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Texans’ State Of the Union...

76Texan

Hall of Fame
The Tunsil's trade was just dammmn too expensive to justify anything.
The only way to justify it is with Tunsil actually playing at the value of the contract and the Texans going to the SB, because the trade was done with the "Win-Now" mode on steroid.
And that has very little chance of happening, like next to Nil.
And I don't think I've ever seen a franchised LT getting that much help in pass pro.
When you pay a guy that much, you expect to see him on an island the vast majority of the time.
 

Corrosion

Idealist
Staff member
That has yet to be determined. I didn't like the trades on face value, but it's kinda like draft picks. We've gotta see how they pan out before calling them great or bad. OB has all kinds of excuses for anything and everything being a clusterf@ck in 2020.

Honestly I think the Tunsil deal looks worse with every passing week.
They paid for a superstar in both assets to acquire and cap space to retain him and they are getting a little above average player.
He's not been a difference maker - Just better than what we had. The offense actually averaged more PPG the year before he came here than since - with Davenport & Lamm at the T spots.

Hopkins was his normal self this past Sunday - 14 catches , 10.78ypc , 8 of those 14 for first downs. and David Johnson , sure he had a solid game but .... didn't move the needle.
Still arguably the leagues top WR and undoubtedly in the top 3-4 at the position at worst.

Clowney .... meh , that was a tough deal. Injuries and all really made it impossible to pay him , don't really think they got much value in the trade tho.
 

dream_team

Hall of Fame
Clowney .... meh , that was a tough deal. Injuries and all really made it impossible to pay him , don't really think they got much value in the trade tho.
Like what 76 said... what made the Clowney deal bad was the timing. They picked the absolute worst time to trade him, leaving the Texans very little options, thus "forced" to accept a bad deal.

After the 2017 season, the Texans should have made up their mind on their long term goals with JD. Are they going to commit to him, or look to trade for him. Instead, they waited til the very end to decide what they're going to do.
 

Texansballer74

Hall of Fame
The Clowney's trade was bad because of the timing. If they know they can't or don't want to accomodate a deal with him, they needed to do the trade before the draft.
Once the draft is done, a number of teams would have already settled their pash rush position either through the dratt or free agency.
That severely limits the prospects, thus losing any leverage.
Martin is just a flash player and a late third rounder has very little chance of becoming an impact player under O'Brien.
Didn't you hear him talk about how difficult it is to draft players?
Dang. He doesn't even trust himself as an evaluator of talent or to develop guys. Remember?
He'd rather have guys like Tunsil, Still, Cobb, and on and on.
Not only that he said it was difficult to coach up rookie left tackles too. Lol dude really doesn’t want to coach up 1st rounders thus the reason why he got rid of those draft picks. Lol
 

gafftop

All Pro
BO'b is the worst type of coach/GM. Thinks he knows everything and is a genius but in reality it is the opposite. I would rather have Forrest Gump as coach because at least he would know he needs help and get it. Also he knows who to talk to and what to say almost like a con man because he sure has McNair believing his crap. I am not calling BO'b a con man because he truly believes everything he says and does is genius. I actually think he is a good man just delusional.

His latest screw ups may do him in though. Giving away the future of the team for Tunsil in draft picks and cap space.
First trading away Hopkins and then getting no where near market value in return.
Signing old broken down receivers, taking the Johnson contract.
Cussing out fans is I guess nothing.

The sad thing is this the damage done will take years to recover from. He is GIVING away all of our collateral, cap space and draft picks and getting nothing in return. But again McNair is letting all this happen.
 

TheKDog

Hall of Fame
Contributor's Club
BO'b is the worst type of coach/GM. Thinks he knows everything and is a genius but in reality it is the opposite. I would rather have Forrest Gump as coach because at least he would know he needs help and get it. Also he knows who to talk to and what to say almost like a con man because he sure has McNair believing his crap. I am not calling BO'b a con man because he truly believes everything he says and does is genius. I actually think he is a good man just delusional.

His latest screw ups may do him in though. Giving away the future of the team for Tunsil in draft picks and cap space.
First trading away Hopkins and then getting no where near market value in return.
Signing old broken down receivers, taking the Johnson contract.
Cussing out fans is I guess nothing.

