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Derek Stingley vs. Sauce Gardner

welsh texan

You may say I’m a dreamer but I’m not the only one
Play 16-17 games a season and I agree.
I don’t think that’s fair, right now he’s done all he can, elevated his game and been pretty much elite for a good stretch, seems to actually still be getting better, if anything, because when he first came back from his recent layoff he was getting beat on a bad play at least once a game and now seems to have eliminated that.

Maybe complain about him missing time if/when he does miss time, appreciate the effort that must go into playing as well as he is doing while that’s happening too?
 

steelbtexan

King of the W. B. Club
Contributor's Club
Another impressive performance by Stingley. Made a similar play to the Broncos game but didn’t come down with the pick. He is such a fun player to watch. I expect OCs are already gameplanning for him which is what you want from a top 3 pick. Difference maker.
Gotta stay healthy
 

maverick512000

Hall of Fame
I don't want to hear another word about Stingley.
No one ever questioned the talent or honestly even of the two which had the higher ceiling. The question was, and still is, with Stingley about his health and his ability to stay on the field for a whole, or at least most, a season. He's like a defensive version of Will Fuller, when he is on the field he changes the entire game and forces teams to have to try and deal with him. Trouble is keeping him on the field. Last year he got taken out early and Gardner looked like the better pick, this year he has played great football and Gardner not so great so Stingley looks like the better pick. Lets see what the next 2-3 years as we go into our window looks like before we put this question to bed.
 

IDEXAN

Hall of Fame
Contributor's Club
No one ever questioned the talent or honestly even of the two which had the higher ceiling. The question was, and still is, with Stingley about his health and his ability to stay on the field for a whole, or at least most, a season. He's like a defensive version of Will Fuller, when he is on the field he changes the entire game and forces teams to have to try and deal with him. Trouble is keeping him on the field. Last year he got taken out early and Gardner looked like the better pick, this year he has played great football and Gardner not so great so Stingley looks like the better pick. Lets see what the next 2-3 years as we go into our window looks like before we put this question to bed.
Excellent post Mav and I especially like the Fuller comparison though as good as Fuller was Sting is probably more talented
But vital to our offense just as Sting is to our defense.
 

Mr teX

Hall of Fame
If Ramsey (MIA) is #1 and Stingley (HOU) #2 in the AFC…..where was Sauce (NYJ) in the CB ranking?
I think people have caught on to the fact that the “sauce” moniker has garnered him more praise than he probably deserves as “the” premier CB in the league. I been saying it for a while now & have been labeled “Ms. Stingley” by at least 1 person on this site…but Lots of guys could do what Sauce does with the talent he has surrounding him on that defense. That doesn’t make u an elite. What does is getting your hands on the ball and getting your offense extra possessions in addition to what he’s doing. Gotta make qbs pay.. & he just doesn’t do that when he has the opportunities to.

As good as he can be in coverage at times, he just doesn’t make a whole lot of game changing plays & that’s only partially b/c qb’s throw at him less…which is marginally less than most other CB’s at best…but this is the excuse lots of his fanboys use to explain away the lack of impact plays.

His comp is Richard Sherman who like Sauce didn’t have elite speed but used his length effectively to beast at the position. But What made him elite wasn’t PBU’s which he had a lot of too. if you go back and look at his numbers, even when he was at his peak & qbs were aware of how good he was & we’re weary of throwing to his side, when they were, he was making them pay and as a result was pulling down at least 3-4 ints on average a year. Sauce has 2 in nearly 30 games.

There’s a difference between being in position to knock a ball down and being in position to intercept & if you’ve been watching Stingley over this timespan he’s almost always in position to intercept. Dude was legitimately upset last week that he didn’t intercept Levis on that sideline pass he batted down b/c he got both hands on it. His route recognition has picked up..so much so that he’s began baiting QBs..yeah he’ll get beat from time to time, but contrary to the Sauce brigade, every CB does b/c elite pass/ball placement beats elite coverage everyday and twice on Sunday.
 
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TheRealJoker

Hall of Fame
There’s a difference between being in position to knock a ball down and being in position to intercept & if you’ve been watching Stingley over this timespan he’s almost always in position to intercept. Dude was legitimately upset last week that he didn’t intercept Levis on that sideline pass he batted down b/c he got both hands on it. His route recognition has picked up..so much so that he’s began baiting QBs..yeah he’ll get beat from time to time, but contrary to the Sauce brigade, every CB does b/c elite pass/ball placement beats elite coverage everyday and twice on Sunday.
This is even more important in today’s NFL with the rules favoring offenses so much. You can be a shutdown CB but still get beat because you are limited in what you can do defensively. Gotta be able to get the ball back for your offense to be an elite difference maker and this is what Stingley does better than Sauce. A healthy Stingley is an elite difference maker. Hope healthy Stingley sticks around!
 

