
He had a good to better than expected draft which was a must have for the 2021 season.
I don’t get the thought process here. Because Mills had better stats than Lawrence and Wilson, it was a good to better than expected draft? That’s BS.

They gave up 3 picks to go get Nico. He was one of the worst receivers in the league. He had a 54% catch rate, from a QB who was pretty decent completing passes. Out of 208 players who had 30+ targets, Nico’s 54% was 199th.

Jordan didn’t even suit up the the 1st 7 weeks, and had 1 target the last 2 games. Now, I do blame more of that on this OB/Kelly offense not knowing that a TE is allowed to catch passes, but still.

Garret Wallow? They moved up TWICE to draft him in the FIFTH ROUND. He had 15 defensive snaps the 1st 12 weeks of the season, 0 snaps from week 6-12, and only saw significant playing time when the Texans were down at LB due to injuries and Covid. Then he was back down to 9 snaps the last 2 games.

Roy Lopez did start 15 games, and that’s great for a 6th rounder, but still played just 46% of the snaps. And he had the 14th highest missed tackle percentage in the league.

So I don’t see how any of that is good or better than expected. I think it was a poorly executed draft to move up and grab players that gave you little to nothing in year 1. Not saying it can’t improve going forward, but this was far from a good draft...so far.
 

steelbtexan

King of the W. B. Club
Contributor's Club
Even if they don’t they could roll it to when they do need it.

It would be different if there was something to show for the $37M. But to just dump $37M for nothing in return should at the very least get the alert up.

I wanted Caserio. I was excited when we finally got him. A few of his moves I liked, a few I questioned, but the questionable outweigh the good ones so far & im not seeing the pay off.
You missed my point, rolling it over really doesn't matter when no FA's want to come here for a couple of yrs anyway. All of the dead $$$$ will be offof the books and Tunsil will either be traded if cap space is needed or extended if Caserio decides to keep Tunsil. Anyways, at this point of the rebuild cap space should be the least of the worries. Adding premium talent around Mills through the next 2 drafts should be prority #1 and after that FA comes into play. Although I'm hoping Caserio can add a couple of more solid cheap FA starters like he did last yr.
 

OptimisticTexan

2022 Rebuilding Block 2 / Go Texans
I don’t get the thought process here. Because Mills had better stats than Lawrence and Wilson, it was a good to better than expected draft? That’s BS.

They gave up 3 picks to go get Nico. He was one of the worst receivers in the league. He had a 54% catch rate, from a QB who was pretty decent completing passes. Out of 208 players who had 30+ targets, Nico’s 54% was 199th.

Jordan didn’t even suit up the the 1st 7 weeks, and had 1 target the last 2 games. Now, I do blame more of that on this OB/Kelly offense not knowing that a TE is allowed to catch passes, but still.

Garret Wallow? They moved up TWICE to draft him in the FIFTH ROUND. He had 15 defensive snaps the 1st 12 weeks of the season, 0 snaps from week 6-12, and only saw significant playing time when the Texans were down at LB due to injuries and Covid. Then he was back down to 9 snaps the last 2 games.

Roy Lopez did start 15 games, and that’s great for a 6th rounder, but still played just 46% of the snaps. And he had the 14th highest missed tackle percentage in the league.

So I don’t see how any of that is good or better than expected. I think it was a poorly executed draft to move up and grab players that gave you little to nothing in year 1. Not saying it can’t improve going forward, but this was far from a good draft...so far.
I saw enough good plays from each player to be optimistic going into 2022. RD3-RD7 players are expected to face some development hurdles as all these picks did. IMHO, they'll all be better for the time they got to put in this season.
 

steelbtexan

King of the W. B. Club
Contributor's Club
I don’t get the thought process here. Because Mills had better stats than Lawrence and Wilson, it was a good to better than expected draft? That’s BS.

They gave up 3 picks to go get Nico. He was one of the worst receivers in the league. He had a 54% catch rate, from a QB who was pretty decent completing passes. Out of 208 players who had 30+ targets, Nico’s 54% was 199th.

Jordan didn’t even suit up the the 1st 7 weeks, and had 1 target the last 2 games. Now, I do blame more of that on this OB/Kelly offense not knowing that a TE is allowed to catch passes, but still.

Garret Wallow? They moved up TWICE to draft him in the FIFTH ROUND. He had 15 defensive snaps the 1st 12 weeks of the season, 0 snaps from week 6-12, and only saw significant playing time when the Texans were down at LB due to injuries and Covid. Then he was back down to 9 snaps the last 2 games.

