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DW4 Traded to Cleveland

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leebigeztx said:
Thats every qb in the nfl,correct? Isn't it all about the superbowl as many want to proclaim? As is winning a superbowl isn't a team award. Joe Flacco had 1 great postseason aided by a bonehead misplay by the safety and has a sb ring. Eli Manning is .500 as a qb but had 2 great defensive efforts vs BB led squad and have 2 rings. I don't judge qb greatness by rings, never have, and I'm not starting now. Whether Elway won a ring or not, he was the greatest qb ever to me based on those teams and offense he drug to playoffs and the superbowl. Can anyone other than football nuts name those 80s Broncos rbs and wrs and defensive players? I can name those 80s 49ers squads though and point to the fact they never rinished lower than 5 in defense during the 80s. In my opinion, getting your team in the playoffs consistently and having a chance at a run to the superbowl is a success for any qb. In the 4 years as qb of the Texans, what team was superbowl worthy when Watson was the qb? I will wait.
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By your own standards Watson is not a great QB. He didn’t have any more success as Osweiler or Hoyer and in fact his best year Texans went 4-12. Texans were consistently making the playoffs before Watson came along, and yes that was helped by a weak division, so it’s not like he took us to the next level.

To be clear I don’t completely blame him for that but if that is the standard you use then he is no better than the random ball tossers we had before.
 
maverick512000 said:
By your own standards Watson is not a great QB. He didn’t have any more success as Osweiler or Hoyer and in fact his best year Texans went 4-12. Texans were consistently making the playoffs before Watson came along, and yes that was helped by a weak division, so it’s not like he took us to the next level.

To be clear I don’t completely blame him for that but if that is the standard you use then he is no better than the random ball tossers we had before.
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I remember when this was the narrative on a recent SB winning qb. He’d never won a playoff game in 3 attempts prior to this past season. According to his critics, He supposedly only put up the great seasons he did b/c he was throwing to calvin johnson for all those years. Hes not capable of elevating a team If he couldnt win a playoff game with that dude they said. he’s just not that good. Hes a gunslinger whose too careless with the ball. Throws too many picks……Oops. All he did in his 1st year with his new team was put up the 2nd best season of his career & be the difference maker in getting them over the hump to finally winning that SB.
 
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Mr teX said:
Russ wanted out b/c he was no longer feeling how Carroll wanted to continue to run the offense. The whole “let Russ cook” campaign & him making controversial statements about where he’d like to play “if” he was traded was all born out of his passive aggressive way of protesting that. So yeah you are right about Wilson..he didnt get his way with how he wanted the offense to go, so he basically forced his way out without outright putting it out in the media..it was all handled behind closed doors basically.

Peyton Manning came in the league pretty much having that say well before he won a SB.

Vick pretty much did too once he got on the field and did damage his rookie year. That “DVD” offense with Warrick Dunn, Vick and TJ Duckett wasnt what Reeves wanted to run, it was setup around what Vick likely told them what he was comfy with.

So your premise is wrong on its face. its not really tied to winning SB’s..its tied to your talent and what the coaches BELIEVE you can do ……if you’ve already shown that you’re a baller at the position and can win.

So…yes i am comparing DW4 to them…..but only as a qb who is viewed by league personnel as a dynamic enough talent at the position to get a team to the promised land…

& regardless of what y’all think about him, its CRYSTAL CLEAR to people in league circles whose livelihoods are on the line that he DEFINITELY is a guy talented enough to maybe listen to his input about what he likes to run, not run and accordingly adjust it or cut it out the playbook entirely.

Dont see how its so hard to admit to and understand that.


its not a matter of “believing him” so much as it is this is just what happens with star qbs period…its just often not spoken on in the manner Stefanski spoke to it.
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People want to keep comparing it to a coach designed offense for a player when I keep saying it is a player designed offense for the coach.

I am moving on.
 
TexansBull said:
People want to keep comparing it to a coach designed offense for a player when I keep saying it is a player designed offense for the coach.

I am moving on.
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Thats b/c theres no such difference. Its a collaborative effort……even with the star qbs. You’re the one trying to infer something that isn’t really there.
 
Mr teX said:
Thats b/c theres no such difference. Its a collaborative effort……even with the star qbs. You’re the one trying to infer something that isn’t really there.
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And that’s why you are wrong. There is such a difference in this case. It has been said as much by Stefanski’s comments.
 
TexansBull said:
And that’s why you are wrong. There is such a difference in this case. It has been said as much by Stefanski’s comments.
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From the article YOU posted:

“I think he’s doing a really nice job learning the system,” Stefanski said.”

