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DW4 Traded to Cleveland

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Earl34 said:
Similar to when O'Brien was here. Albert Breer is a media PR mouthpiece for current and former Patriots. If this is what he is posting, you can believe it came from Caserio or Easterby. The only question is if he is being used to inform or his story is an NRG negotiation ploy.
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Thanks for posting Earl34……article offered some solid insight.

The only thing that could “maybe” change any interested team(s) position…..is if Watson were to come out and announce that he wants to continue playing for the Texans and then he makes all the necessary apologies.

I doubt Watson ever changes his mind but if no team is willing to make a move this season then the Texans leave him in the stands. The Texans are off to the 2022 off-season waiting for any type of legal resolution. I believe Watson’s 2022 contract becomes fully guaranteed in early March, just ahead of the Texans ability to try and trade him. I just stumbled across an interesting article and will try to attach.
 
Texansballer74 said:
Question: Why is Watson acting like the Texans betrayed his trust? What’s the real reason he wants out of here?
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I thought I'd answered that a few times ..... Bottom line , when the crap hit the fan legally with these civil & criminal issues against Watson , Cal & co point blank told him they weren't backing him.
The trade demand had nothing to do with the commonly accepted as truth not hiring a minority stuff , he was kept in the loop about that , he knew that Caserio was their guy and that they were doing their due diligence in checking out other options.
It had nothing to do with Bienemy not getting a look see either - the damage was done before that and no hiring would have changed his decision.

I can't fault Cal & co for telling him that he wasn't backing a guy who was accused of assaulting upwards of 30 women. I wouldn't have either.

They all knew as far back as the end of September 2020 that these legal issues were coming as the first criminal complaints went to police in around that time - two or three weeks after he signed the extension.
That's when they learned that he wasn't just screwing a bunch of groupies as they believed when they traded DHop for being a bad influence ....
 
JB said:
I believe his 2022 contract is already guaranteed. His 2023 salary becomes guaranteed on the 5th day of league year 2022 per OTC

Link
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Thanks for the input. When I get off my iPad I’ll sit down with the laptop and load the article I read. It’s a good read.
 
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Corrosion said:
I thought I'd answered that a few times ..... Bottom line , when the crap hit the fan legally with these civil & criminal issues against Watson , Cal & co point blank told him they weren't backing him.
The trade demand had nothing to do with the commonly accepted as truth not hiring a minority stuff , he was kept in the loop about that , he knew that Caserio was their guy and that they were doing their due diligence in checking out other options.
It had nothing to do with Bienemy not getting a look see either - the damage was done before that and no hiring would have changed his decision.

I can't fault Cal & co for telling him that he wasn't backing a guy who was accused of assaulting upwards of 30 women. I wouldn't have either.

They all knew as far back as the end of September 2020 that these legal issues were coming as the first criminal complaints went to police in around that time - two or three weeks after he signed the extension.
That's when they learned that he wasn't just screwing a bunch of groupies as they believed when they traded DHop for being a bad influence ....
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They’ve been doing wild stuff way before Hopkins got there. That stuff is all over the league. Shoots these players been getting in way back in college. The true reason why they got rid of Hopkins because him and O’Brien got into it after the Chiefs game. He said he forced his way out of here. The man was livid with O’Brien because of his play calling after being up 24 against the Chiefs.
 
Texansballer74 said:
They’ve been doing wild stuff way before Hopkins got there. That stuff is all over the league. Shoots these players been getting in way back in college. The true reason why they got rid of Hopkins because him and O’Brien got into it after the Chiefs game. He said he forced his way out of here. The man was livid with O’Brien because of his play calling after being up 24 against the Chiefs.
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Yeah, Hopkins left cause he knew his career here would end up like AJ’s if he stayed here, with no chance at a ring.
 
Corrosion said:
Maybe we need to wait and see if there is some method to the madness ....


I haven't done paid any attention to the cap in the last 18 months , just haven't had the give a damn.


When does all this dead money come off the books ?
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they have 28 players signed for 2022, with $42m in space. Some simple and likely moves such as cut Cannon ($6.35m), Murray ($5.25m) and McRay ($2m), trade DW4 ($24m) and Cunningham ($1.95m) nets about $40m more. Then expect a lot of draft picks and a few key leaders signed or re-signed. By 2023, if Zach and DW4 are gone, Tunsil is followed by your kickers in salary, so an open book to do what you want.
 
