Jacoby's Gotta Go/**UPDATE**Released

[cbs1507]

Yates was a ROOKIE, in his eighth start, going against a top three defense on the road and in the playoffs. Compare that to Jacoby, who is a five year vet and essentially gave the Ravens seven free points, since they got the ball on the one yard line. He made a mistake that high schoolers don't even make. Interceptions happen, but muffed punts aren't suppose to happen. If you can't see the difference in that, then I don't know what to tell you.

Foster FUMBLED the ball AGAIN. He is not a rookie. Nobody talks about that though because Jacoby Jones fell on the ball. INT happens? So this is excusable? Joe Flacco had ZERO INTs and we pressured him ALL DAY. Him being a rookie is no excuse for throwing into double/triple coverage. Especially, when there are 5 passing options. Yeah I don't see the difference in a 5 year vet who put the ball on the ground IN THE FIRST QUARTER and rookie throwing 3 picks the WHOLE GAME. Jones got ZERO targets. What part of that do you not understand?

By your logic, then we can say muff punts happen. But that muff punt happenED in the FIRST QUARTER, not with the game on the line like Yates last 2 INTs. We were down 7-3 after Jacoby's mistake. Yates throw a pick on our side of the field 2 possessions later that went for a TD. If you're mad that Jacoby's TO gave up 7, well Yates accounted for 10 Ravens point. You can't use the excuse that Yates is a rookie. Jacoby made a mistake, but did not repeat. Yates made the same mistake 3 TIMES. It doesn't take a vet to understand that 3 people around 1 WR is not a good throw. He stared the 1st option down on every play. If he was not comfortable going through his progression then throw it away if the 1st option was triple covered. Point blank. Stop excusing poor play because he was a rookie. He never threw the ball away once. He just chucked up prayers into coverage and we paid the price for it.

 

[gary]

I just have to wonder why Yates was so attached to AJ during the game.

 

[2012Champs]

yep. The lack of objectivity and obsessively blind support are telltale signs.

Funny thing about pointing to the rookie QB in a thread specifically talking about Jacoby Jones. It's much like Coach Smith said about his conversation with Jones after the game. Hey, he's not the only one that made a mistake!

We know Yates will not be the starting QB next season. He was a backup to a backup. Will Jacoby still be a starting punt returner?

Jacoby Jones is a freakin' starter, so the expectations and standards should be higher for a 5th year veteran. That it's not for some folks can only speak volumes about the MBB's (mighty big blinders) they must be wearing for him.

I think the problem is a lack of objectivity and blind hate

 

[2012Champs]

I just have to wonder why Yates was so attached to AJ during the game.

Because he is you best receiver. However he wasnt back to 100% nor is he your best guy when he is double/triple covered

 

[thunderkyss]

Jacoby's was the most inexcusable of all. Bottom line.

Totally agree with this... but don't believe it attributed any more to the outcome of the game than our inability to score in the second half.

We go on about limiting Baltimore's offense to 3 points in the second half & how if Jacoby didn't muff that punt, the score would have been 7 points closer.

Baltimore held us to 0 points in the second half. If it weren't for that muffed punt, we don't know what would have happened. It took a great return by Danieal Manning to get us into Baltimore's territory.... so we could kick that first field goal.

After going 3 & out, Baltimore's defense might have held us to 3 points in the first half, without that 14 point cussion, they might have played a lot tougher.

 

[Double Barrel]

I think the problem is a lack of objectivity and blind hate

It depends on whose perspective(s) you are talking about.

Nobody denies that TJ's mistakes were part of the loss. There is a thread specifically discussing Yates and I'd say most agree that he played like you'd expect an inexperienced rookie to play against a Ravens defense in the playoffs. Not excusing him in any sort of way, but he will be where he should be in 2012: sitting the bench as a backup QB.

But, it's also understandable that Jacoby's mistake is simply inexcusable for a 5th year veteran under the circumstances of that game.

I wish no ill-will toward Jacoby and have nothing personal against him as an individual. However, as a Texans fan, he needs to be a liability on someone else's team after evaluating his 5 years on our team.

I root for the logo on the helmet, not the name on the back of a jersey.

 

[Mr. White]

:mariopalm:

You can not be serious. You HAVE to be to Jacoby Jones what Hulk75 was to David Carr. LOL

Definitely using the same misinformation tactic. According to them, every player on the Texans sucked except for Carr.

He even slammed Andre Johnson for making Carr look bad.

This is the same case. Carr was the weak link then and Jacoby's the weak link now.

 

[2012Champs]

It depends on whose perspective(s) you are talking about.

Nobody denies that TJ's mistakes were part of the loss. There is a thread specifically discussing Yates and I'd say most agree that he played like you'd expect an inexperienced rookie to play against a Ravens defense in the playoffs. Not excusing him in any sort of way, but he will be where he should be in 2012: sitting the bench as a backup QB.

But, it's also understandable that Jacoby's mistake is simply inexcusable for a 5th year veteran under the circumstances of that game.

I wish no ill-will toward Jacoby and have nothing personal against him as an individual. However, as a Texans fan, he needs to be a liability on someone else's team after evaluating his 5 years on our team.

I root for the logo on the helmet, not the name on the back of a jersey.

You can keep saying Yates played like expected. If Gary or any of the staff expected him to throw 3 pics with true performance closer to 5-6 he wouldnt have been playing the game. I too wish JJ well in his career elsewher

 

[ChampionTexan]

While he's never had close to the same success as Brad Lidge, I think those who have compared Jacoby's situation to Lidge's are spot on. I think it's in the best interest of both parties to part ways and move forward. I don't know what the chances are that Jacoby will ever find success as an NFL player (I suspect not good), but i believe if he's ever going to find it, it has to be somewhere else.

