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FIRE O'BRIEN NOW!!!

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badboy said:
I really want to believe in OBrien for head coach but he disappoints almost every single game. His win record will protect him at least into next season first quarter. We should have beaten Jets assertively. Even more of a concern is RAC in last couple games if not more with this allegedly great defense looking lost too many times. If we look away from JJ I'm confused at many of the plays called.
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JJ and JD have been almost there. Lots of plays. The steps have been lost. The secondary has been the Achilles Heel. Which came first. the injuries or the 8 yd.cushions on 3rd and 4? The Texans seem to be expecting too much from Merci. He's a pass rusher. Put him, JJ and JD wherever and let them rush the passer. Let the rest cover.
 
DocBar said:
JJ and JD have been almost there. Lots of plays. The steps have been lost. The secondary has been the Achilles Heel. Which came first. the injuries or the 8 yd.cushions on 3rd and 4? The Texans seem to be expecting too much from Merci. He's a pass rusher. Put him, JJ and JD wherever and let them rush the passer. Let the rest cover.[/QU

Agree we need a cover OLB but do not see that happening even next season.
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Jadmakaveli said:
BoB is a really good HC. Is he a good OC? Nah B that ain’t it. But he’s not gonna let someone come in and call plays because they probably won’t be able to see what he sees.
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That's where I would say that he's not a good head coach, because a good head coach knows when to let go of the reins, as he's already surrounded himself with a capable supporting cast.

That doesn't mean that O'Brian can't be a good head coach, even a great one, yet his progression is slow if that's his trajectory. He really hamstrung himself those first three years. That's on him and whatever Rick Smith brought to the table.

Now, we are into his second batch of three years (I break a coaching tenure into three-year chunks). After this year, if he hasn't learned enough to get an OC, yeah, I'll be manic for his head on the chopping block. Indeed, I'm almost ready for him to go, this very minute, as those first three years are still playing out today.

In other words, with an OC, it's still going to take a miracle for me to put my trust in him, short of him leading us to a Super Bowl this year, or the next. Coming close is not good enough by year 6.
 
thunderkyss said:
Before Kubiak we had this same discussion. We'd have 3 of 5 brand new OLmen every year, but still couldn't protect our QB.

Same QB in 2006. Same 3 new OL. New HC/OC & we're among the least sacked teams.

I hope you're right. But this guy had been given three 2nd rounders & a viable starting center (Mancz) & the problem is as bad as I've ever seen it.

In the past the problem was compounded by lanky uncoordinated baby giraffes or geriatric one more for the Gipper types .

This year he has a dynamic, young, accurate gamer... & it's worse.

Sorry, but we could draft the two best OL in the upcoming draft, sign two of the best FA OLmen this offseason & I think we'll still have the same problem.

Woosaaaaa
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Well then you dont believe in a combination of talent and coaching making a difference. A dream draft for me would be Cajuste and I would let Davenport and Cajuste compete at LT and add a LT that can start at RT like Dillard. That would create competition and I will bet you that regardless of who's starting the offense will look better.

They still need to add a CB or 2 and a WR with speed in the draft/FA. I think they can do this if next yrs draft is as good as last yrs draft.
 
EVOLVIST said:
That's where I would say that he's not a good head coach, because a good head coach knows when to let go of the reins, as he's already surrounded himself with a capable supporting cast.

That doesn't mean that O'Brian can't be a good head coach, even a great one, yet his progression is slow if that's his trajectory. He really hamstrung himself those first three years. That's on him and whatever Rick Smith brought to the table.

Now, we are into his second batch of three years (I break a coaching tenure into three-year chunks). After this year, if he hasn't learned enough to get an OC, yeah, I'll be manic for his head on the chopping block. Indeed, I'm almost ready for him to go, this very minute, as those first three years are still playing out today.

In other words, with an OC, it's still going to take a miracle for me to put my trust in him, short of him leading us to a Super Bowl this year, or the next. Coming close is not good enough by year 6.
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Well you're not asking for much are you. All he has to do is do what 31 other teams, many of which with better rosters and yes better coaches, are doing everything in their power to do. Geeze I know this is football and not baseball but did none of you remember that the Astro's PLANNED on a 6 year or so losing streak in order to get in position to win the world series. Around here though if you haven't delivered a ring within 6 years, even though this team has only existed for 16 years, you are out of here.