Rich Schmidt said:
they have 28 players signed for 2022, with $42m in space. Some simple and likely moves such as cut Cannon ($6.35m), Murray ($5.25m) and McRay ($2m), trade DW4 ($24m) and Cunningham ($1.95m) nets about $40m more. Then expect a lot of draft picks and a few key leaders signed or re-signed. By 2023, if Zach and DW4 are gone, Tunsil is followed by your kickers in salary, so an open book to do what you want.
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proverbial light end of the tunnel. Truly clean slate for Caserio. Just hope more football management people are brought in to replace non football people. Need a solid analytics team, sports medicine doctors, special in house trainers including message therapists and upgrades to the College/Pro football scouting departments.
 
beerlover said:
proverbial light end of the tunnel. Truly clean slate for Caserio. Just hope more football management people are brought in to replace non football people. Need a solid analytics team, sports medicine doctors, special in house trainers including message therapists and upgrades to the College/Pro football scouting departments.
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The four seats at the Kirby boardroom round table says, NO!
 
Corrosion said:
If you remember .... I was the first one to break the reason behind the DHop trade and the Momma Watson involvement as well as the very first to refer to Instagram as the source of these issues which ultimately ends up leading us to the root of his legal issues today.

To this day no "reporter" or talking head has actually reported those things but we've learned piecemeal over time that they were factual..

But lets go back in time here to before that - Watson had no extension and his momma was in the ear of Easterby , Cal & Janice complaining that Hopkins was a bad influence on her son. He's dating all these tramps instead of sticking with the high class girlfriend he had been with for several years.

Without that trade , there probably was no extension and they are forced to either tag him or trade him , sounds great in hindsight .... bit that's because hindsight's always 20/20.
But at the time , before the trade demands and before the sex charges , the world would have laughed at them for ending up in that situation.

I think it's also safe to say that just about any team in the league would have made the same decision trying to protect their franchise QB at the expense of trading Hopkins. Not that those other teams would have gotten such a poor return .... Image is everything.

The optics now are that the Texans are stupid for giving him an extension .... They are idiots for trying to protect him .... problem is they can't protect him from himself.

And here we are today with the Texans doing all they can to salvage their investment .... an investment that one person put the torch to.


When you look at it from your perspective , piecemeal of partial information , it looks like they are keystone cops. But when you break down the facts and apply a little logic , the optics change and there's only one person to blame.


No Cal isn't the best in the business and definitely wasn't ready for the job but he's not the source of the problems , just the one who has to deal with them. Yes , he's done so poorly but being honest , I don't think many people would have handled it differently. This was destined to be a cluster**** from the get go.
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Corrosion said:
I don't know how I haven't been able to get this point across over multiple posts on the subject -

We knew but we didn't know.

What we knew , or thought we knew was that Watson was screwing around with multiple groupies on instagram - None of that is against the law , it was just a lack of discretion on his part.

What we didn't have a clue about was the illegal , none of that had come to light until after the extension.

Does that clear it up for you ?
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Corrosion said:
I thought I'd answered that a few times ..... Bottom line , when the crap hit the fan legally with these civil & criminal issues against Watson , Cal & co point blank told him they weren't backing him.
The trade demand had nothing to do with the commonly accepted as truth not hiring a minority stuff , he was kept in the loop about that , he knew that Caserio was their guy and that they were doing their due diligence in checking out other options.
It had nothing to do with Bienemy not getting a look see either - the damage was done before that and no hiring would have changed his decision.

I can't fault Cal & co for telling him that he wasn't backing a guy who was accused of assaulting upwards of 30 women. I wouldn't have either.

They all knew as far back as the end of September 2020 that these legal issues were coming as the first criminal complaints went to police in around that time - two or three weeks after he signed the extension.
That's when they learned that he wasn't just screwing a bunch of groupies as they believed when they traded DHop for being a bad influence ....
Click to expand...

I needed this all one post for my own ease of reading and thank you
 
Texansballer74 said:
Why haven’t Watson been arrested?
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Two things. When Watson gets indicted they will likely allow himself to turn himself in. It’s very possible folks won’t get the perp walk/arrest him at his house image.

Number two. The grand jury has to decide to indict him. That’s why he isn’t arrested yet. Also another Possibility. HPD could have filed for a warrant with the Sheriffs Department. That also can take time for someone to be arrested. Any misdemeanor charges would have been filed as what’s called “to be” warrants
 
Texian said:
The File Clerk? One could argue that creating more than $15MM in dead cap money in 2022 with even much more to come, reducing the 2022 cap by another $12MM through 2021 restructuring, trading away future draft picks only to cut traded players weeks or months later, using 10 draft picks to draft 5 players and only having 27 players under contract to start the 2022 season (10 less than the avg team) puts the Texans at a distinct disadvantage and compromises the rebuild. Just a different perspective of looking at the definition of the word damage. Which by this definition is substantial.
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Depends on your vision of the rebuild.

