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Save us Savage!!!!!!!

I feel like Kubiak was on board with developing Keenum. He & McNair's disagreement was over timing. Keenum was our 3rd string QB, the scout team QB. Never actually played/practiced in our offense.

I think part of all the hoopla was that Kubiak wanted to go to Yates after Schaub, but since he waited so long, McNair made the decision to go with Case.

Of course I have nothing to back this up. Just what makes the most sense to me. I think Kubiak liked Case, just wasn't ready to start him.

I think it's possible. I have nothing to back up what I said either. It's just how I think it happened but it's a guess really. I agree completely though that if he did think he could develop Keenum he definitely wasn't ready to do it in 2013.
 
Quite a few people on this board seem overly enamored with Watson. Don't get me wrong, I think he is a good prospect and could turn out to be a really good QB, but some seem to think this is a guarantee (which it is not). If Savage had a top 10 year, there is no way I would ditch him for Watson, just like I would not ditch Watson for Tom if it was Watson who had the top 10 year. If you got a top ten QB, you stick with them over an unproven commodity.

I have seen a lot of comments about Watson having X times the talent/upside of Savage. This is probably primarily do to Watson's athleticism (i.e. ability to run). IMO, running it a nice bonus, but the great NFL QBs beat you with their arm not their legs. Of the two, Savage has the stronger arm and has demonstrated better accuracy. The most important asset a QB has is that gray matter between his ears, that is where the truly great ones beat you (provided they have the physical tools to go along with it). Peyton is a good example of a QB who had the football IQ, but his last year the physical tools just weren't there anymore and he struggled. Neither of our two QB's have proven they have the necessary football IQ and can process the game in the heat of battle. That is yet to be seen and can only be discovered on game day and it takes a few of those to find out if a QB has got it or can get it, at least a season worth of them, I think.

My point? When I look at Savage and Watson I don't see two QBs of vastly different potential, I see two QBs with different skillsets. Watson is the flashy, dual threat type QB that is easy to get excited about. Savage is the classic NFL drop back passer. It is exciting to think about how Watson can burn the defense with his feet when the protection breaks down, but I would rather have a QB who can get the ball out quickly and accurately into tight windows to burn the blitz with his arm. Ideally, you would like someone who can do both, but if you can do the latter you don't have to be able to do the former. When analyzing Watson and Savage I believe both have potential, either could be the answer, either could fail, both are unproven. If either one, when given the opportunity, runs away with it - you stay with the hot hand, not the candidate you are enamored with.

a few top 10 passing seasons isn't definitively running away with it though & that's my point. You got people in here talking about trading Watson after 2 top 10 passing seasons from Savage & I find that silly....Especially after all the hell that was raised throughout the last several seasons where people were bitching about them drafting a qb in the 1st.

Maybe after 2 top 5 passing seasons from Savage you start looking to take offers for Watson but that's it. & even in that scenario, short of us winning the SB, you've got to look at the team's outcomes and take that into consideration. Could Watson dynamic ability to run it a little be that piece that gets us over the hump?
 
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I think it's possible. I have nothing to back up what I said either. It's just how I think it happened but it's a guess really. I agree completely though that if he did think he could develop Keenum he definitely wasn't ready to do it in 2013.
I think Kubiak liked Keenum, but not as a sure-fired choice. He knew, just like most people did, that there are obvious drawbacks. Keenum isn't as athletic as Wilson, so he would have to learn to wiggle in the pocket like Brees to find the throwing lane.
You have to give Keenum some credit that he doesn't get many balls batted down. I had watched all of his NFL games and he is about average in that department, compared to other starters in the league.

It was reported that the Broncos were interested in him, but when the Rams slapped that first round tender, they backed up. It could be that Kubiak just wanted Keenum as a veteran backup that knows his system.

In a different way from Osweiler, Kubiak's offense can mask some of Keenum's deficiencies, like with the play action and bootleg.

He wouldn't be as effective in O'Brien's system where he likes for his QB to stand in the pocket and make some quick strike.

No matter how O'Brien (originally) said that size doesn't matter to him, (he pointed to McGloin, who's about 3/8" taller, at Penn St.), he went out and drafted Savage and cut Keenum for Mallett.
I guess the organization doesn't want to have a QB controversy either (within the fan base.)
 
Kirk Cousins did have a choice, the Redskins were willing to make him one of the top paid players in league history, but he actually prefers the one year deals.. I don't get it, but to each his own.

Could it be that he wants to be an unrestricted FA and reunite with little Shanny in San Fran?