I mean there are a lot of things you can say about BoB that I would agree with, he tries to wear to many hats, one of those hats, OC, he really shouldn't wear anyway, he hasn't really proven his rep as a QB whisperer, he needs to learn how to challenge better and when to call time outs better, he is obsessed with running Miller up the middle, his chin makes him look like he has a miniature butt on his face, but thinking any coach can take a team that the only thing it has going for it is a good defense, and even then really more like a one man wrecking crew in JJ Watt, and win a superbowl in just a couple of years with it is.....shall we say unrealistic.
 
maverick512000 said:
Around here though if you haven't delivered a ring within 6 years, even though this team has only existed for 16 years, you are out of here.
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Try 58 years for this city and pro football. 38 for me, personally. A franchise is a long saga, not just a tenure, or a roster change or two. If winning a Super Bowl is the goal every year, then what, pray tell, should O'Brian's high water mark be? Winning a Super Bowl or occupying an office until the next sap walks in?
 
bigmck said:
Yes, that was a first down, he rolled on the players. = That was a weird to say the least TO call. = All of you realize that BOB is going to be with us for a few years. We better get used to him.
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The offense was trying to get the play off quickly and catch our defense off guard. BoB called the time out to prevent that. The play failed which contributed to making BoB looked bad on that call, but if it had worked, they converted and BoB didn't make the call, everyone would be complaining that he should have called a time out there.
 
EVOLVIST said:
Try 58 years for this city and pro football. 38 for me, personally. A franchise is a long saga, not just a tenure, or a roster change or two. If winning a Super Bowl is the goal every year, then what, pray tell, should O'Brian's high water mark be? Winning a Super Bowl or occupying an office until the next sap walks in?
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Yes, but the Texans have only been part of 16 of those years.
 
Texas Jake said:
The offense was trying to get the play off quickly and catch our defense off guard. BoB called the time out to prevent that. The play failed which contributed to making BoB looked bad on that call, but if it had worked, they converted and BoB didn't make the call, everyone would be complaining that he should have called a time out there.
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Exactly... OB is so dumb
 
Texas Jake said:
The offense was trying to get the play off quickly and catch our defense off guard. BoB called the time out to prevent that. The play failed which contributed to making BoB looked bad on that call, but if it had worked, they converted and BoB didn't make the call, everyone would be complaining that he should have called a time out there.
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Exactly,

A lose/lose proposition with the mob on here.

I'm glad he called a TO. It was obvious the defense wasn't lined up correctly. Calling a TO could've possible saved a TD since the Jets were throwing the ball on 4th and 1.

BTW, whose fault was it the defense wasn't lined up properly? I guess it was BOB's fault since he's the HC.
 
Texazan said:
I was one of those wondering WTH when the TO happened because at the time I was watching the offense. If you rewound it and watched the D we were in trouble so I sat down my ass back down and shut up in my living room.
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Me too.
 
EVOLVIST said:
Try 58 years for this city and pro football. 38 for me, personally. A franchise is a long saga, not just a tenure, or a roster change or two. If winning a Super Bowl is the goal every year, then what, pray tell, should O'Brian's high water mark be? Winning a Super Bowl or occupying an office until the next sap walks in?
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Yeah one problem with that, this isn't the same franchise. Different owner, different team, different GM, different coach hell even a different stadium. The only thing that the Texans and the Oilers have in common is that both are Houston football teams and I guess, technically, both have red, white and blue uniforms. So yeah if you are really wanting to follow the "franchise" then the Titans forums are that way.

Also yes, winning the superbowl is the goal every year but guess what only one team/coach can do it each year and sometimes your team roster makes that an unrealistic goal. By your way of thinking every year 31 out of 32 teams should be considering replacing their head coach. I'm not defending BoB, I think he got a free pass on the problems this team has had roster wise and that he had more to do with Osweiler and the rest of the QB carousel then he got blamed for.

