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Olinemen in the 2019 draft.

I think Risner and McCoy have Combine'd themselves into serious RD1 consideration. Watching them on film would make any team needing OL help excited.....seeing both of them confirm those thoughts at the Combine potentially makes them special athletes.

If both guys make it to RD2, it's going to be early in RD2. First, I don't see either as a reach at #23....therefore, I'd be pretty pissed if they allowed both to go by at 23 unless of course, Dillard was still on the board. I'd draft Dillard and trade up for McCoy. Yes, this would drastically improve the OL for years to come.
 
Lucky said:
OK, but were you really comparing Bruce or Jake to Risner? I'm confused.
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JB said:
similar to who though?
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Actually, I liken his upside to Bruce. I think Risner could eventually play RT, RG or C at a top level in the NFL. It's not just the versatility but it's level he could potentially play at any of those positions. Smarts and tenacious are great attributes, toss in size and ability.....he's going to be a good one for years to come.
 
Lucky said:
I've always liked McCoy. But, I didn't know he was that good of an athlete. He may not make it to the Texans 2nd round pick. Howard has potential, but would probably need a redshirt year.
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Would you trade up to 43 for McCoy?

I think I might. They definitely need an upgrade over Martin.
 
OptimisticTexan said:
Actually, I liken his upside to Bruce. I think Risner could eventually play RT, RG or C at a top level in the NFL. It's not just the versatility but it's level he could potentially play at any of those positions. Smarts and tenacious are great attributes, toss in size and ability.....he's going to be a good one for years to come.
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I think making a comp for a prospect is helpful in relating traits, measurables, and skills without necessarily saying the prospect will have the career of the comparison player ... but when you compare a kid who isn't even a first round lock to one of the top few to ever play the position you run the risk of it being derailed by the sheer enormity it. You start wading into Harold Miner/Baby Jordan territory.

And I say that as a fan of Risner heading into pick 23.
 
OptimisticTexan said:
Funny you mentioned that....but I wouldn't be surprised if the Texans were to draft Risner and needed him to play LT that he just might be able to handle the move.
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Let's face it - you could take any of the top eight or so linemen from this draft and I suspect all of them would be an upgrade over Julien Davenport at LT.
And if they weren't, you could still probably move them around on the line and find a niche for them.
 
OptimisticTexan said:
Funny you mentioned that....but I wouldn't be surprised if the Texans were to draft Risner and needed him to play LT that he just might be able to handle the move.
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Let's face it - you could take any of the top dozen or so linemen from this draft and I suspect all of them would be an upgrade over Julien Davenport at LT.
And if they weren't, you could still probably move them around on the line and find a niche for them.
Edit - duplicate post.
 
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steelbtexan said:
Would you trade up to 43 for McCoy?

I think I might. They definitely need an upgrade over Martin.
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It may take a move like that, but It's difficult to say yes in a vacuum. Is McCoy the last player in that tier? Likely giving up a 3rd to make the move where there could still be a solid guy like Penn State's McGovern available. If I could use the other 2nd round pick to move down and recoup the traded pick, that would make the decision easier.
 
steelbtexan said:
Would you trade up to 43 for McCoy?

I think I might. They definitely need an upgrade over Martin.
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Lucky said:
It may take a move like that, but It's difficult to say yes in a vacuum. Is McCoy the last player in that tier? Likely giving up a 3rd to make the move where there could still be a solid guy like Penn State's McGovern available. If I could use the other 2nd round pick to move down and recoup the traded pick, that would make the decision easier.
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Personally, I would rather have McGovern, X, and a third than McCoy
 
Lucky said:
No, all are RTs. But, the Texans need help there, too.
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Yes of course we also need help at RT.
The thing is the Texans will probably only commit their top pick to an OT who's capable of playing on the left side and in this Draft that would be - Dillard, Little, or maybe SteelB's guy Yodny Cajuste, but Cajuste has injury/durability issues. Is there anybody else in this Draft who we could have reasonable expectations to start and help us at LT in the 2019 seson ?
I don't think Gaine is going to draft an offensive tackle @ 23 who's basically limited to playing on the right side.
 
