Why? He's not the one who threw 3 INTs. In fact, if we took him out the game then who would have fallen on Foster's fumble. That's about as close as Jacoby was going to get to redemption because he got ZERO TARGETS in the 2011-2012 playoffs. You guys can bash him all you want, but he can't throw it to himself. Yates was chucking the ball into coverage all game, and people blame Jacoby for us losing. Get over it.
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Jacoby's Gotta Go/**UPDATE**Released
- Thread starter Mr. White
- Start date
Why? He's not the one who threw 3 INTs. In fact, if we took him out the game then who would have fallen on Foster's fumble. That's about as close as Jacoby was going to get to redemption because he got ZERO TARGETS in the 2011-2012 playoffs. You guys can bash him all you want, but he can't throw it to himself. Yates was chucking the ball into coverage all game, and people blame Jacoby for us losing. Get over it.
When the last time he made a boneheaded mistake? Was it in the playoffs?
It's funny how people can overlook 3 bonheaded INTs and excuse it because "he's a rookie". But you bash this guy for 1 boneheaded mistake IN THE FIRST QUARTER. We had 3 TOs after his mistake. All of them were from 1 player, TJ Yates.
We cut the lead by 4 points with a rookie QB. We ran the ball for 95 yards in the first half against the league's #2 rush defense. We were on the road & this was the divisional round of the AFC Play-offs.
That's really not a bad position to be in considering.
if anything, cutting the lead to 4 points, running for 95 yards at the half... if there is any such thing as momentum, we had it..... then we start the 3rd qtr with a defensive 3 & out... yeah, we had the momentum.
Re-read what I have wrote. Jacoby deserves to be criticized & chastized & held accountable for his contributions to that loss.... I only said some of our fans are going a little overboard.
If we were to win that game, his fall on Arian's fumble would have made up for the muffed punt.
Jacoby's muff led to a 4 point deficit, not 7. A 4 point deficit is nothing to change your game plan over.
I didn't say a good year "for" Jacoby. I said Jacoby had a good year as a punt returner, he was selected as an alternate to the pro-bowl as a returner. He didn't muff any punts in the regular season & I think he was one of the leading punt returners in the league.
Jacoby improved his game quite a bit this season. We hadn't talked about Jacoby's punt returns for 18 weeks.
gary
Hall of Fame
If you read the whole thread then you would see that I have done anything but blame Jones for the loss as a matter of fact I have been one of the very few through out this thread to defend him.
Luv_ya_blue
Truth, Love, Faith & Obedience - Christianity 101
http://www.nfl.com/stats/categoryst...rience=null&tabSeq=1&qualified=true&Submit=Go
REGULAR SEASON:
3rd in league with Return yards... (518 yds)
26th in NFL by average returns in ypc... (10.6 ypc on 49 returns)
9th in longest return... (79T)
Tied for 3rd in TDs... (with 14 other players)
Tied for 5th with 20+ ypc... (with 3 other players)
Tied for 1st with 40+ ypc... (with 1 other player)
Tied for 31st in Fair Catch Category... (with 7)
Tied for last with Zero Fumbles Lost in regular season
POSTSEASON:
Tied for 7th out of 10 in total Return yards... (16 yds)
Dead last in league by average returns in ypc... (1.8 ypc on 9 returns)
7th out of 9 in longest return... (9 yds)
No ranking in TDs in postseason
No ranking in 20+ ypc
No ranking in 40+ ypc
Dead last in league in Fair Catches... (with 0)
1st place with Fumbles Lost in postseason... (with 2)
Regular Seaons numbers aren't too bad
Postseason numbers were horrendous imo.
And since postseason is where heroes are made...
Well, it speaks for itself.
Last? Zero lost? doesn't make sense does it?
Understood, never said any different.
TheMatrix31
Hall of Fame
We're still talking about this loser?
Luv_ya_blue
Truth, Love, Faith & Obedience - Christianity 101
Meaning that he didn't lose any fumbles during the reg. season. And he was tied with a bunch of other guys that didn't lose any either. Couldn't really figure out how to word it...and I'm pretty much beat and headed off to bed.
