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Takeaways from the Browns game.

thunderkyss

Just win baby!!!
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I haven't seen enough of him to be making the types of evals you're making,
Have you seen enough to justify the 3-1 pick?

Forget what Pep knows. Did you see enough in college to warrant the pick? Have you seen anything since that might justify the pick?
 

steelbtexan

King of the W. B. Club
Contributor's Club
I guess you missed the part where he climbed the pocket and underthrew the wr?
What play are you talking about.

The bomb to Cooks he threw a great ball where he wanted to throw it, but Mills and Cooks were understandably not on the same page. Stoerner said this on his show yesterday and said he bets Cooks had that play to do over again.
 

steelbtexan

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Contributor's Club
Have you seen enough to justify the 3-1 pick?

Forget what Pep knows. Did you see enough in college to warrant the pick? Have you seen anything since that might justify the pick?
Since he played better than any other rookie QB last Sunday, I would say yes.

Nobody saw enough of Mills in college. That's the reason he fell to the 3rd rd.
 

steelbtexan

King of the W. B. Club
Contributor's Club
Lawrence? no
Fields? No
Mac Jones? probably.
This is splitting hairs.

Pep/Shaw said he can throw a ball 70 yds with a flick of the wrist.

Point is, he can make all of the throws and his arm strength is plenty good enough. In fact I would say his arm is as strong if not stronger than the Pervert. BTW, I've seen the Pervert make some inaccurate throws on short intermediate throws. In fact this is a weakness in his game. Maybe that's the reason the pervert was always looking for the homerun ball? Ball placement certainly isn't a strength of the Pervert's.
 
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76Texan

Hall of Fame
What play are you talking about.

The bomb to Cooks he threw a great ball where he wanted to throw it, but Mills and Cooks were understandably not on the same page. Stoerner said this on his show yesterday and said he bets Cooks had that play to do over again.
I had reviewed the play in one of my previous posts.

No, there was no do-over wanting on Cooks' part.
You can see the reaction from his facial expression.

The FS was bracketing the inside route.
He only veered toward the outside because Cooks did so.

Had Cooks turned to the inside, the FS would have run straight back instead, and would have been where the ball landed.

At best an incompletion.

With the outside route, he had a better chance with a little step on the RCB.
 

thunderkyss

Just win baby!!!
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Nobody saw enough of Mills in college. That's the reason he fell to the 3rd rd.
I'm saying he should have fell further. They saw plenty of Dak Prescott & he went in the 4th.


Since he played better than any other rookie QB last Sunday, I would say yes.
Got it. Since other GMs sht the bed, it's OK if the Texans wet the sheets.
 

steelbtexan

King of the W. B. Club
Contributor's Club
I don't know about "doesn't possess". What I'm looking for that I haven't seen is just a feel for the game. Plays off script. Seeing something that only a player can see. Things that can't be coached. From what I've seen is that Mills is on information overload.
True, information overload is the life of a rookie QB in the NFL. Not just Mills, most rookie QB's look this way. Are you saying Fields/Lawrence/Wilson didn't look this way last Sunday? Put this with the fact that the other QB's have played way more football than Mills and I think Mills has the potential to be a franchise QB. Will he be? Who knows, but it wont be because he doesn't have the talent and for me that's worth the risk of picking him in the 3rd rd. This isn't Savage we're talking about here. Mills has the athletic ability.

I wonder how hyper critical this MB will be with Mills over the next 3 games against 3 of the best defenses in the NFL.
 

Mr teX

Hall of Fame
What traits do the other guys posses that Mills doesn't posses?

If Mills looked like Bambi, then what did Lawrence/Wilson/Fields look like last week. The reason you feel the way you do is 1. He hasn't played much and you dont think he can catch up? 2. He was drafted in the 3rd rd?

