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Nick Caserio - keeper or kerb?

Keeper or kerb?


  • Total voters
    54
  • Poll closed .
Yep we could have
1.2 W Anderson
1.12 CB Christian Gonzalez 13 Ts, 1 sack 1 INT
2.33 Steve Avila OG
Still could have Scruggs and Patterson.

2024
Rnd 1 WR Marvin Harrison
Rnd 1 Browns
QB Shedeur Sanders
Rnd 2 Bralen Trice
6'4 274 DE
I think the problem here is I'm a Stroud guy. I've said he's as good as anyone not named Caleb Williams in this upcoming draft so I was all for taking him. I don't think the "wait for next year's class" is a good strategy when there's a great player at that position available and staring you in the face in the now.

So in my mind it's either Stroud and two picks this year or Stroud + WAJ and one pick this year.

I'm always taking the former rather than the latter as we get guaranteed two great players rather than hoping we and the Browns tank so we can get good players.
 
I think the problem here is I'm a Stroud guy. I've said he's as good as anyone not named Caleb Williams in this upcoming draft so I was all for taking him. I don't think the "wait for next year's class" is a good strategy when there's a great player at that position available and staring you in the face in the now.

So in my mind it's either Stroud and two picks this year or Stroud + WAJ and one pick this year.

I'm always taking the former rather than the latter as we get guaranteed two great players rather than hoping we and the Browns tank so we can get good players.
This is a fair viewpoint.
 
I'm not sure it matters, since we'll never know anyway. In reality, what will happen is Caserio will carry the credit/blame for the draft picks, whether deserved or not. That's just how it is.
Let's assume that.
Stroud to me deserves the 2nd pick; he was preferred by some over Bryce Young during draft discussion.

That should be par for the course for the GM, no?

Same goes for Will Anderson and Dell.

So for me, Caserio was par for the course this year.

It was.last year's draft that pulled his stock down for me.
 
Let's assume that.
Stroud to me deserves the 2nd pick; he was preferred by some over Bryce Young during draft discussion.

That should be par for the course for the GM, no?

Same goes for Will Anderson and Dell.

So for me, Caserio was par for the course this year.

It was.last year's draft that pulled his stock down for me.

He had six 1st round picks, two have been wasted, one traded away, two (so far) really good ones, and one to go. Which means that so far, we've spent five 1st round picks for two good players. The truth ain't so pretty, but at least the trend line is definitely going up.

Hopefully DeMeco is a good influence on him and all our future drafts will continue that upward trend.
 
I think the problem here is I'm a Stroud guy. I've said he's as good as anyone not named Caleb Williams in this upcoming draft so I was all for taking him. I don't think the "wait for next year's class" is a good strategy when there's a great player at that position available and staring you in the face in the now.

So in my mind it's either Stroud and two picks this year or Stroud + WAJ and one pick this year.

I'm always taking the former rather than the latter as we get guaranteed two great players rather than hoping we and the Browns tank so we can get good players.
I get it. I was never against Stroud but his agent did concern me. After the Texans indicated they were not concerned, that eased my mind somewhat. I also was not a wait till 2024 for a quarterback. My plan was to go with Hendon Hooker later in the draft. Once a player is a Texan I root for him but also can compliment or critique him.
The old 1game at a time seems very fitting this season as well as next man up.

It seems that we have our franchise quarterback. We also seem to have at least a better wide receiving department that many of us expected.
 
He had six 1st round picks, two have been wasted, one traded away, two (so far) really good ones, and one to go. Which means that so far, we've spent five 1st round picks for two good players. The truth ain't so pretty, but at least the trend line is definitely going up.

Hopefully DeMeco is a good influence on him and all our future drafts will continue that upward trend.
Hopefully Stingley will comeback and play like he was before he pulled his hammy again and Green gets his surgery and solves the LG issue next yr.
 
I get it. I was never against Stroud but his agent did concern me. After the Texans indicated they were not concerned, that eased my mind somewhat. I also was not a wait till 2024 for a quarterback. My plan was to go with Hendon Hooker later in the draft. Once a player is a Texan I root for him but also can compliment or critique him.
The old 1game at a time seems very fitting this season as well as next man up.