IDEXAN said:
Yes of course we also need help at RT.
The thing is the Texans will probably only commit their top pick to an OT who's capable of playing on the left side and in this Draft that would be - Dillard, Little, or maybe SteelB's guy Yodny Cajuste, but Cajuste has injury/durability issues. Is there anybody else in this Draft who we could have reasonable expectations to start and help us at LT in the 2019 seson ?
I don't think Gaine is going to draft an offensive tackle @ 23 who's basically limited to playing on the right side.
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Not sure why you think this way
 
IDEXAN said:
Is there anybody else in this Draft who we could have reasonable expectations to start and help us at LT in the 2019 seson ?
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I think the wildcard is Jawaan Taylor. He's dropped 20 lbs, and looks to be moving much better. Putting him in the lineup day1 at LT would be tough. But, the potential is there. They could put him at swing OT, then if Davenport or whoever is at LT falters, Taylor might be ready. Taylor may have more upside than any OT in this draft.
 
Late to the game, just watching me some combine now. Think you guys are whittling the prospects down. Hopefully once defensive players showcase talent the spotlight fades off OL prospects. Texans could rebuild interior easily from this draft. Will have to reach and or get lucky to address OT after Dillard (who lacks conditioning and core strength) I don’t know? Think I like McCoy more than Little, think he could be plus RT in time. Davenport better be grinding his craft this offseason, improve balance and footwork.
 
Lucky said:
I think the wildcard is Jawaan Taylor. He's dropped 20 lbs, and looks to be moving much better. Putting him in the lineup day1 at LT would be tough. But, the potential is there. They could put him at swing OT, then if Davenport or whoever is at LT falters, Taylor might be ready. Taylor may have more upside than any OT in this draft.
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No disagreement here but he will be overdrafted based on potential, which means off the board before Texans.
 
Lucky said:
I think the wildcard is Jawaan Taylor. He's dropped 20 lbs, and looks to be moving much better. Putting him in the lineup day1 at LT would be tough. But, the potential is there. They could put him at swing OT, then if Davenport or whoever is at LT falters, Taylor might be ready. Taylor may have more upside than any OT in this draft.
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***
https://floridagators.com/roster.aspx?rp_id=11008
2018: Declared for the NFL Draft following the season… Played in all 13 games and started 12 at right tackle… Florida's offensive line allowed just 18 sacks over the course of the entire season, which ranked 20th in the country and third among SEC teams… Garnered Second Team All-SEC honors from Athlon Sports… Named to the SEC Academic Honor Roll…2017:Played and started in all 11 games… Started the first nine games at right tackle and the final two contests of the season at left tackle…
***
But I dunno looks like its a dubious proposition that he can be an NFL LT because apparently he didn't make it there in college at FLA as he played basically as their RT in '17 with two starts at the end of that season on the left side but he comes back in '18 and is back to playing RT so sounds like he got his shot on the left side but it was short-lived.
 
I think you can overthink on why Taylor didn’t play LT at Florida. The Gators had another guy at LT (Ivey). Try to flip them, and you may cause more short term damage than good. Colleges are there to win now, and if a prospect develops, great. But winning comes first. Had Taylor not come out as a junior, I’d bet he would have been moved to LT in the spring.
 
I have li
Lucky said:
I think the wildcard is Jawaan Taylor. He's dropped 20 lbs, and looks to be moving much better. Putting him in the lineup day1 at LT would be tough. But, the potential is there. They could put him at swing OT, then if Davenport or whoever is at LT falters, Taylor might be ready. Taylor may have more upside than any OT in this draft.
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I have liked Taylor for a while now but he is a fast riser on the various mocks so will likely be gone by #23.
Risner is a strong possibility to be there for us as is Ford.
Personally, there are a bunch of nice prospects who may or may not be better than Davenport, but that would contradict what we already know.
 
Texansphan said:
I have li

I have liked Taylor for a while now but he is a fast riser on the various mocks so will likely be gone by #23.
Risner is a strong possibility to be there for us as is Ford.
Personally, there are a bunch of nice prospects who may or may not be better than Davenport, but that would contradict what we already know.
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There are a bunch of OT prospects that are better than Davenport.
 