I haven't seen enough of him to be making the types of evals you're making, lets see how he does the next 3-4 games. I dont expect him to do that well since he's going to be going up against the top defenses in the NFL. I want to see how well he does against Carolia/Buffalo and if he learned things it should show against Belichick. I'm not talking about setting the world on fire against Belichick, I'm talking about not looking like Wilson did last Sunday.
I expressed my issue with Mills before we even drafted him. He doesn't look like he's cutting it loose when he throws the longer stuff...looks more like he's aiming or trying to place the ball as opposed to letting it loose...Maybe its just his throwing motion that i don't like, but it looks like he's "pulling the string" on his follow through if that make sense. & if you're doing that, that's not good for accuracy...which we've already seen him have problems with in the little time he has gotten in the preseason and regular season. Throwing behind guys & airmailing passes at others. His INT in the browns game was directly b/c of his inaccuracy as he threw it well behind Conley.

Now, do I think it's mostly due to him being a rookie & getting his timing down with the speed of the NFL game? Yes...on the shorter stuff i do. But that deep ball he missed a wide open Cooks for the TD? I think that was due to him trying to placing the ball too perfect. Those types of balls you gotta cut it loose...throw it & let your guy go get it. Especially a speedster like Cooks.
 

steelbtexan

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I'm saying he should have fell further. They saw plenty of Dak Prescott & he went in the 4th.




Got it. Since other GMs sht the bed, it's OK if the Texans wet the sheets.
Caserio got his guy, instead of doing what other Texans GM's have done and missed out on their guys.

It's still to be determined which GM's crapped the bed with top 15 picks? They're rookies and there will be growing pains. Just like there will be growing pains with Mills. Atleast Mills wasn't a top 15 pick if Caserio misses. If Mills doesn't workout then he will be another in a long line of misses that Texans GM's have made over the yrs. Personally I think it was worth the bet. In fact I hope Mills isn't the last QB Caserio drafts. Obviously Caserio values the QB position much more than his predecessors did.

What are your expectations of not just Mills, but all rookie QB's in their rookie yrs and do you think Mills has a chance to be as good as the guys drafted ahead of him? My answer is after seeing the rookies Sunday is yes, he's got a chance to be as good as the higher rated QB's in that class.
 

Mr teX

Hall of Fame
This is splitting hairs.



Point is, he can make all of the throws and his arm strenght is plenty good enough. .
That's not saying anything. Schaub had "plenty good enough" to play & start as long as he did in the NFL. We know his arm strength wasn't great. Ditto for Drew Brees.

Lawrence was the #1 overall pick for a reason..& we saw what kind of pop his arm had on that deep TD pass he threw... he's got a gun. I'm sure Mills can make the same throw too, but not squeezing-it-in-a-tight-window arm strength if he needed to arm strength like Lawrence has.

Lastly, your unhealthy obsession with DW4 is...well unhealthy. That dude doesn't know you exist & if he did he likely wouldn't give 2 shits about what you thought his arm strength was or wasn't. Turn the page for the sake of your mental health.
 

steelbtexan

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I expressed my issue with Mills before we even drafted him. He doesn't look like he's cutting it loose when he throws the longer stuff...looks more like he's aiming or trying to place the ball as opposed to letting it loose...Maybe its just his throwing motion that i don't like, but it looks like he's "pulling the string" on his follow through if that make sense. & if you're doing that, that's not good for accuracy...which we've already seen him have problems with in the little time he has gotten in the preseason and regular season. Throwing behind guys & airmailing passes at others. His INT in the browns game was directly b/c of his inaccuracy as he threw it well behind Conley.

Now, do I think it's mostly due to him being a rookie & getting his timing down with the speed of the NFL game? Yes...on the shorter stuff i do. But that deep ball he missed a wide open Cooks for the TD? I think that was due to him trying to placing the ball too perfect. Those types of balls you gotta cut it loose...throw it & let your guy go get it. Especially a speedster like Cooks.
I agree he needs to work on particularly his short throws accuracy. Particularly on the run. The deep ball he threw to Cooks, he put the ball where he wanted to put it, but Cooks and Mills weren't on the same page. Stoerner said after rewatching the play you're talking about, he bets Cooks wishes he would've gotten a do over.

