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Training Camp Practice Updates - 2011
- Thread starter b0ng
- Start date
painekiller
All Pro
Heres some of the videos I got uploaded. There is still a lot more to go and I'll have all of them up by Tomorrow.
Not the best camera work but it is in HD so remember to switch to HD when your watching it looks a lot better.
Players just coming in. Just chilling and warming up
All the players stretching
Players start doing position drills
Texans start their O v D
O v D
Lestar Jean Amazing grab
Lots more to come. More O v D and 7 on 7 tomorrow!!
You and I must have been sitting close to each other today, I was in the back row, that was a great catch by Lestar. And thank for the videos
EllisUnit
Vote RED!!!
at the 2.17 mark walter burns K. Jack
sbalderrama
Noob
The Trio of Williams, Barwin, and Watt might become OC's worst nightmare. Lets hope.
I'm really surprised that he's back again. I had thought when he was not tendered or whatever that the coaches had finally realized that he has brought almost nothing to the table.
I feel bad being so hard on the guy - he seems to work hard and seems like a decent person - but I have yet to see anything, anytime, from him that would make me think he should be on the team. It's really a mystery to me how he has stayed on the team this long.
I'm always a big fan of continuously trying to improve the OL, and I'm a bit disappointed that we could not even drop what I consider the weak link this year...
They needed depth for camp and he knew the offense enough to diminish the learning curve. If the offseason had been longer, maybe they go another direction.
playa465
Veteran
disagree, looks like the secondary got beat not just KJ...thanks for the videos all!!!
But he made up for it with that spectacular catch in the endzone that i believe tied the game. He has his ways of making up for it.
GP
Go Texans!
There's a thread from a few days ago where we compare stats between David Anderson and Jacoby Jones. The stats show everything but drops, and JJ wins the stat war by a landslide.
Then, I believe it was DutchRudder on here who posted a screenshot of the stat that shows drops. Jacoby isn't even on that list because his drops are so few compared to other brand name WRs out there.
Wes Welker drops more passes than Jacoby Jones. True, Wes Welker probably gets targeted more than Jacoby, but Wes drops a lot of passes out there. And he's deemed to be as "reliable" as David Anderson.
We get this image in our head of the tiny white guy (The Welkers and Andersons of the NFL) being the guy with sticky hands who catches everything thrown his way, and I think it's because we have this idea that small, slow white dudes just MUST be good at catching the ball since that's the only way they'd make an NFL roster. They can't outrun people, so their "angle" for making teams just has GOT to be their ability to never drop a pass out there. It's not necessarily a racist view, it's just that we should all be honest with ourselves about perceptions as it falls along the lines of athleticism for certain positions.
It's an urban legend about Jacoby Jones being the only guy in the NFL who drops every other pass thrown his way, IMO.
The problem is exacerbated by the "Wow" factor that Jacoby brings, at least that's my theory here. He's capable of being so electric and dynamic when he DOES catch the ball...that when he drops one, it sends us into cussing fits.
Matt Schaub throws several interceptions every year. He threw one in OT vs. Ravens last year that ended the game. RBs fumble the ball. I know Arian had at least one fumble last year. Blockers whiff on blocks and get their QB sacked and maybe even hurt. Defense holds a guy and it gives opposing offenses a second life out there when they should be punting.
Jacoby will drop another pass this year. He might drop two. He might drop three. But so will other WRs, and at a larger rate than JJ.
But it's fun to make him the whipping post around here. His talent is great, we want him to utilize 100% of it, and so we hold him to a standard. It's not a BAD thing, mind you, but I wanted to point out that the issue is being blown out of proportion. In my opinion.
I know it's all coach speak, but at the end of the day, I've yet to hear or see something like "Kareem Jackson shutting it down." or Kubiak saying something along the lines of "The job is Jackson's to lose."
Ugh. :wadepalm:
Brisco_County
Apples and roadmaps
I read this morning that Kubiak wanted to get Cushing on the field today rather than tomorrow.
EDIT:
Good timing, thanks.
