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Off season....

badboy

Hall of Fame
You're right. Next year it's $2m then it's $10m in 2021
no you are wrong. Why don't you check out one of the constantly posted links on Texans player salaries and cap cost? It could be very helpful. Neither player is under contract for 2021.
 

TheKDog

Hall of Fame
Contributor's Club
no you are wrong. Why don't you check out one of the constantly posted links on Texans player salaries and cap cost? It could be very helpful. Neither player is under contract for 2021.
His 5th year option would be in 2021
 
The thread that was used was started right after the win vs. Buffalo. Not even called the 'game day thread', just there was no game day thread to use
We try to avoid starting duplicate threads.
I think it’s clear the real reason the Texans lost is not on OB, RAC or Watson it’s on Seegara for letting the team down and not making the game day thread.

You’ve failed us Seegara, we brought you in to compete for the starting job, pun intended, with Jam and you had some big games but when it counted most you didn’t show up.

Now we have to start the rebuild process and draft a new game day thread starter. Anyone know who starts the game day threads for LSU? Maybe we could bring them in.
 

Grams

Veteran
I have zero faith that Cal is going to fire OB.
I have zero faith that Cal is going to hire a real GM
I have zero faith that OB is going to hire an OC (and let the OC run the offense)
I only believe that OB is going to continue to screw up on a regular basis.
I stopped being overly emotionally attached to the Texans 2 years ago, when OB should have been fired. Until the ownership does something to show they are actually committed to improving, I will continue to be mediocre about them as they are.
 

CPTTexan

Waterboy
You hang out with Bill O'Brien much? Cause ain't nobody around here is saying that.
Do you really believe that? How many arguments from those of us who think this team isn't that good have been followed by: "Then how did we win our division if we're not good?" "We went 11-5!" "We went 10-6!" Again, winning the division is important to get to the playoffs......but when you get there and show the football world that you don't belong (2 years in a row), it's embarrassing.
 

Texas Jake

Rookie
Do you really believe that? How many arguments from those of us who think this team isn't that good have been followed by: "Then how did we win our division if we're not good?" "We went 11-5!" "We went 10-6!" Again, winning the division is important to get to the playoffs......but when you get there and show the football world that you don't belong (2 years in a row), it's embarrassing.
You do realize that when you get into the playoffs you are playing the best teams in the NFL and it is a win or go home environment. A team that goes 11-5 then 10-6 is a good team. They may not be a championship team, but the difference between a good team and a championship team is often not that much. We are a couple pieces away from getting there, I think. Can we make the improvement to turn the corner? That is yet to be seen.

I am as disappointed in the way the KC game went as anyone, but I realized going into that game that we weren't a true championship caliber team. We are good enough on offense, but the defense is too suspect. The games we loss all year was because the defense could not hold a lead, or spotted the opposing team quick points to start a game, or couldn't get stops and got steam rolled. By and large, defense wins championships and if you have one as porous as ours you are not going to win a championship.
 

TexanBorn51

Rookie
The XFL Roughnecks are a Houston team so therefore Houston sports fans support Houston no? They begin Feb 8 with 10 games 8 teams. 2 games Saturday 2 games Sunday. They even play the Dallas Renegades. Texans got blown away and the cheating Astros well that's a sad affair. It's inbetween seasons and who knows maybe the Roughnecks will offer a positive glimmer of winning light and hopefully play a championship for the city. If anything it should be fun.
 

CPTTexan

Waterboy
You do realize that when you get into the playoffs you are playing the best teams in the NFL and it is a win or go home environment. A team that goes 11-5 then 10-6 is a good team. They may not be a championship team, but the difference between a good team and a championship team is often not that much. We are a couple pieces away from getting there, I think. Can we make the improvement to turn the corner? That is yet to be seen.

