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Kareem Jackson's plight.

All I'm asking for is an open mind.

BTW, here's the drop-kick call from the playbook.
It doesn't even involve the CB on play side (Jackson).
It simply states that when this call is made (automatically or as the safety calls out, we don't know), the safety comes down on the crossing route and the off-side CB (Quin) takes his place deep.

It clearly says CORNER in the POST.
2003Falconspdf-AdobeReader.jpg
So if a player, corner or safety does not run the play correctly shouldn't head coach have player and DB coach heiney for some chewing?
 
All I'm asking for is an open mind.

BTW, here's the drop-kick call from the playbook.
It doesn't even involve the CB on play side (Jackson).
It simply states that when this call is made (automatically or as the safety calls out, we don't know), the safety comes down on the crossing route and the off-side CB (Quin) takes his place deep.

It clearly says CORNER in the POST.
2003Falconspdf-AdobeReader.jpg
Looking again at this play it shows a CB and FS covering two WRs. Maybe I am missing something as I am tired and my air conditioner quit working in my apartment, but where is the other corner and the SS? I want my CBs to stick with the WRs and FS and SS to back them up not replace them on a play.
 
So if a player, corner or safety does not run the play correctly shouldn't head coach have player and DB coach heiney for some chewing?

Remember the near INT by Quin?
It shows that the coaches did straighten them out.

Unfortunately as Quin was ready to make the INT, Nolan also came back and tip the ball and the eceiver caught it!

Got to work early tomorrow, see ya!

I will post those plays later!
 
Remember the near INT by Quin?
It shows that the coaches did straighten them out.

Unfortunately as Quin was ready to make the INT, Nolan also came back and tip the ball and the eceiver caught it!

Got to work early tomorrow, see ya!

I will post those plays later!
Thanks again for your efforts.
 
Maybe I am missing something as I am tired and my air conditioner quit working in my apartment, but where is the other corner and the SS? I want my CBs to stick with the WRs and FS and SS to back them up not replace them on a play.

I don't believe any team plays strict man coverage 100% of the time. You've got 11 defenders on the field, why not use them all. Especially if you consider the defense is at a disadvantage not knowing exactly what the offense is going to do on a given play, zone coverages make more sense.

This particular defense would be called when the offense is playing two tightends on a run down. They should run, it looks like they are going to run, you load the box.........
 
Schaub has been in the top 10 in completion % since he joined the Texans. If he has accuracy issues, who doesn't? And how can you get confirmation on a few plays out of nearly 600? Not that I'm challenging 76Texan to post screen shots of every play from 2010. Please don't. I'm just saying...


I'm not going to derail this thread, but if you think comp% determines an accurate passer, you need to watch the game different. Carr his last year was at about 70% or so, but that doesn't mean he's accurate. Accuracy is hittting guys in stride down the field. How many top 10 qbs would've made walters or aj stop and wait on the ball after beating the cb by 5 or 6 yds. This is the nfl and those are poorly thrown just in the clips. I watched shcaub leave tds on the field because of a non accurate throw. Had a top qb made those throws, 6 would be on the board.
 
I'm not going to derail this thread, but if you think comp% determines an accurate passer, you need to watch the game different. Carr his last year was at about 70% or so, but that doesn't mean he's accurate. Accuracy is hittting guys in stride down the field. How many top 10 qbs would've made walters or aj stop and wait on the ball after beating the cb by 5 or 6 yds. This is the nfl and those are poorly thrown just in the clips. I watched shcaub leave tds on the field because of a non accurate throw. Had a top qb made those throws, 6 would be on the board.

That's a part of accuracy.

Another part of accuracy is choosing the right guy to hit, and then getting the ball to him so that he doesn't get killed. Schaub is usually pretty good at getting the ball to the right guy and not hanging him out to dry.
 
Looking again at this play it shows a CB and FS covering two WRs. Maybe I am missing something as I am tired and my air conditioner quit working in my apartment, but where is the other corner and the SS? I want my CBs to stick with the WRs and FS and SS to back them up not replace them on a play.

That is why I said it doesn't even emphasize the on-side CB (Jackson).

