sandman
Brexit Advisor
Sometimes I get an involuntary urge to win the internets, so blocking helps keep those triggers at bay.
Keep Texans Talk Google Ad Free!
Venmo Tip Jar | Paypal Tip Jar
Thanks for your support! 🍺😎👍
The New New JaDeveon Clowney Thread
- Thread starter Marshall
- Start date
Sometimes I get an involuntary urge to win the internets, so blocking helps keep those triggers at bay.
Mr teX
Hall of Fame
If you'd present your opinions as actual opinions you wouldn't catch half the hell you do on this message board...but whatever, do you.
Texecutioner
Hall of Fame
How are you any different? It is a message board, and debating or discussing the topic is pretty much the point for all parties.
Texian
Hall of Fame
Don't forget to add, if he had JJ's work ethic which he doesn't.
Charlie Pallilo had a rant last week about Clowney, and based on the definition of "bust" (failing to live up to expectations), he called Clowney a bust. I won't go so far as saying bust, but he's certainly been a huge disappointment.
Yeah, injuries are the reason, but at the end of the day, Clowney certainly has not lived up to any expectations of a 1.1 pick. Hopefully, this year he changes that perception by folks.
It's a damn shame no matter what side of the fence you're on. As a fan, living through another 2-14 season just sucks, and then seeing the first overall pick always on the sideline just adds salt to the wound.
Texian
Hall of Fame
I do understand that most who post here on this message board believe in some form of a Texans Hokey Pokey and if they continue to participate in performing the dance they believe everything will turnout OK.....That's what it's all about.
PapaL
Loose Screw
Most logical fans have that mindset. Some of us even see improvement and hold out hope. He's played well when he's been out there. Even disruptive at times.
On the other hand you have a faction that it seems like they're being forced to be fans and follow this team There's 31 other teams out there. No one is making them watch this team. Go enjoy their hokey pokey instead.
noxiousdog
Rookie
It's not just that. There's a lot of people, in all walks of life, that feel the need to make judgments. That's the difference between saying "Clowney has failed to live up to expectations" and "Clowney is a bust."
Not to go on a philosophical rant (too late), but I prefer to reserve judgments for when the case is closed. Others don't have any issue reversing the decision later.
You are out there now with us as a Clowney fan, so don't try to deny it. Welcome aboard !
Mr teX
Hall of Fame
Who does though? Very few guys hit it like JJ does..it's what separates him from just about every player. It's what separated Peyton. If those guys are your barometer for work ethic, then I think you'll find that there are very few in this league who have a work ethic...Let alone a young kid still learning how to be a pro.
Texian
Hall of Fame
This is called taking or quoting out of context, or commonly known as yellow or sleazy journalism, AKA LYING. You're out there now, this really says more about you. Welcome aboard. Not sure this would make your Mom proud though.
Last edited:
Texian
Hall of Fame
and still some will continue to make excuses for him.
Texian
Hall of Fame
The truth of the matter is if my posts and opinions always agreed with your line of thinking we would be BFFs.
Mr teX
Hall of Fame
and still some cant admit when they overplayed their hand....
Just curious, but how is an article about Clowney from 2010 relevant to him as a Texan? Yeah that's why people call you a troll
This is a thread about Clowney... the articles you posted were about Spurrier talking about Clowney, but now all of a sudden you were talking about Mario as a rookie or second year player? Right!
Texian
Hall of Fame
I'm going to really try and sincerely help you here and I do hope you understand, first, see post #1108; pg. 56 http://www.texanstalk.com/posts/2611253/ Now read the posts prior to (before) #1108 in order to connect the dots to the conversation being discussed at the time. Good Luck!
Yes I'm aware of that and all that went on before and after. You did post the Spurrier bit after. Only you would reference a post 150 posts back like it was your most recent. And your smug condescension and better than thou talk is why no one takes you serious or thinks much of what you say. All you had to do was reference that post when talking about cutting and pasting, otherwise how is someone to know which one of your comments you are talking about at the time. Why do you strive so hard to make people not like you? It's really not that hard to make a point, you don't have to jump around in circles.
