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Steve McNair dead

Steve was a wonderful football player and a great teammate. He was, much like all of us, not a perfect man however. There is a tendency to hagiographize celebrities/athletes though. We in Houston are guilty too -- if Troy Aikman had the same record of spousal abuse that Warren Moon does, how would most of you react to his name coming up?

I mourn Steve's tragic passing. There was still a lot of good in the world left for him to accomplish. His death should still serve as a lesson though. Whatever happened, no matter how painful it may be to have the details come out, it may teach all of us quite a bit about the dangers of infidelity and putting yourself in potentially dangerous situations.
 
Dan B. said:
Steve was a wonderful football player and a great teammate. He was, much like all of us, not a perfect man however. There is a tendency to hagiographize celebrities/athletes though. We in Houston are guilty too -- if Troy Aikman had the same record of spousal abuse that Warren Moon does, how would most of you react to his name coming up?

I mourn Steve's tragic passing. There was still a lot of good in the world left for him to accomplish. His death should still serve as a lesson though. Whatever happened, no matter how painful it may be to have the details come out, it may teach all of us quite a bit about the dangers of infidelity and putting yourself in potentially dangerous situations.
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Agree, however don't think Moon's issues did not tarnish his legacy in Houston. Just ask SheTexan what she thinks of Warren Moon. I lost any respect I had for him too after all of that came out. Choking in the playoffs is one thing, however choking your wife is quite another.
 
For the FWIW department . . .

Just got thru reading aloud the Chronicle story to the wife . . . she said "when was the last time you heard about a woman shooting a man and then killing herself? it's always the other way around."

She thinks Michelle was there waiting for them.

Anyways, forensically, this should be a very easy one to solve.

RIP Steve.
 
Koolaid Time said:
The sad thing is if the Nashville Police didn't cover up the fact that McNair was in the car when the bimbo was popped for the DWI, he still might be alive.

News would leak that a car with McNair in it (and registered to him as co-owner) was involved in a DWI stop. Michelle McNair (wife) would have raised Holy Hell, and Steve would have gone back to Hattiesburg to settle things out. He wouldn't have been in Nashville when the bimbo went off her rocker.
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Whenever someone dies in a tragic way...there are ALWAYS "what-ifs"...

He was a great player...and he will be missed.
 
Hookem Horns said:
True, in a way this is Bud's fault. If he wouldn't have moved the team to Nashville, McNair would have never met that woman.

:thinking:
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Actually, it was the Houston Oilers and the fans' fault. If they hadn't of choked that Buffalo game, the Oilers would still be here, and the Houston Texans and the Tennessee Titans wouldn't even exist.

:wild:
 
Hookem Horns said:
Agree, however don't think Moon's issues did not tarnish his legacy in Houston. Just ask SheTexan what she thinks of Warren Moon. I lost any respect I had for him too after all of that came out. Choking in the playoffs is one thing, however choking your wife is quite another.
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Yep, Warren Moon is definitely NOT one of my fav players of all time. Some has to do with the way he treated his wife, but, more of it has to do with the things I heard about him deliberately throwing games for money. I don't know what's true and what's not, and really don't care anymore. What he, or any football player, does with their personal life is none of my business, BUT, IF he was indeed quilty of throwing a game, then I will hate him until the day I die. NOthing I could do if his wife was to weak to file charges against the bastard, BUT, I will not honor that same bastard for screwing over thousands of Oiler fans.
 
Koolaid Time said:
The sad thing is if the Nashville Police didn't cover up the fact that McNair was in the car when the bimbo was popped for the DWI, he still might be alive.

News would leak that a car with McNair in it (and registered to him as co-owner) was involved in a DWI stop. Michelle McNair (wife) would have raised Holy Hell, and Steve would have gone back to Hattiesburg to settle things out. He wouldn't have been in Nashville when the bimbo went off her rocker.
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You've got a point. I think a lot of the news coming out, assuming they are true, makes this whole thing seem a little fishy. I'll wait until we get more details.
 
