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Do we have a Super Bowl team or not?

eriadoc said:
When your team loses a meaningful game and you just sort of shrug it off, then you probably aren't emotionally invested enough to be on any bandwagon to begin with. If you criticize the fans that are passionate enough to demand perfection and ***** when they don't get it, then you just don't know WTF you're talking about. But at least maybe you care.
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Was this game really all that meaningful? We are still the #1 seed.
 
We still have the best record in the league. We only lost two games to two very good teams. We just lost to a team that hasn't lost, at home, in December, for something like 11-12 years. OF COURSE we're still a Super Bowl team!
 
We're not a super bowl team because we have no chance in hell of beating Peyton or Brady in the playoffs with our current LB corps and DB corps. We're simply too undermanned now.
 
All I know is that Kubiak, Schaub, and Phillips better figure it out, because right now we have no clue how to win against elite QBs. Schaub cannot outscore them. He's a system QB that can't MAKE things happen when we must score and receivers are covered. Most QBs can't do that either, but elite QBs can, especially when Wade uses man coverage all day long. I know, he always does that. It works against most QBs, but the elite ones eat it alive. Their receivers were getting open so fast, sometimes they didn't need pass protection at all. Correction, Brady was putting the ball in their hands so fast, whether they were covered or not, that he didn't need protection at all. Only answer I see is we might need an elite QB (since those are so easy to come by), so that we can go into OT tied at 42-42. I would say that Brady just had an exceptional day, but Rogers tore us a bigger one earlier this year.
 
Going man is a way to beat the pats tho Pittsburg did that like a year ago and beat the pats

same with the giants i think rush four drop everyone else meaning the linebackers can double team there TE and one on there RB then the seconday doubles the Wr's or triples the TE
 
This teams just seems to always mess up in the biggest moments. I gave them a pass for the Packers game. They were not focused and Rodgers was. The Packers had just gotten beaten by the Colts and the week before the Seahawks "beat them". They needed that game and some of the throws that Rodgers was making was just spectacular. He was getting the ball into the smallest of spaces.

This game? Holy ****. They just wet the bed. Kareem tries to be the hero and scoop the ball up one handed instead of falling on it. I had a bad feeling after that and what do you know...TD Patriots on the next play. Schaub getting too greedy and trying to force it to Walter in the endzone, when Arian was open with no one within a five yard radius of him. Schaub's inability to even get a couple of yards by scrambling (like Brady did) just hurt too because he had some openings. The defense was finally holding the Patriots down a bit, but Gary kept calling run plays with 8 in the box. If they could have just made it a 14 point game before the 4th quarters, then they would have had enough spark to maybe pull it out.

The offense just could never get going and the defense checked out. Plus, anytime they did have a stop, the refs gifted the Patriots with a call. The PI on the throw to Welker and the other to Lloyd, IIRC, just did not make any sense.
 
When I was scanning the forum topics, I thought the title of this thread read "Do we have a SUGAR BOWL team or not?" We definitely have a Sugar Bowl team. Super bowl...not so much.
 
We're not a Super Bowl team until we actually get there.

I think we can get there.

I think we will get there.

We can beat any other team. We might have to play better than last night; unless we plan on getting the Chiefs in the divisional round that is.


The Pats blasted the Jets in the regular season 44-6 or something like that and lost to them in the playoffs. Any. Given. Sunday.
 
dream_team said:
Was this game really all that meaningful? We are still the #1 seed.
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Yes, this game was meaningful. Coupled with the Packers game earlier, it pretty well demonstrates that this team can't win a game (hell, even COMPETE) against the truly elite QBs. When you look at what the good but not quite elite QBs have done to to this defense, it reinforces that. When you look at what the really great QBs like Chad Henne and Jake Locker have done to this defense, you start to realize that this team is going to have to rely on its offense.

Oh yeah ... the offense. We saw what they did against the Packers and Pats. They've been fool's gold all year. The OL is a big, big problem and they simply don't have an answer.