And I didn't say you didn't say otherwise. I didn't read through the whole thread...I just happened to glance down and see your comment; so I thought that I'd check into the stats.
Now it makes complete sense.
Funny thing.. I was actually impressed with Jj's hands this year, especially on punts.
It got so bad, that I was not expecting it. When the season started, I crossed my fingers & said a little prayer every time they punted to him. Then all of a sudden, I stopped doing it.. felt it was no longer needed.
Then that happened.
:kubepalm:
Carr Bombed
Hall of Fame
:mariopalm:
You can not be serious. You HAVE to be to Jacoby Jones what Hulk75 was to David Carr. LOL
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So you actually think a TO in the first quarter was more impactful than 3 INTs during the course of the game? Yes it led to 7. But Yates threw a boneheaded pick to AJ by staring him down 2 possessions later. It led TD as well. So both of them accounted for 14 Ravens points in the 1st quarter. Well we came back to within 4. Yates ended up throwing 2 more INTs. Jacoby fell on Foster's fumble and was targeted ZERO times (because Yates was too busy staring down AJ and throwing into triple coverage with a clean pocket instead of taking advantage of 1 on 1 coverage that every other receiver had). I'm sorry you can't pin this one on Jacoby no matter how much you are discontent with his production.
GuerillaBlack
Hall of Fame
Yates was a ROOKIE, in his eighth start, going against a top three defense on the road and in the playoffs. Compare that to Jacoby, who is a five year vet and essentially gave the Ravens seven free points, since they got the ball on the one yard line. He made a mistake that high schoolers don't even make. Interceptions happen, but muffed punts aren't suppose to happen. If you can't see the difference in that, then I don't know what to tell you.
TheMatrix31
Hall of Fame
Quarterbacks throw picks. That stupidity happens.
Fielding a punt that already hit the ground 10 yards out of your own end zone after a 3-and-out up 3 points in the playoffs on the road is unacceptable. People can slice it any ****ing way they want.
THAT. CANT. HAPPEN.
Fielding a punt that already hit the ground 10 yards out of your own end zone after a 3-and-out up 3 points in the playoffs on the road is unacceptable. People can slice it any ****ing way they want.
THAT. CANT. HAPPEN.
Like I said, I understand being upset at Jacoby, no way that should have happened. He should be held accountable.
At the same time, that is not the reason we lost that game. If it didn't happen, it is highly unlikely we could go on, commit 3 turnovers (you know interceptions just happen) & still expect to win that game. That just don't happen, especially not against the Ravens.
I understand Yates getting the. Pass. He's a rookie, playing a top 3 defense, on the road, in the play-offs.
Doesn't mean his turn-overs don't affect the outcome of the game. It's more likely that we win the game if Tj protected the ball & played it safe, like the Bengals game, than if Jacoby fair caught that ball.
2012Champs
Hall of Fame
lets stop this rookie, ints happens stuff. Truth is Yates cost us more points than Jones did. Yates very easily could have been on the hook for 5-6 ints that game.
Who cost us the game? Multiple people
Yates 3 ints
Jones fumble
Rackers missed fg
Turk shanked punt
all those led to points for the ravens.
we could also add
Foster fumble(no points by the ravens because JJ recovered)
TheMatrix31
Hall of Fame
I don't give a pass to Yates. I yelled "seriously, what the **** are you doing, dumbass" for about 5 minutes after each pick he threw. I don't even blame him for the last one as I do it being a terrible playcall.
But, Jacoby's was bigger, and I really don't care what anyone says. You can take one of the Yates' picks away, and 7 points go away. You can also take one of Yates' away and 3 points go away. Terrible throws.
Jacoby's was the most inexcusable of all. Bottom line.
But, Jacoby's was bigger, and I really don't care what anyone says. You can take one of the Yates' picks away, and 7 points go away. You can also take one of Yates' away and 3 points go away. Terrible throws.
Jacoby's was the most inexcusable of all. Bottom line.
