With his love for filming, I bet Belichick has footage of O'Brien going on a F-bomb tirade against Smith and the McNairs.
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[Sources] OB & Smith relationship has worsened
- Thread starter xtruroyaltyx
- Start date
With his love for filming, I bet Belichick has footage of O'Brien going on a F-bomb tirade against Smith and the McNairs.
"Extraordinary claims require extraordinary evidence."
Saying O'Brien will soon be available (meaning he'll quit or get fired) to fill the new head coaching vacancies" is a freakin' extraordinary claim.
Where's the evidence?
Oh and video footage can be doctored. So that's suspect too.
Texecutioner
Hall of Fame
"Extraordinary claims require extraordinary evidence."
Saying O'Brien will soon be available (meaning he'll quit or get fired) to fill the new head coaching vacancies" is a freakin' extraordinary claim.
Where's the evidence?
Oh and video footage can be doctored. So that's suspect too.
No one guaranteed that was about to happen. It was all speculation. That is an accurate thing to speculate when that sort of dysfunctional relationship worsens. I don't think there is any doubt that OB and Smith have had a rocky relationship. Are you calling that itself BS?
Texansballer74
The Marine
We all know O'Brien was heated when he told Mallett to stay home that one game and Rick quickly overruled him.
We all know O'Brien didn't like the fact that he wasn't included on the decision to acquire Brock. Plus he had no other choice put to name him the start right off the bat.
Those are known facts that we all should know about. Now I'm pretty sure there are others that we can only speculate on.
powda
The bridge between stupid and useless is short.
Its as if speculating about a report must mean we think its a fact or a foregone conclusion. I dont think anyone believes that or did. It just spurred conjecture.
A report came out. People speculated on what if. It doesn't mean anyone is any smarter then anyone else. This is a message board. To dismiss the report is obtuse. To consider it fact is just the same. Why people would begin attacking one another over this is beyond me. None of us know ****.
A report came out. People speculated on what if. It doesn't mean anyone is any smarter then anyone else. This is a message board. To dismiss the report is obtuse. To consider it fact is just the same. Why people would begin attacking one another over this is beyond me. None of us know ****.
Texecutioner
Hall of Fame
There are people in here that have gone above and beyond defending Mcnair and Smith and feel that they have some sort of legacy to protect on their arguments. Some will never think that Texans management is dysfunctional.
Max
Veteran
Was this ever conclusively shown? I always thought that was speculation as well.
powda
The bridge between stupid and useless is short.
Forgive me if i translate "legacy" into "ego."
To me, it never looked like Osweiler was forced on O'Brien.
He specifies the type of players that he wants and Rick Smith and the scouts go get them.
http://www.espn.com/blog/nflnation/...d-their-roster-to-bill-obriens-specifications
https://www.google.com/amp/profootb...ing-a-hallmark-of-modern-nfl-free-agency/amp/
Unless it's a specific directive from McNair, which is doubtful.
I don't see McNair going through game films of Osweiler before O'Brien do.
The fact that McNair said that the other two (his GM and his HC) had never had to come to him for a tie-breaker lends itself to the most possible conclusion: that Smith and O'Brien both agreed on Osweiler.
Texansballer74
The Marine
Who are we talking about here? I know darn well those post are not directed at me. I was one of the first to call this organization dysfunctional.
And I guess that report about Bill never meeting with Brock was fake. Yall don't think that rubbed O'Brien the wrong way.
It doesn't take Rockets scientists to figure out a coach would be upset when a particular responsibility is taking from them. Especially when your moxie is that of a quarterback whisper or guru.
76 that man had no other choice but to be ok with Brock signing.
And I guess that report about Bill never meeting with Brock was fake. Yall don't think that rubbed O'Brien the wrong way.
It doesn't take Rockets scientists to figure out a coach would be upset when a particular responsibility is taking from them. Especially when your moxie is that of a quarterback whisper or guru.
76 that man had no other choice but to be ok with Brock signing.
I'm glad BOB has shaken up the Texans org. About time
# Where nothing to traumatic happens/mediocrity happens.
leebigeztx
Keep it Movin!