Ive never watched Cousins play, so I dont know how well he fit Shanahans offense.
 
Hypothetical question - What if Savage stays healthy and plays well this season?

Lets say 4000+ YDs, 25+ TDs, +/-10 INTs, +/-65% CP, which would make him a top 10 QB; not a MVP candidate, but much better than we have had and better than the odds say you will get from a 1st round QB (less than 1 in 3 1st round QBs become a top 10 QB).

Do we pay Savage a 20+ M/YR contract (meaning we would likely not be able to sign Clowney), franchise tag Savage at +/-$22M and delay decision, or let Savage go and risk taking a chance that Watson beats the odds and becomes a quality starter the following season?

With good QB play so hard to find, I would franchise tag Savage and hold off on offering Clowney a long term contract until after his 5th year option, thus delaying the decision a season. If both stayed healthy and played well I would give Savage the long term contract. If either are injured or play poorly the decision is easy.

Please don't reply with your absolute certainty that this couldn't happen, I am aware the odds are not in Savages favor, just curious what most think we should do if it does happen. Seems like most fans are dead set on Watson being the future and Savage just being a place holder, regardless of how Savage performs this season.
Either way Rick Smith will probably be blamed for doing the wrong thing 3 years down the road :kitten:
First, do those numbers relate to a playoff berth and an AFCCG appearance or were they garbage time stats?
That's critical to the decision process.
If Savage's numbers lead to a winning season and playoff games then I tag Savage and see if it was a lucky fluke or not. Oh and we have to make the playoffs again in his franchise year.

If Savage's franchise year (and season results) are again successful, then I sign him to a longer contract... first two years at 20-22 mil (or whatever the going rate is then) with bonuses for staying healthy (playing all 16 games = bonus bucks), pro bowl appearances, and playoff wins.

I KEEP Watson. ...at least for a while.

I do the Belichick thing. Let folks see enough of him in preseason to drool over his potential then dangle as trade bait him in the 4th year of his rookie contract.
 
Could it be that he wants to be an unrestricted FA and reunite with little Shanny in San Fran?

Ive never watched Cousins play, so I dont know how well he fit Shanahans offense.
Cousins ran a pro offense in college, with plenty of WCO principles. His Offensive Coordinator had a lot of experience at various schools that run the WCO.

The Redskins also runs the WCO even as Shanahan left.

So, yeah, Cousins is a good fit with Shanahan. He has a choice.
 
First, do those numbers relate to a playoff berth and an AFCCG appearance or were they garbage time stats?
That's critical to the decision process.
If Savage's numbers lead to a winning season and playoff games then I tag Savage and see if it was a lucky fluke or not. Oh and we have to make the playoffs again in his franchise year.


I like stats. & I'm with you on the garbage time stats. But how do you know if you've got Blake Bottles in garbage time & not Drew Brees in garbage time?
 
a few top 10 passing seasons isn't definitively running away with it though & that's my point. You got people in here talking about trading Watson after 2 top 10 passing seasons from Savage & I find that silly....Especially after all the hell that was raised throughout the last several seasons where people were bitching about them drafting a qb in the 1st.

Maybe after 2 top 5 passing seasons from Savage you start looking to take offers for Watson but that's it. & even in that scenario, short of us winning the SB, you've got to look at the team's outcomes and take that into consideration. Could Watson dynamic ability to run it a little be that piece that gets us over the hump?

Tell me which run 1st/leave the pocket under the 1st sign of duress has ever won a SB. Wilson was a run as the last option type QB and he was the closest QB that has won a SB with the style you're talking about.
 
Tom Savage's humble journey through highs, lows to Texans, NFL
By Brian T. Smith

September 8, 2017 Updated: September 8, 2017 6:54 pm


Tom Savage was never supposed to be here.

Then again, he always was.

Half his life has been predetermined destiny. The boy with the arm who became one of the best freshman quarterbacks in the country. The first QB that Bill O'Brien drafted when a new coach began recreating Bob McNair's Texans.

The other half still barely makes sense. Savage ran the Wing T in high school. He bounced between three colleges in five years and went 1,024 days without taking a recorded snap. He spent his entire second pro season on injured reserve and was one decision away from quitting football two years before the Texans turned him into a project they sometimes forgot existed.

"A couple times I went up (to Pittsburgh) … and he said to me, 'I don't know, dad. I don't know if I can do this,' " Savage's father, Tom Savage Sr., said. "And I said, 'Tom, there's one thing I can tell you. And that's you're not going to be happy with this the rest of your life if you quit. You just can't quit.' "

Savage never has. And now he's here.