TheRealJoker

Hall of Fame

Earl34

Hall of Fame
Thank Lovie, Stingley was his pick.
It's funny how fast perceptions can change in the NFL. A couple of months ago, that statement would have a negative connotation that blames Lovie for drafting an oft injured DB. Today, that same statement is viewed as a positive and gives kudos to Lovie.

If Stingley keeps playing at this level, it will be Caserio who drafted him.
 
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thunderkyss

Just win baby!!!
Staff member
Contributor's Club
If Stingley keeps playing at this level, it will be Caserio who drafted him.
I've been saying that "Lovie pick" crap was BS.

How you going to lock up your HC by giving him a #1 overall pick, but not make any such provision for your GM? The Texans didn't have a #1 pick Caserio's first draft. Then they're going to give away the second drafts #1 pick? I can't see that. Makes no sense.

Then if either Stingley or Gardener was "perfect" for Lovie it would have been Gardner.

Neither Stingley or Pitre are "fits" for the Tampa Two.
 

steelbtexan

King of the W. B. Club
Contributor's Club
It's funny how fast perceptions can change in the NFL. A couple of months ago, that statement would have a negative connotation that blames Lovie for drafting an oft injured DB. Today, that same statement is viewed as a positive and gives kudos to Lovie.

If Stingley keeps playing at this level, it will be Caserio who drafted him.
At least I'm consistent because that's what I heard at the time.
 

Porky

Hall of Fame
Pitre has been flat out bad this year. One of the worst starting safeties in the league. His place on this team is in serious doubt if he doesn’t come to camp next year and ball out. DeMeco isn’t going to put up with his level of play forever just because he was a high draft choice. He will very likely be on the team out of camp, but he will be in prove it mode all year.

A safety at worst…needs to play to the namesake of the word safety. Pitre has been anything but safe and has been caught out of position over and over again. Good safeties are also playmakers. He’s been anything but a playmaker with zero interceptions and very very few impact plays. The only plus is he has managed to be healthy and on the field. As bad as he has been that’s probably a negative lol. My season grade for him in relation to expectations is a D-.
 

Speedy

Former Yeller Dweller
After being named on the all-rookie team last year, Petre's NFL career was off in the right direction so what happened this year when Demeco came in as the new HC ? Just got in coach's dog-house or what ?
Of the 19 safeties drafted in 2022 only 4 started 10 or more games. So there’s a lot better odds of making an all-rookie team like that. Therefore all-rookie doesn’t mean you have to be great at whatever position, especially when the real competition is just 3 other players.

Pitre has been OK but dude has been a miss tackling machine from the get go. And of the 31 other starters at his position throughout the NFL he’s probably mediocre at best.
 

Texansballer74

The Marine
I've been saying that "Lovie pick" crap was BS.

How you going to lock up your HC by giving him a #1 overall pick, but not make any such provision for your GM? The Texans didn't have a #1 pick Caserio's first draft. Then they're going to give away the second drafts #1 pick? I can't see that. Makes no sense.

Then if either Stingley or Gardener was "perfect" for Lovie it would have been Gardner.

Neither Stingley or Pitre are "fits" for the Tampa Two.
Lovie also got Easter Bunny fired. He was also responsible for the Green pick. He had more say than what most of us think he had.
 

Mangler

Toro de España
Lovie also got Easter Bunny fired. He was also responsible for the Green pick. He had more say than what most of us think he had.
I thought it was Hannah that sh*t canned him? I mean, I don’t know that but a lot of changes went down as soon as she stepped in the (higher up) picture. I seriously doubt Lovie was given all this power knowing he was just a stop gap coach. I find it more believable that Hannah told Nick Easterby had to go and Nick did as he was told. But, who the hell really knows…
 

TexansBull

Hall of Fame
I thought it was Hannah that sh*t canned him? I mean, I don’t know that but a lot of changes went down as soon as she stepped in the (higher up) picture. I seriously doubt Lovie was given all this power knowing he was just a stop gap coach. I find it more believable that Hannah told Nick Easterby had to go and Nick did as he was told. But, who the hell really knows…
I think it was McClain or maybe Lance that said Easterby started trying to overstep into Lovie’s world and Lovie said he had to go. I think it had to do with Cooks. Maybe practices? I don’t know for sure.

I also think there was some private conversations being leaked that pointed to Easterby leaking them.

Heard a lot of stuff. Maybe some of it happened in my own head.
 

