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Texans: Derek Stingley Jr.

Porky said:
Great season by Sting. The huge question hanging over his head was durability. Dude was there week after week, and just got better and better. Going forward, it will continue to be about durability. If he can largely stay healthy, the sky is the limit.

I’m on the record as saying I wanted Sauce. I thought he was the safer, better choice at the time. Everything is 100% correct in hindsight. It’s all about risk management. I stand by my call in that moment. But hindsight is undeafeated.

Bottom line is Nick got that one right. Great job Sting! Congrats on an awesome season!
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This wasn't a right or wrong proposition. Sauce is really good too, Stingley's better but are you willing to accept the injury risk to get the best player in the draft (Stingley) or are you just going to take a top 5-10 player without the injury risk? So far Caserio has won that bet.
 
Durability will still be his issue, although I don’t really see that being a thing going forward as his games will likely get easier as teams will likely stay away from him for the next few years; reputation and all.

I don’t know who he held primarily in the chiefs game, but I know Nuk and those boys didn’t get too many looks lol.
 
Mr teX said:
Durability will still be his issue, although I don’t really see that being a thing going forward as his games will likely get easier as teams will likely stay away from him for the next few years; reputation and all.

I don’t know who he held primarily in the chiefs game, but I know Nuk and those boys didn’t get too many looks lol.
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Still wish Meco would have made the decision at half time to put Stingley on Kelce
 
Pay the man Rick!


wait-nowords.gif
 
An extension very much like Nico Collins is what I expect. Again it's about the guarantee money.

As with Collins, Stingley's base + roster bonus for 2025 is ~ $6 million and can be reworked in extension but the proration of the rookie bonus can not. As with Nico's deal, cap hit for this season could be $7 million and $18 for next. That's very reasonable for Stingley.
 
Record deal: Texans All-Pro CB Derek Stingley Jr has agreed to a three-year, $90 million extension including $89 million guaranteed. At $30M base value per year, Stingley is now the highest paid defensive back in NFL history. The CB market has been completely reset.Deal negotiated by David Mulugheta of Athletes First.
https://x.com/AdamSchefter/status/1901626296376926597/photo/1
 
DocBar said:
Record deal: Texans All-Pro CB Derek Stingley Jr has agreed to a three-year, $90 million extension including $89 million guaranteed. At $30M base value per year, Stingley is now the highest paid defensive back in NFL history. The CB market has been completely reset.Deal negotiated by David Mulugheta of Athletes First.
https://twitter.com/x/status/1901626296376926597
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I love the fact that it’s only a three year deal. I wonder how much of the $90 mill was given to him as a signing bonus? Either way, I’m sure Nick will restructure his deal mid way to free up some cap space to extend the other two stars!
 
Good contract for a good player, I think it's in line with his value. Like anything else the contract is "record breaking" until the rest of the CBs sign their own "record breaking" deals.
 
https://twitter.com/x/status/1901645011327807830

If the Texans pick up Stingley’s 5th-year option and add a 3-year, $30M APY extension, here’s how it breaks down:
🔹2025 cap hit: $11M
🔹Projected 5th-year option: $17M (1 Pro Bowl escalator estimate)
🔹Extension: $90M over 3 years

Scenarios:
🔹5-year average cap hit (2025 + option + extension) = $23.6M
🔹4-year average cap hit (option + extension) = $26.75M
🔹4-year average cap hit (no 5th-year option, straight to extension) = $25.25M

Regardless of the final details, we locked down an All-Pro corner who’s still ascending at a price range that WR2s are going for.
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Regardless of the final details, we locked down an All-Pro corner who’s still ascending at a price range that WR2s are going for.
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Regardless of the details? I thought the guy was giving the details? Makes zero sense.
 
Lucky said:
Regardless of the details? I thought the guy was giving the details? Makes zero sense.
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So apparently it is still unclear whether this deal signs Stingley up for 5 years from today, which means year 4 of his rookie deal and the Texans calling his 5th year option at ~$17 million per year, or 4 years from today, which would mean that Stingley has negotiated for the Texans to forgo their 5th year option and head straight to new money in year 5.

