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FIRE O'BRIEN NOW!!!

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Mr teX said:
Yeah apparently some people are incapable of critical thinking around here.
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Not sure how many more emojis I need to drop on that post. I was simply posting a stat. No way am I saying Keenum is the sheeyat. Just trying to point out how bad the Texans are, 1-12 in 13 games is Cleveland Browns level.
 
Texansballer74 said:
Can we please stop bringing up Case Keenum. It is very clear dude is in a better position and is being coached up better.
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The only point in bringing him up is to highlight that he is indeed "in a better position". He goes 0-8 in 2013 and what we hear is "Case doesn't have it. Time to move on". See, that was a "bad situation" and he's now in a better one so why lay that at Case's feet? Not you specifically just in general.

The next season the situation got better in some ways (More players were healthy) and worse in others (Bill O'Brien came to town with his impressive offensive toolbox) and at the end of the season as the Texans were scraping the bottom of the barrel for a healthy QB Case went 2-0 with improvised game plans. It was nice but the most important thing it showed us was that the situation was better and there was no reason to send Case (or Yates) packing after training camp. We went out and got Fitz and Mallet and neither one of them played better than what was here when Bill O'Brien walked in the door.

I've always said that I wouldn't hold years played for Fisher against anyone just like I don't write someone off because they walk into the Cleveland Browns locker room and instantly suck. It's just what happens to guys who enter that building or who play offense for Jeff Fisher. He apparently sold all of his future offensive output to Satan for one trip to a Super Bowl (but didn't read the fine print and failed to realize it didn't include a win in the deal) but in the years that have followed Case has been coached better and it's payed off.

It's not about Case at this point. Clearly Watson is a better QB than Case. Not a doubt in my mind. It demonstrates though that Case is a pretty good QB who was capable of getting better but that Bill O'Brien wasn't going to be able to get that out of him or anybody else.

Makes me wonder what Fitz might have done here given another year. Makes me wonder whether Savage had any sort of future before O'Brien got his hands on him. Probably not but the way Watson looks this year makes me think that it's more Bill O'Brien's incompetence than anything any of those other QB's did that was the problem.
 
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zshawn10 said:
OddsShark

✔@OddsShark

Updated odds to be the first NFL head coach fired this season (@betonline_ag):

McDermott +400
Jackson +500
O'Brien/Wilks +1000
Joseph/Koetter +1000
Jay Gruden +1000
Bowles/Patricia +1200
Tomlin +1600
Carroll/Garrett +2000
Lewis/Rivera +2500
Jon Gruden +2500
Belichick +10000

11:00 AM - Sep 18, 2018
Click to expand...

He's moving up quick!

@WillBrinson: New "First Coach Fired" odds from @betonline_ag. Two thoughts:
1. Hue should never be behind anyone
2. Belichick should never be ahead of anyone https://t.co/rJEImC3elj
 
Earl34 said:
Those back to back quick WR passes were two of the worst calls I've ever seen in a football game. Just pathetic.

There were not even WR screens. Totally outsmarted himself...Again.
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Watson needs to look for the short passes more instead of just sitting back there waiting for the big play throw.
When you need 8 yards, a little throw over the top into the slot will gett it most times if they are stacking the box like that.
 
Hervoyel said:
The only point in bringing him up is to highlight that he is indeed "in a better position". He goes 0-8 in 2013 and what we hear is "Case doesn't have it. Time to move on". See, that was a "bad situation" and he's now in a better one so why lay that at Case's feet? Not you specifically just in general.

The next season the situation got better in some ways (More players were healthy) and worse in others (Bill O'Brien came to town with his impressive offensive toolbox) and at the end of the season as the Texans were scraping the bottom of the barrel for a healthy QB Case went 2-0 with improvised game plans. It was nice but the most important thing it showed us was that the situation was better and there was no reason to send Case (or Yates) packing after training camp. We went out and got Fitz and Mallet and neither one of them played better than what was here when Bill O'Brien walked in the door.

