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Texans Offensive Line

FuzzyLogic said:
I'm confused - we're good with PFF stats when they are good for our players but when they are bad PFF is just a bunch of guys on a couch like us?
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Depends on who you say is 'we'. I have always used PFF as just another source to provide some information. Nothing is better than actual game film.
 
thunderkyss said:
Yeah, whoever is saying the problem is the Tackles have some explaining to do.
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Ah, I think it is just that bad plays remain with us longer than good plays. It may have been Tunsil but some offensive tackle said not long ago that he has to be "on" every play as one "bad" play can make him look like a fool. There were several plays last week that the offensive line did well for Stroud.
 
badboy said:
Must be scary ghosts as our guys jump.
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I think Casper the friendly ghost would make Tunsil jump.

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I just read through each and every post again. This may be the most discombobulated post I've ever read through. These are some very basic principles were considering. Is the offensive line doing a good job ? Are they capable of doing a good job ? Are they spending the effort required ? Are they mentally prepared to do a good job ? Are they laying down on the job ? Are they lazy, out of shape, or trying to spite the quarterback ? Do you see them as capable of improving .... One Hell of a Lot ? BTW, I'm not including center or right guard ... at least not yet. If the answer to is no - I would say they need to be traded ASAP - including, and especially the last one ! I may be way off base .... I never played OL. Either these guys can't .... or they don't want to ! Seriously, am I off base ?
 
welsh texan said:
The whole Tytus Howard Houston Texans tenure doesn’t make any sense. Drafted to play Left Tackle in the first round, you then cross train him on the IOL all through OTA’s and training camp, and replace him through a mega trade before the season begins. You then change your blocking scheme AND his position at regular intervals through his rookie contract, and you resign him to a big extension whilst he’s struggling with both injury and position.

Similar to many of the players on the line, we’ve chopped and changed what we want our OL to be so often whilst repeatedly investing big picks and contracts that force the next coach/scheme to try and shoehorn them into a different scheme.
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This is the most concerning...but what's done is done. I don't expect him to be starting on our OL after this season.
 
thunderkyss said:
Yeah, whoever is saying the problem is the Tackles have some explaining to do.
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Well, could be because this board is myopic, and not comparing our players against the league as a whole. And also, clicking on Tunsil will bring up other grades. His run blocking grade is 64.3, 51/120. And his overall grade is 66.9, 42/120.
 

22) Houston Texans​

Starting five: LT Laremy Tunsil, LG Kendrick Green, C Juice Scruggs, RG Shaq Mason, RT Tytus Howard

Houston’s OL lost more adjusted games to injury in 2023 than any front five in NFL history. It was fair to excuse the unit’s poor production last season because it was missing so many of its projected starters.

While the Texans have been much healthier this year, the results have arguably been worse. Sure, Laremy Tunsil, Juice Scruggs, and Tytus Howard have been banged up here and there, but they’ve all played at least 400 snaps.

 
What has really concerned me this game is how little the OL seemed to care about Stroud's wellbeing. When other QBs take even a hint of an excessive or late hit, their linement are all over the perceived offender like white on rice. Our OL? Zip, nada, nothing. Stroud would be surrounded by Colts jerseys and it felt like our linemen were just wandering around like capybaras. There was this one play that I remarked on in the game thread where Stroud was knocked on his ass and the REF was the one to pull him back up. Another one, Stroud was clearly hurting after taking a hit to his back and not a single linemen was like "Homie, you alright?" Like seriously, what gives?
 
chenjy9 said:
What has really concerned me this game is how little the OL seemed to care about Stroud's wellbeing. When other QBs take even a hint of an excessive or late hit, their linement are all over the perceived offender like white on rice. Our OL? Zip, nada, nothing. Stroud would be surrounded by Colts jerseys and it felt like our linemen were just wandering around like capybaras. There was this one play that I remarked on in the game thread where Stroud was knocked on his ass and the REF was the one to pull him back up. Another one, Stroud was clearly hurting after taking a hit to his back and not a single linemen was like "Homie, you alright?" Like seriously, what gives?
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I’ve noticed it, too! I’m not going to speculate why, but I know that wasn’t the case last year.
 
chenjy9 said:
What has really concerned me this game is how little the OL seemed to care about Stroud's wellbeing. When other QBs take even a hint of an excessive or late hit, their linement are all over the perceived offender like white on rice. Our OL? Zip, nada, nothing. Stroud would be surrounded by Colts jerseys and it felt like our linemen were just wandering around like capybaras. There was this one play that I remarked on in the game thread where Stroud was knocked on his ass and the REF was the one to pull him back up. Another one, Stroud was clearly hurting after taking a hit to his back and not a single linemen was like "Homie, you alright?" Like seriously, what gives?
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Imentioned this in the 2nd Colts game day thread. Green got CJ killed and just strolled back towards the huddle. No one helped CJ up.
 
chenjy9 said:
What has really concerned me this game is how little the OL seemed to care about Stroud's wellbeing. When other QBs take even a hint of an excessive or late hit, their linement are all over the perceived offender like white on rice. Our OL? Zip, nada, nothing. Stroud would be surrounded by Colts jerseys and it felt like our linemen were just wandering around like capybaras. There was this one play that I remarked on in the game thread where Stroud was knocked on his ass and the REF was the one to pull him back up. Another one, Stroud was clearly hurting after taking a hit to his back and not a single linemen was like "Homie, you alright?" Like seriously, what gives?
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I once observed a capybara, on Christmas Eve, sitting all alone in a quaint little church - in vila de carme. It was singing the sweetest little rendition of "I wonder as I wander." ...... talk about touching ......
 