Roy Lopez did start 15 games, and that’s great for a 6th rounder, but still played just 46% of the snaps. And he had the 14th highest missed tackle percentage in the league.

So I don’t see how any of that is good or better than expected. I think it was a poorly executed draft to move up and grab players that gave you little to nothing in year 1. Not saying it can’t improve going forward, but this was far from a good draft...so far.
He found his QB. Players on the team seem to think Collins is the real deal and the injury set him back. Once Jordan started to play I thought he did well. At the very least an above avg depth piece. allow filled in and did well. He's a good depth piece and core ST's guy. Pretty good for a 5th rd pick. Lopez performed better than expected.

BTW, I could've sworn Caserio only traded his 3rd rd draft pick and more pick to move up to pick Collins?

Bottom line is if Caserio hits on Mills then this will be a winning draft for Caserio. After seeing how Mills played over the last month of the season, it looks to me like Caserio drafted the best QB in this class.
 

OptimisticTexan

2022 Rebuilding Block 2 / Go Texans
He found his QB. Players on the team seem to think Collins is the real deal and the injury set him back. Once Jordan started to play I thought he did well. At the very least an above avg depth piece. allow filled in and did well. He's a good depth piece and core ST's guy. Pretty good for a 5th rd pick. Lopez performed better than expected.

BTW, I could've sworn Caserio only traded his 3rd rd draft pick and more pick to move up to pick Collins?

Bottom line is if Caserio hits on Mills then this will be a winning draft for Caserio. After seeing how Mills played over the last month of the season, it looks to me like Caserio drafted the best QB in this class.
...also, the first Texans receiver who decided to hang out with Mills at the Texans complex during the off-season was Nico Collins. We might see a nice bump in Collins' production next season.
 

Texian

Hall of Fame
Do they need the 37 mil this yr? Obviously you've already made up your mind.
If you've to ask this question, then it just proves my point that you do not understand the File Clerk's negligence in his fiduciary duties and his chronic fiscal irresponsibility.

Yes, my mind is made up when it comes to being a coherent fiduciary and fiscally responsible which the File Clerk has yet to demonstrate.
 

Speedy

Former Yeller Dweller
I saw enough good plays from each player to be optimistic going into 2022. RD3-RD7 players are expected to face some development hurdles as all these picks did. IMHO, they'll all be better for the time they got to put in this season.
Anybody can make good plays or you don’t make it to the league.

And what good plays exactly did you see from Wallow from the handful that he played? And you’re just going to ignore the overall body of work by picking out a handful or less of positive plays? OK.

And of course rounds 3-7 are expected to face hurdles. But to say the draft was good to better than expected, I just don’t see it. At least not yet.

Caserio didn’t execute the draft very well at all, considering the players he got had very little impact, other than the QB, of course.
 
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thunderkyss

Just win baby!!!
Staff member
Contributor's Club
All of the dead $$$$ will be offof the books
There’s been nothing to suggest this. If he continues to operate the way he’s been operating we’ll never be in position to target top FAs, just like it was under RS.

This appears to be the way he does business. You’re pointing to something you hope. But that hope is ungrounded.

Sooner or later, he has to stop digging. I hope he does soon.
 

thunderkyss

Just win baby!!!
Staff member
Contributor's Club
Players on the team seem to think Collins is the real deal and the injury set him back. Once Jordan started to play I thought he did well. At the very least an above avg depth piece. allow filled in and did well.
Hopefully we’re past those days where we see flashes one year & the late round prospects disappear from the face of the earth the next.

remember Keke Coutee? Gave ‘‘em hell as a rookie, but struggled with the play book year two. SMH. This has been the norm in Houston & I bet most likely with a new HC & OC.
 

steelbtexan

King of the W. B. Club
Contributor's Club
...also, the first Texans receiver who decided to hang out with Mills at the Texans complex during the off-season was Nico Collins. We might see a nice bump in Collins' production next season.
Yep, Culture

BTW, Derrick/Hopkins were hanging out during the offseason and I'm sure a few passes were completed. Unfortunately those completed passes had nothing to do with football.
 

TexansBull

Hall of Fame
If you've to ask this question, then it just proves my point that you do not understand the File Clerk's negligence in his fiduciary duties and his chronic fiscal irresponsibility.

Yes, my mind is made up when it comes to being a coherent fiduciary and fiscally responsible which the File Clerk has yet to demonstrate.
You are using the word “fiduciary” wrong. It doesn’t apply to GMs. You are reaching.
 

steelbtexan

King of the W. B. Club
Contributor's Club
If you've to ask this question, then it just proves my point that you do not understand the File Clerk's negligence in his fiduciary duties and his chronic fiscal irresponsibility.

