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David Johnson... welcome to houston

Corrosion said:
Bwaaahaaaahaaaaaa.

That's almost comical.

This is what I have been stating for the last month and someone has argued with me every whicha way how it doesn't matter!

Oh , I can't stop laughing.
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I don't even know what your points are, or what you're trying to prove.
I've said many times that I totally disagreed with O'Brien on the contracts he gave Watson and Tunsil, among others.
 
banned1976 said:
David Johnson's yards per attempt so far:
Game 1 = 7.0 (11)
2 = 3.09 (11)
3 = 1.77 (13)
4 = 3.95 (16)
5 = 5.65 (17)
6 = 3.0 (19)
7 = 3.0 (14)

Texans rushing total through 7 weeks = 594. Their opponents = 1161.
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Well to be fair he didn't run against our defense. McClain said he is on pace for 1,000. Hey, that's all I got. :user:
 
Curious if he can be a good player at a somewhat different position. Remember Frank Wychek (sp). Johnson is a similar build and a better catch and run player than a RB. Meaning he can be a hybrid of a RB/FB/WR/TE. Just an idea seeing I saw the way Frank was used and it made me think about Johnson. Seeing if he is in the open field catching he is very dangerous.
 
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Texazan said:
Ok so who in the org made sure DJ stayed around to save something from the Hopkins trade? Do we really think NC made this call? I just can't see it......
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Ugh. Just as soon as you start to think that maybe, just maybe, the Texans have a solid GM on their hands, they do something like this to remind us that they are still the Houston Texans.

Instead of cutting David Johnson and saving $6.9 million, the Texans chose to promise Johnson $4.25 million with a chance to pay him $6 million in 2021. That’s at least an $11.15 million cap swing and could be as much as a $12.9 million difference between Door A and Door B. Source
 
I was surprised at first but ignore his previous cap hit and look at just his 2020 stats, as a seasoned veteran he could be good to have in the backfield with a rookie/second season QB. $4.25 is pretty reasonable and new coaching + hopefully a "new perspective" OC in Kelly using Johnson better, who knows? It should also move RB lower in draft as a need. Buddy Howell may step up also so could be another move by our GM.
 
badboy said:
I was surprised at first but ignore his previous cap hit and look at just his 2020 stats, as a seasoned veteran he could be good to have in the backfield with a rookie/second season QB. $4.25 is pretty reasonable and new coaching + hopefully a "new perspective" OC in Kelly using Johnson better, who knows? It should also move RB lower in draft as a need. Buddy Howell may step up also so could be another move by our GM.
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Well yea IF you’re looking to be 9-7 and sneak into the playoffs maybe not a bad signing and a veteran presence but that isn’t where we’re at, not one bit. It makes no sense given the direction 2021 is going. We just cut Martin and you could pretty much apply your reasoning to Martin. This has to have been an order that NC find a way to keep him one more year.
 
Texazan said:
Well yea IF you’re looking to be 9-7 and sneak into the playoffs maybe not a bad signing and a veteran presence but that isn’t where we’re at, not one bit. It makes no sense given the direction 2021 is going. We just cut Martin and you could pretty much apply your reasoning to Martin. This has to have been an order that NC find a way to keep him one more year.
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Not the same, first Johnson didn’t single handily cost the team a game. Didn’t help us win either but still. Second not sure if you’ve read @CloakNNNdagger report on Martin but he basically said due to injuries Martin will not be able to have the firm base a center has to have. Change of scheme and coaching can help a player play better but it’s can’t help any injuries player be back to his old self.

Back to Johnson the deal is not as bad as it first sounds. With the restructure yes it doubles the guaranteed money to 4 million but it lowers the overall hit from 9 million to 6 million. He also hasn’t had injuries to give a reason to fear that he can’t finish a season so even with more guaranteed money odds are it’s an overall saving of 3 million.

Granted 3 million is not as big a saving as if we had cut him but that would have left us needing 2 RBs instead of 1. I’m thinking if the current number of picks we have holds then they are looking at RB in the 3rd so having a vet on a 1 year deal does make sense.