The sad thing is this the damage done will take years to recover from. He is GIVING away all of our collateral, cap space and draft picks and getting nothing in return. But again McNair is letting all this happen.
No first round pick until 2022 and near the bottom in capspace through 2024
 

banned1976

Fire Bill O’Brien, maybe?
The way I see it:

Watson will be around 30 years old before the Texans have some competent players around him. Because I believe in order to be competing for an AFC championship, the Texans will have to go through at least one more year (2021) of O'Brien's incompetence. In 2022, the Texans will have a new GM and HC. They're going to purge a lot of contracts and hopefully stockpile draft picks. In 2024, your first and second year players start to round out. In 2025, the team will hopefully be competitive against the better teams in the NFL.

Strange things happen in the NFL. It's not uncommon for teams to go from worst to first in one year. But you have to start somewhere, and that starts with removing O'Brien. The longer Cal and Janice wait, the longer it's going to take for the team to improve. As we have seen, BoB's "bold moves" can blow up in his face and do lasting damage to the organization's future.
 
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steelbtexan

King of the W. B. Club
Contributor's Club
The way I see it:

Watson will be around 30 years old before the Texans have some competent players around him. Because I believe in order to be competing for an AFC championship, the Texans will have to go through at least one more year (2021) of O'Brien's incompetence. In 2022, the Texans will have a new GM and HC. They're going to purge a lot of contracts and hopefully stockpile draft picks. In 2024, your first and second year players start to round out. In 2025, the team will hopefully be competitive against the better teams in the NFL.

Strange things happen in the NFL. It's not uncommon for teams to go from worst to first in one year. But you have to start somewhere, and that starts with removing O'Brien. The longer Cal and Nancy wait, the longer it's going to take for the team to improve. As we have seen, BoB's "bold moves" can blow up in his face and do lasting damage to the organization's future.
I agree with this post.

But there will be no championships with DW4. Hopefully a new HC will be in place by the start of the 2023 season so the new HC can see if he can fix what's wrong with DW4 (He wont be able to fix what's wrong with DW4 just like Kubiak wasn't able to fix Carr.) and then the Texans org can start over again with a bunch of young talent and the new HC and hopefully GM can set out to find their QB of the future. (Just like Kubiak/RS did.)

If this doesn't happen in this time frame then the future is bleak. Anywho, it's going to be a long 4 yrs.
 

dream_team

Hall of Fame
I agree with this post.

But there will be no championships with DW4. Hopefully a new HC will be in place by the start of the 2023 season so the new HC can see if he can fix what's wrong with DW4 (He wont be able to fix what's wrong with DW4 just like Kubiak wasn't able to fix Carr.) and then the Texans org can start over again with a bunch of young talent and the new HC and hopefully GM can set out to find their QB of the future. (Just like Kubiak/RS did.)

If this doesn't happen in this time frame then the future is bleak. Anywho, it's going to be a long 4 yrs.
I don't understand why (after 4 years) you were willing to give BOB a 2nd chance under a new GM regime. (remember, according to you, this was supposed to be the end of the "rebuild")

But no 2nd chances for DW4 under a new regime?
 

steelbtexan

King of the W. B. Club
Contributor's Club
I don't understand why (after 4 years) you were willing to give BOB a 2nd chance under a new GM regime. (remember, according to you, this was supposed to be the end of the "rebuild")

But no 2nd chances for DW4 under a new regime?
He's going to get a 2nd chance under a new regime. But I don't think he's going to be successful enough to bring a championship to Kirby and I hope I'm wrong about this.
 

steelbtexan

King of the W. B. Club
Contributor's Club
Shocking

Carr and DW4 have 1 thing in common, they both were/are immensely gifted athletes who couldn't learn how to play the QB position at a championship level in the NFL.

While the OL stunk yesterday and certainly needs to improve, unless DW4 stops locking onto his 1st read on a fairly consistent basis he will continue to have 7 bad games in a row and counting. DW4 threw a bad int and made a terrible throw on what should've been an easy completion. You can say all QB's make bad throws and this is true. But those throws finished doing the Texans in. The only plays in the game that were bigger was the Coutee fumble (I would've cut him today BTW. Gotta have accountability) and the Ravens 4th and 1 TD run.