“We’re talking as a staff, we’re talking with Deshaun — understanding some of OUR concepts that we’re tweaking and those types of things.

“I think with the quarterback, you do want this to be a COLLABORATION,” Stefanski said. “And really, all quarterbacks are different and you want to make sure you meet them where they are”


You’re reaching like Mr. Fantastic trying to infer something that’s not really a big deal and are playing on words at this point. Its not just a 1-way street like you’re trying to infer. What Stefanski is talking about is the overall collaborative process of melding an offense around the concepts that BOTH parties want in it…not just what DW4 wants.

Carroll wouldn’t do that with Wilson……which is why he wanted out.

McCarthy wouldnt do that with Rodgers which is ultimately why he got the axe.

The days of coaches shoehorning qb’s into their way or the highway offenses has been dead for years. Its why no team is really exclusively running WCO or….exclusively EP. Offenses are an amalgamation of concepts. And you can get those concepts included via an infinite number of plays from several types of offenses and schemes. No where in that article you posted does it say DW4 is refusing to run what Stefanski wants..it in fact goes out of its way to state the opposite. He’s “open” to trying new concepts hes never tried before.
 
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djohn2oo8 said:
Pocket awareness........yikes. Couldn’t read a blitz, feel the blitz (which is why he took so many sacks), nor could he spot a wide open receiver many times.
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He did do a nice job, though, running around in circles behind the line of scrimmage. or taking off and running even when the pressure he perceived was phantom. And he never learned to step into and use the pocket as an effective tool and good friend.
 
Mr teX said:
From the article YOU posted:

“I think he’s doing a really nice job learning the system,” Stefanski said.”

“We’re talking as a staff, we’re talking with Deshaun — understanding some of OUR concepts that we’re tweaking and those types of things.

“I think with the quarterback, you do want this to be a COLLABORATION,” Stefanski said. “And really, all quarterbacks are different and you want to make sure you meet them where they are”


You’re reaching like Mr. Fantastic trying to infer something that’s not really a big deal and are playing on words at this point. Its not just a 1-way street like you’re trying to infer. What Stefanski is talking about is the overall collaborative process of melding an offense around the concepts that BOTH parties want in it…not just what DW4 wants.

Carroll wouldn’t do that with Wilson……which is why he wanted out.

McCarthy wouldnt do that with Rodgers which is ultimately why he got the axe.

The days of coaches shoehorning qb’s into their way or the highway offenses has been dead for years. Its why no team is really exclusively running WCO or….exclusively EP. Offenses are an amalgamation of concepts. And you can get those concepts included via an infinite number of plays from several types of offenses and schemes. No where in that article you posted does it say DW4 is refusing to run what Stefanski wants..it in fact goes out of its way to state the opposite. He’s “open” to trying new concepts hes never tried before.
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Why did you leave out the two lines I quoted? Oh wait - because they say what I am saying.
 
CloakNNNdagger said:
He did do a nice job, though, running around in circles behind the line of scrimmage. or taking off and running even when the pressure he perceived was phantom. And he never learned to step into and use the pocket as an effective tool and good friend.
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Yep. Not going to win in the AFC North by scrambling in the backfield 20 yards behind the line of scrimmage trying to perform a highlight play.
 
Watson has a lot of great skills at QB.

Adapting to any given pro style offense is not one of them.

Which is why players like him need to have offenses tailored to their skill set, because they are unable to adapt to many offensive schemes. It's the same thing that the Ravens are doing with Jackson. (Same attitude of trying to teach Brady or Cousins the RPO offense. It's pointless.)

This is not an attempt to denigrate the players, but rather being objective about their potential and understanding that the only success you'll have with them is if you customize plays and then delete the rest of the NFL schemes that they would simply not be able to run for different reasons.

Watson is never going to be a 5-7 step drop back QB that pre-reads defenses and picks apart their weaknesses like Brady or Manning. His best chance is to make his read and then either scramble someone open or make a run for it. His greatest hits video is based on this simple concept.

Once his legs are gone due to injury or age, he will not be as dynamic because he has never focused his game on the skills needed to be a pure pocket passer.
 
Double Barrel said:
Watson has a lot of great skills at QB.

Adapting to any given pro style offense is not one of them.

Which is why players like him need to have offenses tailored to their skill set, because they are unable to adapt to many offensive schemes. It's the same thing that the Ravens are doing with Jackson. (Same attitude of trying to teach Brady or Cousins the RPO offense. It's pointless.)

