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O'Brien You need to deliver... yesterday.
- Thread starter 76Texan
- Start date
Gorgeous redheads never get old!
gs27
Veteran
I'm afraid that O'Brien would get our QB killed.
Come to think of it; how many of the Texans QBs had been on the shell with him as the HC so far?
On the 3rd and 7 with less than 4 minutes to go in the first quarter, he had the C and the RG double teaming the NT.
Grimes (all 209 lbs of him) was left to pick up Laurinaitis (who was listed between 248 and 255).
Normally, it's something a back needs to be able to do.
However, with Laurinaitis already on the LOS, this play has a better chance of success if it was some sort of a quick throw.
In this case, the ball left Osweiler's hand somewhere around the 2.5-sec mark, with Laurinaitis' arm stretching out, obstructing the throwing lane.
There wasn't any short route that can develop quickly enough for Osweiler;
asking a small RB to hold up too long is never a good-percentage play.
One can also argue that since Osweiler is so tall, his set-up takes a bit more time. All that, together with his long wind-up, only makes it harder for the play to succeed.
If O'Brien continues to put his players in similar positions... Grrr; I don't even want to think about it.
Come to think of it; how many of the Texans QBs had been on the shell with him as the HC so far?
On the 3rd and 7 with less than 4 minutes to go in the first quarter, he had the C and the RG double teaming the NT.
Grimes (all 209 lbs of him) was left to pick up Laurinaitis (who was listed between 248 and 255).
Normally, it's something a back needs to be able to do.
However, with Laurinaitis already on the LOS, this play has a better chance of success if it was some sort of a quick throw.
In this case, the ball left Osweiler's hand somewhere around the 2.5-sec mark, with Laurinaitis' arm stretching out, obstructing the throwing lane.
There wasn't any short route that can develop quickly enough for Osweiler;
asking a small RB to hold up too long is never a good-percentage play.
One can also argue that since Osweiler is so tall, his set-up takes a bit more time. All that, together with his long wind-up, only makes it harder for the play to succeed.
If O'Brien continues to put his players in similar positions... Grrr; I don't even want to think about it.
WolverineFan
Hall of Fame
Every team in the league asks 210 lb RB's to pick up LB blitzers.
Texecutioner
Hall of Fame
Oh great we've got the former Texans fan back in here to make up a ton of lies about the Kubiak era all over again. What difference does it make if Manning was in the division. That is 2 games a year genius. Ever think about the other 14? What a ridiculous excuse. It doesn't take teams 6 years to create a good team. OB already proved that wrong in his first year as well as a ton of other coaches around the league did that were hired the same year Kubiak was. Kubiak's first good Texans team was good mainly because of the defense that Wade brought that first year. Basically you could look at Kubiak's entire existence as a HC, and the majority of his team's successes have been mainly on the defensive side of the ball where Wade's coaching was the difference. Kubiak should be paying half his salary to Wade when you think about it. Without Wade, Kubiak's HC career would be a complete disaster. Poor Wade can't get another HC job either all because of his last stint in Dallas that was actually pretty good overall.
Texecutioner
Hall of Fame
Don't waste your time dude. He is nothing but an angry Aggie who is still butt hurt about Kubiak failing here and getting his walking papers. He hates the current Texans and desperately wants to see OB fall on his face as the HC here. He has been invested in that scenario since Kubiak was released.
Hey, Tex.
Where would O'Brien be without the Texans defense, particularly J.J. Watt?
Pray tell me.
Pardon my language, but at times, you can be too passionate (many of us are) you can get too personal (or at least, sound personal to others).
You cannot simply dismiss a person's statement because you happen to disagree with it; worse, by attacking him being an angry Aggie.
It's called "Argumentum ad hominem".
I must say such argument is not only weak, but uncalled for.
Where would O'Brien be without the Texans defense, particularly J.J. Watt?
Pray tell me.
Pardon my language, but at times, you can be too passionate (many of us are) you can get too personal (or at least, sound personal to others).
You cannot simply dismiss a person's statement because you happen to disagree with it; worse, by attacking him being an angry Aggie.
It's called "Argumentum ad hominem".
I must say such argument is not only weak, but uncalled for.
Texecutioner
Hall of Fame
Apparently you forgot that the Texans were last in the league on defense before he got here. They had record setting lows on defense that year. The very next season their defense made a huge turn around and you seem to be conveniently ignoring that. OB had no QB when he arrived and his best weapon on offense was an aging WR that was damn near done, and an aging RB that was as well. His entire offense needed to be stripped down, and he still didn't get a QB drafted by the GM even with Bortles and Carr sitting right there. Our GM made one of the worst #1 draft picks in NFL history and wasted it. Interesting how you ignore all of that when discussing the offense and the major improvement that OB's staff created with the defense right away. Your question was here makes you seem uninformed honestly.