What taints the whole thing is that he was what we traded Hopkins for so naturally the first thought is it’s to save face and that could very well be. But looking at it in a vacuum without considering how he got here the deal isn’t that bad. 2021 was going to suck anyway so it’s not like that extra 6 million would be the difference maker.
 
maverick512000 said:
Not the same, first Johnson didn’t single handily cost the team a game. Didn’t help us win either but still. Second not sure if you’ve read @CloakNNNdagger report on Martin but he basically said due to injuries Martin will not be able to have the firm base a center has to have. Change of scheme and coaching can help a player play better but it’s can’t help any injuries player be back to his old self.

Back to Johnson the deal is not as bad as it first sounds. With the restructure yes it doubles the guaranteed money to 4 million but it lowers the overall hit from 9 million to 6 million. He also hasn’t had injuries to give a reason to fear that he can’t finish a season so even with more guaranteed money odds are it’s an overall saving of 3 million.

Granted 3 million is not as big a saving as if we had cut him but that would have left us needing 2 RBs instead of 1. I’m thinking if the current number of picks we have holds then they are looking at RB in the 3rd so having a vet on a 1 year deal does make sense.

What taints the whole thing is that he was what we traded Hopkins for so naturally the first thought is it’s to save face and that could very well be. But looking at it in a vacuum without considering how he got here the deal isn’t that bad. 2021 was going to suck anyway so it’s not like that extra 6 million would be the difference maker.
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Disagree. How much are the Jags paying their rb? Jones from GB isn't getting that and he's a 4th rd rb. Had they cut him, I highly doubt he would've gotten more than veteran minimum. He sure wasn't getting 4m so why bid against yourself?
 
maverick512000 said:
Not the same, first Johnson didn’t single handily cost the team a game. Didn’t help us win either but still. Second not sure if you’ve read @CloakNNNdagger report on Martin but he basically said due to injuries Martin will not be able to have the firm base a center has to have. Change of scheme and coaching can help a player play better but it’s can’t help any injuries player be back to his old self.

Back to Johnson the deal is not as bad as it first sounds. With the restructure yes it doubles the guaranteed money to 4 million but it lowers the overall hit from 9 million to 6 million. He also hasn’t had injuries to give a reason to fear that he can’t finish a season so even with more guaranteed money odds are it’s an overall saving of 3 million.

Granted 3 million is not as big a saving as if we had cut him but that would have left us needing 2 RBs instead of 1. I’m thinking if the current number of picks we have holds then they are looking at RB in the 3rd so having a vet on a 1 year deal does make sense.

What taints the whole thing is that he was what we traded Hopkins for so naturally the first thought is it’s to save face and that could very well be. But looking at it in a vacuum without considering how he got here the deal isn’t that bad. 2021 was going to suck anyway so it’s not like that extra 6 million would be the difference maker.
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Yes I read Doc on Martin that he had lost most of his base after the ankle issues so maybe not the best analogy but DJ has been also hobbled and is absolutely not the same player he was here in AZ a few years ago. I suppose my only point is clear the books and go young. I’d just rather just cut him and move on. This just feels like more of the same by “someone” meddling and that makes my stomach turn. I so bad want this org to not be doing the same things but this feels like more of the same. No WAY DJ gets close to this deal on the open market.
 
leebigeztx said:
Disagree. How much are the Jags paying their rb? Jones from GB isn't getting that and he's a 4th rd rb. Had they cut him, I highly doubt he would've gotten more than veteran minimum. He sure wasn't getting 4m so why bid against yourself?
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someone influenced/directed this call. It just goes against what it appears NC was doing. Aside from DW who may never suit up again we have no other QBs on this roster but we’re doing a new deal with DJ?
 
Texazan said:
someone influenced/directed this call. It just goes against what it appears NC was doing. Aside from DW who may never suit up again we have no other QBs on this roster but we’re doing a new deal with DJ?
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I wonder who the influencer is 🤔? NE has been known to go ultra cheap on rbs, yet NC about to guarantee Johnson at least 4m when he probably can't get 2 on the street?
 
