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The All Encompassing FIRE KUBIAK & REPLACEMENT thread

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Rey said:
No one is looking at schaub and thinking...I think there's something I can work with there...I want him to qb my team to a superbowl....no one but us at least...
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the last thing a lesser team is looking for in the present is a superbowl qb.

you would be amazed at how many fanbases just want to be in the position the texans are in with schaub or even just win games.

schaub can win games, he's just not a qb to carry a team at that next level.

contrary to popular belief here some people still consider schaub a decent qb.
 
Fiddler said:
But, do you think Tom Coughlin can win a Super Bowl?

I know most people will say, "You can't compare Coughlin to Kubiak, Coughlin has won two Super Bowls & Kubiak has won nothing."

But my point, is that guy is the same guy he was before he won two Super Bowls.
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Not true. There's an NFL Films special on Coughlin and the NYG the year that they won their first SB with him. A significant part of time was spent talking about what a different coach he had become. He changed.

Not getting into how that pertains to Kubiak, but your point is fundamentally flawed.
 
eriadoc said:
Not true. There's an NFL Films special on Coughlin and the NYG the year that they won their first SB with him. A significant part of time was spent talking about what a different coach he had become. He changed.

Not getting into how that pertains to Kubiak, but your point is fundamentally flawed.
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I'm sure there would be a lot of people waxing about the changes Kubiak has undergone his last few years here if anyone wanted to do a documentary on Kubiak.

But that Coughlin that was fired by the Jags, was the same Coughlin that coached a three game losing streak that ended his defending super Bowl champs play off hopes.
 
thunderkyss said:
I'm sure there would be a lot of people waxing about the changes Kubiak has undergone his last few years here if anyone wanted to do a documentary on Kubiak.

But that Coughlin that was fired by the Jags, was the same Coughlin that coached a three game losing streak that ended his defending super Bowl champs play off hopes.
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Sure, but the Coughlin that people think of, the guy that laid into is players for not being early enough, didn't win a Super Bowl. He had to change to adjust to his players.
 
thunderkyss said:
I'm sure there would be a lot of people waxing about the changes Kubiak has undergone his last few years here if anyone wanted to do a documentary on Kubiak.

But that Coughlin that was fired by the Jags, was the same Coughlin that coached a three game losing streak that ended his defending super Bowl champs play off hopes.
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Coughlin also took an expansion team (those Jags you mention) to the AFC Championship if you want to do your homework.
 
I foresee cowher in our future. Maybe it's just me but after watching him interview Watt yesterday, I believe he wants this job. He is in love with Watt. Couldn't say enough good things about him.

Before the game he was saying how Kubiak needs to think outside the box for this game. Can't stay with his normal play calling. I don't know why but it just seems like everything is falling in place for us to get him.

Obviously Kubes is going to get another year most likely 2 no matter what. Cowher announced that he wanted another couple years off before he returned to coaching. Bet he would change his mind real fast if Kubiak got canned.
 
I see what you guys have been talking about. Didn't like the play calling, thought the gameplan was conservative. I don't know how you fire a guy that is in the playoffs two years in a row, even if Houston squandered a 1 seed.

Shaub is good enough in my opinion, but Kubiak... :dontknowa
 
Foxboro Steve said:
I see what you guys have been talking about. Didn't like the play calling, thought the gameplan was conservative. I don't know how you fire a guy that is in the playoffs two years in a row, even if Houston squandered a 1 seed.

Shaub is good enough in my opinion, but Kubiak... :dontknowa
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I agree with this. Schaub isn't Brady or Rogers, but Schaub has played much better in the past. If there is something concrete that would lead me to believe Schaub can't be that guy, then I'd be onboard with moving on.

Kubiak on the other hand... I could understand if more people were looking at him as they criticize this game. I don't understand the focus on Schaub, other than seeing all these young'ns run around & make this QB thing look easy.

Schaub has a list of strengths & a list of weaknesses. I don't think Kubiak has done a good job of putting his QB in a position to succeed. Everyone told us what the Patriots weakness was. TEs over the middle, their secondary...

