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Texans trade Osweiller to Browns
- Thread starter srrono
- Start date
Rick Smith's tenure is a direct reflection of the McNair family. If not Smith, then some other lackey who conducts himself in the same milquetoast manner.
I expect generations of this sort of bumbling management that will cycle an occasional just-good-enough-to-get-to-playoffs results since Cal is a chip off the ol' block. Dude can't even pick out his own clothes. . .
That mustache is uniquely Cal "The General"
I said somewhere in the draft section something to that effect ..... wonder if he is really a .... McNair or is he a McClain ?!
sandman
Brexit Advisor
"I have no hate whatsoever for Rick Smith. But I will make racially homophobic jokes about a black man sexually servicing his white master."
Texian
Hall of Fame
There may a silver lining in McNair's Osweiler FUBAR fiasco. It does appear now that McNair is a bit gun shy and is playing a bit scared. Maybe, just maybe with a total collapse in 2017, McNair will clean house (including moving Ricky McNair out of football operations to league affairs) and actually hire one person who knows what the hell they're doing. (Dreaming?)
I could use a little help, a little bit to the left and higher please.
Texian
Hall of Fame
Well said....with Tom Coughlin now on board and running the show (added 10 new free agents), if I were in Vegas I would bet the Jags will be closer to 8 wins than their typical 3 wins a year.
sandman
Brexit Advisor
Because Coughlin is going to keep Bortles from leading the league in INT's, Sacks and Pick-6's.
This has nothing to do with race. It has to do with Ricky kissing the McNair's ass to the point that he gets to keep his job regardless of job performance. This is in addition to stabbing Kubiak in the back.
Do I like people like Ricky? No. Do I have to deal with people like Ricky? Almost daily. Do I hate Ricky? No Would I say the same thing if Ricky's skin color was green? Yes. Is you trying to paint me as a racist pathetic? Yes. Do you know much of anything about me? Obviously not, because if you knew me and my background you would find this post laughable.
Did my post change your opinion of me. Probably not, but know this, I sleep well at night when it comes to this subject. I've got more African American friends than you probably have friends as a whole. If you went golfing with me yesterday you would understand this. I've helped many minorities get started up in businesses. Some have been successful some not.
Just know this I find this post of ours offensive and my opinion of you as a human being has dropped significantly and I used to really enjoy talking the back and forth of Texans football with you since we are on the opposite ends of the spectrum. But not anymore, you've shown what you're all about.
Texian
Hall of Fame
I couldn't agree more, young Mr. Bortles must have become quite frustrated having to work with 4 different offensive coordinators over the last 3 years. Either he gets fixed now or he's gone. The fact that he's still there suggest Coughlin does have some degree of confidence in him.
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sandman
Brexit Advisor
You're the one who asked if Rick Smith was getting ready to give a ******* to McNair, and your opinion of me has dropped?
Sandman's List of Sh!t That Keeps Him Up At Night:
1. Going to Kazakhstan for the next few months
2. Starting the repatriation process back to Houston while I am in Kazakhstan
3. Getting back to the UK in June and immediately moving the fam back to Houston
4. Getting my daughter off to A&M and figuring out how to pay for it all
5.
6.
7.
999. What you think about me
Texian
Hall of Fame
The Middle School here at Texans Talk is ALWAYS OPEN, 7 days a week, 24 hours a day.
maverick512000
Hall of Fame
*sigh* This always saddens me, random person 1 says that random person 2 is racist and random person 2 feels compelled to talk about how many minority friends they have.
Not really blaming Steelb here it's just a sign of the times and a result of professional victims on both sides of the political aisle and all colors.
Welcome to the PC era, please read this 3 million page, 4 point font book on how to be sure you don't offend someone, the book will also be updated and rewritten hourly so check back often.
Now can we please go back to talking about football and leave the arguments to how great/awful the Texans are and how Smith/O'Brien/McNair are saving/destroying the team and how we are SB bound/Doomed to failure.
Let's save our hatred for I don't know maybe the Colts, Titans or Jags. Oh I know we can all hate on the Pats, hating on the Pats is like hating on the French nobody gets pissed if you hate on the French so it's a safe to hate on them all day, every day.
You got me wrong, I wasn't trying to prove anything. What I was saying is that to not know me at all Sandman made some serious accusations that will not be forgotten in future posts. I personally hope he doesn't respond to my posts anymore since he sees me in that light.
