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The Rise of Hannah

steelbtexan said:
They actually would've been better off listening to some on this MB.

Example: if Beerlover would have been listened too, Donald would be a Texan. If Corrosion had been listened to, Mahomes would be a Texan.

This is the difference between a marketing org with a football division and a team say like the Steelers.
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I imagine there are fans of the Browns, Bears, Niners, Jags, Tits, Jets, Chargers, Panthers and Bengals who thought their GM's should listen to them about Mahomes while he slid all the way to the Chiefs. Let's not act like we are the only fan base that can source the correct pick from hundreds of MB mocks.
 
sandman said:
I imagine there are fans of the Browns, Bears, Niners, Jags, Tits, Jets, Chargers, Panthers and Bengals who thought their GM's should listen to them about Mahomes while he slid all the way to the Chiefs. Let's not act like we are the only fan base that can source the correct pick from hundreds of MB mocks.
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I know a few of us wanted RS to give up the extra 3rd to move up and pick Mahomes.
 
This thread has drawn my interest. I mean as a business owner, small one, my wife know the interworks of my business. There isn't a married man on this earth, especially if he's worth his salt, imo, that there wife doesn't have an opinion or helps out. Whether she is in the background or not. Hannah is his helpmate. Based on what we know, Cal is a introvert, but I think he's a good dude. At least Hannah will say what Cal won't, which seems geniune.
 
leebigeztx said:
This thread has drawn my interest. I mean as a business owner, small one, my wife know the interworks of my business. There isn't a married man on this earth, especially if he's worth his salt, imo, that there wife doesn't have an opinion or helps out. Whether she is in the background or not. Hannah is his helpmate. Based on what we know, Cal is a introvert, but I think he's a good dude. At least Hannah will say what Cal won't, which seems geniune.
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Brother, I married a hardy, plain-speaking Upper Plains/Midwest gal that has spent every day of the past 31 years calling out my dumbassery and making life/family/career better for it. If Hannah is that for Cal, I'm Team Hannah.
 
leebigeztx said:
This thread has drawn my interest. I mean as a business owner, small one, my wife know the interworks of my business. There isn't a married man on this earth, especially if he's worth his salt, imo, that there wife doesn't have an opinion or helps out. Whether she is in the background or not. Hannah is his helpmate. Based on what we know, Cal is a introvert, but I think he's a good dude. At least Hannah will say what Cal won't, which seems geniune.
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From the link I shared on page 3.

Hannah said, “I don’t have an agenda when I speak with Cal (about Texans’ business). My only thing is to support him and speak the truth to him.

She seems to genuinely care for both Cal and the Texans as a whole. I can respect that.
 
sandman said:
My point is a lot of teams missed on Mahomes. And I guaran-damn-tee you that there was a least one fan on their team's MB saying Mahomes was The Guy. You aren't special.
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Did I say I was special?

I just stayed the truth. It wasn't just me who liked Mahomes on this MB.
 
steelbtexan said:
Did I say I was special?

I just stayed the truth. It wasn't just me who liked Mahomes on this MB.
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And it wasn't just y'all on this MB who liked Mahomes. Many other fans on many other MBs did as well. When I say you weren't special, this is what I meant.

You like to frame the issue in a way that the Texans blew a chance that half of the NFL didn't blow as well.
 
sandman said:
And it wasn't just y'all on this MB who liked Mahomes. Many other fans on many other MBs did as well. When I say you weren't special, this is what I meant.

You like to frame the issue in a way that the Texans blew a chance that half of the NFL didn't blow as well.
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They did blow the opportunity because RS wasn't willing to give up a 3rd rd pick.

The single biggest screwups of the RS tenure.

I just love how you frame things. This is why the Texans are where they are at today. You're right there's nothing special about the Texans are or the incompetence that has lead them to this point and time.
 
sandman said:
And it wasn't just y'all on this MB who liked Mahomes. Many other fans on many other MBs did as well. When I say you weren't special, this is what I meant.

You like to frame the issue in a way that the Texans blew a chance that half of the NFL didn't blow as well.
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Exactly. What was the opinion of the NFL teams or media insiders who consider themselves draft experts?

I don't follow mock drafts or care to predict where players get drafted. However, looking at the draft profiles, I don't think anyone expected Mahomes to be what he has become under Reid. It's really a credit to Mahomes AND Andy Reid. It's the perfect union of QB and HC/OC.

Looking at Mahomes draft profiles, they consistently mention his turnovers, inconsistent mechanics, reading defenses and his gunslinger mentality. I don't see too many considering him a top 10 pick.

