Mahomes had a very good vet QB, Alex Smith, in front of him. Stroud is the best QB on the team, day 1.
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CJ Stroud Success Level (Mark it down)
- Thread starter BattleRedBlud
- Start date
sandman
Brexit Advisor
I mean, Mills was the best QB on the team last year. I doubt that is Steel's criteria for saying Day 1 productive starter no excuses.
BattleRedBlud
Blue Steel Pose. No Excuses!
I think immediate starter will be determined during/after pre-season. We have to see how well Stroud operates the Texans offense and how quickly he adapts to NFL speed. It is possible that Mills will start the first handful of games until Stroud is unleashed fully. Also need to see how far our O-Line is progressing and make sure they can protect our fancy new toy under center first.
I don't get wrapped up in @steelbtexan 's criteria. I'll know if Stroud is productive or not.
Yep, when he holds up a trophy while wearing his ring in a parade, I will know he was the right pick. I'm not going to hold my breath.
The OL if healthy should be better. Stroud, if he's what some think he is should be a day 1 starter. No excuses.
Yes, Ryans should do this. But this shouldn't even be an option, this is Stroud's team, succeed or fail, no excuses.
sandman
Brexit Advisor
There have only been two QB's drafted in the last 10 or so years that have won a Super Bowl. Mahomes and Foles.
What you are trying to say is that he isn't Mahomes. And the Texans should have been more aggressive about trading up in 2017 for Mahomes. So the entire narrative moving forward is really about Mahomes, or the failure of not landing him, not whomever the Texans may have as a QB.
This isn't about Mahomes
This is about trying to win a championship with a top 10-15 QB rather than a top 5 QB. Stroud has the least amount of god given ability of the 4 starting QB's in their division.
Think about that for a minute.
BattleRedBlud
Blue Steel Pose. No Excuses!
Is this just your opinion? I do not agree that Stroud has less god given talent than Levis or Richardson. I would almost put him on par with Lawrence, however, need to see how much Stroud can improve over a years' time frame.
Or are we speaking of Mahomes' divison? If we are I agree with you. However Wilson is on the decline, and in a year or two it is every bit possible that Stroud can be as good as Hebert.
I've thought about it, and it means nothing to me. I believe Stroud will be the 2nd best QB in division in short order. I look forward to the Stroud/Lawrence rivalry over the next several years.
sandman
Brexit Advisor
I was writing a response but then I realized you specifically said god-given ability and not talent, so you are crafting a conversation to meet your talking points. In other words, he is not an athletic specimen like Levis, Richardson or Lawrence. You're just going to move the critique topic to whatever you can. Have fun with that.
Texansballer74
The Marine
He will correct himself and start throwing at his receivers feet. Lol
Did you watch the combine? Does Stroud have a stronger arm than Richardson or Levis? Is he faster or more mobile than them?
Hence he's the 4th best athlete playing QB in the NFC South. There's really no debating this with you.
BattleRedBlud
Blue Steel Pose. No Excuses!
Lol. Does stronger arms and faster speeds equate to better QB's now? I don't remember the likes cannon armed JaMarcus Russel and Ryan Mallet being anything but busts. And the list of highly mobile QBs to win the SuperBowl is pretty limited.
I quoted you stating this it wasn't about Mahomes, it was about winning championships. Arm Strength and Speed does not win championships alone. Championships are won by QB's with leadership, capability, ability to learn, adapt and most importantly, their surrounding cast of teammates and coaches.
To claim that Stroud is a 10-15 level QB and allude to Levis and Richardson being above him in that respect is laughable.
The only thing I do agree with your statement is that there is in fact no debating with me on this. Firstly he doesn't play in the NFC South, and secondly a blind man wouldn't rank him below two of the 3 QB's fielded by the other AFCS teams....unless of course he just likes to hear himself talk.
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I believe next yr you may be correct. In 5 yrs probably not.
I think Stroud can be a top 10-15 qb.
I believe Richardson and Levis are more talented and have a greater upside. Stroud will most likely be the better QB next yr but not in 5 yrs
Which QB stands to improve his game more within the next 5 yrs? I realize you're the win now impulsive fan guy, while I like thinking long term.
BattleRedBlud
Blue Steel Pose. No Excuses!
Out of all the QB's in the AFCS, the QB with this highest ceiling would be Richardson. Do I believe he will reach his potential? Nope...less than 15% chance of that happening.
And no, you have me all wrong. I would have preferred building the team first and gambling for a QB in 2024. Stroud also wasn't my choice if we had to take a QB this season. I would have gambled on Richardson due to his upside (swing for the fences), but I am definitely ok with the safe pick. If we can build a strong unit Stroud will be fine.