It seems that we have our franchise quarterback. We also seem to have at least a better wide receiving department that many of us expected.
Good for you.
 
Florio on PFT today suggesting that somebody at some other team was putting out a load of stuff about CJ Stroud’s S2 and character to make the Texans whiff on the pick and get him to fall past them in the draft.

Could it not be the case that the Texans did exactly this to get him to fall from #1?
 
Florio on PFT today suggesting that somebody at some other team was putting out a load of stuff about CJ Stroud’s S2 and character to make the Texans whiff on the pick and get him to fall past them in the draft.

Could it not be the case that the Texans did exactly this to get him to fall from #1?
Supposedly the Texans didn’t have access to the scores. The only ones that did were the Colts and the Titans. Makes me think the Titans were the ones that were leaking the score since the rumor was they wanted Stroud. Good thing the Texans didn’t care for that lol.
 
Florio on PFT today suggesting that somebody at some other team was putting out a load of stuff about CJ Stroud’s S2 and character to make the Texans whiff on the pick and get him to fall past them in the draft.
That's Stroud and just about every top prospect. Rumors leaked to get prospects to drop is as old as the draft itself. Was this Florio's first draft? Good thing Hannah, er Nick didn't fall for it.
 
That's Stroud and just about every top prospect. Rumors leaked to get prospects to drop is as old as the draft itself. Was this Florio's first draft? Good thing Hannah, er Nick didn't fall for it.
Genuine question, is stating that Hannah/ownership make the draft decisions a slight against Caserio? Because I’d have thought that as GM it’s his job to set up the scouting department and oversee the gathering of information ready to make the decision of who to pick in the draft, I doubt many organisations don’t have ownership involved in a meeting of such discussions, it’s the scouting that Caserio must control, we’ve seen enough points in Texans history where the scouting has been an obviously weak point, and we’re happy to criticise him when he misses Kenyon Green’s issues or Stingley’s injury proneness, why don’t we appreciate it when he gets the best QB in the draft and a pass rusher who’s doing great as a rookie also?
 
Genuine question, is stating that Hannah/ownership make the draft decisions a slight against Caserio? Because I’d have thought that as GM it’s his job to set up the scouting department and oversee the gathering of information ready to make the decision of who to pick in the draft, I doubt many organisations don’t have ownership involved in a meeting of such discussions, it’s the scouting that Caserio must control, we’ve seen enough points in Texans history where the scouting has been an obviously weak point, and we’re happy to criticise him when he misses Kenyon Green’s issues or Stingley’s injury proneness, why don’t we appreciate it when he gets the best QB in the draft and a pass rusher who’s doing great as a rookie also?

I've worked in a few different companies for lots of different managers with lots of different management styles. I don't believe there's one right way to do things. There are different strategies that can be successful.

In football, one strategy is to have a GM who has a clear idea of the team he wants to build and how he wants to build it. And that's fine. That can be successful, and it can fail spectacularly. Another strategy is to have a HC who also has GM duties and he has that clear idea of the team and how to build it. This is the Parcells "If I'm the Cook, let me buy the groceries" strategy. Which is great for Bill Parcells but sucks for Bill O'Brien.

I think our strategy, with Caserio, is more of a group effort with both coaches and owners having input. I think this is a more common approach, and I think this can be a successful approach. However, on the one hand, you've got the old saw about how a Camel is just a Horse designed by a committee... but I've also seen cases where a group of people working on something are better than a single person because people working together can bring different viewpoints and ideas to the table that allow for the creation of a better, more complete design. And besides, in the desert, camels rule.

So I personally have no problem with Caserio seeing his position as more of a facilitator, working with coaches to get players they think will work in their system, while also working with the owner and the front office to try to get players the fanbase are going to be excited about.

But that's just me. There are probably more people (or at least more vocal people) who would prefer to go back to the old model of a GM with a view who doesn't allow outside chatter to distract him. And those people want Caserio gone.

I can dig it. I just am not convinced his approach is wrong.
 
... misses Kenyon Green’s issues or Stingley’s injury proneness...
How does anyone know he missed on these players? Was anyone posting on this forum in the room during these discussions? How likely is it that the coaching staff was in on the discussion? The medical staff? The owners?