Patrick Mahomes Draft and Combine Prospect Profile | NFL.com

WalterFootball.com: 2017 NFL Draft Scouting Report: Pat Mahomes

Patrick Mahomes II, QB, Texas Tech: 2017 NFL Draft Scouting Report | FOX Sports
 
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steelbtexan said:
I know a few of us wanted RS to give up the extra 3rd to move up and pick Mahomes.
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I bet there are posters on many Chicago Bears' forums who post about wanting the Bears to trade down and pick Mahomes instead of Trubisky. It happens. NFL teams are not selecting draft picks by reading opinions of random posters on the internet forums of mediocre NFL teams. No disrespect, but besides self-glossing purposes, it doesn't matter what any poster thinks about who should have been drafted.

I will continue to maintain that Mahomes went to the perfect situation with talent at the skill positions, able to sit for a year and be coached by one of the greatest offensive minds in NFL history. Don't get me wrong. Mahomes appears to be a good kid, works hard, is talented and coachable. However, getting drafted by the Chiefs was the perfect situation for him. He immediately had a HOF HC, HOF TE as a security blanket, Hill who is one of the most dynamic WRs in NFL history and one of the more creative and flexible offensive playbooks in the NFL.

If he gets drafted by the Texans, he gets BOB, his ED offense and an overly complicated scheme that requires him to make the OL calls and read defenses immediately. Mahomes has admitted that he didn't really read defenses until his 3rd year. We will never know. However, I firmly believe that he would not be the QB he is today, playing in Chicago or even in Houston with their personnel, coaching and organizational dysfunction.

I bet if Mahomes was drafted and he struggled under BOB, you would say, "RS gave up too much for a dumb QB who cannot read defenses. Why didn't he draft that Watson kid."

The benefit of hindsight is we only really talk about those things that did work out.
---Jonathan Ive
 
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Earl34 said:
If bet there are posters on many Chicago Bears' forums who post about wanting the Bears to trade down and pick Mahomes instead of Trubisky. It happens. NFL teams are not selecting draft picks by reading opinions of random posters on the internet forums of mediocre NFL teams. No disrespect, but it doesn't matter what any poster thinks.

I will continue to maintain that Mahomes went to the perfect situation with talent at the skill positions, able to sit for a year and be coached by one of the greatest offensive minds in NFL history. Don't get me wrong. Mahomes appears to be a good kid, works hard and is coachable. However, getting drafted by the Chiefs was the perfect situation for him. He immediately had a HOF HC, HOF TE as a security blanket, Hill who is one of the most dynamic WRs in NFL history and one of the more creative and flexible offensive playbooks in the NFL.

If he gets drafted by the Texans, he gets BOB, his ED offense and an overly complicated scheme that requires him to make the OL calls and read defenses immediately. Mahomes has admitted that he didn't really read defenses until his 3rd year. We will never know. However, I firmly believe that he would not be the QB he is today, playing in Chicago or even in Houston with their personnel, organizational dysfunction.

I bet if Mahomes was drafted and he struggled under BOB, you would say, "RS gave up too much for a dumb QB who cannot read defenses. Why didn't he draft that Watson kid."

The benefit of hindsight is we only really talk about those things that did work out.
---Jonathan Ive
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Another thing is that team expected to win. They expected to get in the playoffs maybe even a 1st round bye.

& that's huge.

He could have gone to Detroit where they say the right thing & maybe half of them actually want to win & many of those may even expect to win. But there's no winning culture there & they've struggled establishing one.
 
steelbtexan said:
I know a few of us wanted RS to give up the extra 3rd to move up and pick Mahomes.
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steelbtexan said:
They did blow the opportunity because RS wasn't willing to give up a 3rd rd pick.
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No one on this board knew anything about an extra 3rd rd pick at the time of the draft. Has anyone other than McClain purported this to be factual? Do we REALLY know that Buffalo called Houston and offered 10 if the Texans would match Chiefs offer?
 
badboy said:
Yes someone said they did
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I feel like that is where the board is. One person said to draft a great player so the board is right and the Texans FO sucks.

We like to count our winners but never count the losers. By having a larger sample size of picks we can always find someone (sometimes in the back of the room) who got it right.

No one can tell me that had we drafted Mahomes that this franchise would be any better. We still would have had the OB disaster of the Tunsil/Hopkins trades that depleted draft capital, the other draft blunders on underperforming players, and contract blunders that left our team starved of money. What we would have is another version of the Detroit Lions and what they did with Stafford.

So saying we could of had another player wouldn’t change the end of the story.

We probably would have had Mahomes drama of his wife and brother asking for a trade without the sexual assault allegations.
 
