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Texans random thought of the day

CloakNNNdagger

Hall of Fame
The Texans trusted his orthopedic back surgeon's clearance of his previous back problems. But they wanted their own staff to thoroughly evaluate his foot problem before signing. He never made arrangements to have the foot evaluated prior to signing. In week 2 of last season, he suffered a metatarsal stress fracture that was reported to only keep him out for weeks (don't know of many 300 lbers that will not take at least ~2 months to safely return to play). As it turns out, he missed 9 games during the season, while playing only one back-to-back games. He was used very sparingly in the games he did play in, accumulating very sparse stats. I too would be hesitant to trust the evaluation of his previous orthopedic surgeon's foot evaluation to rubber stamp his injury, after such an initial underestimate of the consequence of his injury.
 

badboy

Hall of Fame
Everything I've read says he backed out after agreeing to the contract.
Interesting but not the way I read his tweet. That seemed to indicate the Texans had decided part ways. I had been concerned about his feet as Doc mentioned.
 

OptimisticTexan

Hall of Fame
What if we bring Clowney back?
Clowney and his agent are looking at reality square in the eye. His value to NFL teams is no where near what they thought it would be. Like other veterans, I’d advise Clowney to take a 1 year prove it deal loaded with incentives.

If the Texans got him on this type of deal and moved him to FT DE opposite Watt....he could have a pretty special season and then find himself back on the market in 2021 with many more suitors.

If I were OB, I’d suck up what ever the differences were b/c having Clowney back on defense and playing with a chip on his shoulder would no doubt be a plus for 2020.
 

Texansphan

All Pro
Clowney and his agent are looking at reality square in the eye. His value to NFL teams is no where near what they thought it would be. Like other veterans, I’d advise Clowney to take a 1 year prove it deal loaded with incentives.

If the Texans got him on this type of deal and moved him to FT DE opposite Watt....he could have a pretty special season and then find himself back on the market in 2021 with many more suitors.

If I were OB, I’d suck up what ever the differences were b/c having Clowney back on defense and playing with a chip on his shoulder would no doubt be a plus for 2020.
Like you say, a reality check for these two but we may still have a competing offer out there to beat.
And with OB and Cal making statements in support of African Americans, it might be a little more attractive to head back over.
 

badboy

Hall of Fame
It is said most players have a leap of progress from year one to year two in the NFL. That is a positive we can look forward to. Perhaps a poster will take time to list those Texans this would apply to? Scharpie and Howard come to mind but I would also include those who have not had significant snaps yet expected to play more this season. Ejiofor? Are their "pick ups" from other teams practise squad to our roster who might be new to some? Please mention their position for those who may not know. Thanks!
 

Rich Schmidt

Myopicone
It is said most players have a leap of progress from year one to year two in the NFL. That is a positive we can look forward to. Perhaps a poster will take time to list those Texans this would apply to? Scharpie and Howard come to mind but I would also include those who have not had significant snaps yet expected to play more this season. Ejiofor? Are their "pick ups" from other teams practise squad to our roster who might be new to some? Please mention their position for those who may not know. Thanks!
Lonnie Johnson CB would be huge if he took that step up. The OL as you mention is the other major areas of starters. Maybe Warring at TE sat and learned and would qualify.
 

CloakNNNdagger

Hall of Fame
Houston Texans

The Houston Texans will be heading to training camp with a limited amount of rookies. With the smallest draft class in franchise history and only nine rookie free agents, the Texans are focused on their veterans to get ready for the season.

With the Texans reversing course on defensive tackle Timmy Jernigan, Jr. and opting not to finish their signing of him, it opens the door for rookie defensive tackle Auzoyah Alufohai. "Big Z" is already in prime position to make a mark due to the lack of depth on the defensive line interior.

One of the most intriguing secrets during the draft process, Alufohai, brought scouts from all by one NFL team to West Georgia to get a closer look at him during the season.

With Brandon Dunn and Angelo Blackson was the top returners on the inside of the defense, Alufohai has a chance to add much-needed youth depth along with Ross Blacklock. His sheer size at 6-foot-4 and 320 lbs. gives the Texans a chance to see the big-bodied Alufohai mix it up to eat up blockers.

For Alufohai to make the jump and impress the coaches, he will have to outplay the likes of Carlos Watkins, Eddie Vanderdoes, and Ira Savage-Lewis. A productive camp could put Alufohai in a good position to make the roster based on a numbers game that favors him.
 