So you think Brock was signed without BOB consent? What was his plan at qb? Savage, Hoyer? I'm not buying it at all. They, smith,BOB, and the scouts measured the free agent class vs the draft. They concluded that the cost to move up to get Wentz or Goff or staying put and drafting lynch vs just signing Brock was better for the franchise. Myself personally, I feel you have to draft your franchise qb, but signing Brock was a calculated gamble. Early indications look like they're gonna be out of some money,no picks. When it said and done, they're a good team without the guy they need to become super bowl team.
leebigeztx
Keep it Movin!
You think BOB has shaken up the Texans organization?
While we're talking about crap we know nothing about. Suppose like I said you were the HC and your QB has the worst accuracy you've ever seen in a professional QB, and your GM forced him on you, wouldn't you be a little pissed? The GM is messing with your career/reputation. Then you put in a QB you drafted for 6 qtrs. and your offense looks better.
You still make the playoffs with your GM screwing up (Again) and you're without your best player a multiple DPOY, I could see how you would want to have power to make decisions instead of the GM. Winning the division 2 yrs in a row gives BOB more clout than Ricky McNair in his mind. If BOB is wrong and McNair lets him go or he doesn't get the power he feels he deserves then according to rumors Ricky did BOB a favor by getting BOB's name out there for teams to consider for their HC'ing jobs.
Anything for little Ricky McNair to maintain power even if it means sabotaging BOB and the team just before a playoff game. Knowing how Ricky did Kubes to save his bacon I wouldn't be at all surprised if this is how things went down.
Yes I do,
The Hardknocks thing was the beginning of the shakeup. Benching Os and starting Savage was something Ricky McNair's ego couldn't take. So Ricky went to the media. IMHO. Even if I'm wrong there's little doubt that BOB's win at all cost doesn't mesh with Bob/Cal/Ricky McNair's vanilla boardroom mgmt. style. So yes, BOB's style has shaken up things down on Kirby. About time, IMHO.
leebigeztx
Keep it Movin!
So, why isn't savage starting vs the Pats?
Probably on orders of the McNair's.
It's all about $$$$$/ego's.
I called this when Savage became the starting QB.
Malloy
Hall of Fame
We do ?
One minute we want a GM to be the man. Make personnel decisions & hold the HC accountable. On the other hand, we don't.
Picking a teams QB is not a responsibility taken away from the HC, it was never his to begin with.
The Texans is Bob McNair & Rick Smith. Bill O'Brien is trying to worm his way in. & it's not going to happen if he doesn't get on board.
Rick got rid of Yates & Keenum because O'b didn't want them. He had to bring them back in to save O'bs butt, twice. He brought in Weeden to save O'bs butt, but O'b decided to start Hoyer in the playoff game last season.
Rick Smith gave him Mallett & Savage, but instead of developing them, he went with Fitz & Hoyer. O'b was the one who said Savage is in the same group with Bridgewater, Bortles, & Carr. Well, Carr was the Raiders MVP this season & O'b has gotten squat out of Savage.
I don't think Smith gives a crap which QB O'b develops, as long as it's one of them.
So Rick goes out & gets Osweiler. & now, all of a sudden Savage is a HOFer in waiting.
If Osweiler doesn't blow our minds this coming Saturday (& it could have been Savage if that's what O'b wanted) then I expect change to happen. Another decision is going to be taken out of O'bs hands. Either he will get a QB coach/OC, or the Texans (Bob & Rick) will get one for him. & if he doesn't like it... buh-bye.
We will see on this. Your right about Rick McNair, he's family and that's why BOB wants out. He wanted Jimmy G and little Ricky didn't get him. Good news is since the Jimmy G thing happened, have you noticed that little Ricky has traded up to get the players he wants? McKinney/Strong/Martin/Reader etc... maybe little Ricky is learning how to do his job after a decade of doing that job.
Little Ricky may actually become a top GM with another decade of learning.
infantrycak
Hall of Fame
Where's a quote for this?
Just my opinion, but the childish Rick McNair and Little Ricky references in your posts really takes away from any valid points you make.