If you look back at all the examples I gave concerning the 2-man route, the SS comes down to play the run.

The defense usually shows the QB quite clearly that they are in cover one/cover 3 type.

The 2-man route is designed to beat cover one, especially cover 3.
It is designed to "play" the FS.
The basic concept is that the offense floods the FS middle zone with 2 receivers: one high (the deep route) and one low (the crossing route).
If the FS stays up top to cover deep, the QB hits the crosser.
If the FS comes down, the QB goes long.

The drop-kick call was designed to combat this 2-man route.
It brings the FS down to take the crosser while the off-side CB goes into the deep middle to look to intercept the ball.
This is designed to bait the QB to make the deep throw.

The on-side CB was not shonw, becasue he simply plays his normal assignemnt in cover 3. He takes care of the usual 1/3. He watches for the outside receiver to cut to the corner or to the outside (back shoulder fade) or turn back on a stop/come backer route. He also serves to back up the FS on the crossing route.
 
I certainly don't mind it at all.
A good friend of mine of some 30 years still butt-head with me about KJax.
He's too busy to watch all of these evidence even though I am willing to sit down and go over all 16 games with him.
He said (like Rey said) that he didn't need to rewath anything, that he believe his own eyes.

I still see him pretty much every week.
Hahaha. I've been pretty much on your side with this thread. I think the entire secondary had issues last season and I won't lay 6-10 at the feet of KJ. I'm hoping 2011 shows the big jump in performance for him that it usually does for players. Of course, with the lock out all that might go out the window, too.

The one thing with KJ that still bother me is the well documented problem of slipping/falling down and the damning comments Phillips made about him. I guess only time will tell how good of a player he ends up. He has 2 more years in my book before I label him a bust.
 
That wasn't the point. We aren't trying to compare the Texans pass defense with the Raiders or KJac with Aso.

What 76 is illustrating is that the receiver has the edge, always in one on one coverage. The corner has no idea when the ball is going to release, or where the receiver is trying to get to. The defensive scheme dictates how the corner is going to play a particular route on a particular down. Expecting safety help inside, you have to honor the outside route, where there is no help. When you do that, the receiver gets natural separation if they cut back inside. Which is ok, because there is supposed to be a safety there. If the safety isn't there, the easy (and wrong call) would be to blame the CB for being a talentless clueless P.O.S. even though he did exactly what he was supposed to.

We know it is exactly what he was supposed to do, because that is exactly what pro-bowl corners (& the Colts corner) did.

Unless you are saying each one of those corners in the exact same situation played that situation wrong. If that is your argument, all 76 is asking, is to tell him when & where you saw it done right. A picture or video would be nice... but no one is taking him up on that one.

Ummmm as many raider screen shots as i've seen i have to differ. Plus look 2 posts below the original one posted above.

Comment from Dan Dierdorf on the Walter play:
"He's expecting safety help".

Comment from Solomon Wilcott on the Floyd play:
"Namdi must be saying what happens to the help I wa expecting from the other side of the field?.... Misread and mistake in the secondary will cost you every single time."

Seems like a lot of comparing to me.

K. Jac and Aso are WORLDS apart. I consider K. Jac a minor league player compared to Aso. Cause thats how Jackson plays.
 
Taking this thread to it's logical conclusion, do you think signing Weddle would be a bigger payoff for the Texans than signing Aso? Of course signing both would be the ultimate payoff bt highly unlikely.
:spin:
 
Taking this thread to it's logical conclusion, do you think signing Weddle would be a bigger payoff for the Texans than signing Aso? Of course signing both would be the ultimate payoff bt highly unlikely.
:spin:

Personally, I'm more worried about who we sign for Safety than who we sign for Corner. That's the position that's going to make or break our secondary. We can't go into a season with:

<FA CB> - Quin - Keo/Nolan - KJ/Harris

That's just not going to work.

I'm starting to really like the idea of Goldson but I'd prefer Weddle.

If we could start the season something like:

Joseph - Quin - Manning/Landry - KJ/Harris

That would be epic.
 