My mistake that I didn't know which of your comments you were referencing
Texian
Hall of Fame
It was Monday, less than 48 hours ago. Oh well I tried.....
I do owe you an apology, I did say it was 6 years ago, my mistake, a typo, it was 9 years ago, 2007, so for that I apologize. It was a USA Today story from 2007 that was directly related and pertinent to the conversation at the time.
Last edited:
Did you not say that if Clowney utilized his potential by working harder he could be better than Watt ?
infantrycak
Hall of Fame
Get with the program, he was putting down Clowney more by that statement - Clowney is that much more of a slacker if it is from on high rather than mediocre.
Yes I took it as a back handed compliment, but that included his recognition of Clowneys immense innate talent.
Texian
Hall of Fame
You know exactly what I wrote and just so there isn't any misunderstanding, as you may not be aware, I said before the Texans drafted Clowney that if they did they would be getting another Aundray Bruce.
If you said that, OK fine. But you also said earlier in this thread that "Yes I agree that Clowney could be a very special talent if he applied himself. I would even go as far as to say he could be better than JJ Watt if he had JJ's work ethic.", which clearly indicates a very healthy respect on your part for Clowneys upside.
But you also obviously think he's lazy and lacks motivation. Well I don't because I find I it difficult to believe he could have made it back after going thru the rehab & recovery of micro fracture to get to the point he did last year. So as the saying goes, we'll just have to agree to disagree.
But Clowney is no doubt injury prone, I cant disagree with that.
CloakNNNdagger
Hall of Fame
I'm not sure that I like the fact that Fitzgerald is/has "bulked up" Clowney's upper body........in that his problems stem from the lower body. Strengthening his hip, knee and ankle stabilizing muscles makes sense. However, any significant bulk to the upper body will increase the weight as additional stress on all of his known ailing parts. It's not like he wasn't already maximally "cut" so that the explanation was that he lost fat, and the significant part of his weight gain was in return for loss of significant fat (muscle weighs more than fat).
To tell you the truth, it's hard to believe any of the weights that are out there on Clowney. Last year,there were some reports that he at one time played close to 280 pounds, the article puts him at 270......and the official HT website now has him at 266 (his Combine weight) ..............
sandman
Brexit Advisor
It doesn't say that he hasn't made his leg muscles stronger. It just points out the visual difference in his upper body. I know it's the Texans medical staff we are talking about here, but surely there was a regimen in place that focused on his legs. Right? Or is that crazy talk?
Best guess. Knowing that his body continues to mature and strength programs at the pro level are better than at the college level. What do you think he weighs? I don't find it hard for him to have put on 10-15 pounds over the last few years from his Combine weight.
PapaL
Loose Screw
When we went out and got the top sport science guys and made some secret facility for it I immediately thought it would benefit Clowney the most. I for one am not concerned that he's come in more defined and 5 lbs heavier; especially considering his rookie year injury. Look at WR Strong, one year into the pros and his body is way different.
Different set of circumstances for Clowney and Strong came back much lighter and better defined than last year,
CloakNNNdagger
Hall of Fame
Putting upper body bulk on (which always corresponds to muscular weight when occurring secondary to a weight training program) cannot help but place additional stresses on the lower body joints. Strengthening the lower extremities by strengthening the stabilizing joint muscles are always helpful in trying to avoid injury to these structures.....but that does not negate the stresses placed on the joints by upper body bulking. I would have been more comfortable injury-wise, if we were told that most of the bulking was low so that it would be working in concert with helping his known risks by maximally stabilizing the hip, knee and ankle joints.
Last edited:
Texian
Hall of Fame
I can attest to the fact that after I lost 50 lbs the arthritis in my knee became much less of a problem.
Texian
Hall of Fame
Fair enough and I'll leave at this, Clowney is much like Robert Nkemdiche, both were consensus #1 recruits in high school and All World. However both never could live up to their hype because they couldn't commit and do what they needed to do.
Isn't Nkemdiche that goofey kid who's also doing crazy stuff like falling out of hotel windows several storys up ? I don't know man, I dunno know if Clowney is that interesting, but if you see a comparison fine with me.