TexansBull said:
I feel like that is where the board is. One person said to draft a great player so the board is right and the Texans FO sucks.

We like to count our winners but never count the losers. By having a larger sample size of picks we can always find someone (sometimes in the back of the room) who got it right.

No one can tell me that had we drafted Mahomes that this franchise would be any better. We still would have had the OB disaster of the Tunsil/Hopkins trades that depleted draft capital, the other draft blunders on underperforming players, and contract blunders that left our team starved of money. What we would have is another version of the Detroit Lions and what they did with Stafford.

So saying we could of had another player wouldn’t change the end of the story.

We probably would have had Mahomes drama of his wife and brother asking for a trade without the sexual assault allegations.
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We've never had a player you could consistently dump the ball to who could turn a two yard completion into a 15+ yard gain.

Mahomes is awesome & his ability to get those players the ball is huge.

But he's consistently had 3 of those guys on Andy Reid's team. & that's been a huge part of his development.
 
Earl34 said:
I bet there are posters on many Chicago Bears' forums who post about wanting the Bears to trade down and pick Mahomes instead of Trubisky. It happens. NFL teams are not selecting draft picks by reading opinions of random posters on the internet forums of mediocre NFL teams. No disrespect, but besides self-glossing purposes, it doesn't matter what any poster thinks about who should have been drafted.

I will continue to maintain that Mahomes went to the perfect situation with talent at the skill positions, able to sit for a year and be coached by one of the greatest offensive minds in NFL history. Don't get me wrong. Mahomes appears to be a good kid, works hard, is talented and coachable. However, getting drafted by the Chiefs was the perfect situation for him. He immediately had a HOF HC, HOF TE as a security blanket, Hill who is one of the most dynamic WRs in NFL history and one of the more creative and flexible offensive playbooks in the NFL.

If he gets drafted by the Texans, he gets BOB, his ED offense and an overly complicated scheme that requires him to make the OL calls and read defenses immediately. Mahomes has admitted that he didn't really read defenses until his 3rd year. We will never know. However, I firmly believe that he would not be the QB he is today, playing in Chicago or even in Houston with their personnel, coaching and organizational dysfunction.

I bet if Mahomes was drafted and he struggled under BOB, you would say, "RS gave up too much for a dumb QB who cannot read defenses. Why didn't he draft that Watson kid."

The benefit of hindsight is we only really talk about those things that did work out.
---Jonathan Ive
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I sure would've liked to find out and rumor has it that BOB wanted Mahomes.

Thing is this isn't hindsight. A few of us wanted Mahomes to begin with. As far as being in the perfect situation goes, Reid is great working with QB's. Of course despite what isn't popular opinion around these parts, BOB did a really good job developing Derrick and he developed Young well enough to be picked 1-1. So it's not like BOB was chopped liver when it comes to developing QB's. In fact I'm looking forward to seeing Mac Jones improvement.
 
JB said:
No one on this board knew anything about an extra 3rd rd pick at the time of the draft. Has anyone other than McClain purported this to be factual? Do we REALLY know that Buffalo called Houston and offered 10 if the Texans would match Chiefs offer?
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Funny how McClain says this and everybody questions the info. But when it fits the narrative like in his reporting on the Derrick situation McClain's word is golden. What's not disputable is the Texans had a higher 3rd rd pick than the Chiefs to offer in trade.
 
steelbtexan said:
Funny how McClain says this and everybody questions the info. But when it fits the narrative like in his reporting on the Derrick situation McClain's word is golden. What's not disputable is the Texans had a higher 3rd rd pick than the Chiefs to offer in trade.
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But were they given the opportunity? It was a shock to all when the Chiefs traded up
 
steelbtexan said:
I sure would've liked to find out and rumor has it that BOB wanted Mahomes.

Thing is this isn't hindsight. A few of us wanted Mahomes to begin with. As far as being in the perfect situation goes, Reid is great working with QB's. Of course despite what isn't popular opinion around these parts, BOB did a really good job developing Derrick and he developed Young well enough to be picked 1-1. So it's not like BOB was chopped liver when it comes to developing QB's. In fact I'm looking forward to seeing Mac Jones improvement.
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That is the myth that got BOB hired. Exactly, which NFL QBs did he develop? By the time he became the Patriots QB coach in 2009, Brady was already a 32-year-old, 10-year vet. Did he develop Brady? Did he develop Savage or Osweiler? So, give him all the credit for developing Derrick. But who else?

All kidding aside. I'm on record that BOB is a great teacher and did a good job teaching Watson about NFL defenses. He is a good QB coach. However, he was a below average OC, average HC, terrible GM and has an undeserved reputation as a QB guru.
 
