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The New New JaDeveon Clowney Thread

TheKDog said:
If they didn't want to extend him they should have traded him to a team that could extend him.

With the deadline to extend now past, Clowney's trade value drops because he becomes a rental.

It's not about what Clowney wants. It's about doing whats good for the Texans. But OBrien is a complete moron.
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His value didn’t drop. The extension was going to be something teams were going to have to contend with no matter when they got him. Basically could low ball us then knowing that we would have to overpay to retain him or risk the situation we are in right now.
 
Mr teX said:
His value didn’t drop. The extension was going to be something teams were going to have to contend with no matter when they got him. Basically could low ball us then knowing that we would have to overpay to retain him or risk the situation we are in right now.
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No, if they traded him before the tag deadline they could have extended him right away. Now they have to wait until January.

Obviously he has more value if they can lock him up now rather than risking him wanting to leave next year or getting hurt
 
TheKDog said:
No, if they traded him before the tag deadline they could have extended him right away. Now they have to wait until January.

Obviously he has more value if they can lock him up now rather than risking him wanting to leave next year or getting hurt
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Maybe I’m missing who the “they” is in your first sentence. Is “they” the Texans? If so how do you extend a traded player?
 
otisbean said:
I bet we could get a whole crew of guys from here to protest outside NRG with Fire BOB signs
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Sign me up! I’d even gladly pay a few hobos to join in. I’d be providing jobs, while curing the Texans organization of the cancer that ails them.
 
Honoring Earl 34 said:
I think the Texans leaked out the worker bee thing also . That cost JD money and maybe the Texans did it to dilute the cost but I think he's not what Bill wants .
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O'Brien has been leaking that since clowneys rookie year and it turned out he needed knee surgery
 
TheKDog said:
No, if they traded him before the tag deadline they could have extended him right away. Now they have to wait until January
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That benefits the other team, but I don’t see how that benefits us & why that team would give us demonstrably more for him then just so they could have more time to negotiate something long term with him.

The better play for us would actually be to try to see if we could extend him and if not, franchise him and wait to see if there’s a team desperate enough for his services to give us a nice package.

For his part he has played it bueatifully. But he only has so much time...unless he’s willing to miss game checks.

I think Gus Cook reassured him at the beginning of all this that he could get Donald/Mack money...but later told him the market’s just not there & advised him to go ahead and sign the FA tender & try again next year..so in an effort to save face, Clowney’s now trying to go straight to the source (Dolphins) to hear for himself what’s out there for him and/or get himself comfortable with the idea of signing a long term out there. He only has 1 real power move left....which involves him missing game checks (not gonna happen).
 
It's possible pre July 15th, Texans wanted Clowney back at the price they wanted to pay but not what he wanted . They hoped he would have eventually settled on a deal O'Brien could accept. When he did not and missed time on the field, O'Brien got angry. This seems like a likely scenario to me.
 
Mr teX said:
That benefits the other team, but I don’t see how that benefits us & why that team would give us demonstrably more for him then just so they could have more time to negotiate something long term with him.

The better play for us would actually be to try to see if we could extend him and if not, franchise him and wait to see if there’s a team desperate enough for his services to give us a nice package.

For his part he has played it bueatifully. But he only has so much time...unless he’s willing to miss game checks.

I think Gus Cook reassured him at the beginning of all this that he could get Donald/Mack money...but later told him the market’s just not there & advised him to go ahead and sign the FA tender & try again next year..so in an effort to save face, Clowney’s now trying to go straight to the source (Dolphins) to hear for himself what’s out there for him and/or get himself comfortable with the idea of signing a long term out there. He only has 1 real power move left....which involves him missing game checks (not gonna happen).
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Well if it's better for the other team to get him before the deadline then they would be willing to give more in trade.

I agree the best move would have been either trade or extend but instead we have...whatever this js
 
badboy said:
It's possible pre July 15th, Texans wanted Clowney back at the price they wanted to pay but not what he wanted . They hoped he would have eventually settled on a deal O'Brien could accept. When he did not and missed time on the field, O'Brien got angry. This seems like a likely scenario to me.
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That not what has been reported. Wilson said they didn't negotiate and McClain said they put him on the trade block as soon as they moved Tytus to guard early in camp
 
Honoring Earl 34 said:
I think the Texans leaked out the worker bee thing also . That cost JD money and maybe the Texans did it to dilute the cost but I think he's not what Bill wants .
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What is it exactly that Bill wants? He's been here for 6 years and I still can't figure out what it is..