Someone posted that these picks will be on Caserio's record. I'll give you that. But within the organization, will the culpability be on him? This is what matters.

Caserio has this year and three more on his contract. Based on the limited information I'm reading, everyone who matters is happy with how everything has finally come together.
 
I've worked in a few different companies for lots of different managers with lots of different management styles. I don't believe there's one right way to do things. There are different strategies that can be successful.

In football, one strategy is to have a GM who has a clear idea of the team he wants to build and how he wants to build it. And that's fine. That can be successful, and it can fail spectacularly. Another strategy is to have a HC who also has GM duties and he has that clear idea of the team and how to build it. This is the Parcells "If I'm the Cook, let me buy the groceries" strategy. Which is great for Bill Parcells but sucks for Bill O'Brien.

I think our strategy, with Caserio, is more of a group effort with both coaches and owners having input. I think this is a more common approach, and I think this can be a successful approach. However, on the one hand, you've got the old saw about how a Camel is just a Horse designed by a committee... but I've also seen cases where a group of people working on something are better than a single person because people working together can bring different viewpoints and ideas to the table that allow for the creation of a better, more complete design. And besides, in the desert, camels rule.

So I personally have no problem with Caserio seeing his position as more of a facilitator, working with coaches to get players they think will work in their system, while also working with the owner and the front office to try to get players the fanbase are going to be excited about.

But that's just me. There are probably more people (or at least more vocal people) who would prefer to go back to the old model of a GM with a view who doesn't allow outside chatter to distract him. And those people want Caserio gone.

I can dig it. I just am not convinced his approach is wrong.
Well put.
 
Genuine question, is stating that Hannah/ownership make the draft decisions a slight against Caserio? Because I’d have thought that as GM it’s his job to set up the scouting department and oversee the gathering of information ready to make the decision of who to pick in the draft, I doubt many organisations don’t have ownership involved in a meeting of such discussions, it’s the scouting that Caserio must control, we’ve seen enough points in Texans history where the scouting has been an obviously weak point, and we’re happy to criticise him when he misses Kenyon Green’s issues or Stingley’s injury proneness, why don’t we appreciate it when he gets the best QB in the draft and a pass rusher who’s doing great as a rookie also?
The McNair's picked Stroud. Hopefully this works out. So far so good.
 
I've worked in a few different companies for lots of different managers with lots of different management styles. I don't believe there's one right way to do things. There are different strategies that can be successful.

In football, one strategy is to have a GM who has a clear idea of the team he wants to build and how he wants to build it. And that's fine. That can be successful, and it can fail spectacularly. Another strategy is to have a HC who also has GM duties and he has that clear idea of the team and how to build it. This is the Parcells "If I'm the Cook, let me buy the groceries" strategy. Which is great for Bill Parcells but sucks for Bill O'Brien.

I think our strategy, with Caserio, is more of a group effort with both coaches and owners having input. I think this is a more common approach, and I think this can be a successful approach. However, on the one hand, you've got the old saw about how a Camel is just a Horse designed by a committee... but I've also seen cases where a group of people working on something are better than a single person because people working together can bring different viewpoints and ideas to the table that allow for the creation of a better, more complete design. And besides, in the desert, camels rule.

So I personally have no problem with Caserio seeing his position as more of a facilitator, working with coaches to get players they think will work in their system, while also working with the owner and the front office to try to get players the fanbase are going to be excited about.

But that's just me. There are probably more people (or at least more vocal people) who would prefer to go back to the old model of a GM with a view who doesn't allow outside chatter to distract him. And those people want Caserio gone.

I can dig it. I just am not convinced his approach is wrong.
Great post, Hopefully Hannah gets this right. Caserio is just getting the players Ryans wants and is just doing what ownership wants while collecting a fat pay check. He's certainly not running the football side of the org like Cal said he was.
 
So far it seems like some of Nick's moves are finally coming to fruition and this 2023 draft class looks like a great one. I'm still having trouble getting over how awful that 2022 draft looks though mixed feelings abound.
 
So far it seems like some of Nick's moves are finally coming to fruition and this 2023 draft class looks like a great one. I'm still having trouble getting over how awful that 2022 draft looks though mixed feelings abound.