At the end of the half, we attacked that weakness & we were able to move the ball much better in that 4 minute period than we had the entire half. I thought Gary "saw" that. I thought Gary "woke up"

But after the half, we put that approach on the back burners & went right back to what did not work. I saw Matt Schaub escape the pocket by throwing a stiff arm at a DE/LB... he got out clean to the flat. Did not set his feet, did not locate a receiver, did not deliver the ball down field. Did not "make a play" I'm watching that & with everything else I saw, I'm left with the idea that Kubiak was looking at that & said,"That's it Matt, next time we'll make that throw."

& that's just absurd.
 
If you want to fire a coach, look at Wade. His defense gives up points.

I don't think anyone not named Coach Joe should be fired, but there is plenty of blame to go around on this loss.

But this is a pointless thread, because McNair is not Bud Adams and he will not fire his HC after a playoff loss.

And Kubiak loves him some Schaub, so expect status quo in 2013 with some draft additions that may or may not contribute on the field next season.

What is obvious is that the Houston Texas are a second tier team, one that can look good against regular season opponents and earn a playoff spot, but they are far from a team that can or will assert their will on opponents in the post-season. The best we can hope for at this point is that the other team makes mistakes that we can capitalize on, which they cannot even consistently do that right now.
 
Double Barrel said:
If you want to fire a coach, look at Wade. His defense gives up points.

I don't think anyone not named Coach Joe should be fired, but there is plenty of blame to go around on this loss.

But this is a pointless thread, because McNair is not Bud Adams and he will not fire his HC after a playoff loss.

And Kubiak loves him some Schaub, so expect status quo in 2013 with some draft additions that may or may not contribute on the field next season.

What is obvious is that the Houston Texas are a second tier team, one that can look good against regular season opponents and earn a playoff spot, but they are far from a team that can or will assert their will on opponents in the post-season. The best we can hope for at this point is that the other team makes mistakes that we can capitalize on, which they cannot even consistently do that right now.
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The Texans are like a mom and pop marketing shop who will not get rid of their cousin , nephew , or son unless they really really screw up . In fact they'll give them an extension even when they don't deserve it . :boogereater:
 
Double Barrel said:
If you want to fire a coach, look at Wade. His defense gives up points.

I don't think anyone not named Coach Joe should be fired, but there is plenty of blame to go around on this loss.

But this is a pointless thread, because McNair is not Bud Adams and he will not fire his HC after a playoff loss.

And Kubiak loves him some Schaub, so expect status quo in 2013 with some draft additions that may or may not contribute on the field next season.

What is obvious is that the Houston Texas are a second tier team, one that can look good against regular season opponents and earn a playoff spot, but they are far from a team that can or will assert their will on opponents in the post-season. The best we can hope for at this point is that the other team makes mistakes that we can capitalize on, which they cannot even consistently do that right now.
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I see really good teams giving up big points but I don't see really good teams with horse and buggy offenses while everyone else is buzzing around in them newfangled horseless carriages. Of all the teams that played yesterday, we were the only team that was done...I mean done, once down by 18. You didn't get that feeling when the Seahawks fell behind the Falcons and you know the 9ers, Packers or Pats all have the same ability. The Texans? done. All we could muster up was the holy mosey offense once down by 18 with a quarter left to play. Dinkin' and dunkin' at it's finest level.
 
Vinny said:
I see really good teams giving up big points but I don't see really good teams with horse and buggy offenses while everyone else is buzzing around in them newfangled horseless carriages. Of all the teams that played yesterday, we were the only team that was done...I mean done, once down by 18. You didn't get that feeling when the Seahawks fell behind the Falcons and you know the 9ers, Packers or Pats all have the same ability. The Texans? done. All we could muster up was the holy mosey offense once down by 18 with a quarter left to play. Dinkin' and dunkin' at it's finest level.
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Exactly. As long as the Texans are within 7 points, they have a chance. Once they are down by 20 or more, it's all over. This team just simply isn't built for quick points. That either changes, or we'll just keep getting these nice AFCS hats and dropping out of the playoffs early. Indy, I think, has farther to go than most believe.
 
