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State of the O-line

Earl34

Rookie
In general, I don't disagree... but sometimes you just have to trust your arm (Watson has a good arm, it isn't Mahomes but it ain't Shaub) and sling it. Closest play I could find in a hurry... Mahomes under pressure, throws it without being able to plant, longer throw than DW would have needed to make.

That is true. But even on that play, that's a low percentage throw. Watch how the DB is closing in on the ball. The easier throw would be the post route. If when his back foot lands, he throws with anticipation to the post, it's an easier throw and likely TD.

IMHO, it's just a risky throw.
 

FuzzyLogic

Mathematically Possible
But if that's third & ten...

Really good defensive call if that's third down.
Not third & ten - 7th sack was a second & nine which led to Duke's big third-down conversion...

2-9-HST 28 (7:43) (Shotgun) D.Watson sacked at HST 19 for -9 yards (S.Neal)
3-18-HST 19 (6:56) (Shotgun) D.Watson pass short middle to D.Johnson to HST 37 for 18 yards (T.Edmunds; S.Neal).

I will try and start listing down and distance for any of the videos.
 

CloakNNNdagger

Hall of Fame
Sack 6 - I don't know how you can't at least give partial blame on the OL. I mean, no one blocked the left edge rusher. No one was open. If anything, could blame DW for not throwing the ball ob and give up on the play.
I'm sure you realize that some plays are designed to leave a rusher totally unblocked in order to allow an open receiver.............his running back let the man through...,....cut to the outside and looked back for the pass as he was open...........Watson stepped into the pocket, but instead of a quick pass, he hesitated losing the window for the running back......leaving him with only one option...............to run.............and get sacked
 

dream_team

Hall of Fame
I'm sure you realize that some plays are designed to leave a rusher totally unblocked in order to allow an open receiver.............his running back let the man through...,....cut to the outside and looked back for the pass as he was open...........Watson stepped into the pocket, but instead of a quick pass, he hesitated losing the window for the running back......leaving him with only one option...............to run.............and get sacked
Are you suggesting it was by design to allow the free rusher, while Chris Clark & Nick Martin block nobody? So it's Watson job to evade the rusher, step up in the pocket, and hit Duke (whom isn't open btw). If Duke let the man through to come wide open, then I would understand, but Duke was covered by the LB. See the pic below, this is the moment right after Watson evades the rusher and would be ready to throw. No one is open. IMO, he should have tucked the ball immediately and try to run for it. Probably his only chance to try to pickup a first.


 

Mr teX

Hall of Fame
Are you suggesting it was by design to allow the free rusher, while Chris Clark & Nick Martin block nobody? So it's Watson job to evade the rusher, step up in the pocket, and hit Duke (whom isn't open btw). If Duke let the man through to come wide open, then I would understand, but Duke was covered by the LB. See the pic below, this is the moment right after Watson evades the rusher and would be ready to throw. No one is open. IMO, he should have tucked the ball immediately and try to run for it. Probably his only chance to try to pickup a first.


screenshots arent good to look at this kind of stuff unless we have abunch of them sequencing the play, or a gif. but cloak is right if indeed Duke let the rusher thru. DW4 hesitated instead of just instinctually taking off like he should've done.
 

Mr teX

Hall of Fame
Kinda looks like it was just a good call by Buffalo really. I don't think duke was supposed to pick up that blitzer in DW4's face..but I do think Duke broke off his initial out route & went up field too early. DW4 could've still got the ball to him on the out once he stepped through the initial rush if Duke would've just continued on that out route for a sec or so longer; he was open. The defender wasn't even looking back at DW4. The o-line did what they were supposed to do its not on them imo.
 

dream_team

Hall of Fame
Kinda looks like it was just a good call by Buffalo really. I don't think duke was supposed to pick up that blitzer in DW4's face..but I do think Duke broke off his initial out route & went up field too early. DW4 could've still got the ball to him on the out once he stepped through the initial rush if Duke would've just continued on that out route for a sec or so longer; he was open. The defender wasn't even looking back at DW4. The o-line did what they were supposed to do its not on them imo.
I agree that it was a good disguise by the Bills on who was actually going to rush the passer. To the untrained eye like myself, just seems odd that the OL and backs didn't do a better job of picking up the correct 4 rushers.

If you're the coach, and you're reviewing the tape with the whole team, what are you teaching the offense here to do better?
 

Mr teX

Hall of Fame
I agree that it was a good disguise by the Bills on who was actually going to rush the passer. To the untrained eye like myself, just seems odd that the OL and backs didn't do a better job of picking up the correct 4 rushers.

If you're the coach, and you're reviewing the tape with the whole team, what are you teaching the offense here to do better?
The only thing would be for Duke to stay with the out route a little longer.

B'c he got immediate pressure, For DW4 I would just continue to reinforce with him to trust his instincts but perhaps look to use his legs more quickly in that situation for 2 reasons. 1 b/c Duke was his only option on that side of the field once he stepped through the pressure and started rolling to that side. The other reason is b/c everyone else was running routes away from the way he was rolling & noone was coming either. Once Duke turned up field, he should've just got what he could get then get down & live to fight another down. But its in his nature to look for the big play & I think once he saw Duke turn up field he was loading up to get it to him deep & by then the opposite side DE had chased him down.
 

dream_team

Hall of Fame
The only thing would be for Duke to stay with the out route a little longer.

