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Who Starts at QB in Carolina? - Mallett

Herv you nailed it twice:

You're going to live with some mistakes because that bastard thinks he can throw the ball through a cinder block wall.

Right on both counts. He is going to make some holy **** throws nobody else could deliver and then a WTF?

But really, if you give Mallett the keys you're maybe just signing up for a kind of football that O'Brien is just really wary of tying his cart to. He wants a degree of control and he's made his point with Hoyer coming in. I think Mallett will play within the structure of the system and do well but I think that for him to really break out you got to put some faith in him and let him play his way.

Reading tea leaves, that's it. Mallett is a mustang and OB is a control guy by nature.

That can work. Do I need to disclaimer? Staubach was an off the cuff guy while Landry was a former D discipline guy. They drove each other nuts and Landry had to have Lilly* come talk to him to start Staubach. It worked pretty well after Landry rolled with it.

* if it comes out 10 years from now JJ went and talked to OB this week, I'll start believing in reincarnation.
 
Herv you nailed it twice:



Right on both counts. He is going to make some holy **** throws nobody else could deliver and then a WTF?



Reading tea leaves, that's it. Mallett is a mustang and OB is a control guy by nature.

That can work. Do I need to disclaimer? Staubach was an off the cuff guy while Landry was a former D discipline guy. They drove each other nuts and Landry had to have Lilly come talk to him to start Staubach. It worked pretty well after Landry rolled with it.

Maybe JJ needs to go talk to OB about a QB switch? Wonder how that would go over?
 
Note: I am not saying Mallett is Favre. beyond the general, obvious similarity in arm strength and "gunslinger attitude"

If you go with a QB like Mallett (just as the Packers went with Favre) you're going to get some picks. You're going to live with some mistakes because that bastard thinks he can throw the ball through a cinder block wall.

I understand you're not comparing Mallett to Favre, but when I look at him, I'm hoping he can be our Phillip Rivers. We've still got to put a good team around him & still may not win it all.
 
Maybe JJ needs to go talk to OB about a QB switch? Wonder how that would go over?
Maybe if JJ goes with Godsey?

Both of them can convince that OB doesn't know what's he is doing at the qb position. lol
 
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Maybe JJ needs to go talk to OB about a QB switch? Wonder how that would go over?

Whose office would you be more scared to walk into, Landry or OB?

OB's a freakin' marshmallow.

It took the whole team pushing Lilly.

Funny aside, one of their arguments to Lilly was about him being the NFL golden boy who was getting $45,000 a year.
 
For a kum bah yah moment...

I really would like to think that is what is going on here - a great coach misguided on one issue. The parallels are there.
 
For a kum bah yah moment...

I really would like to think that is what is going on here - a great coach misguided on one issue. The parallels are there.

I would like that to be true. I'd like it to be true about as much as I'd like to never see Bondage-boy "Freddie Mercury" Brian Hoyer again.
 
I know in my heart-of-hearts that Hoyer is going to start Hoyer in Carolina.

I know it.



But I'm still going to be extremely disappointed.
 
For a kum bah yah moment...

I really would like to think that is what is going on here - a great coach misguided on one issue. The parallels are there.

Bill has paralysis by analysis on this issue . Maybe it's just me but I can see a team die ( right before your eyes ) when they don't believe in the QB . It's like watching a little league game where the coach leaves his son in and allows him to walk eight batters . The team gives up because there's no hope and Hoyer might be yiddish for hope but not for the Texans .
 
image.jpg
 
I do not believe that Griffin is smart enough to run this offense. I think that is the problem with the guy. Unless he is put in a college style offense, and defensive players are instructed not to hit him, he is going to fail.



Never seen anyone dislocate their ankle with no contact from another player and only jumping into the air to throw a pass. Mr. Glass indeed!



Bradford is broken but Griffin is not? Huh?
Well, I was trying to make a point that some were O.K. with going after Sam but not Robert. Why? There is one possible exception in Foles. Again, why was this not resolved prior or right after hiring Bill? Don't you see there is a risk involved in either trading or signing injury prone players? So really the only option in that deal would have been Nick Foles and then I would had to determine much he is worth. A different route I might have taken in the 2014 draft is maybe draft a QB with the number one pick instead of a DE then this may not be an issue right now but it is too late and hindsight is always twenty-twenty.
 
There's no doubt consistency was code for turnovers.

Problem is, in his hop pocket was a turnover machine.

I had said in another thread that I didn't think McNair would allow O'Brien to start Hoyer again, as the sound of boos and the site of fans leaving would trigger flashbacks. Thinking it through again, I predict that Hoyer starts. As I said in another post, benching him will permanently end a QB career that O'Brien had envisioned for many years. O'Brien believes that Hoyer deserves another shot.

