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Is it Grade the Draft time?

DocBar said:
I don't think you can compare a phenomenal OL coach in Gibbs to a much lesser of an OL coach in Devlin? It would make absolute sense for Kubes to listen to a ZBS guru like Gibbs. It would be criminally negligent of OB to do the same with Devlin, given the results we've all seen.
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I agree with you

But I'm telling you Devlin is playing the role of Gibbs.
 
All I know is that we're going to see OB and Devlin with the Texans this year. Things would have to be absolutely, inexcusably horrible for Cal McNair to switch things up with OB before January. And OB won't change out Devlin before then, either, if ever. Reading between the lines, I'm thinking that OB would get Devlin "help" of some sort (whatever that means) rather than fire him. I'll write more on that in another post.
 
steelbtexan said:
Which one do you think will do the best next yr?

Have the better career?
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That's a good question, Steel B., and I'll respond in the fun way I think you posed the question.

I think all three guys (Dillard, Howard, and Scharping) will have good careers. I base that on little more than my gut instinct. That's a lot of instinct, by the way.

Howard will be more well rounded than Dillard. Howard will be a lot better run blocker but Dillard may be just a bit better pass blocker.

Scharping will be good and have the longest starting career of the three. I base that on his name, something I wrote about a few days ago in another post. Max Scharping. That's just a classically good name for an OLineman.

I remember some classic names from the past: Bronko Nagurski, Jim Brown, Joe Montana, Mean Joe Green, Billy White Shoes. And now Max Scharping.

At least my reasoning is as good as some of what else I've read around here. Maybe.
 
HaveMercy said:
All I know is that we're going to see OB and Devlin with the Texans this year. Things would have to be absolutely, inexcusably horrible for Cal McNair to switch things up with OB before January. And OB won't change out Devlin before then, either, if ever. Reading between the lines, I'm thinking that OB would get Devlin "help" of some sort (whatever that means) rather than fire him. I'll write more on that in another post.
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PLEASE don't. It's the truth that hurts, and I've had about all the pain I can take, analyzing this team's management.
 
Seegara said:
PLEASE don't. It's the truth that hurts, and I've had about all the pain I can take, analyzing this team's management.
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Okay, I'll take that under advisement, but really, I take your sentiment as a fun kind of challenge.

I spent much of my life diagnosing business and operational processes. I find it very enjoyable. It really helps me to understand why some things work and other things don't. It will help us, the TSAC (Texans Special Advisory Council) (pretty good, huh?), to better weigh the effect of this draft on the Texans, from the players to the coaches to management.

Isn't that what they pay us for?
 
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DocBar said:
If that is true, OB and Gaine deserve to be fired. Even if Howard turns into a perennial all-pro. Devlin is that bad, imo.
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This is true, depending on who you think was calling the shots the last 5 years.

When you have to admit Gaine has made an attempt to fix the ol .

Wether we agree with them or not.
 
steelbtexan said:
This is true, depending on who you think was calling the shots the last 5 years.

When you have to admit Gaine has made an attempt to fix the ol .

Wether we agree with them or not.
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Both GM'S made attempts to fix the offensive line bro. Again it's coaching that failed this team.
 
steelbtexan said:
I want posters to go on the record.
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Record for what reason? You seem to just want to be right...even if it means a draft pick has to fail. Seems most here are supporting the picks just because they want the team to move forward. No GM anywhere bats a thousand, including this team and this draft. I however see a GM intent on moving this team forward with a plan to do so. Also I was a little worried about Cal but he seems pretty team focused as does his mother. But to keep harping on the Texans mediocrity is getting a little psycho imo. May be a twelve step change, but I’m enjoying what I’m seeing. Can’t wait to see these rookies soon.
 
Texansballer74 said:
Both GM'S made attempts to fix the offensive line bro. Again it's coaching that failed this team.
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Hopefully this GM will be better at drafting talent for the OL and yes the coaching could be better. But if you call drafting Davenport an attempt then it was a p!ss poor attempt.
 
Dejaview said:
Record for what reason? You seem to just want to be right...even if it means a draft pick has to fail. Seems most here are supporting the picks just because they want the team to move forward. No GM anywhere bats a thousand, including this team and this draft. I however see a GM intent on moving this team forward with a plan to do so. Also I was a little worried about Cal but he seems pretty team focused as does his mother. But to keep harping on the Texans mediocrity is getting a little psycho imo. May be a twelve step change, but I’m enjoying what I’m seeing. Can’t wait to see these rookies soon.
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I dont want anybody to fail. I want the Texans org to be the best org in the NFL instead of a mediocre franchise. I'm sorry if you dont like me calling them a mediocre franchise but that's exactly what they've been since their inception and will continue to be until they change the way they go about acquiring talent. What have you enjoyed about seeing this team being very content making a fortune and putting a mediocre product on the field at best, while having the 2nd most cap space in the NFL? Do you think this offseason the Texans org has done everything possible to put the best product on the field? If so this is where we disagree.