I do, however, think that now that we actually have a QB worth mentioning, Nuk locked in for several years, a good D if not a great one and a GM that seems to be addressing our needs best he can, this would be a really bad time to replace the HC and start over again. Unless Belichick or Payton would come knocking on our door then hell yeah lets replace the HC, beyond that then I'm not ready to change horses mid-stream. If the O line gets fixed, or at least greatly improved, this draft/FA and we still have the same issues next season then yes I agree its time to start putting feelers out for a new HC. Not saying it has to be a SB win but also not having other teams hoping they play us in the playoffs because its basically a bye week for them.
 
JB said:
But same city... the pain is real for us old folks
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Better than the pain of not having a team at all which was a very real thing. Me, I want nothing to do with the Oilers or their franchise and legacy, Bud Adams was threatening to move the team since the 80s and then, while we were still recovering from the oil bust, he threw a temper tantrum because he didn't get his shiny, new stadium. Then when he moved it he basically just gave the finger to all the old fans and said he didn't care what they wanted or thought. So for me, F the oilers and F their legacy, the only legacy I care about or want to remember started in 2002.
 
maverick512000 said:
Better than the pain of not having a team at all which was a very real thing. Me, I want nothing to do with the Oilers or their franchise and legacy, Bud Adams was threatening to move the team since the 80s and then, while we were still recovering from the oil bust, he threw a temper tantrum because he didn't get his shiny, new stadium. Then when he moved it he basically just gave the finger to all the old fans and said he didn't care what they wanted or thought. So for me, F the oilers and F their legacy, the only legacy I care about or want to remember started in 2002.
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yeah I get ya, but that lengthy diatribe has nothing to do with my comment
 
JB said:
yeah I get ya, but that lengthy diatribe has nothing to do with my comment
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Maybe not but at the same time you talk about the pain of not having a SB win which I get, I really do, but to me that is nothing compared to the pain of watching the city lose its team and then watching the owner that moved it give the finger to that same city. Championships come in time, I mean look at the Astros for God's sake, but only if your city has a team, lose the team and you are never getting a championship for the city no matter how much time passes.
 
maverick512000 said:
Maybe not but at the same time you talk about the pain of not having a SB win which I get, I really do, but to me that is nothing compared to the pain of watching the city lose its team and then watching the owner that moved it give the finger to that same city. Championships come in time, I mean look at the Astros for God's sake, but only if your city has a team, lose the team and you are never getting a championship for the city no matter how much time passes.
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But we have a team... youre stuck on the Oilers like they are a current event instead of the history of suckitude sports fans of this city have endured
 
There's no balanced rationale disccussion with some in here. Witness the :uprights:

0-3 start.... "the coaching sux that's why they're not winning" - reeled off 9 straight, o-line has geled and improved, team is playing hard for BoB

then we heard all these during the 9 game win streak... - Odds of them making the playoffs after 0-3, 2% and unlikely...fire BoB - going to the playoffs
- they suck in the red zone :spit:...............like that's some predictor of anything...for perspective, currently NE =16th, LA Rams are 19th and Arizona is 6th...Nevertheless, the team improved tremendously from where they were at the start of the season.

-they haven't played anybody with a winning record/they've been lucky the other teams have made mistakes/ the division sux Currently, only 2 teams they've played thus far have been eliminated from the playoffs, most of them are .500 or better & we are likely going to win one of the more tougher divisions in the league.

- they can't score more than 20 pts - 3 out of the last 4 games they've put up nearly 30 pts.


Those who want to find fault in something will....that's essentially what this thread has turned into. Doesn't matter at all what the team or HC does...







 
JB said:
But we have a team... youre stuck on the Oilers like they are a current event instead of the history of suckitude sports fans of this city have endured
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No I'm not, I was replying to others talking about the 50+ years of football in Houston without a SB. My point is and was, with an admittedly slight detour on how little I care about the Oilers, that you can't judge any part of the Texans, from the owner down, based on when the Oilers were here. To be fair you have to look at it from the point of view that Houston has only had a team from 2002 on. Now if people want to point out the many screw up that have happen from that point on then its totally fair game.
 
maverick512000 said:
No I'm not, I was replying to others talking about the 50+ years of football in Houston without a SB. My point is and was, with an admittedly slight detour on how little I care about the Oilers, that you can't judge any part of the Texans, from the owner down, based on when the Oilers were here. To be fair you have to look at it from the point of view that Houston has only had a team from 2002 on. Now if people want to point out the many screw up that have happen from that point on then its totally fair game.
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You can ignore the history if you want, but those of us that have been Houston pro football teams since the '60's lived through all that. I don't know how old you are but Oilers ARE part of Houston history, deny it all you want.