Foxboro Steve said:
I see what you guys have been talking about. Didn't like the play calling, thought the gameplan was conservative. I don't know how you fire a guy that is in the playoffs two years in a row, even if Houston squandered a 1 seed.

Shaub is good enough in my opinion, but Kubiak... :dontknowa
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This thread is three years old. If you check the complaints people have had about Kubiak throughout the thread, they haven't changed. And people didn't start the thread until Kubiak had been around for a few years.

At this point in time, there's no chance Kubiak gets fired. But this thread is an interesting trip through time.
 
Vinny said:
I see really good teams giving up big points but I don't see really good teams with horse and buggy offenses while everyone else is buzzing around in them newfangled horseless carriages. Of all the teams that played yesterday, we were the only team that was done...I mean done, once down by 18. You didn't get that feeling when the Seahawks fell behind the Falcons and you know the 9ers, Packers or Pats all have the same ability. The Texans? done. All we could muster up was the holy mosey offense once down by 18 with a quarter left to play. Dinkin' and dunkin' at it's finest level.
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Couldn't agree with this post more.
 
Vinny said:
I see really good teams giving up big points but I don't see really good teams with horse and buggy offenses while everyone else is buzzing around in them newfangled horseless carriages. Of all the teams that played yesterday, we were the only team that was done...I mean done, once down by 18. You didn't get that feeling when the Seahawks fell behind the Falcons and you know the 9ers, Packers or Pats all have the same ability. The Texans? done. All we could muster up was the holy mosey offense once down by 18 with a quarter left to play. Dinkin' and dunkin' at it's finest level.
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I'll be honest with you, I had that gut feeling when they could not score a TD after being gifted with a 94 yard kickoff return.

SETTLING for field goals is this team's mantra.

I was a little surprised that we were within 4 at halftime, but I told my buddy that the Patriots will come out ready to play and the Texans will act like they are sleepy after taking a nap. The 3rd quarter played out exactly as I expected, and according to Kubiak, this quarter is when "they lost the game" (a defeatist attitude, IMO).

I'm sure Schaub fans will use his stats to support him, but I'm not buying it. I saw it with my own eyes. Dude is just not prime time in any sort of way. And this offense runs through him. It is his to succeed or fail.
 
rewatch the game on NFL rewind later and see how slow they huddle once they got behind, how many times they throw short of the yardsticks, how casual the offense was...it was maddening to me. It was like it was too much trouble to ramp it up and take some shots. It felt like hey, lets pad the stat line and make it look good on paper.
 
Double Barrel said:
I'll be honest with you, I had that gut feeling when they could not score a TD after being gifted with a 94 yard kickoff return.

SETTLING for field goals is this team's mantra.

I was a little surprised that we were within 4 at halftime, but I told my buddy that the Patriots will come out ready to play and the Texans will act like they are sleepy after taking a nap. The 3rd quarter played out exactly as I expected, and according to Kubiak, this quarter is when "they lost the game" (a defeatist attitude, IMO).

I'm sure Schaub fans will use his stats to support him, but I'm not buying it. I saw it with my own eyes. Dude is just not prime time in any sort of way. And this offense runs through him. It is his to succeed or fail.
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And it's quite unfortunate we're stuck like chuck for at least another 3 years years. It saddens me that we've basically peaked with this regime and QB. I just can't come up with a scenerio where we can push the door in with this bunch. I'm happy we got to the point of being somewhat of a consistent playoff team, but what's the point if we can't beat the "elite"? It's like the 90's Oilers all over again.
 
Vinny said:
rewatch the game on NFL rewind later and see how slow they huddle once they got behind, how many times they throw short of the yardsticks, how casual the offense was...it was maddening to me. It was like it was too much trouble to ramp it up and take some shots. It felt like hey, lets pad the stat line and make it look good on paper.
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I was wondering if a "hurry up" offense is even an option with this team.

It seems like they are built, both in terms of personnel and mentality, to get a lead and hold it with a run game and aggressive defense.

But once they get down two scores or more, they just seem lost and unable to amp up the intensity to catch up. They used to have the ability to catch up a couple of years ago when the defense sucked, but they have lost that ability and flounder around these days when they get behind.
 
