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Stupor Bowl Ring Not withstanding Joe Flacco STILL aint that great

Dread-Head

Hall of Fame
He has a Superbowl ring and in his mind this makes him worth the $20million a year he THINKS he's worth, but let's be honest. If you gave David Carr Antoine Bolden he'd look like a probowl QB. The Raven's D and some blind refs gave them a Championship it still doesn't change the fact that Flacco doesn't warrant being mentioned in the same breath with Manning, Brady, Rogers, Roethlisburger, Brees or some of the elites to have played the position. For what it's worth hell David Carr has a stupor bowl ring too...doesn't make HIM a better QB.
 

Luv_ya_blue

Truth, Love, Faith & Obedience - Christianity 101
I know you did NOT mention David C***!


Just said it before someone else does.
I agree fwiw.
 

Vinny

shiny happy fan
He has a Superbowl ring and in his mind this makes him worth the $20million a year he THINKS he's worth, but let's be honest. If you gave David Carr Antoine Bolden he'd look like a probowl QB. The Raven's D and some blind refs gave them a Championship it still doesn't change the fact that Flacco doesn't warrant being mentioned in the same breath with Manning, Brady, Rogers, Roethlisburger, Brees or some of the elites to have played the position. For what it's worth hell David Carr has a stupor bowl ring too...doesn't make HIM a better QB.
I find it hard to believe that people watching the playoffs can come to the conclusion that Joe Flacco isn't that good. Bolden is past his prime and cannot create separation and Flacco made some UNREAL passes to him in tight coverages. Flacco escaping the rush was just awesome yesterday...Shaub would have been killed or at least those balls were in the cheap seats but Flacco made completions out of them. Kudos to Bolden for beasting up and making strong-man catches, but it continues to amaze me when people debate if a guy is good or not right after he plays a great series of games.

You can continue to stay married to your 2010 take on Flacco....I'll stick to what my eyes tell me in 2013
 

Rey

Guest
I find it hard to believe that people watching the playoffs can come to the conclusion that Joe Flacco isn't that good. Bolden is past his prime and cannot create separation and Flacco made some UNREAL passes to him in tight coverages. Flacco escaping the rush was just awesome yesterday...Shaub would have been killed or at least those balls were in the cheap seats but Flacco made completions out of them. Kudos to Bolden for beasting up and making strong-man catches, but it continues to amaze me when people debate if a guy is good or not right after he plays a great series of games.

You can continue to stay married to your 2010 take on Flacco....I'll stick to what my eyes tell me in 2013
Must spread....

I do not know what people look at sometimes...

Carr had Andre Johnson, but now if he gets Boldin he's winning superbowls??:barman:
 

Luv_ya_blue

Truth, Love, Faith & Obedience - Christianity 101
I would have said "Bubby Brister 2.0" or "Flacco 1.0" but some wouldn't have known what I meant.
I don't have the anti-Carr venom that some do `round these parts.

I see Flacco as being the role player WITH the tools that are needed to take the team where they need to go. Let's be honest, if not for J@**** Freakin' J@*** and his TWO TDs, there's really not a game at all. But Flacco managed to hit him for one of those TDs and if the 49ers defender doesn't do some stupid hurdling move instead of touching the player--it may be a 3 point drive rather than ending up 7. Take the KR for TD off the board and the 49ers win this one convincingly.

But that's all pie-in-the-sky because it didn't end up that way. In any event, I don't know that you need a superstar/elite QB to win a championship. I mean for Pete's sake, the Ravens have shown that to be true with 1st Dilfer and now Flacco! But if the coaches choose to make him (and his weaknesses) the core of the scheme because they choose to try and constantly outthink the room, rather than just DO WHAT WORKS, it's on them.
 

Luv_ya_blue

Truth, Love, Faith & Obedience - Christianity 101
I find it hard to believe that people watching the playoffs can come to the conclusion that Joe Flacco isn't that good. Bolden is past his prime and cannot create separation and Flacco made some UNREAL passes to him in tight coverages. Flacco escaping the rush was just awesome yesterday...Shaub would have been killed or at least those balls were in the cheap seats but Flacco made completions out of them. Kudos to Bolden for beasting up and making strong-man catches, but it continues to amaze me when people debate if a guy is good or not right after he plays a great series of games.

You can continue to stay married to your 2010 take on Flacco....I'll stick to what my eyes tell me in 2013
He absolutely made some great passes.
I just don't see Flacco nearly as much elite as he is, fortunate to fit into the system.

I could be wrong.
 

TexanSam

Hall of Fame
David Carr had Andre Johnson. Joe Flacco may not be elite during the regular season, but this is two years in a row where he's been excellent in the post-season. He's great when it counts.
 