Texazan said:
Yes I read Doc on Martin that he had lost most of his base after the ankle issues so maybe not the best analogy but DJ has been also hobbled and is absolutely not the same player he was here in AZ a few years ago. I suppose my only point is clear the books and go young. I’d just rather just cut him and move on. This just feels like more of the same by “someone” meddling and that makes my stomach turn. I so bad want this org to not be doing the same things but this feels like more of the same. No WAY DJ gets close to this deal on the open market.
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I was ready for Caserio to move on from DJ.

With this said, DJ on that contract for what I'm assuming is ony 1 yr isn't a bad deal.

I would've liked to have seen them combine a cut Martin/DJ's money and pickup a good CB or LB. That $$$$ would've been better spent on the defensive side of the ball. IMHO Then spend a 4th rd pick on a rookie RB plus sign a vet min guy is the way I would've spent that money.
 
Texazan said:
Well yea IF you’re looking to be 9-7 and sneak into the playoffs maybe not a bad signing and a veteran presence but that isn’t where we’re at, not one bit. It makes no sense given the direction 2021 is going. We just cut Martin and you could pretty much apply your reasoning to Martin. This has to have been an order that NC find a way to keep him one more year.
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And one could argue reasonably against your position that this was an order to Nick Caserio because of the Hopkins deal; that sounds very paranoid to me. I think DJs contract is twice what I would have offered.
 
Texazan said:
someone influenced/directed this call. It just goes against what it appears NC was doing. Aside from DW who may never suit up again we have no other QBs on this roster but we’re doing a new deal with DJ?
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Curious as to how you see signing any positional player as restricting us getting a quarterback? Especially if the goal appears to be in the draft with a trade.
 
badboy said:
Curious as to how you see signing any positional player as restricting us getting a quarterback? Especially if the goal appears to be in the draft with a trade.
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Oh they’re not related just odd timing IMO and let’s get a #2 in here as quick as you can to be ready with or without DW. It just makes sense. who knows maybe it sends a signal....
 
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badboy said:
And one could argue reasonably against your position that this was an order to Nick Caserio because of the Hopkins deal; that sounds very paranoid to me. I think DJs contract is twice what I would have offered.
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Haha yea I’m paranoid. This org has been a complete **** show so yea I have a hard time believing the Patriot way wouldn’t win here with DJ and it didn‘t. That’s not how NC was brought up. We agree regardless that they put out too much.
 
Texazan said:
Haha yea I’m paranoid. This org has been a complete **** show so yea I have a hard time believing the Patriot way wouldn’t win here with DJ and it didn‘t. That’s not how NC was brought up. We agree regardless that they put out too much.
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I agree they may have overpaid but not outrageously like Martin or Mercilous. I just really think because Johnson was brought here due to the Hopkins trade we are putting everything involving him under the microscope. If it wasn’t for the trade I’d think we’d look at it and go “Meh, more then I would pay but whatever.”

Also let’s be honest if they had cut him the board would be saying “Yep it’s official after only one year we get rid of what we got for Hopkins in the trade. Texans are so stupid they couldn’t even get anything out of Johnson.” We’re so burned from the last couple of years that everything the Texans do is damned if the do and damned if they don’t.
 
badboy said:
I was surprised at first but ignore his previous cap hit and look at just his 2020 stats, as a seasoned veteran he could be good to have in the backfield with a rookie/second season QB. $4.25 is pretty reasonable and new coaching + hopefully a "new perspective" OC in Kelly using Johnson better, who knows? It should also move RB lower in draft as a need. Buddy Howell may step up also so could be another move by our GM.
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Have we really stooped to rationalizing why keeping David Johnson is a good thing now? Their conditioning of you to mediocrity is complete.
 