Please tell me how the Texans have changed the way they acquire players since Janice/Cal took over the franchise? I do like the fact that Gaine has made an attempt to fix the OL although I would've gone in a different direction when trying to fix the OL. (Starting with firing Devlin)
 
steelbtexan said:
This is true, depending on who you think was calling the shots the last 5 years.

When you have to admit Gaine has made an attempt to fix the ol .

Wether we agree with them or not.
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Both GM'S made attempts to fix the offensive line bro. Again it's coaching that failed this team.
steelbtexan said:
Hopefully this GM will be better at drafting talent for the OL and yes the coaching could be better. But if you call drafting Davenport an attempt then it was a p!ss poor attempt.
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The Texans GM's are drafting players these coaches want. You've been a Texans fan since day one and still doesn't understand this by now.
 
Texansballer74 said:
Steel is the master of stirring the pot up bwhahaha
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It's important to have someone stir the pot. I've done it plenty of times in my life. I don't always agree with what's stirred, but it keeps things interesting (as long as it doesn't get personal or simply turn into argument by ridicule which isn't really argument at all). Stirring the pot makes me consider other points of view. That's a good thing. So, for the pot stirrers like Steel, thank you for making me think.
 
Texansballer74 said:
Both GM'S made attempts to fix the offensive line bro. Again it's coaching that failed this team.



The Texans GM's are drafting players these coaches want. You've been a Texans fan since day one and still doesn't understand this by now.
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I dont think the former GM had a clue as to the type of OL the coaches wanted, hence he's the former GM. Gaine thought so much of the former GM's OL FA/Draft picks on the OL that he signed 3 OL in FA and drafted 3 OL in his 1st 2 yrs here.
 
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This go on the record stuff is just silly. let's look at 2016, 3 years ago and see what people were saying and how good we or the experts were. Take 1st round WR's and their draft grades, Corey Coleman (B), Will Fuller (F), Josh Doctson (A), Laquan Treadwell (A). Only Will was picked up 5th year, and the expert thought he was a horrible pick

How about OT. Conklin (D+), Tunsil (A+), Taylor Decker (B+), Ifedi (B+). Ifedi and Conklin 5th year options not picked up, mid 30's rank for the other guys. Even the first round is a crap shoot, these are young men who get millions and get dropped into different situations

The right guy FOCUSED ON GETTING BETTER, in the right fit, with the right coaching is very important. Not the name, the school, the experts. I have come around that Dillard probably was not the fit we need with the running game we want. Some reserve on air raid tackles.

We now have a competitive roster that is getting deeper, if we get our butt kicked, I say swap coaches. So time to let the broth simmer and see if it tastes good in a couple of years
 
steelbtexan said:
I dont think the former GM had a clue as to the type of OL the coaches wanted, hence he's the former GM. Gaine thought so much of the former GM's OL FA/Draft picks on the OL that he signed 3 OL in FA and drafted 3 OL in his 1st 2 yrs here.
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Yes he did come on dude you're hating again. When Kubiak was here we had a very good offensive line. Kubiak had a true actually plan and Smith went out and got the players K wanted.
 
CloakNNNdagger said:
Agree with all. Warring has proven his run blocking, but has yet to prove his pass blocking. Although now being in an offense with heavy dose of passing, and with the OC being the past TE coach, I believe he has the ability and the willingness to easily nail that part of his game down.
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I think you have some evidence to support your belief. He has to be a quick learner if he didn't play football 4 years ago and scouts are saying that his technique "is so good that it doesn't look real" (One of the talking heads on 610 said that a scout off the record told him that about Warring). I would tend to believe that he's a sponge and he can learn and adapt quickly.
 
Texansballer74 said:
Yes he did come on dude you're hating again. When Kubiak was here we had a very good offensive line. Kubiak had a true actually plan and Smith went out and got the players K wanted.
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The former GM was well schooled in the WC offense and ZBS from his days in Denver.

Not so much in the E-P system or the kind of OL that it takes to be successful. Hence he's not here.
 
Started to write but decided better not. Can someone tell me if there is a way to delete an entry I've started but not posted? I feel stupid writing "deleted".
 
HaveMercy said:
Started to write but decided better not. Can someone tell me if there is a way to delete an entry I've started but not posted? I feel stupid writing "deleted".
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If you navigate away, your reply will still show in the reply box until you finally post it or change it to something else. Or just do like the rest of us and post stuff you wish you hadn't.
 
