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Anyone else starting to feel optimistic?
- Thread starter keyser
- Start date
Do you want the passing game to improve, or do you just want us to drop back and throw more?
H
humblegeo
Guest
We are ranked 30th in passing out of 32 teams but our record 2-0. Our passing game can't get much worse than it is right now but still, we're winning games somehow. Running game, defense and special teams. Passing game needs to improve and maybe it will during the course of the season.
In this case, it isn't so much a "ranking" as a result of production. We've got less yards in the passing game than 29 other teams, because we haven't had to throw the ball.
If you go over to team stats on NFL.com & put it in order of "Rate" we're second. Meaning we've got the second most efficient passing game in the league... or something like that.
If you put it in order of "AVG" we're third, meaning only two teams gain more yards per attempt than we do.
kinda saying our passing game is "pretty good" more or less.
badboy
Hall of Fame
Pretty sure most of us are talking about next season to remove Arian if at all. A great 2014 helps us but may bring some interesting trade options.
badboy
Hall of Fame
the record should be that win against Pittsburgh not long ago when offense did not score.
infantrycak
Hall of Fame
Try 138 rushing yds from one RB.
And c'mon Texans fans, we scored 24 pts with 47 yds of TOTAL offense in what is still an NFL record.
Pretty sure every year you will (a) want to trade down and (b) trade away one of our top players to have more draft picks in your mock draft.
EllisUnit
Vote RED!!!
Thank god For Aaron Glenn, dude was a beast. I still remember that game, amazing !
infantrycak
Hall of Fame
That is the one Texan I have wanted to see become a coach. Folks talk about that with players all the time but Aaron was constantly teaching the other DBs on the sideline and working the refs. He got away with a ton of savvy hand play but like AJ he talked to the refs a lot.
The Pencil Neck
Hall of Fame
So essentially you're just concerned with how many yards we throw for. There is a very distinct line between fantasy football and the really real stuff they actually play out on the field. And in that real stuff we have the second most efficient passing offense in the league.
1. Control the line of scrimmage
2. Don't turn the ball over
2. Take advantage of favorable matchups
4. Be creative in the redzone
These are the things our offense needs to be diligent about, and they've done a pretty good job so far. A bunch of antiquated rankings based on misleading numbers can go kick rocks.
The Pencil Neck
Hall of Fame
It's 30th in passing if your judging it based on Yards Gained. We're not gaining a lot of yards. We are, however, efficient. We're second in Passer Rating behind the Broncos.
infantrycak
Hall of Fame
Yeah, read those two statements again because wherever you got the first one ain't paying attention.
We have a marginal passing offense built entirely upon the running game.
And we'd be #1 if the only pass thrown this season was the TD to JJ. Big whoop. We do not have a passing attack right now.
Where has the efficiency of our offense been misleading in our first two games?
This is a good thing considering we have Fitzpatrick as the qb and it can get worse once defenses force him to throw the ball more. He didn't earn the nickname "Pickspatrick" for nothing. So what O'Brien is doing is working so far.
infantrycak
Hall of Fame
If you think this passing O can march down the field down 14 points when everyone knows its coming I don't know what to tell you. Getting away with and efficient aren't the same thing even if you can stick them both in Excel and come up with a number.
I never said they necessarily could. So you don't have to tell me anything. To be fair though they haven't needed to yet either, so you can't say definitively that it's impossible.
The fact that Fitz has done what's been asked of him and the results are in the W column is a far more representative statistic per efficiency than trying to base any conclusion off of yardage output. That being the antiquated stat that I said is misleading and can continue kicking rocks.
The Pencil Neck
Hall of Fame
This isn't about "if" or "could be", it's about what is. We are, at the moment, the second most efficient passing game next to the Broncos.
Could we air it out if we got behind by 14 points? I don't know. No one does. So far we haven't had to find out and I don't want to find out. I just want to win. If winning means relying on our run game and only throwing occasional passes and putting our QB in a game-manager position, I'm all for it.
I'm not looking to have the perfect team that can do everything. I'm just looking for a coaching staff that puts its players in the best positions to help the team win and doesn't try to make people do things they can't do. So far, we've played what appear to be a weak couple of teams and we've handled them.
Hopefully, we keep doing that.
infantrycak
Hall of Fame
Hey I'm happy with the result and if they go 19-0 with 2000 yds passing yippee.