The NFL's untouched newness in Week 1 of 2017 - and the week after the historic destruction of Hurricane Harvey. The literal next man up after all those endless Texans quarterbacks - and a fourth-year pro entering the final season of his rookie contract, with first-round pick Deshaun Watson already a franchise face in waiting. The arm, brain and body that are exactly what O'Brien was seeking as he discarded QB after QB - and the understanding that Savage will immediately be cast aside if he can't deliver during a make-or-break season for a fiery coach.

No one is as critical to Year Four of the O'Brien era as Thomas Benjamin Savage. And if you know anything about the life of the Texans' No. 3, you already know he's been heading toward this crossroads since he was a child.

No wonder he believes this is his time.

"I know I'm not the hot, flashy name," Savage said. "But I know what I'm capable of and I know I can go out there and do it."

All business

He would fall down. Get hit. Hurt.

Then he would look around, scanning every direction, trying to find his father.

If Savage Sr. wasn't on the way, his son knew he was fine.

"I would always look over to see if he's coming," said Savage, who was born in Springfield, Pa. "And if he's not, then I'm like, 'Ah. I'm good. I'll get up.' "

He was quiet and shy and always looked up to his hero.

Savage's older brother, Bryan, could do everything and didn't hold back. High school team MVP in football and baseball. Quarterback at Wisconsin and Hofstra.

Bryan played QB, so Savage had to become one.

But when the younger brother with the arm struck out two hitters with the bases loaded to win a youth championship game, and his parents had a camera ready to snap a perfect childhood celebration photo?

"He just walks off the field while everybody else is jumping around. … I just had to laugh," his father said.

Savage has a hidden fire now. Reserved and low key in public. Hot and intense when the facemask goes down. THE REST OF THE DETAILED LONG JOURNEY
 
Tom Savage's humble journey through highs, lows to Texans, NFL
By Brian T. Smith

September 8, 2017 Updated: September 8, 2017 6:54 pm


Tom Savage was never supposed to be here.

Then again, he always was.

Half his life has been predetermined destiny. The boy with the arm who became one of the best freshman quarterbacks in the country. The first QB that Bill O'Brien drafted when a new coach began recreating Bob McNair's Texans.

The other half still barely makes sense. Savage ran the Wing T in high school. He bounced between three colleges in five years and went 1,024 days without taking a recorded snap. He spent his entire second pro season on injured reserve and was one decision away from quitting football two years before the Texans turned him into a project they sometimes forgot existed.

"A couple times I went up (to Pittsburgh) … and he said to me, 'I don't know, dad. I don't know if I can do this,' " Savage's father, Tom Savage Sr., said. "And I said, 'Tom, there's one thing I can tell you. And that's you're not going to be happy with this the rest of your life if you quit. You just can't quit.' "

Savage never has. And now he's here.

The NFL's untouched newness in Week 1 of 2017 - and the week after the historic destruction of Hurricane Harvey. The literal next man up after all those endless Texans quarterbacks - and a fourth-year pro entering the final season of his rookie contract, with first-round pick Deshaun Watson already a franchise face in waiting. The arm, brain and body that are exactly what O'Brien was seeking as he discarded QB after QB - and the understanding that Savage will immediately be cast aside if he can't deliver during a make-or-break season for a fiery coach.

No one is as critical to Year Four of the O'Brien era as Thomas Benjamin Savage. And if you know anything about the life of the Texans' No. 3, you already know he's been heading toward this crossroads since he was a child.

No wonder he believes this is his time.

"I know I'm not the hot, flashy name," Savage said. "But I know what I'm capable of and I know I can go out there and do it."

All business

He would fall down. Get hit. Hurt.

Then he would look around, scanning every direction, trying to find his father.

If Savage Sr. wasn't on the way, his son knew he was fine.

"I would always look over to see if he's coming," said Savage, who was born in Springfield, Pa. "And if he's not, then I'm like, 'Ah. I'm good. I'll get up.' "

He was quiet and shy and always looked up to his hero.

Savage's older brother, Bryan, could do everything and didn't hold back. High school team MVP in football and baseball. Quarterback at Wisconsin and Hofstra.

Bryan played QB, so Savage had to become one.

But when the younger brother with the arm struck out two hitters with the bases loaded to win a youth championship game, and his parents had a camera ready to snap a perfect childhood celebration photo?

"He just walks off the field while everybody else is jumping around. … I just had to laugh," his father said.