I agree with exactly what you say ..... and still, I feel if we up grade at each of the five positions, we will be Superbowl worthy.
 
justmy2cents said:
Hey Badboy, I know you've begun to think about what needs to be done about our offensive line ... care to share any of your ideas? Do you see anyone on the line that DOESN"T need to be replaced ?
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Sorry, I just saw your request. To answer your question I think Patterson or Scruggs will be at left guard with the other at center. The other three remain at left tackle; right tackle as well as Right Guard. There just are not many options in my opinion.

LT Wyatt Milum from West Virginia is 'my guy' in round 2 although he is climbing charts and one source has him round 1.
I allow him to develop because as frustrated as I get with Tunsil; I just see no better option.
I don't see any trade that would bring us what I think would be needed to replace Laremy. After this year if Fisher continues to develop and he needs to get into the game for that, my mind could change. I do not see us doing any trade of significance for any position at the NFL deadline.
 
NitroGSXR said:
He was also the weakest link last year by far. In fact… rated the -worst- guard in the NFL last year per his wiki page.
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Yes and there have been calls for Broeker and Kendrick Green but that has not happened. Evidently the coaches are not seeing in those two during practice what would get them a starter opportunity. We did see Patterson get the opportunity and I think that is because he is now healthy for the first time. In the short time he was at left guard, Jarrett was very good.
 
OptimisticTexan said:
Food for thought….after 7 weeks, every NFL DC has seen the film and concluded, the Texans OL has “zero” ability to diagnose and prevent the success of defensive stunts. What does this mean? Texans OL will see an onslaught of loaded boxes and stunts for the next 10 games. What does this mean? Maybe that’s as far as the season goes.
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I think when Collins returns we will see more deep throws by Stroud and also more rollouts. It seems like part of our issue is we don't use our hurry up offense which has been successful historically since CJ came aboard.

Quick throws to TEs and RBs would help but our TEs haven't been good with short throws [for that matter, neither has Diggs] and not enough targets for Mixon. Versus Colts he saw increased opportunities and the results were four catches for 32 yards! We need to see more of that Thursday.
 
TexansBull said:
I moved this over here because it seemed relevant.

The crazy part of this is we got Tunsil’s best years in years in one of Watson and then a lot of years with Mills. Now with Stroud and a team that has the potential to go to the AFC Championship Game at a minimum this dude wants to half ass it.

Trade him for another LT. If we have to eat the contract than whatever. His attitude is hurting the Oline effort and QB health that results in loses.

The Oline is the only part of the team that doesn't have the SWARM mentality. And that falls on Tunsil, the Oline Coach, and Slowik. And then ultimately - Demeco.
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Why would another NFL team trade for a player as you described Tunsil?
 
badboy said:
Yes and there have been calls for Broeker and Kendrick Green but that has not happened. Evidently the coaches are not seeing in those two during practice what would get them a starter opportunity. We did see Patterson get the opportunity and I think that is because he is now healthy for the first time. In the short time he was at left guard, Jarrett was very good.
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I just finished the all-22 from yesterday and I watched the Patterson drive several times. Man he looked terrible. He was able to engage a little better than Green once or twice but Tunsil was helping him… a lot. I mean… the man basically concussed himself with piss poor balance. He is -bad- right now. We need to keep looking.
 
badboy said:
Actually the game did improve my opinion as Patterson looked extremely good replacing Kenyon at left guard. Howard looked better than he has. I expect same overall results vs Jets as no time to recover and Patterson will not play. Still, I see a win for Houston.
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Watch the all-22. He looked -horrible-
 
badboy said:
We traded for Tunsil's potential. Your description of Tunsil says he doesnt have potential to be a good starting tackle.. on any team.
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Tunsil had already proven himself to be a good tackle. OB wasn’t trading for potential. He was trading for the sure thing.

And you ignored the main point of my post.

People are dumb.

Which is ironic…
 
TexansBull said:
Tunsil had already proven himself to be a good tackle. OB wasn’t trading for potential. He was trading for the sure thing.

And you ignored the main point of my post.

People are dumb.

Which is ironic…
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Then it should be no problem to get that deal. Some here have mentioned that they want Laremy tunsil gone whether we get anything or not. I do understand that frustration but it is not good business sense.