I was just waiting for someone to call me a racist. BTW, Ricky McNair sucking at his job has nothing to do with race. Ozzie is one of my favorite GM's in the league. Winston was my favorite QB coming out the yr he came out. If somebody is good/great at their job I let my thoughts be known. If they're not good at their job then the same can be said.
Likewise
And yes Ricky is an ass kisser at the least and ...... at worst.
I'm done here.
Hope you have a safe trip home and your spincther loosens up some before you leave the UK.
So .... earlier in this thread I was in favor of the trade but now that they have done exactly nothing with the cap space created by that 2nd round pick .... It appears to be an asset needlessly thrown away because of the nothing they have done.
There is the possibility that they use this space 10 days after the draft .... but I don't see anyone left on the free agent market that is going to command more than a portion of the $23.6m (not counting the draft pool) they have at their disposal. Don't see them using all that space filling several needs - SS, RT , G , QB & CB.
Maybe the plan is to carry that space over to next year ?! But what's the point if you don't have the QB in place to make you a true contender ?!
At this point , shedding The Blundering Wizard of Os and his contract looks like a colossal waste of assets.
There is the possibility that they use this space 10 days after the draft .... but I don't see anyone left on the free agent market that is going to command more than a portion of the $23.6m (not counting the draft pool) they have at their disposal. Don't see them using all that space filling several needs - SS, RT , G , QB & CB.
Maybe the plan is to carry that space over to next year ?! But what's the point if you don't have the QB in place to make you a true contender ?!
At this point , shedding The Blundering Wizard of Os and his contract looks like a colossal waste of assets.
I agree, this trade makes less sense with every day that passes by. The only good thing about signing Osweiler was that it didn't cost us any draft capital. & by giving up a 2nd to dump him, they made a bad deal worse.
At this point I have to agree with you. Just hoping that Rick buys a pick or pulls off a shocker deal that will make it all turn out, but I really doubt that happens
CloakNNNdagger
Hall of Fame
Minimize assets this year. Maximize assets next year. I doubt that we go all out on any QB this year. I doubt that O'Brien himself is left to pick a QB this year. After all, if you're making the environment such that it is likely that O'Brien for whatever reason will not be here next season, why would you allow him to pick. The next coach would want his own pick/style at QB to start off his tenure. Kubiak was saddled with Carr, but quickly made a personal choice for his own QB fit, Schaub.
dream_team
Hall of Fame
This move was an obvious attempt at getting Romo here. Unfortunately, didn't work out.
We can't slam the Texans for lack of taking chances on a QB, but when it doesn't work out, we slam them for taking that chance.
Can you imagine the rhetoric around here if we didn't make that Os deal? It would be all about missing on Romo because of the lack of cap space, or the FO not wanting to admit the Os failure.
I think just about everyone was okay with pulling the trigger on Brock in 2016. We desperately need a QB, and we did not know how awful he truly is at the position.
However, giving away a 2nd round pick - probably a high one next year, all things considered - for some misguided, delusional hope of signing a broken choker is all on them. It was colossally stupid.
TexansSeminole
Hall of Fame
I don't know that anyone slammed them for taking a chance on Brock. I'd like to see you show 3 people who have done so.
There was no lack of cap space in order to get Romo in the first place. They could have admitted failure with Brock by cutting him, and also signed Romo, if he was actually interested in the first place.
Literally, everything you said here has no basis.
Texian, scooter, and 76Texan.
TexansSeminole
Hall of Fame
dream_team
Hall of Fame
I agree with you that not many objected on Brock at the time. But after seeing that he was a failure here, there are a numerous amount (especially on TT) that would like to see someone in the FO fired for making the mistake. That's what I have a problem with. We can't plead for the FO take a chance on a QB, then slam them when it fails.
Not sure why you say it was misguided or delusional? Romo made it clear that the Texans were at the top of his list. If he was released when Jerry told Romo he was going to be released, then the Texans were ready to make a play for him. Odds are, he'd be a Texan right now. The "broken choker" part I can't argue against. But people called Peyton broken too before going to Denver.
TexansSeminole
Hall of Fame
You might be right @dream_team, but I haven't seen that. I see that people are more upset that they haven't been taking more chances in the draft at QB, where the investment is much lower.
Scooter
Funky
I was absolutely against it. I thought Brock was a horrible quarterback with next to no potential, and said so repeatedly. I'm all for taking a big swing at the quarterback position, but Brock is definitely not who I would have gone after. He certainly wasn't worth the large contract and guaranteed starting job to me.
