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Caserio Trades Mark Ingram

steelbtexan said:
Yep, there are plans in the works to build another stadium.

Covid/Social issues are a couple of reasons attendance is down.

As for me I'm sitting this yr out because of Covid. I'm actually kind of enjoying watching the games amongst friends at home, rather than being out at the stadium.
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Other factor is the dismal economy and that inflation is sky high. In reality Houston is actually middle of the pack on both total and average attendance this year.

2024 NFL Football Attendance - National Football League - ESPN

Find out the 2024 attendance numbers for every NFL football team
www.espn.com www.espn.com

And to keep the thread on topic I don’t think trading Ingram will help or hurt that attendance. :trapstar:
 
maverick512000 said:
Other factor is the dismal economy and that inflation is sky high. In reality Houston is actually middle of the pack on both total and average attendance this year.

2024 NFL Football Attendance - National Football League - ESPN

Find out the 2024 attendance numbers for every NFL football team
www.espn.com www.espn.com

And to keep the thread on topic I don’t think trading Ingram will help or hurt that attendance. :trapstar:
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Do the Texans really average 68 thousand plus in attendance?
 
Oh god we traded Ingram. Now we are screwed and we can beat this to death on this forum. Most people here thought he was a waste until he was traded. What would we have gotten for him at the end of this year Btw. My take is to see where they are going with this.
 
maverick512000 said:
Other factor is the dismal economy and that inflation is sky high. In reality Houston is actually middle of the pack on both total and average attendance this year.

2024 NFL Football Attendance - National Football League - ESPN

Find out the 2024 attendance numbers for every NFL football team
www.espn.com www.espn.com

And to keep the thread on topic I don’t think trading Ingram will help or hurt that attendance. :trapstar:
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Dismal economy and inflation doesn’t matter when tax payers are paying for it instead of the billionaire owner.
 
Dejaview said:
Oh god we traded Ingram. Now we are screwed and we can beat this to death on this forum. Most people here thought he was a waste until he was traded. What would we have gotten for him at the end of this year Btw. My take is to see where they are going with this.
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Point spread probably open to 89
 
76Texan said:
Do the Texans really average 68 thousand plus in attendance?
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In ticket sales, yes. But the PSL scam is gonna do that. This year is the 1st time those numbers have been below 70,000 though, so there's a few who dropped them and took the loss. I suspect a few more may be doing so in the near future.

Now, actual butts in the seats, they can't be averaging more than 45,000-50,000 or so. And that may be generous. I expect it will be a ghost town there this Sunday.
 
Speedy said:
In ticket sales, yes. But the PSL scam is gonna do that. This year is the 1st time those numbers have been below 70,000 though, so there's a few who dropped them and took the loss. I suspect a few more may be doing so in the near future.

Now, actual butts in the seats, they can't be averaging more than 45,000-50,000 or so. And that may be generous. I expect it will be a ghost town there this Sunday.
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What's the lifetime of a PSL, does anyone know? I'm pretty sure that expires at some point, but I might be wrong. If you need a PSL to buy season tickets for most seats for another decade or two, people might actually be buying those on the cheap this year. But given it's already been 20 years, and there's maybe only 5 years left, they might be getting worthless anyway and easier for people to walk away from.
 
paycheck71 said:
What's the lifetime of a PSL, does anyone know? I'm pretty sure that expires at some point, but I might be wrong. If you need a PSL to buy season tickets for most seats for another decade or two, people might actually be buying those on the cheap this year. But given it's already been 20 years, and there's maybe only 5 years left, they might be getting worthless anyway and easier for people to walk away from.
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There's no lifetime on the PSL's.

Once they have your $$$$ they have it regardless of whether you renew or not.
 
banned1976 said:
So far Caserio has won nothing. I'm all for giving the guy a chance but there's nothing he, or anyone in the organization has done for any fan to chalk up a (premature) victory for the Texans. The player the Texans draft with the Ingram trade is much more likely to not make the team next year while Ingram has a real good chance of making a significant impact for the Saints. On the field and off it.