Beyond that, any outrage or bile spewed forth about Jacoby probably has no effect on anything with the possible exception of the blood pressure of those spewing.

 

[cbs1507]

It depends on whose perspective(s) you are talking about.

Nobody denies that TJ's mistakes were part of the loss. There is a thread specifically discussing Yates and I'd say most agree that he played like you'd expect an inexperienced rookie to play against a Ravens defense in the playoffs. Not excusing him in any sort of way, but he will be where he should be in 2012: sitting the bench as a backup QB.

But, it's also understandable that Jacoby's mistake is simply inexcusable for a 5th year veteran under the circumstances of that game.

I wish no ill-will toward Jacoby and have nothing personal against him as an individual. However, as a Texans fan, he needs to be a liability on someone else's team after evaluating his 5 years on our team.

I root for the logo on the helmet, not the name on the back of a jersey.

Ok I get where you are coming from. I blame management for banking on Jacoby as being a #2 WR. He was always a #3 in my book. We will bring in a #2 by either draft or FA to compete with Jones. He will be on the team next year, and he will have his best statistical season of his career because we will finally have a #2 opposite AJ and he will be able to move to his true position (#3).

 

[Double Barrel]

You can keep saying Yates played like expected. If Gary or any of the staff expected him to throw 3 pics with true performance closer to 5-6 he wouldnt have been playing the game. I too wish JJ well in his career elsewher

Well, "as expected" by fans and media analysts. Nobody ever predicted TJ to be the game deciding factor, but rather the Texans had a chance if Yates could minimize mistakes. The no. 1 reason why nobody picked the Texans to win the game was Yates. So yeah, expectations were that he could hurt us and he lived up to those expectations.

As far as Kubiak and staff, they were forced with slim pickings. Delholmme, he who threw 6 picks in his last playoff game and was sitting on the couch when we called, simply cannot be considered an improvement by any objective analysis.

What was not expected was our 5 year veteran punt returner to make a stupid rookie mistake and give the ball to the Ravens at the 1 yard line. Matter-of-fact, expectations on Jacoby should have been one of depending on the guy to at least play sound football, and in that regard, he failed miserably.

Ok I get where you are coming from. I blame management for putting banking on Jacoby as being a #2 WR. He was always a #3 in my book. We will bring in a #2 by either draft or FA to compete with Jones. He will be on the team next year, and we will have his best statistical season of his career. Because we will finally have a #2 opposite AJ and he will be able to move to his true position (#3).

I do not disagree with you at all. For whatever reason(s), Jacoby gets a pass with this staff that would not be granted by many other successful teams.

 

[gary]

Because he is you best receiver. However he wasnt back to 100% nor is he your best guy when he is double/triple covered

I know he is the best but Yates had to have known ahead of time that AJ was going to covered like he was.

 

[DocBar]

Why isn't Jones gone yet?

 

[Texn4life]

I swear I will be beyond mad if Jacoby's still on this team next year. Not sure if anyone has posted this, but look at what Kubiak said.

With Johnson back, Jones had no catches in the playoffs. He muffed a punt that resulted in Baltimore’s first touchdown, but fans wanting him gone won’t be happy that Kubiak continues to support him.

“A lot of guys made mistakes,” Kubiak said. “As a coach, you’ve got to believe in your people.”

http://blog.chron.com/ultimatetexans/2012/01/expect-an-upgrade-at-receiver-via-draft-for-the-texans/

One thing I will say though is I disagree with some people who call Jacoby a bust as a 3rd round pick. He wasn't productive consistently, but to call him a bust is a reach. Maurice Clarett was a bust. I could give a laundry list of players who were drafted in the 3rd round or higher who never contributed to their teams at all, so I wouldn't label him with that.

NOW, in saying that we should give him a nice parting gift and wish him well with his next team. It's time for both parties to move on. Kubiak's constant babying of him isn't going to help him grow as a player.

 

[steelbtexan]

Like I said, I understand being upset at Jacoby, no way that should have happened. He should be held accountable.

At the same time, that is not the reason we lost that game. If it didn't happen, it is highly unlikely we could go on, commit 3 turnovers (you know interceptions just happen) & still expect to win that game. That just don't happen, especially not against the Ravens.

I understand Yates getting the. Pass. He's a rookie, playing a top 3 defense, on the road, in the play-offs.

Doesn't mean his turn-overs don't affect the outcome of the game. It's more likely that we win the game if Tj protected the ball & played it safe, like the Bengals game, than if Jacoby fair caught that ball.

Agreed

Yates has alot of improving to do. I'm not sure if he's the QB of the future. His tendency to throw high when he throws his fastball across the middle bothers me. He will learn not to get baited into throwing INTS by savy vets like Reed. That's nothing more than a learning experience.

As far as Jacoby goes, cutting him would be showing the other players on the team that everybody is being held accountable for their mistakes.

That and it shouldn't be hard to find an upgrade over Jacoby at the WR/PR positions. Give me a guy that's a little less talented. But is smart and willing to pay the price going over the middle. And as a PR will get me 10-15 yds consistently. While not making boneheaded decisions in fielding punts. (Always looking for the homerun instead of realizing the situation and making the smart play)

 

[steelbtexan]

Ok I get where you are coming from. I blame management for banking on Jacoby as being a #2 WR. He was always a #3 in my book. We will bring in a #2 by either draft or FA to compete with Jones. He will be on the team next year, and he will have his best statistical season of his career because we will finally have a #2 opposite AJ and he will be able to move to his true position (#3).

You're probably right.

But, man I hope you're wrong. 5 yrs of JJ is enough. He's what he is. Somebody you cant win with. It reminds me of when Betel Johnson was the deep threat on the Pats SB teams. Ultra talented, but made too many mistakes. (Route running) = Cut in the BB/Brady regime. Hopefully Gary/Wade will take note.