My greatest memory of McNair was his almost perfect drive to end the SB with the Rams. If the Titans drafted Moss instead of Dyson they would have beaten the Rams that year. McNair made 3-4 just incredible ridiculously athletic plays to keep that drive alive.
 
My top memory of McNair is from a Sunday Night game versus the Bucs (as the QB for the Tennessee Oilers). With a 2 point lead and about 2 minutes left, the Oilers needed a 3rd down conversion, else punt to a hot Tampa Bay offense. A naked boot to the right was called. McNair made a DE miss, cut back against the grain, and outran a very fast Buc defense to the goalline. Jaw dropping play (wish I could find it on youtube).
 
I've had so many. '03 against the Giants in the Meadowlands. '03 vs the Texans at home. So many from the '99 season and of course the 2nd half of the Super Bowl. The thrill of the '02 season. He and Eddie George were the rocks of the franchise through the move and the next seven years. Steve did more than anyone for the Titans and the city of Nashville. The city is devastated right now. I wish he had gotten that ring, whether with Baltimore or Tennessee, because he deserves to be in the Hall of Fame.

My favorite has to be one where he wasn't even playing. The Music City Miracle clip where it shows his expression after Dyson scores. He went through so much adversity that year, from a mini QB controversy created by the fans, expectations finally coming to fruition, back surgery and his usual assortment of nicks and bruises culminated on that play and his reaction showed how much he loved the game. I was eleven and his face sticks out to me more than any other game from that season, even the Super Bowl.

It makes you put things into perspective, as far as sports go, but also makes you want to go back and cherish the moments as they happen.
 
Lucky said:
My top memory of McNair is from a Sunday Night game versus the Bucs (as the QB for the Tennessee Oilers). With a 2 point lead and about 2 minutes left, the Oilers needed a 3rd down conversion, else punt to a hot Tampa Bay offense. A naked boot to the right was called. McNair made a DE miss, cut back against the grain, and outran a very fast Buc defense to the goalline. Jaw dropping play (wish I could find it on youtube).
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That play( I too tried to find it on youtube)and the SB drive that Vinny mentioned are the memories that stand out to me also.
 
Marcus said:
For the FWIW department . . .

Just got thru reading aloud the Chronicle story to the wife . . . she said "when was the last time you heard about a woman shooting a man and then killing herself? it's always the other way around."
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c
 
Malloy said:
Too much speculation going on here. Until more facts are revealed its really bad form to automatically condemn the 20-year old as being a psycho biach and Steve as being unfaithful.
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I think it's self-evident that he was being unfaithful. Rich pro athletes don't buy expensive vehicles for 20-yr old waitresses out of charity and kindness.
 
First of all RIP Steve. Just got back from Lake Austin and am catching up on the details. I loved the way he played

As for what happened. Why are so many focusing on the wife. The 20 year old had a boyfriend or ex that she dated for 4 years and that she broke up with just months before. He could be the person just as easily as the wife. Either way this seems to be something that will be uncovered quickly. Of course he was shot multiple times and the girl in the head once which makes it seem personal towards McNair.
 
SheTexan said:
Yep, Warren Moon is definitely NOT one of my fav players of all time. Some has to do with the way he treated his wife, but, more of it has to do with the things I heard about him deliberately throwing games for money. I don't know what's true and what's not, and really don't care anymore. What he, or any football player, does with their personal life is none of my business, BUT, IF he was indeed quilty of throwing a game, then I will hate him until the day I die. NOthing I could do if his wife was to weak to file charges against the bastard, BUT, I will not honor that same bastard for screwing over thousands of Oiler fans.
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You are assuming that Warren Moon beat his wife when I remember hearing that it was his wife that was the one that was doing the hitting. I don't know what happened and neither do you, so I think it would be best not to imply guilt on his part or weakness on her part when it comes to their personal life.
 
