Wish to make a one time donation? Make it here.

Will Fuller suspended 6 games

thunderkyss

Just win baby!!!
Staff member
Contributor's Club
hasn’t shown that he’s up there with Fuller. Dude just doesn’t get open enough. Fuller route running separate is the difference between these two players. I agree his price should fall but the
Cooks has shown plenty, just not here. Year 1 in New Orleans, 1000 yards. Year one in New England, 1000 yards, year one in LA, 1000 yards.

Year 1 in Houston... probably not a thousand, but that may very well be O'Brien.

If I'm starting a new offense from scratch with real NFL coaches, Cooks would be higher on my list than WFV.

But neither would be in my top 10.
 
Keep in mind also that Texans may be worst than most but a lot of teams are going to be having to make hard choices in regards to the cap because everyone spent like the good times would never end. Depending on who else hits free market that may give us other options than Fuller or even drop his price because why would a team with extra money sign him when they can sign pro bowl player X for the just a few million more.
 
Last edited:

Texansballer74

Hall of Fame
Cooks has shown plenty, just not here. Year 1 in New Orleans, 1000 yards. Year one in New England, 1000 yards, year one in LA, 1000 yards.

Year 1 in Houston... probably not a thousand, but that may very well be O'Brien.

If I'm starting a new offense from scratch with real NFL coaches, Cooks would be higher on my list than WFV.

But neither would be in my top 10.
Oh no doubt, I’m specifically talking about here.
 

Texansballer74

Hall of Fame
Keep in mind also that Texans may be worst than most but a lot of teams are going to be having to make hard choices in regards to the cap because everyone spent like the good times would never end. Depending on who else hits free market that may give us other opinions than Fuller or even drop his price because why would a team with extra money sign him when they can sign pro bowl player X for the just a few million more.
Great point
 

Corrosion

Idealist
Staff member
Good deal, man. I quit smoking in 1995, and my on again/off again relationship with booze ended around 2004. Chronic pancreatitis pain is a great motivator. That, and I did not want to continue the cycle of alcoholism that has haunted my family for generations.

I hear the voices, too. They might not be real, but they do have some good ideas.

Yeah , those voices telling us to do dumb stuff .... like take another drink when we are already trashed.

I just hope my kids are spared the agony of alcoholism .... sometimes it skips a generation.
My grandmother on one side and grandfather on the other had issues , my mother never drinks .... I have had my issues , hopefully they wont.

Yep. He's a risk the Texans have to take at this point. They need him more than he needs them. Maybe this PED pop will end up making better circumstances for the Texans chances to get him back.

While I'm not happy with his decisions, I do think they were made solely to get a full season under his belt. It's got to be an uncertain feeling to finally get a shot at being a no. 1 receiver but have that injury history always in the back of your mind.

WFV .... I don't know that the Texans need him specifically or simply a player who can provide what he does taking the top off a defense.
I just don't think they can overpay to keep him and I'm not sure what an overpay is at this point , numbers are all over the place and then there's Covid economics to take into consideration along with his injury history and PED suspension.

One thing for sure - there won't be a whole heck of a lot of big contracts thrown around this offseason as teams just don't have the cap space as 12 teams have $5m or less in actual cap space currently and most of those will be in the same boat as the Texans having to make space to sign players.

12 teams 5m or less
No teams have between 5-10m
Six teams between 10-22m
Seven teams between 26-35m
Six teams between 41-85m


18 teams are in cap trouble.

There's likely to be a lot of players who are forced to take lower than normal salaries after the big names eat up most of the money available. You'd hope that you can take advantage of that situation and replace some of the guys that are FA or had to be cut to make space with quality players from that group.

Can you get him to sign for a reasonable amount ? If not you have to find a cheaper alternative from that group of players who are left after the big money is spent.

The money is going to be so tight ....
 

Texansballer74

Hall of Fame
Yeah , those voices telling us to do dumb stuff .... like take another drink when we are already trashed.

I just hope my kids are spared the agony of alcoholism .... sometimes it skips a generation.
My grandmother on one side and grandfather on the other had issues , my mother never drinks .... I have had my issues , hopefully they wont.




WFV .... I don't know that the Texans need him specifically or simply a player who can provide what he does taking the top off a defense.
I just don't think they can overpay to keep him and I'm not sure what an overpay is at this point , numbers are all over the place and then there's Covid economics to take into consideration along with his injury history and PED suspension.