Football is won and lost in the trenches. On defense, you have to get after the QB and RB these days more than ever. Our team's front 7 has JJ Watt and 6 guys that rate somewhere between stiffs and Just A Guy. On offense, you have to stop the defense from getting into your backfield. Our team's OL has two guys that are good, one of whom has always had issues with large, athletic DTs. They've averaged less than 4YPC on the season, and that's with one of the best backs in football running behind them.

So yeah, this game matters because it's a real indicator. Seeding just determines where you'll get your ass kicked by the Pats (maybe Broncos) in January.
 
I would give Antonio Smith a little more credit than that, although he didn't actually earn it today.
 
We can win against Elite QBs.

But we NEED our Running game. Our defense wasn't completely lost, they got a few stops... Lets hope Foster goes nutzo in the playoffs again.

Really it's not about Schaub, it's about our other elite players stepping up. Remember Foster carried this offense on his back in the playoffs again and made his name. Running over the Ravens defense that was all healthy...I think we get these guys at home it's going to be a different story. Get a few stops and make Brady watch Foster-Tate grind it out. Kubiak should know the formula, we've had Peyton in our division how long now?
 
eriadoc said:
Yes, this game was meaningful. Coupled with the Packers game earlier, it pretty well demonstrates that this team can't win a game (hell, even COMPETE) against the truly elite QBs. When you look at what the good but not quite elite QBs have done to to this defense, it reinforces that. When you look at what the really great QBs like Chad Henne and Jake Locker have done to this defense, you start to realize that this team is going to have to rely on its offense.
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Didn't we beat Manning? Unless Manning isn't considered elite anymore. We can beat elite QBs, we just need the offense to give more help than they've been giving in these games.
 
The biggest obstacle/hurdle we have to win the whole thing is at QB. I like Schaub. I still think he's better than most in the league. In another thread I've listed only 12 that I like better and there's a couple others that you could argue that would be above them. Some have much higher ceilings because of their age and others are already ahead of him.

However, if you look back at the past 20 Super Bowls you have 40 starting QBs. I count only 13 that I wouldn't put as elite/HoF. You could argue for McNabb and McNair to be added to the elite list if you want.

Grossman for Chicago in 2006
Hasselbeck for Seattle in 2005
McNabb for Philadelphia in 2004
Delhomme for Carolina in 2003
Johnson for Tampa Bay in 2002
Gannon for Oakland in 2002
Dilfer for Baltimore in 2000
Collins for New York in 2000
McNair for Tennessee in 1999
Chandler for Atlanta in 1998
Bledsoe for New England in 1996
O'Donnell for Pittsburgh in 1995
Humphries for San Diego in 1994

Of those only Johnson and Dilfer won their games. Both times they were going against other non-elite QBs.

So..in the last 20 years the team that won the Super Bowl had a QB that is probably going to Canton 18 out of those 20 times.

Getting there isn't as hard as I originally thought. 33% of the QBs in the last 20 years weren't elite. For the Texans to win the Super Bowl, though, we need to hope SF or Atlanta goes. I don't like the odds if they don't.
 
TexanBacker93 said:
The biggest obstacle/hurdle we have to win the whole thing is at QB. I like Schaub. I still think he's better than most in the league. In another thread I've listed only 12 that I like better and there's a couple others that you could argue that would be above them. Some have much higher ceilings because of their age and others are already ahead of him.

However, if you look back at the past 20 Super Bowls you have 40 starting QBs. I count only 13 that I wouldn't put as elite/HoF. You could argue for McNabb and McNair to be added to the elite list if you want.

Grossman for Chicago in 2006
Hasselbeck for Seattle in 2005
McNabb for Philadelphia in 2004
Delhomme for Carolina in 2003
Johnson for Tampa Bay in 2002
Gannon for Oakland in 2002
Dilfer for Baltimore in 2000
Collins for New York in 2000
McNair for Tennessee in 1999
Chandler for Atlanta in 1998
Bledsoe for New England in 1996
O'Donnell for Pittsburgh in 1995
Humphries for San Diego in 1994

Of those only Johnson and Dilfer won their games. Both times they were going against other non-elite QBs.