EDIT:
Good timing, thanks.
michaelm
vox nihili
Tweets by PHABMK6
Slaton TD, running good in between the tackles. #Texans
Reed showing some pass rush ability. #Texans
Quin is covering everything today, especially in the flats. #Texans
Nice run by ward during team drills. #Texans
Tweet from BigRon
@Steve20Slaton is lookin' like it's 2008 again. Just has to protect the pill like he's done today all the time #Texans
Slaton TD, running good in between the tackles. #Texans
Reed showing some pass rush ability. #Texans
Quin is covering everything today, especially in the flats. #Texans
Nice run by ward during team drills. #Texans
Tweet from BigRon
@Steve20Slaton is lookin' like it's 2008 again. Just has to protect the pill like he's done today all the time #Texans
The Pencil Neck
Hall of Fame
Yeah, that may have been GQ biting on the play action and/or Manning not being able to get over in time to close down the inside seam.
b0ng
Bad Hombre
The Kool-Aid is flowing strong and mighty from Texans training camp twitter updates. Everybody looks good, nobody is doing anything wrong, and Brooks Reed is letting his hair down (and apparently playing better).
From everything I have read, Earl Mitchell SHOULD be the starting NT very very soon. That makes me feel relieved for right now, until the preseason games start.
FOOTBALL GAMES TOMMORROW OMG OMG OMG
From everything I have read, Earl Mitchell SHOULD be the starting NT very very soon. That makes me feel relieved for right now, until the preseason games start.
FOOTBALL GAMES TOMMORROW OMG OMG OMG
dream_team
Hall of Fame
michaelm
vox nihili
Earl Mitchell = Breakout Player 2011 (IMO)
b0ng
Bad Hombre
That would pretty much save the 2010 draft if he were lol.
EDIT:
There are many many many tweets of Matt Leinart being an improved QB as well. I am hoping that was money well spent.
The Pencil Neck
Hall of Fame
According to Twitter, Brooks Reed just picked off Leinart who was pressured on a blitz by Brandon Harris but Maehl chased Reed down and knocked the ball out.
michaelm
vox nihili
I've been surprised at the Leinart love on twitter, and also surprised it hasn't been mentioned more here. I guess I'm guilty of not posting any Leinart related updates, because there has clearly been a good amount of positive mention about him so far.
GP
Go Texans!
Here is the link to the thread: Link to Stat Breakdown (JJ vs. DA).
I think that was a good thread that had lots of objective discussion. Usually, threads crumble and spiral down into silliness or name-calling. That thread, IMO, was a productive thread about a topic that's being going on for the past four years.
GP said:
I'm willing go bet that Wes drops balls that he has to extend himself to catch.
I think jacoby's drops are magnified due to the fact that he has had problems holding onto the ball period. Also the drops that I remember from jacoby were very catchable balls. I've seen him virtually sitting still and balls hit him in the bread basket and he's dropped it.
If jacoby didn't have a problem holding onto the ball, why do you think he did the old carry the ball around everywhere and had people randomly try to knock it out?
And I know you specified drops, but that goes back to my earlier point. His drops are magnified because he's had problems losing the ball period.
ChampionTexan
Hall of Fame
For 2010 by itself, his drop rate was 5.1% according to this link (4 drops/78 targets):
LINK
The best article I can find putting that in perspective is a FB Outsiders article written before the 2010 season saying the average drop rates for 2008 and 2009 were 5.9% and 5.7% respectively.
LINK
Unless the average drop rate declined considerably during the 2010 season, this means Jacoby had a slightly better drop rate than the league average when looking at 2010 by itself. Granted, that could very well ignore a much higher than average drop rate in his first three years (Very difficult to find stats for), but it should also be viewed with the knowledge that in that 2010 season, Jacoby had more receptions than in those first three seasons combined.
Finally (and pretty obviously), this doesn't deal with drops/muffs/fumbles on punts, but that's actually a completely different subject.
GP
Go Texans!
Not slamming you here, just trying to "think out loud" like you did.
1. I don't think we can judge drops based on catchable vs. uncatchable. Maybe we can, it would be interesting if the stat was kept like ERROR stats are kept in MLB.