The whole "we're building a culture here" has been an insult to the intelligence of the fans and trading Ingram is just another reminder of how stupid and forgiving they think the Houston fan base is.
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This is an epic post about all this trade crap.
Preach my friend, preach!
 
leebigeztx said:
They don't care about you. I've told you that before. Have you seen the attendance this year? Its abysmal and it's going to get worse. Know why, because they don't have a clear plan, they're not trying to win, they have lied countless times, and Jack is a dark cloud over the over this organization. People hated Ozuna when he played for another team, but loved him in the Astros uni. Nobody except really you and a few would white flag it if Watson played. Guess what? Look at how many people are white flagging it vfc right now. Not to mention, NRG is coming up on 20 yrs old and we know what that means too.
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I got an email asking me why I haven’t attended a game this year (season ticket holder). Whenever one of the options was “team direction-performance” I clicked the crap out of that one.
I’d gladly pay $15 a beer and $10 for stale ass popcorn if this team and ownership was even near legit!
 
steelbtexan said:
There's no lifetime on the PSL's.

Once they have your $$$$ they have it regardless of whether you renew or not.
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I know that. That wasn't my question. I know there is a number of seats, maybe all of them, that you can only buy a season ticket if you own a PSL. If you own the PSL, you HAVE to buy the season tickets. You can sell your PSL to someone else, and then they have the right and the obligation to buy the season tickets for that seat. You can forfeit your PSL, and then I'm assuming the stadium owner gets them back and can do what they want with it.

My question was, how long is the PSL requirement in place to buy the season tickets? For the lifetime of the stadium? For the lifetime of the stadium financing? For a predetermined amount of time (20, 30 years, etc). If I wanted to buy a season ticket today that was originally a PSL seat, do I have to buy a PSL from someone, or can it be available without one?
 
paycheck71 said:
I know that. That wasn't my question. I know there is a number of seats, maybe all of them, that you can only buy a season ticket if you own a PSL. If you own the PSL, you HAVE to buy the season tickets. You can sell your PSL to someone else, and then they have the right and the obligation to buy the season tickets for that seat. You can forfeit your PSL, and then I'm assuming the stadium owner gets them back and can do what they want with it.

My question was, how long is the PSL requirement in place to buy the season tickets? For the lifetime of the stadium? For the lifetime of the stadium financing? For a predetermined amount of time (20, 30 years, etc). If I wanted to buy a season ticket today that was originally a PSL seat, do I have to buy a PSL from someone, or can it be available without one?
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To guarantee that you get the same seats every yr you have to buy a PSL. Once you buy a PSL to keep those seats you have to renew your seats every yr and the payoff games also. This goes from yr to yr for as long as the stadium is open and I would think PSL holders would have 1st chance at renewing their PSL's in a new stadium.

If you choose to not renew your season tickets or playoff tickets, you lose your PSL investment.
 
76Texan said:
Do the Texans really average 68 thousand plus in attendance?
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Guess it depends on how much you trust ESPN. Some here are saying that it’s just ticket holders which I believe but ultimately what teams and the NFL care about is whether you bought a ticket not whether you actually use it and by hook or by crook in that regard Texans are comfortably average.
 
TripleTap said:
I say trade everyone who can be traded for whatever they are worth. The build begins next year.
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That‘s where I am at. This season is a success if we get a high draft pick - bonus points if any of the young players improve or older players improve their value. But right now I basically see no building blocks (maybe outside of Tunsil, but for the right offer he should be on the table as well). If we can get a good trade, no player is untouchable.

And Ingram? People are actually angry about trading an old HB at the start of a rebuild - and one that wasn‘t even averaging 3.5 ypc? I get why Cooks is upset, but as a fan, let‘s just look at the future. I don‘t need to be more competitive this year, I want a good draft position.
 