Taking this thread to it's logical conclusion, do you think signing Weddle would be a bigger payoff for the Texans than signing Aso? Of course signing both would be the ultimate payoff bt highly unlikely.
:spin:

I think Wade will provide the biggest impact. If we start seeing LBs involved in pass defense, & I'm talking Urlacher covering the deep middle kind of involved, then we'll see our sack numbers go up & our INTs

My theory, in the past, QBs have had easy throws to make. They haven't been having to make tight throws, or difficult throws. They haven't had to wait for receivers to clear LBs, or receivers running into safeties. They haven't had to wait that fraction of a second, because all their lanes were open.
 
I don't believe any team plays strict man coverage 100% of the time. You've got 11 defenders on the field, why not use them all. Especially if you consider the defense is at a disadvantage not knowing exactly what the offense is going to do on a given play, zone coverages make more sense.

This particular defense would be called when the offense is playing two tightends on a run down. They should run, it looks like they are going to run, you load the box.........
If you are saying the circles I thought were receivers are actually TEs.. maybe. But nothing indicates that. If it is two WRs, I want corners on them; SS and LBs should cover TEs leaving a FS to back up the play.
 
That is why I said it doesn't even emphasize the on-side CB (Jackson).

If you look back at all the examples I gave concerning the 2-man route, the SS comes down to play the run.

The defense usually shows the QB quite clearly that they are in cover one/cover 3 type.

The 2-man route is designed to beat cover one, especially cover 3.
It is designed to "play" the FS.
The basic concept is that the offense floods the FS middle zone with 2 receivers: one high (the deep route) and one low (the crossing route).
If the FS stays up top to cover deep, the QB hits the crosser.
If the FS comes down, the QB goes long.

The drop-kick call was designed to combat this 2-man route.
It brings the FS down to take the crosser while the off-side CB goes into the deep middle to look to intercept the ball.
This is designed to bait the QB to make the deep throw.

The on-side CB was not shonw, becasue he simply plays his normal assignemnt in cover 3. He takes care of the usual 1/3. He watches for the outside receiver to cut to the corner or to the outside (back shoulder fade) or turn back on a stop/come backer route. He also serves to back up the FS on the crossing route.
And this is why we had problems as our CBs could not run with many WRs and had to have safety help but did not many times. If our CBs could run with WRs, the QB could not successfully choose where to throw regardless of the FS. If we have Aso and my draft pick Brandon Harris @ corners with Quin helping out Harris ALWAYS, then QB has to hope ASO slips or WR just beats him.
 
And this is why we had problems as our CBs could not run with many WRs and had to have safety help but did not many times. If our CBs could run with WRs, the QB could not successfully choose where to throw regardless of the FS. If we have Aso and my draft pick Brandon Harris @ corners with Quin helping out Harris ALWAYS, then QB has to hope ASO slips or WR just beats him.

but we just saw pictures of Walter running away for corners & Aso getting beat.... it's not about talent level, or ability to run with receivers.
 
but we just saw pictures of Walter running away for corners & Aso getting beat.... it's not about talent level, or ability to run with receivers.
Sure, what corner can not be beaten or what WR can not have a great play? Tongue in cheek or not you know you agree with me.:ahhaha:
 
I think Wade will provide the biggest impact. If we start seeing LBs involved in pass defense, & I'm talking Urlacher covering the deep middle kind of involved, then we'll see our sack numbers go up & our INTs

My theory, in the past, QBs have had easy throws to make. They haven't been having to make tight throws, or difficult throws. They haven't had to wait for receivers to clear LBs, or receivers running into safeties. They haven't had to wait that fraction of a second, because all their lanes were open.
That would be great if we had any LB's that were good in coverage. I'm with you and a few others as far as being concerned with our LB corps. I don't count on Ryans coming back anywhere near 100% his pre-injury self or count on him for any extended length of time. So with whom and how is Wade going to improve that aspect of coverage? Do you think Sharpton will be that much improved in his sophomor season? He showed nice flashes last season.
 
Collingsworth's comments on Wade's coverage:
"One of the tough part about playing the Cowboys is that very seldom you have one-on-one coverage. It's like they switch coverages where it looks like you'd be running around on one guy and they release you to the next guy and they end up doubling somebody else so you never feel totally comfortable as a QB when you're throwing the ball because you don't know who's going be the guy who's guarding who."