But if folks are going to talk about antiquated (not even sure how that applies, as last I checked the field still has yardage markers, 1st downs, etc.) and misleading stats then calling the Texans passing game efficient should be exhibit A. David Carr once set the NFL passing record for completions in a row. That like the Texans current "efficiency" rating was a sham. An efficient passing attack is one you can call on at will when you need it. We ain't got it. And having said that, I hope it never gets exposed and we keep right on winning.
I would say it's inconclusive.
Hey I'm happy with the result and if they go 19-0 with 2000 yds passing yippee.
But if folks are going to talk about antiquated (not even sure how that applies, as last I checked the field still has yardage markers, 1st downs, etc.) and misleading stats then calling the Texans passing game efficient should be exhibit A. David Carr once set the NFL passing record for completions in a row. That like the Texans current "efficiency" rating was a sham. An efficient passing attack is one you can call on at will when you need it. We ain't got it. And having said that, I hope it never gets exposed and we keep right on winning.
The usage of yardage as a ranking to determine one offense's quality over another is misleading, and in the past has been tossed around as some kind of measuring stick, like humblegeo tried to do. Which is exactly what I'm trying to dissuade.
I'll repeat, I don't know that this offense can march down the field when need be, they haven't needed to yet. Likewise, no one can say they can't do it. Fitz has done the things he's been asked to do; reads at the line, move the chains, make the odd play. He's avoided the things he's been told to avoid; taking sacks, risky throws into coverage. That's efficient, and it's backed up statistically and in the win column. What it's not is a sham.
The Pencil Neck
Hall of Fame
Hey I'm happy with the result and if they go 19-0 with 2000 yds passing yippee.
But if folks are going to talk about antiquated (not even sure how that applies, as last I checked the field still has yardage markers, 1st downs, etc.) and misleading stats then calling the Texans passing game efficient should be exhibit A. David Carr once set the NFL passing record for completions in a row. That like the Texans current "efficiency" rating was a sham. An efficient passing attack is one you can call on at will when you need it. We ain't got it. And having said that, I hope it never gets exposed and we keep right on winning.
Completion Percentage does not an efficient passing attack make. Sure, David Carr had a 68.3% completion percentage in 2006 BUT in terms of passer rating, that only translated to a 82.1 passer rating.
Now... I'm firmly in the Mallett camp. I think Mallett gives us the best chance to win the most games this season because I think he has a better understanding of this offensive system and the ability to stretch the field in ways that OB wants.
BUT I don't want to belittle what Fitzy has done so far this season, either. He's done what he needed to do and won some games for us (even though I get a distinct Earl Morrall sort of feeling from it.)
infantrycak
Hall of Fame
I wasn't plugging Mallett or belittling Fitz. Fitz has exceeded my expectations and I expect him to be in there until something really bad happens. Maybe he's felt the pressure and it's helped him. I'm just putting a damper on the optimism because IMO we haven't seen a complete team yet. It could be there but I think if OB thought it was we would be seeing different play calling. Our D ain't the '85 Bears, at some point the passing game is going to have to show it can get it done. I'm dubious and hoping I'm wrong.
H
humblegeo
Guest
ESPN is showing Net Passing Yard Leaders with Houston at 31 out of 32 teams. Any way you twist it that's pretty near bottom of the bucket I would say. Is it a problem? Hasn't been so far. Is it a reflection of offensive pass production. You better believe it is.
infantrycak
Hall of Fame
And if you take 1 busted coverage play away they would far and away be dead last.
GuerillaBlack
Hall of Fame
Yeah take this play away and that play away, etc.
infantrycak
Hall of Fame
No, just 1.
GuerillaBlack
Hall of Fame
Point is, you can nitpick many plays throughout a season to make stats appear the way you want them to. That play happened, no matter how "busted" it may have been.
It's a reflection of what our offense has been asked to do.
You mean the play where their safety bit on Fitz's play fake and Hopkins took his route behind said safety and Fitz found him? Well, you can't take that play away, certainly not just to fit your narrative, because it happened. It's happening being a direct result of our guys' play.
ItsMyFault
It's on me.
Way too early to feel optimistic right now. It's 2 weeks in. Maybe if this was like week 8 or 9 and they had a solid record.
So you see us being in dead last in net passing yards as a problem? Would it be better to be #1 on this list but 0-2?
I don't think much of Fitzpatrick or our "passing attack" but I don't believe being 32nd two weeks into the season with a 2-0 record indicative of how good or bad our passing game is. When called upon it got us what we needed more times than not.
