Texian
Hall of Fame
Florio is a whiney butt and one 1stRD pick short.
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Should we trade Watson?
- Thread starter theCATALYST
- Start date
maverick512000
Hall of Fame
Doesn't work that way, as Corrosion has pointed out several times Watson has to play at least 6 games for the season to count and Texans can suspend him multiple times at 6 games a pop making it impossible for him to have played those 6 games he needs. If that happens then the season doesn't count on his contract and the whole thing gets pushed back another year so what he would have got in 2021 becomes what he will get in 2022.
But will they?
I know this is all "new" but as far as I know it would be the first time the Texans did anything like that. It's nice to know that they can. But I'm reluctant to believe they will.
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maverick512000
Hall of Fame
They may not have to, honestly I think Watson's agent is banking on this being the same old Texans. Just like people around here are convinced the Texans will screw it up because they always have. It could be both those people and the agent are right but its a roll of the dice with to much money on the line for me to feel comfortable if I was Watson.
What makes you think that Watson would let the Texans suspend him with just cause if he decides to come back and play?
maverick512000
Hall of Fame
It doesn't take much for a club to suspend a player for misconduct, if they think he's faking and injury or not playing his best then they can take action and Watson doesn't have a lot of recourse. Just cause can be a very loose definition.
Texansballer74
The Marine
What they fail to realize is there’s a smarter Sheriff in town by the name of Nick Caserio. He’s here to clean up all the trash that was left in the streets by O’Brien. He’s not about to let these other GM get the best of the Texans any longer. He’s not about to over pay these players anymore. And he’s not about to let these players force them into a hasty decision any freaking more.
OptimisticTexan
2024 / Rebuilding Block 4 After Playoffs / Texans
Dolphins have the assets and a much bigger desire for a 40M per season QB. The Jets have the #2 pick and if they're as high on Wilson as many in the NFL are.....why give up your assets, Williams and future cap space for a top QB1 that they're in no way prepared to succeed with?
Dolphins have the assets and the most valid reason for trading those assets and a couple of players to obtain Watson's services. I'm not moving Watson to Miami for his benefit but for the Texans benefit. But Watson doesn't go to the Dolphins unless they meet my trade demands:
QB- Tua (I'd keep him, sign McCarron and give them both a chance in camp. I could. Hold this asset and trade him for more capital at any time before the deadline. I assure you that someone will be in dire need of a QB1 before the deadline. McCarron is more than capable of being a bridge QB.)
CB- Howard (He and Roby might make the secondary a bit better going into the 2021 season.....and possibly beyond.)
2021
RD1-03-003
RD1-18-018
RD2-18-050
2022
RD1
2023
RD1
And for those who think the idea of moving Watson is for the excitement of doing a mega type deal so the team has draft assets......remember one thing, the Cowboys traded Herschel Walker for a boatload of picks and built a NFL powerhouse that could've ruled the NFL for far more seasons than they did. Jerry Jones decided, "I sign the checks.....and I want to be the smartest man in the room"!!!!
I think the Texans got themselves a solid GM in Caserio who may have the ability to build the Texans into something special provided he's not held back by the "Fools On Kirby".
Texansballer74
The Marine
The Jets had the assets as well. Plus they can give you solid young players from both sides of the ball. I’ve already listed those players.
badboy
Hall of Fame
Yes that is a possibility and it is also a possibility you are dead wrong. We shall see.
maverick512000
Hall of Fame
I very much hope you are right, so far he's making all the right moves but there is still a lot of off season to go.
badboy
Hall of Fame
They are waiting to see where deshaun's traded to And the results of that. I guess Hopkins is happy that JJ is on his team now.
wildroot
Rookie
But the Jets aren't as ready to make the move with ONLY Watson and a big time depleted draft. Miami on the other hand was coming together last year as a force in need of a few more pieces including a QB.
