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Patriots Accuse Texans of Tampering

txtx

Waterboy
Looks like Bob Blowkraft's tired of losing people due to his escapades.

What I don't get is how all this drama and politics and turnover are going to help O'Brien "get better at" calling plays or keeping Watson's ribs off the bus or help Mike Devlin learn to develop offensive linemen. Seems like a lot of fine-tuning the engine when you only have three tires on.
 
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Seegara

Guitar Picker, Dog Lover, Woodworker
Looks like Bob Blowkraft's tired of losing people due to his escapades.

What I don't get is how all this drama and politics and turnover are going to help O'Brien "get better at" calling plays or keeping Watson's ribs off the bus or help Mike Devlin learn to develop offensive linemen. Seems like a lot of fine-tuning the engine when you only have three tires on.
Link?
 

Seegara

Guitar Picker, Dog Lover, Woodworker
An acquaintance once let a skilsaw get away from him and slice across both thighs. They decided he would need one amputation; the other leg would heal without drastic measures. They got the paperwork screwed up and took off the wrong leg. So then they had to go back and remove the other one. He thought he had a pretty good case and got his lawyer into it. The lawyer told him he didn't have a leg to stand on.:pinned:

From the link, the Pats don't have a leg to stand on.
 

badboy

Hall of Fame
Just my understanding of the situation: Easterby and Caserio videod talking at Kraft's home at ring presentation. Next day, Gaines terminated. So far no proof Texans offered a job. I would not be surprised if a audio magically appears. I would not be surprised if we end up losing a draft pick over this. Circumstantial evidence at best but does commish need more?
 

Brisco_County

Texans worthy
How does the NFL normally find tampering? Does it require metadata like timestamps from phone calls, or hard evidence like the content of the conversation?

Both men had justifiable reasons to be in the same room. Both men had a working relationship and therefore had reason to banter.

There would have to have been a witness.
 

TheKDog

Hall of Fame
Contributor's Club
How does the NFL normally find tampering? Does it require metadata like timestamps from phone calls, or hard evidence like the content of the conversation?

Both men had justifiable reasons to be in the same room. Both men had a working relationship and therefore had reason to banter.

There would have to have been a witness.
If Easterby tampered, Caserio could just say so. We can't assume Caserio would like about the conversation
 

JamTex

Hall Of Fame Texans Fan!
So Easterby going to the ring ceremony a day before Gaine was fired constitutes tampering?
The lows the Patriots stoop to is just ridiculous.
This won't stand. The NFL will see right through the Patriots charade.
 

Max

Veteran
So Easterby going to the ring ceremony this weekend 2 days after Gaine was fired constitutes tampering?
The lows the Patriots stoop to is just ridiculous.
This won't stand. The NFL will see right through the Patriots charade.
The ring ceremony was the day before Gaine was fired.
 

Max

Veteran
If Easterby tampered, Caserio could just say so. We can't assume Caserio would like about the conversation
Seems likely that Caserio will spill the beans if the report is true that Caserio met w/ BB and Kraft just before they filed the tampering charge. They all got their story together before filing.
 

JamTex

Hall Of Fame Texans Fan!
Why extend this thing out over weeks or months in court, which is just what the Patriots want?
Just get it over with and give up the draft pick. Sure the Texans will lose the draft pick, but they will get Caserio.
 

JamTex

Hall Of Fame Texans Fan!
Oh this is great. Check this out guys. If the Patriots would have just denied the Texans the right to interview Caserio, it could have taken weeks for the Texans to go through the league and force the Patriots to allow the interview. Instead, the Patriots chose to file a complaint of tampering against the Texans.
Here's the kicker. All the Texans have to do is offer the Patriots a draft pick for Caserio and the Patriots have no choice but to accept it. If the Patriots refuse the draft pick, the complaint is automatically dismissed and the Texans get to interview Caserio right away and offer him a contract for GM. If the Patriots accept the draft pick, Caserio is then the GM of the Texans without an interview and all he has to do is sign the contract.
The Patriots might have really messed up by trying to block the Texans by filing this tampering complaint. It looks like the Texans will get Caserio whether the Patriots allow it or not.
Get this over with and send that pick to the Patriots for Caserio!
 
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JamTex

Hall Of Fame Texans Fan!
**** that, I'm not giving up a first round pick for a G.M.
It's the only way to get it over with now and avoid the long court battle over this garbage complaint. Plus, it'll be Caserio. I'm sure he will be able to make up that pick in some way be it through a big time free agent signing or making a big splash in the draft next year or both. It's the best thing for the Texans if they want a real GM that can help Cal build a winning team.
 