So..in the last 20 years the team that won the Super Bowl had a QB that is probably going to Canton 18 out of those 20 times.

Getting there isn't as hard as I originally thought. 33% of the QBs in the last 20 years weren't elite. For the Texans to win the Super Bowl, though, we need to hope SF or Atlanta goes. I don't like the odds if they don't.
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McMair won an MVP award, so I don't think he belongs with the rest of those guys.

But that aside, you should probably compare them to Schaub...

And honestly I'd take Schaub over most of the guys on that list.
 
Reading this board all day & all night I have no doubt in my mind that everyone here thinks we have a Super Bowl team.

You wouldn't be so mad, so disgusted, so embarrassed with an 11-2 team if you didn't think this was a Super Bowl team. There's a couple of guys out there who aren't upset about where our team is right now. They knew we weren't winning a Super Bowl anyway. We're going to the play-offs, most likely as division champs.

You're mad, because you think Kubiak or our defense or a letterman's jacket is holding our Super Bowl team back. Think about it.
 
Fiddler said:
You're mad, because you think Kubiak or our defense or a letterman's jacket is holding our Super Bowl team back. Think about it.
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Or, like I said upthread, the OL will prevent this team from winning the big games. Of course, the head coach had a lot to do with the current OL debacle, but I wasn't really going there.
 
eriadoc said:
Or, like I said upthread, the OL will prevent this team from winning the big games. Of course, the head coach had a lot to do with the current OL debacle, but I wasn't really going there.
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How?

Because we couldn't keep Winston and Brisiel under the salary cap?

Or because Butler got injured and Newton and Caldwell also got injured?

Or is it because we give another first round draft pick to the D?

Not only that, you even blame it all despite the result.

Come on dawg.
 
Seeing all the knocks on Shaub, I'm wondering what has happened.

At the beginning of the year, I thought Matt looked the best he has ever looked, and I'm wondering what happened since those first few games.

Was it the questions of his starter capability and the calls for him to back up Yates coming back from injury that motivated him?

Seems now that those calls have died down, he's back to errant pass, can't find the open man Shaub.

Is it me, or is anyone else seen this dropoff for no apparent reason, with exception to the Jags game, has Shaub really looked that good in the past 6 or so games??
 
Perki-Perk said:
Seems now that those calls have died down, he's back to errant pass, can't find the open man Shaub.

Is it me, or is anyone else seen this dropoff for no apparent reason, with exception to the Jags game, has Shaub really looked that good in the past 6 or so games??
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I am not a Schaub fan, but I don't think "he's back to errant pass, can't find the open man Schaub" I do not think that is the norm. This was a bad game. I honestly think Kubiak may have made too big a deal of staying even keel for this game. By the time the offense woke up, it was too late.

I don't believe this offense has worked as well as it had last season. Last season the offense progressed from game one through Matt's last game. But the whole time they were more consistent than what we've seen this year.

Losing Briesel & Winston we pretty much lost our ability to run on anyone, whenever we wanted. We knew that was going to be an issue. With Newton coming back, hopefully we can get closer to being that team & we'll see that offense again.
 
dream_team said:
Didn't we beat Manning? Unless Manning isn't considered elite anymore. We can beat elite QBs, we just need the offense to give more help than they've been giving in these games.
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The Manning we faced in Week 3 is not the same Manning that plays for the Broncos now. I'm not all that confident we could beat them in a rematch here at Reliant, much less on the road like last time.
 
Anybody remember last year's AFC Championship Game?

Surely I wasn't the only one to watch that mundane looking Patriots team & thought, "We would have kicked their as$ if Matt were healthy."

This thing we're doing now, where we make the Patriots & Brady this unconquerable super team is the same thing we're accusing our players of. Being star struck by the great Tom Brady.

They've been beat three times this year, they will get beat again, might as well be us beating him.
 
Posey gave me some hope and Keyshawn Martin remained solid as a returner. Most importantly Newton was back and should be back on keel next week. Cody made me shake my head but Mitchell did have one very good play. I still need a Nose and MLB. Manning and Quin seemed to make a good play then swap it for a bad one. Joseph did not get beat that I saw and hope to see him getting stronger each game. Schaub seemed more on target with the ball & not in panic mode. Barwin had one good play and then QB ran into him for a sack. I may have seen Luck take a $100 bill from Connor as he got up.