One thing for sure - there won't be a whole heck of a lot of big contracts thrown around this offseason as teams just don't have the cap space as 12 teams have $5m or less in actual cap space currently and most of those will be in the same boat as the Texans having to make space to sign players.

12 teams 5m or less
No teams have between 5-10m
Six teams between 10-22m
Seven teams between 26-35m
Six teams between 41-85m


18 teams are in cap trouble.

There's likely to be a lot of players who are forced to take lower than normal salaries after the big names eat up most of the money available. You'd hope that you can take advantage of that situation and replace some of the guys that are FA or had to be cut to make space with quality players from that group.

Can you get him to sign for a reasonable amount ? If not you have to find a cheaper alternative from that group of players who are left after the big money is spent.

The money is going to be so tight ....
Did you get a chance to take a gander at the receivers that will enter the 2021 draft I posted.
 

Mr teX

Hall of Fame
Yeah , those voices telling us to do dumb stuff .... like take another drink when we are already trashed.

I just hope my kids are spared the agony of alcoholism .... sometimes it skips a generation.
My grandmother on one side and grandfather on the other had issues , my mother never drinks .... I have had my issues , hopefully they wont.




WFV .... I don't know that the Texans need him specifically or simply a player who can provide what he does taking the top off a defense.
I just don't think they can overpay to keep him and I'm not sure what an overpay is at this point , numbers are all over the place and then there's Covid economics to take into consideration along with his injury history and PED suspension.

One thing for sure - there won't be a whole heck of a lot of big contracts thrown around this offseason as teams just don't have the cap space as 12 teams have $5m or less in actual cap space currently and most of those will be in the same boat as the Texans having to make space to sign players.

12 teams 5m or less
No teams have between 5-10m
Six teams between 10-22m
Seven teams between 26-35m
Six teams between 41-85m


18 teams are in cap trouble.

There's likely to be a lot of players who are forced to take lower than normal salaries after the big names eat up most of the money available. You'd hope that you can take advantage of that situation and replace some of the guys that are FA or had to be cut to make space with quality players from that group.

Can you get him to sign for a reasonable amount ? If not you have to find a cheaper alternative from that group of players who are left after the big money is spent.

The money is going to be so tight ....
fuller has shown that he's more than a speed guy that takes the roof off. Hes a very good route runner that for it not for his missed time, he'd probably be considered elite in that category.
 

Mr teX

Hall of Fame
Cooks has shown plenty, just not here. Year 1 in New Orleans, 1000 yards. Year one in New England, 1000 yards, year one in LA, 1000 yards.

Year 1 in Houston... probably not a thousand, but that may very well be O'Brien.

If I'm starting a new offense from scratch with real NFL coaches, Cooks would be higher on my list than WFV.

But neither would be in my top 10.
Cooks has been traded around so much b/c of his size. Even though he's got good speed, quickness and hands and he's a very good route runner, his diminutive size means he can be taken COMPLETELY out of a game with double teams and/or big CB's who can run....If you try to play him inside, the same thing applies except you'll typically have a safety with those measureables who can do that. The other less talked about reason is he's absolutely terrible as a run blocker for the run game. You add in his concussion history & it all pretty much limits him only an outside........ #2 WR......under specific circumstances at that.

WFV is much more versatile than that.
 
fuller has shown that he's more than a speed guy that takes the roof off. Hes a very good route runner that for it not for his missed time, he'd probably be considered elite in that category.
I agree but you know what they say sometimes the best ability is availability, if there wasn't such a risk of Fuller getting injured, or apparently suspended, we may not have screamed bloody murder so much when Hopkins was traded. Instead we lost not only the best hands we had but also the most dependable player injury wise.
 

SnakeEyes

Rookie
Well, it’s time to see what Cooks can do.
If he doesn't get hit in the head multiple times. He should be able to make it till the end of the year.

Research shows that someone who has already received one concussion is 1-2 times more likely to receive a second one. If that individual has had two concussions, “a third is 2-4 times more likely, and if they've had three concussions, then they are 3-9 times more likely to receive their fourth concussion.”

Unfortunately, the answer is no. While helmets and other protective equipment can prevent more traumatic head injuries, such as skull fractures, they cannot reliably protect against concussions. Studies have shown that football helmets on average only reduce the risk of traumatic brain injury by approximately 20%.

