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Upgrading Offensive Line via Draft
- Thread starter TexansFan15
- Start date
beerlover
Hall of Fame
Texansphan
Football connoisseur
That works...
banned1976
sleeper mode
Drafting a RB in the second round w/o the personnel to block for him doesn't make sense to me. Unadjusted DVOA for Texans run game was dead last in 2021. And what was it in 2020 you might ask? Dead last. The Texans need to improve in that category.
It's enticing to grab splashy playmakers but I don't feel like this is the year for that. Get better in the basics - blocking and tackling.
I'm beginning to think the Texans might surprise everyone and draft OT at #3 (no surprise) and ILB at #13 (pretty big surprise).
It's enticing to grab splashy playmakers but I don't feel like this is the year for that. Get better in the basics - blocking and tackling.
I'm beginning to think the Texans might surprise everyone and draft OT at #3 (no surprise) and ILB at #13 (pretty big surprise).
TheRealJoker
Hall of Fame
The LB pick would be a bit annoying. But i’ve seen it mocked that way before. In Lovie we trust on the defense additions.
I don’t think it’s about splashy players. I don’t think it’s about the Jimmy’s & the Joes.
It’s been said
we need to get some of that. I’m not against improving the OL talent. But I don’t think they were as bad as their DVOA
banned1976
sleeper mode
Just straight up yards and ypg, the Texans were 32nd in both categories in 2021. They scored running the ball 8 times, tied for worst.
I won't be upset if the Texans draft CB, WR, and then RB. The Texans need upgrades almost everywhere anyway. Might as well draft BPA in every round. And that would okay for me.
Texansphan
Football connoisseur
I hope you're right but the last guy replaced Devlin and he was touted as being an Oline guru so I won't be holding my breath.
We can always hope of course.
He was also ZBS. As easy as it is to implement at the college level, the Texans have had trouble trying to implement it.
I don't know if it's a square peg kinda thing, but going to Warhop's physical gap blocking may be more appropriate to our personnel.
& the coaching problem may not have been restricted to the OL coach. We have a new OC & HC as well. I think better play calling alone will help the run game
beerlover
Hall of Fame
I warned against Campen, he was Chargers OL coach before coming to Texans, worst in league. However positive about Pep Hamilton and his work with Herbert, hence my positivity towards Mills selection when everyone was dumping on the pick.
Warhop seems like an excellent OL coach with solid resume, a Lovie guy and great fit for Tunsil and Company!
Texansphan
Football connoisseur
Darnit, now you and @thunderkyss have given me hope for this Oline agin...
Just because you spend high picks on players doesn't mean they're actually good. These high picks lead to a 3.0 ypc. They've now been through 2 ol coaches. At some point you have to admit you made a mistake and move on from these guys.
Texansphan
Football connoisseur
Either it's on coaching or scouting.
I think they were what the numbers say they were in this case. Why? Because the numbers have been the same 2 yrs in a row under 2 different ol coaches. How many years of finishing last do they have to have before you admit there's a problem?
BTW, do you think there's a correlation between the last place ol play and the finishing with 4 wins the last 2 yrs? I do.
beerlover
Hall of Fame
Ideally the two should go hand in hand. This has been the issue post Kubiak era until now. With GM Caserio and HC Lovie now on the same page. Look forward to good times returning for Houston. And feel with experience over time and now, following two teams using different approaches a little more understanding and compassion than most, but one hell of a toll it’s taken.
All of the ol coaches suck, it couldn't be the talent?
I look at how they play and in any scheme Scharping is a backup level player. Howard's avg at best.
Texansphan
Football connoisseur
New scheme and coaches should help, but I'm with you on the need to take a stud up high.
There are several I think can be instant upgrades:-
Evan Neal
Ikem Ekwonu.
Charles Cross
Kenyon Green.
Bernard Raimann.
Zion Johnson
Trevor Penning.
There are others, but I think one of these guys will be in a Texans uni this season and that's a good thing.
I'm going with scouting.
These guys are below avg players. It sucks that they were drafted so high. But it is what it is.
Texansphan
Football connoisseur
I remember vividly the moment they took Howard and my first thought was"kneejerk" - Philly jumped up and nabbed Dillard in that one.
Turns out Dillard ain't all that either.
Yep, I thought in typical Calhoun's tradition, they got jumped in the draft and the Howard pick was a knee-jerk reaction. Its not like this hasn't happened before.
Normally I agree, but we all know last year was a wasted year with the puppet coaches.
Laremy Tunsil was on that line for two years, producing those numbers, but you still refer to him as a pro bowler, refuse to trade him & have no issue with his $38M cap hiring 2023.
It’s not all about the players.
I agree on Scharping.
I’m not sold Howard is avg at best. But if he is, the run game should have been better than it was, which points to coaching.
I have no problem improving both guard positions. I just don’t think #3 & #13 is the best spots to do it
TexansFan15
All Pro
I think it’s been hard to truly evaluate Howard because he’s been bounced around the line so much. He shows flashes, but consistency is the key.
beerlover
Hall of Fame
Sharping looked like a solid pick as a rookie, then he was bounced around. Key word from Warhop about OL is “consistency” Texan OL has had none of that. It takes a couple years to gel even with best of talent. No this has been mismanaged for years, y’all will see a change this year I’m sure for the better. No where to go but up. Still need to take bpa that lift both offense and defense.
