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Is O'Brien finished shaping roster?

steelbtexan

King of the W. B. Club
Contributor's Club
And that’s another thing-the pass rush. Mercilus shows up in the pass rush too infrequent to make much of a difference. The rest of the LB’s are no threat to disrupting the passer.

The Texans better get a consistent pass rush from an unlikely source because they’re not going to get much from the LB’s. The Texans need a new game wrecker because Watt isn’t that guy anymore.
They need to find a LB that can cover. The defense will look alot better if they can find this LB. The 2 I liked in this last draft was Willie Gay (Went to the Chiefs darn) and Daveon Taylor in the 3rd (Eagles) Both are really athletic LB's which is what the Texans LB corps is missing. Maybe this is the yr that Cole will stay healthy and really help the team out.

They're hoping Blaclock can be the gamewrecking force in the middle that will make things easier to get pressure from the edges. I have hopes for Martin being the guy that provides pressure from the edge.
 

Corrosion

Idealist
Staff member
Cunningham is not tasked to get after the qb. Every blue in the moon RAC would send him on a blitz. So how is that his fault. Last season Cunningham was the best run defender. Now BMac done somethings that will not show up on the stats.

There was quite of few rumors out there about the Texans trying to trade BMac.
After this season - pick one to keep , because you just aren't going to be a very good defense with both of them , someone's got to be able to cover TE's better than 76% completion rates.

McKinney's deal lasts thru 2023 at $6,656,250 , $7,750,000 , $9,500,000 and $10,250,000 with limited dead money - $8.25m this year , $1.5m next , $750k in 2022 and no dead money in 23.

Cunningham's deal ends after this season - $1,074,783 and a signing bonus hit of $348,046.

I think going forward , you could pick either and do well assuming you put the right guy next to them .... so if you can get Cunningham extended at a value less than McKinney's , keeping him is an option.
I just have no clue what he think's his value is or what another franchise may offer ...

The question for me is how do you replace the one that leaves not having premium draft picks and being very limited on free agency spending.

Keeping both just isn't an option to me .. one of them has to go.
 

Lucky

Moderator
Staff member
After this season - pick one to keep , because you just aren't going to be a very good defense with both of them , someone's got to be able to cover TE's better than 76% completion rates.
It might make more sense to go with a 4-3 base defense, at that point. Look for a good WILL LB in free agency.
 

badboy

Hall of Fame
They need to find a LB that can cover. The defense will look alot better if they can find this LB. The 2 I liked in this last draft was Willie Gay (Went to the Chiefs darn) and Daveon Taylor in the 3rd (Eagles) Both are really athletic LB's which is what the Texans LB corps is missing. Maybe this is the yr that Cole will stay healthy and really help the team out.

They're hoping Blaclock can be the gamewrecking force in the middle that will make things easier to get pressure from the edges. I have hopes for Martin being the guy that provides pressure from the edge.
Hopefully Martin or Greenard will step up this season if Scarlett goes out again. I'm optimistic the depth is better on both sides of the ball.
 

badboy

Hall of Fame
It might make more sense to go with a 4-3 base defense, at that point. Look for a good WILL LB in free agency.
I may be crazy but if we traded for Ngayoue I see him at Will and Greenard screams middle linebacker to me with some time in NFL strengthening program. We need to trade BMac and Cunningham. I don't think that happens and Zach will get extension and we will continue without a covg LB. 3-4 is good with a NT like Reader or his predessor. Blacklock is Nose of the future for Houston but I expect Weaver's plan to have more 4+ on line.
 

Corrosion

Idealist
Staff member
It might make more sense to go with a 4-3 base defense, at that point. Look for a good WILL LB in free agency.

I don't see a 4-3 being a viable option with the personnel they have.

With either McKinney or Cunningham in the middle - you can't cover well enough.

You say go get a Will .... but you don't have a Sam either.

Mercilus as a 43 DE ? ugh.

That philosophical change has a lot of moving parts.
 

Corrosion

Idealist
Staff member
Mercilus should be out after 2020, regardless. No way is he worth that $12 million. Who knows if they'll be able to re-sign Cunningham. MLB is a 2 down position, and McKinney can hold that down. Greenard is probably a better fit as a 4-3 end. Easier to find 2 starting LBs than 3.

I don't see Mercilus getting the axe in the next two years as he has $27,200,000 in dead money for this season and $15,150,000 in dead money for 2021 , then $3.1m in 2022 and $1.55m in 2023.
They are committed to him financially for at least this year and next ... 2022 is the earliest I can see them going in another direction.