Note: I am not saying Mallett is Favre. beyond the general, obvious similarity in arm strength and "gunslinger attitude"

But really, if you give Mallett the keys you're maybe just signing up for a kind of football that O'Brien is just really wary of tying his cart to. He wants a degree of control and he's made his point with Hoyer coming in. I think Mallett will play within the structure of the system and do well but I think that for him to really break out you got to put some faith in him and let him play his way.

Though it's based on little evidence right now, the comparison to Favre makes sense. He made high risk throws that irritated coaches. When a coach refers to consistency, he's actually saying, "Yeah, you completed the throw into triple coverage this time, but can you complete that throw every time?" If the answer is no, you have a problem with "consistency." They don't want you throwing like Tom Brady if you're not Tom Brady.

And what coach wants to deal with that if he has options? I can sympathize after watching Favre become a coach killer. I've heard many diehard Packer fans mutter, "Live by Favre, die by Favre."

So as much as I want Mallett in there, I can almost understand O'Brien's insistence at attempting another option first. Though only O'Brien can understand why that option has to be Brian effing Hoyer.
 
I had said in another thread that I didn't think McNair would allow O'Brien to start Hoyer again, as the sound of boos and the site of fans leaving would trigger flashbacks. Thinking it through again, I predict that Hoyer starts. As I said in another post, benching him will permanently end a QB career that O'Brien had envisioned for many years. O'Brien believes that Hoyer deserves another shot.



Though it's based on little evidence right now, the comparison to Favre makes sense. He made high risk throws that irritated coaches. When a coach refers to consistency, he's actually saying, "Yeah, you completed the throw into triple coverage this time, but can you complete that throw every time?" If the answer is no, you have a problem with "consistency." They don't want you throwing like Tom Brady if you're not Tom Brady.

And what coach wants to deal with that if he has options? I can sympathize after watching Favre become a coach killer. I've heard many diehard Packer fans mutter, "Live by Favre, die by Favre."

So as much as I want Mallett in there, I can almost understand O'Brien's insistence at attempting another option first. Though only O'Brien can understand why that option has to be Brian effing Hoyer.
Then we're going back to the same question that has been asked here multiple times now:

Why is Mallett even here?
 
Reading tea leaves, that's it. Mallett is a mustang and OB is a control guy by nature.

That can work. Do I need to disclaimer? Staubach was an off the cuff guy while Landry was a former D discipline guy. They drove each other nuts and Landry had to have Lilly* come talk to him to start Staubach. It worked pretty well after Landry rolled with it.

* if it comes out 10 years from now JJ went and talked to OB this week, I'll start believing in reincarnation.

I agree. Generally speaking, guy's who are considered to be QB or offensive guru's are also micro-managers of what said QB or offense is doing. They just kind of go hand in hand. I think O'Brien wants a certain degree of control over the offense and he knows he will be able to control Hoyer and Fitzpatrick. He doesn't feel the same way about Keenum or Mallett. They operate outside his jurisdiction and that fully conflicts with his controlling nature.

He also knows he can program it into Savage which is why he drafted a complete blank slate as a QB. Also the same reason that I'm positively certain he won't draft a 1st round QB next year even if Mallett completely busts. That guy already comes with a degree of programming that he can't erase and re-write.
 
If Mallet and Hoyer are not long term answers then that should be decided on really soon and then what the next move should be. Either a Brees or Schaub type of trade comes along or it does not. Another potentially high price route to take is trading up in the draft in April. Elite quarterbacks most often stay with their teams for the long term so choose who and how much you're willing to give up. Also, which way you are going to go in order to acquire your starting QB of the future because Schaub and Brees type of trades do not occur often and the time to resolve this matter has come and should have passed but it has not.
 
Freddie Mercury and Infantrycak however put them in the same Google Image Search.


Freddie Mercury & Infantrycak in the same sentence..... & I don't have a problem with that.

I understand Freddie rubbed some people the wrong way(no pun intended) but I loved him. Dude's a badass as far as I'm concerned.
 
Freddie Mercury & Infantrycak in the same sentence..... & I don't have a problem with that.

I understand Freddie rubbed some people the wrong way(no pun intended) but I loved him. Dude's a badass as far as I'm concerned.
Exactly the song I'll be listening to going into the Panthers game.
It will accurately display how we feel about these quarterbacks.

 
He was signed before Hoyer was released. Plus, he's a fallback plan. Even bad coaches have one.

