Support and keep Texans Talk going. Make a donation here.

Derek Stingley vs. Sauce Gardner

Khelar

Rookie
Saw a few people on here saying Stingley didn’t look good and after checking out the all 22 idk what they’re watching.

He had whoever was across from him locked up all game except for the play he got beat by Flowers (about 20 yards). There was a PI against him that imo was borderline. I’m not gonna go so far as to say it was a bad call but there was hand fighting, he turned his head towards the ball, then turned back to the WR as the ball landed. Idk you can’t see all the details so hard to make a determination.

Regardless I thought he played really well. Here’s hoping he can stay healthy this year
 

JB

Innocent Bystander
Contributor's Club
Well I for one refuse to go easy on Stingley when it's widely known and understood that he's 100% guilty of not being Sauce Gardner and at the rate he's going he never will be. I mean first of all he's had a year and still hasn't so much as changed his name to "Sauce".
He could change it to ghost (pepper) or salsa
 

Mr teX

Hall of Fame
Stingley may never live up to his draft status, but his play hasn’t been terrible when he’s been on the field like some folks here are saying. I think some have taken what CnD has said about his condition and have run with it being too critical of his play when in fact he’s been pretty solid.


It’s year 2 and he’s got a little better surrounding cast around him with a better coach & scheme. As long as he can stay healthy I think he’ll be pretty good. Maybe not multi time all-pro good, but a worthy #1 cb.

Comparing him to Sauce…look Gardner isn’t even as good as his hype machine would have you believe. Imo There were many more guys better than him that deserved that all-pro designation before him. But there’s something to be said for that NY hype. He got abused by Diggs last night. His saving grace is that he plays in a great defensive scheme with great talent around him so he’ll always be in position b/c Saleh’s scheme ensures the ball comes out quickly & it limits big plays. But make no mistake…Qb’s ARE NOT afraid to throw at him…which is a hallmark of true shutdown CB’s.
 
Last edited:

steelbtexan

King of the W. B. Club
Contributor's Club
Stingley may never live up to his draft status, but his play hasn’t been terrible when he’s been on the field like some folks here are saying. I think some have taken what CnD has said about his condition and have run with it being too critical of his play when in fact he’s been pretty solid.


It’s year 2 and he’s got a little better surrounding cast around him with a better coach & scheme. As long as he can stay healthy I think he’ll be pretty good. Maybe not multi time all-pro good, but a worthy #1 cb.

Comparing him to Sauce…look Gardner isn’t even as good as his hype machine would have you believe. Imo There were many more guys better than him that deserved that all-pro designation before him. But there’s something to be said for that NY hype. He got abused by Diggs last night. His saving grace is that he plays in a great defensive scheme with great talent around him so he’ll always be in position b/c Saleh’s scheme ensures the ball comes out quickly. But make no mistake…Qb’s ARE NOT afraid to throw at him…which is a hallmark of true shutdown CB’s.
Agreed, but don't Ryans and Saleh run the same scheme?
 

Mr teX

Hall of Fame
Agreed, but don't Ryans and Saleh run the same scheme?
I would assume they do..but we’ve already seen it in the 1 game this year…better scheme, more talent & a better pass rush….the defense looks to be better…that should translate to overall better play, situations for everyone on that defense.

Once we finally get Ward and Pitre back there….together, the secondary SHOULD be a strength of the defense.
 
Last edited:

beerlover

Hall of Fame
They've got Shaq Mason graded out as not great (38/65) and Josh Jones as worse (54/65). But they've got Fant rated 21/65 and Tunsil at 37/65.

I was shocked to see 2 of the top 4 corners being Texans, though. Thomas and Nelson. Stingley was down at 65/92.
Thought Sauce Gardner had a rough opening game too. Did you happen to see how he graded out?
 

Sweech

Waterboy
I would think that is taken into account but I get your point. Same can be said for middle linebacker and quarterback; still they are rated.
I don't really think it can be taken into account because it's the type of thing that's impossible to know.
 

76Texan

Hall of Fame
Business decisions were made.