I don't know .... Seem's a whole lot simpler to me to just replace one of McKinney or Cunningham with a guy who can cover than making such a drastic change and changing the types of players needed when they don't really have them on the roster - up front as well as the Lbers.

You need 2 OLB's

Your DL consists of Watt (maybe) , Blacklock , Omenihu and potentially Greenard ? Dunn and Blackson ?
 

badboy

Hall of Fame
I don't see Mercilus getting the axe in the next two years as he has $27,200,000 in dead money for this season and $15,150,000 in dead money for 2021 , then $3.1m in 2022 and $1.55m in 2023.
They are committed to him financially for at least this year and next ... 2022 is the earliest I can see them going in another direction.


I don't know .... Seem's a whole lot simpler to me to just replace one of McKinney or Cunningham with a guy who can cover than making such a drastic change and changing the types of players needed when they don't really have them on the roster - up front as well as the Lbers.

You need 2 OLB's

Your DL consists of Watt (maybe) , Blacklock , Omenihu and potentially Greenard ? Dunn and Blackson ?
I agree and on top of that it seems Billy O. likes him some Merci which as with Nick Martin seemingly locks him in. Is it possible Jacob Martin cranks it up with more snaps and replaces Brennan Scarlett (Ohara)? In minimal playing time he had three sacks in 2018 and 3.5 2019. Jacob turns 25 YOA December 11th and could be one of those "future " guys who reaches their potential in his fourth NFL season and third in Houston.
 

badboy

Hall of Fame
Any thoughts on players on last season's roster who might be cut or traded? I still get info that Still will be traded. I don't see that with history of injuries on that corps. I Know that several teams need wide receivers.
 

steelbtexan

King of the W. B. Club
Contributor's Club
Any thoughts on players on last season's roster who might be cut or traded? I still get info that Still will be traded. I don't see that with history of injuries on that corps. I Know that several teams need wide receivers.
Wonder if we could NT for Stills. Or maybe a 3rd.
 

badboy

Hall of Fame
Wonder if we could NT for Stills. Or maybe a 3rd.
Just me but I would not trade him for either and prob not both. I believe Weaver is not going to use tradional Nose and that was one of reasons they did not keep Reader.
I need very high second and would have to think on it. As you know I was shopping Still in package for vets.

I think Obrien used his WRs to mollify Watson's loss of Hopkins.
 

steelbtexan

King of the W. B. Club
Contributor's Club
Just me but I would not trade him for either and prob not both. I believe Weaver is not going to use tradional Nose and that was one of reasons they did not keep Reader.
I need very high second and would have to think on it. As you know I was shopping Still in package for vets.

I think Obrien used his WRs to mollify Watson's loss of Hopkins.
I would do a trade for a really good run stuffing NT. I get what you're saying though. They're going to need depth at NT at some point next season.
 
I have to think some more moves will be made. I don't think it will be trading picks. With the covid roster limit in place I see the FO watching the wire of cuts. And then we will pick up someone and release another. Maybe a RB if David Johnson is legit healthy and looking good. Release Duke and sign a 3rd down guy who we didn't think we could get as an example. I just think more will happen with TC.
 

DocBar

Hall of Fame
Contributor's Club
I have to think some more moves will be made. I don't think it will be trading picks. With the covid roster limit in place I see the FO watching the wire of cuts. And then we will pick up someone and release another. Maybe a RB if David Johnson is legit healthy and looking good. Release Duke and sign a 3rd down guy who we didn't think we could get as an example. I just think more will happen with TC.
Why would you cut the RB with the most experience in the system to sign a player who's had 0 off season training? It's bad enough that Texans traded Hopkins for David "Injury Prone" Johnson AND have to eat Johnson's ridiculous salary, then they go and cut Hyde because he was asking for too much money after a career year. TBH, it's almost hilarious it's taking OB, the personel guy, to keep OB, the head football coach, from looking like the dumbest person in the building.
 

steelbtexan

King of the W. B. Club
Contributor's Club
Why would you cut the RB with the most experience in the system to sign a player who's had 0 off season training? It's bad enough that Texans traded Hopkins for David "Injury Prone" Johnson AND have to eat Johnson's ridiculous salary, then they go and cut Hyde because he was asking for too much money after a career year. TBH, it's almost hilarious it's taking OB, the personel guy, to keep OB, the head football coach, from looking like the dumbest person in the building.
While Hyde had a year that was better than expected, he can't catch a cold, which is the same reason Lil Shanny moved on from Hyde.
 