B'c he got immediate pressure, For DW4 I would just continue to reinforce with him to trust his instincts but perhaps look to use his legs more quickly in that situation for 2 reasons. 1 b/c Duke was his only option on that side of the field once he stepped through the pressure and started rolling to that side. The other reason is b/c everyone else was running routes away from the way he was rolling & noone was coming either. Once Duke turned up field, he should've just got what he could get then get down & live to fight another down. But its in his nature to look for the big play & I think once he saw Duke turn up field he was loading up to get it to him deep & by then the opposite side DE had chased him down.
Also have to factor in that it's 3rd down. I don't think he gets the 1st if he just tucks & run.
 

badboy

Hall of Fame
Are you suggesting it was by design to allow the free rusher, while Chris Clark & Nick Martin block nobody? So it's Watson job to evade the rusher, step up in the pocket, and hit Duke (whom isn't open btw). If Duke let the man through to come wide open, then I would understand, but Duke was covered by the LB. See the pic below, this is the moment right after Watson evades the rusher and would be ready to throw. No one is open. IMO, he should have tucked the ball immediately and try to run for it. Probably his only chance to try to pickup a first.


Watson should have thrown it to right corner of field; a soft pass with some air under allowing the receiver at the 18 yard line a chance to adjust and run for it. A short gain and the deep back in front of the A could not have gotten to it. Even better would have been running to right while motioning the receiver to go deeper. No one to stop him except sideline.
 

JB

Old Curmudgeon
Contributor's Club
Watson should have thrown it to right corner of field; a soft pass with some air under allowing the receiver at the 18 yard line a chance to adjust and run for it. A short gain and the deep back in front of the A could not have gotten to it. Even better would have been running to right while motioning the receiver to go deeper. No one to stop him except sideline.
He did run right and got sacked for it
 

Corrosion

Idealist
Staff member
You know , they are better than they were in training camp …. Tunsil's been great when he doesn't false start.

They really miss Howard on the right side ...

The middle of the line has been decent.

But they still have to get a lot better and considering the amount of draft capital they have used up front over the past two years , their performance is a little underwhelming.

3 first round picks 2 second round picks in the past two years.
 

OptimisticTexan

Hall of Fame
How about inside the 20 having a Super Tackle and big boy Fells as Red Zone target?
Actually, I'd like to see the team roll out a 3 TE formation (1 as H-Back) of Fells, Thomas and Aikens (H-Back) along with Hopkins. There's a good size and athletic advantage with that group in the Red Zone. Chip and release being utilized would be a novel thought for this team.
 

Mr teX

Hall of Fame
Actually, I'd like to see the team roll out a 3 TE formation (1 as H-Back) of Fells, Thomas and Aikens (H-Back) along with Hopkins. There's a good size and athletic advantage with that group in the Red Zone. Chip and release being utilized would be a novel thought for this team.

Chipping before releasing with our TE's and RB's was the primary "adjustment" to help out the o-line last year; It had varying degrees of success. Baltimore uses a 2-3 TE set up regularly & have had great success with it, but Andrews, Hurst & Boyle are all much better blockers than Akins, Fells and Thomas are & the Ravens' offense is primarily based around the run. The other quandry is you'd have to take Stills and Fuller off the field to get the other TE's on if my math is right. Not sure that would play to our advantage.
 

badboy

Hall of Fame
Actually, I'd like to see the team roll out a 3 TE formation (1 as H-Back) of Fells, Thomas and Aikens (H-Back) along with Hopkins. There's a good size and athletic advantage with that group in the Red Zone. Chip and release being utilized would be a novel thought for this team.
yep bulks,strength and good hands.
 

badboy

Hall of Fame
Chipping before releasing with our TE's and RB's was the primary "adjustment" to help out the o-line last year; It had varying degrees of success. Baltimore uses a 2-3 TE set up regularly & have had great success with it, but Andrews, Hurst & Boyle are all much better blockers than Akins, Fells and Thomas are & the Ravens' offense is primarily based around the run. The other quandry is you'd have to take Stills and Fuller off the field to get the other TE's on if my math is right. Not sure that would play to our advantage.
I want receivers inside 20 who can bang and get bangged. That ain't Stills and Fuller.
 

Mr teX

Hall of Fame
OB hasn't made them that type of targets in his offense so it would be difficult to fairly assess what they could or couldn't do in the Red Zone.
But what we do know is that they aren't "bangers" b/c none of them can really block worth a lick.. and Fells is the only guy that has shown he can handle being "banged".............. a little.
 

badboy

Hall of Fame
But what we do know is that they aren't "bangers" b/c none of them can really block worth a lick.. and Fells is the only guy that has shown he can handle being "banged".............. a little.
I was not referring TEs blocking but inside 20 catching then taking a bang and still moving forward even if they must bang a defender and yes all our TEs can do that.
 


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