Earl34

Veteran
Random thought of the day.

If the WRs stay healthy this season, would we have the deepest/best WR corps since the R&S days? If so, who would be this generation's version of Drew Hill, Webster Slaughter, Ernest Givins, Haywood Jeffires and Curtis Duncan?

I can see Cobb as Duncan or Slaughter. Fuller or Cooks as Hill, I don't know who would fill the Jeffires or Duncan roles.

BTW. Growing up, I always thought the Hill and Givins' stats were very similar and they were the primary cogs in the offense. Looking at their stats now, Hill was the clear WR1 and the others were all WR2.
 

JB

Old Curmudgeon
Contributor's Club
Random thought of the day.

If the WRs stay healthy this season, would we have the deepest/best WR corps since the R&S days? If so, who would be this generation's version of Drew Hill, Webster Slaughter, Ernest Givins, Haywood Jeffires and Curtis Duncan?

I can see Cobb as Duncan or Slaughter. Fuller or Cooks as Hill, I don't know who would fill the Jeffires or Duncan roles.

BTW. Growing up, I always thought the Hill and Givins' stats were very similar and they were the primary cogs in the offense. Looking at their stats now, Hill was the clear WR1 and the others were all WR2.
I see Cobb as Givins, Fuller as Jeffires, Cooks as Hill (or vice versa re: F&G
 

Speedy

Yeller Dweller
Random thought of the day.

If the WRs stay healthy this season, would we have the deepest/best WR corps since the R&S days? If so, who would be this generation's version of Drew Hill, Webster Slaughter, Ernest Givins, Haywood Jeffires and Curtis Duncan?

I can see Cobb as Duncan or Slaughter. Fuller or Cooks as Hill, I don't know who would fill the Jeffires or Duncan roles.

BTW. Growing up, I always thought the Hill and Givins' stats were very similar and they were the primary cogs in the offense. Looking at their stats now, Hill was the clear WR1 and the others were all WR2.
That's great to look back on, but you're talking about an offense that was designed to spread the ball around. The top 3 WRs on those R&S teams (Hill, Givens & Jeffires) were getting 18-24% of the catches every year. Had to use receptions because targets weren't a stat back then. Duncan, WR4, was in the 13-16% range.

An OB offense has never been close to that. It's harder to equate because of all the missed time, of course, but last year, Nuk had 29% of the receptions, Fuller 13% and Stills 11%.

Even in 2015 where I think the receivers we had then most closely resemble what we have now (Cooks/Nuk, Cobb/Washington, Fuller/Shorts), Nuk got 31% of the receptions, Washington 13%, Shorts 11%.

It's fun to think of all the options out there, IF healthy, but how many teams really spread the ball around at the percentages those R&S teams did? And an OB offense has never come close.

IF OB is getting out of the way and Kelly is able to truly have input into this offense, not just being a play caller which can make some difference with regards to predictability, but having better concepts, better designs, building around the talent he has instead of forcing the square peg into the round hole like we've seen the last 6 years, maybe there's some hope to see something exciting.

Until I see it though, I'm going to hold back my enthusiasm.
 

steelbtexan

King of the W. B. Club
Contributor's Club
That's great to look back on, but you're talking about an offense that was designed to spread the ball around. The top 3 WRs on those R&S teams (Hill, Givens & Jeffires) were getting 18-24% of the catches every year. Had to use receptions because targets weren't a stat back then. Duncan, WR4, was in the 13-16% range.

An OB offense has never been close to that. It's harder to equate because of all the missed time, of course, but last year, Nuk had 29% of the receptions, Fuller 13% and Stills 11%.

Even in 2015 where I think the receivers we had then most closely resemble what we have now (Cooks/Nuk, Cobb/Washington, Fuller/Shorts), Nuk got 31% of the receptions, Washington 13%, Shorts 11%.

It's fun to think of all the options out there, IF healthy, but how many teams really spread the ball around at the percentages those R&S teams did? And an OB offense has never come close.

IF OB is getting out of the way and Kelly is able to truly have input into this offense, not just being a play caller which can make some difference with regards to predictability, but having better concepts, better designs, building around the talent he has instead of forcing the square peg into the round hole like we've seen the last 6 years, maybe there's some hope to see something exciting.

Until I see it though, I'm going to hold back my enthusiasm.
I get this

But lack Talent at several positions could've been holding the offense back for a large portion of that time. There should be no excuses this yr as long as the offense stays relatively healthy.
 