2021

They got Mills (A good backup QB) Collins (A borderline WR1) Jordan (A decent option as a depth piece TE.) What more did you want out of a draft with 1st or 2nd rd draft pick. BTW, I wanted Mienertz over Mills, but I understood the Mills pick.

2022

Stingley- hated the pick because of his injury history and that's proven to be true.

Green- Unfortunately injuries happen.

Didn't like the Metchie pick because of the Stats CnD provided about WR's coming off of ACL injuries. Cancer was something unforeseen.

Rest of the draft was solid

2023- Very solid draft so far.

Caserio's job is to get the players the HC wants and negotiate contracts/WW/PS signings/treades etc....

Caserio has done a solid, not great job, but I think working with Ryans is going to be much more fruitful than working with Lovie.
 
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They got Mills (A good backup QB) Collins (A borderline WR1) Jordan (A decent option as a depth piece TE.) What more did you want out of a draft with 1st or 2nd rd draft pick. BTW, I wanted Mienertz over Mills, but I understood the Mills pick.

That's 2021, right. I think he's talking about Stingley/Green/Pitre/Metchie/Harris/Pierce/Booker/Quitoriano/Deculus draft in 2022, and probably, primarily, the 1st round of that.
 
2021

They got Mills (A good backup QB) Collins (A borderline WR1) Jordan (A decent option as a depth piece TE.) What more did you want out of a draft with 1st or 2nd rd draft pick. BTW, I wanted Mienertz over Mills, but I understood the Mills pick.

2022

Stingley- hated the pick because of his injury history and that's proven to be true.

Green- Unfortunately injuries happen.

Didn't like the Metchie pick because of the Stats CnD provided about WR's coming off of ACL injuries. Cancer was something unforeseen.

Rest of the draft was solid

2023- Very solid draft so far.

Caserio's job is to get the players the HC wants and negotiate contracts/WW/PS signings/treades etc....

Caserio has done a solid, not great job, but I think working with Ryans is going to be much more fruitful than working with Lovie.
Most of my skittishness with him comes down to that 2022 first round. This team could be in much much better shape had we done a better job with those picks. That also makes me nervous moving forward as I don’t trust him drafting just yet. He’s also given out some very questionable contracts during his time here.

But things are definitely on the up, this 2023 offseason looks excellent at this point so another good offseason from him and I’ll be totally back on board.
 
Most of my skittishness with him comes down to that 2022 first round. This team could be in much much better shape had we done a better job with those picks. That also makes me nervous moving forward as I don’t trust him drafting just yet. He’s also given out some very questionable contracts during his time here.

But things are definitely on the up, this 2023 offseason looks excellent at this point so another good offseason from him and I’ll be totally back on board.

The Stingley pick was a Lovie pick if that helps calm your fears.

Ryans seems to be better at telling Caserio the types of players that he's looking for.

If you want to see what a Caserio draft looks like then look at the 2021 draft.
 
I'm not sure it matters, since we'll never know anyway. In reality, what will happen is Caserio will carry the credit/blame for the draft picks, whether deserved or not. That's just how it is.

I think that Caserio/Ryans were in on CJ Stroud from the very beginning of the Draft process. I also believe that the of leaking the S2 test results, absolutely came out of the Texans office (or maybe out of the McNair's house).

Why do I think these facts are true, you ask? If you pay close attention and follow the bread crumbs, there is a definite line of reasoning, that strongly suggests that CJ Stroud was the Texan's "GUY" all along.

After Demeco got hired the first thing he did was hire Bobby Slowick. Bobby Slowick is a card carrying cititzen of the Kubiackishannahanistanian Nation of offensive systems. But on the same day that they annouced Slowicks hiring (Feb 12th), they annouced the hiring of the Texans new QB coach Jerrod Johnson. So why did they hire Johnson along with Slowick? Jerrod Johnson did not have any experience in the Shannahan offensive system, he had been an assitant coach with the Colts and the Vikings, niether of which which run the Shannahan offensive system. So why did they hire Jerrod rather than someone that already knew the system? Why did they hire a QB coach that had no experience with the offensive system that Slowick was going to run? This seems like a major disconnect.

So why Jerrod Johnson? Even though Jerrod had no experience in the Shannahan system, he was a well thought of, up and coming coach. However, you could apply that same label "well thought of, up and coming coach" to a lot of other guy's in the NFL, so again why Jerrod Johnson?