It would be great if the Jets wanted to make the trade, but if I'm them I draft Wilson and build my team over the next few years with all my draft capital.
maverick512000
Hall of Fame
There is an intangible factor to that as well. Jets owner just recently took control over from his brother and reports are he is looking to make a splash and put his mark on thing. High draft picks are to the Jets fans what they use to be to the Browns fans and what winning season's are to the Pats fans. Its something they are so use to that it doesn't excite them any more because they figure the team will just screw it up again. An already established QB like Watson would make a much bigger splash to the average Jets fan than Wilson would plus they can start marketing Mean Green #4 Jersey's before the ink is even dry. Remember when they thought Favre was going to the Jets? They had jersey's sold out before he even got there. So yes they can do more long term with drafting Wilson and keeping the picks but its also depends on how bad the short term looks.
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I can see Watson approving a trade to the Dolphins.
OptimisticTexan
2024 / Rebuilding Block 4 After Playoffs / Texans
I'm in agreement and have posted in other threads about the package the Jets could bring to the table. The key without getting into symantics will be Watson agreeing to waive his NTC so the Texans could move him to the Jets. I don't see Watson willfully picking the Jets as a desired destination.
What would be interesting to see.....the bidding war that the Jets and Dolphins might get in to for Watson's services. The end result may far exceed our expectations regardless of who Watson winds up being traded to.
So you think they will get 7 picks for DW4.
Want to bet they dont.
Loser makes a $50.00 donation to TT.
badboy
Hall of Fame
Watson's brand can grow and he will have solid chance to take team to SB. This morn on radio 610 they played an audio clip of DeShaun meeting this past week and discussing going from a milli to a billi by increasing his Brand.
Add in Dolphins could offer an acceptable package.
It is interesting to me that New York can offer the same and has been relatively quiet about #4.
badboy
Hall of Fame
Did I say they will get 7 picks in that post?
OptimisticTexan
2024 / Rebuilding Block 4 After Playoffs / Texans
That would be a tough bet since no one knows what the market may bear.....especially if Watson waives his NTC to move on from Houston. Also worth mentioning, team may trade up to 4 years worth of draft picks. That could open possibilities for other teams to get into the mix with a combination of picks and players.
For me, I wouldn't trade no further than #8 since I've come to the conclusion that getting OT- Darrisaw (VA Tach) would be my first pick.
If the team moves Watson.....then I'm more than willing to unload one-dimensional LT, Tunsil to recoup another RD1 pick and possibly another one. Tunsil is paid far too much for his ability as a LT. Sweeping away the ugly and foolish contracts is going to help Caserio in the long run. Personally, I think Darrisaw far exceeds Tunsil since he provides run blocking as well in his skill set.
Like I said in another thread, Watson actually has reason to play well in 2021, if he comes back for the Texans.
That team is going to be bad, so it will be difficult to win games.
Even if Watson play his best, the Texans will be lucky to win 7 games.
With a few wins each year, the Texans will be stuck with a first-rd pick outside of the top ten.
The Texans can spend the next 5-6 years in quagmire, never having a winning season, just below mediocre.
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Like the Jets or the Dolphins
maverick512000
Hall of Fame
And why do you assume that they can't improve in 5-6 years?
How so?
Where do I say they can't improve in 5-6 years?
badboy
Hall of Fame
Just FYI I have seen more than one mock draft with darrisaw falling to 18 + one as low 23rd. I would not trade Watson straight to Panthers but after trading him to Miami I would consider strongly Trading 1.3 ( if Zach Wilson gone) to Caroline for number 8 and a whole lot more.
If I knew this scenario would go down with these two trades I would trade tunsil to the Dallas Cowboys for number 10 and Dee Dee Lamb. I could see Jones balking at that as he really was ecstatic that lamb fell to him last year.
1.8 Devonta Smith
1.10 Patrick Sustain
1.18 Darrisaw LT
2.35 Najee Harris
2.40 (CP) Jackson Carman LG
2.50 Humphreys or Dickerson: center
3.67 Deonte Brown RG
Plus WR Lamb and Tua and Xavien Howard corner.
maverick512000
Hall of Fame
maverick512000
Hall of Fame
You're splitting hairs, you've made it clear that in your mind the only way Texans can improve or have any success is to trade Watson. You're idea also is that they should just take whatever they can get for him. The first is wrong and has been shown to be wrong, Texans have plenty of draft picks after 2022 and even if 2021 is a bad season they can move up in the draft or maybe even have a high draft pick already. The second of take what they can get is a horrible way for them to do business and is what led to trades like the Clowney and Hopkins trades. Its been pointed out multiple times that Texans are fully in the drivers seat and that they can have success pretty much no matter what Watson does. Would some routes be easier than other yes but no route leads to a dead end EXCEPT trading Watson away for peanuts.