This refers to disguise and pattern matching.
There would be a LB (whether OLB or ILB) guarding the hole or help double teaming a receiver or a TE. They try to take away the throw to the middle part of the field (mainly). That helps the CBs and safeties by lessening their burden on slants and crossing routes. (Not always, but definitely more help than the Texans LBs ever help out on these routes.)
 
Sure, what corner can not be beaten or what WR can not have a great play? Tongue in cheek or not you know you agree with me.:ahhaha:

Yeah, difference between goodness and greatness in sprots is pretty narrow. A batter in baseball only needs 2 hits per week to go from .250 to .300. A Wr needs only 1.5 catches to go from boring 65 catch guy to 90 catch pro-bowler. It may take a lot for players to make those handful of plays over the next guy, but barring the silly extremes of awful and elite, figuring out how not to let Steve Smith pass interfere or not making that slight slip on a break is a two play difference in being pretty versus not good. It is that close.
 
In summary, I do not feel it would be wise for the Texans to assume that Jackson will improve and become a competent player in 2011. By drafting CBs and (hopefully) bringing in a top free agent, I believe the organization agrees with that rationale. It's time for the Texans to discontinue the practice of handing young players jobs they have not earned. Kareem Jackson has yet to earn a job as a Houston Texan.

FYI, this is what Kubiak said at the combine:

(on what’s been said to cornerback Kareem Jackson this offseason) “I think he’s going to be a great player. I really do. We drafted him. We put him in a tough spot. As a player, we start him from day one. We know he went through some tough times. The whole back end went through some tough times. To be a great player in this league, I think you have to go through some of that. The thing that I’m impressed with Kareem is through last year he never missed a day. Never missed a practice. Never missed a game. When you’re able to withstand that type of stuff, you’re able to go through tough times. The biggest bounce you usually make is from year one to two. I’m expecting him to do that.”

http://www.houstontexans.com/news/article-3/Quotes-Kubiak-at-the-Combine/1ba0f7a9-b25b-48a7-b242-671c5554f1ae
 
If you are saying the circles I thought were receivers are actually TEs.. maybe. But nothing indicates that. If it is two WRs, I want corners on them; SS and LBs should cover TEs leaving a FS to back up the play.

The formation is a standard straight I, with one TE lining up outside the tackle.
The two outside circles are receivers.

It's not like you're asking the FS to run with a receiver; he only comes down to cut off the slant route.

There were a few plays last year that Bush actually had Pollard and Wilson run with the receiver.
 
And this is why we had problems as our CBs could not run with many WRs and had to have safety help but did not many times. If our CBs could run with WRs, the QB could not successfully choose where to throw regardless of the FS. If we have Aso and my draft pick Brandon Harris @ corners with Quin helping out Harris ALWAYS, then QB has to hope ASO slips or WR just beats him.

Allen can run with most receivers, but too often, he can't finish the play.
In a way, he's like JJ of the defense, dropping a few catches more than you would like to see.

I know you like Harris.
My opinion is that he's Jackson younger brother.

"Au contraire" to what you thought, I watched Aso about half a dozen times recently to study him. He's not in zero coverage at any time (The Texans were.) They rolled the safety over to help him just as much as the Texans did to Jackson. On the average, he received better safety help.
 
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That would be great if we had any LB's that were good in coverage. I'm with you and a few others as far as being concerned with our LB corps. I don't count on Ryans coming back anywhere near 100% his pre-injury self or count on him for any extended length of time. So with whom and how is Wade going to improve that aspect of coverage? Do you think Sharpton will be that much improved in his sophomor season? He showed nice flashes last season.

I like Sharpton. I just rewatched a little of the Broncos game and it was said during the game that the Texans are really excited about him (I've heard that before.)

I know I've said this before, but we do have quite a few players who played the same coverage scheme as Wade's in college: Jackson, Harris, Carmichael, Keo, Demeco, Sharpton, Adibi.

I know I have some game tapes of Nolan somewhere, I can check that as well.
Don't think I have one of Quin though.

Safety or CB?
Well, if we only get one than I have to go with Aso.