Nobody is judging the Texans based on the Oilers history. And at least the Oilers won two league championships that are also part of that history
 
Mr teX said:
There's no balanced rationale disccussion with some in here. Witness the :uprights:

0-3 start.... "the coaching sux that's why they're not winning" - reeled off 9 straight, o-line has geled and improved, team is playing hard for BoB

then we heard all these during the 9 game win streak... - Odds of them making the playoffs after 0-3, 2% and unlikely...fire BoB - going to the playoffs
- they suck in the red zone :spit:...............like that's some predictor of anything...for perspective, currently NE =16th, LA Rams are 19th and Arizona is 6th...Nevertheless, the team improved tremendously from where they were at the start of the season.

-they haven't played anybody with a winning record/they've been lucky the other teams have made mistakes/ the division sux Currently, only 2 teams they've played thus far have been eliminated from the playoffs, most of them are .500 or better & we are likely going to win one of the more tougher divisions in the league.

- they can't score more than 20 pts - 3 out of the last 4 games they've put up nearly 30 pts.


Those who want to find fault in something will....that's essentially what this thread has turned into. Doesn't matter at all what the team or HC does...
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And in that same vein some will find absolutely nothing wrong, when at times there are things that go wrong and get attributed to a need for further development or some other flimsy anecdotal opinion. FIRE BILL OBRIEN topic can be put to bed after this year that I can firmly believe due to record alone.

Offensive cohesion, play design, tendency, plenty of things that are definitely up for debate. This cant be a "Bill Does Nothing Wrong" discussion either. Emotions just keep people too far on either side of the argument and nothing is ever really debated with any civility. Guys who cant deal with stats will cry about the eye test or some other intangible, and then the guys who are being logical or empirical dont know anything about the sport? Grasping onto other teams or players in order to excuse the same deficiencies within your own doesnt strike me as very objective either, only fueling the Excuse Brigade rhetoric.

You can state how the teams they've played are good, which in fact they have turned out to be, but then when games like the Giants game, or the Patriots 'not my job' game turn into 'every coach does that' moments? So then OBrien is basically infallible and thats where I myself get turned off. Guys go out of their ways to make an excuse for OBrien even when he makes decisions that make you scratch your head. How many times have people said "Its not Bills fault that the defense sucks"? Sadly plenty of defenses have caused a head coach to get fired, so maybe he should fire RAC? Sacrifice a name to the Football Gods and extend his career a few more years. Haunting.

2 seed is within grasp, hell maybe even the 1 depending on what could happen. Getting one of those two spots would do plenty to temper some hostility, hopefully nothing goes bad, but if it did I would expect that OBrien supporters would try to say it was a multitude of other issues before admitting OBrien ever made any mistakes. I understand defending him against personal preference attacks, but some of the stuff is just indefensible at times.

Where's Thanos when you need him to bring some balance to this conversation? LOL
 
Hard to read tone inflection and body language on a MB. Just because someone doesn't use the words you use doesn't mean complete disagreement. Many times while I recognize OB's many flaws, I can't agree with many posts that blame him for the sun rising while ignoring that players A&B forgot their sunglasses

yeah, I'm working on my drumk
 
EVOLVIST said:
Try 58 years for this city and pro football. 38 for me, personally. A franchise is a long saga, not just a tenure, or a roster change or two. If winning a Super Bowl is the goal every year, then what, pray tell, should O'Brian's high water mark be? Winning a Super Bowl or occupying an office until the next sap walks in?
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Our teams do indeed go to the Super Bowl, they just move out of town first.
 
Uncle Rico said:
And in that same vein some will find absolutely nothing wrong, when at times there are things that go wrong and get attributed to a need for further development or some other flimsy anecdotal opinion. FIRE BILL OBRIEN topic can be put to bed after this year that I can firmly believe due to record alone.