You hate Rick Smith. We get that, but it still doesn't make any of your speculation true.
I think this FO collectively decided on Osweiler based on a public mandate made by the CEO that they needed a QB.
I still don't fault them for swinging, even if it ended being a giant miss.
The only problem is next year's situation with a very overpriced backup QB that no other team will touch. It really limits the options.
Maybe it's O'Brien's gruff attitude, or maybe it's a deeper power play that we are seeing signs of with these rumors. Who really knows? Not us, not the press, but only those men in the boardroom, and they aren't going public with it.
I do think O'Brien and Smith will be here next season. I'm just hoping this is not a sign of dysfunction that turns into a Colts situation between GM & HC that melts down the team chemistry on the field.
I still don't fault them for swinging, even if it ended being a giant miss.
The only problem is next year's situation with a very overpriced backup QB that no other team will touch. It really limits the options.
Maybe it's O'Brien's gruff attitude, or maybe it's a deeper power play that we are seeing signs of with these rumors. Who really knows? Not us, not the press, but only those men in the boardroom, and they aren't going public with it.
I do think O'Brien and Smith will be here next season. I'm just hoping this is not a sign of dysfunction that turns into a Colts situation between GM & HC that melts down the team chemistry on the field.
Mr teX
Hall of Fame
i think it'll work out where BoB gets what he wants and Ricky is "transitioned" to a role where he'll have less impact on day to day things with the team. Hell for all we know, Bob McNair who will be 81 this year and has faced down cancer twice, may be ready to move into move into retirement mode with whatever is left of his life. Dude might be ready to turns over ownership of all the day to day crap to Cal McNair....& rick moves into Cal's position...which this will obviously create a ripple effect of everyone underneath.
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xtruroyaltyx
Hall of Fame
And that's the thing. Disagreements happen. Blowups happen.
The leaked blowups between OB and Os and the reported/rumored rift between OB and Smith does not sound like the healthy type of disagreement that will lead to more production.
It sounds like, as you mentioned, Colts level dysfunction.
I always figure the forum is just like a bunch of friends at a bar or living room shootin' the shit. Not many folks claim absolutes about these things, but rather just talking about something that we all share in caring about as fans.
If I didn't have this place to shoot the shit about the Texans, I wouldn't have any place for it.
I always figure the forum is just like a bunch of friends at a bar or living room shootin' the shit. Not many folks claim absolutes about these things, but rather just talking about something that we all share in caring about as fans.
If I didn't have this place to shoot the shit about the Texans, I wouldn't have any place for it.
Absolutely agree... but sometimes we need to remind ourselves that we are nothing but a bunch of fans shooting the **** and none of us really has a clue
I'm pretty sure O'Brien didn't want anything to do with Garoppolo, or any QB he'd have to develop.
Most likely he had his eye on clipboard Jesus, or Chad Henne. Probably pissed him off that Hasslebeck retired.
Did y'all catch Clowney's post game interview? The reporter wanted to ask if the f.o. drama was affecting him or the team or something & Jd shut him down.
It was pretty funny
It was pretty funny
CloakNNNdagger
Hall of Fame
A good part of why this happened is that Ryan insisted on on changing from a 4-3 to a 3-4 while maintaining 4-3 personnel. They will now go back to a 4-3 with 4-3 personnel.
CloakNNNdagger
Hall of Fame
And that day could be very scary. From several personal sources over the years, Cal does not seem to be exactly the brightest bulb in the carton.
ROO
Tweak the offense already!
Exactly! Which is why I don't get the animosity that exists between certain members here - just sitting around waiting to attack the "enemy," correct their spelling mistakes and punctuation, make fun of them, and act all douchey and smart-ass.
Of course, being around for only a couple years here, I don't know the history that caused this. I think all too often the bad blood in the no spin zone spills over into TexansTalk. Oh well, it is what it is.
DoubleBarrel, thanks for a great post. I appreciate you being a member here. My "real life" friends and co-workers aren't into sports, so TexansTalk is my place to listen to (read) football talk. And you know what, thanks to everyone who is a member here that talks Texans football.