Speedy said:
Have we really stooped to rationalizing why keeping David Johnson is a good thing now? Their conditioning of you to mediocrity is complete.
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I don’t view it as rationalizing as much as understanding. We talk around here about how stupid the Texans front office is but fact is their not, in reality they are most likely smarter football wise than we on this board and they definitely have more information. It’s why I always try to ask myself “why did they do that?” and see if there is any benefit to it first before I just say it’s a bad move. Sometimes I can’t see it, such as the Hopkins trade, but it does make me consider it from all sides.
 
maverick512000 said:
I don’t view it as rationalizing as much as understanding. We talk around here about how stupid the Texans front office is but fact is their not, in reality they are most likely smarter football wise than we on this board and they definitely have more information. It’s why I always try to ask myself “why did they do that?” and see if there is any benefit to it first before I just say it’s a bad move. Sometimes I can’t see it, such as the Hopkins trade, but it does make me consider it from all sides.
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I agree with they have more information, but that doesn’t make them smarter.

They keep a guy who was not only part of one of the worst trades in NFL history, but also the lead part in one of the worst run games in the league.

David Johnson will be paid more in 2021 than Dalvin Cook, Alvin Kamara and Nick Chubb. That doesn’t sound very smart to me.
 
Speedy said:
I agree with they have more information, but that doesn’t make them smarter.

They keep a guy who was not only part of one of the worst trades in NFL history, but also the lead part in one of the worst run games in the league.

David Johnson will be paid more in 2021 than Dalvin Cook, Alvin Kamara and Nick Chubb. That doesn’t sound very smart to me.
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I get what you are saying but its also a one year deal. Cook and Kamara are on long term deals with huge contracts and huge guarantees. Their big contract hits come next year where Cooks will be 12 million and Kamara 14.5 million. Its kind of like Goff will make 28 million and Mahomes only 24 million next year. As far as Chubb goes he's on his last year of his rookie contract so thats not a fair comparison, who knows what his new contract will look like. I'm not saying its a great contract or Texans got a bargain, I agree its an overpay but I don't think its so much an overpay that it would draw this much attention if it wasn't for the fact he came here because of the Hopkins trade.
 
Texazan said:
Well yea IF you’re looking to be 9-7 and sneak into the playoffs maybe not a bad signing and a veteran presence but that isn’t where we’re at, not one bit. It makes no sense given the direction 2021 is going. We just cut Martin and you could pretty much apply your reasoning to Martin. This has to have been an order that NC find a way to keep him one more year.
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Dang Tex I hope you are wrong but your explanation is plausible, which is usually the case when logic is involved.
I so want ownership to permit NC to be autonomous so he has a chance to apply his football experience and knowledge.
Johnson flashed in a couple games last year but all things considered it's still tough to sell that deal Caserio gave him.
 
maverick512000 said:
I get what you are saying but its also a one year deal. Cook and Kamara are on long term deals with huge contracts and huge guarantees. Their big contract hits come next year where Cooks will be 12 million and Kamara 14.5 million. Its kind of like Goff will make 28 million and Mahomes only 24 million next year. As far as Chubb goes he's on his last year of his rookie contract so thats not a fair comparison, who knows what his new contract will look like. I'm not saying its a great contract or Texans got a bargain, I agree its an overpay but I don't think its so much an overpay that it would draw this much attention if it wasn't for the fact he came here because of the Hopkins trade.
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Understood, but the point I'm trying to relay is that there will only be in the neighborhood of 5-7 RBs making more than DJ in 2021. This is a Texans thing that appears to be continuing, where they pay guys top 5-8 money when they're nowhere close to top 5-8 in performance.

Eckler, Hunt, Mostert, Michel, Hines, Ronald Jones, all making less. Not to mention guys like Edwards-Helaire, Swift, Taylor, Akers, Dobbins and Dillon proving that you can find RBs. You can get better for cheaper. It's all over the league.
 
maverick512000 said:
It’s why I always try to ask myself “why did they do that?” and see if there is any benefit to it first before I just say it’s a bad move.
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Was your answer, "Because cutting Johnson would make the Hopkins trade look even worse" ? And why would that matter, if O'Brien was the sole architect of the deal? Obviously, he wasn't. He got plenty of help from his "friend" Jack. And Kyle knows it. This re-signing was for an audience of one.
Speedy said:
Understood, but the point I'm trying to relay is that there will only be in the neighborhood of 5-7 RBs making more than DJ in 2021. This is a Texans thing that appears to be continuing, where they pay guys top 5-8 money when they're nowhere close to top 5-8 in performance.
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Would the Patriots have paid Johnson $6 million? Do they ever pay RBs anywhere close to $6 million? And in a year where the cap is being slashed, is this the absolutely worst time for a fat contract for a shot, over the hill RB?