Offensive cohesion, play design, tendency, plenty of things that are definitely up for debate. This cant be a "Bill Does Nothing Wrong" discussion either. Emotions just keep people too far on either side of the argument and nothing is ever really debated with any civility. Guys who cant deal with stats will cry about the eye test or some other intangible, and then the guys who are being logical or empirical dont know anything about the sport? Grasping onto other teams or players in order to excuse the same deficiencies within your own doesnt strike me as very objective either, only fueling the Excuse Brigade rhetoric.

You can state how the teams they've played are good, which in fact they have turned out to be, but then when games like the Giants game, or the Patriots 'not my job' game turn into 'every coach does that' moments? So then OBrien is basically infallible and thats where I myself get turned off. Guys go out of their ways to make an excuse for OBrien even when he makes decisions that make you scratch your head. How many times have people said "Its not Bills fault that the defense sucks"? Sadly plenty of defenses have caused a head coach to get fired, so maybe he should fire RAC? Sacrifice a name to the Football Gods and extend his career a few more years. Haunting.

2 seed is within grasp, hell maybe even the 1 depending on what could happen. Getting one of those two spots would do plenty to temper some hostility, hopefully nothing goes bad, but if it did I would expect that OBrien supporters would try to say it was a multitude of other issues before admitting OBrien ever made any mistakes. I understand defending him against personal preference attacks, but some of the stuff is just indefensible at times.

Where's Thanos when you need him to bring some balance to this conversation? LOL
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Every team lays stinkers at some point in the season...to blast the team and BoB by extension b/c they laid a few eggs at the beginning on the season is sort of ridiculous imo...especially when certain posters in here blast the offense for any little **** up...& then turn around & make excuses for the other side of the ball even when the **** up huge. The games you’re speaking of at the beginning of the season, offense nor defense was playing worth a lick...but all we heard about on here though was the offense.

BoB isn’t perfect, but he’s not Rich Kotite either. Hell I was just on the chiefs website reading their version of this thread for Andy Reid.... a thread thats been going for at least 2 years. This is a team with the number overall seed! What I’m trying to say here is fans are going to complain no matter what and I understand that. ...we’re all armchair GM/HC anyway. Where I sorta lose my **** on here and in my car when I’m listening to the radio is folks complaining and blame dude for things clearly not on him...or things that clearly require more info...like I’ve said in other posts, we don’t know what he and Watson are seeing..until they tell us. We watch games from the comforts of our home with an aerial view of the field....with a former player in our ear telling us what they think was supposed to happen. Coaches on the sideline don’t have that luxury..hence the “I gotta go back and look at the tape” comments and why every post game presser 20 min after a game is just stupid.
 
Texans PR‏Verified account@TexansPR


HC Bill O’Brien has led the #Texans to winning seasons in 4 of his first 5 years. Prior to his tenure, the Texans had only 3 winning seasons in team history. Of current NFL HCs, only Mike Tomlin and John Harbaugh (5 each) have more winning seasons in their first 5 years as a HC.

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Gary Kubiak gift basket is in the mail LOL .. im kidding im kidding (kinda)

I heard this discussion on the radio this morning John and Lance I think ... and they posed this question: How many years have the Texans actually played good football? You can dissect the 9-7 years while technically 'winners' had some turmoil within the division/team and somebody had to win those years .. the starting talent level etc...

You cant argue with facts, and the facts state that Bill OBrien was an average coach prior to this years outlier (and hopefully continued) results. This season puts him squarely on the coaching map for me (even though the talk show continued to talk about how one GM would have been willing to TRADE for OBrien last year when talks about a 'hot seat' started)

OBriens moment(s) are near..
 
thunderkyss said:
I've seen coaches recount individual plays point by point right after the game. Very impressive.
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Yeah I’m sure every coach can do that to some degree depending on the importance of the play in the scope of the game, but when you’ve got some jackass from the media asking you “what happened on this play yada yada yada..”..your asking them to diagnosis something..for which many times they haven’t yet had time to even see just what might’ve gone wrong.

The other thing is, you’re catching these guys 20 min after an emotionally charged event. These guys are exhausted mentally and physically and don’t want to talk most times. So when a swarmy jackass from the media asks a question based on what he thinks happened....or is trying to lead the player or coach down a road in which he doesn’t want to go with a dumb question, all you’re doing is poking the bear there. That’s why I’ve never understood how these media types have the gall to go on their radio shows and podcasts and blast players and coaches for giving them **** responses to dumb ass questions.....or give them no responses at all.
 