I really don't believe that Romo was much of a priority .... Everything they said and everything he said points to that. Even the money points to that.
IF he had been a priority he'd be a Texan , not retired. If they wanted him , he was theirs to get - a draft pick of debatable value (5-6?) and salary of $14m this year with no guaranteed money beyond - Dallas would have been responsible for all the restructure bonus money $5.7m this year an additional $8.9m total ($5.7m +$3.2m) for next two years of the deal and $5m in signing bonus money- $19.6m dead money on their cap. With the Texans having the ability to cut him at any time with no cap concerns going forward.
(Even with him retiring , the Cowboys still owe him that $14.7m in restructure money the $5m signing bonus already having been paid but not accounted for on the cap)
I didn't realize this until yesterday , looking over the details of his contract. Its obvious that the Texans had no desire to bring him in , that was all fan and media driven speculation .... Reasonable when you look at the circumstances of both the Texans and Romo.
So .... that leads me to believe that the Blundering Wizard of Os was some serious cancer that had to be removed otherwise they wouldn't have wasted the asset to get rid of him and not use the cap space generated in the process .... Or the target of their desires and reason for that cap space is still out there , the trigger just hasn't been pulled.
So who could the reason for that cap space be ?! Or was Os just that much of a cancer ?!
maverick512000
Hall of Fame
I'm really starting to wonder if multiple people, BoB included, didn't say that we got to get him out of here no matter the cost. We can, and have, debate all day about the relationship between Smith and O'Brian but the fact is by the end of the season BoB and Osweiler were, well let's just say they weren't on the same page.
That's the main reason why I say that RS and BoB don't hate each other as much as some think because if they did RS would have saddled BoB with Osweiler for another year. We on these boards might have been pissed and maybe even stop watching but the average fan would have still gone to the games because for most it's about the experience as much as it is about the team so you can't say he did it because the fans would revolt.
Instead RS made his job much harder and took a serious hit to his reputation as a GM by giving up a second round next year. This isn't me defending him, ultimately it's his job to build the team and QB should have been one of the first blocks years ago, this is me trying to see the big picture without just trying to fit in a narrative of Smith/McNair/O'Brian sucking or not. Add to that BoB comments about how he thinks RS has a good eye for talent, comments which go beyond just toeing the line, and I really don't see all this evidence of the HC and GM hating each other that some do.
I think a few people on here are projecting.
Texian
Hall of Fame
I wasn't a fan of signing Brock for several reasons, mainly the scouting reports on Brock are who they said he is, only sees half of the field, slow to process information and displays a lack of accuracy. I thought it preposterous to give an unproven backup a $72 million contract. I was asked to do a objective evaluation of the Pats game. What I said is Denver beat the Patriots with their defense and 200+ yds rushing. Brock did nothing extraordinary to win that game. His success was not making any mistakes to cost them that game and that could be attributed to Kubiak play calling to help Brock stay out of trouble. I thought it even more absurd that no one from the Texans took the time to sit down and meet with Brock one to one, eyeball to eyeball. It was typical Bob McNair rush to judgement, band aid, throw cash at a problem management style. Another classic example of people seeing and hearing what they want to see and hear and not what their eyes and ears are actually telling them.
It's not that I am not a fan of the spending cap, I am a fan of wiser smarter spending cap. In a nutshell I'm not a fan of the Texans history of a having top heavy cap that limits half of the team to league minimum salaries and starting each new season with a cash poor salary cap. You get what you pay for. Texans management of their salary cap is poorly done.
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C'mon, man. First let's set the record straight that Romo is NOWHERE near the level of QB of Peyton Manning. All this unsubstantiated hoopla over Romo the past couple of months is beyond my comprehension. Dude has been an alright QB, but that's it.
Manning, on the other hand, is easily in the top 5 of all time great NFL QBs. And at the time, he was broken. But, his experience and more importantly, his brain, were intangibles that made the risk worth it.
As far as misguided or delusional, Romo is fragile. He would not have lasted an entire season. And it is silly to see him as any kind of savior for the Texans with his 2 playoff wins in 14 seasons. That's just the smell of desperation.
You could be right, but so could the media reports. I tend to believe where there is smoke, there is fire. This team is desperate for a QB, and it would not surprise me at all to learn that McNair really wanted Romo. That kind of "big splash" signing of an over-the-hill broken player is his M.O., all history considered.
