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DW4 Traded to Cleveland

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OptimisticTexan said:
The Giants won’t cut loose of both of their RD1 picks in 2022, but if the Caserio stays focused on getting Watson out of Houston then the Texans might walk away with their RD1-08, RD2-37, and RD3-81 for 2022. That will leave some meat on the bone in 2023 and 2024. I’m thinking, RD1’s in 2023/2024 and another RD3 in 2023.

That wouldn’t be peak return for Watson but I think it would be a healthy return for the Texans and the Giants could afford to pay it based on Watson’s current legal situation and their bundle of picks in 2022.
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I do not think Mara expects Flores and Watson to do more than just have a 500 season if that in 2022. It will not be a throwaway year but would be year 1 improved productivity. The Giants could easily give up the two round ones and the second round as they have two round threes that could be extremely helpful. Going forward into the future years is where I would not want to give up high draft picks. Average QBs in draft, pressure on GMs closer to draft and competiveness of many teams needing the position filled benefit Caserio. I expect him to crank the pressure even higher. Just wait until Rogers and Russell Wilson are off the board.
 
Duh.........

***********************************************************************************************

Nick Caserio: Deshaun Watson return “more than likely would not be the case”
January 18, 2022, 12:26

Last week, Texans G.M. Nick Caserio had not much to say about quarterback Deshaun Watson. On Tuesday morning, Caserio said plenty more.Appearing on Sports Radio 610, Caserio was asked whether the potential hiring of Brian Flores to be the coach would possibly result in Watson sticking around. Via the Houston Chronicle, Caserio said “that more than likely would not be the case.”

It would be a shocker if Watson stays, regardless of whether the next coach is Flores or even Dabo Swinney. The bridge has been both burned and blown to smithereens. Beyond Watson not wanting to be there, the organization likely has misgiving about keeping Watson, given his off-field legal issues.

“I think we have to be open-minded and just take the information and process it and ultimately make the decision that we feel makes the most sense for everybody involved, whatever that looks like,” Caserio said.

They could have traded him before the 2021 deadline in early November, but they didn’t. The question now becomes whether they can get an acceptable deal as the official start of the new league year approaches, on March 16. An unofficial deal can be done at any time; chances are that the quarterback carousel will start to spin once the coaching carousel stops.

Watson has a no-trade clause, which gives him leverage. He also has a fully-guaranteed salary of $35 million, which gives him more leverage. Indeed, it’s one thing for the Texans to pay Watson $10 million to not play in 2021. It’s quite another to pay him another $35 million to not play in 2022.

At some point, Caserio needs to make a move. He can’t, however, unless Watson approves it. Watson may end up going only where he wants to go. Where that is will depend on where the new coaches land, and what the new coaches want.
 
CloakNNNdagger said:
McClain seems to just have too much time on his hands..........

*****************
McClain: A Deshaun Watson-Rick Smith reunion? We can only dream
John McClain, Staff writer
Jan. 17, 2022Updated: Jan. 17, 2022 5:19 p.m.
Click to expand...

Hey Pancakes

Maybe RS can go visit Derrick in jail.

That would be a more likely outcome than RS getting another GM job.

Pancakes, after 12 yrs of failure and trading for a pervert QB exactly why does RS deserve another GM job. Maybe so that he can run around the FO sexually harassing lower level female employees?

Yep, these 2 definitely deserve each other.
 
The last bolded statement below is what I have heard from several sources and have previously posted.

***************************************
TEXAS SPORTS NATION//JOHN MCCLAIN
McClain: If Tim Kelly lands in Carolina, Deshaun Watson could follow
John McClain, Staff writer
Jan. 19, 2022Updated: Jan. 19, 2022 7:57 p.m.


You don’t have to squint to read between the lines to see what’s going on with the Carolina Panthers and a possible trade for quarterback Deshaun Watson.

First, Pep Hamilton, the Texans’ passing game coordinator and quarterback coach who did a terrific job of helping develop rookie quarterback Davis Mills, changed his mind about interviewing for a job as coach Matt Rhule’s new offensive coordinator.

Then, fired Texans offensive coordinator Tim Kelly interviewed with the Panthers, according to multiple media reports, igniting even more speculation they’re going to vigorously pursue Watson.

Assuming, of course, Watson is able to settle the 22 civil lawsuits accusing him of sexual assault and misconduct.

Let’s backtrack and look at Hamilton’s situation before we dive into Carolina’s interest in Kelly.
When it came out the Panthers wanted to interview Hamilton, it made sense he’d be interested. He’s a native of Charlotte, N.C. He played at West Charlotte High School. In his 23 years of coaching, including 13 in the NFL, Hamilton has never coached in his home state. That would seem to make the Panthers particularly attractive, right?