EDIT: Although for a guy with a reputation for being fragile, that might not be such a bad thing.
I still remember Patrick Peterson who was drafted at no. 5
A guy who can do a lot of different things and can be moved to safety when he gets older.
And i still thought it was a bit high unless he makes some big impacts.
I was a bit hard on the slot where Peterson was picked even as Iiked him much.

For a guy drafted at no. 3, Stingley has got to be pretty much a sure thing, doing all the things I mentioned above.

A few All-Pros and more Pro-Bowl appearance to add.

Unless something changes dramatically, this is becoming more and more of a bad pick.
 
Last edited:

steelbtexan

King of the W. B. Club
Contributor's Club
I still remember Patrick Peterson who was drafted at no. 5
A guy who can do a lot of different things and can be moved to safety when he gets older.
And i still thought it was a bit high unless he makes some big impacts.
I was a bit hard on the slot where Peterson was picked even as Iiked him much.

For a guy drafted at no. 3, Stingley has got to be pretty much a sure thing, doing all the things I mentioned above.

A few All-Pros and more Pro-Bowl appearance to add.

Unless something changes dramatically, this is becoming more and more of a bad pick.
Are you holding Stroud to the same standard? He's gotta be a top QB by week 1 of yr 2?
 

76Texan

Hall of Fame
Are you holding Stroud to the same standard? He's gotta be a top QB by week 1 of yr 2?
Take all the QBs that were drafted with the first two slots and use the average.

That's the baseline I'm measuring Stroud by.

That's the nature of the NFL.

Same thing applies to CBs.

You can compare Stingley with all the CBs that were drafted at the 3rd or 2nd slot.
 

Porky

Hall of Fame
Are you holding Stroud to the same standard? He's gotta be a top QB by week 1 of yr 2?
how often is a corner taken 3rd overall? You like the word outlier. That’s an outlier. That’s you telling the football world, he’s not just a good corner, this is a lockdown corner with game changing ability.

altough you mixing apples and pears is par for the course.
 

steelbtexan

King of the W. B. Club
Contributor's Club
how often is a corner taken 3rd overall? You like the word outlier. That’s an outlier. That’s you telling the football world, he’s not just a good corner, this is a lockdown corner with game changing ability.

altough you mixing apples and pears is par for the course.
Apparently you cant take into effect the rookie learning curve. Remember I was a Sauce guy, but I'm willing to give Stingley a chance. Injury is the only reason you shouldn't like the Stingley pick. Dude's a good player if healthy.
 
  • Like
Reactions: JB

76Texan

Hall of Fame
Apparently you cant take into effect the rookie learning curve. Remember I was a Sauce guy, but I'm willing to give Stingley a chance. Injury is the only reason you shouldn't like the Stingley pick. Dude's a good player if healthy.
Was he injured in the last game?
Because he was horrible.
 

Khelar

Rookie
Come off what?

I saw him as being bad to horrible on all 3 TDs by the Ravens.

If he continues that, I'm sure more TDs by the opponents will follow.
First off I care a lot more about CB’s coverage than run support and his coverage was very good. But even if I didn’t think that I don’t think those 3 TD’s were his fault at all.


And also one of them was bad two of them there ain’t a CB in the league stopping JK dobbins untouched with no help meeting him on the half yard line. If you need a cornerback to stop a running back 1 on 1 from inside the 1 yard line with no help your defense is already beat lmfao
 

76Texan

Hall of Fame
First off I care a lot more about CB’s coverage than run support and his coverage was very good. But even if I didn’t think that I don’t think those 3 TD’s were his fault at all.


And also one of them was bad two of them there ain’t a CB in the league stopping JK dobbins untouched with no help meeting him on the half yard line. If you need a cornerback to stop a running back 1 on 1 from inside the 1 yard line with no help your defense is already beat lmfao
Whatever please you.
Whatever please me.
I'm not stopping you from trying to absolve his weakness.

The more you do that, the more I will counter. :runaway:

Stingley was bad, and if he stays that way, teams will run all over the Texans.

Wait... They did.
 

76Texan

Hall of Fame
First off I care a lot more about CB’s coverage than run support and his coverage was very good. But even if I didn’t think that I don’t think those 3 TD’s were his fault at all.