I do get what you're saying about his throwing motion. Look at QB's like LJ/Dak/Mayfield/Even Allen and Mahomes to an extent, they all have different throwing motions from what's the claasic throwing form. But all of them are successful to varying degrees.
 

sandman

Brexit Advisor
Have you seen enough to justify the 3-1 pick?

Forget what Pep knows. Did you see enough in college to warrant the pick? Have you seen anything since that might justify the pick?
Trask was the last pick of the 2nd round (3 picks ahead of Mills) and Mond was drafted in the 3rd one pick before him. Neither were expected to start, just like Mills. All three were drafted to be backups. Trask and Mond are 3rd string and probably haven't even been activated on game days. The Texans are in this situation because TT got hurt, not because they thought Mills was a Day 1 starter his rookie season.

But let's judge Mills after a half of football on the road in a hostile environment while trailing in the game because the starting QB got injured. On Friday we can really judge him for his play against the #1 defense using practice squad WRs and RB's that get 3.0 YPC on three days of classroom/walk-through preparation. Because these are absolutely objective measurements for justifying a third round QB draft pick.
 

steelbtexan

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That's not saying anything. Schaub had "plenty good enough" to play & start as long as he did in the NFL. We know his arm strength wasn't great. Ditto for Drew Brees.

Lawrence was the #1 overall pick for a reason..& we saw what kind of pop his arm had on that deep TD pass he threw... he's got a gun. I'm sure Mills can make the same throw too, but not squeezing-it-in-a-tight-window arm strength if he needed to arm strength like Lawrence has.

Lastly, your unhealthy obsession with DW4 is...well unhealthy. That dude doesn't know you exist & if he did he likely wouldn't give 2 shits about what you thought his arm strength was or wasn't. Turn the page for the sake of your mental health.
Mills film in college showed he had the arm strength to fit the ball into tight spots. In fact he got in trouble with overconfidence in his arm strength sometimes.

I just tried to compare arm strength of Mills vs a QB you love (Nothing unhealthy about that) and I got exactly the response I thought I would get from you.
 

steelbtexan

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I've seen enough of Fields and Lawrence to believe they have those traits. I haven't seen it yet from Mills.
Exactly, we dont know what we've got in Mills.

We're about to find out and that's a good thing. IMHO

I just hope fans will be patient with Mills, afterall he's going to be facing the top 3 defenses in the NFL the next 3 games. Do I expect fans to be patient? LMAO, look at this MB for a clue as what to expect over the next 3 weeks and this is after a 1/2 of football of a young QB that hasn't played much football and looked like he had potential last week.
 

76Texan

Hall of Fame
Exactly, we dont know what we've got in Mills.

We're about to find out and that's a good thing. IMHO

I just hope fans will be patient with Mills, afterall he's going to be facing the top 3 defenses in the NFL the next 3 games. Do I expect fans to be patient? LMAO, look at this MB for a clue as what to expect over the next 3 weeks and this is after a 1/2 of football of a young QB that hasn't played much football and looked like he had potential last week.
So now you like DVOA huh?

But seriously, take into context that:
The Pats played the Jets and the Dolphins.

The Bills also played the Dolphins.
(But, yes, that D can be a test)

The Panther played the Jets and the Saints.
(You know how wild Jameis can be from game to game, and it showed).
 

Mr teX

Hall of Fame
I do get what you're saying about his throwing motion. Look at QB's like LJ/Dak/Mayfield/Even Allen and Mahomes to an extent, they all have different throwing motions from what's the claasic throwing form. But all of them are successful to varying degrees.
Has really nothing to do with the arm strength dude. All these guys have the requisite raw power to throw it long. Its can you get it there on a rope consistently & can you be accurate doing it that way... short or long. Of the guys you mentioned...