I am as disappointed in the way the KC game went as anyone, but I realized going into that game that we weren't a true championship caliber team. We are good enough on offense, but the defense is too suspect. The games we loss all year was because the defense could not hold a lead, or spotted the opposing team quick points to start a game, or couldn't get stops and got steam rolled. By and large, defense wins championships and if you have one as porous as ours you are not going to win a championship.
After a good 10+ years of being: "a couple pieces away from getting there", it just gets tiring. We've literally had the same personnel issues for several years, yet they always seem to be an afterthought to the guys in charge of that. We need a CB? You don't say.....we've needed that for years. We need OL? You don't say.....we've needed that for years. We need a quality 2nd WR who you can actually depend on? Haven't had that in awhile. RB's? They can't even be used properly by our HC/GM/OC. "What are they good at?....nah....run 'em up the middle! That'll work." We have 3 TE's drafted in the previous 2 years......and a former basketball player who's bounced around the league was hands down our best option.

Injuries are a part of the game. Yet, some teams.....seemingly the same teams can lose roughly the same "talent", yet their replacements play up to a level that should be beyond their supposed capability. Then you have teams like us that our personnel guys couldn't find a proper backup to save their lives. Chris F'n Clark was our best secondary option? He sucked last year. If that's really the best our guys can do.......GET NEW GUYS to handle the scouting/personnel decisions.
 

Texas Jake

Rookie
After a good 10+ years of being: "a couple pieces away from getting there", it just gets tiring. We've literally had the same personnel issues for several years, yet they always seem to be an afterthought to the guys in charge of that. We need a CB? You don't say.....we've needed that for years. We need OL? You don't say.....we've needed that for years. We need a quality 2nd WR who you can actually depend on? Haven't had that in awhile. RB's? They can't even be used properly by our HC/GM/OC. "What are they good at?....nah....run 'em up the middle! That'll work." We have 3 TE's drafted in the previous 2 years......and a former basketball player who's bounced around the league was hands down our best option.

Injuries are a part of the game. Yet, some teams.....seemingly the same teams can lose roughly the same "talent", yet their replacements play up to a level that should be beyond their supposed capability. Then you have teams like us that our personnel guys couldn't find a proper backup to save their lives. Chris F'n Clark was our best secondary option? He sucked last year. If that's really the best our guys can do.......GET NEW GUYS to handle the scouting/personnel decisions.
The big difference is we finally have a QB.
 

Seegara

Guitar Picker, Dog Lover, Woodworker
I think it’s clear the real reason the Texans lost is not on OB, RAC or Watson it’s on Seegara for letting the team down and not making the game day thread.

You’ve failed us Seegara, we brought you in to compete for the starting job, pun intended, with Jam and you had some big games but when it counted most you didn’t show up.

Now we have to start the rebuild process and draft a new game day thread starter. Anyone know who starts the game day threads for LSU? Maybe we could bring them in.
Blame it on Seegara. We've heard everything now!
None of the prediction threads I posted were on game day. They were posted several days before gametime, and only after it looked like nobody else was going to.
Of those 24 points, how many were due to the offense? It took KC less than 1 quarter to overcome the deficit. They were so much better than we were, not even divine intervention could have saved us, much less some newly formed superstition about who posted the game thread.
 
Blame it on Seegara. We've heard everything now!
None of the prediction threads I posted were on game day. They were posted several days before gametime, and only after it looked like nobody else was going to.
Of those 24 points, how many were due to the offense? It took KC less than 1 quarter to overcome the deficit. They were so much better than we were, not even divine intervention could have saved us, much less some newly formed superstition about who posted the game thread.
Just checking but you do know it was a joke right?
 

leebigeztx

Keep it Movin!
Diontae Johnson
David Montgomery
Devin Singletary
Terry Mclaurin
Chase Winovich
Will Harris (S)
Bobby Okereke
Mike Edwards (S)

And that was just 2019 3rd Round picks that would have been better.

I'm sure after next draft, I could find roughly the same number of players that would ultimately be better than Conley.
I wanted McLaurin as a Will Fuller replacement . Of all the Ohio St. Wrs, I thought he was the best.
 

Speedy

Yeller Dweller
You do realize that when you get into the playoffs you are playing the best teams in the NFL and it is a win or go home environment. A team that goes 11-5 then 10-6 is a good team. They may not be a championship team, but the difference between a good team and a championship team is often not that much. We are a couple pieces away from getting there, I think. Can we make the improvement to turn the corner? That is yet to be seen.