The difference between winning and losing in the NFL is so small and 4 plays like can be the diffence between winning a game and losing be a couple of TD's. You gotta protect the ball if you want to beat the best teams and the Texans, not just DW4 have failed at this.

Cam is able to come in on short notice and perform in a new offense. Yet DW4's still struggling going into what, yr 4 or 5 I've lost track. Yet some on here think he's going to improve enough to be a championship level QB. This just in, it ain't gonna happen. It's going to be a long 4 yrs, and to think they wasted 160 million on this guy and ruined their cap to the point there's no way they will win a championship. But hey DW4 fanboys he got paid and that's what matters most.

This article is nothing more than an excuse laden DW4 puff piece.
 

OptimisticTexan

6 Years- 1 Game and Counting!!!!
Shocking

Carr and DW4 have 1 thing in common, they both were/are immensely gifted athletes who couldn't learn how to play the QB position at a championship level in the NFL.

While the OL stunk yesterday and certainly needs to improve, unless DW4 stops locking onto his 1st read on a fairly consistent basis he will continue to have 7 bad games in a row and counting. DW4 threw a bad int and made a terrible throw on what should've been an easy completion. You can say all QB's make bad throws and this is true. But those throws finished doing the Texans in. The only plays in the game that were bigger was the Coutee fumble (I would've cut him today BTW. Gotta have accountability) and the Ravens 4th and 1 TD run.

The difference between winning and losing in the NFL is so small and 4 plays like can be the diffence between winning a game and losing be a couple of TD's. You gotta protect the ball if you want to beat the best teams and the Texans, not just DW4 have failed at this.

Cam is able to come in on short notice and perform in a new offense. Yet DW4's still struggling going into what, yr 4 or 5 I've lost track. Yet some on here think he's going to improve enough to be a championship level QB. This just in, it ain't gonna happen. It's going to be a long 4 yrs, and to think they wasted 160 million on this guy and ruined their cap to the point there's no way they will win a championship. But hey DW4 fanboys he got paid and that's what matters most.

This article is nothing more than an excuse laden DW4 puff piece.
I will agree that both were talented and gifted QB's coming into the NFL.....and that's exactly where the agreement stops.

Your under some kind of fog as to exactly what kind of organization both QB's were selected by via the NFL Draft. You present your argument as if both were selected by an elite organization with a solid front office, coaching staff and solid talent on both sides of the ball. When did the Texans ever confuse you for an elite organization? Especially when Carr and Watson were drafted......when?

The Texans organization is so dysfunctional that even if they had drafted Tom Brady or Ben Rothlisberger during the teams run(s) under Casserly/Capers or Smith/O'Brien they might as well have greeted them at the front door with a shovel so they could out back and dig their NFL graves. I mean......what the hail kind of organization do you think the Texans represent to potential NFL players?

Carr and Watson could've both been different NFL QB's and sporting completely different resumes had they been drafted by top organization(s). The Texans have been nothing more than a model of shite. Has this organization ever hired a top notch GM or HC? Everyone on this board knows the answer is no. As the old saying goes, you reap what you sow.
 
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steelbtexan

King of the W. B. Club
Contributor's Club
I will agree that both were talented and gifted QB's coming into the NFL.....and that's exactly where the agreement stops.

Your under some kind of fog as to exactly what kind of organization both QB's were selected by via the NFL Draft. You present your argument as if both were selected by elite an organization with a solid front offices, coaching staff and solid talent on both sides of the ball. When did the Texans ever confuse you for an elite organization? Especially when Carr and Watson were drafted......when?

The Texans organization is so dysfunctional that even if they had drafted Tom Brady or Ben Rothlisberger during the teams run(s) under Casserly/Capers or Smith/O'Brien they might as well have greeted them at the front door with a shovel so they could out back and dig their NFL graves. I mean......what the hail kind of organization do you think the Texans represent to potential NFL players?