2012Champs
Hall of Fame
the only way JJ fumble for 7 is or was bigger is if you are too emotional about it.
3 ints gave the ravens points and cost us points end of story
Texan_Bill
Hall of Fame
Ummmm... Yeah, it was in the playoffs. Our last game.
Try "boneheaded" plays his entire 5 year overpaid career.
When you have a rookie quarterback (who carried a clipboard for the first 10 games of the season) starting in the playoffs, on the road no less, you need to play from ahead - NOT BEHIND. Jacoby's "boneheadedness" single handedly changed that. We were up 3-0 and the defense had just forced a 3 and out giving us the ball back. In short, the defense gave up less than 10 yards, yet we were down 7-3... Thanks Jacoby!!!!!
TheMatrix31
Hall of Fame
Given that Jacoby's was by FAR the worse football blunder, put them at the ONE yard line so they don't even have to WORK for it, right after a 3-and-out, right after we came out and punched them in the mouth, against Baltimore, on the road, in the playoffs...you know, given all those situational things, Jacoby's was much MUCH worse.
I really don't see how it's debatable.
In fact, I think our inability to score on NON-INT-drives were a much bigger deal than the picks themselves seeing as how despite those INTs costing us 10 points, we had like 8 opportunities to cash in and get points of our own after defensive stops, but didn't.
Not even worth discussing. They're going on because of our failures. **** Jacoby AND TJ. AND Albert Haynesworth.
Texan_Bill
Hall of Fame
Jacoby had 31 receptions in the 9 games that Dre missed. Pathetic!!!
TheMatrix31
Hall of Fame
That worthless mother****er had like THIRTEEN targets in the Oakland game and caught ONE.
2012Champs
Hall of Fame
so you acknowledge JJ cost us 7 and INTs cost us 10(plus the ability to score) and you also acknowledge that Yates couldnt score in general and then you still state you dont know how anyone could debate that Jones cost us the game? crazy
Texan_Bill
Hall of Fame
TheMatrix31
Hall of Fame
Yep. Because one could EXPECT Yates and the offense to have trouble moving the ball for consistent points against the Ravens' D, on the road, in the playoffs.
But one shouldn't expect a ****head to field a punt that ALREADY HIT THE GROUND, 10 yards deep in his zone.
Ever consider that Yates forcing to Andre on that first pick is a direct result of him feeling the burden of having to come out firing to make up for Jacoby Jones' blunder and the free 7 points given to the Ravens?
2012Champs
Hall of Fame
Like I said it must be too emotional for you to think clearly. Yates isnt a clipboard carry rookie. 7 Starts removes your clipboard status. Facts are 4 players cost us points in the game and Yates led the crowd. Not only did he lead in giving points to the Ravens, his ints directly impact our ability to score on offense. Also mentioned earlier in the thread even when he didnt throw INTS he still couldnt score.
Yates cost us the most points
JJ 2nd
Rackers 3rd
Turk 4th
It really is that simple
2012Champs
Hall of Fame
So you expected Yates to cause or WR to play more as DBs during the game? You expected Yates to have 3 picks that could have easily been 5-6? You expect our offense to call it game over in the first quarter being down 4 points 5 minutes into the game? If you as a QB cant break out of your 16 PPG average and you throw 3 ints you dont win the game for your team. If you cant overcome a 4 point deficit 5 minutes into the game you were never going to make it far in the playoffs
TheMatrix31
Hall of Fame
Another thing to look at would be...
Yates, for all his failures, "only" cost us 10 points.
Jacoby, for ONE INEXPLICABLE failure cost us 7.
Just a bit of perspective there too. So are we going to just look at numbers and say Yates was more devastating?
It's KINDA (not a perfect analogy) be like saying a guy who went 7-21 (33%) cost his team more than a guy who went 2-14 (14%), because he missed 14 shots and 2-14 guy only missed 12 shots.
All about percentages.