Again, you need to re-read all of my posts carefully.
The post you replied to was my post to Wildroot who said the Texans would get 7 picks.
CloakNNNdagger
Hall of Fame
Stealth anti-Watson tweet:
OptimisticTexan
2024 / Rebuilding Block 4 After Playoffs / Texans
The Bears could probably use him b/c of the cost and their cap situation.
Jack Burton
Veteran
Florio is an east coast clown who’s constantly sucking the chrome off the east coast teams bumpers. He just wants Watson on an east coast team so he gurgle his dingleberries and whining about it like everything else is what he does.
I think if they are going to play hardball , they have to be willing to go all the way and that includes suspension.
The fact that Caserio isn't even listening to offers tells me he's at the very least willing to threaten to do that at the very least. It takes away any leverage Watson may be perceived to have.
Jack Burton
Veteran
I would definitely try to trade up to #2 in that situation and grab Wilson. Trade Tua. He’s a mess and has too many red flags.
Also, I’m not sure about the Madden trades your coming up with.
Jack Burton
Veteran
Yeah, so far NC is playing this correctly.
Jack Burton
Veteran
LOL
Dude, your simply not getting this.
That's a big deal too .... Watson is the only one with anything to lose here.
The team .... they already lost when he asked to be traded and really , it can't get any worse.
His agent has nothing to lose and everything to gain in pulling this off.
Watson's image is already taking a huge hit and he's set to lose millions of dollars in fines & lost salary , the possibility that the team goes after his signing bonus & last but certainly not least , the possibility that the team will void all future guaranteed money in his contract.
And .... he's throwing away a year of his career , right in the prime of it.
The other owners have a lot to lose here too .... players & agents taking over player movement in a new way that allows the salary cap to be manipulated.
Other players won't like it either as it could jeopardize teams giving those big signing bonuses that cause the cap issues with this type of movement. This and the Russell Wilson situation could put an end to that practice effective immediately.
There's a whole lot going on here that people just don't take into consideration.
Seems you have a fairly high opinion of Caserio .... so far.
I can't really find anything to complain about either .....
I could see the Dolphins eventually landing him and it all depends upon what the Jets do.
Why take Watson instead of just drafting Zach ? One of them is "the real deal" the other is nothing but potential.
Jack Burton
Veteran
Why take Watson instead of just drafting Zach ? One of them is "the real deal" the other is nothing but potential.
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I’m not seeing the suggestion that MIA has some kind of overwhelming power to aquire Watson over NYJs. There’s absolutely nothing MIA has that NYJ can’t beat out and they are picking one, single pick behind NYJ at 3. It’s a lame argument and makes no sense whatsoever.
NYJ have MORE than MIA and are picking ahead of them at the most important pick and that’s #2.
NYJs have a more coveted QB between Darnold and Tua by far and NYJ have more trade pieces with better value and on top of all of that, NYJ have a ton more money in FA. Waaay more money to play with.
NYJ are playing with house money. They have a boatload of high picks the next 2 years, and a ton of FA money, and can offer Darnold as well, who can just be traded for more by HOU to another team.
I think there are folks trying to convince themselves to cater to some ulterior motive in aquiring a player or some such nonsense and it makes no sense.
[/QUOTE]
I’m not seeing the suggestion that MIA has some kind of overwhelming power to aquire Watson over NYJs. There’s absolutely nothing MIA has that NYJ can’t beat out and they are picking one, single pick behind NYJ at 3. It’s a lame argument and makes no sense whatsoever.
NYJ have MORE than MIA and are picking ahead of them at the most important pick and that’s #2.
NYJs have a more coveted QB between Darnold and Tua by far and NYJ have more trade pieces with better value and on top of all of that, NYJ have a ton more money in FA. Waaay more money to play with.