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mws

Waterboy
That's great to look back on, but you're talking about an offense that was designed to spread the ball around. The top 3 WRs on those R&S teams (Hill, Givens & Jeffires) were getting 18-24% of the catches every year. Had to use receptions because targets weren't a stat back then. Duncan, WR4, was in the 13-16% range.

An OB offense has never been close to that. It's harder to equate because of all the missed time, of course, but last year, Nuk had 29% of the receptions, Fuller 13% and Stills 11%.
I was looking at some of these stats and found this interesting. Both Fuller & Hopkins catch percentage went up with Watson as QB. Especially in 2018 & 2019.

Fuller:
2016: Others: Rec 47 - Tgt 92, 51.1%
2017: Watson: Rec 13 - Tgt 22, 59.1% | Others: Rec 15 - Tgt 28, 53.6%
2018: Watson: Rec 32 - Tgt 45, 71.1%
2019: Watson: Rec 49 - Tgt 71, 69.0%

Hopkins
2014: Others: Rec 76 - Tgt 127, 59.8%
2015: Others: Rec 111 - Tgt 192, 57.8%
2016: Others: Rec 78 - Tgt 151, 51.7%
2017: Watson: Rec 38 - Tgt 60, 63.3% | Others: Rec 58 - Tgt 114, 50.9%
2018: Watson: Rec 115 - Tgt 163, 70.6%
2019: Watson: Rec 104 - Tgt 150, 69.3%
 

dream_team

Hall of Fame
I was looking at some of these stats and found this interesting. Both Fuller & Hopkins catch percentage went up with Watson as QB. Especially in 2018 & 2019.

Fuller:
2016: Others: Rec 47 - Tgt 92, 51.1%
2017: Watson: Rec 13 - Tgt 22, 59.1% | Others: Rec 15 - Tgt 28, 53.6%
2018: Watson: Rec 32 - Tgt 45, 71.1%
2019: Watson: Rec 49 - Tgt 71, 69.0%

Hopkins
2014: Others: Rec 76 - Tgt 127, 59.8%
2015: Others: Rec 111 - Tgt 192, 57.8%
2016: Others: Rec 78 - Tgt 151, 51.7%
2017: Watson: Rec 38 - Tgt 60, 63.3% | Others: Rec 58 - Tgt 114, 50.9%
2018: Watson: Rec 115 - Tgt 163, 70.6%
2019: Watson: Rec 104 - Tgt 150, 69.3%
Goes to show just how accurate DW is. He's not in that elite company (in regards to accuracy) to Brady, Brees & Rodgers. But he's really good and above average. Also considering many consider accuracy DW's biggest fault, that's pretty damn good.
 

Corrosion

Idealist
Staff member
Random thought of the day.

If the WRs stay healthy this season, would we have the deepest/best WR corps since the R&S days? If so, who would be this generation's version of Drew Hill, Webster Slaughter, Ernest Givins, Haywood Jeffires and Curtis Duncan?

I can see Cobb as Duncan or Slaughter. Fuller or Cooks as Hill, I don't know who would fill the Jeffires or Duncan roles.

BTW. Growing up, I always thought the Hill and Givins' stats were very similar and they were the primary cogs in the offense. Looking at their stats now, Hill was the clear WR1 and the others were all WR2.

Actually I thought they had the best WR group in the league last season - When they were all healthy. Hopkins , Fuller and Stills - there isn't a better trio in the league.
 

Corrosion

Idealist
Staff member
Goes to show just how accurate DW is. He's not in that elite company (in regards to accuracy) to Brady, Brees & Rodgers. But he's really good and above average. Also considering many consider accuracy DW's biggest fault, that's pretty damn good.

On accuracy - There's getting it in the vicinity and then there's putting it on a dime. Watson usually throws a catchable ball - He doesn't often put it on a dime.
 

badboy

Hall of Fame
Lonnie Johnson CB would be huge if he took that step up. The OL as you mention is the other major areas of starters. Maybe Warring at TE sat and learned and would qualify.
I love Lonnies size/speed ratio but hard for me to see him outside. Despite what Weaver says, I think he would be better at safety.
 

badboy

Hall of Fame
Alufohai needs to beat out Vanderdoes or he ends up on PS at best. He is not an end, pure nose. Good story to read his history and he had great senior bowl week before injury but in different world now.
 

badboy

Hall of Fame
Random thought of the day.