Carr and Watson could've both been different NFL QB's And sporting very different resumes had they been drafted by top organization(s). The Texans have been nothing more than a model of shite. Has this organization ever hired a top notch GM or HC? Everyone on this board knows the answer is no. As the old saying goes, you reap what you sow.
While I agree with this post, Kubiak is one of the greatest teachers of QB play in NFL history. He learned under the best QB coach that has ever lived. Although I guess you could debate who was better at teaching QB's HOF Walsh or HOF Gillman. Anyways, Carr had the best of teachers to teach QB play.

DW4 hasn't had that level of teaching yet, although Hoyer/Fitz said they learned more about QB play under BOB than they have anywhere else they've played. This is 1 reason I think what's wrong with DW4 is unfixable.
 

theCATALYST

"Fake" Fan
While I agree with this post, Kubiak is one of the greatest teachers of QB play in NFL history. He learned under the best QB coach that has ever lived. Although I guess you could debate who was better at teaching QB's HOF Walsh or HOF Gillman. Anyways, Carr had the best of teachers to teach QB play.

DW4 hasn't had that level of teaching yet, although Hoyer/Fitz said they learned more about QB play under BOB than they have anywhere else they've played. This is 1 reason I think what's wrong with DW4 is unfixable.
I think it has more to do with OB's style of offense is a better fit for Hoyer/Fitz whereas Rick drafted DW4 and OB is too rigid with his offense to adjust to DW4's strengths.
 

steelbtexan

King of the W. B. Club
Contributor's Club
I think it has more to do with OB's style of offense is a better fit for Hoyer/Fitz whereas Rick drafted DW4 and OB is too rigid with his offense to adjust to DW4's strengths.
This could be true,

But how do you teach a QB not to lock onto his 1st read like DW4 does? Can it be done? I'm guessing no and certainly not by BOB.

Why do you think Fitz/Hoyer were better fits in BOB's offense?
 

Texansballer74

Hall of Fame
I think it has more to do with OB's style of offense is a better fit for Hoyer/Fitz whereas Rick drafted DW4 and OB is too rigid with his offense to adjust to DW4's strengths.
My thing is why pay that many that type of money if you’re not going to do everything in your power to help him and the organization succeed. Why is OB so freaking stubborn?
 

theCATALYST

"Fake" Fan
This could be true,

But how do you teach a QB not to lock onto his 1st read like DW4 does? Can it be done? I'm guessing no and certainly not by BOB.

Why do you think Fitz/Hoyer were better fits in BOB's offense?
I don't think Hoyer/Fitz are bad quarterbacks to be honest. I just don't think either can place a team on their shoulders and will them to a win.
I believe DW4 does have this trait. If we could mix the three QB's....we would probably have our championship caliber player under center.
 

steelbtexan

King of the W. B. Club
Contributor's Club
My thing is why pay that many that type of money if you’re not going to do everything in your power to help him and the organization succeed. Why is OB so freaking stubborn?
I've asked why pay him that much before the contract was done? They've assured themselves of a long 4 yrs.

Is it possible DW4 just ain't that good and although he may be better under new coaching he's still not nor will he ever be a NFL championship level QB?
 

Earl34

Veteran
This could be true,

But how do you teach a QB not to lock onto his 1st read like DW4 does? Can it be done? I'm guessing no and certainly not by BOB.

Why do you think Fitz/Hoyer were better fits in BOB's offense?
Out of curiosity. What makes you say Fitz/Hoyer were better fits? Could their years of NFL experience and being exposed to other NFL schemes play a role in your fond memories of their performances?
  • When Hoyer came here. He was 30 years old, had spent three years under Belichick and had 10 years of NFL experience.
  • When Fitz came here. He was 32 years old, had played on six different teams and systems and had 14 years of NFL experience.
Finally, if Fitz/Hoyer were such great fits why did they only last one year in Houston? Do you think their experience and situation are similar to what we have with Watson? I think you are chasing a false narrative.
 
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Texansballer74

Hall of Fame
Out of curiosity. What makes you say Fitz/Hoyer were better fits?
  • When Hoyer came here. He was 30 years old, had spent three years under Belichick and had 10 years of NFL experience.
  • When Fitz came here. He was 32 years old, had played on six different teams and systems and had 14 years of NFL experience.
Finally, if Fitz/Hoyer were such great fits why did they only last one year in Houston? Do you think their experience and situation are similar to what we have with Watson? I think you are chasing a false narrative.