Dak, Mayfield...those guys are throwing the ball & are cutting it loose. You can tell b/c you see their whole body is into the throwing motion...the body weight shifts forward to their plant/lead foot upon release.

Mahomes & Allen have elite arm strength. So at any given time, they can throw it basically any kind of way & still get the ball with good zip to where it needs to get. Mahomes is uncannily accurate no matter what arm slot & platform he's throwing from (background as a pitcher is likely why). Allen can do it a little, but looses alot of accuracy.

LJ doesn't throw it. He looks like he's more aiming/measuring how/when to release it & he's tyring to place the ball rather than cut it loose... He has the arm strength to get it anywhere on the field, but b/c he's all/mostly arm, the further out he has to throw, the less accurate he becomes......that's why he's not a very good passer tho.
 

76Texan

Hall of Fame
I agree he needs to work on particularly his short throws accuracy. Particularly on the run. The deep ball he threw to Cooks, he put the ball where he wanted to put it, but Cooks and Mills weren't on the same page. Stoerner said after rewatching the play you're talking about, he bets Cooks wishes he would've gotten a do over.

I do get what you're saying about his throwing motion. Look at QB's like LJ/Dak/Mayfield/Even Allen and Mahomes to an extent, they all have different throwing motions from what's the claasic throwing form. But all of them are successful to varying degrees.
Again, no do-over from Cooks.
Mills threw to the wrong place.
Cooks had a clear better chance to the outside.
 

steelbtexan

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Has really nothing to do with the arm strength dude. All these guys have the requisite raw power to throw it long. Its can you get it there on a rope consistently & can you be accurate doing it that way... short or long. Of the guys you mentioned...

Dak, Mayfield...those guys are throwing the ball & are cutting it loose. You can tell b/c you see their whole body is into the throwing motion...the body weight shifts forward to their plant/lead foot upon release.

Mahomes & Allen have elite arm strength. So at any given time, they can throw it basically any kind of way & still get the ball with good zip to where it needs to get. Mahomes is uncannily accurate no matter what arm slot & platform he's throwing from (background as a pitcher is likely why). Allen can do it a little, but looses alot of accuracy.

LJ doesn't throw it. He looks like he's more aiming/measuring how/when to release it & he's tyring to place the ball rather than cut it loose... He has the arm strength to get it anywhere on the field, but b/c he's all/mostly arm, the further out he has to throw, the less accurate he becomes......that's why he's not a very good passer tho.
Mills showed he can throw guys open on his college tape. Can he do it in the NFL? Who knows, we only have a preseason and a 1/2 of football to evaluate.

Where Mills needs to improve is his accuracy while on the move out of the pocket.
 

Dejaview

All Pro
Again, no do-over from Cooks.
Mills threw to the wrong place.
Cooks had a clear better chance to the outside.
That TD pass from Mills to Cooks was a play that Cooks suggested to Kelly. He told him to tell Mills the play, he knows it, and Mills will get it to him. That is why he just needs to keep getting experience with his receivers because good things happen when they are on the same page. Do over
 

76Texan

Hall of Fame
That TD pass from Mills to Cooks was a play that Cooks suggested to Kelly. He told him to tell Mills the play, he knows it, and Mills will get it to him. That is why he just needs to keep getting experience with his receivers because good things happen when they are on the same page. Do over
Yes. Do-Over for Mills.
 

76Texan

Hall of Fame
Who said he threw the ball to the wrong place? Cooks had a DB on his butt. Actually Mills threw an anticipation throw to an open spot on the field. I’m sure they talked about it and the lesson learned By both of them.
Wach the replay.
 

justmy2cents

Veteran
Contributor's Club
I expressed my issue with Mills before we even drafted him. He doesn't look like he's cutting it loose when he throws the longer stuff...looks more like he's aiming or trying to place the ball as opposed to letting it loose...Maybe its just his throwing motion that i don't like, but it looks like he's "pulling the string" on his follow through if that make sense. & if you're doing that, that's not good for accuracy...which we've already seen him have problems with in the little time he has gotten in the preseason and regular season. Throwing behind guys & airmailing passes at others. His INT in the browns game was directly b/c of his inaccuracy as he threw it well behind Conley.