We're talking about a guy that has routinely came in here and bashed OB and the Texans from day one since he was hired all because he can't get over Gary Kubiak's firing. This guy has repeatedly trashed the organization for firing an 8 year HC who went 2-14 when he was let go, and has had a vendetta against the new guy all because of that. Damn near every time he posts it is some butt hurt complaints about what happened with Kubiak that he refuses to get over, so spare me with the attempt to denounce my criticisms for a guy that won't admit how badly he wants the Texans to fail while acting like he is a fan.
Dude, your entire thread is weak. Lol! We aren't even in weak one of the season and you're already trying to put the HC who has done reasonably well here on the hot seat when nothing has even happened yet. Its no wonder you're sticking up for the disgruntled Aggie that wants the Texans to crash and burn over Kubiak. Not surprising at all.
I think the radio in the QBs helmet goes dead with less than 25 seconds on the clock. I don't see how you can blame what you saw on O'b.
Texecutioner
Hall of Fame
I remember hearing a lot about that defense breaking records for points allowed at the time. The entire defense mailed it in that season. They were dreadful. Either way, you're splitting hairs by trying to compare them. They were both trash. You tried to give all the credit to the Texans defense and Watt for the success OB had in his first two seasons, but failed to acknowledge that OB inherited a unit that was arguably the worst in the entire league the year before and didn't give him or his staff any credit at all for turning that unit around so quickly. That unit's effectiveness and turnaround has to be credited to the coaching staff if the offensive struggles are going to be credited towards the staff as well.
Ok, so which thread would you like to tackle first? O'Brien or Osweiler?
We did have a good argument over Cam Newton the year he got drafted, right? We disagreed on things, but we never took anything personal, right?
There you go, stirring the pot again while seeming to aim at a different target, hhahahahaha.
Texecutioner
Hall of Fame
We're all good man. You threw a shot or two at me in the other thread. I retaliated. No love loss man.
I guess I'm just sort of used to that now since the Mods don't really moderate here anymore.
If I remember right you were big on that Cam wagon. Am I right? I was dead wrong on Cam Newton, and he has proven me wrong big time.
The most important thing though was that we had a football argument; never a personal attack.We're all good man. You threw a shot or two at me in the other thread. I retaliated. No love loss man.
I guess I'm just sort of used to that now since the Mods don't really moderate here anymore.
If I remember right you were big on that Cam wagon. Am I right? I was dead wrong on Cam Newton, and he has proven me wrong big time.
Texecutioner
Hall of Fame
The most important thing though was that we had a football argument; never a personal attack.
We still can. It doesn't have to be that way. I have tons of great debates on here that don't get that way. It is only about 10 posters in here where I exchange negative remarks with sometimes. Again, we don't really have moderating on this site anymore. It doesn't exist. For the record though, I'd buy just about anyone in here a beer in person and would likely laugh about all of the bullshit we argue about in here. I've had several posters that I respect the hell out of in here insult me really badly, but I also realize that discussions over the internet tend to come off different and more personal than if it was in person.
But back to the subject, if you read my posts on Oz, I think we'd probably agree more about his skill set than to disagree. I just don't understand why you are so dead set against OB this early. He finally has a ton of offensive weapons and a QB he wanted. It is put up or shut up time for OB for sure. We will finally see what he is capable of putting together as an offensive minded coach.
The mentality that O'Brien was "gift wrapped" a great team is bizarre (and it flies against the Bill Parcells logic of "you are what your record says you are").
Why did Kubiak take a 12-4 team to 2-14 within a year if that team was so "great"?
The answer is that the 2-14 team had fundamental problems. A collection of decent players does not make a good team, it just makes it a collection of decent players.
Why did Kubiak take a 12-4 team to 2-14 within a year if that team was so "great"?
The answer is that the 2-14 team had fundamental problems. A collection of decent players does not make a good team, it just makes it a collection of decent players.
infantrycak
Hall of Fame
Gift wrapped is an exaggeration. What folks are saying is actually critical of Kubiak/Wade - with the talent that was on the team they dramatically underperformed. It was not a typical 2-14 team talent wise. There were key injuries and WB implosion but that goes back to them for not having better backups.
I agree, but some folks use it as a criticism of O'Brien and sort of a perplexing reason why he coached a 9-7 season his first year. Personally, I think he over-achieved with that team, all things considered.