Rich Schmidt said:
This go on the record stuff is just silly. let's look at 2016, 3 years ago and see what people were saying and how good we or the experts were. Take 1st round WR's and their draft grades, Corey Coleman (B), Will Fuller (F), Josh Doctson (A), Laquan Treadwell (A). Only Will was picked up 5th year, and the expert thought he was a horrible pick

How about OT. Conklin (D+), Tunsil (A+), Taylor Decker (B+), Ifedi (B+). Ifedi and Conklin 5th year options not picked up, mid 30's rank for the other guys. Even the first round is a crap shoot, these are young men who get millions and get dropped into different situations

The right guy FOCUSED ON GETTING BETTER, in the right fit, with the right coaching is very important. Not the name, the school, the experts. I have come around that Dillard probably was not the fit we need with the running game we want. Some reserve on air raid tackles.

We now have a competitive roster that is getting deeper, if we get our butt kicked, I say swap coaches. So time to let the broth simmer and see if it tastes good in a couple of years[/QUOTE




I don't want to beat a dead horse. The draft is over and it cannot be changed. I would guess that more pressure was upon the Texans to begin building a legitimately talented offensive line this year, than any previous year. Maybe due to the fact that we are so often ranked at, or near the bottom in offense .... or more likely, because our young QB is more and more frequently being referred to as a "franchise quarterback". We have needed to address the line since 2012 .... the year that Wade Smith, among others. went to the Pro Bowl. He played for 12 years in the NFL. He is a bright man .... most offensive lineman are. When addressing our need to begin rebuilding our offensive line, he said ......



"I think you're stealing if you can get Andre Dillard at 23. He's probably the best athlete in the draft," Wade said. "When you're comparing Andre Dillard to Jonah Williams, that's a tough comparison to make because you see Jonah Williams doing things that translate more to the NFL game in the run-game than you see out of Andre Dillard," Smith said. "But Andre Dillard does such a great job against all types of pass rushers... His footwork is immaculate."

"If I had to choose between those two, I would take Andre Dillard just because I personally like a guy that is really athletic, that has a bunch of pass protection reps... You can work on somebody and make them a better run blocker, as opposed to taking somebody that's a good run blocker and making him into a better pass protector. It's a little bit harder to do the other way."


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steelbtexan said:
I dont want anybody to fail. I want the Texans org to be the best org in the NFL instead of a mediocre franchise. I'm sorry if you dont like me calling them a mediocre franchise but that's exactly what they've been since their inception and will continue to be until they change the way they go about acquiring talent. What have you enjoyed about seeing this team being very content making a fortune and putting a mediocre product on the field at best, while having the 2nd most cap space in the NFL? Do you think this offseason the Texans org has done everything possible to put the best product on the field? If so this is where we disagree.

Please tell me how the Texans have changed the way they acquire players since Janice/Cal took over the franchise? I do like the fact that Gaine has made an attempt to fix the OL although I would've gone in a different direction when trying to fix the OL. (Starting with firing Devlin)
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Its the constant harping. Ok, we all get it by now. But you ain’t changing anything with it. I mean BG has just come on board and you are already writing him off. If you bother to read his interviews this guy is very clear how he is building his team. First he is a strong believer in building through the draft. He says you have to do that. So signing FA’s at this rebuilding stage while forsaking comp picks is back burner for now, but he is capable. Look at the HB signing. Then he BPA’d Reid because the safety position was as broken as the OL. Next he explicitly states he wants the Texans to get bigger, faster and longer. He is doing that, right? Where was Casserly and Smith ever so clear? He is putting all kinds of metrics out there by which he can be judged...putting his young career in full view. What else do you want? I mean the culture is changing before your very eyes. I believe where he is going with this is eventually plug and play. Right player, right position every draft as a goal to try to achieve consistency.
 
Seems to me that Gaine thinks we're not in win now mode...unless a lot of things go just right, which we'd all like but isn't likely. We're not just one or two of the right Free Agents from being contenders. Besides which, the FA's available this year were over priced and not the best fit here anyway.
So, he's taking a better path. He's building through a careful draft plan with an eye towards compensatory picks. That means Yes, I like our draft.

I like the approach Gaine is taking. The Texans are on a good trajectory. Now if the coaches can keep up their end...
 
steelbtexan said:
Do you think this is what happened with Kubiak/Gibbs and Kubiak was a much better offensive mind according to most including me around these parts.
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I think after a couple of years of "not working" Kubiak could/would challenge Gibbs. We're way beyond that & by now if BO'b hasn't realized Devlin ain't no Gibbs, we're in trouble.

Fingers crossed, hoping for best.
 
steelbtexan said:
The ol coach is picking his guys.