Now, do I think it's mostly due to him being a rookie & getting his timing down with the speed of the NFL game? Yes...on the shorter stuff i do. But that deep ball he missed a wide open Cooks for the TD? I think that was due to him trying to placing the ball too perfect. Those types of balls you gotta cut it loose...throw it & let your guy go get it. Especially a speedster like Cooks.

Mr teX, you are hitting the nail on the head in your descriptions of the issues that are plaguing Mills. He is wound tighter than a cheap face lift .... I could even hear it in his terrible interview about Thursday night's game .... and he scored nearly a 40 on the Wonderlic ! Nerves, Anxiety, Fear .... he's got them in spades. In the final preseason gamed, he tried to throw what seemed like 10, (probably more like 6), little check down, dump off passes of 20 to 30 feet, and missed so badly, receivers couldn't even touch them. I've been making that throw - every time .... since I been 10 !! So has everyone on this board ! He's not ready ! It's like Stephen Stills said right before CS&N played at Woodstock, " Man, this is only the third time we've ever played live .... and we're scared sh!tless" !
 

thunderkyss

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Trask was the last pick of the 2nd round (3 picks ahead of Mills) and Mond was drafted in the 3rd one pick before him. Neither were expected to start, just like Mills. All three were drafted to be backups. Trask and Mond are 3rd string and probably haven't even been activated on game days. The Texans are in this situation because TT got hurt, not because they thought Mills was a Day 1 starter his rookie season.
Nobody said anything about being a Day 1 starter.

3rd string & not expected to play is where I thought Davis Mills should be. That they were thinking with development he would have been considered a 1st round QB. So I didn't think he would be activated on game day. Even made a bet, lost, & paid up because he was active day 1.

So... what you're telling me is that the teams that drafted Mond & Trask did not think they were ready to come in & play if something were to happen to their starter, but the Texans did. That's my issue.

I'm hoping for the best for Davis Mills & would have gone a different route to get him ready to play in 2022.
 

76Texan

Hall of Fame
Nobody said anything about being a Day 1 starter.

3rd string & not expected to play is where I thought Davis Mills should be. That they were thinking with development he would have been considered a 1st round QB. So I didn't think he would be activated on game day. Even made a bet, lost, & paid up because he was active day 1.

So... what you're telling me is that the teams that drafted Mond & Trask did not think they were ready to come in & play if something were to happen to their starter, but the Texans did. That's my issue.

I'm hoping for the best for Davis Mills & would have gone a different route to get him ready to play in 2022.
Yeap, both Mond and Trask are third on their depth chart, and they had had much more experiences in college.

Both those teams had an established offense, and they looked for a guy that they think they might be able to develop.

The Buccs, especially, can afford to spend a third rounder on Trask since they have all 22 starters returning, and plenty of depth.
 

Number19

Hall of Fame
I had reviewed the play in one of my previous posts.

No, there was no do-over wanting on Cooks' part.
You can see the reaction from his facial expression.

The FS was bracketing the inside route.
He only veered toward the outside because Cooks did so.

Had Cooks turned to the inside, the FS would have run straight back instead, and would have been where the ball landed.

At best an incompletion.

With the outside route, he had a better chance with a little step on the RCB.
What I'm getting from this is Stoerner is evaluating the pass from the perspective of a QB reading the coverage.

Now I agree what is seen on the screen is the FS "bracketing" the inside route at that last moment.

What Stoerner saw was that as the play was developing, Cooks had the decision to break his route to the outside "post" or break it inside (and I forget the terminology he used for this route). At what point this decision is made was not commented on, nor do I have any idea.

