YeaLikeRightNow
Waterboy
Trade Schaub, trade Newton, retire Reed, release Marciano, make Case the starter for 2014 and make Kubiak hire an offensive coordinator.
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The All Encompassing FIRE KUBIAK & REPLACEMENT thread
- Thread starter Marcus
- Start date
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Signing Schaub/Cushing to extentions early in the yr after they were coming off serious injuries. Signing old man Reed and letting Quin walk.
Has it really gotten to the point where the best that can be said about Smith is that he isn't Casserly? I've been calling for Rick/Gary to be fired since 2009 and I will say the Texans will never win a SB with them in charge.
Via Mark Berman
Texans owner Bob McNair on Case Keenum: "I thought he did a heck of a job. He was outstanding."
Texans owner Bob McNair on Case Keenum: "If we had given him a little better protection at the end I think he'd gotten us down the field again
Bob McNair on Gary Kubiak: "How can anybody get a team playing harder than this team was playing. I don't know how anybody can criticize him
When 2 of your best players R out, your starting QB is out, your still out there playing right down to the wire. What more can u ask of your coaches.
We're better than our record, but as we say you are what your record is too. We just got to get it going
Texans owner Bob McNair on Case Keenum: "I thought he did a heck of a job. He was outstanding."
Texans owner Bob McNair on Case Keenum: "If we had given him a little better protection at the end I think he'd gotten us down the field again
Bob McNair on Gary Kubiak: "How can anybody get a team playing harder than this team was playing. I don't know how anybody can criticize him
When 2 of your best players R out, your starting QB is out, your still out there playing right down to the wire. What more can u ask of your coaches.
We're better than our record, but as we say you are what your record is too. We just got to get it going
houstonspartan
All Pro
cdollaz
Rookie
I hope McNair is just playing nice for the reporters, because if he truly fails to see the problems with Kubiak, that is a bad sign for this franchise long-term. Kubiak, Schaub and all the other underachievers will eventually be gone, but the owner will always be around. And an owner that doesn't expect excellence would be a bummer for us fans.
houstonspartan
All Pro
Fair point. But, he could have also - as he did after the Rams game - simply made himself unavailable to the media. His comments send a massively bad message to season ticket holders...
STEEL BLUE TEXANS
Hall of Fame
Kubiak's leash
Lord Bills
Destruction
how could you not suit your 3rd running back when you know your starting RB is hobbled with a injury?
we couldnt score from the 1 freaking yard line.
we couldnt score from the 1 freaking yard line.
Vance87
All Pro
Just listening to 610. All Texans drive in 4th quarter start with RUN.
Gary give them a chance. Against KC you have to pass on 1st down in 4th.
Reminds me when he use to run Chris Brown up the middle in 2009 I believe.
Yesterday your run game was no better.
First and goal at 1 RUN RUN PASS.
Gary in not going to change.
5 games in a row losing with this team is a joke.
McNair don't fall for injury defense or CK find. GK is a great human being but as HC you have to do better. He will get a job as OC somewhere plus you still owe him money.
Never adjusts to adjustments. Always seems to get outcoached.
Please help me when has GK outcoached the other coach?????
Gary give them a chance. Against KC you have to pass on 1st down in 4th.
Reminds me when he use to run Chris Brown up the middle in 2009 I believe.
Yesterday your run game was no better.
First and goal at 1 RUN RUN PASS.
Gary in not going to change.
5 games in a row losing with this team is a joke.
McNair don't fall for injury defense or CK find. GK is a great human being but as HC you have to do better. He will get a job as OC somewhere plus you still owe him money.
Never adjusts to adjustments. Always seems to get outcoached.
Please help me when has GK outcoached the other coach?????
deucetx
Rookie
I doubt Kubiak gets fired but here are some things that I had issues with that fall onto coaching:
- Derek Newton still plays. That is simple and plain. This guy has been horrendous.
- Time management in the first half. That was just a poor job on Kubiak's part.
- Playcalling toward the end. No backs simply is not going to work against the blitz which they were dialing up more in the second half. If you do it then have a quick hot read involving someone who has the ability to gain separation on the first few steps. Unfortunately, not even sure that person is on our roster.
- Utilization of tight end. I saw some routes where Graham would go on a route and sit. No extension of the route or anything. The defensive back was essentially all over him so that basically took Graham out of the play and made him useless. This may fall on Graham but considering it happened a handful of times it may have been part by design which is sad.