 

[gary]

Leave it to Gary to keep Jones if he indeed does.

 

[thunderkyss]

As far as Jacoby goes, cutting him would be showing the other players on the team that everybody is being held accountable for their mistakes.

Totally do not agree with this. Knee Jerks are not good for your team.

Are we going to cut Ben Tate because he fumbled on the goal line? Luckily it was recovered by Wade Smith & we scored on that play.

Are we going to cut Eric Winston because he gets beat time-to-time & our QBs get lit up?

Are we going to cut Demps for missing a tackle that would have prevented a goal line TD?

Are we going to cut J.Allen for getting beat & turned around on a TD score in a play-off game?

If Jacoby's production through out the season does not warrant bringing him back, then we don't bring him back. If he is beat out in training camp by superior talent, then we don't bring him back.

At the same time, if a coach continues to send a player out there & can not correct his mistakes, should we bring that coach back?

If you make mistakes....

your ****ing human.

 

[Jaysol]

Totally do not agree with this. Knee Jerks are not good for your team.

Are we going to cut Ben Tate because he fumbled on the goal line? Luckily it was recovered by Wade Smith & we scored on that play.

Are we going to cut Eric Winston because he gets beat time-to-time & our QBs get lit up?

Are we going to cut Demps for missing a tackle that would have prevented a goal line TD?

Are we going to cut J.Allen for getting beat & turned around on a TD score in a play-off game?

If Jacoby's production through out the season does not warrant bringing him back, then we don't bring him back. If he is beat out in training camp by superior talent, then we don't bring him back.

At the same time, if a coach continues to send a player out there & can not correct his mistakes, should we bring that coach back?

If you make mistakes....

your ****ing human.

MSR+! I totally agree, although Jones has frustrated me many times, this sudden uproar of people wanting his head because of one play is ridiculous. I would be fine if we brought in some talent in the off season and he was beat out during training camp, but I believe it sets a bad presidence to cut them based primarily on one play.

If that play doesn't motivate Jones to work harder during the off season, then nothing will. Personally, I'd like to see what he does during OTAs and camps before determining if he needs to go or not.

 

[Texn4life]

MSR+! I totally agree, although Jones has frustrated me many times, this sudden uproar of people wanting his head because of one play is ridiculous. I would be fine if we brought in some talent in the off season and he was beat out during training camp, but I believe it sets a bad presidence to cut them based primarily on one play.

If that play doesn't motivate Jones to work harder during the off season, then nothing will. Personally, I'd like to see what he does during OTAs and camps before determining if he needs to go or not.

I wanted Jacoby gone after last season. It wasn't just that play that made the decision easier. It's his lack of consistency. Most coaches either bench or release players for inconsistent play. We've been rewarding him for his inconsistent play by #1) Not bringing in younger talent good enough to push him, and #2) Coaches continuing to play him and not calling him out for his drops, mental mistakes.

I don't know what his roster bonus is after March if he is still on the roster or not, but that's for the FO to decide. I'd let him compete for a spot on the team, but I would bring in 2-3 receivers who can legitimately push the guy. Not these UDFA guys that you're hoping to strike gold with.

 

[welsh texan]

MSR+! I totally agree, although Jones has frustrated me many times, this sudden uproar of people wanting his head because of one play is ridiculous. I would be fine if we brought in some talent in the off season and he was beat out during training camp, but I believe it sets a bad presidence to cut them based primarily on one play.

If that play doesn't motivate Jones to work harder during the off season, then nothing will. Personally, I'd like to see what he does during OTAs and camps before determining if he needs to go or not.

I saw plenty of people calling for his head throughout the regular season long before that play, the guy had his chance to step into AJ's shoes and be our #1 reciever this season yet couldn't beat coverage and couldn't hold onto a catch.

 

[thunderkyss]

I wanted Jacoby gone after last season. It wasn't just that play that made the decision easier. It's his lack of inconsistency. Most coaches either bench or release players for inconsistent play. We've been rewarding him for his inconsistent play by #1) Not bringing in younger talent good enough to push him, and #2) Coaches continuing to play him and not calling him out for his drops, mental mistakes.

"lack of inconsistency"? I do not think that means what you think it means.

When has he been inconsistent? He was consistently one of the better punt returners in the AFC during the regular season. That's pretty damn consistent.

As a wide receiver, compare him to other teams #3 & tell me where he fell short.

For the most part, people are upset that he has not stepped up to take that #2 spot, or become a 1b to Andre.... & I get that. Doesn't mean he has no value on the team. He's not getting paid as a #2 or a 1b. Can we get that same production from an UDFA... probably & I agree it's worth a shot (I think those guys ended up on IR for us this season)...

I don't know what his roster bonus is after March if he is still on the roster or not, but that's for the FO to decide. I'd let him compete for a spot on the team, but I would bring in 2-3 receivers who can legitimately push the guy. Not these UDFA guys that you're hoping to strike gold with.

You've got your sights way too high. Jacoby is not that #2 WR, never was. We wanted him to develop into that guy, but he hasn't. The right place to look for a Jacoby Jones replacement is the UDFA or the later rounds..... he's a punt returner (we spent a late draft pick on Trindon Holliday to replace him there, didn't quite work out the way we planned).

Again, we brought guys in this season to take Jacoby off the depth chart.... including Derrick Mason.... didn't work out.

But if you think about it, at least we got rid of DA... baby steps.

All our Draft picks (& FA dollars) have been used to fix a defense for the last 6 years. Hopefully we are past that point. & we can inject a lot of talent on the offensive side or the ball this off-season.