JB

Old Curmudgeon
Contributor's Club
Oh this is great. Check this out guys. If the Patriots would have just denied the Texans the right to interview Caserio, it could have taken weeks for the Texans to go through the league and force the Patriots to allow the interview. Instead, the Patriots chose to file a complaint of tampering against the Texans.
Here's the kicker. All the Texans have to do is offer the Patriots a draft pick for Caserio and the Patriots have no choice but to accept it. If the Patriots refuse the draft pick, the complaint is automatically dismissed and the Texans get to interview Caserio right away and offer him a contract for GM. If the Patriots accept the draft pick, Caserio is then the GM of the Texans without an interview and all he has to do is sign the contract.
The Patriots might have really messed up by trying to block the Texans by filing this tampering complaint. It looks like the Texans will get Caserio whether the Patriots allow it or not.
Get this over with and send that pick to the Patriots for Caserio!
Does it have to be a 1st? And what is your source of info?
 

JamTex

Hall Of Fame Texans Fan!
Does it have to be a 1st? And what is your source of info?
They were talking about it on the NFL Network. They didn't specify a round. I have no idea if it would have to be a 1st round pick or not. I'm sure it would likely need to be in the first 4 rounds, but that's just an assumption. I really don't know.
 

KA4Texan

Weirdo Mode Engaged
Contributor's Club
The Patriots finally get to accuse someone else of cheating....... I hope they they lose their case and we get a valuable GM.

I'm not for losing a first round for a GM, especially looking at the schedule and the high value that pick will likely have, but.. I'd rather walk away with something for our first, the upside is it will piss off BB and the Patriots, that's a first well spent that we will likely lose anyway.

Wouldnt be surprised to find out that this was all a set up to get the Pat's the Texans first pick AND he had no intention to leave the Pats.
 

JamTex

Hall Of Fame Texans Fan!
This is just the Pats looking for a loophole to block an interview.

They always operate on the fringes and find ways to get what they want.
They do indeed operate on the fringes of what's right, but this time, they may have made the wrong move. Kraft and Belichick might not have thought about the Texans being able to solve this whole thing just by offering them a draft pick. That would really throw a monkey wrench in the works of their trying to find a "loop hole" to slow or stop the Texans from getting their GM. Let's see what happens. Hopefully it's over today or early this week.
 

JamTex

Hall Of Fame Texans Fan!
The Patriots finally get to accuse someone else of cheating....... I hope they they lose their case and we get a valuable GM.

I'm not for losing a first round for a GM, especially looking at the schedule and the high value that pick will likely have, but.. I'd rather walk away with something for our first, the upside is it will piss off BB and the Patriots, that's a first well spent that we will likely lose anyway.

Wouldnt be surprised to find out that this was all a set up to get the Pat's the Texans first pick AND he had no intention to leave the Pats.
Actually, should the Pats get the pick, Caserio is then the Texans GM by way of trade. All he'll need to do is get in the building and sign the contract.
 

bigmck

Rookie
How can it be Tampering if the Texans are offering the guy a promotion? Don't the Pats HAVE to allow the interview? If it is just a matter of the Texans having talked to him before asking the Pats for an interview, that is pretty petty.
 

DocBar

Hall of Fame
Contributor's Club
How can it be Tampering if the Texans are offering the guy a promotion? Don't the Pats HAVE to allow the interview? If it is just a matter of the Texans having talked to him before asking the Pats for an interview, that is pretty petty.
It's tampering if the Texans talked to Caserio about the position before the Pats gave permission. There is a lot of vagueness to Caserio's position with the Pats so they probably wanted to get a full description of this "promotion" the Texans would be offering. The Pats could then declare that it wasn't a promotion and block the Texans from interviewing Caserio.
If Caserio really is all that and a bag of chips, you can bet on BB pulling out all the stops to keep him.
 

DocBar

Hall of Fame
Contributor's Club
Actually, should the Pats get the pick, Caserio is then the Texans GM by way of trade. All he'll need to do is get in the building and sign the contract.
Why are you so certain that Caserio wants to come to Houston? He might very well have turned down McNair if he has a similar role already, on the winningest team of the decade.
 

JamTex

Hall Of Fame Texans Fan!
Why are you so certain that Caserio wants to come to Houston? He might very well have turned down McNair if he has a similar role already, on the winningest team of the decade.
Well, as you know, in a trade, does the party traded have any choice about going to the team they are traded to? Not really. After the trade, the party that is traded is no longer an employee or member of the team they are traded from. At that point, would they have much of a choice but to sign a contract with their new team? As long as the contract is to their approval anyways. Then, once they agree on a contract, they pretty much should sign that contract and prepare to work with their new team.
 