GP

Go Texans!
Is He or Is He Not Elite Joe Flacco, I Fumble Everything Jacoby Jones, Old Man Boldin, Old Man Lewis, Old Man Leach, Penalty Fanatic Pollard, a new o-coordinator halfway through the reg season, they just pretty much told everybody to STFU. IMO.

But yeah, let's try to rationalize why they just lucked into a SB ring.

Some people will do anything to minimize the pain of being a Texans fan.

By the way, they came back and beat the Broncos (tried like hell to help us out by giving us one half of the equation for Home Field in a potential Houston-hosted AFCC game, by the way). Then they freaking DRUBBED the Patriots and made them look like maroons.

Pretty bad thread decision, DreadHead. Take a mulligan.
 

Vinny

shiny happy fan
He absolutely made some great passes.
I just don't see Flacco nearly as much elite as he is, fortunate to fit into the system.

I could be wrong.
Did Joe Flacco just have the best playoffs of any quarterback we've ever seen?

Not joking. This is a conversation that absolutely needs to be had. The Flacchise has numbers that place him into that discussion, and if anything, the numbers might underrate how good he's been during these playoffs.

Let's start with the numbers, though, because they're staggering. Flacco finished the postseason having gone 73-of-126 (57.9 percent) for 1,140 passing yards with 11 touchdowns and zero interceptions. Eleven to zero. Only one other player since the merger has produced a touchdown-to-interception ratio equal to or better than that in the playoffs, and it's a guy who has a pretty sterling postseason reputation: Joe Montana.

Montana's 1989 season pretty clearly stands out to me as the greatest postseason run since 1970, but I've gone ahead and listed some other notable Super Bowl–winning postseasons that might put Flacco's big January into context:

Player Year Team GP Cmp Att Cmp% Yds Y/Att TD INT Rating Yds/Gm
Joe Montana 1989 49ers 3 65 83 78.3% 800 9.6 11 0 146.4 266.7
Troy Aikman 1992 Cowboys 3 61 89 68.5% 795 8.9 8 0 126.4 265.0
Steve Young 1994 49ers 3 53 87 60.9% 623 7.2 9 0 117.2 207.7
Joe Flacco 2012 Ravens 4 73 126 57.9% 1140 9.0 11 0 117.2 285.0
Drew Brees 2009 Saints 3 72 102 70.6% 732 7.2 8 0 117.0 244.0
Joe Montana 1988 49ers 3 56 90 62.2% 823 9.1 8 1 117.0 274.3
Joe Theismann 1982 Redskins 4 58 85 68.2% 716 8.4 8 3 110.7 179.0
Aaron Rodgers 2010 Packers 4 90 132 68.2% 1094 8.3 9 2 109.8 273.5
Terry Bradshaw 1978 Steelers 3 44 78 56.4% 790 10.1 8 4 104.1 263.3
Eli Manning 2011 Giants 4 106 163 65.0% 1219 7.5 9 1 103.3 304.8


It's admittedly going to be hard to top Montana, who basically played perfect football for three consecutive weeks. Flacco arguably had to shoulder a heavier portion of the workload than Montana did with his 49ers, but that's partly due to a shift in league trends; note that Aaron Rodgers (2010) and Eli Manning (2011) each threw more passes than Flacco and the rest of the group. Based on the numbers, Flacco probably belongs in a group just behind Montana, alongside Troy Aikman (1992) and Rodgers's 2010 campaign.
http://www.grantland.com/story/_/id/8912868/bill-barnwell-puts-ravens-win-perspective
 

Playoffs

Hall of Fame
Joe Flacco is better than he's been allowed to be under Cam Cameron.

He was the best QB in these playoffs with a 117 QB rating.

Gotta give the man his due -- he took the chances & they paid off. :clap:
 

Thorn

Dirty Old Man
It doesn't matter how good Flacid is. He won this years Super Bowl so he'll be a big topic all off season.
 

toronto

Hall of Fame
I was already on board with Flacco being damn good, but his post season elevated him to another level. Dread you took on the wrong QB here. This guys stock is google-sequence and deservedly so.

I would take him over almost any QB now. Smart, young, great deep ball and calm under pressure. And now, at its purest form, winner.
 

dtran04

Veteran
He deserves the payday that is upcoming. Although he should send a few million towards Rahim Moore. :)

Probably will make an extra $20 million because of the playoffs.
 

thunderkyss

Just win baby!!!
Staff member
Contributor's Club
Kudos to Bolden for beasting up and making strong-man catches, but it continues to amaze me when people debate if a guy is good or not right after he plays a great series of games.
What's worse, is that he did the same thing in last year's play-offs. Had this been the first time he put on a show like that, yeah I can see how some would attribute it to luck, or whatever. But a second time?