Savage has a hidden fire now. Reserved and low key in public. Hot and intense when the facemask goes down. THE REST OF THE DETAILED LONG JOURNEY
I'm really pulling for him. I hope to see a duplicate of Alex Smith's Thursday night performance, but will be more than happy with 250 yds 2 TDs 0 INTS and 63% completions.
 
First, do those numbers relate to a playoff berth and an AFCCG appearance or were they garbage time stats?
That's critical to the decision process.
If Savage's numbers lead to a winning season and playoff games then I tag Savage and see if it was a lucky fluke or not. Oh and we have to make the playoffs again in his franchise year.

If Savage's franchise year (and season results) are again successful, then I sign him to a longer contract... first two years at 20-22 mil (or whatever the going rate is then) with bonuses for staying healthy (playing all 16 games = bonus bucks), pro bowl appearances, and playoff wins.

I KEEP Watson. ...at least for a while.

I do the Belichick thing. Let folks see enough of him in preseason to drool over his potential then dangle as trade bait him in the 4th year of his rookie contract.

Good point that others have also hinted at. You know that quote about not knowing how to define if something is obscene but "I know it when I see it"? Well I think we can all pretty much tell when a QB's play is pushing the teams success or when he's picking up meaningless stats in garbage time or simply riding the defense. We know meaningful QB play when we see it around these parts. It's entirely possible to make top ten stats while your team carries you.

We'll see what happens.
 
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"I am so glad the regular season is here so we can stop using some meanless preseason stats like they are golden."

And I am so glad the regular season is here so we can stop using some meaningless college stats like they are golden.
 
"I am so glad the regular season is here so we can stop using some meanless preseason stats like they are golden."

And I am so glad the regular season is here so we can stop using some meaningless college stats like they are golden.
Man use your own damb words. And where did I use Watsons stats as if they were golden?
 
Tom Savage's humble journey through highs, lows to Texans, NFL
By Brian T. Smith

September 8, 2017 Updated: September 8, 2017 6:54 pm


Tom Savage was never supposed to be here.

Then again, he always was.

Half his life has been predetermined destiny. The boy with the arm who became one of the best freshman quarterbacks in the country. The first QB that Bill O'Brien drafted when a new coach began recreating Bob McNair's Texans.

The other half still barely makes sense. Savage ran the Wing T in high school. He bounced between three colleges in five years and went 1,024 days without taking a recorded snap. He spent his entire second pro season on injured reserve and was one decision away from quitting football two years before the Texans turned him into a project they sometimes forgot existed.

"A couple times I went up (to Pittsburgh) … and he said to me, 'I don't know, dad. I don't know if I can do this,' " Savage's father, Tom Savage Sr., said. "And I said, 'Tom, there's one thing I can tell you. And that's you're not going to be happy with this the rest of your life if you quit. You just can't quit.' "

Savage never has. And now he's here.

The NFL's untouched newness in Week 1 of 2017 - and the week after the historic destruction of Hurricane Harvey. The literal next man up after all those endless Texans quarterbacks - and a fourth-year pro entering the final season of his rookie contract, with first-round pick Deshaun Watson already a franchise face in waiting. The arm, brain and body that are exactly what O'Brien was seeking as he discarded QB after QB - and the understanding that Savage will immediately be cast aside if he can't deliver during a make-or-break season for a fiery coach.

No one is as critical to Year Four of the O'Brien era as Thomas Benjamin Savage. And if you know anything about the life of the Texans' No. 3, you already know he's been heading toward this crossroads since he was a child.

No wonder he believes this is his time.

"I know I'm not the hot, flashy name," Savage said. "But I know what I'm capable of and I know I can go out there and do it."

All business

He would fall down. Get hit. Hurt.

Then he would look around, scanning every direction, trying to find his father.

If Savage Sr. wasn't on the way, his son knew he was fine.

"I would always look over to see if he's coming," said Savage, who was born in Springfield, Pa. "And if he's not, then I'm like, 'Ah. I'm good. I'll get up.' "

He was quiet and shy and always looked up to his hero.

Savage's older brother, Bryan, could do everything and didn't hold back. High school team MVP in football and baseball. Quarterback at Wisconsin and Hofstra.

Bryan played QB, so Savage had to become one.

But when the younger brother with the arm struck out two hitters with the bases loaded to win a youth championship game, and his parents had a camera ready to snap a perfect childhood celebration photo?

"He just walks off the field while everybody else is jumping around. … I just had to laugh," his father said.