It's the only way to get it over with now and avoid the long court battle over this garbage complaint. Plus, it'll be Caserio. I'm sure he will be able to make up that pick in some way be it through a big time free agent signing or making a big splash in the draft next year or both. It's the best thing for the Texans if they want a real GM that can help Cal build a winning team.
And you are basing this on what? The many years he has spent as a GM across many successful franchises? Because if we are just basing it on the Pats that not something I'm comfortable with because what makes the Pats great both have a first name that start with B. People are acting like this guy is the secret weapon of the Pats that makes them great. News flash people, the final say on drafts and team always has been and always will be controlled by BB. Add to that TB on the field makes guys that on any other team would be average at best look like superstars so the Pats always look better than they are. Doesn't hurt that they have gotten to feast on a division almost as weak as the AFCS.

Not saying Caserio wouldn't be good but there are way to many unknows. This reminds me of that "Can't miss, sure fire all pro" in every draft that people insist couldn't possibly be a bust. And how many times is that guy a bust? Its not worth it to lose a first, and from what I've read the Pats can have say in what round, just to INTREVIEW the guy. What's to stop him from then saying "You know what, with the Pats having two first round picks this year think I'm going to just stay up there and have a fresh lobster dinner and clam chowder to celebrate our latest brilliant draft move."
 
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It's tampering if the Texans talked to Caserio about the position before the Pats gave permission. There is a lot of vagueness to Caserio's position with the Pats so they probably wanted to get a full description of this "promotion" the Texans would be offering. The Pats could then declare that it wasn't a promotion and block the Texans from interviewing Caserio.
If Caserio really is all that and a bag of chips, you can bet on BB pulling out all the stops to keep him.
Doesn't work that way, just like the Texans would have to show it is a promotion the Pats have to show its not. In other states contracts, especially Exec ones, carry a lot more weight than they do in Texas. Pats can't just up and decide "oh hey this is now part of your job scope" or "guess what you now have this authority" without rewriting what is spelled out in his contract. Just like the vagueness in BoBs level of power and the Org structure could hurt the Texans argument the fact that titles mean little in NE and BB has final say on everything could hurt their argument.
 
Well, as you know, in a trade, does the party traded have any choice about going to the team they are traded to? Not really. After the trade, the party that is traded is no longer an employee or member of the team they are traded from. At that point, would they have much of a choice but to sign a contract with their new team? As long as the contract is to their approval anyways. Then, once they agree on a contract, they pretty much should sign that contract and prepare to work with their new team.
Again where are you pulling this from? You can't force someone to sign a contract to work for you, that's so illegal its not even funny. Really I don't even think you can trade executives, the whole draft picks thing is not about a trade its a penalty for tampering.

"A transfer of draft choices could be in play if the Texans are found to have tampered in their pursuit of Caserio, according to the “specific penalties” section of the anti-tampering policy.
In recent tampering cases involving players, the offending team has been fined and/or lost draft picks. The Jets were docked $100,000 in 2015 for tampering with then-Patriots cornerback Darrelle Revis.
In addition to being fined $350,000, the Chiefs were stripped of a 2016 third-round pick and a 2017 sixth-round pick for tampering with wide receiver Jeremy Maclin while he was still under contract with the Eagles. "

https://www.bostonherald.com/2019/06/12/patriots-file-tampering-charges-against-texans-for-pursuit-of-nick-caserio/


Players agree to the rules of the NFL when they sign on as a player, even then there are loopholes just ask the Colts when they drafted Elway, but FO people are hired strictly by the team itself. Its why their salaries don't count towards the cap. You're comparing apples to oranges.
 

DocBar

Hall of Fame
Contributor's Club
Well, as you know, in a trade, does the party traded have any choice about going to the team they are traded to? Not really. After the trade, the party that is traded is no longer an employee or member of the team they are traded from. At that point, would they have much of a choice but to sign a contract with their new team? As long as the contract is to their approval anyways. Then, once they agree on a contract, they pretty much should sign that contract and prepare to work with their new team.
So you would be good with the Texans trading away a draft pick for a GM who doesn't want to be the Texans GM (hypothetically)? I'm playing devil's advocate with this, but we really don't know if Caserio even wants to leave NE.
 