Oddly enough, that's not the case. Hoyer was already a FA. Mallett was a FA. Fitzpatrick was signed with us.

We were trying to land Hoyer, who was in talks with the Jets. "Rumor" was if we signed Hoyer, they would be interested in Fitzpatrick. We signed Mallett, who was in contract talks with someone else. We were sitting on pins & needles hoping we could also sign Hoyer.

The Texans also are expected to signBrian Hoyer, although the free-agent quarterbackwill field an offer Monday from the New York Jets, sources have confirmed to ESPN.

We then traded Fitzpatrick to the Jets for a conditional 7th

The offensively challenged New York Jets made their second trade in less than a week, acquiring well-traveled quarterback Ryan Fitzpatrick on Wednesday from the Houston Texans, the Jets confirmed.


Honestly, I think Godsey wants Mallett & OB wants Hoyer. At least I think I heard that somewhere.
 
Oddly enough, that's not the case. Hoyer was already a FA. Mallett was a FA. Fitzpatrick was signed with us.

We were trying to land Hoyer, who was in talks with the Jets. "Rumor" was if we signed Hoyer, they would be interested in Fitzpatrick. We signed Mallett, who was in contract talks with someone else. We were sitting on pins & needles hoping we could also sign Hoyer.

We then traded Fitzpatrick to the Jets for a conditional 7th

That all sounds familiar, but my memory replays a different story. What can I say, I drink a lot.
 
Freddie Mercury & Infantrycak in the same sentence..... & I don't have a problem with that.

I understand Freddie rubbed some people the wrong way(no pun intended) but I loved him. Dude's a badass as far as I'm concerned.

Me too

Freddie wouldn't have given a second thought about coming up in the same image search as the picture cak posted. Freddie did what he did and everybody could just deal with it.

Gotta respect that kind of "zero ***** given"
 
Bill has paralysis by analysis on this issue . Maybe it's just me but I can see a team die ( right before your eyes ) when they don't believe in the QB . or the team .not f It's like watching a little league game where the coach leaves his son in and allows him to walk eight batters . The team gives up because there's no hope and Hoyer might be yiddish for hope but not for the Texans .

I think you are right in large part. That's exactly AJ storming off the sideline in 2013. Fans can sit around and rationalize Dilfer but players want a QB that gives them hope.

Me too

Freddie wouldn't have given a second thought about coming up in the same image search as the picture cak posted. Freddie did what he did and everybody could just deal with it.

Gotta respect that kind of "zero ***** given"

That's our generation, a weird dichotomy. Some of us became ardent libertarian and the rest became up tight helicopter parents wondering why little Johnny can't cope if he escapes the Xbox.
 
I think you are right in large part. That's exactly AJ storming off the sideline in 2013. Fans can sit around and rationalize Dilfer but players want a QB that gives them hope.



That's our generation, a weird dichotomy. Some of us became ardent libertarian and the rest became up tight helicopter parents wondering why little Johnny can't cope if he escapes the Xbox.

I thought I edited that post ... dang .
 
Prediction: Mallett will start against Carolina. Not that he is great; he blows hot and cold. Just that he's a better choice than Hoyer, and if OB can't see that...disaster. Savage would have been still better, but Savage is too injury prone to play a full season, ever. We have to get a top QB in the next draft. Not only the team, but the city of Houston, depends on it.
 
Prediction: Mallett will start against Carolina. Not that he is great; he blows hot and cold. Just that he's a better choice than Hoyer, and if OB can't see that...disaster. Savage would have been still better, but Savage is too injury prone to play a full season, ever. We have to get a top QB in the next draft. Not only the team, but the city of Houston, depends on it.

Only problem I have with that, is you're probably right about Mallet being hot & cold and that plays right into what OB has been saying... consistency.

I can plan & compensate for consistency. Not knowing if I'm getting Testeverde or Sánchez, not so much.
 
Only problem I have with that, is you're probably right about Mallet being hot & cold and that plays right into what OB has been saying... consistency.

I can plan & compensate for consistency. Not knowing if I'm getting Testeverde or Sánchez, not so much.

Being a Spurs fan, watching Manu play was both exhilarating and terrifying. You knew he was going to do something amazing, and also attempt something else amazing that would go horribly wrong. But knowing you had that guy who COULD let you accept the times that he COULDN'T.

Unproven still, but that is how I view future Mallett. But I would rather have the guy who tried to carry the team and failed at times, then have the guy who never tried and hid behind the "system".
 
Unproven still, but that is how I view future Mallett. But I would rather have the guy who tried to carry the team and failed at times, then have the guy who never tried and hid behind the "system".