TheMatrix31
Hall of Fame
You're not just overcoming a 4 point deficit. Get that through your ****ing head. The Ravens didnt get the ball and have a 70 yard drive to score. They didn't score on their own volition. It's not just any normal 4 point deficit. It was a catastrophic miscue that absolutely destroyed any semblance of momentum for a team that needed to not GIVE the Ravens any ****ing gifts.
2012Champs
Hall of Fame
Are you really trying to say Yates only cost us 10? That seems a little off when every INT stopped our drives. Every almost INT 2-3 cost us downs. Missed opportunities. If you are going to say that how many points did JJ fumble recovery save us? Did JJ fumble recovery give the O a chance to keep going and score? Your use of fg %s is invalid and how on earth you could attempt to apply it here is mind boggling
Yates turned the ball over more and cost us more points than JJ there is no rookie adjustments to FACTS, rookie adjustments or forgiveness is an emotional response
Texan_Bill
Hall of Fame
When starting a rooking QB, on the road and in the playoffs it is imperative that you play from ahead. We had that lead and we were about to get the ball back. Jacoby's jackassery cost us not only the lead but also momentum. Dude has had five years to make a difference and then makes a costly, costly mistake like that dumbass play AND nearly lost another on the very next punt.
I don't fault Jacoby that much in the same way you can't blame a dog for being a dog. I blame Kubes because 6 returns for a whopping 4 yards and Jacoby's history is awesome.
2012Champs
Hall of Fame
Like I said if your team cant overcome being down 4 points 5 minutes into the game you werent going to make it anywhere in the playoffs.
Lets talk about the destroyed nature of being down 4 points with 55 mins of playing time left. Our defense dominated the game, they never lost momentum. Our offense never had momentum starting the game, we had a 50+ yard kickoff return that netted us a FG. Holy smokes Im sure that fired up the offense. Our team wasnt destroyed by JJ mistake
2012Champs
Hall of Fame
When starting a rooking QB, on the road and in the playoffs it is imperative that you play from ahead. We had that lead and we were about to get the ball back. Jacoby's jackassery cost us not only the lead but also momentum. Dude has had five years to make a difference and then makes a costly, costly mistake like that dumbass play AND nearly lost another on the very next punt.
I don't fault Jacoby that much in the same way you can't blame a dog for being a dog. I blame Kubes because 6 returns for a whopping 4 yards and Jacoby's history is awesome.
Yeah I guess JJ is responsible for return coverage too now? lol Blame him for everything.
Forgive the rookie and find a villain its emotional and gives you closure so you can feel better
Just so we are clear. I dont want to see JJ back next year either but the extent he is getting blamed for our Team's loss is crazy
Ole Miss Texan
Hall of Fame
Look at the situation of those though.
We started the game with momentum from Manning's 60 yard kickoff return. Get 2 completions, a first down and then kick a field goal to be up 3-0 on the road.
Then we kickoff and it starts shaky for the Ravens. I think they fumbled on the kick return but recovered it. Our defense stops Rice and Flacco, forcing a 3 and out. They're forced to punt the ball.
So now we're getting the ball back with all the momentum you could ask for to start the divisional round of the playoffs on the road. Instead of going down and scoring to be up 6-0 or 10-0... Jacoby fumbles the ball, giving it to them on the 2 yard line. Now we're down 3-7.... much different. We're down early, the momentum has definitely shifted... and now we've got our rookie 3rd stringer that's having to lead us from behind against one of the toughest teams in the AFC on the road.
Did Yates make some boneheaded throws? Yes. I actually like the fact he threw it downfield some and even tried to force it to AJ, one of the best WRs in the game, to make a play or two. But I did not like how it seemed he would lock onto his receiver.
But it's a no brainer for me. Jacoby's fumble at the beginning of the game was the biggest single factor and dumbest mistake in our loss. That changed the complexion of the game.
Our defense held the Ravens to 3 points during the last 46 minutes of play. That's incredible. If we would have started the game up 6-0 or 10-0 instead of being down 3-7.... I think this game would have been much different and in our favor.
Mr. White
Retired OLine Coach
He's got all the physical tools, but he couldn't handle the pressure of the playoffs on the road. More proof that the guy is just weak-minded.