I've always said that I wouldn't hold years played for Fisher against anyone just like I don't write someone off because they walk into the Cleveland Browns locker room and instantly suck. It's just what happens to guys who enter that building or who play offense for Jeff Fisher. He apparently sold all of his future offensive output to Satan for one trip to a Super Bowl (but didn't read the fine print and failed to realize it didn't include a win in the deal) but in the years that have followed Case has been coached better and it's payed off.

It's not about Case at this point. Clearly Watson is a better QB than Case. Not a doubt in my mind. It demonstrates though that Case is a pretty good QB who was capable of getting better but that Bill O'Brien wasn't going to be able to get that out of him or anybody else.

Makes me wonder what Fitz might have done here given another year. Makes me wonder whether Savage had any sort of future before O'Brien got his hands on him. Probably not but the way Watson looks this year makes me think that it's more Bill O'Brien's incompetence than anything any of those other QB's did that was the problem.
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It's not COACHING....its experience.

most here right now would say Kubiak is/was a better HC than BoB. Yet in his 1st 8 starts here Under Kubiak/Wade he went 0-8. his 2nd stint here under BoB he went 2-0 but it was his 10th start overall. By the time he gets to Minny & does what he did he's got 26 starts under his belt.

Watson hasn't even complete 10 starts yet & he's coming off an injury. Some of the things we've been seeing from Watson are things everyone should've expected once teams got tape. Watson's fumbled the ball twice this year on just basic crap he's been learning since high school. That's not coaching man..that's a kid who's getting indoctrinated into the NFL now that they have tape on him.
 
Texansphan said:
Watson needs to look for the short passes more instead of just sitting back there waiting for the big play throw.
When you need 8 yards, a little throw over the top into the slot will gett it most times if they are stacking the box like that.
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From what I heard Bill O'Brien is micromanaging him. So he threw those passes where Obrien wanted him too.
 
Mr teX said:
It's not COACHING....its experience.

most here right now would say Kubiak is/was a better HC than BoB. Yet in his 1st 8 starts here Under Kubiak/Wade he went 0-8. his 2nd stint here under BoB he went 2-0 but it was his 10th start overall. By the time he gets to Minny & does what he did he's got 26 starts under his belt.

Watson hasn't even complete 10 starts yet & he's coming off an injury. Some of the things we've been seeing from Watson are things everyone should've expected once teams got tape. Watson's fumbled the ball twice this year on just basic crap he's been learning since high school. That's not coaching man..that's a kid who's getting indoctrinated into the NFL now that they have tape on him.
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Oh absolutely. For a QB of Keenum's caliber to even get enough time to put together that many starts is rare. UDFA projects rarely get much of a chance to let the game slow down. The 8 games he got in 2013 were a mixed blessing. Playing time in the regular season is the only thing that will make the game slow down for players but at the same time he was not a QB who was going to be able to just step in and stun people with his game like Watson did with his 6 games last season. Keenum was always going to be a long-term project who needed a coach/team who believed in him and a system in place that leveraged what he did well while compensating for what he did not.

Imagine what 2013 might have looked like if instead of a Bataan Death March of injuries the Texans had been their 2011-2012 selves. Arian Foster and Ben Tate gaining all those yards behind a healthy sure would have gone a long way that season toward covering Keenum's shortcomings the way Minnesota did last year.

Watson made our terrible OL look like it was sort of not drowning and still flourished with his rookie energy and unknown quality. Can you imagine what we would have looked like in 2013 with a healthy offense and him coming in once Schaub went down? Lord Have Mercy! That would have been insane.
 
Another possible coaching mistake not many are talking about.

Football Outsiders:

the Texans faced a fourth-and-8 at the Tennessee 37 with 6:50 left. Bill O'Brien decided to punt, which led to a net of 12 yards in field position after a touchback and 5-yard penalty on Houston. That sounded like a ludicrous decision to me, so I looked at the Game Winning Chance (GWC) according to EdjSports to see what the preferred decision was. By punting, Houston's GWC was 44.4 percent. Going for it with a pass bumped them up to 49.4 percent. The recommended decision was a 55-yard field goal attempt, which moved the GWC to 51.0 percent. Kicker Ka'imi Fairbairn had missed a 54-yard field goal earlier in the game, which may have impacted the decision to punt.