Maybe not.

Hamilton might have turned down the interview for a variety of reasons. Let’s start with the possibility general manager Nick Caserio has told him he’ll be promoted to replace Kelly under the new coach.

That may sound far-fetched if Caserio hires a new coach who was an offensive coordinator. The new guy might want to call plays or hire an offensive coordinator he knows to call plays.

Now, if Caserio hires Brian Flores or Jerod Mayo — who both have defensive backgrounds with a New England pedigree — Hamilton could make for a smoother transition on offense.

Most important, Mills would have his position coach for a second consecutive season. The worst thing that can happen to a young starting quarterback is constant change in coaches and systems. It can be detrimental to their development.
Mills was Caserio’s first draft choice as a general manager. Caserio believes in Mills enough to project him as the starter going into next season, even though he won’t admit it publicly.

THE REST OF THE STORY
 
CloakNNNdagger said:
The last bolded statement below is what I have heard from several sources and have previously posted.

***************************************
TEXAS SPORTS NATION//JOHN MCCLAIN
McClain: If Tim Kelly lands in Carolina, Deshaun Watson could follow
John McClain, Staff writer
Jan. 19, 2022Updated: Jan. 19, 2022 7:57 p.m.


You don’t have to squint to read between the lines to see what’s going on with the Carolina Panthers and a possible trade for quarterback Deshaun Watson.

First, Pep Hamilton, the Texans’ passing game coordinator and quarterback coach who did a terrific job of helping develop rookie quarterback Davis Mills, changed his mind about interviewing for a job as coach Matt Rhule’s new offensive coordinator.

Then, fired Texans offensive coordinator Tim Kelly interviewed with the Panthers, according to multiple media reports, igniting even more speculation they’re going to vigorously pursue Watson.

Assuming, of course, Watson is able to settle the 22 civil lawsuits accusing him of sexual assault and misconduct.

Let’s backtrack and look at Hamilton’s situation before we dive into Carolina’s interest in Kelly.
When it came out the Panthers wanted to interview Hamilton, it made sense he’d be interested. He’s a native of Charlotte, N.C. He played at West Charlotte High School. In his 23 years of coaching, including 13 in the NFL, Hamilton has never coached in his home state. That would seem to make the Panthers particularly attractive, right?

Maybe not.

Hamilton might have turned down the interview for a variety of reasons. Let’s start with the possibility general manager Nick Caserio has told him he’ll be promoted to replace Kelly under the new coach.

That may sound far-fetched if Caserio hires a new coach who was an offensive coordinator. The new guy might want to call plays or hire an offensive coordinator he knows to call plays.

Now, if Caserio hires Brian Flores or Jerod Mayo — who both have defensive backgrounds with a New England pedigree — Hamilton could make for a smoother transition on offense.

Most important, Mills would have his position coach for a second consecutive season. The worst thing that can happen to a young starting quarterback is constant change in coaches and systems. It can be detrimental to their development.
Mills was Caserio’s first draft choice as a general manager. Caserio believes in Mills enough to project him as the starter going into next season, even though he won’t admit it publicly.

THE REST OF THE STORY
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I’m not certain that the Panthers have the assets (players & picks) to make a serious run at Watson.
 
January 19, 2022 @ 4:08pm » Daniel Bates

Report: Deshaun Watson Refused To Speak With NFL Owner

In the latest twist in the Deshaun Watson saga, an article published by The Athletic revealed that Dolphins owner Stephen Ross did in fact want to acquire Deshaun Watson, despite conflicting reports.

Per Jeff Howe, Ross attempted to contact the quarterback before this season’s trade deadline. However, Watson “refused” to speak with the owner.

https://twitter.com/x/status/1483525851580928006

“The reality is Ross also wanted Watson to be a Dolphin,” Howe wrote. “Ross tried to set up a phone call with Watson the night before the Nov. 2 trade deadline this season to see if the quarterback would resolve his legal situation to facilitate a trade. Watson wasn’t prepared to settle and refused to speak to Ross.”

“The [Houston] Texans have wanted at least five assets, including three first-round picks, in any trade for Watson, according to sources,” he continued. Adding, “They also have no plans to reduce those demands when trade discussions resume this offseason.”