Do you have any thoughts on how we replace him and with whom?
 
badboy said:
Do you have any thoughts on how we replace him and with whom?
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No. My level of expertise is to only point out the obvious and provide no solutions.

Edit - And then I will complain why nothing was never done about it.

And then when there is a solution I will complain about it not being the right one or when it works I will complain why it wasn’t done sooner and I knew the answer to the problem the whole time.
 
DocBar said:
Imentioned this in the 2nd Colts game day thread. Green got CJ killed and just strolled back towards the huddle. No one helped CJ up.
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DanielTx said:
I noticed multiple defenders jawing at Cj after the sideline hit in Greenbay. The soft line didn’t come to his defense. Very disappointing I tell you
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I wonder if CJ pissed off the line and told them “You guys suck. You are going to get me killed. Play better or I will get Nick to trade every last one of suckers to the Browns where you can give Watson a happy ending.”

I could see CJ doing that.
 
NitroGSXR said:
I just finished the all-22 from yesterday and I watched the Patterson drive several times. Man he looked terrible. He was able to engage a little better than Green once or twice but Tunsil was helping him… a lot. I mean… the man basically concussed himself with piss poor balance. He is -bad- right now. We need to keep looking.
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Peterson made a really good block to spring Mixon on his TD run. So he certainly wasn't terrible.
 
NitroGSXR said:
CJ also refused to get up after Tunsil or Green offered his hand yesterday.
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Yeah, Demeco and Caserio saw that for sure. Cj looked frustrated and hurt from the hit. Think that’s the play Deforest was lined up in front of Kenyon Green who double teamed all pro Tunsil man. Maybe it’s not the coaches. Just maybe, Kenyon Green isn't smart enough to be a nfl football player. Maybe he struggles with memorizing and processing the play assignments which leads him to be confused and Cj being pressured. It doesn’t help that he benched the lowest reps in his draft class for line men.

TexansBull said:
I wonder if CJ pissed off the line and told them “You guys suck. You are going to get me killed. Play better or I will get Nick to trade every last one of suckers to the Browns where you can give Watson a happy ending.”

I could see CJ doing that.
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Haha, I believe the line felt annoyed and slightly disrespected. The announcers stated, Cj told his line, “I need more time guys”. One of those situations where the line didn’t want to take accountability and were mentally and physically defeated. Body language said it all.
 
steelbtexan said:
Peterson made a really good block to spring Mixon on his TD run. So he certainly wasn't terrible.
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He was thrown ASIDE LIKE A RAGDOLL by the DT and fell down onto the ground. He stopped himself from falling with his arms but he went -down-. Tunsil had to wrap his arms around the DT to hold him so Patterson could get himself back up and ultimately into #45 who kneed him into a concussion. If that’s the block… then gosh I don’t know what to say. Look at the all-22. While we were fortunate, the play looked terrible.

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NitroGSXR said:
He was thrown ASIDE LIKE A RAGDOLL by the DT and fell down onto the ground. He stopped himself from falling with his arms but he went -down-. Tunsil had to wrap his arms around the DT to hold him so Patterson could get himself back up and ultimately into #45 who kneed him into a concussion. If that’s the block… then gosh I don’t know what to say. Look at the all-22. While we were fortunate, the play looked terrible.

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Regardless of how it looked he got the block that mattered on #45.
 
NitroGSXR said:
He was thrown ASIDE LIKE A RAGDOLL by the DT and fell down onto the ground. He stopped himself from falling with his arms but he went -down-. Tunsil had to wrap his arms around the DT to hold him so Patterson could get himself back up and ultimately into #45 who kneed him into a concussion. If that’s the block… then gosh I don’t know what to say. Look at the all-22. While we were fortunate, the play looked terrible.

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I don’t think his assignment was to hold that block. More of a block the DT for 2 seconds and move on to block the linebacker
 
badboy said:
Sorry, I just saw your request. To answer your question I think Patterson or Scruggs will be at left guard with the other at center. The other three remain at left tackle; right tackle as well as Right Guard. There just are not many options in my opinion.

LT Wyatt Milum from West Virginia is 'my guy' in round 2 although he is climbing charts and one source has him round 1.
I allow him to develop because as frustrated as I get with Tunsil; I just see no better option.
I don't see any trade that would bring us what I think would be needed to replace Laremy. After this year if Fisher continues to develop and he needs to get into the game for that, my mind could change. I do not see us doing any trade of significance for any position at the NFL deadline.
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Milum is becoming a stud .... quickly ..... I'd grab him in a second if he was there !
 
NitroGSXR said:
I just finished the all-22 from yesterday and I watched the Patterson drive several times. Man he looked terrible. He was able to engage a little better than Green once or twice but Tunsil was helping him… a lot. I mean… the man basically concussed himself with piss poor balance. He is -bad- right now. We need to keep looking.
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How would you grade Scruggs?
 
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