Even if Stingley managed to get out of his 5th year option, it’s still good for the Texans because it means they used a bargaining chip of a year at $17 million to keep his contract beyond that more affordable and team friendly in terms of restructure options etc.
 
steelbtexan said:
The NFL is about to become the truly have's vs have not's.
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This needs to be in another thread, but I've had the same thought lately. I think the middle-class player is the loser in this new wave of signings of the best players. It's like many countries now, including our own. The rich get richer at an exponential pace, the ones on the bottom scrape by if they can, or end up homeless (cut in this case), and the middle class lags behind its previous pace and has to accept the crumbs handed down by the wealthy and beg for their job...or be laid off (cut). I don't think it's good for the game overall, but the winners will win big.

I don't like it, but the Texans have to play in the same sandbox as the other teams, so within that context and framework, locking down arguably the best corner in football for several years now is smart business.
 
Still unclear but I always look at wordage. Often, they use the word rework if it eliminates any year of the previous contract. Often, an extension means it is added on to the existing contract but signing bonuses that are prorated can begin with the immediate year. It also just depends on who is writing the crap.
Probably better for Houston if it is a 5-year contract now. Better for the player if it's only three or four and he can get back to the marketing table sooner. I am looking at this for now as a four-year deal.
 
Porky said:
This needs to be in another thread, but I've had the same thought lately. I think the middle-class player is the loser in this new wave of signings of the best players. It's like many countries now, including our own. The rich get richer at an exponential pace, the ones on the bottom scrape by if they can, or end up homeless (cut in this case), and the middle class lags behind its previous pace and has to accept the crumbs handed down by the wealthy and beg for their job...or be laid off (cut). I don't think it's good for the game overall, but the winners will win big.

I don't like it, but the Texans have to play in the same sandbox as the other teams, so within that context and framework, locking down arguably the best corner in football for several years now is smart business.
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So the better class of player is at fault for being ... better? You are correct, if we are going to discuss the classes of people by income, I think that should be another thread and that it will probably be deleted sooner or later.
 
Earl34 said:
That breakdown is interesting. Listening to 610, they made it seem like a 3-year, $90 million contract that averages $30 million a year and $5 million more than the next highest paid CB.
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They are probably talking apy, or average per year which could mean anything. The players only care about guaranteed money
 
badboy said:
So the better class of player is at fault for being ... better? You are correct, if we are going to discuss the classes of people by income, I think that should be another thread and that it will probably be deleted sooner or later.
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As it pertains to NFL player salaries, I think it’s a fair subject.

We are seeing the top players at their position really stretching their legs in regards to APY. I mean, it is not a long time ago that $30 million per year was groundbreaking QB money, while CBs were allowed to walk if their asking price hit ~$15 million.

Because teams are building by saying actually, we keep a few franchise players at select positions at 10-20% of the cap each, back ourselves to draft well for the mid-level players that round out a squad, and pay vet minimum for the vets who fill out the roster on 1 year deals in FA.

So yeah, there does seem to be a bit of a void forming between rookie pay scale, astronomical franchise salaries, and the 1/2 year cheap prove it deals with many players hitting the FA market repeatedly.
 
badboy said:
An extension very much like Nico Collins is what I expect. Again it's about the guarantee money.

As with Collins, Stingley's base + roster bonus for 2025 is ~ $6 million and can be reworked in extension but the proration of the rookie bonus can not. As with Nico's deal, cap hit for this season could be $7 million and $18 for next. That's very reasonable for Stingley.
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Texansballer74 said:
https://twitter.com/x/status/1901683450848944634
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badboy said:
If true, that would be amazing in my opinion. The article indicated only a small signing bonus which would be surprising as they can prorate it. Thanks for posting.
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I was close with my Feb post.
Spotrac seems to confirm this is true extension with 2025 cap hit of only $11 million cap hit. As always, the way each year is worded is the emphasis. It does appear that the 2025 signing bonus will be a proration of a little over $4 million for the length of the 5-year deal or ~ $20 m that goes into Stingley's account immediately. Most contract links for 5 years at maximum except for some quarterbacks. I think this is a awesome negotiation by Nick. I also feel this contract supports the hypothesis that the salary cap is going to really boom going forward with the reevaluation of NFL incoming dollars as we've discussed earlier.
 
welsh texan said:
As it pertains to NFL player salaries, I think it’s a fair subject.