Any team that wants to take the next step has to cut bait on these kind of guys.
Texan_Bill
Hall of Fame
EXACTLY!! Exactly why you have to play with the lead when starting a 5th round rookie QB.
Mr. White
Retired OLine Coach
Yep. When you have 2 strong defensive teams you go in expecting to play a low scoring game for field position. A guy that returns punts should know this.
2012Champs
Hall of Fame
Im sorry but with that good of a kick off, the fg leaves the offense dissapointed I assure you
Our d held the entire game, they never "lost momentum" we forced many fumbles and never recovered one
Your best WR wasnt at his best and while throwing down field is nice to see. Doing so into double and triple coverage isnt good to see and Yates did it all game long and was on lockdown on his receivers
The single biggest factor in our loss was our 4 turnovers that cost us 17 points. Break it down however you want but Jones didnt carry the majority of either the points or turnovers and he recovered a fumble as well
Our d held the whole game. We can play the IF game many ways. IF TJ didnt have 3 ints we would have won the game. If TJ had one pick and rackers/turk did their job we would have won. IFs get away from what really happend
2012Champs
Hall of Fame
4 turnovers 17 points
1 missed FG 3 point and gave the ravens 3 IIRC
1 punt my 6 year old nephew could have pulled off gave them 3 as well
17+6+3= 26 point swing
Thats why we lost
Luv_ya_blue
Truth, Love, Faith & Obedience - Christianity 101
Couldn't agree more.
Some guys are clutch and others aren't.
Some players can handle being the "go to guy" and some can't.
Doesn't mean he's not a good guy...just means that he can't contribute like WE need him to.
Vinny
shiny happy fan
wasn't TOTALLY destroyed but it matters in a game where field position and mistakes are what separates winners from losers. We lost and Jacoby was one of the reasons...pretty much period.
2012Champs
Hall of Fame
was he one of the reasons? Of course and I think I have posted that a few times. He wasnt the reason we lost.
Vinny
shiny happy fan
He was part of the reason we lost. Highlighting the word THE won't help the fact that he's a big part of why we didn't win.
Mr. White
Retired OLine Coach
You've said this about a half dozen times now in this thread. I get your point. You're saying it's a team loss.
My point is that he has no place on this team.
Ole Miss Texan
Hall of Fame
Agreed. The turnovers were the BIGGEST reason why we lost. But If I had to point to one SINGLE play - it would be the Jacoby punt return fumble.
You're right, our defense played GREAT the entire day. All the more reason why Jacoby's fumble frustrates me.
Baltimore only scored two FGs (6 points) when they started on their side of the field out of 9 or 10 possessions. They scored two TDs (14 points) when starting on Houston's side of the field out of 3 possessions (1 off Jacoby's fumble; 1 off TJ's interception).
Their offense had a hard time driving the ball. If Jacoby would have not fumbled it, let's just assume we would be forced to punt. That would put Baltimore on their side of the field.
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gary
Hall of Fame
I am not going to go on and on about this because overall I think the team played well enough to have a chance at the end of the game. Rackers cost the team three points and then Yates being locked onto AJ too much when another receiver was probably open did not help the team either. Was that just Yates or some play calling too mixed in? I don't know but Yates is a rookie so you just have to expect what we saw from him and hope he has learned a lot from it. Most of all hope that Schaub plays an entire season next year but for now things are over and done with major props to the whole team for a great season with so many players going down at different times through out the season.
yep. The lack of objectivity and obsessively blind support are telltale signs.
Funny thing about pointing to the rookie QB in a thread specifically talking about Jacoby Jones. It's much like Coach Smith said about his conversation with Jones after the game. Hey, he's not the only one that made a mistake!
We know Yates will not be the starting QB next season. He was a backup to a backup. Will Jacoby still be a starting punt returner?
Jacoby Jones is a freakin' starter, so the expectations and standards should be higher for a 5th year veteran. That it's not for some folks can only speak volumes about the MBB's (mighty big blinders) they must be wearing for him.