With the Texans in no man's land at the 37, they probably should have tried something minimal on third down to set up an easier fourth down or field goal. Instead Watson had tried another deep throw for a touchdown, but missed the mark badly. I still think punting was the worst possible decision there.
 
TheKDog said:
Another possible coaching mistake not many are talking about.

Football Outsiders:

the Texans faced a fourth-and-8 at the Tennessee 37 with 6:50 left. Bill O'Brien decided to punt, which led to a net of 12 yards in field position after a touchback and 5-yard penalty on Houston. That sounded like a ludicrous decision to me, so I looked at the Game Winning Chance (GWC) according to EdjSports to see what the preferred decision was. By punting, Houston's GWC was 44.4 percent. Going for it with a pass bumped them up to 49.4 percent. The recommended decision was a 55-yard field goal attempt, which moved the GWC to 51.0 percent. Kicker Ka'imi Fairbairn had missed a 54-yard field goal earlier in the game, which may have impacted the decision to punt.

With the Texans in no man's land at the 37, they probably should have tried something minimal on third down to set up an easier fourth down or field goal. Instead Watson had tried another deep throw for a touchdown, but missed the mark badly. I still think punting was the worst possible decision there.
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I get that Fairbairn missed on a 54 yarder that he clearly miss hit earlier in the game, but the kid has a leg on him. He hit from 60 in college, and was constantly sending them through the back of the endzone in kickoffs. I didn't see any reason to not let him try it

To me it comes down to, do you play to win or play to not lose. O'Brien has proven time and time again he will play to not lose a game over playing to win.
 
Shishkabob said:
I get that Fairbairn missed on a 54 yarder that he clearly miss hit earlier in the game, but the kid has a leg on him. He hit from 60 in college, and was constantly sending them through the back of the endzone in kickoffs. I didn't see any reason to not let him try it

To me it comes down to, do you play to win or play to not lose. O'Brien has proven time and time again he will play to not lose a game over playing to win.
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No guts no glory comes to mind.
 
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More Football Outsiders:


the Texans absolutely whooped the Tennessee Titans in DVOA this week despite actually losing the game.

They lost the game because of one big play (the fake punt touchdown), two Tennessee fourth-down conversions, and some very bad game and clock management. They got stuck twice with fourth-and-long in no man's land, and punted both times: fourth-and-14 on the Tennessee 38 and fourth-and-8 on the Tennessee 37. But overall when it came to getting yardage, the Texans were better than you think they were. Those yardage gains aren't usually going to end up with fourth-and-long in no man's land in future games.
 
Texansballer74 said:
Yeah it's crazy out there.
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I think what he's saying is even after 16 years of marriage & 4 kids, we still see folks deciding to "stop living a lie."

What we really need to know is if you went camping with your buddies & passed out after drinking too much, would you tell anyone if your rear was sore when you woke up?
 
Hervoyel said:
Went out the door Sunday morning without a second thought. My wife asked me what time the game was and I told her I didn’t know. I was taking a break.

I know when I say I got rid of all my Texans **** it brings to mind idiot fans burning their jerseys and stupid stuff like that. All that tells the Texans is your dumb ass is ready to buy a new jersey when they turn it around. I didn’t throw everything away. I cleared out all the crap that was all over the house to get it out of my face 24-7. It’s about taking this down a notch and trying to get football back in perspective. Starting back in 2002 I think a lot of us just got all “110%” and wanna-be “Superfan” (I know I did) and I didn’t do myself any favors putting the Texans on a pedestal from day one. Unrealistic expectations and as we all found out they weren’t prepared to meet even realistic expectations. Sure if they’d been the second coming of the old Dallas Cowboys that would be one thing but it became obvious pretty quick that they were as dumb and dysfunctional as the Oiler’s before them. Maybe for those who hated Columbia Blue they were a step up in team colors but they have always been just as lost as the Oiler’s were for most of their existence.