Lucky said:
It may take a move like that, but It's difficult to say yes in a vacuum. Is McCoy the last player in that tier? Likely giving up a 3rd to make the move where there could still be a solid guy like Penn State's McGovern available. If I could use the other 2nd round pick to move down and recoup the traded pick, that would make the decision easier.
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I could see where they might trade a 2nd for a 3rd and a 4th. Kinda like what the Texans did to trade up and get Nix.
 
Lucky said:
I think you can overthink on why Taylor didn’t play LT at Florida. The Gators had another guy at LT (Ivey). Try to flip them, and you may cause more short term damage than good. Colleges are there to win now, and if a prospect develops, great. But winning comes first. Had Taylor not come out as a junior, I’d bet he would have been moved to LT in the spring.
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On the contrary because I think it behooves Gaine (or any GM for that matter) to do their due diligence on any prospect for whom they are considering using their top Draft pick to acquire.
 
IDEXAN said:
On the contrary because I think it behooves Gaine (or any GM for that matter) to do their due diligence on any prospect for whom they are considering using their top Draft pick to acquire.
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When did I say anything contrary to doing "due diligence"?
 
Lucky said:
When did I say anything contrary to doing "due diligence"?
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Definition of overthink. : to think too much about (something) : to put too much time into thinking about or analyzing
***
OK then let me rephrase it: I definitely want and expect GM Gaine to overthink the credentials of any prospect he'd consider selecting with our first round pick to be our teams LT.
 
IDEXAN said:
Definition of overthink. : to think too much about (something) : to put too much time into thinking about or analyzing
***
OK then let me rephrase it: I definitely want and expect GM Gaine to overthink the credentials of any prospect he'd consider selecting with our first round pick to be our teams LT.
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My point is pretty simple. Just because Taylor did not play LT at the University of Florida doesn't necessarily mean he cannot play LT in the NFL. And I'm really referring to fans overthinking that, rather than the Texans front office and scouts. I'm pretty sure that is something they are very aware of.
 
Lucky said:
My point is pretty simple. Just because Taylor did not play LT at the University of Florida doesn't necessarily mean he cannot play LT in the NFL. And I'm really referring to fans overthinking that, rather than the Texans front office and scouts. I'm pretty sure that is something they are very aware of.
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I'm not suggesting he's incapable of playing LT but unless FLA had a southpaw QB last year, if Taylor was unable to crack their lineup at LT then this informs that even in his third year as a starting offensive tackle that at best he's no more than the second best offensive tackle on their team.
I dunno am I making a mountain out of a molehill, maybe ? It's just that I'm concerned it's possibly a red flag regarding his ability to be long-term starter as an NFL LT ?
Course a GM could take this approach: hey we think he can play LT but if not we are very confidant he's a 10-year starter in the league at RT.
 
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Lucky said:
No. Just in this instance, wrong. No team thinks Taylor was the 2nd best OT on the Florida o-line.
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If he's not playing LT then the guy who is is therefor probably a better pass-blocker which gets back to my basic point.
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8/28/18: Taylor played right tackle for the Gators last year and has impressed some team evaluators. "Taylor at Florida is very talented with size, movement skills, and strength," said one scout. "His stock could boom with a strong season. He needs to be more consistent though." In the final two games of the 2017 season, Taylor started at left tackle for Florida. If he can't play on the blind side, he could be a guard or right tackle in the NFL.

http://walterfootball.com/

So says the NFL analyst. Humm ?
Anyway the guy who was playing the blind side for FLA last year is named Martez Ievy and is in this Draft.
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Pass Protection- A major liability in pass protection at offensive tackle. Can be beaten by inside moves, inside jap steps to set up edge rushes and pure speed and bend around the corner. Hands are massive and often late. Bends at the waist and often sees his hands knocked down or frame push-pulled off-balance. For his size, startling inability to even make life tough on speed rushers by pushing them up the field. Does drop anchor against power and can completely shut down bull rushes.
https://thedraftnetwork.com/player/martez-ivey
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Yikes ! This Ivey dude sucks big-time but was the the Gators choice over Taylor to handle duties @ LT ?
 