Double Barrel said:
I was wondering if a "hurry up" offense is even an option with this team.

It seems like they are buit, both in terms of personnel and mentality, to get a lead and hold it with a run game and aggressive defense.

But once they get down two scores or more, they just seem lost and unable to amp up the intensity to catch up. They used to have the ability to catch up a couple of years ago with the defense sucked, but they have lost that ability and flounder around these days when they get behind.
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That was when Andre could take over a game. He's still a hell of a receiver but he doesn't destroy coverages anymore and he is more of a possession guy who can pick up big first downs here and there instead of a take the top off the defense kind of a threat. That's one reason I think this team needs an injection of speed and quickness. Both outside and in the slot. If we do that we still need to overcome this horse and buggy offense and be flexible like other elite teams...but Kubiak's offense seems stuck in the past.
 
Interesting reading this thread. Perhaps the main knock I have on Kubiak right now is that I don't believe he has it in him to part ways with Schaub at this juncture.

And in terms of Kubes' near term job security, that is probably the best decision for him, I mean, what are the chances that a rookie QB comes in and is an immediate upgrade? What are the chances that we can cut Schaub and then still be able to afford to get a vet who's an upgrade, and then even if we do, the chance that they don't take to the system.

For Kubes, it makes perfect sense to stick with Schaub and keep on beating everyone you're supposed to beat and failing against the elite tier QB's who given the current NFL rules will shred any D you put in front of them.

Take the Welker bomb on KJax, Welker pushed off on Kareem, if Kareem pushed back it would have been PI on D.

As for the Offensive scheme, I really don't know. We talk about our 'young' team, but our O is starting to get old now. AJ getting up there, OD too, Walter, Schaub, Thats 4 of your top 5 skill position players beyond their prime now. They haven't drafted/traded for an upgrade at any of those positions for years either. They bring on their draftees extremely slowly and then bleed them in in a way that puts plenty of tape on to scheme against before they've ever had chance to do any real damage. Just look at the Casey FB switch, I get the feeling Bill would have exploited that mismatch until teams simply had to sell out against it. What does Gary use it for?

A little wrinkle here and there, maybe let him rack up 100 yards receiving in a game once every 18 months or so. Whats the point of that when you could have a full on blocking FB roadgrading for our excellent RB group?

I have no expectations that we'll move on from either Schaub or Kubiak this offseason, and I don't see us winning fewer than 10 games with the status quo either. But we're going to be praying for favourable playoff seedings and more in January 2014 again unless something changes in philosophy. Which, again it won't.

Worst thing about last night? Lots of people were worried that the refs would screw us, yet the calls almost all went our way, there were awful ball spots that moved the chains for us, Fosters TD that could easily have been called short, video evidence was inconclusive at best. Injuries, not something you wish for but the Pats lost some important pieces during the game. What more could you ask for, and the scoreline reads far, far more respectably than it could have done.

This entire Smithiak era is beginning to look to me the way the Chargers looked a few years ago, racking up loads of stats in the regular season and failing in the playoffs. They had a lot of similar tools to what we have in terms of personnel too. Just never managed to get it done.
 
Foxboro Steve said:
I see what you guys have been talking about. Didn't like the play calling, thought the gameplan was conservative. I don't know how you fire a guy that is in the playoffs two years in a row, even if Houston squandered a 1 seed.

Shaub is good enough in my opinion, but Kubiak... :dontknowa
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Without seeing the gameplan or looking at the All-22 viewpoint to see what routes were available, how do you know the fail wasn't execution by Schaub?
 
welsh texan said:
Interesting reading this thread. Perhaps the main knock I have on Kubiak right now is that I don't believe he has it in him to part ways with Schaub at this juncture.

And in terms of Kubes' near term job security, that is probably the best decision for him, I mean, what are the chances that a rookie QB comes in and is an immediate upgrade? What are the chances that we can cut Schaub and then still be able to afford to get a vet who's an upgrade, and then even if we do, the chance that they don't take to the system.

For Kubes, it makes perfect sense to stick with Schaub and keep on beating everyone you're supposed to beat and failing against the elite tier QB's who given the current NFL rules will shred any D you put in front of them.