I here you, but I bet O'Brien comes out with a very run oriented game plan to hide Hoyer. I seriously doubt OB ever planned for either of these guys to carry this team.
 
I here you, but I bet O'Brien comes out with a very run oriented game plan to hide Hoyer. I seriously doubt OB ever planned for either of these guys to carry this team.

No one player rises above the team. Everyone is interchangeable. The collective brings success. Individuality is not rewarded. Welcome to the Borg. Or the UK.
 
No one player rises above the team. Everyone is interchangeable. The collective brings success. Individuality is not rewarded. Welcome to the Borg. Or the UK.

That was 2014 O'Brien. In 2015, he's been making sure everyone knows who the favorites are.
 
Start Hoyer for the first series just to throw everyone the **** off, then put his ass on the bench for the rest of the season. Mallett will come in and kill it with his laser arm. Let the boy play! Jesus Christ O'Brien.... We need some ******* juice out there. Hoyer looks like a broken wimpy little child in this video. I thought he was gonna ******* cry.... http://www.houstontexans.com/tv-med...an-Hoyer/98a59b44-707f-4307-814d-cdeeccc5e5fb

I changed over to Mallett's post-game presser, and have to say I was impressed. He was all business and demanding better play from himself and everyone. Hoyer just seems to say sorry for five whole minutes.
 
Being a Spurs fan, watching Manu play was both exhilarating and terrifying. You knew he was going to do something amazing, and also attempt something else amazing that would go horribly wrong. But knowing you had that guy who COULD let you accept the times that he COULDN'T.

Unproven still, but that is how I view future Mallett. But I would rather have the guy who tried to carry the team and failed at times, then have the guy who never tried and hid behind the "system".


Mallett's arm reminds me of Marino. He can put it places other guys just cant .... and he knows it. The only guy with as much pure arm talent in the league today has a couple MVP's & a Lombardi trophy.

Considering how hard the position is to fill , and the known quantity that Hoyer is .... I'd much rather go with the guy who has that exceptional talent and let him either pass or fail.

Going with all these retreads that give you the potential to reach 8-8 is just silly. You play to win the game .... Every game not half of them. Once you realize that guy gives you no more potential .... its time to move on and experiment with the next guy and the next .... until you get it right. Superbowl or bust.

You'll never find out if you have that guy when you keep laying down bunts with guys like Hoyer or Fitz. The odds may be against you but go take a cut and try to knock one outa the yard.





Draft Mettenberger & throw him out there , doesn't get it done , move on to Mariota.
 
Mallett's arm reminds me of Marino. He can put it places other guys just cant .... and he knows it. The only guy with as much pure arm talent in the league today has a couple MVP's & a Lombardi trophy.

Considering how hard the position is to fill , and the known quantity that Hoyer is .... I'd much rather go with the guy who has that exceptional talent and let him either pass or fail.

Going with all these retreads that give you the potential to reach 8-8 is just silly. You play to win the game .... Every game not half of them. Once you realize that guy gives you no more potential .... its time to move on and experiment with the next guy and the next .... until you get it right. Superbowl or bust.

You'll never find out if you have that guy when you keep laying down bunts with guys like Hoyer or Fitz. The odds may be against you but go take a cut and try to knock one outa the yard.





Draft Mettenberger & throw him out there , doesn't get it done , move on to Mariota.

I was hoping that Hoyer could take advantage of his familiarity in O'Brien's system and flourish. I believe I was very wrong. I am officially in the Mallet corner. He may be just as ineffective as Hoyer but we don't know that yet. Hoyer has Schaub arm strength but is far more careless with the ball.
 
I changed over to Mallett's post-game presser, and have to say I was impressed. He was all business and demanding better play from himself and everyone. Hoyer just seems to say sorry for five whole minutes.

Yeah and the "You know what I mean?" over and over. I realize that is a bit anal, but that drives me crazy!
 
Doesn't sound like a man who knows that he has lost his starter status.

Texans quarterback Brian Hoyer eager to get back to work, correct his mistakes
By Aaron Wilson on September 15, 2015 8:41 PM

Although Texans quarterback Brian Hoyer joked about using his best poker face Tuesday while fielding questions about his status, he behaved like a man who’s still the starter.

Two days removed from a season-opening loss to the Kansas City Chiefs where he had an interception, a lost fumble and was sacked four times before being replaced by backup Ryan Mallett, Hoyer appeared to be in a good mood during a Texans stats challenge math event at Claughton Middle School.

Texans coach Bill O’Brien said Monday he won’t announce a starter, but already knows who he wants to go with. Several sources not authorized to speak publicly said they would be at least mildly surprised if O’Brien gave up on Hoyer after one game and didn’t start him Sunday against the Carolina Panthers at Bank of America Stadium.