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Brugler: NFL Scouting Combine Friday wrapup: Bradbury, Dillard dominate OL workouts

Extensive tape study will always be the backbone of a player’s scouting report, but there is tremendous value in the on-field drills at the scouting combine. The opportunity to break down a player’s movement skills (and how he takes direction) in person is an important step in the evaluation process. I spent Friday morning in the stands at Lucas Oil Stadium watching the big boys run around and perform both position-specific and nonfootball drills. Most players looked as expected, although several looked better while others disappointed. Let me reinforce that this is just a step (not a defining step) in the process.

Garrett Bradbury, OC, NC State (Height: 6-2 7/8, Weight: 306, Arms: 31 3/4)
Bradbury entered the combine as the No. 1 interior offensive line prospect in the 2019 NFL Draft and he leaves with the same distinction. The better question is just how high will the former tight end be drafted? A day after pumping 34 reps on the bench press, Bradbury ran one the fastest 40-yard dashes (4.92) among the offensive linemen, but more important, he was terrific in the positional drills. In the mirror drills, Bradbury showed off his effortless lateral range, keeping his eyes level and hands in an elevated punch position. There was zero labor in his movements. In the "wave" drill, which helps show a player’s change of direction skills, Bradbury looked clean with his lower body fluidity and core flexibility in motion. He also was impressive in the vertical jump (31 inches), surpassing the average among starting NFL interior blockers (28 inches). Bradbury was already in the first-round conversation and he only cemented that status Friday. For a zone-heavy offense, it wouldn’t be a surprise to see him come off the board in the top-20 picks.

Andre Dillard, OT, Washington (6-5, 315, 33 1/2)
An above-average athlete, there were high expectations for Dillard entering this week, and he either met or exceeded them on Friday. He looked outstanding in pass protection drills – quick pitter-patter feet and easy lower body movements. In the "short-pull power" drill, Dillard’s torso flexibility and loose hips were on display as the pulling lineman – advancing to the second level, engaging the linebacker (another lineman holding a shield) and driving him from the spot. This drill helps evaluate the hips and movement skills of a lineman, but also their overall body balance, requiring them to use their eyes, hands and lower body in unison. And Dillard looked flawless in this drill, achieving his balance and allowing his natural biomechanics do the work. He also crushed the broad jump with a 09’10" jump, which is much better than the average for tackles in the NFL (08’08"). Dillard has the best feet among the offensive linemen in this draft with outstanding lower body flexibility, which could push his draft value in the top half of Round one.

Erik McCoy, OG/C, Texas A&M (6-3 7/8, 303, 33)
I despise using the word "safe" when it comes to NFL prospects, but McCoy comes close to a safe prospect. He might not be explosive on tape, but his initial quickness is outstanding, which was clear on the field at Lucas Oil Stadium on Friday. McCoy looked smooth in pass protection drills on an island, beating rushers to the spot with natural knee bend. In the "wave" drill, he moved well with smooth shuffle-and-drive footwork, and in pulling drills, his hip flexibility and ability to open up really stood out compared to the other participants. I don’t know if McCoy, who ran the fastest 40-yard dash (4.89) among the linemen, will ever make a Pro Bowl in his NFL career, but I think he will be a rock-solid starter on the interior for a long time. He is competing with Mississippi State’s Elgton Jenkins to be the second center off the board.

Jonah Williams, OT/G, Alabama (6-4 1/2, 302, 33 5/8)
Much of the conversation around Williams has been about his lack of ideal length and whether he will play tackle or guard in the NFL. But on Friday, none of that mattered as he had the chance to show off his movements and technique. In the "pass pro rush" drill, Williams flew out of his stance with the quick feet to handle speed. While others were able to do the same, Williams did an excellent job keeping his hands high, tight and in a punch position, which is extremely important. It is great if a blocker has lower body athleticism to shut down the corner, but it doesn’t mean much if the hands are late to cut off rush speed. That wasn’t a problem for Williams who was always in a "ready" position. Williams doesn’t look like the prototypical left tackle, but that shouldn’t matter. Based on his tape and combine performance, teams shouldn’t hesitate if they have a need at tackle. Williams has the movements (feet, knees, hips) and muscle memory with his technically sound approach that project him as an NFL starter.