It’s time to not care about them for a while. It will be good for me. Better things to do them watch them bumble around raising my blood pressure.
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Couldn't agree more. I haven't watched a game, or even cared about this team since the end of the 15-16 season. It was like I was in a abusive relationship with this team, no matter what they did I would make excuses, and take up for them. Then I finally got tired of it, and chunked up the deuce. There was one major thing that finally made me say fk it, and give up (:patriot) and I haven't given a damn, or looked back since. As a matter of fact, I had forgotten all about football season this year, until I saw a commercial for the preseason games last month on channel 13.. Last Sunday, I was out shopping with my girl, and saw the game on the TV at a bar, and didn't even give it a double take to check it out. Its cool to not have to break plans, and piss my old lady off by having to watch football on Sundays. Now, from the outside looking in, I'm becoming disgusted with the league just like I did with the NBA. It would take a miracle for me to even attempt to follow this team or the NFL for the foreseeable future. I'm not hating one people that still watch, and Im not gonna talk **** about them, they can do as they please, it all good. I believe everyone should do what makes them happy in life, just don't talk smack or judge me because I'm no longer down with the game. Ok, thats all I have to say about that. :forrest:
 
TheKDog said:
Another possible coaching mistake not many are talking about.

Football Outsiders:

the Texans faced a fourth-and-8 at the Tennessee 37 with 6:50 left. Bill O'Brien decided to punt, which led to a net of 12 yards in field position after a touchback and 5-yard penalty on Houston. That sounded like a ludicrous decision to me, so I looked at the Game Winning Chance (GWC) according to EdjSports to see what the preferred decision was. By punting, Houston's GWC was 44.4 percent. Going for it with a pass bumped them up to 49.4 percent. The recommended decision was a 55-yard field goal attempt, which moved the GWC to 51.0 percent. Kicker Ka'imi Fairbairn had missed a 54-yard field goal earlier in the game, which may have impacted the decision to punt.

With the Texans in no man's land at the 37, they probably should have tried something minimal on third down to set up an easier fourth down or field goal. Instead Watson had tried another deep throw for a touchdown, but missed the mark badly. I still think punting was the worst possible decision there.
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I was livid he didn't go for it here. Or at least try the FG
 
steelbtexan said:
I think BOB is getting worse in his decision making over the yrs. But I want to see what he does with a complete team ...
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You wanted Kubiak gone after 4 seasons, he began with nothing (Andre and a mediocre kicker) and spent his entire career with Rick Smith. O'Brien began with a roster that had won 12 games and sent 9 players to the ProBowl in a single season, with Keenum as a potential starting quarterback. You say you want to see what O'Brien can do with a complete team? I'd like to see O'Brien make the team BETTER for once. Hell, I'm not sure if a head coach has ever been gifted a more complete team.
 
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Scooter said:
You wanted Kubiak gone after 4 seasons, he began with nothing (Andre and a mediocre kicker) and spent his entire career with Rick Smith. O'Brien began with a roster that had won 12 games and sent 9 players to the ProBowl in a single season, with Keenum as a potential starting quarterback. You say you want to see what O'Brien can do with a complete team? I'd like to see O'Brien make the team BETTER for once. Hell, I'm not sure if a head coach has ever been gifted a more complete team.
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Kubiak hand picked Smith.

Surely you can see the difference.

I blame Kubiak for the decade of incompetence. He's the one who brought Ricky here and he suffered the consequences of that decision.
 
steelbtexan said:
Kubiak hand picked Smith.

Surely you can see the difference.

I blame Kubiak for the decade of incompetence. He's the one who brought Ricky here and he suffered the consequences of that decision.
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Lol this is actually better than I hoped. Your post is nonsense of course, but I didn't expect "decade of incompetence" while completely failing to respond to my post.
 
Scooter said:
Lol this is actually better than I hoped. Your post is nonsense of course, but I didn't expect "decade of incompetence" while completely failing to respond to my post.
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Who vouched for bringing Ricky here?

The McNair's didn't wakeup one morning and say, we just gotta interview this Rick Smith guy. The McNair's didn't even know Rick Smith existed.

Carry on and dont jizz on your Kubiak sheets this morning.
 
steelbtexan said:
Who vouched for bringing Ricky here?

The McNair's didn't wakeup one morning and say, we just gotta interview this Rick Smith guy. The McNair's didn't even know Rick Smith existed.

Carry on and dont jizz on your Kubiak sheets this morning.
Click to expand...