From system, to playcalling, to staff, and to now front office. We still don't know what the hell he wants and what's scarier.. I don't think he knows either. He's just a football simpleton who's throwing **** against a wall.
 
Dolphins have some intriguing backs on their roster for Texans to consider after Lamar Miller's season-ending injury, including Kenyan Drake and Kalen Ballage. Ballage has outstanding size at 6-2, 230 pounds.

— Aaron Wilson (@AaronWilson_NFL) August 27, 2019
 
TheKDog said:
Well if it's better for the other team to get him before the deadline then they would be willing to give more in trade.

I agree the best move would have been either trade or extend but instead we have...whatever this js
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Likely not much more if any more at all. Again it doesn’t make sense for them to give us substantially more for him just for a little bit more time to negotiate an extension with him. They recognize that it’s a ticking time bomb to get him locked in on an extension that probably could turn out contentious when he hits them with that Donald/Mack money request. & then when u factor in his ticking time bomb of a knee.....
 
badboy said:
It's possible pre July 15th, Texans wanted Clowney back at the price they wanted to pay but not what he wanted . They hoped he would have eventually settled on a deal O'Brien could accept. When he did not and missed time on the field, O'Brien got angry. This seems like a likely scenario to me.
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Agree with the first sentence. Next best option was to franchise him. But I don’t think a trade or extension was in their original plans unless that 75$$m offer was real, but I doubt it. I still maintain the knee was messing with their extension plans but they wanted him until Ejiofor was ready but Ejiofor’s injury threw a monkey wrench in that plan.
 
zshawn10 said:
Dolphins have some intriguing backs on their roster for Texans to consider after Lamar Miller's season-ending injury, including Kenyan Drake and Kalen Ballage. Ballage has outstanding size at 6-2, 230 pounds.

— Aaron Wilson (@AaronWilson_NFL) August 27, 2019
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Ballage hasn't done anything with it. Even O'Brien knows to steer clear of that.
 
Mr teX said:
Likely not much more if any more at all. Again it doesn’t make sense for them to give us substantially more for him just for a little bit more time to negotiate an extension with him. They recognize that it’s a ticking time bomb to get him locked in on an extension that probably could turn out contentious when he hits them with that Donald/Mack money request. & then when u factor in his ticking time bomb of a knee.....
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The you let him play on the franchise tag. But obrien is now in a grudge match where the Texans end up with nothing or a bunch of crap from miami
 
zshawn10 said:
Dolphins have some intriguing backs on their roster for Texans to consider after Lamar Miller's season-ending injury, including Kenyan Drake and Kalen Ballage. Ballage has outstanding size at 6-2, 230 pounds.

— Aaron Wilson (@AaronWilson_NFL) August 27, 2019
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Ballage 36 carries and 9 catches? Nah unless he comes with a whole bunch of second and third round picks
 
mussop said:
No position to sit out? Why? He could sit out a year and go to the highest bidder the next year. Think about it from his POV. If he signs tender he is going to wherever BOB sends him and gets a guarantee what 15 million or so? That’s great but what if he destroys his knee while playing on that tender for some shitty team? Now it’s almost a given he will never get a mega deal. If he sits out teams will be lining up to give him a long term mega contract.

Him sitting out is his trump card right now. BOB played hard ball with him (“the balls in Clooney’s court” remember?) now it’s Clowneys turn to play hard ball. You trade me where I want to go or I’ll sit out a year and you will get nothing.
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If this happens I would just tag him again.

Going to the Eagles is best case scenario for both parties. IMHO

BTW, Nothing has really changed.
 
Dejaview said:
Agree with the first sentence. Next best option was to franchise him. But I don’t think a trade or extension was in their original plans unless that 75$$m offer was real, but I doubt it. I still maintain the knee was messing with their extension plans but they wanted him until Ejiofor was ready but Ejiofor’s injury threw a monkey wrench in that plan.
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To clarify when I said O'Brien hope that Clowney would settle on a deal I was referring to a long-term extension deal not a trade. Perhaps my wording mistake.
 