NYJ are playing with house money. They have a boatload of high picks the next 2 years, and a ton of FA money, and can offer Darnold as well, who can just be traded for more by HOU to another team.
I think there are folks trying to convince themselves to cater to some ulterior motive in aquiring a player or some such nonsense and it makes no sense.
For sure NYJ's best offer can trump all others , Miami included.
Thing is , they have options - Zach Wilson is a fantastic prospect , I think he might be the best QB in this draft ... keep the rest of those picks and build around him.
Or do you take the proven top 5-8 QB in Watson ?
I don't really want to send him to Miami .... but that's not because their offer isn't better than everyone (except NYJ) but because I don't want to send him to a team ready to win , especially if I'm getting future draft picks .... but also out of pure spite and as a screw you on the way out like you screwed my franchise.
Jack Burton
Veteran
The only overwhelming aspect to this conundrum by NYJ is Wilson is all projection as you said.
Watson isn’t and he’s a proven franchise QB, however he’s showing he’s got a little Jay Cutler in him though and that’s a red flag.
The overriding factor to me is NYJ have so many picks the next 2 seasons after having a lot of high picks the last couple seasons too that they actually have too many. Those are contracts they have to get these guys under contract. It’s easier said than done. There’s actually a point where having too many high picks can hurt the team. Lots of money being spent and that’s if they pan out.
So, giving up 2 1’s and a 2 and Darnold isn’t the end of the world and they get a PROVEN QB, that they as a perennial loser, can cater to Watson a bit and make him happy and they compete in their division immediately. It’s a huge win as they can take on anyone in their division.
Wilson being projected as a franchise guy is fine cause they know they are getting at the least a franchise guy with Watson.
Again, NYJ are playing with house money. It’s not going to really hurt them to give up 3 picks and a QB they won’t have on the team for training camp next year anyways.
It’s all gravy. If there ever was a team who would jump on this, it would be them. It’s all win for them.
OptimisticTexan
2024 / Rebuilding Block 4 After Playoffs / Texans
I’m not seeing the suggestion that MIA has some kind of overwhelming power to aquire Watson over NYJs. There’s absolutely nothing MIA has that NYJ can’t beat out and they are picking one, single pick behind NYJ at 3. It’s a lame argument and makes no sense whatsoever.
NYJ have MORE than MIA and are picking ahead of them at the most important pick and that’s #2.
NYJs have a more coveted QB between Darnold and Tua by far and NYJ have more trade pieces with better value and on top of all of that, NYJ have a ton more money in FA. Waaay more money to play with.
NYJ are playing with house money. They have a boatload of high picks the next 2 years, and a ton of FA money, and can offer Darnold as well, who can just be traded for more by HOU to another team.
I think there are folks trying to convince themselves to cater to some ulterior motive in aquiring a player or some such nonsense and it makes no sense.
[/QUOTE]
So the Jets and Dolphins make similar offers and all it comes down to....who does Watson want to play for without having to invoke his NTC?
Jack Burton
Veteran
So the Jets and Dolphins make similar offers and all it comes down to....who does Watson want to play for without having to invoke his NTC?
[/QUOTE]
No one cares who Watson wants to play for. LOL.
It’s irrelevant.
He will be traded to who HOU wants to trade him too and if he complains and says no, he will sit out a year.
Also, didn’t Watson say he would play for NYJ? Yeah, I believe he did.
badboy
Hall of Fame
Nope. Wrong. Count 'em. 6 picks and Q.
Your post 3252 you said that what you had listed was more likely for a DW 4 Value in a trade than wildroot value. You continued in fact may get less than what you had listed.
Your post 3270 said laughable trading DW4 for 7 picks.
Jack Burton 3274 Exactly lol in response to YOU saying 7 picks.
My post 3311 quoted your post 3252 and I said your evaluation is a possibility or dead wrong.
Your post 3318 "you think they will get 7 picks?"
I never said 7 picks nor did Wildroot. I was replying to you evaluation of what DW4 could bring.
badboy
Hall of Fame
Yes but what do you think about Florio? LOL