If the WRs stay healthy this season, would we have the deepest/best WR corps since the R&S days? If so, who would be this generation's version of Drew Hill, Webster Slaughter, Ernest Givins, Haywood Jeffires and Curtis Duncan?

I can see Cobb as Duncan or Slaughter. Fuller or Cooks as Hill, I don't know who would fill the Jeffires or Duncan roles.

BTW. Growing up, I always thought the Hill and Givins' stats were very similar and they were the primary cogs in the offense. Looking at their stats now, Hill was the clear WR1 and the others were all WR2.
Man I loved those Oiler receivers but Texans have to come to play to be that good. I'm hopeful.... But
 

badboy

Hall of Fame
That's great to look back on, but you're talking about an offense that was designed to spread the ball around. The top 3 WRs on those R&S teams (Hill, Givens & Jeffires) were getting 18-24% of the catches every year. Had to use receptions because targets weren't a stat back then. Duncan, WR4, was in the 13-16% range.

An OB offense has never been close to that. It's harder to equate because of all the missed time, of course, but last year, Nuk had 29% of the receptions, Fuller 13% and Stills 11%.

Even in 2015 where I think the receivers we had then most closely resemble what we have now (Cooks/Nuk, Cobb/Washington, Fuller/Shorts), Nuk got 31% of the receptions, Washington 13%, Shorts 11%.

It's fun to think of all the options out there, IF healthy, but how many teams really spread the ball around at the percentages those R&S teams did? And an OB offense has never come close.

IF OB is getting out of the way and Kelly is able to truly have input into this offense, not just being a play caller which can make some difference with regards to predictability, but having better concepts, better designs, building around the talent he has instead of forcing the square peg into the round hole like we've seen the last 6 years, maybe there's some hope to see something exciting.

Until I see it though, I'm going to hold back my enthusiasm.
I agree but that is why Obrien went and got those guys..spread ball and give Watson better targets to pass to. He went and got TEs one way or another also and then didn't use them so I don't know... holding my enthusiasm too. Lol
 

badboy

Hall of Fame
As I said in regards to Hopkins trade, Janice McNair is interested in her personage. The "inmates" comment by her husband no matter how he meant it brought crap to the fan. Hopkins in her opinion had to go; that he asked for more money on a contract simply made the situation a football move for Cal and O'Brien. Janice as with most people thinks the Michael Floyd death was horrible. O'Brien's recent statement and the current acknowledgement that Bill will kneel is more than just trying to keep his job. I think O'Brien wants to do all he can to keep his players buying into "team". For now, Janice McNair is leading this organisation.
 

badboy

Hall of Fame
On 610 this afternoon question presented "what role player is necessary for Texans to be division champion?" Watson, Tunsil, Watt, Roby and Jordan Reed excluded as not "role" players. Sterner went with Fuller and Short with Howard. Interesting discussion.
I'm going with RB David Johnson. If Fuller goes out, we have Cooks, Stills and Randall Cobb to get us there. Howard is huge, no pun intended but we got there with only half of him; rather him for half season. I'm unsure if we'd have the championship without Hyde's contribution; therefore David. Obrien got Carlos his career best yardage and if David healthy, why not at least a good year? I like Duke but does anyone think he will be used differently than 2019? Not saying team cannot win without David but no championship.

I base this on O'Brien's desire for run to set up pass and willingness to take on DJ's contract.
 

Corrosion

Idealist
Staff member
On 610 this afternoon question presented "what role player is necessary for Texans to be division champion?" Watson, Tunsil, Watt, Roby and Jordan Reed excluded as not "role" players. Sterner went with Fuller and Short with Howard. Interesting discussion.
I'm going with RB David Johnson. If Fuller goes out, we have Cooks, Stills and Randall Cobb to get us there. Howard is huge, no pun intended but we got there with only half of him; rather him for half season. I'm unsure if we'd have the championship without Hyde's contribution; therefore David. Obrien got Carlos his career best yardage and if David healthy, why not at least a good year? I like Duke but does anyone think he will be used differently than 2019? Not saying team cannot win without David but no championship.

I base this on O'Brien's desire for run to set up pass and willingness to take on DJ's contract.

I'm gonna go with Brandon Dunn.