Other quick hits:

  • Chris Lindstrom, OG, Boston College (6-3 3/4, 308, 34 1/8)
    – Lindstrom ran the second-fastest 40-yard dash (4.91) among the linemen and his agility was on full display during position drills. He doesn’t labor when unlocking his hips to adjust in space, showing why he could be a top-40 prospect in April.
  • Elgton Jenkins, OG/C, Mississippi State (6-4 1/2, 310, 34)
    – Jenkins looked a tad heavy in the movement drills, but in the closed quarter action like "short pull" drill, that is where he looked most comfortable. His impressive lower body power and leg drive were on full display.
  • Kaleb McGary, OT, Washington (6-7 1/8, 317, 32 7/8)
    – McGary was up and down during his drills. He has nimble feet and moves well, but his pass sets are tall and narrow, which was clear in the kickslide drills. McGary can bend, but he needs to do it more consistently in his initial sets to cut off speed.
  • Dru Samia, OG, Oklahoma (6-4 3/4, 305, 33)
    – What I love about offensive line workouts at the clombine is the ability to evaluate blocker’s hips. And Samia’s ability to open up his hips and use power were impressive during drills. He stays balanced in his lateral movements.
  • Bobby Evans, OT/G, Oklahoma (6-4 3/8, 312, 34 3/4)
    – While Samia and Cody Ford looked strong among the Oklahoma offensive linemen, Evans wasn’t nearly as clean in his movements, appearing tight in his lower body. His upper and lower body seemed to be on different pages as well.
  • Yodny Cajuste, OT, West Virginia (6-4 7/8, 312, 34)
    – Cajuste was limited on Friday and didn’t perform a full workout, but he was unimpressive in the drills he did do, appearing off-balance and wild. In several ways, that matches the tape and why he could still be available on Day Three of the draft in April.
  • Hjalte Froholdt, OG, Arkansas (6-4 5/8, 306, 31 1/4)
    – An offensive lineman I would be targeting on Day Three of the NFL Draft, Froholdt is clearly still connecting the dots, but his movement skills and redirection are terrific. He is a talented blocker worth stashing and developing on the depth chart.
  • Tyler Jones, OG, NC State (6-3, 306, 33 3/4)
    – One of my favorite "sleepers" in this draft class, Jones played left tackle for the Wolfpack, but his skill-set projects best at guard. He labored some in his redirection, but his lateral quickness and lower body bend were clean.
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IDEXAN said:
If he's not playing LT then the guy who is is therefor probably a better pass-blocker which gets back to my basic point.
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8/28/18: Taylor played right tackle for the Gators last year and has impressed some team evaluators. "Taylor at Florida is very talented with size, movement skills, and strength," said one scout. "His stock could boom with a strong season. He needs to be more consistent though." In the final two games of the 2017 season, Taylor started at left tackle for Florida. If he can't play on the blind side, he could be a guard or right tackle in the NFL.

http://walterfootball.com/

So says the NFL analyst. Humm ?
Anyway the guy who was playing the blind side for FLA last year is named Martez Ievy and is in this Draft.
&&&
Pass Protection- A major liability in pass protection at offensive tackle. Can be beaten by inside moves, inside jap steps to set up edge rushes and pure speed and bend around the corner. Hands are massive and often late. Bends at the waist and often sees his hands knocked down or frame push-pulled off-balance. For his size, startling inability to even make life tough on speed rushers by pushing them up the field. Does drop anchor against power and can completely shut down bull rushes.
https://thedraftnetwork.com/player/martez-ivey
&&&
Yikes ! This Ivey dude sucks big-time but was the the Gators choice over Taylor to handle duties @ LT ?
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Ivey is an OG that played LT. Big strong dude that can move his feet pretty well, but his hand placement and technique were awful. Plus he had stamina issues. I think he could play RT in the NFL with alot of work and proper coaching. I doubt he's going to be willing to put in the work.
 