Mr teX said:
Yeah I’m sure every coach can do that to some degree depending on the importance of the play in the scope of the game, but when you’ve got some jackass from the media asking you “what happened on this play yada yada yada..”..your asking them to diagnosis something..for which many times they haven’t yet had time to even see just what might’ve gone wrong.

The other thing is, you’re catching these guys 20 min after an emotionally charged event. These guys are exhausted mentally and physically and don’t want to talk most times. So when a swarmy jackass from the media asks a question based on what he thinks happened....or is trying to lead the player or coach down a road in which he doesn’t want to go with a dumb question, all you’re doing is poking the bear there. That’s why I’ve never understood how these media types have the gall to go on their radio shows and podcasts and blast players and coaches for giving them **** responses to dumb ass questions.....or give them no responses at all.
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Thats why I like Nuk's recent pressers

"What happened on your 2 touchdown catches today"

Nuk "Well Deshaun threw the ball, and I caught the ball"
 
Shishkabob said:
Thats why I like Nuk's recent pressers

"What happened on your 2 touchdown catches today"

Nuk "Well Deshaun threw the ball, and I caught the ball"
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Exactly it’s like, you saw the damn play, what the hell u mean what happened? He threw it, I caught it...There wasnt any controversy about it..lol.
 
The offense didn't nearly put up 30 points in 3 of the last 4 games when you take out defensive TDs.

I still don't think OBrien is a good OC. Still ranked 21st in offense by dvoa.
 
NitroGSXR said:
At the end of the day... the final score is all that matters. I’m grateful that we have a balanced team where one side can help the opposite.
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If anyone heard Brees after last nights game he basically said the same thing. If the players are saying it then I’ll roll with their opinion that’s from NFL experience. It’s not always going to pretty ....hell it may not be pretty for 9 games but it’s a W, Take it, move on and do better
 
NitroGSXR said:
At the end of the day... the final score is all that matters. I’m grateful that we have a balanced team where one side can help the opposite.
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I think at the end of the day the Texans are trying to win a super bowl. It isn't really a balanced team, it's a defensive team that can make clutch offensive comebacks as we saw against the Jets and in many close victories. But I'd still like to have an OC who can build a top 10 offense, or at least top 15.

The Texans could win a super bowl this year, but I think the odds are stacked against them until the OL and overall offense improves.
 
Bill O'Brien is not trying to show the league his hands. Maybe that's why he hasn't open up the playbook like he did in those 6 games from last season. He has shown a few glimpses of those type of explosive plays throughout each game. Injuries, players coming back from injuries (mainly Watson) could be another reason why he hasn't fully open that thing up. Come playoffs I believe he will.
 
Uncle Rico said:
Gary Kubiak gift basket is in the mail LOL .. im kidding im kidding (kinda)

I heard this discussion on the radio this morning John and Lance I think ... and they posed this question: How many years have the Texans actually played good football? You can dissect the 9-7 years while technically 'winners' had some turmoil within the division/team and somebody had to win those years .. the starting talent level etc...

You cant argue with facts, and the facts state that Bill OBrien was an average coach prior to this years outlier (and hopefully continued) results. This season puts him squarely on the coaching map for me (even though the talk show continued to talk about how one GM would have been willing to TRADE for OBrien last year when talks about a 'hot seat' started)

OBriens moment(s) are near..
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4 out of 5 winning yrs with Ricky at GM is simply amazing. Do you think it's a coincidence that Ricky's gone and the Texans will probably win 11 games without having 1st/2nd rd draft picks?

One thing I know for sure is if the Texans win a SB within the next 2 yrs Smith will be taking credit for it and some on this MB will be giving it to him.
 
Texansballer74 said:
Bill O'Brien is not trying to show the league his hands. Maybe that's why he hasn't open up the playbook like he did in those 6 games from last season. He has shown a few glimpses of those type of explosive plays throughout each game. Injuries, players coming back from injuries (mainly Watson) could be another reason why he hasn't fully open that thing up. Come playoffs I believe he will.
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Hopefully
 
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