“If Ross didn’t want to deal for Watson — because of Watson’s legal situation or the price to acquire him –— the Dolphins owner could have simply rejected the idea,” Howe concluded. “Ross instead tried to lead the acquisition.”

https://twitter.com/x/status/1480983951485259779
 
CloakNNNdagger said:
“Ross tried to set up a phone call with Watson the night before the Nov. 2 trade deadline this season to see if the quarterback would resolve his legal situation to facilitate a trade. Watson wasn’t prepared to settle and refused to speak to Ross.”
Click to expand...
Did Ross get permission from the Texans to speak directly to Watson? Is that the possible tampering that was rumored last November?
 
CloakNNNdagger said:
Watson was given permission to communicate with Miami, just before the tradeline. But, the tampering was early 2021 when team Watson was communicating with Miami behind the Texans' back.
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Any thoughts as to why Watson refused to talk to Stephen Ross at deadline?
 
CloakNNNdagger said:
January 19, 2022 @ 4:08pm » Daniel Bates

Report: Deshaun Watson Refused To Speak With NFL Owner

In the latest twist in the Deshaun Watson saga, an article published by The Athletic revealed that Dolphins owner Stephen Ross did in fact want to acquire Deshaun Watson, despite conflicting reports.

Per Jeff Howe, Ross attempted to contact the quarterback before this season’s trade deadline. However, Watson “refused” to speak with the owner.

https://twitter.com/x/status/1483525851580928006

“The reality is Ross also wanted Watson to be a Dolphin,” Howe wrote. “Ross tried to set up a phone call with Watson the night before the Nov. 2 trade deadline this season to see if the quarterback would resolve his legal situation to facilitate a trade. Watson wasn’t prepared to settle and refused to speak to Ross.”

“The [Houston] Texans have wanted at least five assets, including three first-round picks, in any trade for Watson, according to sources,” he continued. Adding, “They also have no plans to reduce those demands when trade discussions resume this offseason.”

“If Ross didn’t want to deal for Watson — because of Watson’s legal situation or the price to acquire him –— the Dolphins owner could have simply rejected the idea,” Howe concluded. “Ross instead tried to lead the acquisition.”

https://twitter.com/x/status/1480983951485259779
Click to expand...
I don’t know why teams would want a player with this type of attitude. So now that Flores is gone, he doesn’t pick up the phone.
Unprofessional
 
Texansphan said:
Right now I'd take a 6th and their 2nd and call it quits.
Two valuable picks right there.
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Carolina doesn’t have any RD2 or RD3 picks in 2022. They’d have to include McCaffrey to try and create some cap relief to absorb Watson’s contract. To move this type of trade towards reality the Panthers probably have to include their RD1, RD4 & (2) RD5 picks in 2022 along with RD1 & RD2 in picks in 2023 and finally a RD1 pick in 2024 to satisfy Caserio. Carolina better really want themselves some Deshaun Watson but in all reality, I think Watson would poo-poo a trade to Carolina.
 
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Would hiring Tim Kelly help Panthers land Deshaun Watson?
Anthony Rizzuti - 2h ago


There’s no hiding, despite any past attempts of it, the Carolina Panthers’ interest in Deshaun Watson. There’s also no hiding the bond between said quarterback and one of his longtime coaches.

That longtime coach is former Houston Texans offensive coordinator Tim Kelly, who had been with Watson from the very start of his professional career. Kelly, as reported by ESPN’s Jeremy Fowler on Tuesday, has drawn interest from head coach Matt Rhule in his search for a new offensive coordinator.

Now, obviously, the links are being drawn. Could the Panthers eventually sway Watson over, with him waiving his no-trade clause in the process, after the possible hiring of Kelly as their play-caller? Well, John McClain of the Houston Chronicle believes that could happen.

In addition to his piece on the prospect, the longtime Texas scribe joined WFNZ’s The Clubhouse with Kyle Bailey this week to address the topic.

“So whoever gets Tim is getting a really good guy,” McClain said. “He is battle-tested, he’s been in the NFL—this’ll be his ninth year. I know Bill O’Brien thinks the world of him. If Bill O’Brien gets that Jacksonville job, Tim Kelly’s there.

“So if I’m the Panthers, and I’m sure Tim probably did a good job in his interview. He met with the media once every week for the last two years. He always did a good job with us. And there’s quite a few people who thought Tim, at some point, has got a chance to be a head coach.”
 

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CloakNNNdagger said:
Would hiring Tim Kelly help Panthers land Deshaun Watson?
Anthony Rizzuti - 2h ago


There’s no hiding, despite any past attempts of it, the Carolina Panthers’ interest in Deshaun Watson. There’s also no hiding the bond between said quarterback and one of his longtime coaches.