LikeMike said:
And Ingram? People are actually angry about trading an old HB at the start of a rebuild - and one that wasn‘t even averaging 3.5 ypc?
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Other than Cooks, who’s angry? I thought bringing in a guy to be the feature back who was relegated to RB3 last year on a team Culley was coaching on, was a dumb move to begin with. But culture, dammit!

Very curious to see what this team looks like after Tuesday as the Benny Hill theme continues in the background.
 
Speedy said:
Other than Cooks, who’s angry? I thought bringing in a guy to be the feature back who was relegated to RB3 last year on a team Culley was coaching on, was a dumb move to begin with. But culture, dammit!

Very curious to see what this team looks like after Tuesday as the Benny Hill theme continues in the background.
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Exactly, I haven't seen anyone angry about it, and my posts should not be perceived that way. You might as well got rid of DJ, and Lindsay too. All of them are awful, but at least Ingram made it past the LOS more than the other two, but that's not saying much. DJ doesn't even look like he wants to be out there.
 
LikeMike said:
And Ingram? People are actually angry about trading an old HB at the start of a rebuild - and one that wasn‘t even averaging 3.5 ypc? I get why Cooks is upset, but as a fan, let‘s just look at the future. I don‘t need to be more competitive this year
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You're missing the point.

Every thing they did this year, they said it was about building a culture. Mark Ingram was the face of that culture, so they said. & now they traded him. So what does that say about what they are building?

Anyone who has expressed any disappointment with the Ingram trade didn't want Ingram on the team in the first place. They'd rather role that money over, they'd rather Scottie Phillips & other young RBs been brought in & taken their lumps or uncover a diamond in the rough. They're upset that Caserio & crew are wasting time.
 
thunderkyss said:
You're missing the point.

Every thing they did this year, they said it was about building a culture. Mark Ingram was the face of that culture, so they said. & now they traded him. So what does that say about what they are building?

Anyone who has expressed any disappointment with the Ingram trade didn't want Ingram on the team in the first place. They'd rather role that money over, they'd rather Scottie Phillips & other young RBs been brought in & taken their lumps or uncover a diamond in the rough. They're upset that Caserio & crew are wasting time.
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True, but I don't know if they are really wasting time or trying to get the best players or deals they can. Seeing it doesn't look like they will be back to winning for 2 or more years. I think Ingram was traded due to 5 RBs and only 2 QBs. 1 is injured and could be again, 1 is a rookie a Jeff on the PS is not going to be better than a WR at QB. The Saints called and asked about Ingram (or a RB in general) and Caserio picked the 1 that might have interest in going to the Saits. Along with ok play, in order to we hope recover any type of pick or player. I have a feeling QB, RB, DB are top targets for next year.
 
austins23 said:
I got an email asking me why I haven’t attended a game this year (season ticket holder). Whenever one of the options was “team direction-performance” I clicked the crap out of that one.
I’d gladly pay $15 a beer and $10 for stale ass popcorn if this team and ownership was even near legit!
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Plus we have great weather during the early part of the season. I won't even give them Nielsen ratings. I watch the game on game pass later that night. Even during the bad seasons the team had hope and competitiveness.
 
Hardcore Texan said:
Exactly, I haven't seen anyone angry about it, and my posts should not be perceived that way. You might as well got rid of DJ, and Lindsay too. All of them are awful, but at least Ingram made it past the LOS more than the other two, but that's not saying much. DJ doesn't even look like he wants to be out there.
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Just like his last years in Arizona
 
thunderkyss said:
You're missing the point.

Every thing they did this year, they said it was about building a culture. Mark Ingram was the face of that culture, so they said. & now they traded him. So what does that say about what they are building?