I actually think that Jackson's make up is very good to be a safety.
If we get Aso and another vet, I wouldn't hesitate to move Jackson to safety.

Nolan may work out if he can raise his football IQ some (but then again, we've already tried Pollard.)
I still haven't given up on him though. We'll see if he can improve.

In the end, it's probably more realistic to hope for a vet CB not named Aso and a vet safety.
 
In the Chargers game, it cam be said that none of the 3 guys involved played it well.

Quin is at the top of he screen, Jacksona the bottom and Wilson at safety.

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Here we see that Jackson is threatened with a possible backshoulder fade, or a corner route.

At this moment, Jackson can see that Wilson was still in good position to provide help inside.

We can also see that it was cover 3 because the crosser was distancing himself from Quin.
 
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Wilson committed himself way before Rivers threw the pass.
You can't do that in cover 3.
The rule of thumb is to break on the ball.
(Let's recall that on the pass to R. Williams, Wilson didn't react until way after the ball was thrown.)

Wilson can only break early if a drop kick call was made.
In that case, Quin took too much of a vertical break instead of heading straight toward the deep route.

From the shuffle, Jackson was forced to take a baseball turn and therefore could not squeeze the route more to the inside.
 
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Here we see that Jackson is threatened with a possible backshoulder fade, or a corner route.

At this moment, Jackson can see that Wilson was still in good position to provide help inside.

We can also see that it was cover 3 because the crosser was distancing himself from Quin.

Is there a problem here with the spacing of the linebackers?

Should the MLB have gotten a little more depth on this? Or is this where he's supposed to be? That just seems like a huge hole there and the LB should be taking that passing lane away. At least, that's what it looks like to me.
 
The baseball turn from the shuffle also left Jackson behind the receiver.

In this case, the shuffle technique hurt.
The miscommunication between the back 3 hurt more though.

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You're making it sound like KJ was almost on par with Aso. Except the Raiders had better S play. If this is true Huff should be valued like Reed and Polamalu in FA.

You've done a fine job using a few plays to illustrate your point with KJ. My eyes at the time told me a different story. I also remember the thread about D.Gibbs teaching the CB's a different technique than most other DB coaches. This contributed mightly to KJ's struggles. IMHO

I do appreciate all of the time you spend watching film. It's very informative.
 
Is there a problem here with the spacing of the linebackers?

Should the MLB have gotten a little more depth on this? Or is this where he's supposed to be? That just seems like a huge hole there and the LB should be taking that passing lane away. At least, that's what it looks like to me.

I have considered it and I agree with you.
But it's also a tough call for the MLB.
He did have to play the run, and then he had to look for the FB at the same time he made his drop.

The rule in zone coverage is to gain depth first, and that he didn't do.
He went horizontal a bit too much.
He could have helped Wilson from making the early jump, but only if he committed to getting depth first.

Basically, the Chargers PA run fake works just as ours normally did.
 
You're making it sound like KJ was almost on par with Aso. Except the Raiders had better S play. If this is true Huff should be valued like Reed and Polamalu in FA.

You've done a fine job using a few plays to illustrate your point with KJ. My eyes at the time told me a different story. I also remember the thread about D.Gibbs teaching the CB's a different technique than most other DB coaches. This contributed mightly to KJ's struggles. IMHO

I do appreciate all of the time you spend watching film. It's very informative.

I just mentioned that the shuffle technique hurt Jackson in this case.
(You will see that very often when I get to the games - I think I already did in those game analysis.)

Better safety play than what the Texans had last year isn't hard to find.
 
You're making it sound like KJ was almost on par with Aso. Except the Raiders had better S play. If this is true Huff should be valued like Reed and Polamalu in FA.

You've done a fine job using a few plays to illustrate your point with KJ.

What 76 has shown, is that KJ did what he was supposed to do in specific situations.

Aso, Revis, & a handful of other CBs do the things they are supposed to, & then some. They make things happen. We haven't seen that from KJac. He's still learning & if you've really watched him all year, you'll know he was much better at the end of the season..... but the game is still too fast for him. We'll see if it's slowed down any in a few weeks.

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I think you are making things too complicated. I disagree with your analysis of the play as well.