We are seeing the top players at their position really stretching their legs in regards to APY. I mean, it is not a long time ago that $30 million per year was groundbreaking QB money, while CBs were allowed to walk if their asking price hit ~$15 million.

Because teams are building by saying actually, we keep a few franchise players at select positions at 10-20% of the cap each, back ourselves to draft well for the mid-level players that round out a squad, and pay vet minimum for the vets who fill out the roster on 1 year deals in FA.

So yeah, there does seem to be a bit of a void forming between rookie pay scale, astronomical franchise salaries, and the 1/2 year cheap prove it deals with many players hitting the FA market repeatedly.
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I don't see how you can carve the NFL out from the rest of business and then try to make a point with it. I would think any business, sports or not, will have those making extremely high incomes and then a middle income class and then those that are just coming in the door or may not be expected to remain for long.

What @Porky said is true but so what? What were NFL players saying 5 years ago, 10 years ago, 15 years ago? Back in my day, we didn't make anything compared to these new whippersnappers!
 
Porky said:
I think the middle-class player is the loser in this new wave of signings of the best players.
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The players have a CBA. If they "collectively" have issues with the pay disparity, that can be addressed at the next CBA negotiation. And tell me what "middle class" player doesn't dream that he can also sign a monster contract one day?
 
badboy said:
I don't see how you can carve the NFL out from the rest of business and then try to make a point with it. I would think any business, sports or not, will have those making extremely high incomes and then a middle income class and then those that are just coming in the door or may not be expected to remain for long.

What @Porky said is true but so what? What were NFL players saying 5 years ago, 10 years ago, 15 years ago? Back in my day, we didn't make anything compared to these new whippersnappers!
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Yep, same market forces that determine NFL salaries as determine what McDonald’s pays, supply and demand. You are completely correct.

The extremely limited supply of All-pro NFL cornerbacks and the demand of 32 NFL teams needing one, and the money to be made from having a great NFL team, evidently leave that figure at $30 million apy right now.

Look at what happens for soccer players in Saudi Arabia where there isn’t a salary cap for an even more extreme example.
 
amazing80 said:
CJ and WAJ will cripple us financially.
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Hard to tell what figures they are going to require. Waj $40, CJ $70 million per?

If that means you have $140 million per year tied up in your top 3 players, $170 in your top 4, maybe your top 5 then take up 50% of the cap, then that inflates over time so by doing these deals ahead of time you do claw back some inflationary relief by the time they toll.
 
Even though inflation has been high in recent years, NFL salaries are far ahead of inflation growth. They have been for many years, but not at the exponential rate seen over the past couple of years. 40 million for Chase? That's insane.

The influx of money might support this for now, but it reminds me of the housing bubble. Setting artificially high salary growth that is entirely out of sync with any other industry can't last forever, especially when the demands made of advertisers, ticket holders, and TV rights become too high to sustain such rates. At some point, this might happen. Not in the near term, mind you, but it's possible.

Like the housing bubble, lower—and middle-class players will suffer the most if available funds collapse. I don't believe this is sustainable in the long run.

And yes, this is a perfectly reasonable discussion on a football forum. I'm using some analogies, but my post is about football and its survival over the long term.

Aesop's fable about the golden goose comes to mind:

There was once a Countryman who possessed the most wonderful Goose you can imagine, for every day when he visited the nest, the Goose had laid a beautiful, glittering, golden egg.

The Countryman took the eggs to market and soon began to get rich. But it was not long before he grew impatient with the Goose because she gave him only a single golden egg a day. He was not getting rich fast enough.