2. You're going on memory. All of us can mis-remember things. I'm going off of stats on Passes Dropped league-wide.
3. I think JJ does have a problem catching passes AND punts whereby he is just standing still. I mentioned this back in the Stat Breakdown: JJ vs. Da thread (IIRC) and I seriously think he makes most his drops when he's not running in-stride. I don't know if it's a coordination thing with him or what.
4. Jacoby Jones is not the only guy in the NFL, or at any level, who has had a coach make him walk around with a football all the time. This is not, IMO, an indictment on Jacoby as it relates to his alleged standing in the league as being the worst pass dropping WR in the NFL. Any other player on any other team could be subject to that coaching technique at any time. And for good reason!
Ole Miss Texan
Hall of Fame
Again, they're completely different types of WRs. JJ's stats will always be "better", even in a bad year.
JJ had 4 drops last season on 78 targeted passes. Welker was targeted 138 times. By virtue Welker would likely have more dropped passes (as does Andre) but to JJ's credit his ratio is better.
Anderson was targeted 18 times last season and had 0 drops. ZERO. That's fairly reliable.
I think a huge reason why Jacoby gets so many complaints about drops is because of his follies as a punt returner. He's fumbled 7 punt returns. That's what gets this fanbase. One minute he'll take a punt and return it for a TD. Then the next he'll fumble it. The inconsistency (huge high and huge low) is what kills us (me).
The Pencil Neck
Hall of Fame
Texans owner Bob McNair: "J.J. (Watt) is more than what we expected."
-- HoustonTexans
-- HoustonTexans
Just a thought
With Slaton and Ward running so well and Leshoure getting hurt/out for the season, does anybody think the Lions would do a Sammie Lee Hill for Tate trade at the end of camp?
With Slaton and Ward running so well and Leshoure getting hurt/out for the season, does anybody think the Lions would do a Sammie Lee Hill for Tate trade at the end of camp?
bo orlando
Waterboy
You also have to consider that there is a greater 'degree of difficulty' on JJ's passes as compared to DA. JJ essentially runs #1 receiver routes, wheras DA runs possession receiver routes. And in line with that, it's reflective of their differing strengths and skillsets. JJ may not have the best hands, but he has the speed, quickness, and even size to get open deeper down the field. He's also a YAC threat. Anderson has great hands, and knows how to exploit holes in the zone. It's not really fair to compare the two.
infantrycak
Hall of Fame
Not going to jump into the merits of y'alls' discussion but being catchable is in the definition of a drop. That's the whole point. You could have and should have caught it but did not. Throw a ball a WR has to make a diving one handed reception on and even if he missed it, it wouldn't be considered a drop. It's a WR fault statistic which by nature has to attempt to eliminate QB fault.
GP
Go Texans!
All I care is that we're finally discussing the merits of the "Jacoby is a dunce" routine that has gone on for four years.
Is he clumsy? He can be. But it's not the defining trait of his. Ron Dayne will forever be known as the guy who ended Charles' Spencer's probable chances at being a GREAT o-linemen in the NFL, yet it was not his real defining trait. Jokes to begin in 3...2...1, LOL.
Apparently, the Texans are ready to gamble that we have enough possession-type receivers and we need homerun hitters (Jacoby).
Strangely enough, I think in the long run we have better Andre Johnson-type projects (Dorin Dickerson, Jean, Toliver) that could grade out better than Jacoby if those guys get the chance to stick around.
Is he clumsy? He can be. But it's not the defining trait of his. Ron Dayne will forever be known as the guy who ended Charles' Spencer's probable chances at being a GREAT o-linemen in the NFL, yet it was not his real defining trait. Jokes to begin in 3...2...1, LOL.
Apparently, the Texans are ready to gamble that we have enough possession-type receivers and we need homerun hitters (Jacoby).
Strangely enough, I think in the long run we have better Andre Johnson-type projects (Dorin Dickerson, Jean, Toliver) that could grade out better than Jacoby if those guys get the chance to stick around.
GP
Go Texans!
Why do you exclude the part where I said I think it would be neat to see ERROR type stats like they use in MLB?
Parsing much? All you had to do is hit the quote button and roll with it, instead you go in and cut out parts of what I said.