I am as disappointed in the way the KC game went as anyone, but I realized going into that game that we weren't a true championship caliber team. We are good enough on offense, but the defense is too suspect. The games we loss all year was because the defense could not hold a lead, or spotted the opposing team quick points to start a game, or couldn't get stops and got steam rolled. By and large, defense wins championships and if you have one as porous as ours you are not going to win a championship.
No we’re not a championship caliber team. And though we’re winning divisions and 10, 11 games, I don’t believe we’re that close either.

OB’s playoff losses:
KC 30-0 (-30)
NE 34-14 (-20)
Ind 21-7 (-14)
KC 51-31 (-20)

And that’s after throwing all in this year.

OB is at his ceiling, and it’s only as high as it is because he has a super talented QB. He’s 28-31 without Watson. 24-14 with him.

Limited capital going forward the next 2 years, and no telling how much more that gets screwed up.

It’s past time to move on from this guy. He is not the one who’s going to get you to that next level of being a championship caliber team. He just isn’t.
 

Texas Jake

Rookie
We scored 7 points in the second half.
True. When the defense can't get a stop the offense gets desperate and tries to do to much. Once the momentum shifted, the offense didn't seem like it could settle back into a productive rhythm.

This offense is not really capable of winning games when it becomes a shootout, but it is good enough to win games with a good defense. I agree there is a lot of room for improvement on the offense, but I still stand by my statement that with a good defense, we have enough on offense to have a chance at going all the way. We do not have a good defense--we have a defense that can play good at times.
 
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steelbtexan

Hall of Fame
No we’re not a championship caliber team. And though we’re winning divisions and 10, 11 games, I don’t believe we’re that close either.

OB’s playoff losses:
KC 30-0 (-30)
NE 34-14 (-20)
Ind 21-7 (-14)
KC 51-31 (-20)

And that’s after throwing all in this year.

OB is at his ceiling, and it’s only as high as it is because he has a super talented QB. He’s 28-31 without Watson. 24-14 with him.

Limited capital going forward the next 2 years, and no telling how much more that gets screwed up.

It’s past time to move on from this guy. He is not the one who’s going to get you to that next level of being a championship caliber team. He just isn’t.
If you dont believe DW4 is a championship level QB then trade him for draft capital and save the ton of cap space it will take to re-sign him.
 

Seegara

Guitar Picker, Dog Lover, Woodworker
I'll check in from time to time, but I guess I won't be posting much until the draft unless there's a major shakeup in the coaching staff. One can only take so much before one loses interest in a team.
 

TripleTap

Dead Wood
this is heresy around here, but some of us have quietly wondered—he runs around a lot, these days he gets caught and sacked a lot, he doesn’t pick his running spots all that well, a lot of his passes are off the mark. I mean, it would be wonderful if he was (or could be) as disciplined as the KC guy, but for now he isn’t. Maybe it’s on OB, or the blocking, or something else, but for the moment he looks good, not even nearly great. Sorry to say.
 

steelbtexan

Hall of Fame
this is heresy around here, but some of us have quietly wondered—he runs around a lot, these days he gets caught and sacked a lot, he doesn’t pick his running spots all that well, a lot of his passes are off the mark. I mean, it would be wonderful if he was (or could be) as disciplined as the KC guy, but for now he isn’t. Maybe it’s on OB, or the blocking, or something else, but for the moment he looks good, not even nearly great. Sorry to say.
For the last month of the season he wasn't even good.

Shouldn't he be improving every game since he's young?

That's the narrative around hear, his mistakes are because he's young or it's BOB's fault or both. Or maybe it's just he's just not that good.
 

RGV82

Random guy
Are you implying that you are not happy with DeShaun Watson as our QB? He had a 98.0 QBR this year (better than Tom Brady, Aaron Rodgers, Matt Ryan, Philip Rivers), and finished 8th overall in completion percentage (67.3 percent). The guy is a star.
 

Texas Jake

Rookie
For the last month of the season he wasn't even good.

Shouldn't he be improving every game since he's young?