This is not an attempt to denigrate the players, but rather being objective about their potential and understanding that the only success you'll have with them is if you customize plays and then delete the rest of the NFL schemes that they would simply not be able to run for different reasons.

Watson is never going to be a 5-7 step drop back QB that pre-reads defenses and picks apart their weaknesses like Brady or Manning. His best chance is to make his read and then either scramble someone open or make a run for it. His greatest hits video is based on this simple concept.

Once his legs are gone due to injury or age, he will not be as dynamic because he has never focused his game on the skills needed to be a pure pocket passer.
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I disagree mainly because we've seen him in an inept offense that didn't have outs. Any time you have a play design that says don't block TJ Watt, that says alot.
 
leebigeztx said:
So dude come unblocked and you posting that? I would challenge your football acumen, but you're not worth my time. By you posting that clip of all clips, I can tell you're a novice observer of football.
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Step up in the pocket but he never does that. That’s why he won’t win anything until he does. “Scrambles forward, to the right, and then back, Sack. Rinse and Repeat”.
 
leebigeztx said:
Every year with the Texans, his offensive line has ranked bottom 3rd. Every year with the Texans, he's been under the most pressured qbs in the nfl. I'm guessing you will never understand how that correlates and he still played at a high level. We've seen Mahomes in the SB under stress and what happened? We've seen Brady vs NY under pressure go from 35ppg to 14. I have never said all the sacks and hits were the oline fault, but we also saw a guy who was in the system for 3 plus years, pocket passer, get sacked almost every play in Savage. How did the o-line look then? Since 2017, name me a year the Texans had an average o-line. You can't. If you go and use a tool like pff, you will see straight trash and players regressing. You want a step up or climb in the pocket when Martin is being pushed into the lap of the qb or the Davenport getting beat off the snap. Miss me. As I stated, your football acumen is not worth my keystrokes. Keep posting about Watson in Cleveland on a Texans forum. Argue with yourself.
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https://twitter.com/x/status/1179055969499791360

Holds on to the ball too long. That will make the line look bad. Also, dancing around in the pocket doesn’t work.
 
“The Line was so bad that they got to the playoffs twice” lol

Also, the line was just bad for Watson and pass blocking it sounds like, since Hyde Rushed for 1,000 Yards and Lamar Miller just shy of it.
 
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With Cleveland still looking for WRs, Desean Jackson making a pitch to rescind possible retirement. Jackson is a walking injury and his performance as of recent proves that.

If Watson is paired up with any WR, I expect to see Will Fuller............who pouted so much over his boyfriend Watson not getting traded to the Dolphins that he decided to step away from the Dolphins and football for the 2021 season (publicly for "personal reasons."

1650672584479.png
 
CloakNNNdagger said:
With Cleveland still looking for WRs, Desean Jackson making a pitch to rescind possible retirement. Jackson is a walking injury and his performance as of recent proves that.

If Watson is paired up with any WR, I expect to see Will Fuller............who pouted so much over his boyfriend Watson not getting traded to the Dolphins that he decided to step away from the Dolphins and football for the 2021 season (publicly for "personal reasons."

View attachment 10063
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Donovan Peoples Jones is on the come. He's young and has a very good skillset. I'm not the biggest Cooper fans, but he's a great route runner and productive. They could easily sign one of the vets after the draft or draft a wr in the 3rd rd and come in to play. I think they're bigger issue is replacing Hunt who is going to be a free agent after this year and is making 6m per and Felton. They could solve that with James Cook or even Spiller in the 5th.
 
“Yeah, we’ve actually been on a lot of talks with that camaraderie,” [Denzel] Ward said. “I mean, we’ve been doing things off the field again together, going out to eat. I know guys like Deshaun (Watson), Myles (Garrett) are planning trips for guys and we’re going to get together and build that camaraderie off the field, not just here in the facility.’’ link