There is plenty of reasons to be critical of O'Brien, but fans should also give him props where it is due. Nobody would have blinked an eye if that had been a 5-11 or 6-10 team his first season.
Sorry, but I fully expected a hell of a better season.
Tell me, what did you vote on one those PS pollls?
But really, to accept more of the status quo can be your choice, but not mine.
You expected a better season with Fitzpatrick as our starting QB? You do realize that Fitz has never been to a playoff game in his decade+ career, yeah?
I think you are just reaching for reasons to be critical of O'Brien at this point. You appear to have lost all objectivity.
But, then again, you are the one starting a thread demanding better results in the past, so not sure what I expected even participating in this thread.
And gtfo with that utter bullshit "accept more of the status quo can be your choice". What other choice do you have, stop being a fan? Bitch and whine more? Oh, I know, I'm calling Ted Johnson on the radio!! Just laughable.
Good, I see you're encouraging my renegade vain.
We'll get to it in a minute.
So let's say, you were happy that O'brien brought in Fitz?
I don't want to jump on a conclusion.
It would help to know what position we take on a particular point.
Speedy
Former Yeller Dweller
I wasn't happy with Fitz, damn sure wasn't happy with Hoyer. Even made it known on these here boards. Did it change one damn thing with the Texans? No. So your status quo comment is pretty stupid. Whether you're lollipops and rainbows, whether you're Debbie Downer, it doesn't matter at all because it changes nothing. You can go on and on about Osweiler and O'Brien, but it changes nothing. And neither does being a condescending ass to those who don't share your view.
There you go, stirring the pot again while seeming to aim at a different target, hhahahahaha.
Stirring the pot?
Just saying, you can't b... nvm
I hated Fitz. He was always one of my examples of why we should support Schaub before he became a pick 6 machine.
However, by the end of the season, I started to respect the guy (Fitz). Dude was certainly a competitor.
Never liked Hoyer and still don't to this day. I hate his face....in that football bubble sort of way (I've got nothing against the actual person).
These abysmal choices made me start to look bigger picture and realize that from year to year, there's just not a lot to choose from.
Good QBs are a rarity. Which is why I'm willing to take a leap of faith with my team's decision to go all in with Brock. If he sucks, he sucks. But what fun is it to be Debbie Downer all the time before we actually find out what he's about? Right now it's just speculation and assumptions to have a hard opinion either way.
Texan_fan_13
Needed: OL now that we have a QB worth it
Kubiak and Gruden two coachs that won the superbowl with someone else's team.
I voted for more wins, but I thought Fitz would be benched by game 3... 4 at the least & I hoped, wished, & prayed Mallett would take the job & pwn it.
I thought Mallet was going to be a badass. It was a punch to the gut as a fan that he turned out to be such a jackass. I blame O'Brien for that one.
Regardless of anybody's expectation IMO, it is you that lost al objectivity.
(It is very easy to say one way or another, you see.)
What other choice... well, I'm sorry
I can respect what you're saying, even though I totally disagree.
Now there's a thought.
But wait, in your own words "if he sucks, he sucks".
I am very sorry that you ask me to be positive.
Please explain. My mind reads it as babble.
I can explain my own point. You are demanding something "yesterday". The past is history.
WTF does your thread title even mean?
I'm not asking you to be anything. I'm simply stating my own chosen perspectives. You asked and then reply with this? I get more honest answers from my 7 yo.
At this point, you seem like you are attempting to troll but are not very good at it. Good luck with all that. I see your threads are not really where I should spend my finite time, so you are free to have the last word and I'll just avoid them altogether.
You're putting words in my mouth when you said certain things.
Just be
The thing is you cannot ask another long-time Oilers/Texans fan to "behave" the way you do.
It's totally "Unamerican.".
Just be
Everything that you said here.
The thing is you cannot ask another long-time Oilers/Texans fan to "behave" the way you do.
It's totally "Unamerican.".
Now, I'd be frank.
We need to keep score here.
And it's not about being right.
I do not expect this from you.
But it seems that you're calling me out.
Right?
Maybe we should ask why the previous coaches didn't win with their team! If it's essentially the same team why didn't they win the SB the year before? One of those previous coaches just went into the HOF too!
Texecutioner
Hall of Fame
Easy answer for the Broncos. They had a great defense and they got close the year before. Wade came in there and made their defense one of the best of all time rivaling the Ravens, Bears, and the Bucs. Monte Kiffin did something similar in Tampa when Gruden went there if I'm not mistaken. Gruden seemed like a great coach in Oakland. He got exposed badly after several years in Tampa though.