I always figure the forum is just like a bunch of friends at a bar or living room shootin' the shit. Not many folks claim absolutes about these things, but rather just talking about something that we all share in caring about as fans.
If I didn't have this place to shoot the shit about the Texans, I wouldn't have any place for it.
I wish I could like this post way more than once.
This is how I feel,
For instance Cak and I disagree on most things, but I really enjoy his takes and enjoy the back and forth banter. Even though he gives me a hard time about my typing ability etc.... I really respect him. He doesn't let his NSZ views crossover into the TT section. (Atleast when we are posting back and forth and I appreciate that.)
I feel the same way about TK, we obviously have different views on how the Texans are being run and probably always will. But I like that his responses are well thought out. Same goes with long time posters like JB, Tex, Texian, dutch etc... and I'm really glad that so many new passionate members have joined the TT forum/family.
I just wanted to say thanks guys for making this a great place to talk football/vent. My favorite part of the MB is the draft section where everybody's opinions are different and thru disscussion I've learned alot about players that I wasn't aware of. (For instance I wanted the Texans to draft Chad Wheeler in the 3rd rd and Bah told me to look into his history. He's got alot of crazy in him and I'm not sure if I would draft him at all now.)
Enough pontificating,
I just wanted to put this out there and say thanks
I dont hate anybody
Please dont mistake my thoughts on his job incompetence for hate.
Life is too short for hate.
It's been rumored by more than one reporter.
We will never know.
If the Texans get blown out on Saturday, what are the chances McNair changes his mind and fires BOB iyo? Better than 50-50. IMHO
powda
The bridge between stupid and useless is short.
I think it depends on the scale of the loss and our competition level on Saturday. Honestly, we went from one extreme to another; connor cook followed by perhaps the best qb ever.
Texansballer74
The Marine
If we get blown out, I expect O'b & Godsey to commit seppuku right there in the middle of Gillette. Before Brady takes that last knee, I want O'b on his knees, sword drawn ready...
Not really. I think McNair is going to sit down with Rick, Cal, & O'Brien assess where this team "really" is & figure out how they can make it better. If O'b is intent on over stepping his position & starts drawing lines in the sand, Bob's going to do what Bob's needs to do.
powda
The bridge between stupid and useless is short.
I think godsey is already a gonner. AND THATS A GOOD THING. Mcnair will try to save his oz investment by amping up the ol this off-season. Ob will make contingencies and draft a qb in the first 4 rounds.
I dont think losing when your a 16 point dog is the end of the world. Just dont show up flat. Steeleb's 50/50 marker is far to much imo. Still, with all the reports rampant one never knows.
If we lose, people will say it was a given. If we win this will surpass any win we've ever had and most in nfl history. This IS our super bowl. Try not to **** the bed.
xtruroyaltyx
Hall of Fame
Godsey & O'Brien have been together about as long as Kubiak & Dennison. Two peas in a pod.
I would be impressed if Godsey were even demoted.
I think O'b is determined to develop Godsey. & I think a lot of what we've been seeing on offense is just that. Teaching our OC, QB, RB. & rookie WRs our complicated offense.
TexansSeminole
Hall of Fame
I think, like I've said before, that OB takes what he's been given and develops the best game plan to win the game. It sounds obvious, but I don't think a lot of people are seeing it.
Brock is inaccurate. He's inaccurate on easy, open throws and it's fairly often that he misses them. When throws are past 1-6 yards, he's even worse. He doesn't move his feet, sitting stationary in the pocket. He holds the ball too long. He makes horrible decisions frequently, even with a good lead. It's very difficult to be a high functioning offense with this handicap. We also have a good defense, one that can actually provide short fields through repeated punts and turnovers.
How does this apply to the game plan? Well, we see it every week. OB's plan is to not lose yards. He wants to get to 3rd and 6 on average and hope Brock can make the throw, because hoping he can make a 3rd and 9 is disaster. The object is to play field position and not turn it over. That's the gameplan. With this strategy comes runs up the middle. Sure, he will occasionally run outside with Miller or Hunt or put in a reverse for Braxton Miller (not an option anymore) to keep the defense honest, but it's not a staple of the offense because with this offensive line and quarterback, it's not sustainable. He limits turnovers and plays field position and hopes for breaks.