With that said we still had a chance to win the game. Though Kubiak said he would not handcuff Keenum I think it was obvious in pockets during the game that he was. The end of the first half was an example. Coaches rarely call the perfect game but things like time management and leaving a first time starter too often with no additonal blocking is a bit much. Well that and playing Newton so much. I am just going to assume Harris was hurt or something for that to continue.
- Derek Newton still plays. That is simple and plain. This guy has been horrendous.
- Time management in the first half. That was just a poor job on Kubiak's part.
- Playcalling toward the end. No backs simply is not going to work against the blitz which they were dialing up more in the second half. If you do it then have a quick hot read involving someone who has the ability to gain separation on the first few steps. Unfortunately, not even sure that person is on our roster.
- Utilization of tight end. I saw some routes where Graham would go on a route and sit. No extension of the route or anything. The defensive back was essentially all over him so that basically took Graham out of the play and made him useless. This may fall on Graham but considering it happened a handful of times it may have been part by design which is sad.
With that said we still had a chance to win the game. Though Kubiak said he would not handcuff Keenum I think it was obvious in pockets during the game that he was. The end of the first half was an example. Coaches rarely call the perfect game but things like time management and leaving a first time starter too often with no additonal blocking is a bit much. Well that and playing Newton so much. I am just going to assume Harris was hurt or something for that to continue.
htowntexans1985
1st Round Pick
Gary is going to stay. Bob has his back......
Mr teX
Hall of Fame
& this is exactly what i was afraid was going to happen if Keenum played well.......
IlliniJen
Hall of Fame
Time management wasn't bad. Kubiak wanted to RUN OUT THE CLOCK, as he always does at the end of halves because he doesn't want to take any chances. The Texans offense screwed up his plan of getting off the field and into the locker room by actually gaining some yards and putting them in the position to maybe get a FG.
So, the Texans were performing well DESPITE Kubiak. Only when they got within some sort of striking distance did he realize that Keenum could make something happen and started to use his two time outs.
Typical horrible gutless Kubiak playcalling. He plays to not lose the game, doesn't get aggressive or assertive in any way, and we wonder why we feel this team has reached its peak under him. He has NO balls. ZERO testicles. My two neutered male dogs, who both squat like girls to pee, have more balls than Kubiak.
He's outmatched in today's NFL. This ain't the 80's anymore. Him and Wade look completely clueless.
silvrhand
All Pro
Can I buy you a beer, or wait the way this season is going it'll be a shot..
8 yrs
How many yrs before BoB decides Gary isn't the man to Lead his org to a SB?
That's if BoB even cares about getting to a SB.
Fans that want to blame Gary/Schaub should really be looking at BoB and the way he goes about his business.
How many yrs before BoB decides Gary isn't the man to Lead his org to a SB?
That's if BoB even cares about getting to a SB.
Fans that want to blame Gary/Schaub should really be looking at BoB and the way he goes about his business.
Mr. White
Retired OLine Coach
Yeah I remember that day like it was yesterday. That was after we got embarrassed by the Jets and made Mark Sanchez a crossover pop culture star.
I was so upset over that loss, I wasn't able to go to sleep that night. There's probably evidence of it in this thread. I'm sure it makes for an entertaining read.
I've reevaluated my life since then. I try to keep my fanhood in perspective nowadays considering that I have less than zero control over the way this team does things.
True BoB is going to do what BoB's going to do.
But enough is enough. If this season continues on its current course and I'm not talking strictly about W/L's then as a decade long season ticket holder I'm done if no major changes are made.
I bet I will not be the only one.
houstonspartan
All Pro
Wow, I was JUST telling a co-worker about 10 minutes ago that, at some point, Bob McNair will have to answer to season ticket holders. Letting a coach flail for 8 years - while other teams re-boot in two, three and four years - is unacceptable.
Something has got to give with this team.
Texian
Hall of Fame
4 years ago I was feeling depressed and melancholy about the Houston Texans. It was the hiring of Frank Bush and the results of that decision that became my final straw. Today I am happy and exuberant because in recent weeks I can see the light at the end of the tunnel. Sure it may be a tough road over the next year and half but that is better than traveling the same road of the last 4 years. Change will be welcomed! I can now see the potential for a way to find the answer to Andrew Luck, playoffs and beyond the one and done.