If they hit on Collins then I will be glad they traded up to get him. The rest of the trades were basically late rd pick swaps and he spent a 5th taking a flier on Miller. Certainly not a franchise ruining move. He probably recaptured that in the Ingram trade. I've already talked until I'm blue in the face with you about why the cap doesn't really matter until 2024.
 
Earl34 said:
Similar to when O'Brien was here. Albert Breer is a media PR mouthpiece for current and former Patriots. If this is what he is posting, you can believe it came from Caserio or Easterby. The only question is if he is being used to inform or his story is an NRG negotiation ploy.
Click to expand...

He's just pointing out the obvious.
 
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You know those Antique Roadshow episodes where someone comes in with an item and a fantastic story about how they came about to possess it and that it must be worth so much, only for the expert to say it is a fake, but a good one, and worth next to nothing?

This is how I feel about the trade value the Texans will eventually get for Watson.
 
steelbtexan said:
I've already talked until I'm blue in the face with you about why the cap doesn't really matter until 2024.
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Saying it over and over still doesn't make it so. It just means you're terribly uninformed and wrong every time you say it. :)

Why you're wrong. If you hadn't flushed $50MM down the drain in fiscally irresponsible decision making you would have an extra $50MM that could go a very long way to signing some real long time players that would make a BIG difference in rebuilding.

And while you think pissing $50MM down the drain is no BIG deal, Indy, Jax and Tenn are not and as result have $50MM in new players putting the Texans that much further behind in their rebuild.

Your logic is Kirby Boardroom Roundtable logic.
 
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banned1976 said:
The one thing I would have done differently if I was in charge (and I say this w/o knowledge about what could be happening behind the scenes) was had Watson suit up. Right now, what it looks like from my humble outsider view, the Texans are doing Goddell’s dirty work.
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No way he should even see the field. None. Because the Texans know the severity of it and what he has done. I guess you can say well they knew last season too.
 
No sane team is trading what it will take to get WD40 with his legal uncertainty. The Texans are not going to off-load him for a bargain price either. They can just wait and let the legal process play out at this point instead of taking a bargain rate now. Doesn’t matter how many new articles Mike Florio publishes for clicks. The Texans may be in the business of “doing players a solid” when it comes to letting JJ and Mercilus go for nothing and letting Ingram go for what might as well be nothing.

But that’s not happening with WD40. He will fetch the asking price or he will rot on the bench as the world’s most expensive bench warmer.
 
Corrosion said:
I don't know how I haven't been able to get this point across over multiple posts on the subject -

We knew but we didn't know.

What we knew , or thought we knew was that Watson was screwing around with multiple groupies on instagram - None of that is against the law , it was just a lack of discretion on his part.

What we didn't have a clue about was the illegal , none of that had come to light until after the extension.

Does that clear it up for you ?
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I understand not knowing the illegal Instagram activity and understand your point. My point is they are running a billion dollar corporation and to their knowledge, one of their most valuable assets is running around like a horny dog humping air. Did they have something similar to the rookie symposium as a refresher for him or even the entire team? Is this Instagram whoring part of the NFL players' culture? Did they bring in someone like a John Lucas or Calvin Hill? Wasn't Easterby suppose to be that guy?

Instead of the knee jerk trade of Hopkins, did they bring both men into a meeting with the character coach as a mediator and reiterate the responsibilities that goes into being the face of the franchise and the potential for the lack of discretion to ruin their brand? Hell, if all of the moms are involved, why not bring in Hopkins' mom and start an intervention with their sons? Even if they still went ahead and traded Hopkins, they should have made Watson aware of the role his behavior played in the trade. Did they do that?

At the end of the day, Watson is a grown man, this mess is his fault and he has to take full responsibility for it. But based on your posts, it seems instead of the Texans addressing the issue head-on, they attempted to sweep it under the rug by trading Hopkins and not holding Watson accountable for his part in the trade or the potential ramifications and unexpected consequences of his legal IG whoring. If they tackled the problem head-on and inform him that this is not "Texans worthy" and unacceptable behavior for the face of their franchise and he gets offended, you trade his ass and whisper to Albert Breer about his IG whoring. Would they be in a worst position than they are today?

So, my point isn't that they knew or should have known about the illegal activities. It's the lack of organizational judgement, leadership and the amateurish way they tried to address this Watson issue. Especially when it appears that trading Hopkins did not fix the issue and might have made it worst. Then they reward Watson with a huge contract and a no-trade clause? It just seems that the McNairs having a known womanizer as the face of their franchise and giving him a huge contract and NTC goes against the perception of them wanting choir boys only.
 