This is ultra conservative and boring as all get out, but can you really blame the guy? He tried to open the playbook earlier in the season and Brock simply could not make the throws.
I don't blame OB or Godsey. We're talking about a staff on offense that has had poor offensive line and very poor quarterback play, but still was able to get to the playoffs.
I think some fans look at offense and defense as if they're both independent, but they're not. That the offense coordinator should be aggressive and the defense should be aggressive. Personnel doesn't always support that. A head coaches job is to look at the entire football team and determine how best to win games. OB has done that with this team, a team with major flaws. Major. Most teams fall flat on their faces with these problems. Fans hoping that we get a new coordinator that spreads us out and plays aggressive with this offensive line and quarterback are not seeing the big picture. This offense is not built well enough to play that way. If we ask Brock to spread it out, we'd get slaughtered by any team with a competent defense. In the NFL, almost every defensive coordinator would feast on that situation.
The FO missed on Brock. It's pretty clear. It happens. However, they completely **** the bed with the offensive line. This was an unacceptable mistake that affects everything on offense and amplifies every weakness. It was poor planning by Rick and Co and it's really not a debate.
I can't fault OB or Godsey for calling games as they do. I agree that it gives this team the best chance to win. They deserve a better constructed roster, plain and simple.
Brock is inaccurate. He's inaccurate on easy, open throws and it's fairly often that he misses them. When throws are past 1-6 yards, he's even worse. He doesn't move his feet, sitting stationary in the pocket. He holds the ball too long. He makes horrible decisions frequently, even with a good lead. It's very difficult to be a high functioning offense with this handicap. We also have a good defense, one that can actually provide short fields through repeated punts and turnovers.
How does this apply to the game plan? Well, we see it every week. OB's plan is to not lose yards. He wants to get to 3rd and 6 on average and hope Brock can make the throw, because hoping he can make a 3rd and 9 is disaster. The object is to play field position and not turn it over. That's the gameplan. With this strategy comes runs up the middle. Sure, he will occasionally run outside with Miller or Hunt or put in a reverse for Braxton Miller (not an option anymore) to keep the defense honest, but it's not a staple of the offense because with this offensive line and quarterback, it's not sustainable. He limits turnovers and plays field position and hopes for breaks.
This is ultra conservative and boring as all get out, but can you really blame the guy? He tried to open the playbook earlier in the season and Brock simply could not make the throws.
I don't blame OB or Godsey. We're talking about a staff on offense that has had poor offensive line and very poor quarterback play, but still was able to get to the playoffs.
I think some fans look at offense and defense as if they're both independent, but they're not. That the offense coordinator should be aggressive and the defense should be aggressive. Personnel doesn't always support that. A head coaches job is to look at the entire football team and determine how best to win games. OB has done that with this team, a team with major flaws. Major. Most teams fall flat on their faces with these problems. Fans hoping that we get a new coordinator that spreads us out and plays aggressive with this offensive line and quarterback are not seeing the big picture. This offense is not built well enough to play that way. If we ask Brock to spread it out, we'd get slaughtered by any team with a competent defense. In the NFL, almost every defensive coordinator would feast on that situation.
The FO missed on Brock. It's pretty clear. It happens. However, they completely **** the bed with the offensive line. This was an unacceptable mistake that affects everything on offense and amplifies every weakness. It was poor planning by Rick and Co and it's really not a debate.
I can't fault OB or Godsey for calling games as they do. I agree that it gives this team the best chance to win. They deserve a better constructed roster, plain and simple.
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sandman
Brexit Advisor
Even with a blow out loss, they made it to the divisional game. No way that McNair fires O'Brien. I do see Godsey getting shown the door in this situation, against O'Brien's wishes, while they get in a real OC instead of what has basically been a glorified grad assistant/intern.
Didn't O'Brien take over play calling duty after the Pats game?