The answer is very simple. Of all, of all the potential QB coaches that the Texans could have hired, Jerrod Johnson had something that absolutely no one else had. A history of personally coaching and improving CJ Stroud's QB skills and technique.

Jerrod's history with CJ goes back to CJ's High School days, back when CJ was thought of as a good, but not elite QB talent. There is an annual High Schhool showcase QB competition called the "Elite 11". In 2019 CJ as a High School Senior, was not selected to attend the Elite 11 competition but instead was pick as an alternate. CJ at this time did not have any scholarship offer's from any big time schools. As it turned out one of the selected canidates suffered a late injury, and CJ was picked up as a participant. However they did not have a coach to handle CJ's squad. So the Elite 11 people, called a little known ex-Aggie QB by the name of Jerrod Johnson and asked him if he would coach the the stray dog they had added to the participants. They thought that even though Jerrod was not a high profile QB coach, he was only coaching an alternate so what damage could be done. Well as it turns out under Jerrod's coaching tutelage, CJ Stroud the alternate, ended up as the Elite 11 MVP. Based on the Elite 11 Showcase results, CJ Stroud recieved a scholarship offer from Ohio State and the rest is history. Thus, Jerrod Johnson was a major influence on CJ Stoud's football career.

Now the whole point of this diatribe, is the fact that the Texans hired Jerrod Johnson as the new Texans QB Coach, all the way back on Feb 12th rather than any of the numerous Shannahan System guy's that they could have hired. Is strong circumstantial evidence that CJ Stroud was the Texans QB draft target all the way back on Feb 12th.

Yes this is only circumstantial evidence, as to what actually happened we will never know for sure untill everyone retires. But the fact that they hired Jerrod Johnson as QB Coach out of no where, and then drafted CJ Stroud when no one had a clue they were considering CJ with the 2nd pick, seems awfully coincidental, considerering the history those two had.
 
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But the fact that they hired Jerrod Johnson as QB Coach out of no where, and then drafted CJ Stroud when no one had a clue they were considering CJ as their 1st pick, seems awfully coincidental, considerering the history those two had.
I'm picking up what you're putting down brother,

But what would have happened if the Panthers drafted Stroud? Then the Texans would be stuck with a coach they didn't really want. Not really a good way to handle your hiring.

IF they had the #1 pick I could see it.
 
I'm picking up what you're putting down brother,

But what would have happened if the Panthers drafted Stroud? Then the Texans would be stuck with a coach they didn't really want. Not really a good way to handle your hiring.

IF they had the #1 pick I could see it.
I think they would’ve went with Levis at 12 and WAJ at 2.
 
I have heard that he prefers Wranglers

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I'm picking up what you're putting down brother,

But what would have happened if the Panthers drafted Stroud? Then the Texans would be stuck with a coach they didn't really want. Not really a good way to handle your hiring.

IF they had the #1 pick I could see it.

You sir, have just hit on why I think the whole "S2" test results got out into the public.

Whoever in the Texans management (or maybe ownership, and yes Hannah: I think you are not above mentally playing one of your fellow owners, like a "Mark" at a carnival game) leaked the info, it was brilliant move. When the "S2" info hit the media, and became public knowledge. It reinforced David Tepper, preconceived biases, assuring that the midget would be the Panther's pick at one.

Thus, guaranteeing that CJ Stroud would be available for the Texans, with the 2nd pick.
 
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I think that Caserio/Ryans were in on CJ Stroud from the very beginning of the Draft process. I also believe that the of leaking the S2 test results, absolutely came out of the Texans office (or maybe out of the McNair's house).

Why do I think these facts are true, you ask? If you pay close attention and follow the bread crumbs, there is a definite line of reasoning, that strongly suggests that CJ Stroud was the Texan's "GUY" all along.

After Demeco got hired the first thing he did was hire Bobby Slowick. Bobby Slowick is a card carrying cititzen of the Kubiackishannahanistanian Nation of offensive systems. But on the same day that they annouced Slowicks hiring (Feb 12th), they annouced the hiring of the Texans new QB coach Jerrod Johnson. So why did they hire Johnson along with Slowick? Jerrod Johnson did not have any experience in the Shannahan offensive system, he had been an assitant coach with the Colts and the Vikings, niether of which which run the Shannahan offensive system. So why did they hire Jerrod rather than someone that already knew the system? Why did they hire a QB coach that had no experience with the offensive system that Slowick was going to run? This seems like a major disconnect.

