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Derek Stingley vs. Sauce Gardner

corry

Waterboy
I'm sorry that you don't understand how NFL coverages work. First off in no universe was that play cover 2, you saying it is already tells me you have no idea what you're talking about.

Secondly NFL defenses don't typically play spot drop zone, meaning that you (typically) aren't just given an area to cove, there are rules based on what the receiver does you don't just drop to a spot. In cover 3 when the #1 receiver goes vertical it turns into man to man with the corner vs the receiver. Stingley was in no way shape or form responsible for the flats or curls on that play. If you don't believe me go back and watch, Stingley's movements and they will tell you all you need to know. Pitre also screwed up as it's his job to help Stingley there. But Pitre also screwing up doesn't mean Stingley didn't get burned, he did.
LO ******* L... Stop talking ball.
 

Mr teX

Hall of Fame
I'm sorry that you don't understand how NFL coverages work. First off in no universe was that play cover 2, you saying it is already tells me you have no idea what you're talking about.

Secondly NFL defenses don't typically play spot drop zone, meaning that you (typically) aren't just given an area to cove, there are rules based on what the receiver does you don't just drop to a spot. In cover 3 when the #1 receiver goes vertical it turns into man to man with the corner vs the receiver. Stingley was in no way shape or form responsible for the flats or curls on that play. If you don't believe me go back and watch, Stingley's movements and they will tell you all you need to know. Pitre also screwed up as it's his job to help Stingley there. But Pitre also screwing up doesn't mean Stingley didn't get burned, he did.
Bro shut up. Yeah so u seem to be full of yourself. FIRST OF ALL, I didn’t say it was cover 2..I said I detailed that cards TD play in the game thread…& I said IN THAT THREAD it was COVER 3 smart guy.…2nd of all where that ball was caught on the field and Pitre’s reaction, it told me everything I needed to know about who that Cards TD was primarily on….& it was PRIMARILY on Pitre. Furthermore, Stingley wasn’t reacting to come up and play the flats, Moore was 10-15 yards down the field when he dipped inside towards Pitre and the numbers.

Furthermore unless you were in the Texans huddle or film room, you don’t know exactly what Stingley’s responsibility was beyond the base coverage
 

Khelar

Rookie
Bro shut up. Yeah so u seem to be full of yourself. FIRST OF ALL, I didn’t say it was cover 2..I said I detailed that cards TD play in the game thread…& I said IN THAT THREAD it was COVER 3 smart guy.…2nd of all where that ball was caught on the field and Pitre’s reaction, it told me everything I needed to know about who that Cards TD was primarily on….& it was PRIMARILY on Pitre. Furthermore, Stingley wasn’t reacting to come up and play the flats, Moore was 10-15 yards down the field when he dipped inside towards Pitre and the numbers.

Furthermore unless you were in the Texans huddle or film room, you don’t know exactly what Stingley’s responsibility was beyond the base coverage
I didn't say you said it was cover 2 are you joking with this? Maybe cover 3 is a bit much for you to understand if you can't even get the quotes system down right. I didn't go back to find your stupid post in the cardinals thread from several weeks ago I was responding to the guy that I quoted.

And again Pitre's reaction tells you he screwed up and I'm with you there. It is partially on Pitre. But Moore was also Stingley's responsibility and he burned him as well.

And for the "flats" part of your response I'm not sure what you're even saying here. The #1 receiver took his route vertical which means Stingley is man to man. I don't have to be in the Texans film room to know that, that's how cover 3 works and you can watch the way Stingley plays it and see that clearly that is the case.

Please be quiet
 

Khelar

Rookie
if your primary responsibility as Player B is to be the safety valve of the entire defense and the guy caught the ball over you, yeah it’s on u.

You knit picking as if none of these guys give up or bust coverages. They all do it.
Are you incapable of understanding that two players can be at fault on a play. Is that a bridge too far for you?
 

Mr teX

Hall of Fame
I didn't say you said it was cover 2 are you joking with this? Maybe cover 3 is a bit much for you to understand if you can't even get the quotes system down right. I didn't go back to find your stupid post in the cardinals thread from several weeks ago I was responding to the guy that I quoted.

And again Pitre's reaction tells you he screwed up and I'm with you there. It is partially on Pitre. But Moore was also Stingley's responsibility and he burned him as well.

And for the "flats" part of your response I'm not sure what you're even saying here. The #1 receiver took his route vertical which means Stingley is man to man. I don't have to be in the Texans film room to know that, that's how cover 3 works and you can watch the way Stingley plays it and see that clearly that is the case.