So it seems like he has a 20% less chance of getting another. But, it is not helping that he has already had:

Cooks, who will turn 27 in September, has suffered five known concussions in his six-year NFL career, three of which came in the past two seasons when he was with the Los Angeles Rams

So, doing the math (not my strong suit) it basically means he should be about double as likely to get another as someone who has not had one. That's going to by having 5 and 20% more protection in the NFL with the gear they use. My numbers are not right I'm pretty sure. However, it's a ballpark figure and at least the NFL is using stuff college and high school doesn't have to lower odds.
 
Last edited:

banned1976

All Pro
How much is a receiver worth if you're going to be paying him to play in 9-11 games out of a 16 game season?

Over the last 4 years, Will Fuller has been available in: 11, 11, 7, and 10 games. Oh, and he's already out for at least one game next season.

To me, Fuller's not worth the headache. He's too fragile and I'm not sure about now but the rules used to be if a guy gets popped a second time for PED's, he's suspended for 10 games.

I'd start over with a new receiving corps. There will be some decent vets out there next year in free agency that will be more reliable than Fuller. Not as fast, but they'll be there on gameday.
 

Decim8

Waterboy
Then if that's true it means he messed up his potential draft position. Still, compared to Mahomes, Rogers, Allen and Hebert he has a weaker arm.

Subtract Rogers, he is is a vet.
Messed up his draft position how? The man got drafted 12th overall. Unless you think he would've been a top 5 pick if he put more zip on the ball. And again he doesn't need to have an arm like those 5 you mentioned.....he has plenty enough already
 

Corrosion

Idealist
Staff member
Messed up his draft position how? The man got drafted 12th overall. Unless you think he would've been a top 5 pick if he put more zip on the ball. And again he doesn't need to have an arm like those 5 you mentioned.....he has plenty enough already
I think if he'd had the big arm reputation he'd have gone higher - That was one of the knocks pre draft - adequate but not a howitzer.
Looking back , its a bit overstated ... he can make all the throws and is very good on the long ball.
 

Decim8

Waterboy
I think if he'd had the big arm reputation he'd have gone higher - That was one of the knocks pre draft - adequate but not a howitzer.
Looking back , its a bit overstated ... he can make all the throws and is very good on the long ball.
Oh right but I thought the issue with Watson coming out of college was that he was prone to turn overs, fumbles etc
 

Corrosion

Idealist
Staff member
Oh right but I thought the issue with Watson coming out of college was that he was prone to turn overs, fumbles etc
I don't recall that being the case .... The main issue was the coming from the spread system and reading defenses as Dabo essentially cut the field in half for him.
Accuracy and arm strength were the other issues. I know I know he completes a high percentage .... that doesn't mean the ball is well placed.
 

Double Barrel

Moderator / Admin
Staff member
Contributor's Club
Yeah , those voices telling us to do dumb stuff .... like take another drink when we are already trashed.

I just hope my kids are spared the agony of alcoholism .... sometimes it skips a generation.
My grandmother on one side and grandfather on the other had issues , my mother never drinks .... I have had my issues , hopefully they wont.
yep. Been there/done that, but never got the t-shirt.

I hope it skips generations. My kids don't have the background of experience to understand addiction. My childhood was rough, but it has been something that I have relied on to avoid as a father and make me strive to be a better overall person. I have talked to them a lot about it, though, so hopefully we have a foundation of respect and wisdom to draw upon when they have to face those potentially inherent struggles.

WFV .... I don't know that the Texans need him specifically or simply a player who can provide what he does taking the top off a defense.
I just don't think they can overpay to keep him and I'm not sure what an overpay is at this point , numbers are all over the place and then there's Covid economics to take into consideration along with his injury history and PED suspension.

One thing for sure - there won't be a whole heck of a lot of big contracts thrown around this offseason as teams just don't have the cap space as 12 teams have $5m or less in actual cap space currently and most of those will be in the same boat as the Texans having to make space to sign players.

12 teams 5m or less
No teams have between 5-10m
Six teams between 10-22m
Seven teams between 26-35m
Six teams between 41-85m


18 teams are in cap trouble.

There's likely to be a lot of players who are forced to take lower than normal salaries after the big names eat up most of the money available. You'd hope that you can take advantage of that situation and replace some of the guys that are FA or had to be cut to make space with quality players from that group.

Can you get him to sign for a reasonable amount ? If not you have to find a cheaper alternative from that group of players who are left after the big money is spent.

The money is going to be so tight ....
Good points. When I mentioned 'need' it was more about a lack of draft capital and cap space to find another no. 1, and he's already got chemistry with #4.