zshawn10 said:
Brugler: NFL Scouting Combine Friday wrapup: Bradbury, Dillard dominate OL workouts
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1. Dillard might’ve performed himself out of our draft range unless we decide to trade up. He’s a top tackle prospect.
2. Because of the NFL’s affinity for length at the tackle position, Williams possibly might drop to us. It’s a slim chance, but it’s possible. I’d draft him in a heartbeat if that were the case.
3. I like McGary as a day 2 prospect for us. He’ll be a right tackle for a long time coming.
4. Froholdt is a player I’ve been keeping an eye on as one of our day 3 picks.
 
steelbtexan said:
Ivey is an OG that played LT. Big strong dude that can move his feet pretty well, but his hand placement and technique were awful. Plus he had stamina issues. I think he could play RT in the NFL with alot of work and proper coaching. I doubt he's going to be willing to put in the work.
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So why would an offensive lineman who's basically a guard and not very highly regarded at that be playing LT instead of the highly egarded Jawaan Taylor who's plying RT ?
Sounds to me like the guard/Ivey playing LT is more highly valued as a pass-protector by the coachs than his teammate at RT, Jawaan Taylor.
 
IDEXAN said:
So why would an offensive lineman who's basically a guard and not very highly regarded at that be playing LT instead of the highly egarded Jawaan Taylor who's plying RT ?
Sounds to me like the guard/Ivey playing LT is more highly valued as a pass-protector by the coachs than his teammate at RT, Jawaan Taylor.
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I really cant exlain this,

But I'm guessing that Ivey was more comfortable on the left side and Taylor was more comfortable on the right side. If Taylor can play both sides and Ivey can only play the left side then you put Ivey on the left side and Taylor on the right side so you can your best OL on the field at positions they are most comfortable.
 
steelbtexan said:
Agreed

How much higher

What do you think about Greedy falling as unlikely as that is?

I could see Greedy going as high as Tampa @5 or Detroit @8.
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.

Idea is to select BPA hence it will most likely be a defensive linemen, let other teams reach for need. Spend money in free agency to improve OL.

Reviewing OL class off combine for like 6th time and no prospect is conclusive with 23rd pick (excluding Andre Dillard and Jawaan Taylor).
 
beerlover said:
.

Idea is to select BPA hence it will most likely be a defensive linemen, let other teams reach for need. Spend money in free agency to improve OL.

Reviewing OL class off combine for like 6th time and no prospect is conclusive with 23rd pick (excluding Andre Dillard and Jawaan Taylor).
Click to expand...

I totally agree, but I doubt Gaine feels this way.

I know you have to be happy with reports of Gaine thinking about trading back.
 
beerlover said:
.

Idea is to select BPA hence it will most likely be a defensive linemen, let other teams reach for need. Spend money in free agency to improve OL.

Reviewing OL class off combine for like 6th time and no prospect is conclusive with 23rd pick (excluding Andre Dillard and Jawaan Taylor).
Click to expand...
Yes, yes agree with all of that as it's a truly powerhouse Draft this year in the defensive line (hey the backers aren't too shabby either).
 
beerlover said:
.

Idea is to select BPA hence it will most likely be a defensive linemen, let other teams reach for need. Spend money in free agency to improve OL.

Reviewing OL class off combine for like 6th time and no prospect is conclusive with 23rd pick (excluding Andre Dillard and Jawaan Taylor).
Click to expand...
Comes down to coaching also.
For instance, how many of the top olinemen in the last ten years had "perfect" profiles coming out of college?
 
Devlin was coaching some drills @ Combine for OL. Mostly focusing on get off, mobility and quickness. 2nd and 3rd rounds more likely, to grab OL. Davenport strengths coming out was size/measureable and intelligence. I know that doesn't give us much to work with, since they don't release wonderlic scores now but Julie'n scored a good score 29 back in 2017.
 
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