Stoerner also noted Cooks facial expression but also noted how quickly Cooks tried to adjust his route; and interpreted this as Cooks realizing his mistake.

Now Stoerner is a former NFL QB and as he read the play, Mills made the correct decision. Perhaps if you can watch the play using all 22 (which I don't have), this would be most revealing.

It's just my opinion, but as the play ended up, Cooks was covered by two defenders. Had he broken inside, perhaps it would have been one-on-one.

Had Cooks broke his route inside, we can't say how it would had ended. But the point is the QB and receiver needs to be on the same page reading the coverage and be on the same page how to respond.
 

76Texan

Hall of Fame
What I'm getting from this is Stoerner is evaluating the pass from the perspective of a QB reading the coverage.

Now I agree what is seen on the screen is the FS "bracketing" the inside route at that last moment.

What Stoerner saw was that as the play was developing, Cooks had the decision to break his route to the outside "post" or break it inside (and I forget the terminology he used for this route). At what point this decision is made was not commented on, nor do I have any idea.

Stoerner also noted Cooks facial expression but also noted how quickly Cooks tried to adjust his route; and interpreted this as Cooks realizing his mistake.

Now Stoerner is a former NFL QB and as he read the play, Mills made the correct decision. Perhaps if you can watch the play using all 22 (which I don't have), this would be most revealing.

It's just my opinion, but as the play ended up, Cooks was covered by two defenders. Had he broken inside, perhaps it would have been one-on-one.

Had Cooks broke his route inside, we can't say how it would had ended. But the point is the QB and receiver needs to be on the same page reading the coverage and be on the same page how to respond.
They definitely need to be on the same page.
But here's the play as I saw it, numerous times, and again, just now.

Cooks lined up between the left hash and the numbers.
The RCB played outside technique, 8 yards off the LOS

The ball ended up nearly in the center of the field.
(This is where the FS was, in the middle of the field.)

The FS was a step deeper than the RCB (ie. Cooks had more separation from the RCB).
18yd line vs. 19yd line.

The FS followed Cooks to the outside; he can see that Cooks was looking to the left (to the outside) for the ball.

Had Cooks break toward the middle earlier, the FS would have had a straighter line to follow, and therefore, even closer to the ball.
He would be the one closest to the ball, not Cooks.
 

76Texan

Hall of Fame
It's just my opinion, but as the play ended up, Cooks was covered by two defenders. Had he broken inside, perhaps it would have been one-on-one.
And no; if the ball was thrown to the outside (where Cook was looking for it), he would be further from the FS, with more separation from the RCB as stated in the post above.
That's where he would be one on one, with a couple of steps on the RCB.
 

Number19

Hall of Fame
They definitely need to be on the same page.
But here's the play as I saw it, numerous times, and again, just now.

Cooks lined up between the left hash and the numbers.
The RCB played outside technique, 8 yards off the LOS

The ball ended up nearly in the center of the field.
(This is where the FS was, in the middle of the field.)

The FS was a step deeper than the RCB (ie. Cooks had more separation from the RCB).
18yd line vs. 19yd line.

The FS followed Cooks to the outside; he can see that Cooks was looking to the left (to the outside) for the ball.

Had Cooks break toward the middle earlier, the FS would have had a straighter line to follow, and therefore, even closer to the ball.
He would be the one closest to the ball, not Cooks.
Can you tell me what time on the clock this play occurred?
 

Mr teX

Hall of Fame
They definitely need to be on the same page.
But here's the play as I saw it, numerous times, and again, just now.

Cooks lined up between the left hash and the numbers.
The RCB played outside technique, 8 yards off the LOS

The ball ended up nearly in the center of the field.
(This is where the FS was, in the middle of the field.)

The FS was a step deeper than the RCB (ie. Cooks had more separation from the RCB).
18yd line vs. 19yd line.