That said, there are a lot of concerns with him, as well. I would not overpay, which might not even be a concern from other teams since so many will be struggling. And this suspension certainly lowers his value in the eyes of some franchises.

Next off-season is going to be one of the most interesting we've seen in a while as this pandemic continues to impact society.
 

SnakeEyes

Rookie
Oh right but I thought the issue with Watson coming out of college was that he was prone to turn overs, fumbles etc
It was also, mainly INTs. And he still has the issue if he runs left and throws. Exactly what his scouting report says. This is the type of thing that I feel he has to improve. If you watch, he is still prone to bad throwd going to the left. Something he should have been working on since he was drafted. Now we can blame OB, or the OC or QB coach. But really it's a player who has to locate weakness and fix it.
I don't recall that being the case .... The main issue was the coming from the spread system and reading defenses as Dabo essentially cut the field in half for him.
Accuracy and arm strength were the other issues. I know I know he completes a high percentage .... that doesn't mean the ball is well placed.
It was: Arm strength, ball placement and INTs were the biggest things scouting reports said. Placement tends to be from not reading the D right or (taken from NFL.com's main weakness of all NFL QBs 2020-2021)

Deshaun Watson, Texans
Biggest weakness: Decision making

Watson dominated the league during his abbreviated rookie season, but luck had a lot to do with his unreal production. With receivers bailing him out by making contested catches and defenders not capitalizing on easy interceptions, Watson’s interception total is deceiving. He had a lot of turnover-worthy throws that defensive backs dropped. Watson tends to hold the ball too long. Allowing other teams to adjust to what he is doing. Making smarter plays with the ball is paramount for Watson to lead his team deep into the playoffs.
 

badboy

Hall of Fame
I would think the market for a WR that gets hurt every yr and gets caught using PED's in a contract yr in an effort to stay healthy and get paid would be very depressed. No more than 4-5 mil per yr on a 2 yr deal with 5 or 6 mil guaranteed. Personally I would let WFV walk and re-up Cooks at say 8 mil per yr for 3 yrs with 12 mil up front. (He can give you the same things WFV gives you) and sign a cheap bigger bodied WR to replace WFV. If Coulter shows he can play in the remaining games then this will also help answer these issues.

I hate that 1. They didn't trade WFV 2. He got popped. But since this is a lost season anyways it's time to get a look at guys like Coulter and some of the young guys on defense. Speaking of young guys playing is Heck going to play this yr or is this going to be his redshirt yr?

Also if Bienemy becomes the next Texans HC I would pay great $$$$ to see Andy Heck come with Bienemy. If Fangio gets fired then Munchak would be at the top of my list as the next OL coach and I would pay him top dollar. Have y'all seen the improvement in Denver's OL this yr? I bet guys like Howard/Scharping could really improve under his watch. N.Martin/Fulton would probably be gone if not next yr then in 2 yrs.
Cooks is under a great team contract thru 2023. Your offer would be turned down if I were Cooks.
 

badboy

Hall of Fame
How much is a receiver worth if you're going to be paying him to play in 9-11 games out of a 16 game season?

Over the last 4 years, Will Fuller has been available in: 11, 11, 7, and 10 games. Oh, and he's already out for at least one game next season.

To me, Fuller's not worth the headache. He's too fragile and I'm not sure about now but the rules used to be if a guy gets popped a second time for PED's, he's suspended for 10 games.

I'd start over with a new receiving corps. There will be some decent vets out there next year in free agency that will be more reliable than Fuller. Not as fast, but they'll be there on gameday.
Make him a WR coach after his playing career...nah.
 

Earl34

All Pro
It was also, mainly INTs. And he still has the issue if he runs left and throws. Exactly what his scouting report says. This is the type of thing that I feel he has to improve. If you watch, he is still prone to bad throwd going to the left. Something he should have been working on since he was drafted. Now we can blame OB, or the OC or QB coach. But really it's a player who has to locate weakness and fix it.


It was: Arm strength, ball placement and INTs were the biggest things scouting reports said. Placement tends to be from not reading the D right or (taken from NFL.com's main weakness of all NFL QBs 2020-2021)

Deshaun Watson, Texans
Biggest weakness: Decision making

Watson dominated the league during his abbreviated rookie season, but luck had a lot to do with his unreal production. With receivers bailing him out by making contested catches and defenders not capitalizing on easy interceptions, Watson’s interception total is deceiving. He had a lot of turnover-worthy throws that defensive backs dropped. Watson tends to hold the ball too long. Allowing other teams to adjust to what he is doing. Making smarter plays with the ball is paramount for Watson to lead his team deep into the playoffs.
Are you basing your opinions on his draft scouting report, his Max Prep high school report or his 2020 season?
 