Anyone who has expressed any disappointment with the Ingram trade didn't want Ingram on the team in the first place. They'd rather role that money over, they'd rather Scottie Phillips & other young RBs been brought in & taken their lumps or uncover a diamond in the rough. They're upset that Caserio & crew are wasting time.
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Ingram was a good choice for the Texans rebuild. Although his better days are behind him, he is vet that can establish some locker room leadership and culture they're trying to establish (he was one of Culley's boys). He also came relatively cheap. In a traditional rebuild you don't want to bring in your new long term skill players until after you've built your core (aka the trenches). Based on the Ingram trade and comments being made from other team vets I would say the team leadership and new culture is not going well or as expected.
 
So we're down to 4 RB's - none of whom are worthy of starting for any NFL team other than the Texans.

I believe that NC's original intent was to be competitive this year and see what we have. However, after TT was injured and it became clear that Mills isn't ready, Nick has shifted to acquiring as much draft capital as he can for next year and has already written off this season. Therefore, he should trade anybody of value for as much draft capital as we can get - with a couple of exceptions.
 
zshawn10 said:
https://twitter.com/x/status/1454127680895455235
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Was hoping for something in 2023, but I can't complain about getting a draft pick for a 32-year old RB with an expiring contract. Playing him the rest of the season won't make a difference in how competitive this team will be, and then he would walk with zero compensation. NO reached out because they needed someone to pair with Kamara, and the Kamara/Ingram duo was pretty deadly a few years ago. Good for Ingram to get that opportunity again and good on Caserio for getting another draft pick that will clearly be used as fodder for moving up in the 2022 draft.
 
Texian said:
Ingram was a good choice for the Texans rebuild. Although his better days are behind him, he is vet that can establish some locker room leadership and culture they're trying to establish (he was one of Culley's boys). He also came relatively cheap. In a traditional rebuild you don't want to bring in your new long term skill players until after you've built your core (aka the trenches). Based on the Ingram trade and comments being made from other team vets I would say the team leadership and new culture is not going well or as expected.
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This is the last possible pick the Saints could've traded. Maybe they did Ingram a solid
 
banned1976 said:
Hahahaha…let catch my breath. Bhaahaahahahah!!!

Yet, of course, someone has already posted that this was a decent haul for the Texans. Hahahahahaha!!!
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Perhaps you have a value spreadsheet you can share that says what 32-year old RB's should fetch in a trade? Because I am absolutely willing to say that the Texans got fleeced on this one if you can give me some metrics to measure it against.
 
thunderkyss said:
You're missing the point.

Every thing they did this year, they said it was about building a culture. Mark Ingram was the face of that culture, so they said. & now they traded him. So what does that say about what they are building?

Anyone who has expressed any disappointment with the Ingram trade didn't want Ingram on the team in the first place. They'd rather role that money over, they'd rather Scottie Phillips & other young RBs been brought in & taken their lumps or uncover a diamond in the rough. They're upset that Caserio & crew are wasting time.
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Oh it’s some fans mad…it’s some that are big mad. Those locked into PSL’s I understand..a little bit anyway. but others with no stake in the Texans other than your viewership? Simple solution for some get back. Quit bitching, and just stop watching/posting. this is what ya’ll wanted from the outset anyway.

& lol wasting time? Ingram was on the street when he was picked up on a 1 yr. Deal worth 2.5 mil…500,000 guaranteed; IOW, Peanuts. Odds were that Nothing was happening this year & The only way you can say time was wasted is if he made all the moves he made with players and then replaced them with longer term, big money contracts…& then traded those guys away. Not at all the case here.

& none of these players can be pissed about anything. They are the folks who have the most control in terms of what happens on the field. Their performance and our 1-7 record is the reason this **** happened. You don’t want the GM tearing the team down built in the offseason, play better.
 
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sandman said:
Perhaps you have a value spreadsheet you can share that says what 32-year old RB's should fetch in a trade? Because I am absolutely willing to say that the Texans got fleeced on this one if you can give me some metrics to measure it against.
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The 2022 #224 draft pick has a value of 2 points. Ingram today is worth more than that even on this terrible team.

However, I wouldn’t say “fleeced”. They traded a lamp shade for a used toothbrush.