The FS followed Cooks to the outside; he can see that Cooks was looking to the left (to the outside) for the ball.

Had Cooks break toward the middle earlier, the FS would have had a straighter line to follow, and therefore, even closer to the ball.
He would be the one closest to the ball, not Cooks.
Without seeing it & going off your description and what i can recollect, sounds like Cooks had a tight split (based on being in between the left hash & numbers) & the route was a post corner & the browns were in some sort of zone coverage.. 4/6 look. Hard to know exactly without seeing it & knowing where the TE was. WR's are taught several things in order to create separation. In this instance i think Cooks faked Mills out on the "post" portion of his post corner route b/c when he broke inside towards the safety and began attacking the safety's leverage, to get him to slow up and/or widen, he held it for a tick longer than normal before he stemmed & broke his route back outside. Mills probably thought Cooks was gonna continue inside & threw it that way just as Cooks was breaking outside. So the screw up is probably on Mills.

Again going off your description it only makes sense for Cooks to break his route away from where the defender was..in this case the safety who was the only defender in play. Which leads me to believe it was likely a cover 2 look disguised as man..or something else. Reason i believe this is b/c the holes in that coverage are in the seams between the mlb's and safety and that deep outside 1/2, the later of which is where Cooks was probably breaking to.
 

sandman

Brexit Advisor
Nobody said anything about being a Day 1 starter.

3rd string & not expected to play is where I thought Davis Mills should be. That they were thinking with development he would have been considered a 1st round QB. So I didn't think he would be activated on game day. Even made a bet, lost, & paid up because he was active day 1.

So... what you're telling me is that the teams that drafted Mond & Trask did not think they were ready to come in & play if something were to happen to their starter, but the Texans did. That's my issue.

I'm hoping for the best for Davis Mills & would have gone a different route to get him ready to play in 2022.
OK, then I am honestly confused. I replied to your post about how his play to this point hasn't justified using a 3rd round pick, but then you state that he should be 3rd string and not playing like the other QB's picked in the same area of the draft. So if he doesn't play, it meets your expectation of a top of the third round QB pick, but because he has played - and not played well - it doesn't meet your expectations? Honest question.
 

thunderkyss

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Contributor's Club
So if he doesn't play, it meets your expectation of a top of the third round QB pick, but because he has played - and not played well - it doesn't meet your expectations? Honest question.
I originally supported drafting Mills. I bought the line that Shaw & Pep had some secret meeting & Pep was convinced Mills was the real deal. With that in mind, I imagined they drafted him with the idea that Pep would work with him on the practice squad & get him ready to compete for the backup/starting spot in 2022.

But they made him the backup, saying he is ready to play.

Which means they thought much higher of him than I thought they did. & I'm not seeing it. I guess I'm mad because I was wrong about what they thought about Davis Mills, or that they're idea was, "If Tyrod gets hurt, we're in tank mode."
 

The Pencil Neck

Hall of Fame
I originally supported drafting Mills. I bought the line that Shaw & Pep had some secret meeting & Pep was convinced Mills was the real deal. With that in mind, I imagined they drafted him with the idea that Pep would work with him on the practice squad & get him ready to compete for the backup/starting spot in 2022.

But they made him the backup, saying he is ready to play.

Which means they thought much higher of him than I thought they did. & I'm not seeing it. I guess I'm mad because I was wrong about what they thought about Davis Mills, or that they're idea was, "If Tyrod gets hurt, we're in tank mode."
Dude.

Relax. Rrrreeeellllaaaxxx.
-- Davis Mills
 

76Texan

Hall of Fame
Without seeing it & going off your description and what i can recollect, sounds like Cooks had a tight split (based on being in between the left hash & numbers) & the route was a post corner & the browns were in some sort of zone coverage.. 4/6 look. Hard to know exactly without seeing it & knowing where the TE was. WR's are taught several things in order to create separation. In this instance i think Cooks faked Mills out on the "post" portion of his post corner route b/c when he broke inside towards the safety and began attacking the safety's leverage, to get him to slow up and/or widen, he held it for a tick longer than normal before he stemmed & broke his route back outside. Mills probably thought Cooks was gonna continue inside & threw it that way just as Cooks was breaking outside. So the screw up is probably on Mills.