Honoring Earl 34 said:
I'm pretty sure Brandon Brooks will not give any ringing endorsements to the Texans either . Maybe they can do a three way trade with Miami . Eagles get Clowney , Miami gets draft picks , Texans get Tunsil .
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This is what I would try to accomplish, but it's probably not going to happen.
 
TheKDog said:
The you let him play on the franchise tag. But obrien is now in a grudge match where the Texans end up with nothing or a bunch of crap from miami
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Or the Texans could get a very good deal. I don't like O'Brien but let's wait to see what he gets before castigating him
 
Uncle Rico said:
JD controls everything. As has been evidenced by the MIA trade that didnt go through. All was contingent on JD agreeing that he would like to play long term in MIA, but since MIA didnt get that reassurance (was JDs management even in the preliminary talks?) further exasperated by the fact that JD was READY TO PLAY FOR THE TEXANS ON THE FRANCHISE TAG he felt some kind of way about it all. HUMAN RELATIONS! The man was on the verge of reporting and the stupid ass people on Kirby fked it all up.

Who knows who is where right now? JD COULD sit out all season. The Texans COULD just say 'screw him' and let him sit and then franchise again next year, but there are optics involved. Fans will not care and treat him like an indentured servant. Players will see how this plays out and no doubt will be swayed in the future about coming here. A good tactician is necessary, an experienced personnel guy who can reach out to these players and agents. Bill OBrien doesnt strike me as a guy who would be easy to work with in this regard. Dont ask me why just a hunch.
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Yes, the guys down on Kirbry continued a long tradition of screwing things up.

Indentured servant getting paid 16 mil next yr? Sign me up.
 
TheKDog said:
The you let him play on the franchise tag. But obrien is now in a grudge match where the Texans end up with nothing or a bunch of crap from miami
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BoB is a team guy...values team over everything & if u look up and down our roster, we have a bunch of guys like that...0 divas. Don’t want those guys and won’t put up with those guys. That’s what he knows and that is “the patriot way”

So I think prior to July 15th, that probably was the plan. Let him play on the FA tag & see if we can come together on an extension before July 15. But then once the deadline passed and JD STILL didn’t sign the F-tag....well that’s not very team oriented and that when they started seriously entertaining trading him and eventually put him on the block.
 
DEagle7 said:
Eagles fan here. TONS of talk about trying to trade Clowney by fans and local beat writers around here. Like some of you guys pointed out it makes sense on paper: we could use an edge rusher, we play in a scheme that theoretically could be a good fit for him (4-3 with a wide-9ish scheme), and we have good depth at OT and RB.

There are a few issues there though unfortunately
- The Eagles brass puts a premium on OL and OL depth. We have a ton of depth right now but Vaitai is gone next year and Peters is retiring any year now so that depth can go away quickly
- We also have a lot of cap space locked into Wentz, Cox, Johnson, Graham, etc. Howie Roseman is a cap-space wizard but still if Clowney is angling for a big pay-day I'm not sure the Eagles have the flexibility to do it.
- Mailata has shown a crazy amount of promise for a guy who never played before last year (look up Brian Baldinger's take on him, he absolutely gushes over the guy). But the reality is he is still very very raw. Great upside but I would imagine you guys are mostly focused on protecting Watson now. Vaitai has shown he can be a capable tackle but has also been inconsistent and needs to be schemed around. Peters would probably retire if he was traded and Johnson/Dillard are likely untouchable.
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How has Mailata looked this preseason compared to Vaitai?
 
Mr teX said:
BoB is a team guy...values team over everything & if u look up and down our roster, we have a bunch of guys like that...0 divas. Don’t want those guys and won’t put up with those guys. That’s what he knows and that is “the patriot way”

So I think prior to July 15th, that probably was the plan. Let him play on the FA tag & see if we can come together on an extension before July 15. But then once the deadline passed and JD STILL didn’t sign the F-tag....well that’s not very team oriented and that when they started seriously entertaining trading him and eventually put him on the block.
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He didn't sign it because OBrien was going to trade him to Miami. He doesn't have to sign it. He's not getting fined.