That's the narrative around hear, his mistakes are because he's young or it's BOB's fault or both. Or maybe it's just he's just not that good.
Too much is put on his shoulders. When you score what should be the game winning drive and the defense gives the game away or you spot the other team to TDs off the back and you are constantly playing catch up, that is a lot of pressure in a young QB. I think a big part of the problem is Watson tries to do too much and the offense has to abandon the game plan early because the defense can't stop the other team.

I am not saying Watson doesn't need to improve, but the situation is magnified because of the situations he is put in. It is also hard to establish a rhythm when the other team keeps marching down the field, scoring points and running the clock. I don't think the play calling helps him out enough, but I believe part if that has been Watson being over committed to the big play and not taking (or possibly seeing) the underneath routes and checkdowns.

I know you don't believe this, but I think we have a QB to get us to and win a SB. I don't think he is that QB yet, but I think he definetly has the potential to become that QB. Regardless, one player doesn't win a SB, it takes a team (players and coaches) and we ain't there, yet.
 
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steelbtexan

Hall of Fame
Too much is put on his shoulders. When you score what should be the game winning drive and the defense gives the game away or you spot the other team to TDs off the back and you are constantly playing catch up, that is a lot of pressure in a young QB. I think a big part of the problem is Watson tries to do too much and the offense has to abandon the game plan early because the defense can't stop the other team.

I am not saying Watson doesn't need to improve, but the situation is magnified because of the situations he is put in. It is also hard to establish a rhythm when the other team keeps marching down the field, scoring points and running the clock. I don't think the play calling helps him out enough, but I believe part if that has been Watson being over committed to the big play and not taking (or possibly seeing) the underneath routes and checkdowns.

I know you don't believe this, but I think we have a QB to get us to and win a SB. I don't think he is that QB yet, but I think he definetly has the potential to become that QB. Regardless, one player doesn't win a SB, it takes a team (players and coaches) and we ain't there, yet.
Go back and look at his play over the last month, take the Tampa game as an example, the defense played well and he still sucked. Same with Buffalo for 2 1/2 qtrs. They won because he got lucky and yes there may be too much for him to process going through his head right now. (I'm not saying he's stupid) The question is how does BOB get things to slow down and will it ever slow down?

Like Corrosion said he ran an easy 2 sometimes 3 read offense under Dabo. This is what I would do with him because what BOB's currently doing isn't working and the league has figured out what DW4 likes to do and how to stop him if you have above avg talent on defense.

The question you asked is valid, will he ever get there? You think he will, I dont because in order to get there he will have to change SOME things he's been doing his whole life and those are changes I dont think he can make.
 

steelbtexan

Hall of Fame
Are you implying that you are not happy with DeShaun Watson as our QB? He had a 98.0 QBR this year (better than Tom Brady, Aaron Rodgers, Matt Ryan, Philip Rivers), and finished 8th overall in completion percentage (67.3 percent). The guy is a star.
I'm implying that the last month of the season has shown that the NFL has caught up to DW4 and what he likes to do. I dont know the numbers but look at how he played the last month of the season.
 

RGV82

Random guy
I'm implying that the last month of the season has shown that the NFL has caught up to DW4 and what he likes to do. I dont know the numbers but look at how he played the last month of the season.
I refuse to write him off because of 2 poor games at the end of the season. He picked apart New Englands number 1 ranked secondary in December in case you forgot. I agree he had a couple of rough games towards the end of the season. When you consider teams like Chicago who stick with a guy like Trubisky for 3 years+, there is no way I am giving up on him after a rough month.
 

Texas Jake

Rookie
Go back and look at his play over the last month, take the Tampa game as an example, the defense played well and he still sucked. Same with Buffalo for 2 1/2 qtrs. They won because he got lucky and yes there may be too much for him to process going through his head right now. (I'm not saying he's stupid) The question is how does BOB get things to slow down and will it ever slow down?

Like Corrosion said he ran an easy 2 sometimes 3 read offense under Dabo. This is what I would do with him because what BOB's currently doing isn't working and the league has figured out what DW4 likes to do and how to stop him if you have above avg talent on defense.