Wasn't happy with several of plays Phillips and Kubes called. Another week to get healthier.
 
My contention even at the beginning of the season has always been that we dont have one. The o-line will hold us back on the offensive side and the undiscipline play at times will be a problem on the defensive side.
 
Mr teX said:
My contention even at the beginning of the season has always been that we dont have one. The o-line will hold us back on the offensive side and the undiscipline play at times will be a problem on the defensive side.
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I'm curious As to which team you had as SB contenders before the season started.
 
scourge said:
The Manning we faced in Week 3 is not the same Manning that plays for the Broncos now. I'm not all that confident we could beat them in a rematch here at Reliant, much less on the road like last time.
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I agree. If we have to play them in the playoffs, we'd better have more than just Watt in his face, or it's done.
 
Marcus said:
I agree. If we have to play them in the playoffs, we'd better have more than just Watt in his face, or it's done.
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Manning's record in the playoffs isn't as good as Brady's. Either way, we'll end up facing one of them in the playoffs.
 
We have Newton and Graham back.
Jones and Brook will have more experience.

Posey is showing some flashes.
Tate is finally healthy.
Our depth is good.

We will get Reed back.
JJo seems to get healthier.
He'll get some rest before the play-offs.
McCain looks to be on schedule to return.
Our depth at CB will be increased with Routt knowing more of the play book.

We're in pretty good shape for the play-off run.
 
I don't think we have a Super Bowl team. I think they can be a Super Bowl team by Feb 3, 2013

76Texan said:
We have Newton and Graham back.
Jones and Brook will have more experience.
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Please tell me we're working Brooks out at LG..... please, please, tell me we're working him out at LG.
76Texan said:
McCain looks to be on schedule to return.
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I'm loving what I see from Brandon Harris. He played pretty clean today, except for that hold on Reggie Wayne. I don't know if it was a bone-head play that worked out for us, or if he was smart enough to take the penalty than give up an even bigger play.

But he's physical, I love it. Fast, I love it. & plays something like glue, I love it.
 
JCTexan said:
Win next week and Houston is the #1 seed. The worse they can be is the #3 seed.
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That was my point. We must win in Indy (something we have never done) or its the 3 seed. 3 seed, 4 seed.... Its all the same. This team is lightyears away from being able to challenge for anything anymore.
 
They can't win a super bowl with this O-line.

My worst fears from the mishandling of this offseason are coming true and it's too late in the season to fix it.

Paying Foster at the expense of absolutely gutting the O-line was criminal.
 
3 weeks ago vs Pats 1 first string offensive TD

Last week vs Colts 1 offensive TD

This week no offensive TD's

No.... This is no Super Bowl team... Maybe next year but not this one
 
No. We do not.

The offense, whether it's Schaub or the Oline, or the running game . . .

No. We do not.
 
JCTexan said:
Win next week and Houston is the #1 seed. The worse they can be is the #3 seed.
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A trip to New England or Denver is a carved in stone guaranteed loss for the Texans. There's not a doubt in my mind. These guys would be hard pressed to win any playoff game on the road much less one against either of those teams.

Win next week and Houston is the #1 seed. Anything less than that and they're screwed.
 
No we don't. And that's been pretty obvious for weeks now. This is a playoff caliber team, but not a team that's going to go deep in the playoffs or make noise. I seriously doubt Schaubiak ever get us to a CCG, much less a SB.
 
WolverineFan said:
No we don't. And that's been pretty obvious for weeks now.
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Therefore, those of us who have been pointing out what's obvious for weeks can start to finally get some recognition, not for what we've been saying, but for why we're frustrated with this team. It's not that we're eternally pessimistic or that we don't want to root for the team, it's because we recognize that this team is not a Super Bowl caliber team. And through the first half of the season, they had us all believing they were. And we all want a Super Bowl.
 
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