And in the line of thinking long term, Richardson may have the highest capability of the 4 QB's, but I also think he has the highest chances of not being around in 2 to 3 years, much like Malik Willis. I cannot fault the Texans for going the best of the safe routes, and drafting Stroud.
sandman
Brexit Advisor
So you're not trying to win a championship in the next 5 years? How many years of a rebuild are you planning on while allowing your QB to develop? It's been three already.
Going the safe route and being impatient are McNair family traditions. Gotta put butts in the seats 1st and foremost. At least now guys like Cak cant say well if you dont like what their doing then tuff because there's a season ticket holder waiting list. LMAO
I'm planning on being a contender by 2025 and having a high upside QB would go a long way to accomplishing this. Personally, I wouldn't have drafted a QB high this yr and would've drafted the 2024 higher upside class.
But Cal's gotta put butts in the seats and I get from a business stand point why Stroud was the pick. There will be a price to pay for putting business over the on field product. You know, just like Cal's dad did.
BattleRedBlud
Blue Steel Pose. No Excuses!
The safe route in this circumstance is a darn good QB. I see you and I both selected good on this poll as well. Can he win a championship? I think it is likely he wins us one before any of the other AFCS QBs win their team one.
Why do I believe this? I have faith in our coaching staff.
I think his ceiling is limited to a top 10-15 QB, which is good. Good is what the Texans have been at their best since their inception. The opportunity to build a dynasty was there, but they settled for good enough.
BattleRedBlud
Blue Steel Pose. No Excuses!
I do not disagree with you. However now we have a "good enough" QB until it comes time for Strouds follow up contract. At that time, hopefully our front office can do their due diligence before handing out a dumb contract to him aka Watson. If a better QB is available to us at that time (or already acquired and on the depth chart), then roll with it.
As it stands, Cal has righted a sinking ship. We now have the ability to float. Lets see is Stroud can provide the wind in our sails, or if he instead lights the deck on fire.
Levis sitting behind Tannehill is in the best position.
DeMeco should be able to contend with a top 10-15 QB. Like a Garoppolo.
michaelm
vox nihili
You spent the past year saying Mills could be a good QB, but surely you have to agree that Stroud is better in every category.
Literally every category, even performance under pressure.
And I'm not pointing fingers when it comes to Mills. I was right there with you being wrong af about Mills prospects as a starter.
Yeah. I think you are disregarding the fact how accurate CJ Stroud is from multiple throwing trajectories.
Just because you have a bigger arm does not mean you are more talented.
AR is not a layered thrower and Will Levis is no where near as developed as Stroud from the pocket.
So how is there greater upside? Are those things just magically going to happen?
Why do the Ravens fail to win with Lamar Jackson in the playoffs? Can't throw the ball well enough. I put AR in a similar category.
We will see.
I was thinking like this until I applied deeper thinking. there is no guarantees that the next class will be better. Injuries happen, the Ridder-effect is real and un-foreseen events will happen between now and next April. And you delay any possibility of that championship at least another year while your current stars are growing older and more expensive. I don't want to AJ/Watt any more players
Yes Stroud should be better. Time will tell if he is.
Like I said this is about who and why Stroud was drafted and Cal's inabilty to stay patient.
I get what you're saying and even if they took he chance and weren't able to draft Williams/Maye. McCarthy/Sanders would've been on the board for them to pick. Point is a top 10 pick would've been good enough to draft a QB next yr, particularly having an extra 1st next yr. But Cal shockingly couldn't stay patient. SMH
The draft is a crapshoot, we always have questions, Leaf and Manning, Brady, that dumbass from A&M that Cleveland drafted…..
I’m all in on CJ because he’s the QB of my team!
He hasn’t quit or pulled any slimeball maneuvers and I’ll be the first to call him out on it if he does.
My trust is in DeMeco and I believe he won’t let any of that Shiite go on.
I’m all in on CJ because he’s the QB of my team!
He hasn’t quit or pulled any slimeball maneuvers and I’ll be the first to call him out on it if he does.
My trust is in DeMeco and I believe he won’t let any of that Shiite go on.
Yep, how many championships has Jimmy G won? And you know that I like Jimmy G more than I like Stroud.
You know that you used smart in the same post as you used Cal's name. I would use the term used car salesman to describe Cal. But I cant blame him, he learned this from his dad. I still remember a time on this MB where posters said Bob was a hands off owner, meanwhile Bob was on the NFL finance committee. Yep, the McNair's keep a close eye on the money and will do whatever it takes to revive the golden goose/keep it alive and well. The Stroud pick helps in regards to their ultimate goal.