Texansballer74

Hall of Fame
Are you basing your opinions on his draft scouting report, his Max Prep high school report or his 2020 season?
What’s really funny, is the weak arm stuff. The young man has the capability of throwing a 70 yard bomb. During this streak of elite play he’s throwing with some Tabasco sauce on a lot of those passes. But hey dude is right he had a weak inaccurate arm at Clemson.
 

CWTexansFan

¯\_(ツ)_/¯
Contributor's Club

I honestly don’t even know who you are. But clearly you wish to be apart of something so sure whatever you say bro .
Well, how rude. No brisket for you.

Oh, I'm President of the anti coddle Watson coalition. Sashay away.
No wonder dude agrees with almost everything one particular member says. And it’s amazing when those that speak positive of Watson play y’all quickly refutes it and then start throwing the accuracy thingy around, he’s not a leader, he’s not a Super Bowl quality quarterback, and the arm strength. Why don’t you ever charge those guys up when they come after those members who highlights the positive aspects of his game. You don’t think those members blow things out of proportion either?

And let’s not forget a team not winning the Super Bowl if the quarterback eats up a certain percentage of the cap.
So ungrateful, and to think I said you should be head coach.


Pretty sure you just proved @Corrosion point. Plenty of times someone has spoken positively of Watson but that gets forgotten the moment that person also criticizes him, I have said I think Watson can be a great QB he just needs a scheme that fits him better, Corrosion has said that he could design an insane scheme for a QB with Watson's talents, @steelbtexan has listed multiple times what he feels Watson's strengths are when asked directly.

You, and yes I mean you @Texansballer74 because I'm tired of these dance around names game, seem to take everything someone says to the extreme. They say Watson has accuracy issues or isn't as accurate as another QB you act as though they said he couldn't hit the broad side of a barn, they say he doesn't have the strongest arm, something no one has really brought up for years, you act like they said he has a wet noodle for an arm, they say he isn't a leader, which I agree doesn't make sense, and rather than taking it as one person's opinion you act like its the general feeling of everyone that has ever said anything. Finally the fact that no team has won a Superbowl when a QB is 15% or more of the cap you act like that is an attack on Watson when it's simply a fact of the NFL. Doesn't matter if the QB is Rodgers, Wilson, Big Ben or any other QB you care to name the fact is it has never been done but again you act like its an attack on Watson.

Its like you think we all sit around and discuss how we are going to run Watson down today or hell even talk to each other about any of these outside of these posts. I won't speak for the others but I can count the number of PM conversations I have had on one hand and have fingers left over and only one of them was about Watson and it wasn't about his on field play but what his role on the committee was. So my question to you is why is this so personal for you and why do you feel you have to defend him with every post and answer everything that is said? Its why people have said that Steel is in your head because he could say Watson has bad taste is clothes and you would make 10 posts defending his taste in clothes.
Well said.
Why are you even expounding on this . Dude nobody is even talking about you. This is your freaking problem right here. I’m not the only one who feels this way. Speedy, Earl , Optimistic, Santo and several other members complains about the negativity from those select few as well. But of course your weak self only wants to charge me up. Nobody was fn with you when you disagreed constantly with Steel. And dude stop the fabrication crap. That dude doesn’t really give Watson any props. There’s alway a freaking but behind it. Like I said it’s crazy when we give the man his creds y’all are so quick to diss it. But when people criticize y’all quickly jump on board.

I’ve told you once before what you can do. If you don’t like my comments then bypass them or better yet hit the ignore button. You and I don’t ever have to discuss football around these parts. Just that simple
Have you ever thought of being a dictator for a third world shithole?
I think you'd be great at it.
:kitten:
I'd like in on that. I'll pick you up @steelbtexan
I'll throw in a brisket and some pork and/or beef ribs.
 

SnakeEyes

Rookie
It was also, mainly INTs. And he still has the issue if he runs left and throws. Exactly what his scouting report says. This is the type of thing that I feel he has to improve. If you watch, he is still prone to bad throwd going to the left. Something he should have been working on since he was drafted. Now we can blame OB, or the OC or QB coach. But really it's a player who has to locate weakness and fix it.