Then one day, after he had finished counting his money, the idea came to him that he could get all the golden eggs at once by killing the Goose and cutting it open. But when the deed was done, not a single golden egg did he find, and his precious Goose was dead. Those who have plenty want more...and so they lose all they have.
 
Porky said:
Even though inflation has been high in recent years, NFL salaries are far ahead of inflation growth. They have been for many years, but not at the exponential rate seen over the past couple of years. 40 million for Chase? That's insane.

The influx of money might support this for now, but it reminds me of the housing bubble. Setting artificially high salary growth that is entirely out of sync with any other industry can't last forever, especially when the demands made of advertisers, ticket holders, and TV rights become too high to sustain such rates. At some point, this might happen. Not in the near term, mind you, but it's possible.

Like the housing bubble, lower—and middle-class players will suffer the most if available funds collapse. I don't believe this is sustainable in the long run.

And yes, this is a perfectly reasonable discussion on a football forum. I'm using some analogies, but my post is about football and its survival over the long term.

Aesop's fable about the golden goose comes to mind:

There was once a Countryman who possessed the most wonderful Goose you can imagine, for every day when he visited the nest, the Goose had laid a beautiful, glittering, golden egg.

The Countryman took the eggs to market and soon began to get rich. But it was not long before he grew impatient with the Goose because she gave him only a single golden egg a day. He was not getting rich fast enough.

Then one day, after he had finished counting his money, the idea came to him that he could get all the golden eggs at once by killing the Goose and cutting it open. But when the deed was done, not a single golden egg did he find, and his precious Goose was dead. Those who have plenty want more...and so they lose all they have.
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That is the guy that made the first Goose foie gras! He be doing okay.

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Earl34 said:
Stingley hired David Mulugheta in August. I guess it paid off because he's now the highest paid CB in the NFL and it appears Mulugheta and Caserio completed a contract without any drama. :kitten:

https://twitter.com/x/status/1828112879335415929
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Or - and this may blow your mind - Stingley got paid as the highest paid CB because he is the best CB in the league. Doesn’t matter if Mulugheta the Boogey Man was the agent or someone else.

And kudos to Caserio for holding out on that $1M dollars and not giving up a guaranteed contract. Makes me optimistic he can do the same on Stroud’s future contract negotiations. Maybe Caserio can holdout on $2M dollars.
 
Summary of Stingley's contract:

1. Signing bonus: $25 million.

2. 2025 base salary: $1.431 million, fully guaranteed.

3. 2026 base salary: $21.595 million, fully guaranteed.

4. 2026 per-game roster bonus: $500,000.

5. 2027 base salary: $20 million, guaranteed for injury at signing, and fully guaranteed by March 2026.

6. 2027 per-game roster bonus: $500,000.

7. 2028 base salary: $21 million, guaranteed for injury at signing, and fully guaranteed by March 2027.

8. 2028 per-game roster bonus: $500,000.

9. 2029 offseason roster bonus: $1 million.

10. 2029 base salaey: $21 million.

11. 2029 per-game roster bonus: $500,000.

The new-money average is $30 million per year on the three new years, and it’s a five-year, $113 million with an average of $22.6 million from signing.

The total guarantee is $89 million, with $48 million fully guaranteed at signing, $68 million fully guaranteed by 2026, and the $89 million vesting by 2027.
 
TexansBull said:
Or - and this may blow your mind - Stingley got paid as the highest paid CB because he is the best CB in the league. Doesn’t matter if Mulugheta the Boogey Man was the agent or someone else.

And kudos to Caserio for holding out on that $1M dollars and not giving up a guaranteed contract. Makes me optimistic he can do the same on Stroud’s future contract negotiations. Maybe Caserio can holdout on $2M dollars.
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Highest-graded cornerbacks from the 2024 NFL season
Cooper DeJean, Philadelphia Eagles (86.3) ...
Pat Surtain II, Denver Broncos (83.8) ...
Derek Stingley Jr., Houston Texans (80.4) ...
Christian Benford, Buffalo Bills (79.3) ...
Marlon Humphrey, Baltimore Ravens (79.0) ...
Quinyon Mitchell, Philadelphia Eagles (78.5)
 
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