Why would you cut the RB with the most experience in the system to sign a player who's had 0 off season training? It's bad enough that Texans traded Hopkins for David "Injury Prone" Johnson AND have to eat Johnson's ridiculous salary, then they go and cut Hyde because he was asking for too much money after a career year. TBH, it's almost hilarious it's taking OB, the personel guy, to keep OB, the head football coach, from looking like the dumbest person in the building.
Do you know that David Johnson is not going to play well? Do you have an inside source? I also said it was an example. Case and point:
If David Johnson plays well in camp and looks amazing with no injury at all. Then why couldn't you make a trade with a player who is still good and not over 30? The answer, besides it was an example, is that you very well might.
 

badboy

Hall of Fame
Why would you cut the RB with the most experience in the system to sign a player who's had 0 off season training? It's bad enough that Texans traded Hopkins for David "Injury Prone" Johnson AND have to eat Johnson's ridiculous salary, then they go and cut Hyde because he was asking for too much money after a career year. TBH, it's almost hilarious it's taking OB, the personel guy, to keep OB, the head football coach, from looking like the dumbest person in the building.
Just to clarify, the Texas did not cut Carlos Hyde who was unrestricted free agent after the 2019 season.
 

DocBar

Hall of Fame
Contributor's Club
Do you know that David Johnson is not going to play well? Do you have an inside source? I also said it was an example. Case and point:
If David Johnson plays well in camp and looks amazing with no injury at all. Then why couldn't you make a trade with a player who is still good and not over 30? The answer, besides it was an example, is that you very well might.
What makes you think that Johnson may very well play well? History suggests otherwise.
 

Texansballer74

Hall of Fame
While Hyde had a year that was better than expected, he can't catch a cold, which is the same reason Lil Shanny moved on from Hyde.
[/QUOTE

In 2019 Hyde had 59 receptions, targeted 88 times for 350 yards. He rushed for 933 yards and had 8 touchdowns. He had 1070 yards and 6 touchdowns for us and we didn’t try to use him in the passing game. Yes he finally cracked the 1000 yards mark with us but people truly be pumping that up like it was great.
 
What makes you think that Johnson may very well play well? History suggests otherwise.
Once again, I didn't say he would or would not play well and go uninjured. I simply stated a senecio of a roster move at RB as an example. Nothing less or more. Other people have inserted comments and altering a plain example.
 

badboy

Hall of Fame
I find it interesting the Texans signed OT Jerald Hawkins;one of my sources speculated that Roderick Johnson could be on way out possibly as trade bait. Hmm... if RJ was worth more than a 6th, we should keep him. I had high hopes but he seemed to fizzle as season went on but I attributed that to not playing him 100% at right guard. I think he could play RT if allowed to play that position but moving him around didn't allow him to get settled anywhere. I think OBrien prefers a vet with minimal snaps over rookie Charlie Heck.
 

badboy

Hall of Fame
The additions of Hawkins and DT PJ Hall could be significant deprh as starters begin to wear down last quarter of season. Hopefully both can get their careers going. Biggest thing Hall had against him he was not chosen by Gruden. Texans could be perfect place to get in football shape, get some snaps and listen to other vets.

Hall not invited to combine was great at his pro day with 36 lifts at 225 pounds.i think with training he can be more than just a nose tackle which would greatly benefit him and team. Basically still a rookie he has been through the process in 2018 an 2019. I hope getting cut by Las Vegas after failed physical stopped trade to Vikings pumps him up as did no combine invite. If he doesn't come to the plate like a hungry dog, he will be put the door. Does he realize this? Quien sabe?
 

badboy

Hall of Fame
I don't care as long as he can cover a TE .... sign him up.
So if he gets into fight with Justin Reid, the rest of Texans want him off team and is reported to be cancer in Texans locker room, you still want him here? I love Thomas the player but he certainly is a distraction even if his girlfriend is not trying to shoot him for being in bed with other women. I just don't see Janice allowing that type player to be signed.
 

Corrosion

Idealist
Staff member
So if he gets into fight with Justin Reid, the rest of Texans want him off team and is reported to be cancer in Texans locker room, you still want him here? I love Thomas the player but he certainly is a distraction even if his girlfriend is not trying to shoot him for being in bed with other women. I just don't see Janice allowing that type player to be signed.

Sign him to a cheap incentive laden contract , if he causes any disruption you can walk away from it ....

This team needs someone that can cover a TE in a bad way. We know the LBers can't do it , better get someone who can.
 