If he can't hold the middle against the run , its gonna be a long season , teams are gonna pound the rock inside for 4-5 yard chunks at a time and the Texans defense will see an awful lot of 3rd and short situations and that's a DC's worst nightmare.
 

dream_team

Hall of Fame
On 610 this afternoon question presented "what role player is necessary for Texans to be division champion?" Watson, Tunsil, Watt, Roby and Jordan Reed excluded as not "role" players. Sterner went with Fuller and Short with Howard. Interesting discussion.
I'm going with RB David Johnson. If Fuller goes out, we have Cooks, Stills and Randall Cobb to get us there. Howard is huge, no pun intended but we got there with only half of him; rather him for half season. I'm unsure if we'd have the championship without Hyde's contribution; therefore David. Obrien got Carlos his career best yardage and if David healthy, why not at least a good year? I like Duke but does anyone think he will be used differently than 2019? Not saying team cannot win without David but no championship.

I base this on O'Brien's desire for run to set up pass and willingness to take on DJ's contract.
I'd have to go defense. The way the defense finished the season was just ugly. Will be tough for ANY offense to overcome how poorly the defense played. I'm gonna go with Gareon Conley. Not only in coverage, but I want to see improvement with his tackling. If he doesn't prove to be a solid starter, then I think it's a big drop-off to Lonnie, Hargreaves & company.
 

IDEXAN

Hall of Fame
Contributor's Club
As I said in regards to Hopkins trade, Janice McNair is interested in her personage. The "inmates" comment by her husband no matter how he meant it brought crap to the fan. Hopkins in her opinion had to go; that he asked for more money on a contract simply made the situation a football move for Cal and O'Brien. Janice as with most people thinks the Michael Floyd death was horrible. O'Brien's recent statement and the current acknowledgement that Bill will kneel is more than just trying to keep his job. I think O'Brien wants to do all he can to keep his players buying into "team". For now, Janice McNair is leading this organisation.
"Janice McNair is interested in her personage" & "For now, Janice McNair is leading this organisation."
Interesting choice of words, language there Badboy. And you know this how or you are surmising this from what we all know, that is what's publically been stated by the Texans ?
I hope you are right because this organization definitely needs some leadership, an she is of course the sole owner now.
BTW even if she was the one spearheading D-Hops departure because of his comp demands, still no excuse for the sorry azz deal O'Brien did with the Cards.
 

badboy

Hall of Fame
I'm gonna go with Brandon Dunn.

If he can't hold the middle against the run , its gonna be a long season , teams are gonna pound the rock inside for 4-5 yard chunks at a time and the Texans defense will see an awful lot of 3rd and short situations and that's a DC's worst nightmare.
I agree on his importance but I think Blackson and Vanderdoes should be able to be at least adequate. I also believe that most talk indicates Weaver not going with traditional nose as we have used in past. Thanks for response.
 

badboy

Hall of Fame
I'd have to go defense. The way the defense finished the season was just ugly. Will be tough for ANY offense to overcome how poorly the defense played. I'm gonna go with Gareon Conley. Not only in coverage, but I want to see improvement with his tackling. If he doesn't prove to be a solid starter, then I think it's a big drop-off to Lonnie, Hargreaves & company.
Again I agree and thought long on Conley; I like him. Roby still has not convinced me of his quality but as his second season he should step up as hopefully Lonnie will. Optimistically LJ will be as good as would have a 2020 Johnathan Joseph. I see defense in a better light than many do.
 

badboy

Hall of Fame
"Janice McNair is interested in her personage" & "For now, Janice McNair is leading this organisation."
Interesting choice of words, language there Badboy. And you know this how or you are surmising this from what we all know, that is what's publically been stated by the Texans ?
I hope you are right because this organization definitely needs some leadership, an she is of course the sole owner now.
BTW even if she was the one spearheading D-Hops departure because of his comp demands, still no excuse for the sorry azz deal O'Brien did with the Cards.
Let me plead 5th amendment and say my info is based on "all my resources". Also, I did say she allowed Cal and O'Brien to trade Hopkins as football decision. My trade scenarios for DHop well before he was sent to Arizona was for at least two first rounders. The sorry azz deal (I used worse language when I found out details) I still don't get. My thought is she wanted him gone as a role model and therein lies the talk between him and O'Brien. Janice McNair may be the right owner for us if she allows "football guys" to run team but the team is still a symbol for her and Bob's legacy. Again this is supported by Bill repeatedly mentioning "Janice McNair is just sick about (Michael Floyd) and very tearful." This lengthy statement by O'Brien was way ahead of the curve of all NFL teams.
 


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