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JB said:
But were they given the opportunity? It was a shock to all when the Chiefs traded up
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I feel pretty certain they shopped the pick to get the best deal possible. If not their GM wasn't doing his job. McClain said they shopped the pick and RS didn't want to give up the 3rd. So you can believe him or not. What do you think was most likely?
 
Earl34 said:
That is the myth that got BOB hired. Exactly, which NFL QBs did he develop? By the time he became the Patriots QB coach in 2009, Brady was already a 32-year-old, 10-year vet. Did he develop Brady? Did he develop Savage or Osweiler? So, give him all the credit for developing Derrick. But who else?

All kidding aside. I'm on record that BOB is a great teacher and did a good job teaching Watson about NFL defenses. However, he was a below average OC, terrible GM and an undeserved reputation as a QB guru.
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The only QB RS drafted that he got the chance to develop was Savage. So that's a very small sample size. I would say Os was developed by Kubiak before he ever set foot on Kirby.

He helped develop Derrick and Young. Not a bad job. Fitz said he learned more about the QB position from BOB than he did from any of his other coaches. So there's that.
 
steelbtexan said:
I feel pretty certain they shopped the pick to get the best deal possible. If not their GM wasn't doing his job. McClain said they shopped the pick and RS didn't want to give up the 3rd. So you can believe him or not. What do you think was most likely?
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I think RS had a deal in place to move up to 12 and if Buffalo called early shopping the pick RS wasn't interested. I don't think he ever knew that the Chiefs were trading up to 10 as you imply nor do I think he had any contact with Buffalo after the draft started. And you act like you knew how it would go down all along. You do love hindsight and make your arguments from there
 
Earl34 said:
That is the myth that got BOB hired. Exactly, which NFL QBs did he develop? By the time he became the Patriots QB coach in 2009, Brady was already a 32-year-old, 10-year vet. Did he develop Brady? Did he develop Savage or Osweiler? So, give him all the credit for developing Derrick. But who else?

All kidding aside. I'm on record that BOB is a great teacher and did a good job teaching Watson about NFL defenses. He is a good QB coach. However, he was a below average OC, average HC, terrible GM and has an undeserved reputation as a QB guru.
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All facts!
 
JB said:
I think RS had a deal in place to move up to 12 and if Buffalo called early shopping the pick RS wasn't interested. I don't think he ever knew that the Chiefs were trading up to 10 as you imply nor do I think he had any contact with Buffalo after the draft started. And you act like you knew how it would go down all along. You do love hindsight and make your arguments from there
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I know if I was Buffalo I would shop the pick to the highest bidder. McClain said that RS chose not to give up the 3rd. You can either choose to believe him or not. This has nothing to do with me, other than Mahomes was my QB 1. BTW, getting jumped in the draft for a guy RS wanted by another team was a RS tradition. So this really doesn't surprise me at all. Getting jumped and losing Mahomes actually is part of a pattern.
 
JB said:
Derrick and Young were pretty well developed long before OB
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Of course they were.

How old was Young when he began starting at Alabama?

Are you saying Derrick didn't improve throughout the years?
 
JB said:
For most of the time leading up to the draft, Peterman was your QB1
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Bullbleep

I put him in a mock or 2 in the 2nd rd iirc. Never was Peterman #1..

You're reaching and I notice how you didn't respond to the Bills shopping the pick for the best haul possible, or the fact that RS had gotten jumped in the draft before Mahomes. All part of a pattern.
 
steelbtexan said:
I put him in a mock or 2 in the 2nd rd iirc. Never was Peterman #1..
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My error. I do remember you being high on Peterman and mocking him in the second. I don't think you mocked any QB in the first. As far as Bills shopping the pick, I'm sure they did prior to the draft but not if they did when they were on the clock like you're alluding to.
 
steelbtexan said:
Corrosion, a guy whose been around HOF type QB's.
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Most on this board, thought Mahomes would be there at the pick, like Watson. Going into the draft, nobody says they would move heaven and earth to move up to take Mahomes. As you notice, these trade deals have framework in advance, not the day of. Rick Smith might have had both rated evenly and was rated the same. Nobody on this board can say Mahomes would have the same success under BOB as he does under Andy Reid. Andy Reid has receipts to show he can get the most out of an NFL qb. What has BOB shown?
 
leebigeztx said:
What has BOB shown?
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Obligatory…Lol.