Lucky

Ride, Captain, Ride!
Staff member
I think it was McClain or maybe Lance that said Easterby started trying to overstep into Lovie’s world and Lovie said he had to go. I think it had to do with Cooks. Maybe practices? I don’t know for sure.

I also think there was some private conversations being leaked that pointed to Easterby leaking them.

Heard a lot of stuff. Maybe some of it happened in my own head.
Don’t forget losing the draft pick because Rasputin setup Watson’s Houstonian account.
 

TexansBull

Hall of Fame
Don’t forget losing the draft pick because Rasputin setup Watson’s Houstonian account.
Lol. If I remember correctly he was smart enough to have another person set up the account. However he didn’t cover his tracks and everything led back to him.

Crazy times.

Glad that is in the past. Future is bright.

Since the future is looking bright, anyone know what happened to @Texian? It seems his posts are fewer than usually. I miss the reminders of how bad everything is.
 

IDEXAN

Hall of Fame
Contributor's Club
Of the 19 safeties drafted in 2022 only 4 started 10 or more games. So there’s a lot better odds of making an all-rookie team like that. Therefore all-rookie doesn’t mean you have to be great at whatever position, especially when the real competition is just 3 other players.

Pitre has been OK but dude has been a miss tackling machine from the get go. And of the 31 other starters at his position throughout the NFL he’s probably mediocre at best.
OK Speedy thanks for informing me of those stats which certainly does tend to lower any prestige that might be associated with Pitre's rookie season "accomplishments", but never the less I think it's still fair to say his rookie season was a relative success ?
 

Thorn

Dirty Old Man
Lol. If I remember correctly he was smart enough to have another person set up the account. However he didn’t cover his tracks and everything led back to him.

Crazy times.

Glad that is in the past. Future is bright.

Since the future is looking bright, anyone know what happened to @Texian? It seems his posts are fewer than usually. I miss the reminders of how bad everything is.
There are several of us here that could help you with that. :lol:
 

Speedy

Former Yeller Dweller
OK Speedy thanks for informing me of those stats which certainly does tend to lower any prestige that might be associated with Pitre's rookie season "accomplishments", but never the less I think it's still fair to say his rookie season was a relative success ?
I don’t know. On a team void of talent and just starting to try and put pieces in place, a piece like Pitre is probably going to look pretty good comparatively speaking. It doesn’t necessarily mean that a guy like Pitre is a cornerstone. Could just be that that’s how bad the talent level here was before and guys like Pitre and Pierce are better than that. But that bar was awfully low.
 

IDEXAN

Hall of Fame
Contributor's Club
I don’t know. On a team void of talent and just starting to try and put pieces in place, a piece like Pitre is probably going to look pretty good comparatively speaking. It doesn’t necessarily mean that a guy like Pitre is a cornerstone. Could just be that that’s how bad the talent level here was before and guys like Pitre and Pierce are better than that. But that bar was awfully low.
OK so let's talk about another player from last year's Draft: what's your thoughts about CB Stingley right now after a clearly not so successful rookie season but what appears to be a late surge in production in his second season in the NFL ?
 

JB

Innocent Bystander
Contributor's Club
OK so let's talk about another player from last year's Draft: what's your thoughts about CB Stingley right now after a clearly not so successful rookie season but what appears to be a late surge in production in his second season in the NFL ?
Maybe you could start a different thread for that or take it to PM's. This thread isn't really for general discussions
 

Speedy

Former Yeller Dweller
OK so let's talk about another player from last year's Draft: what's your thoughts about CB Stingley right now after a clearly not so successful rookie season but what appears to be a late surge in production in his second season in the NFL ?
The deal with Stingley is and always has been a matter of staying on the field. No doubt he has talent, but all the talent in the world means nothing if you're not on the field. He missed 8 games last year and 6 so far this year. He's got pretty good advanced stats when he's on the field, it's just a matter of availability with him. Playing in just 18 of 32 games so far isn't going to cut it.
 

Texazan

Our HOF 34
Lol. If I remember correctly he was smart enough to have another person set up the account. However he didn’t cover his tracks and everything led back to him.

Crazy times.

Glad that is in the past. Future is bright.

Since the future is looking bright, anyone know what happened to @Texian? It seems his posts are fewer than usually. I miss the reminders of how bad everything is.
I and others asked this question many weeks ago and its been crickets....Texian and Steel were like Bosom Buddies there for a while right after the draft but at least Steel has stuck around and enjoyed the ride. I don't know, maybe he's too busy running the Urban Meyers "Grabbin' Booty" fan club...or fundraising for the Blake Bortles Experience......
 


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