That longtime coach is former Houston Texans offensive coordinator Tim Kelly, who had been with Watson from the very start of his professional career. Kelly, as reported by ESPN’s Jeremy Fowler on Tuesday, has drawn interest from head coach Matt Rhule in his search for a new offensive coordinator.

Now, obviously, the links are being drawn. Could the Panthers eventually sway Watson over, with him waiving his no-trade clause in the process, after the possible hiring of Kelly as their play-caller? Well, John McClain of the Houston Chronicle believes that could happen.

In addition to his piece on the prospect, the longtime Texas scribe joined WFNZ’s The Clubhouse with Kyle Bailey this week to address the topic.

“So whoever gets Tim is getting a really good guy,” McClain said. “He is battle-tested, he’s been in the NFL—this’ll be his ninth year. I know Bill O’Brien thinks the world of him. If Bill O’Brien gets that Jacksonville job, Tim Kelly’s there.

“So if I’m the Panthers, and I’m sure Tim probably did a good job in his interview. He met with the media once every week for the last two years. He always did a good job with us. And there’s quite a few people who thought Tim, at some point, has got a chance to be a head coach.”
Click to expand...

Pancakes, LMAO

Where have Kelly's vaunted offenses been ranked the last 2 yrs? Particularly in the run game?
 
badboy said:
Watson got Tim Kelly an extra year in Houston and now it looks like he will get him a contract on another NFL team. Kelly should come up with a very unique gift if that occurs. Perhaps use of the team's massage tables?
Click to expand...

An oiled up finger massager would be a great gift for Derrick.
 
CloakNNNdagger said:
Would hiring Tim Kelly help Panthers land Deshaun Watson?
Anthony Rizzuti - 2h ago


There’s no hiding, despite any past attempts of it, the Carolina Panthers’ interest in Deshaun Watson. There’s also no hiding the bond between said quarterback and one of his longtime coaches.

That longtime coach is former Houston Texans offensive coordinator Tim Kelly, who had been with Watson from the very start of his professional career. Kelly, as reported by ESPN’s Jeremy Fowler on Tuesday, has drawn interest from head coach Matt Rhule in his search for a new offensive coordinator.

Now, obviously, the links are being drawn. Could the Panthers eventually sway Watson over, with him waiving his no-trade clause in the process, after the possible hiring of Kelly as their play-caller? Well, John McClain of the Houston Chronicle believes that could happen.

In addition to his piece on the prospect, the longtime Texas scribe joined WFNZ’s The Clubhouse with Kyle Bailey this week to address the topic.

“So whoever gets Tim is getting a really good guy,” McClain said. “He is battle-tested, he’s been in the NFL—this’ll be his ninth year. I know Bill O’Brien thinks the world of him. If Bill O’Brien gets that Jacksonville job, Tim Kelly’s there.

“So if I’m the Panthers, and I’m sure Tim probably did a good job in his interview. He met with the media once every week for the last two years. He always did a good job with us. And there’s quite a few people who thought Tim, at some point, has got a chance to be a head coach.”
Click to expand...
Lucky said:
Well, it didn't work for the Texans. Maybe the Panther luck is different?
Click to expand...
badboy said:
Watson got Tim Kelly an extra year in Houston and now it looks like he will get him a contract on another NFL team. Kelly should come up with a very unique gift if that occurs. Perhaps use of the team's massage tables?
Click to expand...
steelbtexan said:
Pancakes, LMAO

Where have Kelly's vaunted offenses been ranked the last 2 yrs? Particularly in the run game?
Click to expand...
Panthers hire former Giants coach Ben McAdoo as offensive coordinator (msn.com)
 
Well with Schoen to NYG as GM and McAdoo to Panthers as OC, lights are not as bright for a DW4 trade as they once were. Hello Miami? Philly?
 
Texian said:
Well with Schoen to NYG as GM and McAdoo to Panthers as OC, lights are not as bright for a DW4 trade as they once were. Hello Miami? Philly?
Click to expand...

I’m curious to see where Flores lands and the team’s QB situation that signs him.

If it doesn’t happen, Watson and his agent probably start talking about waiving his NTC so he can find a new team next season. I don’t see Watson sitting for another season unless his legal situation determines otherwise.
 
thunderkyss said:
Why?