You know the hate is real when someone says Hoyer and Fitzpatrick were a better fit., lol man I almost flipped my truck over laughing at that comment.


Comedy at it's finest!
 
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Double Barrel

Moderator / Admin
Staff member
Contributor's Club
While I agree with this post, Kubiak is one of the greatest teachers of QB play in NFL history. He learned under the best QB coach that has ever lived. Although I guess you could debate who was better at teaching QB's HOF Walsh or HOF Gillman. Anyways, Carr had the best of teachers to teach QB play.

DW4 hasn't had that level of teaching yet, although Hoyer/Fitz said they learned more about QB play under BOB than they have anywhere else they've played. This is 1 reason I think what's wrong with DW4 is unfixable.
Let's be honest about O'Brien. He pulled Hoyer after one half of football in 2015. First game of the season (I went to that one), and the QB was so bad in the first half that he was benched for freakin' Ryan Mallett. Hoyer ended up bookending that season with 4 INTs (and a fumble!) in a 30-0 playoff blowout loss to the Chiefs. Yeah, what a wonderful season O'Brien was able to get from Hoyer that year. Just amazing. Like a work of art.

Fast forward to Watson's rookie season, and this same braniac HC started his chosen one at QB - Tom Savage - only to bench him after one half of football. btw, where is Tom Savage these days? He was on the Texans roster for FOUR seasons. He was given chances by four other NFL teams. He never made another NFL roster.

Do you sense a pattern here?

You might be right about Watson. Time will tell. But I have absolutely no doubt at this point that most of us are right about O'Brien. 7 seasons in, this is nothing new under the sun.

It's time for pragmatism, not delusional idealism. This franchise needs to be sold and gutted from the top on down. Total rebuild inside and out. Obviously not gonna' happen, so expect more of the same in the years to come.
 

steelbtexan

King of the W. B. Club
Contributor's Club
Out of curiosity. What makes you say Fitz/Hoyer were better fits? Could their years of NFL experience and being exposed to other NFL schemes play a role in your fond memories of their performances?
  • When Hoyer came here. He was 30 years old, had spent three years under Belichick and had 10 years of NFL experience.
  • When Fitz came here. He was 32 years old, had played on six different teams and systems and had 14 years of NFL experience.
Finally, if Fitz/Hoyer were such great fits why did they only last one year in Houston? Do you think their experience and situation are similar to what we have with Watson? I think you are chasing a false narrative.
The catylist said they were better fits not me. I was just asking him why he felt this way.

Out of curiosity why do you think Hoyer , 2 yrs and Fitz 1 yr could run BOB's offense better than DW4 after 4 years?
 

Texansballer74

Hall of Fame
Let's be honest about O'Brien. He pulled Hoyer after one half of football in 2015. First game of the season (I went to that one), and the QB was so bad in the first half that he was benched for freakin' Ryan Mallett. Hoyer ended up bookending that season with 4 INTs (and a fumble!) in a 30-0 playoff blowout loss to the Chiefs. Yeah, what a wonderful season O'Brien was able to get from Hoyer that year. Just amazing. Like a work of art.

Fast forward to Watson's rookie season, and this same braniac HC started his chosen one at QB - Tom Savage - only to bench him after one half of football. btw, where is Tom Savage these days? He was on the Texans roster for FOUR seasons. He was given chances by four other NFL teams. He never made another NFL roster.

Do you sense a pattern here?

You might be right about Watson. Time will tell. But I have absolutely no doubt at this point that most of us are right about O'Brien. 7 seasons in, this is nothing new under the sun.