Updated

http://sports.espn.go.com/nfl/news/story?id=4307274

NASHVILLE, Tenn. -- Former NFL quarterback Steve McNair's death has been classified a homicide, but the death of Sahel Kazemi, the woman found alongside him in his downtown condominium, remains unclassified, Nashville police said.

Autopsies were conducted early Sunday, and McNair was found to have suffered four gunshot wounds -- two to the head, and two to the chest, police spokesman Don Aaron said during an afternoon news conference.

Kazemi, 20, had one gunshot wound, to the head, according to police. A semiautomatic pistol was found under her body later during processing of the crime scene, and there was no sign of forced entry, police said.

As for the victims' connection, "They apparently were involved in a dating relationship over the past several months," Aaron said.

Nashville police said Saturday night that they weren't actively looking for suspects, and also did not believe McNair's wife was involved.

Mechelle McNair, mother of two of his four sons, was expected to collect her husband's belongings from authorities. Funeral arrangements were not expected to be finalized until Monday afternoon at the earliest
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BattleRedToro said:
You are assuming that Warren Moon beat his wife when I remember hearing that it was his wife that was the one that was doing the hitting. I don't know what happened and neither do you, so I think it would be best not to imply guilt on his part or weakness on her part when it comes to their personal life.
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Sorry, but the facts were pretty straight forward. Moon's wife reported to the Houston police he slapped her, then choked her to the point of almost losing consciousness. The case went to trial. However, with Moon promising that he would go through conseling and publicly apologizing, his wife refused to testify against him, leading to acquittal.
 
Besides when the Oilers came home after losing in the Afc Championships so long ago, the only fan friendly thing I can remember Dud doing in Houston is having a draft party the year the Oilers drafted Steve. We all take the draft parties for granted now and I didn't even go to this years because it almost seemed to be a "been there, done that" event but back then it was the biggest fan event I had ever been too. I remember standing on the 50 yard line in the Dome after the Oilers drafted him and thinking "Life don't get any better than this."

You never know what personal demons a person carries. I don't know yours. You don't know mine. We don't know Steves. I don't like the sound of what it looks like may have happened but I won't judge a dead man. It's not my place.

My prayers go out to his and her families. They need them more than I need to be able to put a football player on a pedistal.
 
The girlfriend's sister adds more potential twists to the story.
[The Tennessean]

Salmani said she talked to her sister nearly every day, and that she'd been hearing about McNair for several months, since he started coming to Dave & Busters and chatting her up.

"He started to talk to her a little," Salmani said. "They exchanged phone numbers, and started dating from there."

Kazemi told her sister that McNair was in the process of divorcing.

"That's why she was like, 'OK, now you're divorcing. We can date,'" Salmani said. "He told her, it was going to be finished, the whole divorce was going to be done, two weeks from yesterday."

Although a check of Davidson County's court records shows there is no divorce pending — at least in Nashville — McNair's house is for sale. His wife, Mechelle McNair, hasn't spoken to the media. Police said she is distraught over his death.

Salmani said her sister believed that she and McNair would move in together once the divorce was final, and eventually marry.

"All she was trying to do was have fun," Salmani said. "Nothing else. I believe there is a third person involved."

Kazemi first came to Nashville nearly four years ago with her then-boyfriend, Keith Norfleet. They broke up about five months ago, and she started seeing McNair soon after.

She probably didn't know who McNair was, Salmani said, until her colleagues at the restaurant told her. Salmani now fears McNair was using her sister, because she was a young woman with a pretty face. She fears jealous people in his life are the reason her sister is dead, and won't live out her dreams.

Her greatest dream, Salmani said, was to be famous.

"I think she is now," she said. "She is everywhere."
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Anyone find this interesting? It was a screen shot taken from a MySpace page of a friend of McNair's girlfriend's x-boyfriend Keith Norfleet. The account has been deleted by someone. Notice what his MS headline says, then notice the last time he had logged in.