Still missing my post. Your random rant about Kubiak and Smith and jizz kinda speaks to what I was saying here and elsewhere.
 
steelbtexan said:
I know, and thought that the Texans house should've been cleaned.

Ricky/BOB should've both been fired and a clean slate for the new GM/HC should've been in place. But that's not the way the McNair's operate their org.
Click to expand...

They are so worried of being a perennial bad team, that they hang onto the guy that they think makes them at least mediocre, and then add someone who they hope can take the mediocrity over the top
 
Scooter said:
Still missing my post. Your random rant about Kubiak and Smith and jizz kinda speaks to what I was saying here and elsewhere.
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What is the point of your post?

The Texans made it to the playoffs 2 out of the 4 yrs that BOB has been here and got to the same place in the payoffs as Kubiak did. The only difference is it took Kubiak twice as long to accomplish what BOB did.

With that said I would've cleaned house when Ricky was fired and gotten a fresh start. Just like I would have fired Ricky when Kubiak was fired and started over.
 
Shishkabob said:
They are so worried of being a perennial bad team, that they hang onto the guy that they think makes them at least mediocre, and then add someone who they hope can take the mediocrity over the top
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The greatest failing of the Texans org.

But hey, the way they run their org has made them billions, so what do I know.
 
steelbtexan said:
What is the point of your post?

The Texans made it to the playoffs 2 out of the 4 yrs that BOB has been here and got to the same place in the payoffs as Kubiak did. The only difference is it took Kubiak twice as long to accomplish what BOB did.

With that said I would've cleaned house when Ricky was fired and gotten a fresh start. Just like I would have fired Ricky when Kubiak was fired and started over.
Click to expand...

The point of my post is that O'Brien inherited everything, built by Kubiak and Smith. 2 #1 receivers, a #1 tightend, a massive offensive line, and a hidden gem that Kubiak had been working on in Keenum ... along with a monster defense with (luckily) Romeo coaching. And he entered with the #1 pick in the draft.

You want to see what O'Brien can do with a full roster? We saw it - 8 offensive probowlers and a top 2 defense with Romeo on board. The two best offensive linemen were outspoken against the Texans, and we dropped/retired everyone else. Our junk qb's are better elsewhere. Now? Kubiak made those probowlers out of zero with Rick Smith ... why didn't O'Brien with 8 to begin with?
 
Scooter said:
The point of my post is that O'Brien inherited everything, built by Kubiak and Smith. 2 #1 receivers, a #1 tightend, a massive offensive line, and a hidden gem that Kubiak had been working on in Keenum ... along with a monster defense with (luckily) Romeo coaching. And he entered with the #1 pick in the draft.

You want to see what O'Brien can do with a full roster? We saw it - 8 offensive probowlers and a top 2 defense with Romeo on board. The two best offensive linemen were outspoken against the Texans, and we dropped/retired everyone else. Our junk qb's are better elsewhere. Now? Kubiak made those probowlers out of zero with Rick Smith ... why didn't O'Brien with 8 to begin with?
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They were a West Coast/Old team.

They were on their last legs on offense. Myers/Wade Smith soon retired and weren't the same guys. OD, all of these guys retired within 3 yrs of BOB taking over. AJ = on his last legs.

The defense was good.

Please lets not turn this into a BOB/Kubiak debate and lets see how BOB/Gaine do next yr with 26 mil in cap space rolled over, (They probably wont spend much in FA) and a full compliment of draft picks.
 
Sports Insights

✔@SportsInsights
https://twitter.com/SportsInsights/status/1042145555798020104

Next #NFL Head Coach to be fired odds:

Bill O'Brien +500
Hue Jackson +600
Sean McDermott +750
Jay Gruden +1000
Steve Wilks +1000
Vance Joseph +1000
Dirk Koetter +1200
Todd Bowles +1200
Pat Shurmur +1400
Matt Patricia +1600

via Bet Online

1f3c8.png
23ec.png
http://actionnetwork.com/nfl

3:17 PM - Sep 18, 2018

Boston Globe Sports

✔@BGlobeSports
https://twitter.com/BGlobeSports/status/1042366503318966272

.@BenVolin: Bill O’Brien’s embarrassing Week 2, and other thoughts from around the NFL.https://trib.al/wqRHmnh