And also one of them was bad two of them there ain’t a CB in the league stopping JK dobbins untouched with no help meeting him on the half yard line. If you need a cornerback to stop a running back 1 on 1 from inside the 1 yard line with no help your defense is already beat lmfao
Some reading materials for you before you think I'm overreacting.
I'm not.

https://steelersnow.com/run-defense-important-test-for-steelers-rookie-cb/

https://www.shakinthesouthland.com/2010/6/17/1516369/defensive-back-run-support
 

Khelar

Rookie
Whatever please you.
Whatever please me.
I'm not stopping you from trying to absolve his weakness.

The more you do that, the more I will counter. :runaway:

Stingley was bad, and if he stays that way, teams will run all over the Texans.

Wait... They did.
Ravens running backs ran for 2.6 YPC (63 yards on 24 carry’s). Is that what you call getting run all over?

Their only success was Lamar scrambles and short yardage red zone.

And again you ignored the fact that 2 of those three would have involved a CB 1v1 a running back on the 1 yard line. Good luck with that.

But hey don’t let the facts stop a good story
 

76Texan

Hall of Fame
Ravens running backs ran for 2.6 YPC (63 yards on 24 carry’s). Is that what you call getting run all over?

Their only success was Lamar scrambles and short yardage red zone.

And again you ignored the fact that 2 of those three would have involved a CB 1v1 a running back on the 1 yard line. Good luck with that.

But hey don’t let the facts stop a good story
Goal line stand.

CB shed a block and stood up a big fullback. That's how the Steeleers continue to have a good to great defense year in and year out.

Stingley was not even blocked on any of those three plays.

https://steelersnow.com/run-defense-important-test-for-steelers-rookie-cb/

3 rushing TDs is running all over.
If you're happy with that, the Cardinals thank you.
 

Khelar

Rookie
Goal line stand.

CB shed a block and stood up a big fullback. That's how the Steeleers continue to have a good to great defense year in and year out.

Stingley was not even blocked on any of those three plays.

https://steelersnow.com/run-defense-important-test-for-steelers-rookie-cb/

3 rushing TDs is running all over.
If you're happy with that, the Cardinals thank you.
Edit: deleted original post as I’m over this convo. If you’d like to believe giving up 2.6 ypc is getting run all over then by all means, brings to mind a saying about horses and water however
 

76Texan

Hall of Fame
Edit: deleted original post as I’m over this convo. If you’d like to believe giving up 2.6 ypc is getting run all over then by all means, brings to mind a saying about horses and water however
You can limit the other team to 3 yards rushing while giving then 3 TDs; they'll be happy to take it.

I know if the Texans get 3 rushing TDs, I'd be very happy.

This is tongue in cheek, of course.
But why are you moving the goal post?

The point is Stingley was bad to horrible on all 3 of their TDs.

That never changes.
 

Mr teX

Hall of Fame
He's not my boy.
He's a Ravens' fan.
And he's laughing at Stingley.
Why don't you get into it with him on the Comment Section of his video.
I'll wait to see it with my bag of popcorn 🍿 😋
He’s an idiot is what he is & there’s no point in “getting into it” those types. He can laugh all he wants. He doing the opposite of what he’s trying to do. He’s showing exactly how much he doesn’t know about ball by trying to act like he’s pointing something out.
 
Last edited:
after all this back and forth...I would like to add that I DO NOT AND WOULD NOT want my "shut down cover corner" trying to hit Rb's that have a full head of steam as if he was some kind of MLB. Thats not his position, thats not his forte, he isnt built for it...
Did people not learn for the CB we drafted that was small framed that tried to "lay the wood" on WR's and RB's and get hurt and then was pretty much done for his career??? And all for what??
 

76Texan

Hall of Fame
after all this back and forth...I would like to add that I DO NOT AND WOULD NOT want my "shut down cover corner" trying to hit Rb's that have a full head of steam as if he was some kind of MLB. Thats not his position, thats not his forte, he isnt built for it...
Did people not learn for the CB we drafted that was small framed that tried to "lay the wood" on WR's and RB's and get hurt and then was pretty much done for his career??? And all for what??
Kareem Jackson says Hi.
All 5-10 and 196lbs of him.
 


Top