Either Caserio learned nothing in his two decades with the Patriots. Or Easterby has roster control. It's really that simple.
 
steelbtexan said:
I was ready for Caserio to move on from DJ.

With this said, DJ on that contract for what I'm assuming is ony 1 yr isn't a bad deal.

I would've liked to have seen them combine a cut Martin/DJ's money and pickup a good CB or LB. That $$$$ would've been better spent on the defensive side of the ball. IMHO Then spend a 4th rd pick on a rookie RB plus sign a vet min guy is the way I would've spent that money.
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This is not a good move at all. Even if this team wasn't in disarray, this isn't a good move. The rb market, is bloated in terms of talent to the point you probably can get Fournette for 5m and still combine him with a late round rookie.
 
I don't like the contract either, but I'll give NC the benefit of the doubt at the moment.

On the plus side, DJ does not have fumbilitis issues throughout his career and he's a good receiving back.
That's good for any QB.

On the minus side, I don't know how many more concussions he can take, and his vision seems to be poor as is his acceleration to the hole.

Now, maybe some of the problem is the line.
I'm sure NC gets input from the new OL coach (who is a pretty good one) as he sits with Kelly the OC and Barret the RB coach to review the tapes.

The downside is the possibility of another concussion and his injury history.

And as mentioned by some, the signing doesn't indicate anything near a cut-throat approach, but more of a reverse in philosophy: fairly-to-quite generous.
 
leebigeztx said:
This is not a good move at all. Even if this team wasn't in disarray, this isn't a good move. The rb market, is bloated in terms of talent to the point you probably can get Fournette for 5m and still combine him with a late round rookie.
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Fournette wouldn't come here. Especially if you're going to be a bad team and although I don't like the move if you're going to be bad be really bad and DJ helps with the tank.
 
The way I look at it is they spent ~$4mil for David Johnson in 2021. I mean, they were going to pay him 2mil regardless.

After cutting Duke, which I agreed with, they NEEDED an RB. Question is, could have they gotten someone better than DJ for 4 mil? Maybe? I don't know. At a one year deal, most likely not.

What this move does tell me, though, is the team is not planning a complete re-build. If the team is thinking we're going to trade DW and go through a total rebuild, doesn't make sense to retain DJ.
 
leebigeztx said:
Ridiculous signing. Should've ate that 2m and bring in some young backs.
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Hope you don’t mean young backs via FA...you’re gonna be paying a premium and way more for those guys than you are resigning Johnson on a 1 year deal;.that is if you want someone worth a damn. Plus too the young backs are gonna be here through the draft and FA regardless. The only guys we have a the position currently on the roster are Johnson and Howell I believe.

I like the deal simply b/c he’s a vet, he wants to be here, you didn’t break the bank and actually lessened his cap hit to well under what you would’ve paid him and he’s actually a good back. He showed what he could do in a few games .......when he’s got lanes to run through.
 
leebigeztx said:
This is not a good move at all. Even if this team wasn't in disarray, this isn't a good move. The rb market, is bloated in terms of talent to the point you probably can get Fournette for 5m and still combine him with a late round rookie.
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the market might be bloated, but fournette or any of these younger guys you’re talking about aren’t coming here on 1 year deals for 4 million guaranteed. The other thing is we can’t afford to waste ANY of our draft picks this year on a rb. Perhaps an undrafted guy...but even in that scenario, they have to want to come here over other offers they may recieve from other teams...especially given the press we’ve enjoyed as of late. It’s just not as simple as you’re making it out to be.
 
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