But, if we don't sign Mario, forget that. You'll draft DL (including OLB) early, 1st or second & an insurance policy in the later rounds.

This offense will continue to be more about Kubiak's creativity & caution than it will be about the talent needed to truly be a great offense.

 

[thunderkyss]

I saw plenty of people calling for his head throughout the regular season long before that play, the guy had his chance to step into AJ's shoes and be our #1 reciever this season yet couldn't beat coverage and couldn't hold onto a catch.

Jacoby gets a lot of slack on this MB, because he hasn't lived up to their expectations. I don't believe that is necessarily fair.

Because he gets so much slack I watch his play, just like I watch Kj's play when I'm at the games. I've learned two things.

1. Kj is excellent in man to man coverage.... doesn't play the ball that well, but at least his man isn't open & the QB chooses to go to their next read when he is playing.
2. Jacoby is hell to cover. He's fast, he runs good routes, not great, but definitely no where near as bad as being said here. & he's takes the top off of defenses & is virtually uncoverable one-on-one

Not blaming Schaub, but a different QB who can take advantage of what Jacoby can do would make him look totally different.

People want to talk about that Oakland game..... I think they listen to the commentators too much & like sheep repeat what they hear, especially when it "supports" their limited view. Jacoby was targeted 11 time, only caught one ball. Watch the game, only 3 of those balls were catchable. He was targeted 11 times, because he was open 11 times.

Again, I would be happy to move on from the Jacoby Jones experiment. He's not a good fit for this team. But I'd bet anyone, dollars to donuts, he'll have a long career in this league much like Jabar Gaffney.

& if he goes to a team like the Saints, or the Packers who normally have 4 to 5 receivers with more than 500 yards, he'll probably be a star.

Robert Meachum..... many guys talk about Robert Meachum as a "suitable" replacement for Jacoby Jones. First, I don't think he's as fast, second, he drops as many balls, third, he was a first round pick who the Saints will most likely let go. If he comes to this team, he's going to look a lot like Jacoby Jones, for more than $3Million a year.

 

[Texn4life]

"lack of inconsistency"? I do not think that means what you think it means.

When has he been inconsistent? He was consistently one of the better punt returners in the AFC during the regular season. That's pretty damn consistent.

As a wide receiver, compare him to other teams #3 & tell me where he fell short.

For the most part, people are upset that he has not stepped up to take that #2 spot, or become a 1b to Andre.... & I get that. Doesn't mean he has no value on the team. He's not getting paid as a #2 or a 1b. Can we get that same production from an UDFA... probably & I agree it's worth a shot (I think those guys ended up on IR for us this season)...




You've got your sights way too high. Jacoby is not that #2 WR, never was. We wanted him to develop into that guy, but he hasn't. The right place to look for a Jacoby Jones replacement is the UDFA or the later rounds..... he's a punt returner (we spent a late draft pick on Trindon Holliday to replace him there, didn't quite work out the way we planned).

Again, we brought guys in this season to take Jacoby off the depth chart.... including Derrick Mason.... didn't work out.

But if you think about it, at least we got rid of DA... baby steps.

All our Draft picks (& FA dollars) have been used to fix a defense for the last 6 years. Hopefully we are past that point. & we can inject a lot of talent on the offensive side or the ball this off-season.

But, if we don't sign Mario, forget that. You'll draft DL (including OLB) early, 1st or second & an insurance policy in the later rounds.

This offense will continue to be more about Kubiak's creativity & caution than it will be about the talent needed to truly be a great offense.

Lack of consistency!!! I'm pretty sure you knew what I meant, but thanks for the grammar lesson. Jacoby as a punt returner was incredibly inconsistent. I don't know how exactly you can ignore that. He probably led the league in negative returns throughout the season. Did he break some long ones that helped his average out over the course of the season? Sure, but he also danced around a lot after he caught the ball trying to break long ones that led to him being tackled for negative yardage.

I don't have the time to compare him numbers wise to #3 wide outs in the league, but that's not what he was this year. He was a #2 receiver for half the season, and still failed to show the ability to succeed as a reliable option out on the field. I'm not saying he's terrible. He shows flashes that make you think that there might be potential there, but I'm saying it's time to move on. To say that he's consistent catching the ball is borderline insane. He'll probably always have questionable hands.

As to your saying that we have our sights way too high on Jacoby, I would say you have your sights too low. If Jacoby didn't show the potential to develop into a legitimate receiver then I would agree with you. But his problem is one that can't be fixed with the Texans. Its time for both to move on. I wish him well in the future and don't fault him 100 percent for the mistake in the divisional game. He tried to make a play and was stupid for it, but mistakes happen. Its time to move on though. We can get the production we got out of him for much less money or for the same amount of money through the 1st pick in the draft. Probably more production. Again, thanks for the grammar lesson!

 

[DocBar]

How about we just ditch Jones and find away for the Texans and sAints to sign and trade MW for Colston. They badly need help on the D side of the ball and we desperately need a stud like Colston to go with AJ. Hell, throw Jones in with the trade if the sAints won't charge us too much for taking him.

 

[bckey]

Totally do not agree with this. Knee Jerks are not good for your team.

Are we going to cut Ben Tate because he fumbled on the goal line? Luckily it was recovered by Wade Smith & we scored on that play.

Are we going to cut Eric Winston because he gets beat time-to-time & our QBs get lit up?

Are we going to cut Demps for missing a tackle that would have prevented a goal line TD?

Are we going to cut J.Allen for getting beat & turned around on a TD score in a play-off game?

If Jacoby's production through out the season does not warrant bringing him back, then we don't bring him back. If he is beat out in training camp by superior talent, then we don't bring him back.

At the same time, if a coach continues to send a player out there & can not correct his mistakes, should we bring that coach back?

If you make mistakes....

your ****ing human.