Savage has a hidden fire now. Reserved and low key in public. Hot and intense when the facemask goes down. THE REST OF THE DETAILED LONG JOURNEY
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Some of you have related to me that for some reason you cannot see the rest of the article. It is interesting enough that I will post the rest of it :


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But he watched his dad work and provide. He saw his brother's football arc end short. So he started his own path and tried not to forget where he came from.

"To this day, Tom comes home - no matter what kind of star he thinks he is or other people think he is - and he still takes out the trash cans," Savage Sr. said.

An early lesson

It's happening.

His time. Destiny.

Savage takes over Rutgers' offense straight out of high school and even wins a bowl game for Greg Schiano's Scarlet Knights. He throws for the most yards and touchdowns by a freshman in Big East history and ends 2009 - to this day, the best overall season of Savage's football life - with a freshman All-American nod.

It's all so easy.

But this is Savage and half of his career rarely makes sense. So, of course, his life is about to completely change.

"I was really excited as a father," Savage Sr. said. "But I knew there was a lot he didn't know about the game."

Seven years after his criss-crossed journey began - transferring to Arizona, sitting out and leaving; transferring to Pitt, sitting out and walking on; waiting behind Ryan Fitzpatrick, Ryan Mallett, Brian Hoyer, Brock Osweiler, etc. - the Texans' starting QB in 2017 looks back on his first misstep with pure honesty.

He was wrong. He's still recovering and learning from it.

"I just went out there and I assumed that the second year (at Rutgers) was going to be easier. And that's kind of where that entitlement came," Savage said. "Like, 'Hey, I'm freshman All-American. I deserve this. I earned this.' And really in this game, you don't earn anything. You're only as good as your next game. That really just taught me a valuable lesson at a really young age. That nothing in this league, nothing in this sport, is guaranteed. You're not entitled to anything."

Not even playing football again.

Building himself up

This has always fascinated me about Savage, ever since he became the No. 135 overall pick of the 2014 draft and the first quarterback O'Brien selected: He was a construction worker.

This is after Arizona and a lost year in 2011, and before he almost quit the sport forever at Pittsburgh.

Savage returned home and began living at his parents' house again, waiting to walk on for the Panthers.

His father, a proud member of the working class, pointed out the obvious.

"My dad was like, 'Hey, buddy. You've got to work. You can't just be laying around here,' " Savage said.

So a 27-year-old man, who on Sunday will become O'Brien's fourth starting QB in four seasons, started doing it all for "peanuts."

He cleaned up. He scraped metal off the floor. He helped out with the family business while he was supposed to be on his perfect path to the NFL.

"I learned so many lessons from it," Savage said. "It was good to go through, because you're going from a freshman All-American in college to - there's nothing wrong with construction work, but it's just not what I envisioned two years later."

His father's wisdom: "You go out there and you break your hump every day for no money, then you can appreciate other things."

On the verge of quitting

There was still another level to fall.

Savage goes from Nov. 13, 2010 to Sept. 2, 2013 without even playing in a college game.

He's actually practicing again. But he's walking on and paying to attend Pitt and it's training camp and nothing is going right and, really, let's be honest - what's the point?

Savage has never forgotten that moment and the feeling.

"I was literally this close to quitting football. I was just like, 'I'm done.' I had enough," Savage said. "The coaches were yelling at me. I'm like, 'What am I doing? You're going to go get a job, get my degree. … This is rock bottom, for sure.' "

Savage remembers riding his Big Wheel around as a child, falling over and scraping a knee. His mom would start to help him up. His father would grab her first.

"Let him figure it out," Savage Sr. said. "He'll be fine."

The older brother that a quiet, shy kid always looked up to? Bryan's college career ended in tears, after a serious back injury was discovered just before the start of his senior season.

All those life lessons and everything that had already been overcome, and now the second son wants to quit?

"I remember my dad said, 'That's fine. I'll come pick you up,' " Savage said. " 'But just one thing: When you get older and your kids ask you about football, how are you going to tell them that it ended? Are you just going to tell them that you just quit? Or are you going to finish out and do it the right way?' "

Savage stayed, became a team captain, and completed 61.2 percent of his passes for 2,958 yards and 21 TDs in his only season playing for the Panthers. Then the young man who was at three colleges in five years started shooting up final mock drafts.

The Texans had just gone 2-14 after Matt Schaub fell apart and they needed a quarterback.

A slow NFL start

He showed up on Kirby Drive in June 2014, still driving a 2007 Chevrolet Malibu that came from his college years.

Color: "Terrible black."

You have a new four-year contract that pays an average of $575,000 a year. You're not going to buy a new car?

"I'm going to stick with the Malibu," said Savage, back when Fitzpatrick was O'Brien's first answer, and Case Keenum and T.J. Yates were competing for the Texans' No. 2 spot.