Surely you've got to at least acknowledge that maybe there's something there.
 

Lucky

Trust Me. I Know What I'm Doing.
Staff member
I don't know if Joe "Hardy" Flacco didn't made a Faustian deal. And I don't know if he will be an elite QB next season. But in these playoffs, he was elite. And I'm sure his agent will remind the Ravens.
 
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Texecutioner

Hall of Fame
I find it hard to believe that people watching the playoffs can come to the conclusion that Joe Flacco isn't that good. Bolden is past his prime and cannot create separation and Flacco made some UNREAL passes to him in tight coverages. Flacco escaping the rush was just awesome yesterday...Shaub would have been killed or at least those balls were in the cheap seats but Flacco made completions out of them. Kudos to Bolden for beasting up and making strong-man catches, but it continues to amaze me when people debate if a guy is good or not right after he plays a great series of games.

You can continue to stay married to your 2010 take on Flacco....I'll stick to what my eyes tell me in 2013
No question he has looked very good in the post season. But all of this elite talk has been pretty over the top and way to quick. Flacco has had a very nice run, and played pretty well in the post season last year, but he has to show that he carry his team from this point on and put the fear into defenses year after year. Guys like Rodgers, Brady, and Manning have been doing this for years at the highest level. That is why they are called elite in the first place. For years people have considered the QB position one of the weakest positions on the Ravens team with Flacco out there. Many of them even said at one point that the only reason why the Steelers had more SB rings then they did was because the Steelers had Ben and they had Flacco. People are forgetting that QB's and teams make big runs every year. Flacco has a lot further to go as far as getting into that conversation. This post season run that he helped to lead his team on was a giant leap for Flacco. Let's see if he can maintain that consistency in the season for 16 games without his fans and his team questioning him as the guy. Ravens fans have had just as much controversy with Flacco as the QB as Schaub has recently had here.
 

Dutchrudder

King of the Potato People
I think it's pretty obvious that the issue with the Ravens offense the past few years was Cam Cameron. Flacco looked like a different QB once Cam was gone, and the playbook was adjusted to work to Flacco's strengths, adjust the offensive line protections, and better scheme against the pass rush. I wouldn't call Flacco elite, but he's certainly moved in to the tier 2 discussion.
 

dream_team

Hall of Fame
Here's a better question. Would you pay 12+ mil a year for him? I think that's what Baltimore will end up giving him. Flacco made the smartest decision in his life by not extending before the season.
 
Flacco isn't a bum, but nobody was calling this guy elite 4 weeks ago. Suddenly he has 2 good games (nothing amazing) and one decent game and he's being talked about like a guy who carries his team.

The playoffs have moved his valuation up, but you can't just erase years of average play.

He's never thrown for over 4,000 yards, and his best YPA season was just 7.4. He's not a guy who can throw a mediocre team on his back and take them deep in the playoffs every year like a Manning, Brady or Brees.

I would still rank him bellow Schaub and Rapistburger.

Here's a better question. Would you pay 12+ mil a year for him? I think that's what Baltimore will end up giving him. Flacco made the smartest decision in his life by not extending before the season.
With the state of QB salaries, Flacco has earned $12+ mil and I think most teams who don't have a better QB would cough up that and then some.
 

HoustonFrog

Dallas Frog
I find it hard to believe that people watching the playoffs can come to the conclusion that Joe Flacco isn't that good. Bolden is past his prime and cannot create separation and Flacco made some UNREAL passes to him in tight coverages. Flacco escaping the rush was just awesome yesterday...Shaub would have been killed or at least those balls were in the cheap seats but Flacco made completions out of them. Kudos to Bolden for beasting up and making strong-man catches, but it continues to amaze me when people debate if a guy is good or not right after he plays a great series of games.

You can continue to stay married to your 2010 take on Flacco....I'll stick to what my eyes tell me in 2013
This!!!!

11 TDs, 0 interceptions in playoffs. 124 QB rating in SB. And your behind the times if your pumping up their D. They were around 17th in every major category this year. Not the same team. He also was great using Torrey Smith and Jacoby. This is a fail when it comes to post ideas.

BTW, post Cam Cameron 5-2 with 15 TDs and 1 int.
 

handswarmer

Rookie
The lack of information nd football knowledge displayed in tis thread is astounding....

Dutchrudder, Texecutioner, CKHouston, Vinny and Houston Frog and others all made very salient points.

Others are like Jamie Dukes on NLFN and are still looking at Joe like its 09 or 10 seasons.