It was: Arm strength, ball placement and INTs were the biggest things scouting reports said. Placement tends to be from not reading the D right or (taken from NFL.com's main weakness of all NFL QBs 2020-2021)

Deshaun Watson, Texans
Biggest weakness: Decision making

Watson dominated the league during his abbreviated rookie season, but luck had a lot to do with his unreal production. With receivers bailing him out by making contested catches and defenders not capitalizing on easy interceptions, Watson’s interception total is deceiving. He had a lot of turnover-worthy throws that defensive backs dropped. Watson tends to hold the ball too long. Allowing other teams to adjust to what he is doing. Making smarter plays with the ball is paramount for Watson to lead his team deep into the playoffs.
Earl... You honestly don't like what NFL.com said? Hate to break it to you but it has been said since anyone started scouting him. In highschool and college and now the NFL. So, if you want to argue with 100's of scouts and football organizations at all levels and say you know more than they do (which is exactly what you're doing) feel free. But do us a favor...

Post the credibility you have over the 100's of scouts, coaches, general managers. Something tells me that you have zero experience. And combine they have a couple thousand years worth. So, saying they are wrong is flat out lunacy. Also notice not 1 said it was unable to be fixed, just that it was the same issue they saw (coach, scout, general managers...pick one).
 

SnakeEyes

Rookie
What’s really funny, is the weak arm stuff. The young man has the capability of throwing a 70 yard bomb. During this streak of elite play he’s throwing with some Tabasco sauce on a lot of those passes. But hey dude is right he had a weak inaccurate arm at Clemson.
And in highschool. And 100's of scouts, coaches and GMs agree. But you have what 30-40 yrs of experience in football vs what a few 1000 (that's thousand) years that they do... So of course you trump them we bow to you sir
 

Decim8

Waterboy
Earl... You honestly don't like what NFL.com said? Hate to break it to you but it has been said since anyone started scouting him. In highschool and college and now the NFL. So, if you want to argue with 100's of scouts and football organizations at all levels and say you know more than they do (which is exactly what you're doing) feel free. But do us a favor...

Post the credibility you have over the 100's of scouts, coaches, general managers. Something tells me that you have zero experience. And combine they have a couple thousand years worth. So, saying they are wrong is flat out lunacy. Also notice not 1 said it was unable to be fixed, just that it was the same issue they saw (coach, scout, general managers...pick one).
Those scouts with all that experience can get it wrong too, for example check trubisky report

"The No. 1 attribute for any successful quarterback in the NFL is accuracy, which is a strength for Trubisky. He has good ball placement, is able to beat tight coverage by firing the ball precisely into tight windows, and throws his receivers open"

now go on the bears forum and read what they have to say of him lol
 

Texansballer74

Hall of Fame
Well, how rude. No brisket for you.

Oh, I'm President of the anti coddle Watson coalition. Sashay away.

So ungrateful, and to think I said you should be head coach.


If those ribs doesn’t look these, throw them in the trash


Well said.

Have you ever thought of being a dictator for a third world shithole?
I think you'd be great at it.
:kitten:

I'll throw in a brisket and some pork and/or beef ribs.
 

Attachments

Those scouts with all that experience can get it wrong too, for example check trubisky report

"The No. 1 attribute for any successful quarterback in the NFL is accuracy, which is a strength for Trubisky. He has good ball placement, is able to beat tight coverage by firing the ball precisely into tight windows, and throws his receivers open"

now go on the bears forum and read what they have to say of him lol
To be fair Chicago is worst than Cleveland in it being he place QB careers go to die. I mean Jay Cutler has their franchise records for heaven’s sake. Trubisky isn’t, and was never going to be, the QB Watson or Mahomes is but Chicago doesn’t do their QB any favors either. On a different team that doesn’t think the QBs job is just to be a tackling dummy Trubisky might could have been at least decent but we’ll never know after his Chicago years.
 

Decim8

Waterboy
To be fair Chicago is worst than Cleveland in it being he place QB careers go to die. I mean Jay Cutler has their franchise records for heaven’s sake. Trubisky isn’t, and was never going to be, the QB Watson or Mahomes is but Chicago doesn’t do their QB any favors either. On a different team that doesn’t think the QBs job is just to be a tackling dummy Trubisky might could have been at least decent but we’ll never know after his Chicago years.
The point i was trying to make is that scouts even with all the experience they have can get it wrong too
 

Texansballer74

Hall of Fame
The point i was trying to make is that scouts even with all the experience they have can get it wrong too

Exactly, we also see coaches getting it wrong as well. No one is perfect. We have to stop cherry picking in a quest of trying to find stuff that fits our agenda.