Texansphan
Football connoisseur
Tend to agree. Decent OL are more often found in lower rounds than good edges - generally speaking. Iow, you are more likely to find a top tier OL later and this draft looks fairly deep for them.
Still, if you want what seems to be the best immediately, then you pick from the top shelf.
Keep on counting those beans.
Caserio considers these guys to be cornerstones of the rebuild. You don't.
I'm glad Caserio is running things and you aren't.
TheRealJoker
Hall of Fame
Sharping looked like a solid pick as a rookie, then he was bounced around. Key word from Warhop about OL is “consistency” Texan OL has had none of that. It takes a couple years to gel even with best of talent. No this has been mismanaged for years, y’all will see a change this year I’m sure for the better. No where to go but up. Still need to take bpa that lift both offense and defense.
Give me Evan Neal at 3 and Jordan Davis at 13.
Texansphan
Football connoisseur
Neal will be an upgrade on our line, but I'm starting to lean Ekwonu.
Davis will be a nice add too
Scharping won't make it it out of training camp. If he even makes it to camp.
There are no building blocks on this line. Tunsil will be gone by the time the Texans are ready to compete. As will the vast majority of the current rostered O-line. Of course the Texans are going to invest in the line. It's blatantly obvious to any football observer.
Posters say "We need to surround Mills with talent so we know if he's the franchise QB or not." Better surround the guy with a line that can block, first.
I haven't had an issue with his pass blocking.
Run blocking was an issue, but he wasn't alone. I don't know that he's the problem
You're missing the point, again, it's not about counting beans. If you're gutting the OL because they avg 3.0 ypc, then you gut it.
Tunsil is just as much responsible for that as Howard.
But you don't see it that way. You've separated Tunsil from the 3.0 ypc.
I think Howard should be separated as well.
Tunsil missed most of last year. So no I don't see him in the same light as Howard. Also let Howard make a couple of pro bowls and we will talk. Obviously Caserios actions says he agrees with me more than you. I get why you don't like Caserio, I wouldn't either if I was in your shoes.
Your LT should be the guy that protects you QBs blindside and be a decent run blocker. Your RT is who should be the guy you more consistently run behind.
Not asking you to look at them in the same light. Asking you to use the same logic. If the 3.0 ypc for the last two years do not reflect negatively on Tunsil it shouldn't reflect negatively on Howard.
Howard has issues, that's fine. You think he's avg. I'm not arguing that.
Tunsil was part of that. 2 yrs. That's what I'm arguing
I do not consider Tunsil to be a cornerstone. What do you think he'd do, if they told him they were going to pay him according to his performance ? Seriously .... do you think he would still have a hang nail ? Could you call him a team player ? I have a lot more respect for a player with little talent, who busts his a$$ while trying to do a good job !
leebigeztx
Keep it Movin!
Can someone tell me how the Texans were able to run the ball before Hopkins was traded vs below average after the trade? What changed?
leebigeztx
Keep it Movin!
I'm in the camp of it was a scheme and rb room problem moreso than oline problem. The 2 teams in the superbowl weren't good rushing teams. TB with Brady wasn't either.
beerlover
Hall of Fame
They had to respect the pass.
beerlover
Hall of Fame
There isn’t any wow offensive tackles worth top three pick, that’s one reason so much uncertainty. Other is two top DB’s Hamilton and Stingley both have medical red flags. Next QB class, need I say anything. That really leaves 3 edge rushers and one CB, up to teams needs and best fit I suppose.
Would be fine selecting Neal or Ekwonu, just realize it’s need over bpa. Im sure Warhop would accept either to impact his position group. In the secondary however, have no idea where to even start so would be ok with Sauce, Hamilton and Stingley finding a better fit, with more pieces around them, even though any three if healthy would be bpa in 2022 class.
Would be fine selecting Neal or Ekwonu, just realize it’s need over bpa. Im sure Warhop would accept either to impact his position group. In the secondary however, have no idea where to even start so would be ok with Sauce, Hamilton and Stingley finding a better fit, with more pieces around them, even though any three if healthy would be bpa in 2022 class.
TheRealJoker
Hall of Fame
I’m good with either. Both will be studs.
leebigeztx
Keep it Movin!
Bingo. So there is always a light box and safeties back. Under BOB they were never a great running offense, but respectable especially since Watson was getting 400 yds running also. They let Hyde go for pennies, trade Hopkins, and now they can't even be respectable. To me if they add someone like Williams and a rb who can at least make someone miss, the run game improves enough to be respectable. Your running back has to be able to make people miss and break tackles in the hole. Also having a pass game that teams fear helps also.
Caserio sees things differently than you do.
I think Caserio held Tunsil out to help with the tank. Or atleast that's what Caserio's actions have looked like this off-season. Top 10 LT's dont grow on trees, Caserio realizes this.
beerlover
Hall of Fame
YAC (yards after catch WR’s or yards after contact for RB’s) two very good metrics to drill down and separate prospects.
He was a part of the 2020 issues. Not so much the 2021issues.
They drafted Howard/Scharping
I consider Neal to be the best player in this draft. Well worth pick #3.
banned1976
sleeper mode
Whatever they decide to do, I'm prepared to be happy. I was always prepared to be befuddled and angry with O'Brien.