FWIW:

- Flacco has as many post season wins as Peyton Manning

- Flacco is tied with Joe Montana and Steve Young in post season history with 11 TDS and Zero INTS

- Flacco's records are too numerous to list in all seriousness.

The "ELITE" debate is stupid and meaningless= its a fool's debate because the debate is never quantified, the requirements for making the determination are never set and the guidelines are stretched, abused and broken to make an argument/point.

Joe is a SB MVP, a SB Champ and our QB....and will be for a long long time.
 

thunderkyss

Just win baby!!!
Staff member
Contributor's Club
This!!!!

11 TDs, 0 interceptions in playoffs. 124 QB rating in SB. And your behind the times if your pumping up their D. They were around 17th in every major category this year. Not the same team. He also was great using Torrey Smith and Jacoby. This is a fail when it comes to post ideas.

BTW, post Cam Cameron 5-2 with 15 TDs and 1 int.
There's another thread ("Oh my...") where the writer questions the small sample sizes we use to formulate our opinions. This 7 game stretch you're mentioning is just that. I'd have to imagine Flacco has posted similar numbers at some other time in his career. His play off performance last year was just as impressive as what he had done this year.

Just saying I don't know that removing Cam Cameron equals a better Flacco. When they played us over the last two or three years, they seemed to go deep quite a bit. They've always had a vertical offense, they just had issues providing the protection needed to do so.

Then there's the "firing the OC will light a fire under their butts" thing. Just the fact that Cameron was fired mid season could have been the mental motivation they needed & it's affects could wear off by September. Not saying that's the case, just saying that may be the primary reason for this "short-term" performance.

I'm all about Flacco, I think his stock has gone up as a result of his most recent play-off performance. I think it's confirmation of what we saw last year. So it's not that I don't think much of Flacco, just what we're attributing his success to. He's always been streaky. A couple of great games followed by a couple of duds.

He's definitely one of the better QBs in the league, but to be elite (not that you're saying he's elite) he's got to minimize those dud games.
 

thunderkyss

Just win baby!!!
Staff member
Contributor's Club
The "ELITE" debate is stupid and meaningless= its a fool's debate because the debate is never quantified, the requirements for making the determination are never set and the guidelines are stretched, abused and broken to make an argument/point.
Maybe you should take up another hobby if it's getting too intense for you. This isn't going to go away, it's just getting started. & if you're going to get your panties in a wad every time it comes up.... maybe you need a time out.


Joe is a SB MVP, a SB Champ and our QB....and will be for a long long time.
For some reason that doesn't scare me. I'm not worried about playing the Ravens next year. Our chances of winning is 50/50 if not better. In fact, I wouldn't be surprised if we're favored to win by more than the home field advantage (-3 if at Reliant).

Seriously doubt we'll be favored against the Patriots or the Packers or Saints (thank God we're not playing the Packers or Saints).
 

HoustonFrog

Dallas Frog
There's another thread ("Oh my...") where the writer questions the small sample sizes we use to formulate our opinions. This 7 game stretch you're mentioning is just that. I'd have to imagine Flacco has posted similar numbers at some other time in his career. His play off performance last year was just as impressive as what he had done this year.

Just saying I don't know that removing Cam Cameron equals a better Flacco. When they played us over the last two or three years, they seemed to go deep quite a bit. They've always had a vertical offense, they just had issues providing the protection needed to do so.

Then there's the "firing the OC will light a fire under their butts" thing. Just the fact that Cameron was fired mid season could have been the mental motivation they needed & it's affects could wear off by September. Not saying that's the case, just saying that may be the primary reason for this "short-term" performance.

I'm all about Flacco, I think his stock has gone up as a result of his most recent play-off performance. I think it's confirmation of what we saw last year. So it's not that I don't think much of Flacco, just what we're attributing his success to. He's always been streaky. A couple of great games followed by a couple of duds.

He's definitely one of the better QBs in the league, but to be elite (not that you're saying he's elite) he's got to minimize those dud games.
Give me a break. They haven't always been vertical. They have TRIED to be vertical but Cameron was giving the ball to Rice around 44% of the plays...which equals no play action and no one open deep. When Caldwell took over, Rice started getting it around 51% of the time and all of a sudden the deep ball and play action were open. Coincidence?

I don't care when his streak was. They just beat Indy, went on the road and beat Denver, went on the road and beat NE and then played in the SB and beat SF. Arguably the 3 top teams in the league in a row. In that span he doesn't throw an interception. Sorry, you can speculate all you want, the numbers play out that he played his tail off and stepped it up another level. Saying anything else is untruthful.