McNairsuspect3.jpg
 
Mailman said:
I think it's self-evident that he was being unfaithful. Rich pro athletes don't buy expensive vehicles for 20-yr old waitresses out of charity and kindness.
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IF he cheated, then that would be low. I have pretty much no respect for cheaters.

However, I'm not about to jump on a moral soapbox just after someone died. We have all fallen from grace at some point and IF this was his "fall," then it shouldn't take away from the sum whole of his life. Especially when he was a pillar of the community, gave much of himself and his money for so many causes, and was the kind of player you want to root for. Even if he wasn't on your team.
 
BattleRedToro said:
You are assuming that Warren Moon beat his wife when I remember hearing that it was his wife that was the one that was doing the hitting. I don't know what happened and neither do you, so I think it would be best not to imply guilt on his part or weakness on her part when it comes to their personal life.
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Why don't you read a post completely before you respond with sarcasm. I CLEARLY said, I don't know what's true and what's not!! I also said it's none of my business what player's do with their personal life. We all have opinions as to what happened back in that day and age, and we can all agree to disagree about W. Moon. This thread has to do with Steve McNair! I apologize for anything I said that might have highjacked this thread away from it's original intention.

RIP Steve!!
 
Hookem Horns said:
Anyone find this interesting? It was a screen shot taken from a MySpace page of a friend of McNair's girlfriend's x-boyfriend Keith Norfleet. The account has been deleted by someone. Notice what his MS headline says, then notice the last time he had logged in.

McNairsuspect3.jpg
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Yes...interesting...the RIP Sahel part is especially interesting.
 
Hookem Horns said:
Anyone find this interesting? It was a screen shot taken from a MySpace page of a friend of McNair's girlfriend's x-boyfriend Keith Norfleet. The account has been deleted by someone. Notice what his MS headline says, then notice the last time he had logged in.
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It's also interesting that the police HAVE NOT ruled her death a suicide. The fact that they have not done this yet leads me to believe that there "might" be someone else involved, and when I see the page like the one you just posted, it futhers my belief that someone else was involved.

Didn't she say something about her boyfriend wanted to kill him? Just seems odd to me that this is taking so long.
 
RIP Steve, you will be missed! Thoughts and prayers are with you and your loved ones!
 
texanmojo.com said:
It's also interesting that the police HAVE NOT ruled her death a suicide. The fact that they have not done this yet leads me to believe that there "might" be someone else involved, and when I see the page like the one you just posted, it futhers my belief that someone else was involved.

Didn't she say something about her boyfriend wanted to kill him? Just seems odd to me that this is taking so long.
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There are many strange bits of info coming out, or should I say, not coming out. The late revelation that the gun wasn't found because she was laying on it, and the crime scene investigators discovered it "later." It is very atypical for a suicide gun not to found away from the body. Then the fact that no-one was brought in for questioning and the announcement was made that they are pursuing no other suspects (throw any suspects off). After the autopsy, knowing the exact angle of trajectory, the position of the body, the position of the gun, the powder patterns, the casings and type of bullet and its pattern........and still no suicide confirmation. At that time of occurence, it is probably safe to assume, with both of their past party/drinking history, that there was alcohol associated at some level. There can be many speculative alternatives, not saying that any are correct. A third party present after she shot McNair, only to shoot her (unexpected to her) as a staged suicide..............her ex, a hired gun, an angry father (Persian honor killing). No matter how this turns out, it would not surprise me to see this show up as a segment on "Snapped," because it is obvious someone snapped.

Whatever the real story, let it come out sooner than later, for the sake of this not being a long ardous story that only prolongs an already tragic set of events having befallen those innocents left behind.
 
CloakNNNdagger said:
Whatever the real story, let it come out sooner than later, for the sake of this not being a long ardous story that only prolongs an already tragic set of events having befallen those innocents left behind.
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Its only going to get worse IMO. I wonder what was "cleaned up" at the condo and flushed down the toilet in the 30 minutes between the bodies were found by the co-owner of the condo, who for some reason called McNair's buddy instead of immediately calling the authorities.