To me it looks like the lb didn't get deep enough and the safety had to come up and fill the void. He squeezes down on the crossing route and he let's Jackson "handle" the deep route.

Jackson just used poor technique and wasn't physically gifted enough to overcome it. He got roasted. Even if Eugene plays the deep route the middle crossing route is wide open because of the play fake and the lbs not busting his butt to get depth.

Rivers is a very good qb and be was going to find the open man.

Jackson still needs to be able to make a tackle or be in the vicinity to at least make a play on the receiver.

You are putting too much pressure on the safeties IMO. Their job is to help the corners when possible. Not completely bail them out. Otherwise, what exactly is the point of Kareem being out there?

The safeties were not good, but when you have lbs that struggle in coverage and corners that can't stay within tackling distance of their man it makes your job harder.

I said this before and I'll say it again. . .Bernard pollard had a very good year the year before Kareem arrived and Wilson was thought to be a decent stop gap until we got a better player there.

Kareem and the rest of the kiddy corners arrive and they are the worst coverage safeties ever? Not buying it.

I've seen dunta and reeves and other corners at least be around the receiver when the catch was made. I haven't seen a corner consistently so far away from his man when the ball was thrown since faggins.

The safety isn't always going to be right there over the top giving a helping hand. You have to man up and make a play sometimes. Kareem never did that.

If the safety didn't do enough to help Kareem he got burned. That's mostly what I'm getting from this thread.

If Kareem got burned it was someone elses fault. Coaches, safeties, wr cheated.

Well Kareem needs to man the heck up next season because every thing around him isnt always going to be perfect. It'd be nice if the first round pick could actually flash some playmaking ability or at least not look uncomfortable so much.

Even if you found one Kareem esque play from aso I guarantee that he manned up and made more plays when someone else messed up than Kareem did. I know that Deion has some plays where he looked bad, Kareem Jackson bad. But I guarantee be manned up and made some plays.

I didn't think Kareem would be great his rookie season, but I didn't expect him to be that bad.

I really can't take the analysis serious because you arent presenting plays that clearly show Kareem messing up. Every bad play he was a part of you are blaming it on someone else.

It would make for a better discussion if you presented both sides so that a good analysis could be made. Show the good, the bad and the ugly. Right not it just seems like you are trying to force feed this notion that Kareem was actually good. It was everyone else around him that let him down.

And I'm not saying this with any animosity or mean spiritedness. I just don't think that you are being very objective and you are looking for and clinging on to anything you can find to try and prove a point that most of us just aren't going to take seriously.

Kareem was awful last year. I think he has talent. But a majority of his woes were not due to outside forces. Well maybe the biggest factor was an outside force. He should have never been handed a starting job without earning it. He was not ready.

Hopefully this coming season he steps his game up.
 
You're making it sound like KJ was almost on par with Aso. Except the Raiders had better S play. If this is true Huff should be valued like Reed and Polamalu in FA.

You've done a fine job using a few plays to illustrate your point with KJ. My eyes at the time told me a different story. I also remember the thread about D.Gibbs teaching the CB's a different technique than most other DB coaches. This contributed mightly to KJ's struggles. IMHO

I do appreciate all of the time you spend watching film. It's very informative.

I think the main thing to take away is that KJ wasn't always as bad as he looked. That's not to say he was great or that he was anywhere near the level he needed to be. But the safeties and linebackers didn't do him any favors.

I've been meaning to ask 76Texan about the difference in footwork and if that caused KJ problems especially coming from a college that taught a technique.

But ultimately, our whole defense sucked. Top to bottom. And I don't think our players are that stupid or that untalented. Why is it that our players (for the past 5 years) have to have our defenses dumbed down for them and have to play everything vanilla and no one else's players seem to have that problem? That's got to be at least partially on the coaches.
 
I think you are making things too complicated. I disagree with your analysis of the play as well.

To me it looks like the lb didn't get deep enough and the safety had to come up and fill the void. He squeezes down on the crossing route and he let's Jackson "handle" the deep route.

Jackson just used poor technique and wasn't physically gifted enough to overcome it. He got roasted. Even if Eugene plays the deep route the middle crossing route is wide open because of the play fake and the lbs not busting his butt to get depth.