Mallett soon held that and Savage became third string. NFL life comes at you fast.

Savage got a shot in Week 15 of his rookie year at Indianapolis, after Fitzpatrick broke his leg. The young man with the arm looked promising - until he ended up in a knee brace.

Nine months later, Savage sprained his shoulder in pointless preseason game four. In the season of Hoyer versus Mallett, the Texans opted for an extra roster body, locking Savage away on IR the entire year.

He wanted out when his world changed at Rutgers. At Pitt, he nearly walked away when the road felt too far.

In 2015 - a season that doesn't feature a single regular-season stat for No. 3 - Savage made the smartest move of his career. He acted, studied and observed like an NFL starter, even though he was never going to play and constantly thought the Texans could cut him.

He went to work, just like his father taught him.

"(Savage is) a resilient guy," O'Brien said. "I was always struck with his demeanor, his poise and his straightforwardness, and you could just tell that he was a guy that believed in himself through all the things that he had been through."

A solid foundation

He has learned patience and perspective. He's a husband and father now. When he stood behind a podium last month as the Texans' starting QB, his baby girl, Summer, rested in his arms.

He works with wood in his free time, crafting the furniture that sits inside his family's home, building a world that was unimaginable when he almost walked away for good.

"When I leave this (stadium), I kind of need to decompress for an hour. … It's really therapeutic and it's really rewarding," Savage said. "You've just got to be perfect at it, you know? Everything's got to be perfect. Not to get too philosophical, but you've got to be perfect with it or it's not going to operate."

No one in Houston is expecting anything close to perfection. Tom Brady lost Thursday and Alex Smith looked like the better QB. Atlanta blew a late 28-3 Super Bowl lead in the stadium Savage calls home.

Life is hard. The NFL can be incredibly cruel.

But if Savage can lead and last and keep Watson on the sideline in Year One? If one of the NFL's best defenses finally has a quarterback that doesn't let it down at the worst time?

Savage will become one heck of a story in 2017.

"So many people ask me about what happened and who they're always bringing in and they drafted a first rounder," he said. "Listen, that all is part of this game and I haven't done anything to prove them otherwise. So I know, as a competitor, that it's my job to go out there and prove that I can do it. And until you do that, they're going to have to make decisions for what's best for this organization. And I know that and fans know it and everyone knows it. It's just the way it is."

Savage was always supposed to be here. The time is now his and this is the best chance he's ever going to get.

It just took him forever to arrive his own way.

"All that stuff built the foundation to where I am now," Savage said. "I know I'm very flat-line in here. But I'm telling you, out there … I'm pumped and I'm ready to go."
 
I'm a Savage fan but I'll be happy to admit that he has yet to really do much more than outplay Brock Osweiler in a very journeyman-like manner so far in his career. That's all he's done. He's been more efficient than Brock. He had a couple of good seasons in college (two years apart) and he had some nice moments in a few preseasons here and there.

It's a very flawed window we're looking through. Lots of reasons to doubt the good stuff and point to the bad stuff.

This season is it though. Starting today it's all on Savage. He's had a full camp and been the unquestioned starter from day one of this football year. He has more experience with this system than any QB we've had under O'Brien.

No excuses are acceptable from this point forward and I will offer none. I'm a Savage fan but he either has this or he doesn't. Today we should find out. I don't expect him to be perfect. I wish Duane Brown hadn't picked this season to pull his bullshit. I wish we didn't have so many banged up guys on offense and I wish we had a better line in front of him BUT... Tom's far from the first QB to be asked to go to work with those kinds of problems. Compared to the **** storm some guys get thrown into Savage still can't complain. He's been setup for success. Either he can do it or he can't.
 
I'm a Savage fan but I'll be happy to admit that he has yet to really do much more than outplay Brock Osweiler in a very journeyman-like manner so far in his career. That's all he's done. He's been more efficient than Brock. He had a couple of good seasons in college (two years apart) and he had some nice moments in a few preseasons here and there.

It's a very flawed window we're looking through. Lots of reasons to doubt the good stuff and point to the bad stuff.

This season is it though. Starting today it's all on Savage. He's had a full camp and been the unquestioned starter from day one of this football year. He has more experience with this system than any QB we've had under O'Brien.