Insideop

All Pro
I hate to say this but I saw all this tampering stuff coming from a mile away. Originally I thought they would use this as a road block or stall tactic to by time and force the situation to be dragged out, hoping the Texans would just give up eventually and go look elsewhere. Now, I'm not so sure. It may be they know they are going to lose Caserio so they want to get some kind of compensation in return and the tampering charge is the way to get it. If JamTex is correct in what he heard, and all the Texans have to do is offer them a draft pick, then I think this was what the Pats were looking for if they believe they were going to lose Caserio anyway. If this is all true then the only question now is what draft pick do the Texans give them?
 

DocBar

Hall of Fame
Contributor's Club
Again where are you pulling this from? You can't force someone to sign a contract to work for you, that's so illegal its not even funny. Really I don't even think you can trade executives, the whole draft picks thing is not about a trade its a penalty for tampering.

"A transfer of draft choices could be in play if the Texans are found to have tampered in their pursuit of Caserio, according to the “specific penalties” section of the anti-tampering policy.
In recent tampering cases involving players, the offending team has been fined and/or lost draft picks. The Jets were docked $100,000 in 2015 for tampering with then-Patriots cornerback Darrelle Revis.
In addition to being fined $350,000, the Chiefs were stripped of a 2016 third-round pick and a 2017 sixth-round pick for tampering with wide receiver Jeremy Maclin while he was still under contract with the Eagles. "

https://www.bostonherald.com/2019/06/12/patriots-file-tampering-charges-against-texans-for-pursuit-of-nick-caserio/


Players agree to the rules of the NFL when they sign on as a player, even then there are loopholes just ask the Colts when they drafted Elway, but FO people are hired strictly by the team itself. Its why their salaries don't count towards the cap. You're comparing apples to oranges.
Coaches salaries don't count against the cap and there have been 5 traded for draft picks. I'm not necessarily disagreeing with you, but salaries not counting towards the cap isn't a reason you wouldn't be able to trade for a GM.
 

TheKDog

Hall of Fame
Contributor's Club
I think the Texans tampered. That's what happens when you elevate some character coach to an executive position. He probably doesn't know all the rules.

Secondly, I don't think Caserio really wants to come here. There has been no indication he is even interested in interviewing.
 

IDEXAN

Hall of Fame
Contributor's Club
Just my understanding of the situation: Easterby and Caserio videod talking at Kraft's home at ring presentation. Next day, Gaines terminated. So far no proof Texans offered a job. I would not be surprised if a audio magically appears. I would not be surprised if we end up losing a draft pick over this. Circumstantial evidence at best but does commish need more?
Israel awards Patriots owner Robert Kraft the ‘Jewish Nobel’ prize
JERUSALEM (AP) — New England Patriots owner Robert Kraft has been awarded Israel’s 2019 Genesis Prize in recognition of his philanthropy and commitment to combatting anti-Semitism, organizers of the prize announced on Wednesday.

The $1 million award, widely known as the “Jewish Nobel” prize, is granted each year to a person recognized as an inspiration to the next generation of Jews through professional achievement and commitment to Jewish values.
***
https://www.boston.com/sports/new-england-patriots/2019/01/09/israel-robert-kraft-jewish-nobel-prize
***
So sometime after the presentation in his home that Easterby, Caserio, et. al., attended looks like Kraft took his "Jewish Values" to collect the "Jewish Nobel" prize
in Israel and I wouldn't be at all surprised if Bobby obtained a quick BJ or maybe a series of BJs while in the promised land.
 
Coaches salaries don't count against the cap and there have been 5 traded for draft picks. I'm not necessarily disagreeing with you, but salaries not counting towards the cap isn't a reason you wouldn't be able to trade for a GM.
I know what you are referring to but even those weren't trades in the same sense as a players traded.

Bill Belichick: The Jets were awarded the Pats first round pick by the NFL. The NFL awarded the Pats the Jets 5th and they swapped 7ths. That wasn't a trade as it was the NFL making a ruling.

Bill Parcells: Indirectly ties in to the BB deal and was one of the reasons that Jets didn't get a boat load from the Pats in that deal because they had pulled shady stunts first. Plus the NFL love affair with NE was just getting started because the Jets got hammered by the NFL for this one.

Herm Edwards: Wanted to leave the Jets and KC gave them a fourth rounder to release him from his contract but after that he didn't have to sign with KC.

Mike Holmgren: Pretty much the same deal as above.