It's time for pragmatism, not delusional idealism. This franchise needs to be sold and gutted from the top on down. Total rebuild inside and out. Obviously not gonna' happen, so expect more of the same in the years to come.
DB Watson is being destroyed by O’Brien right before our very eyes. And it’s in the very same fashion as David Carr. Bill O’Brien has this youngster out there second guessing him. Add in the fact that that line is atrocious at best. Did you hear David Johnson’s presser last week when he said he ran the wrong route. None of the great minds said nothing about that. This just shows us these receivers like years past are still confused and lost in this system. Meaning this is a systemic issue. Why won’t this man adapt to his players strengths is very baffling to me. Yes Watson has some flaws but this coach and his system isn’t making things better. It’s actually getting worse
 
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steelbtexan

King of the W. B. Club
Contributor's Club
You know the hate is real when someone says Hoyer and Fitzpatrick were better fit., lol man I almost flipped my truck over laughing at that comment.


Comedy at it's finest!
They ran the offense more efficiently.

I didn't say they were better. They certainly aren't more talented.
 

theCATALYST

"Fake" Fan
Out of curiosity. What makes you say Fitz/Hoyer were better fits? Could their years of NFL experience and being exposed to other NFL schemes play a role in your fond memories of their performances?
  • When Hoyer came here. He was 30 years old, had spent three years under Belichick and had 10 years of NFL experience.
  • When Fitz came here. He was 32 years old, had played on six different teams and systems and had 14 years of NFL experience.
Finally, if Fitz/Hoyer were such great fits why did they only last one year in Houston? Do you think their experience and situation are similar to what we have with Watson? I think you are chasing a false narrative.
It was actually I that made that correlation, but I am in no way saying those two are better quarterbacks than DW4, quite the contrary actually. The point I was trying to make was that due to their experience in the NFL prior to landing with the Texans, and the types of offenses they commandeered, they where a better fit to the type of offense that OBrien was trying to establish in Houston.

In my opinion, DW4 would flourish in an offense like Kubiak's or Kingsbury's.

My statement wasn't mean to be a knock on any of the three quarterbacks then it was to point out that DW4 is the square peg to OBriens proverbial round hole. It is up to Watson to round off some of his sharp corners and on OBrien to notch out some of his circular hole so that the two fit........OR......Obrien needs to find a new hole (i.e. playbook).
 

dream_team

Hall of Fame
Better than it is now.
The stats say otherwise:

-------- DVOA - Points/game - Yards/play
2014 - 21st --- 23.2 (14) ---- 5.2 (24)
2015 - 25th --- 19.9 (26) ---- 4.9 (32)

2018 - 19th --- 24.1 (12) ---- 5.5 (17)
2019 - 17th --- 23.9 (12) ---- 5.7 (12)

But I know, I know... let me save you some time, stats are for losers. In 2015, under Hoyer, they were dead LAST in yards per play. That's bad no matter how you want to spin it.
 

dream_team

Hall of Fame
The catylist said they were better fits not me. I was just asking him why he felt this way.

Out of curiosity why do you think Hoyer , 2 yrs and Fitz 1 yr could run BOB's offense better than DW4 after 4 years?
They ran the offense more efficiently.

I didn't say they were better. They certainly aren't more talented.
You clearly said "better".
 

steelbtexan

King of the W. B. Club
Contributor's Club
The stats say otherwise:

-------- DVOA - Points/game - Yards/play
2014 - 21st --- 23.2 (14) ---- 5.2 (24)
2015 - 25th --- 19.9 (26) ---- 4.9 (32)

2018 - 19th --- 24.1 (12) ---- 5.5 (17)
2019 - 17th --- 23.9 (12) ---- 5.7 (12)

But I know, I know... let me save you some time, stats are for losers. In 2015, under Hoyer, they were dead LAST in yards per play. That's bad no matter how you want to spin it.
23.2 with Hoyer or Fitz (I'm not sure which played QB that yr) vs 23.9 with a supposed top 5 QB. Not much difference in points scored. Although there's a big difference in talent levels between the 2 QB's. Kind of sad really.
 

dream_team

Hall of Fame
23.2 with Hoyer or Fitz (I'm not sure which played QB that yr) vs 23.9 with a supposed top 5 QB. Not much difference in points scored. Although there's a big difference in talent levels between the 2 QB's. Kind of sad really.
Once again... more talent now compared to that 2014 team? Ummm... I don't know about that.

Arian Foster, Andre Johnson, Deandre Hopkins, Duane Brown, Ben Jones, Brandon Brooks, Chris Myers.
 