Please be quiet
OR….maybe you’re just wrong. It is MOSTLY on Pitre not only b/c he is the safety & isn’t supposed to let anyone get behind him but also b/c the ball was caught damn near on the hash mark…which in a cover 3 middle 3rd, Pitre’s area. They’ve been targeting him for weeks, it’s CLEARLY in teams’ game plans to attack him and he gave up YET ANOTHER TD today in coverage. Furthermore, you’re late as hell, you not the only one who knows secondary play, go kick rocks playboy

I honestly don’t even know why I’m entertaining your trash ass analysis…maybe you should go work for PFF…GTFO
 

Porky

Hall of Fame
Y’all put a sock in it. Clearly they were playing cover 5 with a turtle shell, and in basic armadillo with their front. The offense tried a slinky route, and Sting used his box coverage to go over the under and Pitre used a slime bail technique which only allowed smoke thru a keyhole.
 

Khelar

Rookie
OR….maybe you’re just wrong. It is MOSTLY on Pitre not only b/c he is the safety & isn’t supposed to let anyone get behind him but also b/c the ball was caught damn near on the hash mark…which in a cover 3 middle 3rd, Pitre’s area. They’ve been targeting him for weeks, it’s CLEARLY in teams’ game plans to attack him and he gave up YET ANOTHER TD today in coverage. Furthermore, you’re late as hell, you not the only one who knows secondary play, go kick rocks playboy

I honestly don’t even know why I’m entertaining your trash ass analysis…maybe you should go work for PFF…GTFO
Fine I’ll try and be nice, despite the fact that he was the one who started with the personal attacks.

The last thing I’ll say on this is this.

They were playing cover 3, in cover 3 when the #1 WR goes vertical it turns into man coverage for Stingley. It’s his job to cover the receiver wherever he goes. Since the #2 receiver doesn’t go vertical it is Pitre’s job to help over the top. When the WR beats both Stingley and Pitre over the top it means both players screwed up and both are at fault.

The fact that Pitre should have been there doesn’t change the fact that Stingley got beat.

I feel like all of this is pretty simple and straightforward but maybe not for some.
 

Porky

Hall of Fame
Sting got beat yes, but Pitre also was at fault. But if you’ll get out of the weeds and look at the big picture, I think you’ll find that Sting is playing his ass off since he returned from injury. His ball skills are off the charts. He is playing like a top 10 pick. Health is his biggest enemy.
 

steelbtexan

King of the W. B. Club
Contributor's Club
Hasn't been a 3 game season. He was basically untested the first few games pre injury because he was sticky.

Him getting burned is something that has occurred due to Cover 2, knowing he has safety help up top which has been horrible.

He goes for picks and is going to blanket coverage 9/10 times.

He's a stud.
I played golf instead of watching the game today. I'm guessing Ward being back made a big difference in things like what you're talking about. Reliable safety help over the top is a big thing.
 

CloakNNNdagger

Hall of Fame
Y’all put a sock in it. Clearly they were playing cover 5 with a turtle shell, and in basic armadillo with their front. The offense tried a slinky route, and Sting used his box coverage to go over the under and Pitre used a slime bail technique which only allowed smoke thru a keyhole.
I followed and understood everything you wrote perfectly, until you brought up basic armadillo. :D
 

Marcus

Windmill cancer survivor
I played golf instead of watching the game today. I'm guessing Ward being back made a big difference in things like what you're talking about. Reliable safety help over the top is a big thing.
Did you ever watch the game later?
 

steelbtexan

King of the W. B. Club
Contributor's Club
Did you ever watch the game later?
Nope

CBS and Direct TV are in a contract dispute. So I couldn't tape it. I'm taping the replay at noon today.

How did the secondary look with a healthy Ward, Stingley and King back and playing again?
 

Marcus

Windmill cancer survivor
Nope

CBS and Direct TV are in a contract dispute. So I couldn't tape it. I'm taping the replay at noon today.

How did the secondary look with a healthy Ward, Stingley and King back and playing again?
They played well. Stingley especially, King was robbed of a touchdown return, but his name was called many times. But the secondary was helped immensely by the pressure from Anderson and Greenard. Anderson IMO, proved to me at least, he was worth the #3 pick. And he is only going to get better. I’m excited about his future.

Edit: Petrie is getting faked out of his jock too many times. I don’t understand why his level of play is down from last year.

As for the offense, I’m concerned with Dell going down. Stroud needs to get on the same page with his other receivers not named Nico Collins, John Metchie especially. And DeMeco needs to end it with Dameon Pearce. He seems to be a little stubborn in that regard.
 