As for the word elite...I don't use it and not sure this makes him elite. I just know what he did was awesome. But there are elite QBs that all have dud games. Brady, Rodgers, etc all have bad games. So saying he has to be a stud for 16 games and playoffs makes no sense.
 

GP

Go Texans!
The lack of information nd football knowledge displayed in tis thread is astounding....

Dutchrudder, Texecutioner, CKHouston, Vinny and Houston Frog and others all made very salient points.

Others are like Jamie Dukes on NLFN and are still looking at Joe like its 09 or 10 seasons.

FWIW:

- Flacco has as many post season wins as Peyton Manning

- Flacco is tied with Joe Montana and Steve Young in post season history with 11 TDS and Zero INTS

- Flacco's records are too numerous to list in all seriousness.

The "ELITE" debate is stupid and meaningless= its a fool's debate because the debate is never quantified, the requirements for making the determination are never set and the guidelines are stretched, abused and broken to make an argument/point.

Joe is a SB MVP, a SB Champ and our QB....and will be for a long long time.
You left me off the Nice List :(

90% of us are accepting of Flacco. The hold-outs are more or less "sour grapes" posters who are jealous that a "blah" QB not named Matt Schaub won a ring.

Flacco's performance has underscored or highlighted Matt Schaub's lack of Big Game capabilities.

Jacoby's performance has done the same to Kubiak's player management and ineffectiveness at using the talent in ways that focuses on player strengths, i.e. "Letting the guys play and leaving the micromanagement at home." Once Jacoby landed on a team that didn't have a water-tight sphincter for a head coach, he becomes a new man all of a sudden.

So there's a few reasons why some Texans fans are not going to give propers to the Ravens. IMO, has less to do with lack of football knowledge and more to do with sour grapes AND a lack of reality in terms of how our team is woefully mismanaged by its HC.
 

Rey

Guest
So there's a few reasons why some Texans fans are not going to give propers to the Ravens. IMO, has less to do with lack of football knowledge and more to do with sour grapes AND a lack of reality in terms of how our team is woefully mismanaged by its HC.
This.
 

thunderkyss

Just win baby!!!
Staff member
Contributor's Club
Give me a break. They haven't always been vertical. They have TRIED to be vertical but Cameron was giving the ball to Rice around 44% of the plays...which equals no play action and no one open deep. When Caldwell took over, Rice started getting it around 51% of the time and all of a sudden the deep ball and play action were open. Coincidence?

I don't care when his streak was. They just beat Indy, went on the road and beat Denver, went on the road and beat NE and then played in the SB and beat SF. Arguably the 3 top teams in the league in a row. In that span he doesn't throw an interception. Sorry, you can speculate all you want, the numbers play out that he played his tail off and stepped it up another level. Saying anything else is untruthful.
Give me a break. I didn't say anything contrary to what you just said. They're more vertical now than they were under Cam... doesn't contradict what I said when you state they were "trying" to be vertical.. which is what I said.
As for the word elite...I don't use it and not sure this makes him elite. I just know what he did was awesome. But there are elite QBs that all have dud games. Brady, Rodgers, etc all have bad games. So saying he has to be a stud for 16 games and playoffs makes no sense.
I agree, which is why I didn't say that.
 

Dread-Head

Hall of Fame
Must spread....

I do not know what people look at sometimes...

Carr had Andre Johnson, but now if he gets Boldin AND A DEFENSE WHO HAS TO BE FED RAW MEAT he's winning superbowls??:barman:
:fingergun: There...fixed it for ya. Carr is now a back up to a guy who is slightly better than HE is but has a WALL of a defense which earned them BOTH of their superbowl rings. And doesn't Carr HAVE a ring now?
 

thunderkyss

Just win baby!!!
Staff member
Contributor's Club
Flacco's performance has underscored or highlighted Matt Schaub's lack of Big Game capabilities.
Flacco's performance definitely highlighted Matt's lack of big game production.

I am not convinced that Matt is not capable. He's definitely not capable in the way that Flacco is (though some will point to Flacco's undrthrown deep balls), but Matt is capable none the less.
 

HoustonFrog

Dallas Frog
Give me a break. I didn't say anything contrary to what you just said. They're more vertical now than they were under Cam... doesn't contradict what I said when you state they were "trying" to be vertical.. which is what I said.


I agree, which is why I didn't say that.
You said "He's definitely one of the better QBs in the league, but to be elite (not that you're saying he's elite) he's got to minimize those dud games."

My point being that you can't eliminate dud games. They happen to everyone. I'm not going to downgrade a guy who plays well when he has some bad games unless it becomes consistently like that or trends start developing.