Mangler

All Pro
So if he gets into fight with Justin Reid, the rest of Texans want him off team and is reported to be cancer in Texans locker room, you still want him here? I love Thomas the player but he certainly is a distraction even if his girlfriend is not trying to shoot him for being in bed with other women. I just don't see Janice allowing that type player to be signed.
My little brother and Earl Thomas’ little brother Seth go way back. (WOS Football) According to Seth, Earl is pretty much set on taking whatever offer the Cowboys give him. They are a Cowboy family. I would have liked him being our #1 safety here, but he does seem mentally unstable. Not saying I’m 100% certain he goes to Dallas, but Seth told my brother that Earl has been trying to go to Dallas since he was in Seattle. So, we shall see.
 

badboy

Hall of Fame
Sign him to a cheap incentive laden contract , if he causes any disruption you can walk away from it ....

This team needs someone that can cover a TE in a bad way. We know the LBers can't do it , better get someone who can.
Yeah as I said I love his play and while Janice may not permit him here and that's supposition on my part..the g'friend pulling gun on him is between them and police.
I am more concerned with teammates being against him. Players fight frequently so Clark situation doesn't bother me with the exception team leadership voted Thomas off the island.

I think some team will pay more even if Texans want him. He and Reid would be awesome and I would keep Murray. That would help our corners as well as the line.
Just don't see it.
 

badboy

Hall of Fame
My little brother and Earl Thomas’ little brother Seth go way back. (WOS Football) According to Seth, Earl is pretty much set on taking whatever offer the Cowboys give him. They are a Cowboy family. I would have liked him being our #1 safety here, but he does seem mentally unstable. Not saying I’m 100% certain he goes to Dallas, but Seth told my brother that Earl has been trying to go to Dallas since he was in Seattle. So, we shall see.
yeah it's a known fact that he wants to go to Dallas. That was one of the problems when he was with Seattle he kept voicing his desire to play for the Cowboys.
 

badboy

Hall of Fame
Well we can help him bid up Dallas. Help them use up that $15 million cap space. Remember under old CBA they used a lot of cap and were penalized? Another team did same but cannot remember which.
 

OptimisticTexan

6 Years- 1 Game and Counting!!!!
Gulp....I'm actually going to state this. For this season and this season only and b/c there's so many questions in regards to the defense.....I really wouldn't be horribly opposed to bringing in -both- Clowney and Thomas to help. Clowney on the DL helps with defending the run while offering help in regards to putting pressure on the QB while Thomas could do what no other player on the Texans appears to be capable of doing.....cover a TE. Reid and Thomas as Safeties could really help cover for the weaker CB's. I’d add that a strong defensive push could help the CB's look much better on the field than they do on paper.

It's a funky season for 2020 and adding a couple of guys like this could provide a big spark on this defense since both would be playing for their 2021 contracts. If OB is the players coach he appears to be....then he should be more than capable of getting the best out of both players.....aka Belichick. If they don't step up as team first players, then like Belichick he needs to swell up and show them the door with no remorse.

Texans have the cap to sign both guys to strong 1 year prove-it type of deals loaded with incentives. Would this be controversial.....yes, yes it would. Could the upside outweigh the downside.....yes, yes it could. Texans defense needs help and both players might cost nothing more than a possible one year deal.
 
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zshawn10

All Pro
From the latest Michael Lombardi podcast:

On Yannick Ngakoue: "Two teams that would love to have him, Houston and Indianapolis, are monitoring this thing very closely... But Jacksonville isn't going to trade him to those two [same division] teams right now.
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"I keep hearing [the Deshaun Watson extension] that's going to come before the beginning of the season, so we'll see."
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Titans interested, but not a the number Clowney wants which is at least $17M. He turned down more from Cleveland. Seahawks, Raiders also interested but Raiders interest is split between Gruden and Mayock (Gruden not). Clowney won't lower his price. "The longer this goes on he doesn't care because he doesn't practice anyway." ... "And if you can get his price down from 17, how do I know he's in shape? If he's coming in a week before the opening game?" ... "I would rather pay Ngakoue the $17M than Clowney because Clowney I think you're only going to get 5 or 6 games out of him."
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Logan Ryan wants $10M/year, as a safety or a star.
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On Earl Thomas: "Earl has off-the-field issues, Earl is not a happy man. No one wants to deal with Earl. Do you really want to go to work every day and deal with this?" ... "You can't be an asshole. It's one thing if you're great and you're an asshole, but at some point... asshole overtakes talent... You can't cure asshole... so you're going to have to get rid of him... Most of the time good teams don't want assholes on their teams."
 


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