I’m still waiting on ole buddy snake to provide us with current data that will support his case.
 
Last edited:

steelbtexan

King of the W. B. Club
Contributor's Club
Exactly, we also see coaches getting it wrong as well. No one is perfect. We have to stop cherry picking in quest of fitting out agenda.

I’m still waiting on ole buddy snake to provide us with current data that will support his case.
Yes we do

There's an entire agenda based thread you started up.
 

Corrosion

Idealist
Staff member
I see Fuller as a 2 yr - 8M dollar player who will need to hit performance thresholds if he wants more money out of the next 2 seasons. He definitely has had his moments but they just don't overshadow his injuries and now his foolish decision to use PED's in a contract season. I don't see teams knocking themselves out to sign Fuller in the off-season b/c of his history. Fuller is probably going to to find out that the market will be extending him low money contracts with performance bonuses as the carrot.....and those will definitely be on short term offers with easy outs financially for the team.

Fuller would be better served to take a prove-it contract from the Texans versus going to a new team and offense. If Fuller can right the ship in 2021-22.....he's still young enough to cash in on his talent.

Numbers for Fuller are all over the place.

@thunderkyss said $5m. You are in the same ballpark at 2/8.
@Texansballer74 said $10m
Someone (I forget who that was) a couple days ago posted the team would franchise him - that's $17.865m in 2020 , could be slightly higher in 21.
Spotrac has his market value at 4y 16.9m per, #8 among WR's.

He got $10.162m this year (minus the suspension money of course) which was the 5th year option on his rookie deal.
Honestly I think this year was a "prove it" year for him ... he hasn't played a full slate of games in any single year and then gets popped for PEDS while posting career high numbers pretty much across the board.

He's a productive player when on the field .... just can't seem to stay there.

With Covid economics killing cap growth you can't overpay for players , there's a line that has to be drawn in the sand by the team on his value , I'd put that figure around $12m.

I have a feeling he may end up on one of the teams with more cap space to work with - a team like Cleveland stands out after losing Odell Beckham to an ACL and needing an upgrade at the position even if he's healthy and they have the cap space to pay him.

Then there's Cooks who probably should call it a career after this year with all the concussions over the years. He's got $39m left on his deal but no dead money and no guaranteed money and hasn't been cost effective here. Freeing up his $12m in cap space would be a big deal.

In a normal offseason , we'd probably see both these guys gone but they don't have draft capital to replace them and will have to do so via FA and being so limited in cap space , with the leftovers of FA.

All this makes the DHop trade even worse .... thanks mother goose.
 

banned1976

All Pro
The top 5 projected 2021 FA WR's:
1) Chris Godwin
2) Allen Robinson II
3) Kenny Golladay
4) Will Fuller V
5) JuJu Smith-Schuster

Because of the cap situation the Texans find themselves in, they can't afford any of those receivers. The draft isn't exactly brimming over with WR talent so all 5 of those receivers I listed above are going to get paid.

Bottom line, even if they wanted to sign Fuller, the money isn't there. He's probably going to sign a deal somewhere else for 3-5 years with a contract worth up to $55-80 mil. The Texans aren't the only team that needs WR help, they're just one of the teams in cap trouble.

The Texans will have to dip into the mid and bottom tier of the free agency pool to fill some WR roster spots. Receivers like Marvin Jones JR, Corey Davis, Willie Snead, or John Ross III.

On Cooks, he's received all of his guaranteed salary. They can try to trade him for cents on the dollar or cut him and save $12 mil. The real pain comes from the fact they gave up a very important 2nd round pick for a receiver that's going to wind up playing 1 year for you in a terrible season for the team.

Honestly, anyone who had anything to do with the 2020 offseason should be fired for malfeasance and I know damn well who the driving force behind the Cooks trade was. And it pisses me off knowing that guy is still around. I've avoided looking at the numbers, the free agency, the draft because I knew it would just annoy me but I finally went there. The devil is in the detail, as they say, and I know more than I want to about the details behind all these terrible decisions. And that makes me have no respect at all for the puppet masters that pull the strings on Kirby. The Texans can be a good team again in 2-3 years but only if they hire really smart football people to run the front office and stay out of their way. I have zero confidence they will do that, though.
 

steelbtexan

King of the W. B. Club
Contributor's Club
The top 5 projected 2021 FA WR's:
1) Chris Godwin
2) Allen Robinson II
3) Kenny Golladay
4) Will Fuller V
5) JuJu Smith-Schuster

Because of the cap situation the Texans find themselves in, they can't afford any of those receivers. The draft isn't exactly brimming over with WR talent so all 5 of those receivers I listed above are going to get paid.