For four years the Texans have started each new year with not enough salary cap to meet their minimum obligations. As a result they mortgage the future by restructuring contracts in order to complete a 53 man roster, practice squad and the other minimum obligations for that year. This has become a pattern of behavior over the last four years.
When all you can do is meet the minimum operation standards because of salary cap restraints, the team cannot get any better. After a few years of repeating the same process the team begins to decline and gets worse. Sadly with Smubiak, 2014 looks like more of the same and 2015 looks worse.
The Texans have also released or traded many players who they have not replaced with equal or better talent. Compound all of this with average to below average drafts and you have a recipe for the Houston Texans that you see today. The time has come for Kubiak and Smith to go. In the beginning I thought Gary Kubiak could be another mild mannered Texan in the mold of Tom Landry, alas I was wrong. Because of Kubiak's loyalty to his players and coaches it makes sense to me why some new contracts were done so early. The time for a new direction and level to the "Commitment to Excellence" has arrived.
One thing Bob McNair cannot afford to lose is the fan support. As this season progresses I think that will become Loud & Clear. My friendly fan suggestions are talk to Eric DeCosta, assistant GM for the Ravens who has been training under Ozzie Newsome for 17 years. Oliver Luck is smart but would he want to go against his son twice a year?
Head Coaches that deserve an opportunity, 1. David Shaw, his teams are always well prepared. 2. Jimbo Fisher, his teams are also well prepared and he reminds a bit of Jimmy Johnson. 3. Darrell Bevell, drafted Russell Wilson and wasted no time putting him into the offense, even after spending much money for other QBs in the off season. I find that intriguing.
For four years the Texans have started each new year with not enough salary cap to meet their minimum obligations. As a result they mortgage the future by restructuring contracts in order to complete a 53 man roster, practice squad and the other minimum obligations for that year. This has become a pattern of behavior over the last four years.
When all you can do is meet the minimum operation standards because of salary cap restraints, the team cannot get any better. After a few years of repeating the same process the team begins to decline and gets worse. Sadly with Smubiak, 2014 looks like more of the same and 2015 looks worse.
The Texans have also released or traded many players who they have not replaced with equal or better talent. Compound all of this with average to below average drafts and you have a recipe for the Houston Texans that you see today. The time has come for Kubiak and Smith to go. In the beginning I thought Gary Kubiak could be another mild mannered Texan in the mold of Tom Landry, alas I was wrong. Because of Kubiak's loyalty to his players and coaches it makes sense to me why some new contracts were done so early. The time for a new direction and level to the "Commitment to Excellence" has arrived.
One thing Bob McNair cannot afford to lose is the fan support. As this season progresses I think that will become Loud & Clear. My friendly fan suggestions are talk to Eric DeCosta, assistant GM for the Ravens who has been training under Ozzie Newsome for 17 years. Oliver Luck is smart but would he want to go against his son twice a year?
Head Coaches that deserve an opportunity, 1. David Shaw, his teams are always well prepared. 2. Jimbo Fisher, his teams are also well prepared and he reminds a bit of Jimmy Johnson. 3. Darrell Bevell, drafted Russell Wilson and wasted no time putting him into the offense, even after spending much money for other QBs in the off season. I find that intriguing.
Texian
Hall of Fame
it's deja a vu all over again. Glad you enjoyed it!
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The bolded part is the most important part, and is spot on. This is Kubiak's 8th season. He has made the playoffs twice, and has two playoff wins. I don't know of any coach recently in the NFL that has had this many years with one team with this little success. If there is, please correct me.
Unfortunately for fans, the owners have instituted a perfect diabolical plan to counter any potential situation that would have season ticket holders giving up in substantial numbers.
That plan is called personal seat licenses - aka PSLs.
Franchise after franchise has implemented this plan with each new taxpayer funded stadium built, and it all but guarantees "sell outs" regardless of the results on the field. We need look no further than our own Houston Texans as a perfect example of this plan in action over many years. They brag about 11 seasons of "sell outs", in spite of winning just two playoff games and only three winning seasons in that span of time.
Attendance might go down as a by-product of shoddy product, but make no mistake, the owner and league still makes a nice profit and do not concern themselves with mass fan exodus due to the PSL "investment".
houstonspartan
All Pro
So, season ticket holders aren't important? Nope. Ain't buying it.