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steelbtexan

King of the W. B. Club
Contributor's Club
They played well. Stingley especially, King was robbed of a touchdown return, but his name was called many times. But the secondary was helped immensely by the pressure from Anderson and Greenard. Anderson IMO, proved to me at least, he was worth the #3 pick. And he is only going to get better. I’m excited about his future.

As for the offense, I’m concerned with Dell going down. Stroud needs to get on the same page with his other receivers not named Nico Collins. And DeMeco needs to end it with Dameon Pearce. He seems to be a little stubborn in that regard.
Thanks for the recap. The secondary getting healthy and King back and playing well is going to make a big difference in this defense and they're only going to get better the more they play together.

They've got playmakers at all levels.

The offense is going to really miss Dell. Play makers like him cant really be replaced. Although Brown did a good job of replacing him earlier. I still would have a hard time passing on a top tier WR in the next draft.
 

Marcus

Windmill cancer survivor
Well, we get to watch them both this Sunday. If we’re the Jets DC, I’d stick Sauce onto Nico.

And I am looking forward to seeing how Slo and CJ move forward without their ‘security blanket’.
 

Porky

Hall of Fame
Nico is more than capable of doing the same thing.
No...no he's not. Nico isn't putting anything into a blender except for fruit and spinach leaves. Different athlete. I'm not saying Nico can't own Sauce...but it won't be blender style.

Nope, Nico needs to put his big, tall body and long strider speed to use. Nico continues to remind me of Andre Johnson. He's that sort of big, tall, fast long strider type. I'm not saying he is as good as AJ, merely comparing their athletic profiles. Nico will need to put together multiple seasons like this one before I mention the two in the same sentence in terms of impact.
 

badboy

Hall of Fame
No...no he's not. Nico isn't putting anything into a blender except for fruit and spinach leaves. Different athlete. I'm not saying Nico can't own Sauce...but it won't be blender style.

Nope, Nico needs to put his big, tall body and long strider speed to use. Nico continues to remind me of Andre Johnson. He's that sort of big, tall, fast long strider type. I'm not saying he is as good as AJ, merely comparing their athletic profiles. Nico will need to put together multiple seasons like this one before I mention the two in the same sentence in terms of impact.
Before Dell was injured, I was looking forward to seeing Dell covered by DJ Reed and Collins by Gardner. It will be interesting to see which of those covered Noah Brown. I'm guessing our WRs and Jordan overwhelm their DBs and LBs. Wind could immensely impact that.
 

Arky

Veteran
No...no he's not. Nico isn't putting anything into a blender except for fruit and spinach leaves. Different athlete. I'm not saying Nico can't own Sauce...but it won't be blender style.

Nope, Nico needs to put his big, tall body and long strider speed to use. Nico continues to remind me of Andre Johnson. He's that sort of big, tall, fast long strider type. I'm not saying he is as good as AJ, merely comparing their athletic profiles. Nico will need to put together multiple seasons like this one before I mention the two in the same sentence in terms of impact.
I would include Noah Brown. Nico and Noah - both very similar. Tall, lanky, good hands and good with the YAC. I do hope the Texans put them both on the field at the same time quite often due to the Dell injury although Metchie might be used for the Tank role...
 

beerlover

Hall of Fame
I'm not so sure Sting hasn't been the best corner in the NFL since he returned from injury.
He’s in the conversation with Bland and Witherspoon. Believe Sauce is in disbelief with his teams QB situation. Stingley has CJ, Sauce has Zach Wilson. That has to suck the life out of the whole team. Zach has been benched for two games, now elevated back to starter vs Texans. Let Stingley & Nelson feast :taz:
 

thunderkyss

Just win baby!!!
Staff member
Contributor's Club
Before Dell was injured, I was looking forward to seeing Dell covered by DJ Reed and Collins by Gardner. It will be interesting to see which of those covered Noah Brown. I'm guessing our WRs and Jordan overwhelm their DBs and LBs. Wind could immensely impact that.
I thought Gardner played a side, like Stingley.
 

Hottoddie

Veteran

Hottoddie

Veteran
If you had any clue what you were talking about I imagine you'd be able to come up with some kind of actual response. But this kind of answer should tell anyone reading all they need to know
It appears the same could be said of you. Here are some screenshots of how the play developed. In the first screenshot (click on the attachment for the first screenshot), you can see that #19 (Mims Jr) goes in motion to the near sideline. Stingley is on the far sideline & has to stay put to guard against the TE running unopposed on that side. Pitre moves up on the near side to guard Sutton & motions for Nelson to guard the man in motion (Mims Jr). Stingley is never in that play to guard against the touchdown. Pitre had him all the way with some help over the top from Ward. 1701985159764.png1701985159764.png
 

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