“Regardless of the situation, I’m always going to prepare like I’m the starter, whether I am or not,” said Hoyer, who declined comment when asked directly if he’s been told if he’s still the starter. “That’s the only way you can approach your job, especially when you’re an NFL quarterback. You never know what’s going to happen. You always have to be prepared for any scenario.”

After competing last year with former Heisman Trophy winner Johnny Manziel, Hoyer is accustomed to competitions extending beyond training camp even after being declared the starter.

“That’s part of the job,” he said. “It’s something I’ve dealt with and will continue to deal with. You put your best foot forward and you always be ready no matter where you are on the depth chart.”

After reviewing the game tape, Hoyer came away more encouraged than discouraged. He was downcast Sunday and apologized to teammates in the locker room and publicly said he thought he’d let the entire organization down after completing 18 of 34 passes for 236 yards and a 72.7 passer rating with both of his turnovers leading to Chiefs touchdowns.

Hoyer said he can’t wait to get back to work Wednesday when the Texans will resume preparations for the Panthers.

“It’s nothing that’s not correctable,” Hoyer said. “It wasn’t one of those things where we just couldn’t get it done. Actually, when you look at the film, some really good plays, too. You want to build on those, learn from your mistakes, correct them and really move on towards Carolina and get a good feel for what you do.

“The good thing is you get to play a new game every week. The bad thing is they’re seven days apart. Sometimes you wish they would come a little sooner.”

As frustrated and disappointed as Hoyer was Sunday, he seemed recharged Tuesday. Hoyer said he spent Sunday night with his wife and kids following the 27-20 loss.

“That’s usually the best way to do it, whether it’s a win or a loss,” Hoyer said. “I kind of just pulled back a little bit and just kind of put things in perspective.”

Hoyer is aware of the concerns surrounding the Texans after dropping to 0-1.

“First game of the year, you want to come out and put your best foot forward,” Hoyer said. “There’s disappointment all around. You find out what you did wrong, fix those mistakes and get ready for the next week. We’re looking forward to the challenge of playing Carolina, who was a playoff team, on the road. That’s going to be a great challenge.”

Hoyer said he enjoys applying math principles to his job, including the analytics that tells him what percentage of coverages defenses use at particular down and distances.

“In football, there are so many numbers that are out there,” he said. “Like I said to these kids, you’ve got to know the down and distance, you’ve got to know the personnel groupings, which we use numbers for. How many defensive lineman are in the game? How many linebackers? What’s the coverage? In football, it’s applied all the time even though we’re not always thinking about it as math.”
 
Doesn't sound like a man who knows that he has lost his starter status.
I think I am resigned to the fact that O'Brien will start him again seeing as it is an away game. But I suspect if he turns the ball over even once, he will get the hook again. Possibly for good. I'd rather go down in flames with Mallett at the helm then try to win with Hoyer. As I said in a previous post, if Hoyer starts, I'm going fishing instead.
 
I think I am resigned to the fact that O'Brien will start him again seeing as it is an away game. But I suspect if he turns the ball over even once, he will get the hook again. Possibly for good. I'd rather go down in flames with Mallett at the helm then try to win with Hoyer. As I said in a previous post, if Hoyer starts, I'm going fishing instead.
What if he pulled him out last Sunday because people were booing him? It being an away game, he might let him in the whole game.

Just a thought.
 
What if he pulled him out last Sunday because people were booing him? It being an away game, he might let him in the whole game.

Just a thought.
I won't care because I will switch it off if O'Brien trots Hoyer out there to start. I'll watch the game the next day.
 
I won't care because I will switch it off if O'Brien trots Hoyer out there to start. I'll watch the game the next day.

Exactly. That when I got to DVR mode and go outside to work in the yard. If there's a reason to watch it later I will but why put myself through another "Hoyering"? I already know how that turns out.
 
I was hoping that Hoyer could take advantage of his familiarity in O'Brien's system and flourish. I believe I was very wrong. I am officially in the Mallet corner. He may be just as ineffective as Hoyer but we don't know that yet. Hoyer has Schaub arm strength but is far more careless with the ball.

I'm not really "In the Mallett corner" or anyone's corner for that matter.

I'm in the corner of move on from those we know aren't the right guy and run anyone and everyone out there you find the right guy .... The water boy , the equipment manager , the bathroom attendant , the guy chunking you peanuts in the stands .... just no more Fitz & Hoyer or their equivalent. We know what they are , you cant fix them .... move on. Giving Mallett the reins is just the next logical step in that process.
 
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