Hey man something has been bugging me: who's picture is that you've got on your web page ? I know that guy from someplace ? Who is
that guy ?
Texian
Hall of Fame
Jimbo Fisher and hey maybe Clowney just didn't get caught.
That does seem to be a problem with a lot of those consensus top recruits coming out of high school. Everything is given to them and they don't have to work as hard as those who are less talented. I just hope Clowney can take a page out of Watt's book and realize what it takes to be a total professional at the NFL level. Nothing is going to be given to you. You have to earn it. As for Nkemdiche, he could be headed down that Manziel path. You know, the one that leads to destruction!
Texecutioner
Hall of Fame
Vernan Gholston comes to mind.
Why the big crush on Fisher ?
Since your handle also begins with TEX like Texian and you share a low opinion of Clowney with him are you two one in the same ?
Texian
Hall of Fame
Coaches are like every other profession, there is the creme of the crop. Lew Holtz told me that the reason he was so successful is because he knew how to win more more football games than his fellow coaches. The same can be said for Jimbo Fisher and Urban Meyer, they are the creme of crop. All they do is WIN! In addition they both have a GREAT eye for talent illustrated by their Top 3 recruiting classes every year. They say it takes 10,000 hours of practice to perfect your craft. Well Fisher and Meyer have spent their time being the Best of the Best.
Bum Phillips explained it best when he was asked about Don Shula, Bum said, "He can take his'n and beat your'n and take your'n and beat his'n". That's Fisher and Meyer.
Coaches like Fisher and Meyer will want full and complete control because they have earned it and can get it. And because coaches like Jimmy Johnson, Steve Spurrier and Nick Saban are telling them that's the only way to do it. Do a deal like Pete Carroll or don't do one at all. The fly in the ointment for the Texans IMHO is Bob McNair is not willing to relinquish that control. McNair is a hands on micro manager owner more like a Jerry Jones and not so much a hands off and let the people I hired fully do their job like Paul Allen, Bob Kraft or even a Steven Bisciotti. In essence McNair is not willing to to give up control to hire the Best of the Best so he tries to maneuver his way around it which is also a pattern of how he manages his ball club.
Selecting like a claw arcade game from the top of the talent pool doesn't necessarily equate to having a great eye for talent.
infantrycak
Hall of Fame
The tale keeps growing with retelling - now McNair is a full on micromanager.
Texian
Hall of Fame
Why is it some can do it year in and year out and others not so much. Why is it some are always top of their class successful no matter where they go and others not so much. Why is USC so successful with Carroll and not so much w/o him? Same is true for Meyer and OSU and Fisher and FSU???
ONLY Draft War Room picture where the Owner is on the front row and everyone else sits behind him. Who said Case Keenum is our starting QB? Who signed Ed Reed before consulting with the Defensive Coordinator?
Last edited:
infantrycak
Hall of Fame
We're all well aware of your ridiculous seating theory.
Pretty sure Meyer didn't land top 5 recruiting classes at Bowling Green or Utah.
And of course top players want to play for these guys, but that's not necessarily an eye for talent. It's an established reputation. And so then they get the pick of the litter. Top 5 recruiting classes are coming to them and they're labeled before they get there.
I'm not even saying these guys don't know talent. Just that saying so by their recruiting class rankings is silly. Of course coaches want those players and coaches like Meyer and Fisher generally have their run of the lot.
Texian
Hall of Fame
The scoreboard of McNair's winning percentage confirms my ridiculous seating theory and relegates all your theories to excuses, hoping, wishful thinking and lots and lots of Kool Aid drinking.
Texian
Hall of Fame
I think you did a pretty good job of explaining the Best of the Best and knowing how to win more that your colleagues....one atta boy for you.
Last edited:
Can't wait till play starts so we can see all the 5-star kids Meyer and Fisher have unearthed that no one had heard of.
I'm sure they'll shock the recruiting world when their untapped markets in Ohio, Texas, Florida, and California bear fruit.
I'm sure they'll shock the recruiting world when their untapped markets in Ohio, Texas, Florida, and California bear fruit.