They had the option of just cutting Brock if he was a cancer and detrimental to the franchise. They clearly wanted that cap space for a reason. Perhaps it was Romo, or maybe it's another target. So far, though, they have provided us with absolutely nothing to indicate that they have any sort of plan. Bob, Cal, and Rick are three blind mice right now.
I've got to go-sign this point. My money says O'Brien himself went to Smith/McNair and told them he wanted Osweiler gone. Period. Especially after they almost went to fist-city.
Now whether the trade with Cleveland was necessary depends on (a) which is more important to you, cap space or draft picks and (b) whether getting Romo was really ever a plan that could be pulled off. I think early on it was but Jerrah kinda screwed that up.
Again, we could have cut him for nothing, no additional cost. If it was simply a matter of getting rid of Brock... we cut him.
Giving away the 2nd round pick was about cap space, or keeping money in McNair's pocket.
If it's about the cap space, why? We haven't used it & all the FAs who would have required it are gone.
If we gave up a 2nd round pick to keep $16M in McNair's pocket... I think that is a stupid use of a 2nd round pick. But I've never had $16M in my pocket so what would I know?
TripleTap
Dead Wood
Two cents:
(1) Osweiler will be starting QB for Browns this year and will do very well;
(2) All the talk about Osweiler and O'Brien butting heads probably accurate and in part because O'Brien declined to tailor offense for Osweiler.
Not a big fan of Osweiler, but he did well in Denver which suggests he's capable, under right circumstances, to perform in NFL.
(1) Osweiler will be starting QB for Browns this year and will do very well;
(2) All the talk about Osweiler and O'Brien butting heads probably accurate and in part because O'Brien declined to tailor offense for Osweiler.
Not a big fan of Osweiler, but he did well in Denver which suggests he's capable, under right circumstances, to perform in NFL.
xtruroyaltyx
Hall of Fame
Rick Smith's tenure is a direct reflection of the McNair family. If not Smith, then some other lackey who conducts himself in the same milquetoast manner.
I expect generations of this sort of bumbling management that will cycle an occasional just-good-enough-to-get-to-playoffs results since Cal is a chip off the ol' block. Dude can't even pick out his own clothes. . .
Lmao
Hervoyel
BUENO!
Rick Smith's tenure is a direct reflection of the McNair family. If not Smith, then some other lackey who conducts himself in the same milquetoast manner.
I expect generations of this sort of bumbling management that will cycle an occasional just-good-enough-to-get-to-playoffs results since Cal is a chip off the ol' block. Dude can't even pick out his own clothes. . .
Hey! Cal was taught "Giraffe goes with Giraffe", "Lion goes with Lion", and so on.
The Garanimals approach has always served him well.
(1) Please, no drinking while posting. People can get hurt from laughing too hard.
(2) How would one tailor an offense to Brock? Handoffs and screen passes only?
DX-TEX
#TomSavageDontCare
Kubiak'ed!
CloakNNNdagger
Hall of Fame
Brock Osweiler may be with the Browns for start of training camp
2:49 PM CT
BEREA, Ohio -- Brock Osweiler's future remains murky, but the Cleveland Browns said Wednesday that he may be with the team for the start of training camp.
Browns VP Sashi Brown quashed speculation that the team might trade for a veteran quarterback, saying it's not part of the plan.
"Yeah, we expect Brock to be here," vice president of football operations Sashi Brown said when asked whether Osweiler would be on the team in training camp. "He is in [for the offseason program] and has done a good job coming in the first couple days. He is a positive young man who has some ability and talent. We look forward to him trying to establish himself here and have a chance to compete to be the starting quarterback."
Although Brown's words sounded definite, it's expected the Browns will continue to pursue a trade involving Osweiler during the draft.
Having the chance to compete of course depends on whether Osweiler is on the roster. At the NFL's spring meetings, coach Hue Jackson said he did not know whether Osweiler would be on the team in August. ESPN Cleveland reported that he will not be made available to the media until after the draft to be sure he's on the team at that point.
The team acquired him in early March in a deal that allowed Houston to send Osweiler's $16 million guaranteed salary to Cleveland and allowed the Browns to add a second-round draft pick in 2018.
The Browns did not originally intend to keep Osweiler. Instead, they hoped to trade him again for another draft pick.
If Osweiler stays on the team, he would join Cody Kessler, Kevin Hogan and a draftee as possible starters for the Browns in '17.