The problem with Jacoby is between his ears. All the other players you mention here made mistakes but those type of mistakes happen to all players over their careers at some point. Jacoby can't think straight under pressure. I've seen him field punts inside the 10 yard line many times. I've seen him dance around for no yards or negative yards instead of just getting positive yards or making a fair catch. Not once but most of the time. He has had ample opportunities to show everyone that he is a legit wr in the NFL only to disappoint over and over and over. Have there been flashes? Yes. But the negatives far out weigh the positives when it comes to JJ.

The play where Jacoby fumbles close to his own endzone after the Texans just stopped the Ravens on their 1st drive with a 3 and out was inexcuseable. If he fields the punt normally and then fumbles ok. But to watch it bounce and then try and field it surrounded by Ravens is dumb. It reminded me of Leon Lett. Jacoby just isn't able to think straight when the pressure is on and unfortunately in the NFL that leads to big time mistakes that leave you scratching your head. He has talent. It got him through high school and college but in the NFL that alone doesn't cut it. The best of the best play in the NFL. Its time to part ways with this guy. Wish him the best and move on.

 

[rickyb]

MSR+! I totally agree, although Jones has frustrated me many times, this sudden uproar of people wanting his head because of one play is ridiculous. I would be fine if we brought in some talent in the off season and he was beat out during training camp, but I believe it sets a bad presidence to cut them based primarily on one play.

If that play doesn't motivate Jones to work harder during the off season, then nothing will. Personally, I'd like to see what he does during OTAs and camps before determining if he needs to go or not.

[Jaysol, this post is not directed at you in particular. You just said something that I was sensitive to.]

It is exactly this label of "the sudden uproar" and "one play" that I was anticipating and hoping to avoid. My disdain for Jacoby Jones is not based upon one play. Rather, it is a culmination of his body of work, or lack thereof. I did not like him going into this season, and this season, more than any other, due to the AJ injuries, gave him his opportunity to prove me wrong.

Performance. All else equal, throw a jump ball to AJ, and he finds a way more often than not. Throw a jump ball to JJ, and he finds a way to miss. Show me his game winning 25+ yard reception. If anyone wants to be a JJ apologist, and point to "oh it is not fair to compare him to the best receiver in the NFL," fine go ahead. I for one am not about excuses; I believe in results.

No one likes a whiner. Have you ever noticed how often JJ begs for calls on incomplete passes? It bugs the **** out of me. If you can't go up and get the ball, don't beg the refs. A whine here or there is pardonable -- we are only human -- but here I am pointing to a persistent manner of behavior. Don't be a whiner. Be a winner.

Results first, showboat second. It bugs me that he makes a show out of the most pedestrian of plays. On the odd occasion that he actually DID catch a 3rd down pass for 1st down, he would come up, flip the ball, do some sort of shimmy shiver, and generally show-boat. AJ can showboat (though I would point out he does not do so), as he has earned that right.

Only thing JJ has earned in my book is my contempt for his mediocre play. Object if you must (note: you being a general reference to the reader, not the poster which I quoted above. This is not a diatribe against any one poster.). Everyone is entitled to an opinion. I guess the only opinions that count in the end are the ones who decide who is and is not on the roster. For me, I have seen enough. More than enough. Sorry, #12. You will probably benefit from a fresh-start elsewhere.

Rick

PS: As a footnote, I would add that giving any team 7 points in the playoffs is a big flippin' deal. It gave new life to a more-than-capable opponent, at a time where our defense was taking the opponents' heart and hope away (yes, even so early in the game.).

PPS: Regarding Yates' play, one of his INT's came on an inexplicable 40 yard **play-call** with 2 minutes or so (was it 1:41? I am going off memory.) We had the ball, the clock, and the momentum. Why we chose to poke at the end zone at that moment is beyond me. My point is this play was as much about play calling as it was about Yates' rookie mistake of trying to force a ball into AJ against a future HOF safety. All this finger-pointing at Yates is misplaced. It's a game of inches, and this team was right there, in spite of mistakes. This team has the pieces to be good for quite some time. And when you get this good, you look to upgrade talent at key positions, rather than fill gaping flippin' holes. I know this is a mindshift around here, since we had so many holes for so long. Surely we can upgrade at WR2. (Whew! Glad I got all that off my chest.)

 

[cbs1507]

[Jaysol, this post is not directed at you in particular. You just said something that I was sensitive to.]

It is exactly this label of "the sudden uproar" and "one play" that I was anticipating and hoping to avoid. My disdain for Jacoby Jones is not based upon one play. Rather, it is a culmination of his body of work, or lack thereof. I did not like him going into this season, and this season, more than any other, due to the AJ injuries, gave him his opportunity to prove me wrong.

Performance. All else equal, throw a jump ball to AJ, and he finds a way more often than not. Throw a jump ball to JJ, and he finds a way to miss. Show me his game winning 25+ yard reception. If anyone wants to be a JJ apologist, and point to "oh it is not fair to compare him to the best receiver in the NFL," fine go ahead. I for one am not about excuses; I believe in results.

No one likes a whiner. Have you ever noticed how often JJ begs for calls on incomplete passes? It bugs the **** out of me. If you can't go up and get the ball, don't beg the refs. A whine here or there is pardonable -- we are only human -- but here I am pointing to a persistent manner of behavior. Don't be a whiner. Be a winner.

Results first, showboat second. It bugs me that he makes a show out of the most pedestrian of plays. On the odd occasion that he actually DID catch a 3rd down pass for 1st down, he would come up, flip the ball, do some sort of shimmy shiver, and generally show-boat. AJ can showboat (though I would point out he does not do so), as he has earned that right.