You also said "they always had a vertical offense." The difference between what we are talking here is trying and having one. They way you talked Flacco was that he always threw deep and just now got streaky. My point was that he was put in the right offense finally to make it more about the talent he has always had vs. having to force despite the way the offense was run. My argument is he always had this talent but we are just now seeing what he can do with it. As I said, 0 ints vs Indy, Denver, NE and SF big time.

We are splitting hairs but when you jumped in and in yesterdays Schaub thread you definitely have/had a beef with Flacco being considered a top QB.
 

handswarmer

Rookie
You left me off the Nice List :(

90% of us are accepting of Flacco. The hold-outs are more or less "sour grapes" posters who are jealous that a "blah" QB not named Matt Schaub won a ring.

Flacco's performance has underscored or highlighted Matt Schaub's lack of Big Game capabilities.

Jacoby's performance has done the same to Kubiak's player management and ineffectiveness at using the talent in ways that focuses on player strengths, i.e. "Letting the guys play and leaving the micromanagement at home." Once Jacoby landed on a team that didn't have a water-tight sphincter for a head coach, he becomes a new man all of a sudden.

So there's a few reasons why some Texans fans are not going to give propers to the Ravens. IMO, has less to do with lack of football knowledge and more to do with sour grapes AND a lack of reality in terms of how our team is woefully mismanaged by its HC.
Sorry bud....you nailed it.....back on the nice list
 

Dread-Head

Hall of Fame
The lack of information nd football knowledge displayed in tis thread is astounding....

Dutchrudder, Texecutioner, CKHouston, Vinny and Houston Frog and others all made very salient points.

Others are like Jamie Dukes on NLFN and are still looking at Joe like its 09 or 10 seasons.

FWIW:

- Flacco has as many post season wins as Peyton Manning

- Flacco is tied with Joe Montana and Steve Young in post season history with 11 TDS and Zero INTS

- Flacco's records are too numerous to list in all seriousness.

The "ELITE" debate is stupid and meaningless= its a fool's debate because the debate is never quantified, the requirements for making the determination are never set and the guidelines are stretched, abused and broken to make an argument/point.

Joe is a SB MVP, a SB Champ and our QB....and will be for a long long time.

:headhurts: Handswarmer baby, take off your fan goggles for a minute here. Your team just won the Superbowl and you're still smiling from ear to ear and that's great, But ...and I love big "buts" and I can not lie I have to burst your bubble right quick. When fans see "Baltimore" on their team's schedule they think: "Oh God! RAY LEWIS!" or "Damn! Our Receivers will have their hands full trying to get past Ed Reed and that secondary" and even "man, that is one tough defense." NO ONE is thinking "OH MY GOD! We have to have to face FLACCO!" You're a loyal Raven fan which is why you're comparing him to Payton Manning, but you're comparing apples and tomatoes. Both are fruit, but hardly simular. Joe Montana? Now you've gone from rabid fan to either delusional or HIGH. You might as well say Flacco is better than Dan Marino and Mr. Warren Moon because neither of them has a Superbowl ring and HE does. Joe Montana got into the hall of fame on the first ballot and has FOUR of these :trophy:. Flacco just got his ONE. If your team is facing the Ravens Flacco is an AFTERTHOUGHT. He's a mediocre QB on a team with a GREAT defense. I'm not trying to be harsh here man, but it's the truth.
 

handswarmer

Rookie
Maybe you should take up another hobby if it's getting too intense for you. This isn't going to go away, it's just getting started. & if you're going to get your panties in a wad every time it comes up.... maybe you need a time out.




For some reason that doesn't scare me. I'm not worried about playing the Ravens next year. Our chances of winning is 50/50 if not better. In fact, I wouldn't be surprised if we're favored to win by more than the home field advantage (-3 if at Reliant).

Seriously doubt we'll be favored against the Patriots or the Packers or Saints (thank God we're not playing the Packers or Saints).
LOL! You've never seen me upset...I just dislike the "Lists" that people come up with ("The Best Tailgate in th NFL" or "Top QB's of ALL TIME") but provide no criteria for determining the list. No Guidelines.

That is all- and I never said te Ravens should strike fear into anyone next year. They will have alot of FA that will be cashing in with new teams- Ravens are up aganst the Cap and have to sign Flacco, Reed, Kruger, Ellerbe, Pitta, etc.......besides signin all the draft picks....I expect 8-8, 9-7....
 

Dread-Head

Hall of Fame
LOL! You've never seen me upset...I just dislike the "Lists" that people come up with ("The Best Tailgate in th NFL" or "Top QB's of ALL TIME") but provide no criteria for determining the list. No Guidelines.