3ac5dadc5dada7497e4f4913c9cc9300.jpg
 
leebigeztx said:
Most on this board, thought Mahomes would be there at the pick, like Watson. Going into the draft, nobody says they would move heaven and earth to move up to take Mahomes. As you notice, these trade deals have framework in advance, not the day of. Rick Smith might have had both rated evenly and was rated the same. Nobody on this board can say Mahomes would have the same success under BOB as he does under Andy Reid. Andy Reid has receipts to show he can get the most out of an NFL qb. What has BOB shown?
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Exactly! I can see if Mahomes was still on the board and Rick Smith didn't draft him. Then we can have a legitimate discussion on why Smith didn't draft him.

For years we heard about the type of QB that BOB wanted to run his ED offense. I might be mistaken, but Mahomes doesn't fit the BOB standard. After watching the idiotic personnel moves that BOB made as GM, does anyone think Smith should have been listening to BOB? Hell, based on what we know now, Smith should have kicked him out of the draft room.
 
Earl34 said:
Exactly! I can see if Mahomes was still on the board and Rick Smith didn't draft him. Then we can have a legitimate discussion on why Smith didn't draft him.

For years we heard about the type of QB that BOB wanted to run his ED offense. I might be mistaken, but Mahomes doesn't fit the BOB standard. After watching the idiotic personnel moves that BOB made as GM, does anyone think Smith should have been listening to BOB? Hell, based on what we know now, Smith should have kicked him out of the draft room.
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He got jumped in the draft, which happened on a semi regular basis.

When it comes to QB's BOB was proven correct.
 
leebigeztx said:
Most on this board, thought Mahomes would be there at the pick, like Watson. Going into the draft, nobody says they would move heaven and earth to move up to take Mahomes. As you notice, these trade deals have framework in advance, not the day of. Rick Smith might have had both rated evenly and was rated the same. Nobody on this board can say Mahomes would have the same success under BOB as he does under Andy Reid. Andy Reid has receipts to show he can get the most out of an NFL qb. What has BOB shown?
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Derrick and Young say hi. I sure would have liked to have found out. Another RS failure that greatly contributed to why this franchise is where it's at today. It was a franchise altering mistake.
 
thunderkyss said:
Until the day he left you complained that he was too dumb to play QB & was still making the same mistakes he made as a rookie. But now... because you want to bump BO'b you're singing a new song.

smdh
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I think BOB did a great job with a dumb QB. He got a smart QB in Young and the results showed.

As a coach the ceiling is limited by having a dumb QB.
 
Earl34 said:
Exactly! I can see if Mahomes was still on the board and Rick Smith didn't draft him. Then we can have a legitimate discussion on why Smith didn't draft him.

For years we heard about the type of QB that BOB wanted to run his ED offense. I might be mistaken, but Mahomes doesn't fit the BOB standard. After watching the idiotic personnel moves that BOB made as GM, does anyone think Smith should have been listening to BOB? Hell, based on what we know now, Smith should have kicked him out of the draft room.
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Hey and the crazy thing was Watson didn’t fit his type either. Even after DW balled out when BOB tailored his offense to fit DW. The very next year he forced his brand of offense on DW. Why because he was to stubborn and wanted to do things his way and his way only.??
 
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Earl34 said:
Exactly. What was the opinion of the NFL teams or media insiders who consider themselves draft experts?

I don't follow mock drafts or care to predict where players get drafted. However, looking at the draft profiles, I don't think anyone expected Mahomes to be what he has become under Reid. It's really a credit to Mahomes AND Andy Reid. It's the perfect union of QB and HC/OC.

Looking at Mahomes draft profiles, they consistently mention his turnovers, inconsistent mechanics, reading defenses and his gunslinger mentality. I don't see too many considering him a top 10 pick.

Patrick Mahomes Draft and Combine Prospect Profile | NFL.com

WalterFootball.com: 2017 NFL Draft Scouting Report: Pat Mahomes

Patrick Mahomes II, QB, Texas Tech: 2017 NFL Draft Scouting Report | FOX Sports
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I've always said that Alex Smith deserves a huge amount of credit also; how prepared Mahomes was when he became the starter is at least partly down to his guidance.
 
Texansballer74 said:
Hey and the crazy thing was Watson didn’t fit his type either. Even after DW balled out when BOB tailored his offense to fit DW. The very next year he forced his brand of offense on DW. Why because he to stubborn and wants to do his way and his way only.??
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In contrast. To help Mahomes. Reid changed the terminology and integrated many of the Texas Tech Air Raid concepts into his version of the WCO. He didn't ask Mahomes to make the OL calls and adjustments at the LOS. He adapted his offense for Mahomes and allowed him to sit for the year.

Based on Hill's comments, Mahomes wasn't ready that first training camp and needed to sit. But SteelB thinks BOB and his ED offense would have him playing at the same level as Reid. LMAO.

 
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