Earl34

Veteran
Being able to run the offense better and being the more talented player is 2 entirely different things. Sorry I didn't make myself clear.
Since they ran the offense better, why weren't they here longer than one year? Surely, with that production they could have been bridge QBs or helpful backups. Why do you think they didn't play more than one year and don't mention Ricky.
 

mws

Waterboy
While I agree with this post, Kubiak is one of the greatest teachers of QB play in NFL history. He learned under the best QB coach that has ever lived. Although I guess you could debate who was better at teaching QB's HOF Walsh or HOF Gillman
Once again you need to check the facts unless you are trying to say that George Seifert is the GOAT of QB teachers. Kubiak was still playing for Denver when Walsh left the NFL.

In my opinion it was probably Mike Shanahan that had the most influence on Kubiak. Shanahan was OC for the 1 year Kubiak spent with the 49s & Shanahan took Kubiak with him to the Broncos in 1995.

Bill Walsh As head coach
San Francisco 49ers (1979–1988)
Stanford (1992–1994)

Gary Kubiak

Player
Denver Broncos (1983–1991)

Coach
Texas A&M (1992–1993)
Running backs coach

San Francisco 49ers (1994)
Quarterbacks coach

Denver Broncos (1995–2002)
Offensive coordinator & quarterbacks coach

Denver Broncos (2003–2005)
Offensive coordinator

George Seifert as head coach
San Francisco 49ers (1989–1996)
 

76Texan

Hall of Fame
The catylist said they were better fits not me. I was just asking him why he felt this way.

Out of curiosity why do you think Hoyer , 2 yrs and Fitz 1 yr could run BOB's offense better than DW4 after 4 years?
They are not running the same offense.
They may use the same EP terminologies to name a play, a concept, etc., but the plays themselves are different.
Watson runs more from the shotgun, with a good number of RPO concept in there.

Remember Jay Prosch? The Texans no longer have a FB.

O'Brien has been retooling the offense "to fit" Watson the last couple of years.
That's what he said and I can see it on the field.
It's just that the play design remains unimaginative and does not put the players in good positions to succeed (enough of the time as compared to the better offensive minds out there).
A lot of it are in the details, from blocking concept to throwing lane; how to make those things work better for the players.
There are not enough "easy layups" for the players to build their confidence and to help maintain consistency.
 

steelbtexan

King of the W. B. Club
Contributor's Club
Since they ran the offense better, why weren't they here longer than one year? Surely, with that production they could have been bridge QBs or helpful backups. Why do you think they didn't play more than one year and don't mention Ricky.
Because they thought Hoyer was better than Fitz. They were wrong. However they ran the offense more efficiently. Longer sustained drives. (Something they currently aren't getting.) Problem is both were avg turnover prone QB's.
 
They are not running the same offense.
They may use the same EP terminologies to name a play, a concept, etc., but the plays themselves are different.
Watson runs more from the shotgun, with a good number of RPO concept in there.

Remember Jay Prosch? The Texans no longer have a FB.

O'Brien has been retooling the offense "to fit" Watson the last couple of years.
That's what he said and I can see it on the field.
It's just that the play design remains unimaginative and does not put the players in good positions to succeed (enough of the time as compared to the better offensive minds out there).
A lot of it are in the details, from blocking concept to throwing lane; how to make those things work better for the players.
There are not enough "easy layups" for the players to build their confidence and to help maintain consistency.
Something I have noticed among the better run offenses is that they all have much better O-lines than our Texans. I still don't see the O-line as a reason the offense should suck as bad as it does. There are ways to lessen the issues inherent in a bad O-line.
 

76Texan

Hall of Fame
Something I have noticed among the better run offenses is that they all have much better O-lines than our Texans. I still don't see the O-line as a reason the offense should suck as bad as it does. There are ways to lessen the issues inherent in a bad O-line.
Just bad teaching and bad design at times.
They say the devil is in the details.
Just look at the plays of the Chiefs and the Ravens.
Things have got to work in concert, from the routes run complimentary to one another, the blocking scheme, how to clear out the passing lane for the QB, etc.
A totally different class.
 


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