Only thing JJ has earned in my book is my contempt for his mediocre play. Object if you must (note: you being a general reference to the reader, not the poster which I quoted above. This is not a diatribe against any one poster.). Everyone is entitled to an opinion. I guess the only opinions that count in the end are the ones who decide who is and is not on the roster. For me, I have seen enough. More than enough. Sorry, #12. You will probably benefit from a fresh-start elsewhere.

Rick

PS: As a footnote, I would add that giving any team 7 points in the playoffs is a big flippin' deal. It gave new life to a more-than-capable opponent, at a time where our defense was taking the opponents' heart and hope away (yes, even so early in the game.).

PPS: Regarding Yates' play, one of his INT's came on an inexplicable 40 yard **play-call** with 2 minutes or so (was it 1:41? I am going off memory.) We had the ball, the clock, and the momentum. Why we chose to poke at the end zone at that moment is beyond me. My point is this play was as much about play calling as it was about Yates' rookie mistake of trying to force a ball into AJ against a future HOF safety. All this finger-pointing at Yates is misplaced. It's a game of inches, and this team was right there, in spite of mistakes. This team has the pieces to be good for quite some time. And when you get this good, you look to upgrade talent at key positions, rather than fill gaping flippin' holes. I know this is a mindshift around here, since we had so many holes for so long. Surely we can upgrade at WR2. (Whew! Glad I got all that off my chest.)

Well apparently Yates giving the Ravens 10 points wasn't a big deal.
BTW This is not a playcalling issue. Nobody called a 40 yard pass play. There were 5 options. One of those 5 options was double covered. That means 4 other options had 1 on 1 coverage. Nobody made Yates throw it into coverage. You can't blame the playcalling for that. It's a rookie issue. Point blank.

PS
Jacoby Jones had ZERO targets in the 2011 playoffs. ZERO. So to have disdain for somebody that doesn't even get the ball thrown his direction is ridiculous. He couldn't have redeemed himself if he wanted to. The closest he got to redemption was falling on Foster's untimely fumble in the 4th quarter. People always point out how the fumble got to his head. But a veteran QB, would have given him a chance to redeem himself instead of staring into double and triple coverage and chucking up prayers at the first option WR on plays with 5 options.

 

[escrimador]

Now that it's been a week, I've been thinking about how Jacoby might redeem himself IF they keep him. The guy is is still an athlete. Why not convert the guy to a CB? He's tall with long arms and has the speed to stay with WR's.

 

[GuerillaBlack]

I have had a week to think about it and I can't wait until they cut Jacoby Jones. So much talent this year in FA and the draft for a WR. Jacoby is nothing special and hasn't improved in five seasons. Still making rookie mistakes too. Terrible. Won't be hard to replace him.

 

[Texn4life]

I have had a week to think about it and I can't wait until they cut Jacoby Jones. So much talent this year in FA and the draft for a WR. Jacoby is nothing special and hasn't improved in five seasons. Still making rookie mistakes too. Terrible. Won't be hard to replace him.

I feel the same way. They had a great point on 610 earlier in the week asking, "If Jacoby Jones was on another team would you want to go after him to play for the Texans?". I don't know many people that would say yes to that question. I don't hate the guy and like I've said many time I wish him well with whatever team he ends up on in whatever role he fills. I just don't want him as the Texans #2, #3, or PR next year. Is it possible that we may miss out on some of his big punt returns? Yes, but I'll take catching the punt and getting up field for positive yardage over the negative plays he comes with.

 

[cbs1507]

I feel the same way. They had a great point on 610 earlier in the week asking, "If Jacoby Jones was on another team would you want to go after him to play for the Texans?". I don't know many people that would say yes to that question. I don't hate the guy and like I've said many time I wish him well with whatever team he ends up on in whatever role he fills. I just don't want him as the Texans #2, #3, or PR next year. Is it possible that we may miss out on some of his big punt returns? Yes, but I'll take catching the punt and getting up field for positive yardage over the negative plays he comes with.

If Jacoby was on another team he might actually get thrown the ball (ZERO targets). Of course they probably wouldn't have a rookie QB that stares down the 1st option and chucks it into triple coverage instead of utilizing one of the other 4 routes that had 1 on 1 (or possibly wide open).

 

[Texn4life]

If Jacoby was on another team he might actually get thrown the ball (ZERO targets). Of course they probably wouldn't have a rookie QB that stares down the 1st option and chucks it into triple coverage instead of utilizing one of the other 4 routes that had 1 on 1 (or possibly wide open).

Jacoby was targeted plenty of times throughout the year unsuccessfully. Its a reason why most people aren't simply pointing to this one game for wanting the Texans to move on. Plenty of players leave teams throughout their careers. For the life of me I can't understand why some are so hell bent on keeping this one guy a part of the team.

 

[GuerillaBlack]

I feel the same way. They had a great point on 610 earlier in the week asking, "If Jacoby Jones was on another team would you want to go after him to play for the Texans?". I don't know many people that would say yes to that question. I don't hate the guy and like I've said many time I wish him well with whatever team he ends up on in whatever role he fills. I just don't want him as the Texans #2, #3, or PR next year. Is it possible that we may miss out on some of his big punt returns? Yes, but I'll take catching the punt and getting up field for positive yardage over the negative plays he comes with.

I remember in the Raiders game, Jacoby had like nine targets and only caught one pass. Dude is lazy on his route running and doesn't cut. He didn't even try helping Schaub out on the last play of that game. Again, shouldn't be hard to replace. I wish him well on whatever other team he will go to, but its clear he hasn't played well enough here.

 

[gary]

Is Jones still on the team?

 

[cbs1507]

Jacoby was targeted plenty of times throughout the year unsuccessfully. Its a reason why most people aren't simply pointing to this one game for wanting the Texans to move on. Plenty of players leave teams throughout their careers. For the life of me I can't understand why some are so hell bent on keeping this one guy a part of the team.