Most season ticket holders have accepted the PSL - which were usually paid years ago - as a sunk cost. True, no one wants to give that sunk cost up, but a lot of ticket holders will weigh giving up that sunk cost against constantly rising costs of tickets for a meidocre team.
Also, owners get quite a bit of revenue from parking (which, at Reliant, has almost doubled over the last several years) and concessions.
You cannot raise ticket prices when the product does not warrant it. You can't. That's why McNair kept ticket prices at one level for several years, and then raised them the year after we went 9-7.
infantrycak
Hall of Fame
Marvin Lewis is in his 11th year - 4 playoffs, 0 wins. But your point holds generally.
badboy
Hall of Fame
Exactly what I saw. After the run, call time out and work sidelines for yardage. I was yelling at the tv. TV yelled back that Gary was afraid of a pick six. What irks me is we could have won this game.
toronto
Hall of Fame
Minus 1999, Jeff Fisher. Actually, Kubiak has a worst record and less playoff succes than Fish, and I always felt Fisher was ridicukously overrated in this category (see 2000, 2003, 2004, 2008)
Wrong on all counts. The owners get the significant money from the TV contracts. The fans and parking is insignificant window dressing.
Bob McNair could CARE LESS what the fans think. WHY? Because they are just not all that important. Quit believing that tired myth that the fans are important because "they pay the players' salaries". THEY DON'T. They are nothing but loose pocket change at best.
YOU ARE NOT IMPORTANT.
toronto
Hall of Fame
Very true and this article breaks down just how crazy wealthy the NFL is, and why they could easily pay $750M to players. Look at the revenue!
http://www.forbes.com/sites/kurtbadenhausen/2011/12/14/the-nfl-signs-tv-deals-worth-26-billion/
Financial terms have not been released, but the three networks are expected to pay roughly $3 billion a year on average annually compared to the current $1.93 billion they collectively pay. ESPN re-upped its deal with the NFL earlier this year at an annual rate of $1.9 billion. Factor in other media deals with the NFL Network, DirectTV ($1 billion annually), Westwood One radio and others, and NFL teams will divvy up nearly $7 billion in media money starting in 2014. That is more than $200 million per team every year before one ticket, beer or jersey is sold.
Its also worth noting that since he got the team, the value of the Texans has increased over 400 million, minimum. These guys aren't billionaires by accident.
houstonspartan
All Pro
Speak for yourself. You are not important, but, I - and other fans - are. No, I'm not being naieve.
Also, when did I say the majority of revenue comes from parking and concessions? I said a lot of it does. You are correct: most of it comes from tv contracts.
Speaking of which, exactly how do you think tv contract amounts are set? By ratings. And guess who ratings are determined? By the number of people watching a particular game. That's why the Texans freaked several years ago when tv stations in Beaumont-Port Arthur and Austin stopped carrying their games. The know that eyeballs = tv ratings = revenue.
But, guess what? You're likely to lose viewers if you don't build your FAN BASE.
A strong, loyal fan base keeps the tv contract money flowing.
utahmark
markbeth
Who watches the games on TV? It always comes back to the fans.
Texian
Hall of Fame
Bob McNair cannot afford to lose fan support.
Carr Bombed
Hall of Fame
If your fan base becomes disinterested in your product, they stop showing up and buying tickets, stop putting butts in your seats.. and your games get blacked out and stop getting shown on TV. You then start losing sponsorship money from a crap load of local companies who want to associate themselves with the team in order to sell their product to the fans.. So this goes way beyond just "ticket revenue, parking, and concession sales". Everybody wants to be a part of a winner and a winner that has people beating down their door to get in and buy their product.. it's good for business.
Trust me, NcNair cares about what the fans think of his team.. it's why he's always cared so much about P.R. I mean it sure is a hell of a lot easier to get brand new shiny T.V.s paid for and installed in your stadium when you have some of the best fan support in the entire league.
I'm not selling. I never said that season ticket holders are not important.
But, please explain to me how season ticket holders will somehow demand answers from Bob McNair.
Your exact statement: "Bob McNair will have to answer to season ticket holders"
How?
Perhaps I assumed you meant by turning in their season tickets with my reply. Because this is the only way McNair gets that message.
If not, what do you propose?
It did not happen after 2-14.
It did not happen after 6-10 in Kubiak's fourth season.
You speak for ALL season ticket holders? How?
As already eloquently explained by Marcus and Toronto, parking passes and game tickets are a small percentage of the overall profit that teams take in.