That is all- and I never said te Ravens should strike fear into anyone next year. They will have alot of FA that will be cashing in with new teams- Ravens are up aganst the Cap and have to sign Flacco, Reed, Kruger, Ellerbe, Pitta, etc.......besides signin all the draft picks....I expect 8-8, 9-7....
Flacco needs to ask for 10 mil a season and leave it at that. His 20 mil will screw the rest of the team with the cap. There will be a HUGE dif in that Defense without Ray. There will be no DYNASTY and they like many defending champs won't make it two in a row. This is merely the end of the Ray Lewis era.
 

handswarmer

Rookie
:headhurts: Handswarmer baby, take off your fan goggles for a minute here. Your team just won the Superbowl and you're still smiling from ear to ear and that's great, But ...and I love big "buts" and I can not lie I have to burst your bubble right quick. When fans see "Baltimore" on their team's schedule they think: "Oh God! RAY LEWIS!" or "Damn! Our Receivers will have their hands full trying to get past Ed Reed and that secondary" and even "man, that is one tough defense." NO ONE is thinking "OH MY GOD! We have to have to face FLACCO!" You're a loyal Raven fan which is why you're comparing him to Payton Manning, but you're comparing apples and tomatoes. Both are fruit, but hardly simular. Joe Montana? Now you've gone from rabid fan to either delusional or HIGH. You might as well say Flacco is better than Dan Marino and Mr. Warren Moon because neither of them has a Superbowl ring and HE does. Joe Montana got into the hall of fame on the first ballot and has FOUR of these :trophy:. Flacco just got his ONE. If your team is facing the Ravens Flacco is an AFTERTHOUGHT. I'm not trying to be harsh here man, but it's the truth.
He has as many rings as Manning, P.

As many as Kurt Warner.

I pointed out that Flacco threw for 11 TDs and Zero Interceptions which tied the record for most TD's without an Interception in th playoffs. Montana happens to head the list.
 

handswarmer

Rookie
Flacco needs to ask for 10 mil a season and leave it at that. His 20 mil will screw the rest of the team with the cap. There will be a HUGE dif in that Defense without Ray. There will be no DYNASTY and they like many defending champs won't make it two in a row. This is merely the end of the Ray Lewis era.
#1- Check out the coming salaries for QB's http://www.spotrac.com/top-salaries/nfl/2013/quarterback/ He beat #1- in his house.

#2- If you think that Ray's ret will be a detriment to the defense, then you haven't been watching. I expect it to be te same maybe even better. His knowledge couldn't ****er the loss of speed on the field- watch the playoffs over again, especially in the SB- the 9er's tore him an new hole across the middle...
 

Dread-Head

Hall of Fame
He has as many rings as Manning, P.

As many as Kurt Warner.

I pointed out that Flacco threw for 11 TDs and Zero Interceptions which tied the record for most TD's without an Interception in th playoffs. Montana happens to head the list.
Warner was MARGINALLY better than Flacco. But if you're comparing him to MANNING then I have to admit I've NEVER tried drugs, but I'm afraid I'm going to have to BEG for some of whatever it is you're smoking, shooting into your veins or otherwise sticking into your nose.


There are no Manning or Brady lovers on this MB, but to paraphrase a line from Malcolm in the Middle if Flacco considers himself the PEER of either of the men you've mentioned I would laugh in his face and say: "Yeah right...*[ability wise] you should be his pet!" Doug Williams had a better Superbowl than your boy Flacco. He aint gettin' into the hall of fame either. Your team won the big one two days ago. Congrats, but don't get it twisted. He's not worthy of being mentioned in the same breath as the NFL royalty you were rattling off. Enjoy your parade later this week it'll be a while before they have another one.


*Substituted for "intellectually"
 

handswarmer

Rookie
Warner was MARGINALLY better than Flacco. But if you're comparing him to MANNING then I have to admit I've NEVER tried drugs, but I'm afraid I'm going to have to BEG for some of whatever it is you're smoking, shooting into your veins or otherwise sticking into your nose.


There are no Manning or Brady lovers on this MB, but to paraphrase a line from Malcolm in the Middle if Flacco considers himself the PEER of either of the men you've mentioned I would laugh in his face and say "Yeah right...*[ability wise] you should be his pet!" Doug Williams had a better Superbowl than your boy Flacco. He aint gettin' into the hall of fame either. Your team won the big on two days ago. Congrats, but don't get it twisted. He's not worthy of being mentioned in the same breath as the NFL royalty you were rattling off. Enjoy your parade later this week it'll be a while before they have another one.