5:55 AM - Sep 19, 2018

SportsMap@sportsmaphou
https://twitter.com/sportsmaphou/status/1042343489709715456

Bill O'Brien lacks the goods of big time head coaches http://bit.ly/2Dc0MXz

4:23 AM - Sep 19, 2018
 
zshawn10 said:
Sports Insights

✔@SportsInsights

Next #NFL Head Coach to be fired odds:

Bill O'Brien +500
Hue Jackson +600
Sean McDermott +750
Jay Gruden +1000
Steve Wilks +1000
Vance Joseph +1000
Dirk Koetter +1200
Todd Bowles +1200
Pat Shurmur +1400
Matt Patricia +1600

via Bet Online

1f3c8.png
23ec.png
http://actionnetwork.com/nfl

3:17 PM - Sep 18, 2018

Boston Globe Sports

✔@BGlobeSports

.@BenVolin: Bill O’Brien’s embarrassing Week 2, and other thoughts from around the NFL.https://trib.al/wqRHmnh

5:55 AM - Sep 19, 2018

SportsMap@sportsmaphou

Bill O'Brien lacks the goods of big time head coaches http://bit.ly/2Dc0MXz

4:23 AM - Sep 19, 2018
Click to expand...

I believe O'Brien has jumped to +1000. Significant jump in the wrong direction.
 
Come on Bill!!!!!

Throwing out that retarded WR screen pass would do you good buddy.

Release the WR into the flat and have more cross and slant routes. Hell 3 yards is better than this -2 yards were getting.
 
BOBdaFRAUD said:
Come on Bill!!!!!

Throwing out that retarded WR screen pass would do you good buddy.

Release the WR into the flat and have more cross and slant routes. Hell 3 yards is better than this -2 yards were getting.
Click to expand...

but but it worked that 1 time against Seattle...
 
Come on Bill!!!!!

Throwing out that retarded WR screen pass would do you good buddy.

Release the WR into the flat and have more cross and slant routes. Hell 3 yards is better than this -2 yards were getting.
Shishkabob said:
but but it worked that 1 time against Seattle...
Click to expand...


Wait was that with Kevin Walter was out WR?
 
BOBdaFRAUD said:
Come on Bill!!!!!

Throwing out that retarded WR screen pass would do you good buddy.

Release the WR into the flat and have more cross and slant routes. Hell 3 yards is better than this -2 yards were getting.



Wait was that with Kevin Walter was out WR?
Click to expand...
No last year when Hopkins did it against Seattle.
 
BOBdaFRAUD said:
Come on Bill!!!!!

Throwing out that retarded WR screen pass would do you good buddy.

Release the WR into the flat and have more cross and slant routes. Hell 3 yards is better than this -2 yards were getting.
Click to expand...

According to patdstat watson audibled to the wr screens
 
Much as I hate Bill, scary thing is the lack of energy from the players.

These players are tackling like losers and running half speed. I mean how can that be Bill's fault.
 
TheKDog said:
Another possible coaching mistake not many are talking about.

Football Outsiders:

the Texans faced a fourth-and-8 at the Tennessee 37 with 6:50 left. Bill O'Brien decided to punt, which led to a net of 12 yards in field position after a touchback and 5-yard penalty on Houston. That sounded like a ludicrous decision to me, so I looked at the Game Winning Chance (GWC) according to EdjSports to see what the preferred decision was. By punting, Houston's GWC was 44.4 percent. Going for it with a pass bumped them up to 49.4 percent. The recommended decision was a 55-yard field goal attempt, which moved the GWC to 51.0 percent. Kicker Ka'imi Fairbairn had missed a 54-yard field goal earlier in the game, which may have impacted the decision to punt.

With the Texans in no man's land at the 37, they probably should have tried something minimal on third down to set up an easier fourth down or field goal. Instead Watson had tried another deep throw for a touchdown, but missed the mark badly. I still think punting was the worst possible decision there.
Click to expand...
Maybe he thought he still had Lechler and could pin them down inside the 5. It's not his job to keep track of who is on the team, right?
 
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