Destinations of Camaraderie trips planned by Deshaun Watson:
  • JC Relaxing, Inc., also known as Relax Massage, 3321 Center Road, Brunswick
  • Hua Nan Massage (formerly SJ Relax, Inc.), 4004 Milan Road, Unit A, Perkins Township
  • Robust Asian Massage, LLC, 16360 Pearl Road, Strongsville
  • SC Relax, Inc., 14403 Pearl Road, Strongsville
  • Sunny H. Reflex, Inc., 7914 Broadview Road, Broadview Heights
  • Relax, Inc., 1211 West Main Street, Kent
  • Lucky Jade, LLC., 2747 Medina Road, Medina
  • Ming Relax, Inc., 4000 Oberlin Avenue, Unit 2, Lorain
  • Bamboo Relaxing Massage, Inc., 2522 Cleveland Road, Unit A; Wooster
  • W&D Relax, Inc.,1523 Lexington Avenue, Unit A, Mansfield
  • Sun GR Reflect, Inc., 17456 Lorain Avenue, Unit A, Cleveland
  • Sun GR Reflect, Inc., 26761 Royalton Road, Columbia Station
  • Posh Massage, Inc., 37300 Detroit Road, Avon
  • 1299 Old Eagle Drive #M5, Brunswick
  • 1287 Old Eagle Drive # 109, Brunswick
  • 411 Plymouth Court, Brunswick
 
This would be a good time for some to read how the game is played and how it can end.

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NFL salary cap: What are void years and why are teams using them?
Here’s a primer on general managers’ favorite cap weapon
By Matt Warren Mar 16, 2022, 3:06pm EDT


On Wednesday, the Buffalo Bills restructured safety Micah Hyde’s contract to spread out his salary-cap hit over multiple seasons. With only two years left on his current contract, Buffalo wanted the benefit of the maximum amount of salary-cap relief, so they added three void years to the deal, making the entire contract five full years.

Contract restructures

Contract restructures like this take money already allocated on the books in roster bonus and base salary and reallocate it. It makes the player happy because they get all of their money up front and it makes the team happy because they get to clear cap space. These restructures are only done with players that the team knows are going to be on the roster for the season (and usually multiple seasons) and often times they are completed on players who already have guaranteed money on their deals. Because the money is already guaranteed, it just accelerates when it’s going to be paid.

Buffalo has done this in the past with other contracts including Hyde’s, but typically they just keep to the current length of the deal. If there are three years left on the deal, they spread it out over three years. What’s different now is they are using void years.

Void year

Void years are dummy seasons added to the end of the contract. A signing bonus is pro-rated over all the remaining years of a deal up to five years, so by adding years, you can spread out the cap hit across more seasons.

For Hyde, he had two years left on his contract (2022 and 2023) so they added three void years on the back end (2024, 2025, and 2026). If he is still on the roster with a new contract extension, those cap hits will toll equally among all five seasons. If he retires or is not re-signed, they will accelerate to count during the next season.

Hyde’s example

For Hyde, he was due a $2.5 million roster bonus and $3.7 million of his $4.3 million salary was set to fully guarantee this weekend. That’s $6.8 million in compensation for 2022. Instead, Buffalo reduced his base salary to the veteran minimum ($1.12 million) and pro-rated the remaining $5.68 million over the remaining years left in the deal.
AD

If they didn’t use the void years and instead split it into the two remaining years on his old contract, it would have been $2.84 million in each season. His cap hit would have been $6.86 million, a cap savings of $2.84 million.

By adding the three void years, they took that $5.68 million and spread it out over five years instead of two. That makes the cap hit $1.136 million in each of the five seasons and saves Buffalo $4.544 million on their cap in 2022.

That’s a difference of $1.7 million between using and not using void years.

You eventually have to pay the piper. If Hyde doesn’t sign an extension beyond 2023, he has a dead-cap hit of $3.4 million in 2024 because three years of that restructure bonus will accelerate.

What it means for the Bills

Bills’ general manager Brandon Beane has said in the past he doesn’t like using this approach, likening it to a credit card. You rob the future to pay for the present. The first time he used it was last offseason, when he signed WR Emmanuel Sanders to play one season, but there was a void year on that contract to save space in 2021.

In addition to the Hyde deal, he’s now done it with Tim Settle’s contract in the last week. That is the only contract for which we know details, so he could be deploying it in multiple instances this cycle.

Ultimately, these can build up so you’re using cap space on players not on your roster. QB Drew Brees had $22.65 million in dead-cap charges when he retired. Buffalo is nowhere near that, but it demonstrates the complications that can arise down the line.
 
Mr teX said:
I remember when this was the narrative on a recent SB winning qb. He’d never won a playoff game in 3 attempts prior to this past season. According to his critics, He supposedly only put up the great seasons he did b/c he was throwing to calvin johnson for all those years. Hes not capable of elevating a team If he couldnt win a playoff game with that dude they said. he’s just not that good. Hes a gunslinger whose too careless with the ball. Throws too many picks……Oops. All he did in his 1st year with his new team was put up the 2nd best season of his career & be the difference maker in getting them over the hump to finally winning that SB.
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This was a Tartt dropped Int from being a totally different narrative.
 
djohn2oo8 said:
https://twitter.com/x/status/1179055969499791360

Holds on to the ball too long. That will make the line look bad. Also, dancing around in the pocket doesn’t work.
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I remember that game well.