Bottom line, even if they wanted to sign Fuller, the money isn't there. He's probably going to sign a deal somewhere else for 3-5 years with a contract worth up to $55-80 mil. The Texans aren't the only team that needs WR help, they're just one of the teams in cap trouble.

The Texans will have to dip into the mid and bottom tier of the free agency pool to fill some WR roster spots. Receivers like Marvin Jones JR, Corey Davis, Willie Snead, or John Ross III.

On Cooks, he's received all of his guaranteed salary. They can try to trade him for cents on the dollar or cut him and save $12 mil. The real pain comes from the fact they gave up a very important 2nd round pick for a receiver that's going to wind up playing 1 year for you in a terrible season for the team.

Honestly, anyone who had anything to do with the 2020 offseason should be fired for malfeasance and I know damn well who the driving force behind the Cooks trade was. And it pisses me off knowing that guy is still around. I've avoided looking at the numbers, the free agency, the draft because I knew it would just annoy me but I finally went there. The devil is in the detail, as they say, and I know more than I want to about the details behind all these terrible decisions. And that makes me have no respect at all for the puppet masters that pull the strings on Kirby. The Texans can be a good team again in 2-3 years but only if they hire really smart football people to run the front office and stay out of their way. I have zero confidence they will do that, though.
LBEZTX brought up Davis, he would be a perfect fit.

Agreed about the behind the scenes stuff. But after seeing the search committee the future looks pretty bleak unless they get really lucky.
 

thunderkyss

Just win baby!!!
Staff member
Contributor's Club
A retarded lizard would do a better job than OB.
Can we please use less offensive language? I know most don't care for the "politically correct" movement, but... I'm offended.

I'd appreciate it if you'd say, "the former HC of the Houston Texans, or Easterby's exbuddy, or Tim Kelly's old boss.
 

SnakeEyes

Rookie
Not that I could make any sense of that post, but if someone says the sky is blue, there aren't any problems. It's when someone says the sky is green, posing it as fact, goes on ad nauseam about it giving no actual facts to his claim, and ignores the facts that are then provided by countless others. That's where the problem lies.

Then he laughs in your face with the bullshit lie that he doesn't know how to copy & paste links. For the amount of his life he spends on this message board for a decade or more, if you can't do that simplest of things, you can't be much smarter than a bag of sand. And if that's the case, the takes he floods this board with are supposed to mean something?

That, my friends, is a troll. And 75% of this forum is everyone who responds to just that one person's bullshit. It's the damnedest thing I've ever seen. Hell, I've got him on ignore and I'm still responding to this bullshit. But like I said, it's 75% of the content on here, so what can you do if you want to participate in the forum?

Dissenting opinions and the discussing it brings...nothing wrong with that. Rehashing the same ol bullshit by the same ol poster, on and on and on and on and on and on and on, that's not discussion. That's playing the game of a troll.
You are part right. If you post a stat, and then you have 10 people who agree and 10 that don't. The forum tends to have the 10 that don't have to belittle or argue that the stat is wrong. I just posted recently about according to scouts, coaches and GMs Watson's weakness is his choices with ball placement. Which was originally on his scouting report and now in 2020 is listed as his biggest weakness according to NFL.com ( who interviewed scouts, coaches and GMs) to get the overall consequences. Instead of saying that he should fix this... Thay bash it like they know more than what people with 100's to 1000's of combine years feel.

That is not how you debate a subject. That's how elementary school kids act when someone says something they don't like. And I posted about his arm strength, which has been measured. And say he tossed a 70 yard pass. Watson has not thrown a 70yrd pass unless you count YAC. He throws about 50 max and yes that is good. But how hard is the pass?

We need to get a grip and treat opinions with respect.
 

powda

I find your lack of faith disturbing.
Can we please use less offensive language? I know most don't care for the "politically correct" movement, but... I'm offended.

I'd appreciate it if you'd say, "the former HC of the Houston Texans, or Easterby's exbuddy, or Tim Kelly's old boss.
I'm on a civil rights council and a steadfast activists supporting retarded lizards everywhere and I do not appreciate your comparison to OB one bit @Thorn.

I have reported your post and hopefully the mods will delete it.

#SLM

(Stupid lizards matter!)
 


Top