The question you asked is valid, will he ever get there? You think he will, I dont because in order to get there he will have to change SOME things he's been doing his whole life and those are changes I dont think he can make.
Definetly agree he needs to change some things. I think he can and you have serious doubts and I respect that. But how long has it taken to get to the place where we have a QB we can even have a serious conversation whether he is a franchise QB. I am very reluctant to spin that roulette wheel again.
 
I refuse to write him off because of 2 poor games at the end of the season. He picked apart New Englands number 1 ranked secondary in December in case you forgot. I agree he had a couple of rough games towards the end of the season. When you consider teams like Chicago who stick with a guy like Trubisky for 3 years+, there is no way I am giving up on him after a rough month.
New England only had the number one 1 ranked defense because they did nothing but play really bad teams the first half of the season.

Steelers that started the season ice cold
Dolphins
Jets
Bill's before they got hot and even when they did it was because of their defense
Redskins
Giants
Jets again
Browns in the middle of their Jersey Shore style collapse
Then they got slapped by the Ravens the first good offense they played
Eagles and Cowboys the front runners of a historically bad division
And then us and the chiefs.

In other words anytime they played a team with a real offense they got destroyed. If they had had a little tougher schedule at the start they would have had a good defense but nothing like what people were talking about.
 

RGV82

Random guy
New England only had the number one 1 ranked defense because they did nothing but play really bad teams the first half of the season.

Steelers that started the season ice cold
Dolphins
Jets
Bill's before they got hot and even when they did it was because of their defense
Redskins
Giants
Jets again
Browns in the middle of their Jersey Shore style collapse
Then they got slapped by the Ravens the first good offense they played
Eagles and Cowboys the front runners of a historically bad division
And then us and the chiefs.

In other words anytime they played a team with a real offense they got destroyed. If they had had a little tougher schedule at the start they would have had a good defense but nothing like what people were talking about.
Regardless, this is all irrelevant trying to justify getting rid of Watson. He is not going anywhere for the foreseeable future.
 

Uncle Rico

Ur apology should be as loud as Ur disrespect was
Diontae Johnson
David Montgomery
Devin Singletary
Terry Mclaurin
Chase Winovich
Will Harris (S)
Bobby Okereke
Mike Edwards (S)

And that was just 2019 3rd Round picks that would have been better.

I'm sure after next draft, I could find roughly the same number of players that would ultimately be better than Conley.
I would dump Roby, Conley and Hargreaves and try to pry multiple guys from the FA list or a new crop of rookies (im giving Lonnie another year before declaring him dumpster juice):

Brian Poole
Troy Hill
Chris Harris
Byron Jones
(2nd rounder)
(3rd rounder)

honestly if this entire draft is not devoted to the defense then its the blind leading the blind.

on that note Texans should be players on these guys too:

Robert Quinn
Kyle Van Noy
Yannick Ngakoue
Cory Littleton
Mike Daniels
Jarran Reed
 

steelbtexan

Hall of Fame
I refuse to write him off because of 2 poor games at the end of the season. He picked apart New Englands number 1 ranked secondary in December in case you forgot. I agree he had a couple of rough games towards the end of the season. When you consider teams like Chicago who stick with a guy like Trubisky for 3 years+, there is no way I am giving up on him after a rough month.
They are married to DW4 for atleast another 5 yrs. What I'm saying is dont expect championships within those 5 yrs.
 

austins23

Hall of Fame
If the Texans do stick with O’Brien, it’s imperative that they bring someone in to oversee the personnel side of things.

O’Brien has already raided the team of most of its long-term assets—if the franchise waits much longer, the cupboard will be completely bare when they finally look for a GM.

Very telling from this article....
In August he gave up a third-round pick for Browns running back Duke Johnson, who totaled 820 scrimmage yards.
Just ridiculous...He had no clue how to use this guy.

Now they’ll watch as the Titans play in the AFC championship game, and O’Brien had no answers after the loss:
Reporter: What's holding your team back?

Bill O'Brien: I don't know

(via @CBSSportsHQ)pic.twitter.com/T9DzNQNPgl
— Sports Illustrated (@SInow) January 12, 2020
He doesn't know what's holding his team back?? Damn buffoon.
 


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