No excuses are acceptable from this point forward and I will offer none. I'm a Savage fan but he either has this or he doesn't. Today we should find out. I don't expect him to be perfect. I wish Duane Brown hadn't picked this season to pull his bullshit. I wish we didn't have so many banged up guys on offense and I wish we had a better line in front of him BUT... Tom's far from the first QB to be asked to go to work with those kinds of problems. Compared to the **** storm some guys get thrown into Savage still can't complain. He's been setup for success. Either he can do it or he can't.

I will give you Savage has been set up.

For success not so much.
 
It ain't savage...it's this o-line...absolutely no chance behind them right now. Any qb would struggle.

DB...man I'm sorry I doubted your value sir.
 
Did they move the team to California today because this thread has gone to LaLa land.
1. Savage hasn't thrown as many passes in real games as many college QB's.
2. With this OL Savage is not mobile enough to be successful.
3. I don't think Savage is durable enough to be an NFL QB.
4. To indecisive or lack of confidence or inability to read defense.....not good for success.
Just my opinion.
I sure hope the plan is to bring back Weeden later because I don't want Watson to be forced to play when Savage goes down.
This is reality. Don't sacrifice Watson today!!!!!!!!!
 
Well, that didn't go well. Savage looked to me like everything around him was just happening way too fast for him to process it. The physical ability is there but he doesn't have what it takes to play at this level outside of preseason and garbage time. We saw his limit today and he's not the one.

I'm not even sure I'd keep him on the roster at this point. Seriously. I'd actually consider cutting Savage and trying to re-sign Weeden. We know Weeden can process NFL speed game action reasonably well.
 
Did they move the team to California today because this thread has gone to LaLa land.
1. Savage hasn't thrown as many passes in real games as many college QB's.
2. With this OL Savage is not mobile enough to be successful.
3. I don't think Savage is durable enough to be an NFL QB.
4. To indecisive or lack of confidence or inability to read defense.....not good for success.
Just my opinion.
I sure hope the plan is to bring back Weeden later because I don't want Watson to be forced to play when Savage goes down.

I know I missed the hypothetical question earlier in the week when I made this response but AGAIN I am really pissed off that Savage was our starter. And this is reality.
If the Texans want only two QB's get rid or Savage.

Why does the Texan's brain trust BOB/Smith/McNair need to be hit in the head over and over again with players like Brock, Savage, Mallet, Reed, ...... before they see what reality is??????????????

Houston I think we have a PROBLEM.
 
I'm watching the Seahawks-Packers game and Rodgers has been sacked 4 times, has an INT and a rating of 65.2. Pressure does that to even elite QBs. Not trying to salvage anything good for Savage, just noting how important a good OL is to a QBs success.

Savage was ploddingly slow in everything he did today and didn't look like an NFL starting QB.
 
So much for Savage saving us. I really had faith in him, but everything he did today was just way too slow.
I'll take my crow grilled. I was about as wrong as you can be. GO WATSON!!
I'll join you; although no QB will do well behind our line. What Watson showed me today was that he may have the smarts and the ability to avoid serious injury. Savage is probably the better passer, if he has the pocket time, but Watson might win us a few more games with his pocket presence under adverse line play, and ability to make plays with his legs.

Bring Weeden back? Just wondering if his release was premature.
 
Well, that didn't go well. Savage looked to me like everything around him was just happening way too fast for him to process it. The physical ability is there but he doesn't have what it takes to play at this level outside of preseason and garbage time. We saw his limit today and he's not the one.

I'm not even sure I'd keep him on the roster at this point. Seriously. I'd actually consider cutting Savage and trying to re-sign Weeden. We know Weeden can process NFL speed game action reasonably well.
Posed the same question before reading your post.
 
To me, Savage looked like a guy trying not to get hurt. I remember in his first 2 years, in preseason he showed some little bit of athleticism. He got hurt in the Dallas preseason game back in 2015 trying to run away from pressure.

You can not start a QB who's afraid of injury. Watson isn't afraid. He actually looks more comfortable running outside, out and away from the pocket. The pass to CJF was perfect.

Right now, I would start Watson against Cinci and let him run around a little. Wear out the defensive line chasing him around. Then start taking your shots downfield.
 
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Savage needs more pocket time? Dude had 5 seconds on a few of those sacks. Then his zombie walk drop back, and his plodding movement in the pocket? As bad as it could get for him today.
I don't want to bash a guy who just had the worst day in his football life. It's O'Brien who put Savage in this position. If O'Brien can't see that Savage is not a starting NFL QB, why is he a NFL head coach? Have we seen any QB improve under O'Brien? They seem to get worse the more coached they are. Do we really want Watson to be coached up (or down) by O'Brien? If the Texans are mired with a losing record by midseason, I think O'Brien should be cut loose and let Crennel be the interim HC for the remainder of the season.
 