TheTexans have $36M reasons to make something happen before the league year starts. Even if I wanted Watson in a bad way, I’d wait, & wait. Texans will flinch.
Click to expand...
I am thinking not but that could just be my optimism. I think that other teams dire need will be greater than pressure on Caserio . I believe Nick wants to get back some that his predecessor flippantly gave away. Some of that will be draft picks but some of it will be face. Houston fans probably have different opinions of Watson as he was our dilemma. Other GMs may think " he will not do that to us." That is why so many recycled players are traded annually. I think many GM's are going to be focusing on his 2020 statistics, his age and his realistic contract rather than what we focus on.
Several teams need quarterback and there just aren't any good ones in this draft. There is no urgent need for cap money this season so why rush to get rid of your biggest asset?
 
thunderkyss said:
Why?

TheTexans have $36M reasons to make something happen before the league year starts. Even if I wanted Watson in a bad way, I’d wait, & wait. Texans will flinch.
Click to expand...
That works if there is only one team that wants him in a bad way. Add another couple of teams and the urgency rises.

Of course Watson can control some of this with the NTC, so it may not matter how many teams join in.

Sent from my SM-G970U using Tapatalk
 
CloakNNNdagger said:
Would hiring Tim Kelly help Panthers land Deshaun Watson?
Anthony Rizzuti - 2h ago


There’s no hiding, despite any past attempts of it, the Carolina Panthers’ interest in Deshaun Watson. There’s also no hiding the bond between said quarterback and one of his longtime coaches.

That longtime coach is former Houston Texans offensive coordinator Tim Kelly, who had been with Watson from the very start of his professional career. Kelly, as reported by ESPN’s Jeremy Fowler on Tuesday, has drawn interest from head coach Matt Rhule in his search for a new offensive coordinator.

Now, obviously, the links are being drawn. Could the Panthers eventually sway Watson over, with him waiving his no-trade clause in the process, after the possible hiring of Kelly as their play-caller? Well, John McClain of the Houston Chronicle believes that could happen.

In addition to his piece on the prospect, the longtime Texas scribe joined WFNZ’s The Clubhouse with Kyle Bailey this week to address the topic.

“So whoever gets Tim is getting a really good guy,” McClain said. “He is battle-tested, he’s been in the NFL—this’ll be his ninth year. I know Bill O’Brien thinks the world of him. If Bill O’Brien gets that Jacksonville job, Tim Kelly’s there.

“So if I’m the Panthers, and I’m sure Tim probably did a good job in his interview. He met with the media once every week for the last two years. He always did a good job with us. And there’s quite a few people who thought Tim, at some point, has got a chance to be a head coach.”
Click to expand...

These articles are all over the place. The problem with this article. At the start of Watson's career in 2017, Sean Ryan was the QB coach and Kelly was the TEs coach. They make it seem like Kelly has been coaching Watson his entire career. Kelly got promoted to QB coach in 2019 and was in full control of the offense after BOB was fired in 2020. Ryan left the Texans in 2018 because he figured would not be promoted to OC and decide to explore other options.

Sean Ryan is the current QB coach for the Panthers. So, do they really need Tim Kelly when Ryan was the QB coach during the period where Watson and Texans offense might have been at its best? A case could be made that Ryan has just as much experience as Kelly with Watson and did a better job as QB coach than BOB or Kelly.
 
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Dabol has done his interview and now waiting on Flores. I am almost more interested in who their head coach is then who Texans will be.
 
badboy said:
Brian Dabol has completed his interview with the New York Giants and Flores has been invited. As discussed Flores may want Watson with him in New York if hired.
Click to expand...

Keep on dreaming.

Daboll is supposedly the front runner for the NYG job.

Flores as of right now is the front runner for the Bears job. Of course the Bears haven't hired their GM yet.
 
badboy said:
you do not know about my desire for the Giants to get DeShaun Watson through Flores? That is why I said I was almost more interested in their head coach than Texans.
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No I didn’t know about that fascination.

However I think cap wise, or so I have read/heard the NY Giants cap makes it difficult for them to make a trade for Watson.

The guy needs to go. Giants. Redskins. Dolphins. Cardinals. Just go already.


Low chance for Steelers. Watson doesn’t deserve to play with a franchise like the Steelers so I hope he doesn’t go but Tomlin wanting a mobile quarterback makes me wonder.
 
steelbtexan said:
I dont know if they're in cap or not. But if they want to clear space for Watson then Schoen could trade guys like Bradberry/Logan Ryan etc... to clear cap space. I dont see a trade happening wit the NYG.
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I thought you had posted something at some point about it.

Here you go:

www.google.com

As NFL salary cap rises in 2022, Giants remain in cap hell — a mess of Dave Gettleman’s creation

The New York Giants will have one of the worst cap situations in the NFL in 2022 without many avenues for clearing space outside of cutting players like Kyle Rudolph or Blake Martinez.
www.google.com www.google.com
 
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