Rivers is a very good qb and be was going to find the open man.

Jackson still needs to be able to make a tackle or be in the vicinity to at least make a play on the receiver.

You are putting too much pressure on the safeties IMO. Their job is to help the corners when possible. Not completely bail them out. Otherwise, what exactly is the point of Kareem being out there?

I have put down all the situations you said (on this play).

I talked about the LB not getting depth, and about the shuffle techqniue.
I also said Jackson was unable to squeeze the route more to the inside.
I didn't let him off the hook.

I still maintain the two more important points however:

1. In cover 3, the safety cannot break before the ball is thrown unless he made a great read or the D had a drop-kick call on.
Otherwise, they would just have to bide their time ang give up the crossing route like the Chargers safety did, giving up a 17yd gain to JJ and a 33-yd gain to Casey.
Jammer was a #5 pick overall in 2003; why can't the Chargers let him alone to cover the deep route?

2. If there was a drop-kick call, Quin needed to head directly toward the play.

....

You are asking too much of Jackson in this instance even though you've seen how far Aso was from the play (he was even further away than Jackson.)

You've seen that Walter could have had a TD if the ball was thrown to a receiver on stride.

So why can't Aso man-up and make a tackle before the receiver crossed the goal line?
What was the use of him being out there?
 
I've been meaning to ask 76Texan about the difference in footwork and if that caused KJ problems especially coming from a college that taught a technique.

I never did see Jackson play the shuffle at Alabama (even though Saban did use it on a very limited basis some years before.)

They didn't play zone there either.
When people talk about zone at Alabama, it was the pattern matching concept.
It's a zone that turns into man very quickly.
It's more like switch-man defense in basketball with weak side help, something like that.

I know that all the SEC fields were grass.
I imagine he needs some time to get use to playing on other surfaces, wearing different type of shoes.
 
If the safety didn't do enough to help Kareem he got burned. That's mostly what I'm getting from this thread.

If Kareem got burned it was someone elses fault. Coaches, safeties, wr cheated.


I really can't take the analysis serious because you arent presenting plays that clearly show Kareem messing up. Every bad play he was a part of you are blaming it on someone else.

It would make for a better discussion if you presented both sides so that a good analysis could be made. Show the good, the bad and the ugly. Right not it just seems like you are trying to force feed this notion that Kareem was actually good. It was everyone else around him that let him down.
You keep missing the main point.
That is why the title of the thread is "Jackson's plight".
It is meant to show those plays where he was really not terrible (though certainly nowhere near great) but was made out to be terrible.

You cannot condemn a player when he was doing what he was told by his coaches.
Can he do some thing better? Certainly!

I fail to see how by showing these plays that I can force feed the notion that Jackson was good.
He didn't do anything spectacular in those plays.
 
You are putting too much pressure on the safeties IMO. Their job is to help the corners when possible. Not completely bail them out. Otherwise, what exactly is the point of Kareem being out there?

The safeties were not good, but when you have lbs that struggle in coverage and corners that can't stay within tackling distance of their man it makes your job harder.

I also presented the safeties in these plays as they were.
I look at what their job assignments were and whether they were able to fullfill them.

On the R. Williams play, for example.
It was a one-receiver route with Wilson lining up on that side.
If a safety cannot provide any form of help in that instance, thre's no other conclusion that can be drawn other than he failed utterly at his job.

On the Jabar Gafney 50yd catch (which was actually on a different thread), the Texans were in cover 2 (5-underneath zone, not man).
There was only one receiver on that side and he (Gaffney) ran a skinny post right toward Nolan's landmark.
Nolan bit on the run fake and vacated his zone.

Jackson stretched his zone more than 30 yards and ran after the receiver.
But in an underneath zone, you can ask the CB to stretch only so much.
(I can show you a Dunta play I happen to found to show you how much further away from the receiver Dunta was.)

The mistake was unequivocally Nolan's.
It had nothing to do with Jackson's speed.

In a 5 underneath - 2 deep zone, the CB seeks his landmark, looks for the QB, and reacts.