So why Jerrod Johnson? Even though Jerrod had no experience in the Shannahan system, he was a well thought of, up and coming coach. However, you could apply that same label "well thought of, up and coming coach" to a lot of other guy's in the NFL, so again why Jerrod Johnson?

The answer is very simple. Of all, of all the potential QB coaches that the Texans could have hired, Jerrod Johnson had something that absolutely no one else had. A history of personally coaching and improving CJ Stroud's QB skills and technique.

Jerrod's history with CJ goes back to CJ's High School days, back when CJ was thought of as a good, but not elite QB talent. There is an annual High Schhool showcase QB competition called the "Elite 11". In 2019 CJ as a High School Senior, was not selected to attend the Elite 11 competition but instead was pick as an alternate. CJ at this time did not have any scholarship offer's from any big time schools. As it turned out one of the selected canidates suffered a late injury, and CJ was picked up as a participant. However they did not have a coach to handle CJ's squad. So the Elite 11 people, called a little known ex-Aggie QB by the name of Jerrod Johnson and asked him if he would coach the the stray dog they had added to the participants. They thought that even though Jerrod was not a high profile QB coach, he was only coaching an alternate so what damage could be done. Well as it turns out under Jerrod's coaching tutelage, CJ Stroud the alternate, ended up as the Elite 11 MVP. Based on the Elite 11 Showcase results, CJ Stroud recieved a scholarship offer from Ohio State and the rest is history. Thus, Jerrod Johnson was a major influence on CJ Stoud's football career.

Now the whole point of this diatribe, is the fact that the Texans hired Jerrod Johnson as the new Texans QB Coach, all the way back on Feb 12th rather than any of the numerous Shannahan System guy's that they could have hired. Is strong circumstantial evidence that CJ Stroud was the Texans QB draft target all the way back on Feb 12th.

Yes this is only circumstantial evidence, as to what actually happened we will never know for sure untill everyone retires. But the fact that they hired Jerrod Johnson as QB Coach out of no where, and then drafted CJ Stroud when no one had a clue they were considering CJ as their 1st pick, seems awfully coincidental, considerering the history those two had.
Jerrod Johnson was with the Vikings when Kubiak was an offensive consultant and his son was the OC. Those Aggie roots run deep.

Great story, I was not aware of Johnson coaching at the elite 11. Johnson will be a NFL HC one day. I played golf with Johnson (No I dont know him, 4 of us were paired together) the Friday before he was hired. He was talking to somebody on his phone about the Lions game and coverages. This let me know how bright his future is. Great guy too, very personable. Great athlete in football and basketball in highschool.
 
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Jerrod Johnson was with the Vikings when Kubiak was an offensive consultant and his son was the OC.

That would be incorrect. Jerrod Johnson was Assistant QB for the Vikings in 2022 when Wes Phillips was the Vikings OC. Klint Kubiak was the Vikings OC in 2021, and Jerrod was not on the Vikings staff that year. He was a Offensive Quality Control Coach for the Colts in 2020 and 2021.

The fact that Jerrod had only been an Assistant QB Coach for one year when the Texans hire him, is again pretty compelling evidence, that there had to be some particular reason that the Texans want him as their QB Coach.

I wonder what that reason could have been?
 
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That would be incorrect. Jerrod Johnson was Assistant QB for the Vikings in 2022 when Wes Phillips was the Vikings OC. Klint Kubiak was the Vikings OC in 2021, and Jerrod was not on the Vikings staff that year. He was a Offensive Quality Control Coach for the Colts in 2020 and 2021.

The fact that Jerrod had only been an Assistant QB Coach for one year when the Texans hire him, is again pretty compelling evidence, that there had to be some particular reason that the Texans want him as their QB Coach.

I wonder what that reason could have been?
Since you seem to know, was Kubiak still an offensive assistant.

Like TK said, if Stroud had been picked by the Panthers then this theory wouldn't have held water.
 
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