He worked out Howard 3 times.
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Provably just doing what he's told.

Gaine: "I want you to go look at this kid, tell me what you think."

Devlin: "Real nice kid. Had a Southern accent."

Gaine: "Go look again. Watch him play football."

Devlin: "Real nice kid. Can throw the ball 80 yards."

Gaine: "Work him out as an OL, we really like him... uh, take BO'b with you."
 
HaveMercy said:
Started to write but decided better not. Can someone tell me if there is a way to delete an entry I've started but not posted? I feel stupid writing "deleted".
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I use the backspace button. Keep holding it down until everything is gone.

Wait a couple seconds.

Hit refresh, then go about my day.

Sounds complicated, takes 5-10 seconds.
 
CloakNNNdagger said:
Delete the text and go to the disk icon to the left of the 2 arrowed semicirculars in the toolbar. Click on it and click "Delete Draft."
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Actually, you can go directly to the disk icon (without first deleting the text) and click on it and click "Delete Draft." Get out of the thread and the post will automatically be deleted.

[You will notice that if you just traditionally only simply delete the text........and leave the thread.........and come back to respond to another post in the same thread, the text you thought was deleted will reappear..........and you will have to delete it in order to make a clean new post.]
 
Dejaview said:
Its the constant harping. Ok, we all get it by now. But you ain’t changing anything with it. I mean BG has just come on board and you are already writing him off. If you bother to read his interviews this guy is very clear how he is building his team. First he is a strong believer in building through the draft. He says you have to do that. So signing FA’s at this rebuilding stage while forsaking comp picks is back burner for now, but he is capable. Look at the HB signing. Then he BPA’d Reid because the safety position was as broken as the OL. Next he explicitly states he wants the Texans to get bigger, faster and longer. He is doing that, right? Where was Casserly and Smith ever so clear? He is putting all kinds of metrics out there by which he can be judged...putting his young career in full view. What else do you want? I mean the culture is changing before your very eyes. I believe where he is going with this is eventually plug and play. Right player, right position every draft as a goal to try to achieve consistency.
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LMAO

I want him to do things other successful orgs do.
 
Norg said:
yeahhh to early wait 4 to 5 years so 2024 LOL is more of the time

how about yall grade 2015....

1 16 Kevin Johnson CB Wake Forest
2 43 Benardrick McKinney * ILB Mississippi State from Cleveland
3 70 Jaelen Strong WR Arizona State from New York Jets
5 175 Keith Mumphery WR Michigan State Compensatory pick
6 211 Reshard Cliett OLB South Florida Compensatory pick
6 216 Christian Covington DT Rice Compensatory pick
7 235 Kenny Hilliard RB LSU[/QUOTE


Love McKinney .... Loved Covington .... wish he were still here .... Kind of the way I feel about Mancz .... Hope he stays .... KJ always looked the part !
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Norg said:
yeahhh to early wait 4 to 5 years so 2024 LOL is more of the time

how about yall grade 2015....

1 16 Kevin Johnson CB Wake Forest
2 43 Benardrick McKinney * ILB Mississippi State from Cleveland
3 70 Jaelen Strong WR Arizona State from New York Jets
5 175 Keith Mumphery WR Michigan State Compensatory pick
6 211 Reshard Cliett OLB South Florida Compensatory pick
6 216 Christian Covington DT Rice Compensatory pick
7 235 Kenny Hilliard RB LSU
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That draft was utter trash, smh. At least B-Mac somewhat developed though. So, one hit (kinda) out of that entire class. Lord that’s awful...
 
Mangler said:
That draft was utter trash, smh. At least B-Mac somewhat developed though. So, one hit (kinda) out of that entire class. Lord that’s awful...
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There is a reason why the depth BG inherited was abysmal. Like he has stated numerous times, you have to build through the draft. Can’t sign enough UDFA’s or FA’s to cover that one. Ugh.
 
Dejaview said:
There is a reason why the depth BG inherited was abysmal. Like he has stated numerous times, you have to build through the draft. Can’t sign enough UDFA’s or FA’s to cover that one. Ugh.
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Only time will give us the real story if this draft, but from where we sit now, I'm thinking that we took big steps, about the best we could. And frankly, I'm impressed that Gaine didn't bow to the pressure to bring in overpriced Free Agents or get in a bidding war to move up one pick in the first round. On balance, I'm very pleased.
 
justmy2cents said:
Deja, you've been a member for a week, and you are already scolding folks ? I think you'll improve .... I'm pulling for ya !
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Keep pulling. Ain’t stopping. It would be nice to let someone express a little optimism some taking a shot. It’s not like anyone here has all the answers. But BG only has a little over one season under his belt. I’m just trying to show a little respect for those that actually have skin in the game.
 
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