Osweiler was signed by the Texans a year ago to a four-year, $72 million free-agent deal. After he completed 59 percent of his passes with 15 touchdowns and 16 interceptions, the Texans sent him to Cleveland to get out of $16 million in guaranteed money.
**************************************************************************************************
A raving endorsement.
2:49 PM CT
- Pat McManamonESPN Staff Writer
BEREA, Ohio -- Brock Osweiler's future remains murky, but the Cleveland Browns said Wednesday that he may be with the team for the start of training camp.
Browns VP Sashi Brown quashed speculation that the team might trade for a veteran quarterback, saying it's not part of the plan.
"Yeah, we expect Brock to be here," vice president of football operations Sashi Brown said when asked whether Osweiler would be on the team in training camp. "He is in [for the offseason program] and has done a good job coming in the first couple days. He is a positive young man who has some ability and talent. We look forward to him trying to establish himself here and have a chance to compete to be the starting quarterback."
Although Brown's words sounded definite, it's expected the Browns will continue to pursue a trade involving Osweiler during the draft.
Having the chance to compete of course depends on whether Osweiler is on the roster. At the NFL's spring meetings, coach Hue Jackson said he did not know whether Osweiler would be on the team in August. ESPN Cleveland reported that he will not be made available to the media until after the draft to be sure he's on the team at that point.
The team acquired him in early March in a deal that allowed Houston to send Osweiler's $16 million guaranteed salary to Cleveland and allowed the Browns to add a second-round draft pick in 2018.
The Browns did not originally intend to keep Osweiler. Instead, they hoped to trade him again for another draft pick.
If Osweiler stays on the team, he would join Cody Kessler, Kevin Hogan and a draftee as possible starters for the Browns in '17.
Osweiler was signed by the Texans a year ago to a four-year, $72 million free-agent deal. After he completed 59 percent of his passes with 15 touchdowns and 16 interceptions, the Texans sent him to Cleveland to get out of $16 million in guaranteed money.
**************************************************************************************************
A raving endorsement.
...but at who?
Scooter
Funky
...but at who?
When you have to pay
a second round pick to take your starting quarterback, and he's a 'maybe' on the roster. There's a very direct line of laughter. Kinda makes it worse that this is an old photo and still their X'd #4 is our current backup.
I don't know about tailoring an offense for Brock, but I hope we see the things every other coach does with young QBs, or with rhythm QBs & call plays that help a young QB string together good series.
Maybe the fault was Brock's limitations. But run, run, throw on third & long doesn't help. & my point is that there were big problems with the play calling all year. Didn't look like the team was playing to their strengths. You could almost argue the plays were called to emphasize our weaknesses.
FYI,
Using Play finder from Profootball Reference, it shows that the Texans totaled 473 plays on first down.
They chose to pass 243 times and to run 218 times.
( Don't tell me that Savage always pass on first down.)
Osweiler threw 8 INTs on first downs.
(That's half of his total.)
Beer and Metal
Buzzed Cacophony
It's all making sense now, and it's a brilliant move by the Texans. They must have consulted with Ms. Cleo, the Long Island Medium and that creepy lady from Poltergeist.
All the evil spirits plaguing Houston football must have attached themselves to Brock's contact. If they had just cut him, they would've just stuck around. Now, all that bad juju is in a place where it will feel at home.
The Browns talking about keeping Brock is what convinced me.
All the evil spirits plaguing Houston football must have attached themselves to Brock's contact. If they had just cut him, they would've just stuck around. Now, all that bad juju is in a place where it will feel at home.
The Browns talking about keeping Brock is what convinced me.
TxnsJuggernaut
Veteran
My hunch is that under the right circumstances Brock Osweiler will atleast be serviceable.
Max
Veteran
Almost the entire season I felt like Brock could have played better with play calling that did a better job of getting him into a rhythm. I saw the light during the final NE game when a more opened up game was called - which I thought he would perform better in - and he stunk up the joint.
I wouldn't rule out some moderate success in the league but it doesn't seem likely. So if Brock were to do well elsewhere, would it help the organization see the light concerning BOB and help them to decide to show him the door? Hmmmmmmmm
I wouldn't rule out some moderate success in the league but it doesn't seem likely. So if Brock were to do well elsewhere, would it help the organization see the light concerning BOB and help them to decide to show him the door? Hmmmmmmmm
Speedy
Former Yeller Dweller
Yeah, they definitely threw on 1st down because damn near every incomplete pass on 1st down was followed by a run on 2nd and 10.