Yes, my mind is made up when it comes to being a coherent fiduciary and fiscally responsible which the File Clerk has yet to demonstrate.
I understand fully, I just disagree with you.

I just dont think any damage has been done at this point. Of course I dont have the bean counter mentality. He's staying within the cap and when the time comes there will be plenty of money available for FA signings.
 

steelbtexan

King of the W. B. Club
Contributor's Club
There’s been nothing to suggest this. If he continues to operate the way he’s been operating we’ll never be in position to target top FAs, just like it was under RS.

This appears to be the way he does business. You’re pointing to something you hope. But that hope is ungrounded.

Sooner or later, he has to stop digging. I hope he does soon.
Check back in with me in a couple of yrs.

He's got the vehicles he needs to open up quite a bit of cap space this offseason if he wishes too. Starting by cutting Cannon and saving 6 mil. plus many of the other 30 FA's he signed last offseason. Also can you tell me how much the cap is going to go up next season?
 

steelbtexan

King of the W. B. Club
Contributor's Club
Hopefully we’re past those days where we see flashes one year & the late round prospects disappear from the face of the earth the next.

remember Keke Coutee? Gave ‘‘em hell as a rookie, but struggled with the play book year two. SMH. This has been the norm in Houston & I bet most likely with a new HC & OC.
Amen, I'm thinking these guys are solid players. Some who will low end starter level guys like Lopez. Some who will be great depth guys, these are the types of guys that were rarely drafted under previous regimes down on Kirby, but the types of guys that are contributors on contending teams when injuries hit. (Mills and hopefully Collins will be alot more than this) I know fans aren't used to seeing many contributors drafted in rd 3 and later. This is hat a solid draft looks like.
 

OptimisticTexan

2022 Rebuilding Block 2 / Go Texans
I don't need that long; I've already seen enough to know what we got.
Man, you’re either enjoy punishment or like to take long trips to nowhere. Take a couple of seasons off and loosen those shoulders. The only folks participating here….have no say in the Texans operations. There’s always the “Glass Half Full” approach to being a Texans fan.
 

Texian

Hall of Fame
Man, you’re either enjoy punishment or like to take long trips to nowhere. Take a couple of seasons off and loosen those shoulders. The only folks participating here….have no say in the Texans operations. There’s always the “Glass Half Full” approach to being a Texans fan.
Been there, done that. No thanks. Get yourself another drink of that good old Houston Texans Kool Aid. Game Boy appreciates your patronage.
 

mws

Rookie
I'm sorry but after 20 years of the Texans & 25+ years of the Oilers I am definitely in the I'll believe it when I see it camp. It is the same old story we have had to swallow for years. I'll be a fan as long as Houston has a team but the odds are probably higher that I'll win the lottery before the Texans win a Super Bowl.

As far as all the free agent signings this year I heard Caserio on 610 say that we currently have 35 unsigned players going into next year.

This was a miserable season. We were outscored 452 to 280. That's a -172 point differential.

Look at our 5 worst games.

Bills - Loss - Score 40-0
Colts - Loss - Score 31-0
Colts - Loss - Score 31-3
Cardinals - Loss - Score 31-5
Seahawks - Loss - Score 33-13

Man, I sure hope we are on the right track but so far I have not seen anything to make me want to break out the pom-poms. So yeah when it comes to the Texans I'm from Missouri & I say show me.
 

IDEXAN

Hall of Fame
Contributor's Club
Man, you’re either enjoy punishment or like to take long trips to nowhere. Take a couple of seasons off and loosen those shoulders. The only folks participating here….have no say in the Texans operations. There’s always the “Glass Half Full” approach to being a Texans fan.
Well now you know OpTex - longtrips to nowhere is standard behavior for de facto trolls.
 

steelbtexan

King of the W. B. Club
Contributor's Club
Just so you know you and @steelbtexan are the only two members of the Kool Aid Brigade that I do not have on ignore.
I dont consider myself part of the koolaid brigade. I just look at how Caserio is doing business differently than you do. Good thing is in 2-3 yrs we will know who was correct. I still think there will be plenty of cap space after they get all of the bad contracts off of the books next offseason and the gamblers help the cap go way up. There should be plenty of cap space available and if there isn't enough a Tunsil trade can create even more cap space.

Really for me this comes down to Caserio being able to find 4-6 star level players in the next couple of drafts and adding 2-3 Thomas/KGH type FA guys the next 2 yrs. Then Caserio should go big game hunting in FA. After seeing what Caserio did in the last draft (I really like Mills) I'm looking forward to a very bright future.
 


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