As someone mentioned up- thread, maybe the Texans were doing Ingram a solid. And that’s who they are…givers, never recipients.
 
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Dejaview said:
Oh god we traded Ingram. Now we are screwed and we can beat this to death on this forum. Most people here thought he was a waste until he was traded. What would we have gotten for him at the end of this year Btw. My take is to see where they are going with this.
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Texans are screwed either way with or without Ingram. That much is clear.

But just from an observation standpoint, on the outside looking in, I find it curious that they signed him in the first place--I'm guessing to be some sort of locker room presence?--and then trade him away when his leadership would probably be needed most...for basically nothing...

Maybe Ingram asked out?

If I put myself in the shoes of someone who still cares about this team I'd probably be concerned that this team is developing a reputation for being a place guys want to get away from.
 
xtruroyaltyx said:
Texans are screwed either way with or without Ingram. That much is clear.

But just from an observation standpoint, on the outside looking in, I find it curious that they signed him in the first place--I'm guessing to be some sort of locker room presence?--and then trade him away when his leadership would probably be needed most...for basically nothing...

Maybe Ingram asked out?

If I put myself in the shoes of someone who still cares about this team I'd probably be concerned that this team is developing a reputation for being a place guys want to get away from.
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OB's overall demeanor/dismantling of the team and Watson using a bad season as a bailing point to cover for his legal issues catching up with him have had a significantly higher impact on Houston being a desirable place to play than Caserio cutting an underperforming/overpaid aging LB and trading away an old RB who had been here less than half a season, even if both were considered good locker room guys.
 
thunderkyss said:
I was aiming too high.
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giphy.gif
 
76Texan said:
Have you checked the Patriot's draft record of the last decade?

And please don't tell me Caserio deserves much of any credit in his early years when he was just an apprentice.
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Caserio was Director of Player Personnel for since 2008. 3 Super Bowls in that time.

Prior to that in 2002 he was a coaching assistant, then scout, then Director of Pro Personnel, then a wide receivers coach then finally promoted Director of Player Personnel.

He doesn’t get credit for Superbowls, or any success pretty much during that time, but you want to credit him with the draft for the last 10 years.

That doesn’t make sense.
 
Texian said:
If he did have a plan it was a terrible, horrible, horrendous no good plan. So these players that the File Clerk has been accumulating, most of them have been cut or traded. That aside, the File Clerk is accumulating players for a new head coach in 2023 but the File Clerk has no idea who this new head coach and staff will be or the systems they will run? And you don't see a problem with this? What could possibly go wrong? What self respecting head coach would want to be a part of that and not have any say on the players he will coach? Is the File Clerk also going to be the ghost head coach?

HERE IS THE ONE THING THAT WE DO KNOW ABOUT THE FILE CLERK. HE HAS A DECADE OF HISTORY SHOWING HIS MANAGEMENT SKILLS AND ABILITIES ARE LIMITED TO SETTING UP AN NFL DRAFT BOARD WITH SOME VERY BAD PLAYERS.
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I’m now just waiting for the local news story about you ripping your clothes off and running across a highway into the forest screaming about Caserio, then lighting yourself on fire.
This is getting thoroughly enjoyable.
 
TexansBull said:
Caserio was Director of Player Personnel for since 2008. 3 Super Bowls in that time.

Prior to that in 2002 he was a coaching assistant, then scout, then Director of Pro Personnel, then a wide receivers coach then finally promoted Director of Player Personnel.

He doesn’t get credit for Superbowls, or any success pretty much during that time, but you want to credit him with the draft for the last 10 years.

That doesn’t make sense.
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I've already documented in the Mercilus thread the stats on players drafted on his watch as the Director of Player Personnel:
23 Pro Bowl Selections
11 First Team All Pro Selections
7 Second Team All Pro Selections
2 All Decade Team Selections
1 Defensive Rookie of the Year

And of course three Superb Owls. But the Patriot drafts sucked when he was in charge of them.
 
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