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steelbtexan said:
He's just pointing out the obvious.
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Like when Smith and O'Brien got into it regarding Mallet being late for the Dolphins game. Who put out a public statement reminding people that he had control of the 53? How about for contract negotiations, Breer was the one posting about O'Brien would replace Belichick or complaints about O'Brien's battles with Rick Smith or his source telling him O'Brien would not renew his contract if he didn't get more control? McClain and Berman were not publishing those stories.

1635621434028.png

https://twitter.com/x/status/659070148226117632
 
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Earl34 said:
So, my point isn't that they knew or should of known about the illegal activities. It's the lack of organizational leadership and amateurish way they tried to address this Watson issue. Especially when it appears that trading Hopkins did not fix the issue and might have made it worst.
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Absolutely. & I can understand Watson being upset about it. If it were me, that is the issue that makes the whole think unreconcilable. No way I’m playing for a team that would go to my mom as if I’m some little kid.
 
Texansballer74 said:
They’ve been doing wild stuff way before Hopkins got there. That stuff is all over the league. Shoots these players been getting in way back in college. The true reason why they got rid of Hopkins because him and O’Brien got into it after the Chiefs game. He said he forced his way out of here. The man was livid with O’Brien because of his play calling after being up 24 against the Chiefs.
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Based on the various posts, we have two potential scenarios. The mother of an employee of a billion dollar corporation going to the owner(s) complaining about bad influences around her son and gets the influential, productive employee terminated or senior managers tired of that productive employee and using the "bad influence" angle to convince the owner(s) to terminate him?

I guess we will never know.
 
Texian said:
Saying it over and over still doesn't make it so. It just means you're terribly uninformed and wrong every time you say it. :)

Why you're wrong. If you hadn't flushed $50MM down the drain in fiscally irresponsible decision making you would have an extra $50MM that could go a very long way to signing some real long time players that would make a BIG difference in rebuilding.

And while you think pissing $50MM down the drain is no BIG deal, Indy, Jax and Tenn are not and as result have $50MM in new players putting the Texans that much further behind in their rebuild.

Your logic is Kirby Boardroom Roundtable logic.
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By 2023-2024 they should have plenty of cap space and that's all that really matters, whether you think so or not.
 
steelbtexan said:
By 2023-2024 they should have plenty of cap space and that's all that really matters, whether you think so or not.
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I'm thinking about everything they could do with an extra $50MM between now and 2023 - 2024. $50MM now is a good head start on catching up on division rivals Indy, Jax and Tenn. Why wait until 2023 - 2024? What if 2023 -2024 turns into another bonehead File Clerk 2021 - 2022? File Clerk said he was not going to change his ways. Your whole world is based on a "what if" not a "what has actually happened". This is what the File Clerk knows.
 
Texian said:
I'm thinking about everything they could do with an extra $50MM between now and 2023 - 2024. $50MM now is a good head start on catching up on division rivals Indy, Jax and Tenn. Why wait until 2023 - 2024? What if 2023 -2024 turns into another bonehead File Clerk 2021? File Clerk said he was not going to change his ways.
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OB is that you?

“Doesn’t matter Brian. AFC South Champs two times in a row, Brian!”

I am over being competitive in the AFC South.
 
Texian said:
I'm thinking about everything they could do with an extra $50MM between now and 2023 - 2024. $50MM now is a good head start on catching up on division rivals Indy, Jax and Tenn. Why wait until 2023 - 2024? What if 2023 -2024 turns into another bonehead File Clerk 2021 - 2022? File Clerk said he was not going to change his ways. Your whole world is based on a "what if" not a "what has actually happened". This is what the File Clerk knows.
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No premium FA's want to play for the Texans.

Therefore cap space wont matter until the team is rebuilt and they need to add a few pieces in FA. Now isn't that time.
 
Jack Burton said:
Who’s an immature idiot. How anyone would be butthurt about how Watson was handled in this situation is clearly someone who still lives with his mom.
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DW bought house and a Lambo in 2018 and remodeled his mom's house in Georgia that same year IIRC.
 
Earl34 said:
Based on the various posts, we have two potential scenarios. The mother of an employee of a billion dollar corporation going to the owner(s) complaining about bad influences around her son and gets the influential, productive employee terminated or senior managers tired of that productive employee and using the "bad influence" angle to convince the owner(s) to terminate him?

I guess we will never know.
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Neither employee was "just another employee".
 
Texansballer74 said:
They’ve been doing wild stuff way before Hopkins got there. That stuff is all over the league. Shoots these players been getting in way back in college. The true reason why they got rid of Hopkins because him and O’Brien got into it after the Chiefs game. He said he forced his way out of here. The man was livid with O’Brien because of his play calling after being up 24 against the Chiefs.
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Agreed.

Peyton Manning tea-bagged some chick when he was playing for the Vols…allegedly.

They play a child’s game and a lot of them take a long time to grow up, if they ever do.
 
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