It was McNair's buddy who then came over to the condo and then called 911.

I have a feeling that the tox results will show some "party substances" in the blood of both.
 
BattleRedToro said:
You are assuming that Warren Moon beat his wife when I remember hearing that it was his wife that was the one that was doing the hitting. I don't know what happened and neither do you, so I think it would be best not to imply guilt on his part or weakness on her part when it comes to their personal life.
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OK battle I was going to say the same thing but to keep from getting in a big mess on these boards again I thought I would just let it ride. You are right that we don't have a clue what was going on in their personal lives. I've known women who are pretty violent....so what do you do in that case? I guess be a punching bag..lol
 
GuerillaBlack said:
I'm thinking it was photoshopped. It could have been easily.
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True, however the board that I found this on had the original link posted to MySpace for all to to see this live and others were replying to seeing this thing live on MySpace. Within a few hours the account was deleted. However someone took a screenshot of the page before it went down and that is what I posted.

Here is the link to the account this was found on http://www.myspace.com/postedinthaoch . Notice to the right of the "More" dropdown menu it has the "The Caucasion Persuasion" as the last choice. This account was real.

As for the board I found this on look at the thread here http://www.websleuths.com/forums/showthread.php?t=86011&page=2 and people replying to what it said before it was taken down. Off of that I tend to believe this is an actual screenshot and not a Photoshop job since people were seeing this live on MySpace.

Also, IMO if someone was going to go through the trouble of photoshopping this they would have done it on her x-boyfriend's MySpace page here http://www.myspace.com/460719734

If this is real it will come out in a few days. MySpace surely has a way to retrieve records of deleted acccounts and I am sure someone has forwarded this to the police in Nashville.
 
I have had very few 'football' heroes, thanks to a relatively crummy franchise you all know well and suffered with alongside me before they split to Nashville.

Campbell. Bethea. Matthews. Moon. Bishop. McNair. That's been it for me, and McNair's death has just stunned the crap outta me. Almost 2 days later and I can't shake the 'stun.'

:(
 
I just read a rumor that someone at the crime scene leaked that according to her liver temperature, she had been dead for 2 days.
 
The Tennessean writes a 3 page interview with the girlfriend's nephew, which confirms the relationship, the trips, the future plans, her ex's jealousy, and reasons that she and the family had reason to believe that McNair and his wife were separated in preparation for divorce.

Police continue to investigate the circumstances of the events leading up to the deaths, but according to friends of Kazemi, she was smitten and so was McNair.

For her 20th birthday in late May, McNair got her a black Cadillac Escalade. Her family met him over sushi dinner that same weekend. Before that, Kazemi zipped around in his Bentley, telling family and friends about the generosity of her new beau — a former professional athlete.

"We met him because I don't watch football and didn't know who he was," said Farzin Abdi, Kazemi's nephew, who was in town from Jacksonville, Fla. to retrieve the body. "We went out to dinner and she was so happy and was having fun. Were we happy about the relationship? No."
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There were trips, dinners, a promise of living together and ultimately marriage, according to Abdi, 27.

"I don't know if he had filed for divorce but I thought it wouldn't happen," Abdi said, adding that Kazemi was a child when adopted into the family after her mother died in Iran. Abdi's mother is Kazemi's sister.

McNair took Kazemi, known as Jenny to friends, on trips to Key West in Florida, Las Vegas, California, Hawaii and McNair's farm in Mississippi, with the couple seeing each other often, Abdi said. Pictures of the smiling couple parasailing were posted Sunday afternoon on the celebrity gossip site TMZ.com.
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Kazemi told Abdi they would take a break when McNair would go away on his own with his children. McNair and the children recently returned from Mexico, Abdi said.