31 TEAMS IN THE NFL MAKES A PROFIT EVERY SEASON. (The exception is the Lions, who reside in a third world country and have crappy management - see hiring Matt Millen as an example)
Profit. In spite of records. Profit. In spite of ticket sales. Profit. In spite of merchandising sales.
Certainly successful teams make more profit than others. But that does not change the basic fact that virtually all teams make a profit. Every season.
Shared revenue was instituted decades ago to ensure that NFL teams turn a profit every season.
QFT. This times 1000. All the bellyaching, protesting, bitching and moaning, or whatever else fans try to do to get the attention of owners is pointless.
Besides, McNair has already said that he doesn't listen to fans. Most of the time I consider that a good thing.
For anyone delusional enough to think McNair hears you:
Now some might say that this is just owner speak. But that some has not been paying attention to Bob McNair for the past 11 years. He says stuff like this because he believes stuff like this.
So get out your placards and get ready to march on Kirby. It won't make a difference, of course, but you can at least have the satisfaction that you did...."something".
Now some might say that this is just owner speak. But that some has not been paying attention to Bob McNair for the past 11 years. He says stuff like this because he believes stuff like this.
So get out your placards and get ready to march on Kirby. It won't make a difference, of course, but you can at least have the satisfaction that you did...."something".
HOU-TEX
Ah, Football!
Yup, which is why I've been saying we're stuck like chuck for at least another year. Status quo, man, status quo
Quite depressing, to say the least
Exactly. We have to know our limits and not expect things that are unrealistic.
McNair, to his credit, probably thinks he has the eternal goodwill of the city for bringing pro football back to Houston.
And if he ever listened to fans, it would have been at the beginning and understood that he just had to be the anti-Bud.
Seen through that prism, it all makes sense.
And if he did listen to fans, I still think we would all be moaning about how far back the VY pick left this franchise.
Infinite patience, man. That is what is required to be a Texans fan. Otherwise, a fan could drive himself crazy every season.
yep! If you put yourself in the patent-pending "Bob McNair Reality Bubble", you quickly realize that Kubiak is a long-term project.
McNair has stated that he admires Tom Landry, who did not have a winning season for five years. McNair admires the Steelers, who stay loyal to coaches (not necessarily realizing that the loyalty was born from championships, but whatever).
McNair sees a good time at his games. Nevermind the fact that it's all scripted, it is still a party! And look at that parking lot! So many people gettin' down and tailgating. This is more than just a game. It's an EVENT!! And fun for the whole family!
He's not Bud Adams, which is obviously a good thing. But, not to defend the recently departed, we never questioned Bud's desire to win a championship. His methods were maddening, but his desire was in the right place.
And while I have no doubt that McNair wants to win a championship, what is evident is that the fans are starting to question his methods, as well.
But, like Bud, McNair will not cave to fan desires.
Say Watt
Hall of Fame
After Kubiak's comments about still evaluating his quarterbacks and that Matt is the starter but was injured, I am now for the FIRST time in the history of my time on Texans Talk am donning the pink (in this case blue) fire Kubiak soap.
Screw the idiot. He has absolutely no clue how to manage a football team.
Screw the idiot. He has absolutely no clue how to manage a football team.
Thorn
Dirty Old Man
Say Watt
Hall of Fame
Great post, DB. Bob McNair is certainly first on the list as deserving of blame in this whole situation. But sadly, we can't do anything about Bob McNair so we have to move on down the hierarchy to the people we can get rid of. So that leaves Kubiak, his coaches, and Rick Smith.
Personally, I think Rick Smith has done an ok job as GM but even still, our team is lackluster as far as depth is concerned. We find ourselves in cap hell, and his second and third rounders have been pretty much garbage during his tenure. I know there have been a couple hits in those rounds but overall, our stars are either late round picks, undrafted, or first rounders. We simply aren't finding the talent in the middle rounds of the draft, and that is unacceptable.
If Kubiak stays after this season though, I might be looking for a new team to root for. I have to unhitch myself from this wagon and quit going through the emotional roller coaster that is being a Houston Texans fan.
texanhead08
All Pro
I could deal with all the secrets if we were winning championships, but they act like telling something as simple as who is starting the next game is going to equal an automatic loss.
That's because Kubiak plays not to lose...good and great coaches just play to win. It's that simple with Kubiak he is a flat out loser.
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