Acknowledge the complete thought, not an edited version of it please.
Back to the topic: People grouse about the ERROR stat in MLB, especially when you feel it wasn't an E and yet someone gets to decide it is...and it sticks. In the NFL, I think the game's officials should have instituted, long ago, the idea of a similar system to show errors on QBs, WRs/TEs, and RBs--The ones who must advance the ball.
dream_team
Hall of Fame
Here is the link to the thread: Link to Stat Breakdown (JJ vs. DA).
I think that was a good thread that had lots of objective discussion. Usually, threads crumble and spiral down into silliness or name-calling. That thread, IMO, was a productive thread about a topic that's being going on for the past four years.
Thanks for the "eye-opener". I do give him credit for fixing his problem with muffing punts. I do notice a big improvement.
Someone mentioned he catches better when he's in stride, opposed to standing still. The problem I see is when standing still, he tries to catch the ball by trapping it in his chest. When in stride, he catches with his hands.
I also notice when he thinks he's about to get popped, he'll lose focus and drop the ball. This is where DA excelled.
GP
Go Texans!
It was me who thinks there's a correlation between legs churning (in motion) and making better catches vs. standing still and bobbling the reception. I have no proof, but it SEEMS that's the case most of the times.
Again, just what I think I am seeing and not a scientific fact etc.
Another one of our posters here, Thunderkyss, was watching games awhile back and said he felt like Steve Slaton almost always tried to make a cutback to the LEFT and that's where his best cuts were made for his best gains. Again, he can talk better about it (better than I am) because it was something he apparently saw and started noticing. That's how it was with Jacoby. I started watching him to see if there was a reason or some sort of "tell" that explained when he was goofing up and when he was excelling at catching the ball.
C
Ckw
Guest
People complaining about Jacoby should go look at some threads from 06 and prior about Andre Johnson. People were absolutely murdering the guy for some of his ridiculous drops. Then he became Andre Johnson and all that talk ended.
Now I am NOT saying Jacoby will become Andre, but I am saying almost every young receiver struggles with it. If Jacoby can't get it under control and become a reliable #2 in the next year or two, then he needs to go. But for now, the guy deserves a chance.
Now I am NOT saying Jacoby will become Andre, but I am saying almost every young receiver struggles with it. If Jacoby can't get it under control and become a reliable #2 in the next year or two, then he needs to go. But for now, the guy deserves a chance.
powda
The bridge between stupid and useless is short.
I've rewatched a fair chunk of last seasons games...early in the season a lot of his drops were 3rd down drive killers. Breadbasket drops that deflated the entire offense...
JJ's best value is as a threat...his actual production rarely lives up to the billing.
Cjeremy635
Overtraining
That's great to hear. I don't know anything about this kid (I don't follow college ball), but I'm glad we have him. I keep hearing that he has a motor that won't quit and that's something that you can't teach. Hopefully he'll be a solid player with us for years to come.
Shaft75
All Pro
The Maehl kid impressed me yesterday. I just don't even want to imagine that guy going over the middle in the NFL.
GP
Go Texans!
Was only saying that you guys act like he's isolated in a chamber and no other WR or PR on God's green earth does what JJ does.
I think you watch only OUR games or something???
The level of effort some people are going to, to show that Jacoby is a dunce is amazing. He's going to drop passes. Shocker. Other players are going to drop passes. Shocker. Why remain in this place of acting like Jacoby should be on the bubble every camp because HE drops passes? I find it interesting, that's all.
Let's ignore ALL of the TDs (9) he scored. Let's ignore all of the 20+ and 40+ gains he produced. Let's ignore total yards. Let's ignore average yards per catch. Let's ignore first downs he made. Let's say that David Anderson is RELIABLE and that, by golly, means Jacoby is broken.
Not even Andre Johnson is perfect. There's just so much bitching and snarkiness about something that other WRs have happen to them, too, that it's funny to watch the antics. It was funny then, and it's hilarious NOW to watch people ignore other stats and just focus on certain scenarios in certain games. As if Jacoby is the only one who ****s up plays at certain times in certain games.