I'm just hoping for an AFCCG appearance. That's a contender.
sometexansfan
Blue Bomber
So these 4 are all future top 5 qbs?
BattleRedBlud
Blue Steel Pose. No Excuses!
I know some around here are pretty Jaded when it comes to the McNairs. I just cannot bring myself to dislike Cal however. Yes, maybe he was brought up with the money mindset of his father, but I am sensing an evolution in the ownership thought process. Whether you give Cal that credit of Hannah I do not know, but I think ownership cares more about building a contender than some are giving them credit for. DO they know how? Probably not, but I think they are now listening. And with the correct people now coaching this team, I think they are also learning. I see good times ahead for the organization and fans.
Texansballer74
The Marine
Barking up the wrong tree there bud. His mind is made up.
Porky
Hall of Fame
Is this Savage vs Watson redux?
Mills having the same weapons may make him marginally better but I’m not holding my breath.
Unless one of the new weapons is named stretch Armstrong, it’s not going to help Mills. Guys were wide open many, many times, and Mills would either sail it, or dump it at their feet. He especially had issues outside the numbers. Down the seam. Mills had a few beautiful strikes. But you can’t live throwing nothing but seam routes. Stroud can threaten every blade of grass. I’m not sure why SB or a few others are hugging Mills nuts. Is Mills SB’s long lost son? I don’t remember him pounding the table for Brock Osweiler, a QB with a a similar skill set and similar results…maybe a bit better than Mills but that’s subjective. Why don’t we call it the Osweiler treatment? Why the nut hugging over nearly inarguably one of the 3 worst starters in the NFL last year?
He was a 3rd round flyer. Showed a bit at times, but wasn’t nearly consistent enough, wasn’t processing quickly enough, too many picks, major accuracy issues, etc. it’s not like he didn’t have a legit shot. Nearly two full years and wasn’t improving enough to keep rolling him out there. Hell his own coaches pulled him mid season. Get real. He’s got a place in the league, but he has a long way to go if he’s going to be a long term starter. I’d be shocked if he made it to that level, but hope he keeps working on his craft and he gets there. It’s nothing personal, but it won’t be here.
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I completely understand the doubts and pessimism about Texans ownership.
And it would be pretty easy to predict failure when the metric is an NFL championship. I would be in the "never thought it could happen" crowd if it ever did happen here.
So I'm not setting my expectations that high.
I want to be entertained. Because at the end of the day, that's all any of this is to any of us. Unless you're coaching or playing for the Texans, we're just spectators and this should ONLY be entertainment in your life, even if/when they win a championship.
I loved the Astros winning World Series. Great entertainment and great for the city. But I still had to go to work the next day. Nothing changed in my life. It was an extremely entertaining experience.
And ultimately, that's all I want from the Texans. Quit sucking. It's not fun to watch. Being competitive = being entertaining. Everything beyond that is just sprinkles.
Stroud and Anderson are major upgrades that should definitely help in that regard.
And it would be pretty easy to predict failure when the metric is an NFL championship. I would be in the "never thought it could happen" crowd if it ever did happen here.
So I'm not setting my expectations that high.
I want to be entertained. Because at the end of the day, that's all any of this is to any of us. Unless you're coaching or playing for the Texans, we're just spectators and this should ONLY be entertainment in your life, even if/when they win a championship.
I loved the Astros winning World Series. Great entertainment and great for the city. But I still had to go to work the next day. Nothing changed in my life. It was an extremely entertaining experience.
And ultimately, that's all I want from the Texans. Quit sucking. It's not fun to watch. Being competitive = being entertaining. Everything beyond that is just sprinkles.
Stroud and Anderson are major upgrades that should definitely help in that regard.
The1ApplePie
Hall of Fame
The Chiefs had Alex Smith, a solid veteran QB, at the helm. With all respect to him, Case isn't Smith, and don't even mention Mills. The Texans will have to either start CJ right away, or put him in after a few games.
Looks like CJ, Richardson, and Young will all start right away. Levis and Hooker will probably sit a year.
We’ll see in camp just like with Watson who the superior QB is, I don’t think it’ll even be close.
Thorn
Dirty Old Man
Stroud is obviously the superior QB. How soon is he ready for the NFL is another story. We can always blandly start Case or Mills for a few games, but I'd expect Stroud to take over this season sometime and be the "show". It's why they drafted him.