No he was targeted plenty of times when Matt Schaub was at QB. He did not get many targets as soon as Yates took over, even without Andre. He had ZERO target the enitre playoffs. I don't care how you try to frame. The guy had ZERO targets in the playoffs. You can bash him all you want, but a vet QB gives him a chance to redeem himself. Point blank.

 

[cbs1507]

I remember in the Raiders game, Jacoby had like nine targets and only caught one pass. Dude is lazy on his route running and doesn't cut. He didn't even try helping Schaub out on the last play of that game. Again, shouldn't be hard to replace. I wish him well on whatever other team he will go to, but its clear he hasn't played well enough here.

One game is all you could come up with. He actually played decent when Matt Schaub was playing (save the Oakland game, but that was our first game we played without AJ). I could could name many more than that where he was wide open and didn't get looks (all the games TJ Yates started). He even got a few looks when Jake Delhome came in for the last game of the season. Only to get ZERO targets the entire playoffs.

BTW How do you even see his routes (since you are critiquing them)? He doesn't get targeted for you to even know what he ran.

 

[Texn4life]

No he was targeted plenty of times when Matt Schaub was at QB. He did not get many targets as soon as Yates took over, even without Andre. He had ZERO target the enitre playoffs. I don't care how you try to frame. The guy had ZERO targets in the playoffs. You can bash him all you want, but a vet QB gives him a chance to redeem himself. Point blank.

He had 5 years to show me something. You ever think that maybe there was a reason Yates didn't trust Jacoby? I'm basing wanting Jacoby for the lack of consistency he failed to show during his entire 5 years. It has nothing to do with the playoffs. We can get the production we got from him with a rookie at a cheaper price. If you don't understand that then I don't know what else to tell you.

And its not personal. I've met and hung out with Jacoby on more than a few occasions since he's dated one of my friends, but I just think its time to move on. Don't know where you think I'm bashing him. Bashing would be saying he sucks. I'm not saying that. Its just time to move on.

 

[cbs1507]

He had 5 years to show me something. You ever think that maybe there was a reason Yates didn't trust Jacoby? I'm basing wanting Jacoby for the lack of consistency he failed to show during his entire 5 years. It has nothing to do with the playoffs. We can get the production we got from him with a rookie at a cheaper price. If you don't understand that then I don't know what else to tell you.

And its not personal. I've met and hung out with Jacoby on more than a few occasions since he's dated one of my friends, but I just think its time to move on. Don't know where you think I'm bashing him. Bashing would be saying he sucks. I'm not saying that. Its just time to move on.

I am just using reason instead of emotion, like most fans on this thread seem to doing. Personally, it wouldn't bother me if management decided to go with another WR. But realistically he'll be here next year. They'll probably bring in another WR through either draft or FA. He will probably get bumped down to WR3, which he might benefit from.

BTW what is it with people and saying Jones is inconsistent. 500 yards a season is consistent IMO, when you consider that we have plenty of options. He could have had more if he actually got some targets. I'd say 500 yards is a good season, if you actually were paying attention to Yates' play down the stretch. The game against Baltimore did not surprise me because he was missing open receivers down the stretch.

 

[Carr Bombed]

So you actually think a TO in the first quarter was more impactful than 3 INTs during the course of the game? Yes it led to 7. But Yates threw a boneheaded pick to AJ by staring him down 2 possessions later. It led TD as well. So both of them accounted for 14 Ravens points in the 1st quarter. Well we came back to within 4. Yates ended up throwing 2 more INTs. Jacoby fell on Foster's fumble and was targeted ZERO times (because Yates was too busy staring down AJ and throwing into triple coverage with a clean pocket instead of taking advantage of 1 on 1 coverage that every other receiver had). I'm sorry you can't pin this one on Jacoby no matter how much you are discontent with his production.

:vincepalm: One of the reasons why Yates had to throw so much was because instead of having a lead (which we had before Jones "Jacobied" the ball) we had to play from behind.

Get a clue here.. You can't pin the loss on a rookie and I expect more out of my 5 year vets. I expect them to atleast know what to do in a certain situation that even high school football players know what to do in the same situation. GET AWAY FROM THE FOOTBALL!

 

[Texn4life]

I am just using reason instead of emotion, like most fans on this thread seem to doing. Personally, it wouldn't bother me if management decided to go with another WR. But realistically he'll be here next year. They'll probably bring in another WR through either draft or FA. He will probably get bumped down to WR3, which he might benefit from.

BTW what is it with people and saying Jones is inconsistent. 500 yards a season is consistent IMO, when you consider that we have plenty of options. He could have had more if he actually got some targets.

I don't know what universe you're in, but I actually watch the games. Jones is far from consistent. Numbers don't tell the whole story. It was a crap shoot most of his career if he would catch the ball thrown to him or not.

I've already said I want to cut bait and move on, but if they brought him back then it is what it is. Jacoby hasn't been pushed by any talent though throughout his entire career here. It's time that his job is threatened and maybe he'll step up and play up to his potential. I just don't think its going to happen here though. Sometimes a chance of scenery is what a player needs. Not too hard to understand this.

 

[cbs1507]

:vincepalm: One of the reasons why Yates had to throw so much was because instead of having a lead (which we had before Jones "Jacobied" the ball) we had to play from behind.

Get a clue here.. You can't pin the loss on a rookie and I expect more out of my 5 year vets. I expect them to atleast know what to do in a certain situation that even high school football players know what to do in the same situation. GET AWAY FROM THE FOOTBALL!

Really? After Jacoby's fumble the score was 7-3. Oh yeah major mountain to climb. That darn Jacoby made Yates throw it to the WR that had triple coverage when the play had 4 other options.