Take the Welker bomb on KJax, Welker pushed off on Kareem, if Kareem pushed back it would have been PI on D.

As for the Offensive scheme, I really don't know. We talk about our 'young' team, but our O is starting to get old now. AJ getting up there, OD too, Walter, Schaub, Thats 4 of your top 5 skill position players beyond their prime now. They haven't drafted/traded for an upgrade at any of those positions for years either. They bring on their draftees extremely slowly and then bleed them in in a way that puts plenty of tape on to scheme against before they've ever had chance to do any real damage. Just look at the Casey FB switch, I get the feeling Bill would have exploited that mismatch until teams simply had to sell out against it. What does Gary use it for?

A little wrinkle here and there, maybe let him rack up 100 yards receiving in a game once every 18 months or so. Whats the point of that when you could have a full on blocking FB roadgrading for our excellent RB group?

I have no expectations that we'll move on from either Schaub or Kubiak this offseason, and I don't see us winning fewer than 10 games with the status quo either. But we're going to be praying for favourable playoff seedings and more in January 2014 again unless something changes in philosophy. Which, again it won't.

Worst thing about last night? Lots of people were worried that the refs would screw us, yet the calls almost all went our way, there were awful ball spots that moved the chains for us, Fosters TD that could easily have been called short, video evidence was inconclusive at best. Injuries, not something you wish for but the Pats lost some important pieces during the game. What more could you ask for, and the scoreline reads far, far more respectably than it could have done.

This entire Smithiak era is beginning to look to me the way the Chargers looked a few years ago, racking up loads of stats in the regular season and failing in the playoffs. They had a lot of similar tools to what we have in terms of personnel too. Just never managed to get it done.
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Good points all, repped.

I guess I'd sum it up this way... We managed to climb out of the cellar and not be perpetual whipping boys any more under Schaub and Kubiak, Yaaay us.

....but is this as good as it gets? How long before Uncle Bob figures out there's more work to be done and he needs new pieces and/or upgrades to existing pieces to go the rest of the way? Because Schaub and/or Kubiak aren't enough.
 
2 years ago as far as I'm concerned. But, he doesn't have a QB worth a damn, A Johnson is past his prime, and the secondary is depending on a washed up Ed Reed to make it better. Texans aren't very good.
 
ljhog said:
2 years ago as far as I'm concerned. But, he doesn't have a QB worth a damn, A Johnson is past his prime, and the secondary is depending on a washed up Ed Reed to make it better. Texans aren't very good.
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They were good enough to have the game in the bag until Schaub threw a TD pass to the wrong guy .... again.
 
It ran out a few years ago. I've never been a big fan of his and I've always stated that I thought of him as someone who righted the ship, but not someone who is going to lead us deep into the playoffs. Should've gone after Peyton when he was available but they were too arrogant.
 
Kubiak's offensive philosophy and calling is okay. We're saddled with a liability at QB, though, and that QB is regressing.

2010 Matt Schaub with our current defense could have won a Super Bowl. 2013 Matt Schaub has fallen so far off the tracks that we're not going to win the division.
 
htownfan32 said:
Kubiak's offensive philosophy and calling is okay. We're saddled with a liability at QB, though, and that QB is regressing.

2010 Matt Schaub with our current defense could have won a Super Bowl. 2013 Matt Schaub has fallen so far off the tracks that we're not going to win the division.
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2010 Matt Schaub chokes under pressure just like 2013 one.
 
htownfan32 said:
Kubiak's offensive philosophy and calling is okay. We're saddled with a liability at QB, though, and that QB is regressing.

2010 Matt Schaub with our current defense could have won a Super Bowl. 2013 Matt Schaub has fallen so far off the tracks that we're not going to win the division.
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For the first time today, I agree with you.
 
ljhog said:
2 years ago as far as I'm concerned. But, he doesn't have a QB worth a damn, A Johnson is past his prime, and the secondary is depending on a washed up Ed Reed to make it better. Texans aren't very good.
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One guy doesn't make one mistake and cost us 6 points with three minutes left and we probably win the game against what most consider the best team in the league. Everyone would be talking about Superbowl. Now we are no better than 8 and 8. Gotta Love it:wadepalm:
 
Kubiak....kinda lost faith in him last year in the playoffs....he's taken is as far as he can....I think this game kinda sealed my belief in Schaub....can kubes and you'll get your qb of the future.....I'd hate to let him be apart of choosing that qb and then be fired the next year... The new coach may not want that guy.
 