No team in the league has thrown less interceptions than us. Only two teams avg more yards per attempt. Only one team has a better passer rating. No one has given up less sacks. Only 7 teams have thrown more TDs.
It's only been two games, but so far we're trending well & are in good company.
Am I ready to get into a shoot out with Denver? No... but I'm not worried in the slightest about being 32nd in Net Passing yards either.
infantrycak
Hall of Fame
The rest was surplus.
/thread
The caution around the apparent effectiveness of our passing attack is because it has not been tested. That's no fault of theirs and I don't think anybody said it was.
But as the season marches on and individual games ebb and flow, some of us feel that this offense will be called upon to step up and produce under duress.
So, while I'm enjoying the ride (as short as it's been to date) I can't quite move into "optimistic" territory until I have some idea on how much comeback capability we have.
After two games , they are #2 in the NFL in yards per pass play at 8.4 , trailing only Andy Dalton and the Bungles at 9.1.
Fitzpatrick is also one of only two QB's yet to take a sack.
They don't sling it around much , but when the have put the ball in the air , its been effective.
As long as they don't turn the ball over and the defense continues to play well , they can win their share of games being #32 in net passing yards & #2 in yards per passing play ..... Pending Foster remains healthy.
Thorn
Dirty Old Man
We're not the best team in the NFL, so it's little wonder some of the stats are skewed towards the bottom. We were 2-14 last year, this team has problems, so yeah, some of the stats will not look good.
But so far this year, after just two games of course, we look like we can beat the other bottom feeders. It's progress.
But so far this year, after just two games of course, we look like we can beat the other bottom feeders. It's progress.
burro
probably drunk
I'll feel more optimistic when we beat a team that isn't completely horrible...for now I am just glad that we are getting it done against the team's who, at least on paper, we should be beating easily.
If we can go 3-1 in October (DAL-IND-PIT-TEN) then I'll feel optimistic...but it's hard to start talking playoffs because we beat Oakland and a team starting Robert Griffin at QB.
If we can go 3-1 in October (DAL-IND-PIT-TEN) then I'll feel optimistic...but it's hard to start talking playoffs because we beat Oakland and a team starting Robert Griffin at QB.
^ ^ ^
This
Why in the world should we have "easily" beat either Washington or Oakland?
Not many teams should expect to go better than 2-2 through those 4 teams. Not Cincinnati, not Baltimore. & they will play those 4 teams this year.
Y'know, I remember last year when we started 2-0 & the negative nancies were running rampant, they said it was the way we played in those two wins that got them so down. We were more bad than good, more lucky than good, & we proved that we couldn't sustain.
This year is different. We're running the ball well, not because of luck, but because we are good. We're forcing turnovers, because the mindset has been changed. We're recovering those turnovers because we are hustling to the ball.
"Wait until they're 5-1, then I'll be optimistic." Sounds kinda bandwagon to me.
Still hung up on that?
No one was saying he is Tom Brady. The point was that the stats are inconclusive at this point. Our passing game has delivered what & when we asked of it. We just haven't had to ask much of it.
Those pointing to our efficiency rating aren't saying we've got the 2nd best passing game in the league. We don't believe we have the worst passing game in the league like our "net passing yards" minus big play would have you believe.
We're somewhere in between, where exactly we don't know. Hopefully, we won't have to find out anytime soon.
EllisUnit
Vote RED!!!
Na i think blue will have a break out game if AF cant go. I still feel good about it.
Gotta love the
running through your veins!! 
This should give us fans a good indication of where the team really is. It's also going to give us an idea of how well this coaching staff can game plan for different players.
I hope you're right about Blue and I hope he has a good game in pass pro and doesn't get Fitz killed.
H
humblegeo
Guest
Like to see something from Damaris Johnson this game. Small guy 5'8" 175 punt returner wide receiver. I know it's only been two games but our punt returns have been pretty weak so far. Picked him up on waiver wire but why???
EllisUnit
Vote RED!!!
Gotta love the
This should give us fans a good indication of where the team really is. It's also going to give us an idea of how well this coaching staff can game plan for different players.
I hope you're right about Blue and I hope he has a good game in pass pro and doesn't get Fitz killed.
I love the way blue runs, he isn't as agile as Foster but he will run some people over, and still get yards after contact.
The Pencil Neck
Hall of Fame
A little less optimistic this morning.