OBrien is a real team guy getting into fights with players every year
 
TheKDog said:
He didn't sign it because OBrien was going to trade him to Miami. He doesn't have to sign it. He's not getting fined.

OBrien is a real team guy getting into fights with players every year
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What's best for the team is trading him for a LT which was rumored to have been the case with Miami.

True, he doesn't have to sign the tender but giving up 16 mil is kinda hard to do. Ask Bell about this.
 
TheKDog said:
He didn't sign it because OBrien was going to trade him to Miami. He doesn't have to sign it. He's not getting fined.

OBrien is a real team guy getting into fights with players every year
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The rumors about Miami didn’t even start to come out until well after the 7/15 deadline. Clowney could’ve signed the tag well before then.

True he didn’t have to...but if he REALLY wanted to be here as he asserts, he would’ve signed it. He didn’t. So now we’re at where we’re at.
 
[\UOTE="TheKDog, post: 2978645, member: 55459"]The team is royally screwed for years.

They will need to do a Cleveland Browns tank and rebuild.[/QUOTE]

Not at all,

They have some great players and this is yr 2 of a 3 yr rebuild. Fact is the Texans have to spend $$$$ on Watson/Watt. That's why they're wanting to trade Clowney. Did BOB screw this up? Time will tell, but it's not looking promising in typical Texans fashion.
 
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steelbtexan said:
How has Mailata looked this preseason compared to Vaitai?
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Less polished, more exciting. He still makes really big mistakes on occasion. But the progress he has made in 1 year considering he had never played before is simply incredible. He is an athletic freak but still needs to develop consistent technique. Very much a project who if forced to start right now might get you into trouble here and there, but it also clearly has a ceiling much higher than Vaitai. Baldinger is super hyperbolic but still he shows why he has promise in done of his tweets: https://twitter.com/BaldyNFL/status/1159976200627900416

Vaitai has played mostly guard this preseason (first time for him) and has looked pretty good. Solid player but nothing exciting which can still be valuable in the NFL. FWIW I believe Clowney beat up on Vaitai last year at LT.
 
steelbtexan said:
What's best for the team is trading him for a LT which was rumored to have been the case with Miami.

True, he doesn't have to sign the tender but giving up 16 mil is kinda hard to do. Ask Bell about this.
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I agree with you. But the word is OBrien wants to trade him to Miami for RB/wr and picks

Tunsil would be great but not happening
 
DEagle7 said:
Less polished, more exciting. He still makes really big mistakes on occasion. But the progress he has made in 1 year considering he had never played before is simply incredible. He is an athletic freak but still needs to develop consistent technique. Very much a project who if forced to start right now might get you into trouble here and there, but it also clearly has a ceiling much higher than Vaitai. Baldinger is super hyperbolic but still he shows why he has promise in done of his tweets: https://twitter.com/BaldyNFL/status/1159976200627900416

Vaitai has played mostly guard this preseason (first time for him) and has looked pretty good. Solid player but nothing exciting which can still be valuable in the NFL. FWIW I believe Clowney beat up on Vaitai last year at LT.
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Thanks,

Give me the guy who has really improved over this yr and Smallwood and I would be happy.
 
steelbtexan said:
[\UOTE="TheKDog, post: 2978645, member: 55459"]The team is royally screwed for years.

They will need to do a Cleveland Browns tank and rebuild.
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Not at all,

They have some great players and this is yr 2 of a 3 yr rebuild. Fact is the Texans have to spend $$$$ on Watson/Watt. That's why they're wanting to trade Clowney. Did BOB screw this up? Time will tell, but it's not looking promising in typical Texans fashion.
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What year of the rebuild is the offensive line in?

Watson will be extended next year
 
Mr teX said:
BoB is a team guy...values team over everything & if u look up and down our roster, we have a bunch of guys like that...0 divas. Don’t want those guys and won’t put up with those guys. That’s what he knows and that is “the patriot way”
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I agree with this. And I think players acquiesce to that in NE because they're signing up for the privilege of playing for SB's so it works. I'm not sure how long it will work here w/ players playing for first round playoff beat-downs. The x-box dude was talking about RAC threatening to quit over this whole JD thing. Could be complete BS, but it's not difficult to imagine losing a team under this kind of leadership if we're not winning.
 
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