If you were there you were screaming throw the ball. There were guys open. He was very confused once the Panthers rush their DE's wide and forced Derrick to sit in the pocket and read defenses. He looked like he wanted to be somewhere else.
 
Interesting chain of events.

**********************************************************************************

The Saga of the Browns-Texans Draft Trade(s) for Deshaun Watson
ByANDREW SPAYDE 12 hours ago

CLEVELAND, Ohio -- The Browns have executed two trades that involved Deshaun Watson in the past five years. Most Browns fans probably know this, but it's worth remembering exactly how the Browns first traded Watson away, before eventually trading for him. Of course, the story goes back even further, to the 2016 NFL Draft, when the Browns held the second overall pick and traded it to the Eagles. But the Browns made a lot more than just that one trade during the 2016 NFL Draft. Let's look back.

THE BROWNS WILD 2016 DRAFT

As much as you don't want to, send your mind back to the 2016 Browns. This was Sashi Brown and Hue Jackson's first season. Mike Pettine and Ray Farmer had just been fired and the clear mandate from ownership was a complete teardown and rebuild. Paul DePodesta was hired before Brown and Jackson and was the architect of the Browns strategy that offseason. The team aggressively shed salary, declining to re-sign homegrown offensive linemen Alex Mack and Mitchell Schwartz, which is almost unthinkable even now. The team then began a frankly impressive series of trade downs in the 2016 NFL Draft.

The Browns sent the second overall pick in the 2016 NFL draft along with a 4th round compensatory pick (#139) in the 2017 draft to the Eagles for the 8th, 77th, and 100th picks in the 2016 draft, the 12th pick in the 2017 draft, and the 64th pick in 2018.

The Browns then traded the 8th overall pick to the Tennessee Titans to move down again, trading pick number 8 and a 6th round pick (#176) to Tennessee for the 15th and 76th overall picks in 2016 and a 2017 second-round pick (#52.)

Finally, the Browns made two trade downs in the later rounds of the 2016 draft, to create even more selections. They traded picks #77 and #141 to Carolina for #93, #129, and #168.

Cleveland also traded pick #100 to Oakland #114 and #154.

These trades are even more impressive taken as an aggregate.

The Browns came into the 2016 draft and traded these assets:

First-Round Pick (#2)
Fifth-Round Pick (#141)
Sixth-Round Pick (#176)
Fourth-Round Pick (#139) in 2017

In return the Browns received:

First-Round Pick (#15)
First-Round Pick (#12) in 2017
Second-Round Pick (#52) in 2017
Second-Round Pick (#64) in 2018
Third-Round Pick (#76)
Third-Round Pick (#93)
Fourth-Round Pick (#114)
Fourth-Round Pick (#129)
Fifth-Round Pick (#154)
Fifth-Round Pick (#168)

Unfortunately for the Browns, a lot of those extra picks never panned out as NFL players. Very few of them are in the league at this point.

#15 – Corey Coleman, WR, Baylor (Signed with the Chiefs this offseason to pursue a comeback.)
#76 – Shon Coleman, OT, Auburn (Signed to the Indianapolis Colts practice squad this offseason.)
#93 – Cody Kessler, QB, USC (Currently out of football)
#114 – Ricardo Louis, WR, Auburn (Plays for the Saskatchewan Roughriders in the CFL)
#129 – Derrick Kindred, S, TCU (Currently out of football)
#154 – Jordan Payton, WR, UCLA (Currently out of football)
#168 – Spencer Drango, G, Baylor (Currently out of football)
#52 in 2017 - DeShone Kizer, QB, Notre Dame (Currently out of football)
#64 in 2018 was traded to the Colts for #67 (Chad Thomas, DE, Miami, who is also currently out of football) and #178, which was then traded to the Patriots as part of a trade-up for kicker Austin Seibert (currently the kicker for the Detroit Lions.)





THE FIRST DESHAUN WATSON TRADE

The Browns came into the 2017 NFL Draft with the first and 12th overall picks, thanks to going 1-15 in 2016 and the Eagles going 7-9. The Browns did not have an incumbent starting quarterback, after releasing both Robert Griffin III and Josh McCown before the draft. Cody Kessler was the default starter but had not played well in 2016. As a result, the Browns were strongly connected with quarterbacks in the draft, including Mitchell Trubisky, Patrick Mahomes, and Deshaun Watson.