:vincepalm:

BTW You are forgetting that Yates threw a hand me pick to Webb on our own 34 yard line by staring down AJ on a 2 man route (just throw it away). It put us down 17-3. The he follwed that up by throwing 2 picks into double and triple coverage IN THE 4TH quarter. That darn Jacoby. Wake up man. Yates costed us the game, not Jacoby. Get over it.

 

[Carr Bombed]

No he was targeted plenty of times when Matt Schaub was at QB. He did not get many targets as soon as Yates took over, even without Andre. He had ZERO target the entire playoffs. I don't care how you try to frame. The guy had ZERO targets in the playoffs. You can bash him all you want, but a vet QB gives him a chance to redeem himself. Point blank.

Targeted "plenty of times huh"....I guess that's why our backup TE had as many catches as he did... Cut the crap and stop revising history here. Yates was able to pass everyone the ball. Kevin Walter had targets with him behind center this season.. So did Daniels, so did Andre.. But he just hates JaNobody huh? :vincepalm:

You're trying to blow smoke up people's rears and it isn't working. Point blank.

 

[cbs1507]

Targeted "plenty of times huh"....I guess that's why our backup TE had as many catches as he did... Cut the crap and stop revising history here. Yates was able to pass everyone the ball. Kevin Walter had targets with him behind center this season.. So did Daniels, so did Andre.. But he just hates JaNobody huh? :vincepalm:

You're trying to blow smoke up people's rears and it isn't working. Point blank.

I didn't say he hated him. Jacoby had ZERO targets the whole playoffs. Wake up man. Yates has tunnel vision. He can't see the field.

BTW AJ 15 Targets only 8 catches. Walter 8 targets only 2 catches. Everyone else had 3 targets or less. In Jacoby's case...ZERO.

 

[Carr Bombed]

Really? After Jacoby's fumble the score was 7-3. Oh yeah major mountain to climb. That darn Jacoby made Yates throw it to the WR that had triple coverage when the play had 4 other options.

:vincepalm:

BTW You are forgetting that Yates threw a hand me pick to Webb on our own 34 yard line by staring down AJ on a 2 man route (just throw it away). It put us down 17-3. The he followed that up by throwing 2 picks into double and triple coverage IN THE 4TH quarter. That darn Jacoby. Wake up man. Yates costed us the game, not Jacoby. Get over it.

:vincepalm: What part of rookie 3rd string QB and 5th year starter doesn't compute with you?

Turnovers happen, bad plays happen, bad QB play even happens, but in a sport where you can't control everything, there are things that you can control.

GETTING THE **** AWAY FROM THE BALL AFTER YOU ALREADY MUFFED THE CATCH IS ONE OF THEM!

For Janobody's sake and mental well being I am glad he has your shoulder to cry on though, just be sure to tell him to take his "talents" elsewhere next year.

 

[Carr Bombed]

I didn't say he hated him. Jacoby had ZERO targets the whole playoffs. Wake up man. Yates has tunnel vision. He can't see the field.

BTW AJ 15 Targets only 8 catches. Walter 8 targets only 2 catches. Everyone else had 3 targets or less. In Jacoby's case...ZERO.

And why the hell do you think he had zero targets when everyone else had passes thrown their way? Could it be.. GASP, due to the fact that he's a shitty receiver? I mean I know I'm going out on a limb here by thinking he sucks at his job, but just maybe that's the reason

(BTW that last sentence was complete sarcasm in case you missed it)

 

[cbs1507]

I didn't know Jacoby was a 5th year starter.

Being a rookie does not excuse throwing into double and triple coverage on plays with 5 effing options. If #1 option is double/triple teamed, throw it to one of the other options. What happened to captain checkdown jr? Down the stretch he was passing to TE/RBs only. Now he get's AJ back and start's chucking up prayer into coverage. All the while he consistently missed opportunities to move the chains. In the case of the lastt game it costed us because of TOs.

 

[Mr. White]

Really? After Jacoby's fumble the score was 7-3. Oh yeah major mountain to climb. That darn Jacoby made Yates throw it to the WR that had triple coverage when the play had 4 other options.

:vincepalm:

BTW You are forgetting that Yates threw a hand me pick to Webb on our own 34 yard line by staring down AJ on a 2 man route (just throw it away). It put us down 17-3. The he follwed that up by throwing 2 picks into double and triple coverage IN THE 4TH quarter. That darn Jacoby. Wake up man. Yates costed us the game, not Jacoby. Get over it.

Jacoby knew that we had a 3rd string rookie playing just like everyone else. That's why it's that much more important for him to catch a routine punt. Goes to show that he's still got nothing going on upstairs.....just like we already knew.

For the purposes of this thread, I could give a rat's ass about how Yates played. I'm sure he's got his own thread somewhere around here. We all knew what to expect from him. Jacoby's got no excuse.

 

[cbs1507]

I believe management will bring in another WR in the offseason by either draft or FA to actually challenge Jacoby. But he will likely be on the team next year, and will have his best statistical season of his career (as a #3 WR).

 

[cbs1507]

Jacoby knew that we had a 3rd string rookie playing just like everyone else. That's why it's that much more important for him to catch a routine punt. Goes to show that he's still got nothing going on upstairs.....just like we already knew.

For the purposes of this thread, I could give a rat's ass about how Yates played. I'm sure he's got his own thread somewhere around here. We all knew what to expect from him. Jacoby's got no excuse.

I expected him to miss wide open receivers, because he did that down the stretch. 3 INTs is inexcusable. Point blank. You can frame it however you like.

BTW I am not excusing Jacoby Jones' mistake. It was bonehead. But it did not cost us the game. TJ Yates did.