Jon Gruden: About the closest to a player style trade as there is on the list. Oakland didn't want to give him a big money deal so they got what they could before his contract ran out.

https://www.oregonlive.com/nfl/2015/12/nfl_5_coaches_who_have_been_tr.html

So even on the coaches that were traded it wasn't like when players are traded. This situation is more like the one between the Jets and the Pats than any others which is bad for us because Pats rarely lose these kinds of fights.

On a side note I find it interesting that three of these deals included the Jets. Guess no one really wants to coach there in addition to not wanting to play there.
 
Israel awards Patriots owner Robert Kraft the ‘Jewish Nobel’ prize
JERUSALEM (AP) — New England Patriots owner Robert Kraft has been awarded Israel’s 2019 Genesis Prize in recognition of his philanthropy and commitment to combatting anti-Semitism, organizers of the prize announced on Wednesday.

The $1 million award, widely known as the “Jewish Nobel” prize, is granted each year to a person recognized as an inspiration to the next generation of Jews through professional achievement and commitment to Jewish values.
***
https://www.boston.com/sports/new-england-patriots/2019/01/09/israel-robert-kraft-jewish-nobel-prize
***
So sometime after the presentation in his home that Easterby, Caserio, et. al., attended looks like Kraft took his "Jewish Values" to collect the "Jewish Nobel" prize
in Israel and I wouldn't be at all surprised if Bobby obtained a quick BJ or maybe a series of BJs while in the promised land.
Not sure what your point could possibly be and frankly given some of the wording you used I'm not sure I want to know. Kind of wish they would add a "dislike" button here.
 

Uncle Rico

Ur apology should be as loud as Ur disrespect was
The Texans out there looking thirsty AF ... leave it alone already .. not all of the great football people come from NE .. make your own mark .. stop riding coat tails. This is embarassing and makes everyone that is associated with HOU look incompetent.
 

IDEXAN

Hall of Fame
Contributor's Club
Not sure what your point could possibly be and frankly given some of the wording you used I'm not sure I want to know. Kind of wish they would add a "dislike" button here.
If there's some confusion on your part then I suggest you read the article in its entirety as reported by Kraft's hometown publication.
 

thunderkyss

Just win baby!!!
Staff member
Contributor's Club
The Texans out there looking thirsty AF ... leave it alone already .. not all of the great football people come from NE .. make your own mark .. stop riding coat tails. This is embarassing and makes everyone that is associated with HOU look incompetent.
They wanted this guy last year but were blocked from interviewing. I dont know why they didn't just wait until after the season if they really wanted this guy.

Being that they didn't wait, I dont think it is as done deal as some would like to represent.

Maybe NE knows they're going to lose Caserio and they're just trying to get a freebie out of the deal. You know how BB loves to stockpile draft picks.
Agreed. To me it looks like the Patriots are the ones who are desperate. We've got some good candidates. I don't think they can prove tampering.
 
If there's some confusion on your part then I suggest you read the article in its entirety as reported by Kraft's hometown publication.
I did and frankly there is still no point to you posting this. It has ZERO to do with the tampering charge or even football in general. Add to that the how you want to highlight the part about Jewish values, which was mostly just a throw away comment and its a really bad look.

The $1 million award, widely known as the “Jewish Nobel” prize, is granted each year to a person recognized as an inspiration to the next generation of Jews through professional achievement and commitment to Jewish values.

You are acting like a guy having hookers and drugs in the NFL is something new or that it disqualifies someone from getting some kind of award. If that's the case the HoF is about to lose a lot of players.
 

TexansBull

Hall of Fame
The comments in reddit are gold as usual.

“So Kraft is now PRO-VIDEO?”

“My sources tell me Texans sent Caserio a winky face on Facebook which Caserio clicked liked. Disgusting.”

“Roger Goodell reportedly has had to have it explained to him multiple times that the Patriots are the ones filing the charges, not the Texans. At one point, sources say, puppets were involved in the explanation.”
 

IDEXAN

Hall of Fame
Contributor's Club
I did and frankly there is still no point to you posting this. It has ZERO to do with the tampering charge or even football in general. Add to that the how you want to highlight the part about Jewish values, which was mostly just a throw away comment and its a really bad look.

The $1 million award, widely known as the “Jewish Nobel” prize, is granted each year to a person recognized as an inspiration to the next generation of Jews through professional achievement and commitment to Jewish values.

You are acting like a guy having hookers and drugs in the NFL is something new or that it disqualifies someone from getting some kind of award. If that's the case the HoF is about to lose a lot of players.
If you sincerely feel that way then I suggest you write the Boston Globe a letter.
 


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