As it transpired, the team decided to draft Myles Garrett with the first overall pick in 2017. It was later reported that the team was interested in Patrick Mahomes at #12, but the Chiefs traded up and selected him at #10. The Browns had the opportunity to select Deshaun Watson at #12 but elected to trade the pick to the Houston Texans, who gave the Browns the 25th pick in the 2017 draft and their first-round pick in 2018, which ended up being #4 overall. The Browns selected safety Jabrill Peppers with the 25th overall pick, and Peppers was then part of the blockbuster trade orchestrated by John Dorsey for Odell Beckham Jr.

The quarterback the team did end up selecting in the 2017 draft, DeShone Kizer, played just one season for the team before being traded to the Packers in exchange for Damarious Randall and a swap of picks. Meanwhile, we all know what Patrick Mahomes has become and it's worth wondering if he could have reached the same heights in Cleveland. Deshaun Watson went on to have a stellar rookie season, coming in in relief of Tom Savage in the opening game and playing extremely well until tearing his ACL during a practice on November 2. For his rookie season, Watson totaled 1,699 passing yards with 19 touchdowns and eight interceptions.


2018 NFL DRAFT

In the 2018 NFL Draft, the final reverberations of the initial trades in the 2016 draft were felt. The Browns used the first overall pick on quarterback Baker Mayfield and the fourth overall pick, traded to the Browns by Houston in 2017, on cornerback Denzel Ward. Ward, as you know, just signed the largest contract ever for a cornerback and looks set to spend the bulk of his career in his hometown as the Browns' top cornerback.

Another connection between the Browns and the Texans was the 2017 trade that sent Brock Osweiler, a 2018 second-round pick, and a 2017 sixth-round pick to the Browns in exchange for a 2017 fourth-round pick. The Texans did the trade to free up cap space to pursue quarterback Tony Romo, who ended up retiring a month later. The Browns used that 2018 second-round pick on running back Nick Chubb.


2022 BROWNS TEXANS TRADE

Of course, all of these intersecting lines culminated in the Browns trading for Deshaun Watson in mid-March. In this trade, the Browns sent the Texans three first-round picks in 2022, 2023, and 2024 as well as a third-round pick in 2023 and a fourth-round pick in 2022 and 2024. In return, the Browns received Watson and a 2024 sixth-round pick.
THE REST OF THE STORY
 
steelbtexan said:
I remember that game well.

If you were there you were screaming throw the ball. There were guys open. He was very confused once the Panthers rush their DE's wide and forced Derrick to sit in the pocket and read defenses. He looked like he wanted to be somewhere else.
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That was one of his worse games. Kelchly and Davis closed alot of inside windows which they were great at. BOB struggled with those short,inside routes that day also. I mean,it happens to every qb in the nfl. We just seen Rodgers score 10 pts vs SF.
 
leebigeztx said:
Accuracy? You think accuracy isn't a strength especially deep ball?
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Depends on if you think he is accurate or not. Even in college there were questions about that. Given that he spent most of his NFL career throwing to Hopkins who could catch anything within a 3 foot radius I would say there are still questions about it.
 
thunderkyss said:
If Andrew Berry had any idea what he was doing he'd traipse Baker around the country & let him negotiate a new contract.

Win-win
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Yeah I don't really see a team trading for Mayfield right now because no team is really a QB away and even if they were Mayfield has not really shown he is that QB. I can very much see teams saying to force Browns to cut him and eat that cost or carry him another year and eat the lost roster spot and the cost. Either way next year he is a FA and teams that want him don't have to give up anything except money.
 
maverick512000 said:
Depends on if you think he is accurate or not. Even in college there were questions about that. Given that he spent most of his NFL career throwing to Hopkins who could catch anything within a 3 foot radius I would say there are still questions about it.
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Watson was 3rd in completion % in 2020. Without Hopkins. 70.2%, trailing Rodgers and Brees (70.7% & 70.5% respectively). While leading the league in yards/completion.

Stick to the massage jokes. At least you'll be "accurate".
 
Lucky said:
Watson was 3rd in completion % in 2020. Without Hopkins. 70.2%, trailing Rodgers and Brees (70.7% & 70.5% respectively). While leading the league in yards/completion.

Stick to the massage jokes. At least you'll be "accurate".
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Was he throwing to Cooks most of the time?
 
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