*Substituted for "intellectually"
Dude, I am at the parade right now- me and 350,000 of my closest friends....watch it live on te NFL Network....Jacoby Jones just went past.....while he danced....

Now instead of 'elite' you use the term 'royalty'...whats your criteria...
 

Dread-Head

Hall of Fame
#1- Check out the coming salaries for QB's http://www.spotrac.com/top-salaries/nfl/2013/quarterback/ He beat #1- in his house.

#2- If you think that Ray's ret will be a detriment to the defense, then you haven't been watching. I expect it to be te same maybe even better. His knowledge couldn't ****er the loss of speed on the field- watch the playoffs over again, especially in the SB- the 9er's tore him an new hole across the middle...
Losing Ray is like losing the HEART of your defense. He's essentially been an onfield COACH for the bulk of his career. If you think it'll be "business as usual" without him you're delusional. It would be like the Texans offense losing Andre Johnson then acting as if they were complete without him.
 

Dread-Head

Hall of Fame
Dude, I am at the parade right now- me and 350,000 of my closest friends....watch it live on te NFL Network....Jacoby Jones just went past.....while he danced....

Now instead of 'elite' you use the term 'royalty'...whats your criteria...
:headhurts: Let me see if I can get this straight, your team won the superbowl and instead of enjoying a once in a lifetime event at which you're present, you're here debating with MY crazy ass over my inconsequential opinion of your teams' QB?! Fool go back to your PARADE! Savor it and post pics of EVERYONE BUT JUDAS!
 

thunderkyss

Just win baby!!!
Staff member
Contributor's Club
You said "He's definitely one of the better QBs in the league, but to be elite (not that you're saying he's elite) he's got to minimize those dud games."

My point being that you can't eliminate dud games.
Big difference between eliminate & minimize.

Compared to the Bradies, Rogers, & Brees.... he has more dud games. Too many.

We are splitting hairs but when you jumped in and in yesterdays Schaub thread you definitely have/had a beef with Flacco being considered a top QB.
He's a top QB. I've never tried to take that away from him (Since the Super Bowl). In comparison to Schaub I've said he & Ryan were thought to be in the same tier until the play offs. My point was more about Matt Schaub than Joe Flacco.

If Flacco can go from eh.. to borderline elite (which he is) with a great play off run (for Flacco it's been two great play off runs, but he's been more blah.. than Schaub in the regular season), then so can Schaub. Ryan has had one great play off run & a great season so I can see him in that same category (as Flacco) as well.

Up until these play offs, Ryan just like Schaub was thought to shrink in big games. Didn't matter that he had a decent defense, Roddy White, & Tony Gonzales, the Falcons decided to give him another weapon & now Ryan is a better QB because of it.
 

handswarmer

Rookie
:headhurts: Let me see if I can get this straight, your team won the superbowl and instead of enjoying a once in a lifetime event at which you're present, you're here debating with MY crazy ass over my inconsequential opinion of your teams' QB?! Fool go back to your PARADE! Savor it and post pics of EVERYONE BUT JUDAS!
Why not? I can get love from the 400,000 people present....they just shut the Stadium gates- 100,000 plus in there right now...only seats 70,000.....headed to the bar....gonna have a "Jacoby Special"- its a purple Grape Vodka and Tonic drink that leaves a Ring! Hee hee hee
 

Scooter

Funky
joe flacco's now elite ... is that the term for everyone? peyton manning, tom brady, aaron rodgers, and usually drew brees are generally the head of the pack regardless of who you ask - elite. how did flacco break into those ranks with one playoff run? or does that make ben and his 2 rings elite? eli and his 2 rings? that's 7 elite quarterbacks, 3 added because of what they've done in the playoffs.

now tell me this - age not withstanding, who here would take flacco over luck? over RG3 or kaepernick or wilson? over matt ryan? over the other 6 "elite" quarterbacks? i wouldnt, which puts him just outside a top 10 quarterback in my book. i'd also strongly consider cutler or stafford, but that's beside the point. sure he's a good quarterback, you can (obviously) win in the playoffs with flacco, but he didnt morph into a top 3 quarterback in the span of a month.
 

AJ-80

Waterboy
Not elite now; however, he has the physical tools to become elite in the next couple of years. I think the OC change had a huge positive impact on him.
 

toronto

Hall of Fame
Why not? I can get love from the 400,000 people present....they just shut the Stadium gates- 100,000 plus in there right now...only seats 70,000.....headed to the bar....gonna have a "Jacoby Special"- its a purple Grape Vodka and Tonic drink that leaves a Ring! Hee hee hee
You are officially the first person I have ever seen online posting on a non divisional rival fan site during your victory parade. Draw your own conclusions on what that looks like.
 


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