"I was under the impression that his family knew about her," Abdi said. "That he took the children alone with him on vacation is a sign that they were separated."

Kazemi told her sister, Sepideh Salmani, that McNair was in the process of divorcing.

Kazemi, though younger than Abdi and Salmani, was actually their aunt but they were raised as siblings.

Salmani talked to her sister every day and said she was very happy in her relationship with McNair.

"That's why she was like, 'OK, now you're divorcing. We can date,' " Salmani said. "He told her, it was going to be finished, the whole divorce was going to be done, two weeks from yesterday."
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The family was worried about the rapid relationship and the extravagance that came with it.

"She was in a Bentley and I don't think it was right because there are jealous people," Abdi said. "People were telling her that they didn't have anyone to pay their bills or buy them things."

Kazemi first came to Nashville nearly four years ago with her then-boyfriend, Keith Norfleet. They broke up about six months ago, and she started seeing McNair soon after. The family says the ex-boyfriend was not happy about her seeing the former quarterback and wanted to rekindle their relationship.

But Kazemi had moved on and remained friends with Norfleet.

Neighbors said they overheard arguments come from her Hermitage apartment periodically, and occasionally saw Kazemi dropped off by a limo service. Abdi said they were minor arguments without giving details of the spats.
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I'm laaaaate to the discussion, but I really feel for McNair and his family. His personal life (between 2 consenting adults) is none of my business. As a player I thought he was awsome at Alcorn and he was a real life Rocky that just wouldn'y go down for the count. He made it tougher to hate the Titans right after they left Houston.
 
Blazing Arrow said:
I hope that you all will show respect and class in this ...
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Pfffft. Like we care what you hope for. :rolleyes:



RIP Steve. You were one of the toughest sumbitches to play.

With that said, I hope this situation is just another reminder of putting athletes on pedestals and teaching our children to look up to these guys. It's one thing to admire their talent and feats on the field, it's a whole other issue to worship these guys overall.
 
Bulluck53 said:
BA, they only have ill will towards Bud, he made the decision.

I'm in disbelief right now. I keep watching ESPN and everytime I see it in print it shocks me again. He's a big reason I became a fan.
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exactly....
You never want to see someone in his position die early muchless in the circumstances that Steve McNair did. It is sad but it shows how little we know the people we root for. We nor anyone else can criticize the position he put himself in, because we dont know the entire story. all we can do is offer sympathy.
 
Steve McNair's wife was unaware of affair with Sahel Kazemi until husband's death

New York Daily News

The wife of slain quarterback Steve McNair may have only learned about the gridiron star's affair with a gorgeous young woman after the clandestine couple's grisly deaths, sources close to the football player said Sunday.

"She's blindsided by this," one source said of Mechelle McNair, who was holed up in her family's home just 6 miles from the condo her husband used to bed his mistress. "She's crushed. Her whole world is shattered."
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Investigators said McNair had been drinking at a pair of Nashville bars - Blue Moon Lagoon Bar and Loser's Bar - into the early-morning hours of Saturday and then returned to the downtown condo he shared with a pal.
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R.I.P. Steve is all I can say at this time. I loved it when we selected him and enjoyed watching him play the game. He was a warrior on the field.
 
Ummm....can someone take the question mark off the title? Yes, he's dead.


Since I'm jumping in on the 8th page I'll just say RIP Steve McNair. Hard to root against a guy who played like he did but this just goes to show that crazy **** happens to anyone, regardless of fame or fortune.
 
RIP Steve McNair. :(

The respect toward his NFL career was earned with sweat and blood, and he was the kind of player that hearkened back to the old days of the NFL when players played for passion of the game instead of greed. He played through and with so many injuries that it could be considered heroic as it pertains to sports. His legacy will be remembered by all football fans, and hopefully will inspire future players to fulfill their potential.

My thoughts and prayers are with the victims' families. Such a sad time, and his poor kids will never get to be with their dad again.
 
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