TexansFight
Veteran
Really? What you are feeling is where I was last year. Brian Hoyer nearly killed my Texans fandom. I had no excitement or enthusiasm for the season with that piece of **** as our starter. We have at least achance now and have some really intriguing new pieces on offense. Give it a go. As for picking teams, I'm on Team Texian. I would much rather have him as our GM over Rick.
infantrycak
Hall of Fame
Except he would have traded our next two drafts+ to move up and get one of the top 2 picks. Didn't think you favored that.
Fred
Veteran
Actually 2-14 would have been status quo. "A hell of lot better" than 9-7 wouldn't be 10-6 or even 11-5. So you were expecting a new coach to take over a 2-14 team and get 12 to 14 wins the first year? When the previous regime had stuck him with D Hop, who (according to you) would never be a #1 receiver?
WolverineFan
Hall of Fame
Mallet was a jackass long before he got to Houston. Not sure how that's on O'Brien.
Texian
Hall of Fame
Then I assume that Mallett was a jackass in New England at the time he was being coached by O'Brien.
Texian
Hall of Fame
That's not entirely true, first I would not have fired Kubiak but would have released Matt Schaub instead. Then I would have drafted Blake Bortles instead of Jadeveon Clowney eliminating any need for trading any draft picks in 2016. And based on my fantasy draft history the Texans would also have a Offensive Line that would rival the Dallas Cowboys.
WolverineFan
Hall of Fame
That's a fair point. Mallet had a history in college and it showed up again here in Houston but I don't recall him having any issues in NE. That said, Belichick rarely has issues with players.
I figured that O'Brien brought Mallet here because he was the Patriot's OC when they drafted him in 2011. He was part of the coaching staff that conducted draft talent evaluation and worked with him for his entire rookie season. Unless Mallet became more immature in the subsequent years, O'Brien whiffed on knowing the guy's obvious personality flaws....or maybe thought he could coach them out of the guy.
But, it's not a big deal, just a minor criticism. In the end, it's a results driven business, and the fact that he's posted back-to-back 9-7 seasons his first two years is a positive to me. He just needs to build on it in 2016.
Yeah. Just imagine if they were back-to-back 8-8 seasons. We'd already be seeing the pink soap dishes!
infantrycak
Hall of Fame
Well I was only talking about last year but since you are taking it back to 2014 I suspect you lost most of your disciples when you said keep Kubiak.
Texecutioner
Hall of Fame
Yeah, it is pretty ridiculous to act like OB has been a bad coach with back to back 9-7 seasons after taking over a 2-14 team where he was going to do a pretty big overhaul of the roster. Every coach does that for the most part especially once they assemble their coaching staff. You can't make all players fit every system, and some players just play much better and harder for a coach they are comfortable with. Examples like Keyshawn Johnson/Parcells, Daniels/Kubiak come to mind. 9-7 with all the different trios at QB and then no running game last season shows that OB was able to make lots of adjustments and changes that worked after making early mistakes that didn't work.
This year he finally has the QB he wanted a lot of weapons to run the offense with real weapons. If he can't put together a top offense by from weeks 8-16 that can go into next year as a top tier offense, then OB will likely be let go after this year or next. It is put up or shut up time now that he has his QB and quite a few weapons. We will finally see how good of an offensive coach he can really be. Anyone trying to pick apart every problem they had on offense the last two seasons without a capable QB is just looking for reasons to hate on the guy.
He'd probably get a pass from most of is had he not chosen to start Hoyer against the poor Jags defense to prepare him for the KC playoff defense.
Then start Hoyer against KC.
Texecutioner
Hall of Fame
No way he'd get pass simply by that. There have been a number of people on this site that have hated him since day one because they were so in love with Kubiak and were angry about Kubiak getting canned. It wouldn't have mattered who the HC was. They were going to get unfairly criticized. Hoyer was an ugly FA pick up, but so would have just about all the other guys in the off season. OB was also kind of screwed the season before, because Mallet got hurt and we never really got to see what we had in him until that next season so they still had a hopeful belief that he could possibly come in and make it work. I think he felt okay with those two options going into the season with everything else they had a shot at which wasn't much.
Doesn't matter now. What's done is done. At least we've got game one in 3 weeks.
infantrycak
Hall of Fame
Careful, your betrothed might get angry. Texian wanted to keep Kubiak.
Texecutioner
Hall of Fame
You must still be bothered from the other thread to be trying to troll this hard Cak. Or is it Texian that got you all worked up? This attempt is low rent.