Corrosion said:
Hard to bench a starting QB .... but damn , if ever one deserved it , Schaub is that guy.

Im absolutely disgusted with his play over the last ~8 games.
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There have been HOF QBs that have been benched for poor play. There have been Super Bowl winning QBs that have been benched for poor play. Schaub doesn't have anything close to that pedigree, and he's not going to bench himself.
 
htownfan32 said:
kubiak's offensive philosophy and calling is okay. We're saddled with a liability at qb, though, and that qb is regressing.

2010 matt schaub with our current defense could have won a super bowl. 2013 matt schaub has fallen so far off the tracks that we're not going to win the division.
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this!!!!!!
 
MEGA SWATT said:
Fire Kubes fire MS
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I can't help but feel like we should start case/tj, if either of them fails we have a nice draft pick to plug the hole at QB with and the money we save on having a rookie contract QB can be used to resign the quality young team we have to put around them.

Today is the first time I've come to the conclusion that Schaub can't get it done anymore. He's knackered and it upsets me to see it because I give him a lot of credit for pulling our team to respectability.

Kubiak gets the opportunity to sort this out for me if, and only if, he's willing to face up to the fact that he no longer has a QB.

The rest of this team is good, some issues on the back end of D that I believe will even themselves out, plenty of potential on the oline and I do trust the coaching staff to make the most of that talent, eventually. I see a lot of positives apart from the most important position on the team.
 
ljhog said:
2 years ago as far as I'm concerned. But, he doesn't have a QB worth a damn, A Johnson is past his prime, and the secondary is depending on a washed up Ed Reed to make it better. Texans aren't very good.
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Sure they are. The defense played a great game as did the offense until the second half. Then the offense just stopped showing up, Matt went "full retard" and the defense finally wore down. They can't stop them every single time and no one expects them to be able to do that.

The offense lost this game and specifically they lost it because of Matt Schaub. Not because the running game wasn't there. Not because the offensive line isn't good enough. They lost it because Matt Schaub can't deal with any pressure at all and Matt Schaub can't make good decisions under any kind of pressure.

Those are primary attributes required to play QB in the NFL at a high level. No amount of smoke and/or mirrors will cover up the fact that those are missing forever.
 
Hervoyel said:
Sure they are. The defense played a great game as did the offense until the second half. Then the offense just stopped showing up, Matt went "full retard" and the defense finally wore down. They can't stop them every single time and no one expects them to be able to do that.

The offense lost this game and specifically they lost it because of Matt Schaub. Not because the running game wasn't there. Not because the offensive line isn't good enough. They lost it because Matt Schaub can't deal with any pressure at all and Matt Schaub can't make good decisions under any kind of pressure.

Those are primary attributes required to play QB in the NFL at a high level. No amount of smoke and/or mirrors will cover up the fact that those are missing forever.
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you-went-full-retard-never-go-full-retard.jpg
 
Kubes is falling on the sword in the presser. I made a bad call there, blah blah blah. He's never going to yank MS until or unless he is either injured or they fall out of the playoff picture imo. I would start Yates next week. He has playoff experience. If nothing else, it sends a message that nobody is safe if you suck eggs.

We should have gotten rid of Kubes after 2010. He sucks as a HC, his offense is very modern....if it's 1976... and he again tucked his tail, and hid under his turtle shell.
 
"At what point does Kubiak run out of leash?"

About three years ago but I'm not holding the leash. I'd have fired him after the 6-10 season that brought us Wade Phillips and the sudden realization that no, we don't have a talent issue on that side of the ball. Just a brain issue with the HC and DC.
 
Just to think about it. If Russel Wilson or Colin Kaepernick were sitting behind Schaub at this point, Schaub would still remain the starter.
 
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