It's not Jackson's fault that Nolan failed to keep his assignment.
But because Jackson ran after the receiver that he was blamed for the play.
(If only you remember who posted a link to that video in the first place, you would know that he's one of the harshest critics of Jackson, and he was completely bias there.)
 
I never did see Jackson play the shuffle at Alabama (even though Saban did use it on a very limited basis some years before.)

They didn't play zone there either.
When people talk about zone at Alabama, it was the pattern matching concept.
It's a zone that turns into man very quickly.
It's more like switch-man defense in basketball with weak side help, something like that.

I know that all the SEC fields were grass.
I imagine he needs some time to get use to playing on other surfaces, wearing different type of shoes.

He fell down plenty on the grass field in Reliant.

Hopefully he continues to make the improvements that were starting to show at the end of last yr.
 
Here's Jackson in cover 2 on the Gaffney catch:

The whole sequence can be found here:

http://s1217.photobucket.com/albums...s/Gaffney 50 yd catch in cover 2 reduce size/
You can't tell squat from those screen captures. But, you can watch the actual video here and see that Jackson never bumped Jabar, turned and ran with him the entire play, and was smoked by the speed challenged Gaffney.

And that was exactly the lack of field speed that Wade Phillips is concerned with. That's not coaching. That's not technique. That's just getting outrun by a possession receiver.
 
Allen can run with most receivers, but too often, he can't finish the play.
In a way, he's like JJ of the defense, dropping a few catches more than you would like to see.

I know you like Harris.
My opinion is that he's Jackson younger brother."Au contraire" to what you thought, I watched Aso about half a dozen times recently to study him. He's not in zero coverage at any time (The Texans were.) They rolled the safety over to help him just as much as the Texans did to Jackson. On the average, he received better safety help.
WIll you explain this? Two different types of corners.

i am not saying a safety will never help out Aso but it is well known that Asomugha can take care of one side of field by himself. Yes, he will make some bad plays any any player will but most plays you can roll both safeties away from his side offering more strength to Harris.
 
In the Chargers game, it cam be said that none of the 3 guys involved played it well.

Quin is at the top of he screen, Jacksona the bottom and Wilson at safety.

vlcsnap-1800733.jpg


vlcsnap-1800784.jpg


vlcsnap-1800829.jpg


vlcsnap-1800843.jpg


vlcsnap-1800854.jpg
Note that in last two frames QB appears to have committed to runnoing or throwing towards Jackson's side and FS Wilson's back remains toward that area of field where WR will take KJ.
 
You can't tell squat from those screen captures. But, you can watch the actual video here and see that Jackson never bumped Jabar, turned and ran with him the entire play, and was smoked by the speed challenged Gaffney.

And that was exactly the lack of field speed that Wade Phillips is concerned with. That's not coaching. That's not technique. That's just getting outrun by a possession receiver.

Ok well heres what happened, "Screen shot" that was illegal by the WR, "Screen Shot" The safety made Jackson look bad. "Screen Shot" Aso would have even gotten beat there. "Screen Shot" See how everything is always so unfair when its jackson "Screen Shot" Allens INT was a fluke he had terrible coverage "Screen Shot" He fell due to a flaw in The grass, the gardener ambushed K. Jac. Summary Cant you see how good K. Jac is and how unfairly he's being judged. ;)
 
You can't tell squat from those screen captures. But, you can watch the actual video here and see that Jackson never bumped Jabar, turned and ran with him the entire play, and was smoked by the speed challenged Gaffney.

And that was exactly the lack of field speed that Wade Phillips is concerned with. That's not coaching. That's not technique. That's just getting outrun by a possession receiver.

Did you watch the video with sound off?

Must be, 'casue you certainly missed what the announcer was saying:
"Troy Nolan beaten on the play."

Also, there's no specific rule in cover two that the CB has to bump the receiver.
Quin certainly didn't bump the receiver.
And by the way, Jackson lined up at least 7 yards away from the LOS, any kind of bump will be a penalty.

Another note for you: In cover 2, the safety can never be found closer to the LOS than the CB.

Yet another note for you, based on your definition, Dunta was a turtle; he was a mile away from the receiver.
 
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