Again going off your description it only makes sense for Cooks to break his route away from where the defender was..in this case the safety who was the only defender in play. Which leads me to believe it was likely a cover 2 look disguised as man..or something else. Reason i believe this is b/c the holes in that coverage are in the seams between the mlb's and safety and that deep outside 1/2, the later of which is where Cooks was probably breaking to.
Close.
It was a 3-4 zone.

The Texans were in single back, double TE set, with two receivers on either side.

Cooks (the X) simply runs a seam route while the other receiver (the Z) runs a crossing route underneath him. It was just a two-man route; the other 3 skilled players were basically at home to block/draw the attention away from the LBs.

The crossing route by the Y, from my understanding, is to try to draw the FS up, leaving Cooks alone in one-on-one with the RCB.
As it was, the FS never bought the shallow route and stayed home.
This, IMO, should tell the QB to either go with the corner route to the X or the shallow crossing route by the Y (depending on the depth of the RCB).

We see this route a lot, not just with OB, but with other teams, and at the collegiate level, too.

The fact that Cooks started to turn to the outside to look for the ball was also telling.
He was expecting the ball to go to the outside.
 

thunderkyss

Just win baby!!!
Staff member
Contributor's Club
Close.
It was a 3-4 zone.

The Texans were in single back, double TE set, with two receivers on either side.

Cooks (the X) simply runs a seam route while the other receiver (the Z) runs a crossing route underneath him. It was just a two-man route; the other 3 skilled players were basically at home to block/draw the attention away from the LBs.

The crossing route by the Y, from my understanding, is to try to draw the FS up, leaving Cooks alone in one-on-one with the RCB.
As it was, the FS never bought the shallow route and stayed home.
This, IMO, should tell the QB to either go with the corner route to the X or the shallow crossing route by the Y (depending on the depth of the RCB).

We see this route a lot, not just with OB, but with other teams, and at the collegiate level, too.

The fact that Cooks started to turn to the outside to look for the ball was also telling.
He was expecting the ball to go to the outside.
...
We really have no idea how that was supposed to play out.
 

Mr teX

Hall of Fame
safeties tell everything and according to 76, there were only 2 people out in route so while we don’t know definitively what was supposed to happen, Sounds like Mills made the right read on who to go to of the 2 out in route…based what 76 says the safety did, he just put the ball in the wrong area for Cooks…

Based on that alone, I still think Cooks may have confused Mills by how he ran his route, but without seeing the play for myself from the All-22, I can’t make that determination.
 

Norg

-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-
seems like we got alooot on nicks and injuries not good not good

our team and depth is kinda kinda thin
 

76Texan

Hall of Fame
safeties tell everything and according to 76, there were only 2 people out in route so while we don’t know definitively what was supposed to happen, Sounds like Mills made the right read on who to go to of the 2 out in route…based what 76 says the safety did, he just put the ball in the wrong area for Cooks…

Based on that alone, I still think Cooks may have confused Mills by how he ran his route, but without seeing the play for myself from the All-22, I can’t make that determination.
Two-man route.
X seam with sight adjust
Z cross

vs. Cover 3
4 underneath zone.
The IRLB stepped up to check the run before turning back to follow the crosser Z.

The RCB had to watch the X so he cannot afford to stay in step with the X (Cooks); otherwise, it would be an easy throw for the QB to the Z, over the LB

For this reason, I agree that the ball should go to Cooks, but to the outside, where Cooks would be the guy nearest to the ball, in one-one-one, with a step or two over the RCB.
 


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