To me, Savage looked like a guy trying not to get hurt. I remember in his first 2 years, in preseason he showed some little bit of athleticism. He got hurt in the Dallas preseason game back in 2015 trying to run away from pressure.

You can not start a QB who's afraid of injury. Watson isn't afraid. He actually looks more comfortable running outside, out and away from the pocket. The pass to CJF was perfect.

Right now, I would start Watson against Cinci and let him run around a little. Wear out the defensive line chasing him around. Then start taking your shots downfield.
With Cinci's front 7? Absolutely. Savage was getting creamed by them last year.
 
I don't want to bash a guy who just had the worst day in his football life. It's O'Brien who put Savage in this position. If O'Brien can't see that Savage is not a starting NFL QB, why is he a NFL head coach? Have we seen any QB improve under O'Brien? They seem to get worse the more coached they are. Do we really want Watson to be coached up (or down) by O'Brien? If the Texans are mired with a losing record by midseason, I think O'Brien should be cut loose and let Crennel be the interim HC for the remainder of the season.
If I were Smith or McNair, I'd be making phone calls to Chucky, Cowher and Harbaugh, offering them the moon to come coach the Texans. OB is just not a good coach or talent evaluator. As soon as he said that he likes the Texans tackles, I flashed back to 2015 and groaned.
 
I just heard the perfect analogy for Savage. He's the kind of guy that would sit at a blackjack table and stay on a 12 just to stay in the game a little longer. Even if the dealer has an ace or a face card, Savage isn't hitting on a 12.

He's had 86 career passing attempts, 0 TD's and 0 INT's. Looks like someone who gets sacked a lot.
 
I just heard the perfect analogy for Savage. He's the kind of guy that would sit at a blackjack table and stay on a 12 just to stay in the game a little longer. Even if the dealer has an ace or a face card, Savage isn't hitting on a 12.

He's had 86 career passing attempts, 0 TD's and 0 INT's. Looks like someone who gets sacked a lot.
You don't stand on 12 when the dealer has an ace or a face card.
 
Tom Savage post game: "I don't know who they were booing at, you can boo at me, but don't boo at my guys....."

Really?

I really hate when the fans boo at their own stadium , I really do, but I had no problem with today's booing. I mean did you see the game Tom? Our city's name is on your jersey and damn it was embarrassing. You turned to ball over repeatedly, hung on to the ball way to long, the o-line couldn't stop my 8 year old 62 lb daughter and you gave up 10, count then 10 freaking sacks. The D-Line was bull dozed, never so much as whiffed bortles. The secondary talks more than they play, the product looks identical to 2016 only worse which is saying something. The coaching is horrible on both sides of the ball, the GM didn't address huge needs and squandered draft picks in the off season.

The only reason you scored a single point today was because you threw a wrinkle at the Jags they weren't completely ready for on one drive, and even then it took a lot of boneheaded penalties by the Jags for that to happen.

So Tom why don't you give us one single reason not to boo at you, the offense, the defense, the coaches, the GM or anyone else?
 
I don't want to bash a guy who just had the worst day in his football life. It's O'Brien who put Savage in this position. If O'Brien can't see that Savage is not a starting NFL QB, why is he a NFL head coach?.

I wonder how O'Brien can say with a straight face, "it starts with me." But fires his OC/QB coach & benches his starting QB in game 1 two years in a row.

But I bet McNair told him to do all that.
 
Had there been an actual QB competition in training camp we wouldn't have these problems. Why was the starting job just handed to the robotic Savage? Is it because the team thought they could sell more jerseys with his vicious-sounding surname? If that's the case, what a waste; who is gonna walk around town in a Savage jersey now?
 
So much for Savage saving us. I really had faith in him, but everything he did today was just way too slow.
I'll take my crow grilled. I was about as wrong as you can be. GO WATSON!!

And Watson is any better?
Even with a TD pass, Watson's QB rating was worse than Savage, Y/A worse, and completion percentage worse.

Got news for you folks. It's not the QB. It's Bill O'Brien and this shit show he calls an offense.

Since OB got here;
14th to 21st to 28th in points
17th to 19th to 29th in yards

Judging from today, it doesn't look like he'll be satisfied until he gets to 32/32.
 
I don't know what to say about that disaster .... Are the Jaqs that good ? Is the OL that bad , can anyone get open ?! Savage held the ball way too long .... he's a count slow (said that somewhere before). Watson had to channel his inner Mike Vick a couple times .... or the sack total mighta been 15.
 
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