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FIRE O'BRIEN NOW!!!

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steelbtexan said:
Chiefs OL

1st Fisher 1st Erving 2nd Morse 6th Laurent TD Schwartz 2nd

Rams OL

Witworth FA 2nd Saffold 2nd FA 6th Sullivan 7th Blythe 2nd Havenstein

They invested two 2nd rd picks and 2 FA's they hit on late rd pick Blythe

I would say these teams heavily invested in protecting their QB's.
Click to expand...

Come on man... you're really stretching the definition of "heavily investing". Teams like the Cowboys & Titans heavily invested. Chiefs & Rams moderately invested.

Chiefs
Fisher - 1st rounder
Erving - drafted as a 1st rounder, but acquired by Chiefs for a 5th round pick
Morse - 2nd round
Laurent - 6th round pick
Schwartz - 2nd rounder by Browns, signed by Chiefs as FA for similar money to Zach Fulton

The Chiefs only highly invested in two guys, unless you consider Zach Fulton a heavy investment?

Rams
Whitworth - signed as a 35yo FA (13th highest paid OT)
Saffold - 2nd rounder
Sullivan - journeyman 6th round pick by Vikings, whom they eventually cut
Blythe - 7th rounder by Colts, which Rams picked up off waivers
Havenstein - 2nd rounder

The Rams don't have a 1st rounder in the group, plus two journeymen.

I can play this game too and make it sound like the Texans heavily invested in their OL last season to protect their rookie QB. The Texans last season (projected opening day)
Brown - 1st rounder
XSF - 2nd rounder
Martin - 2nd rounder
Allen - 2nd rounder (by Chiefs)
Clark - via trade
 
dream_team said:
Come on man... you're really stretching the definition of "heavily investing". Teams like the Cowboys & Titans heavily invested. Chiefs & Rams moderately invested.

Chiefs
Fisher - 1st rounder
Erving - drafted as a 1st rounder, but acquired by Chiefs for a 5th round pick
Morse - 2nd round
Laurent - 6th round pick
Schwartz - 2nd rounder by Browns, signed by Chiefs as FA for similar money to Zach Fulton

The Chiefs only highly invested in two guys, unless you consider Zach Fulton a heavy investment?

Rams
Whitworth - signed as a 35yo FA (13th highest paid OT)
Saffold - 2nd rounder
Sullivan - journeyman 6th round pick by Vikings, whom they eventually cut
Blythe - 7th rounder by Colts, which Rams picked up off waivers
Havenstein - 2nd rounder

The Rams don't have a 1st rounder in the group, plus two journeymen.

I can play this game too and make it sound like the Texans heavily invested in their OL last season to protect their rookie QB. The Texans last season (projected opening day)
Brown - 1st rounder
XSF - 2nd rounder
Martin - 2nd rounder
Allen - 2nd rounder (by Chiefs)
Clark - via trade
Click to expand...

The point is the Rams went out and in 1 offseason fixed their OL by investing in 2 proven FA OL and drafted their RT in one offseason.

It's true though the Texans were terrible at picking in the draft and FA. Putrid. Hopefully that changes under Gaine.
 
dream_team said:
Come on man... you're really stretching the definition of "heavily investing". Teams like the Cowboys & Titans heavily invested. Chiefs & Rams moderately invested.

Chiefs
Fisher - 1st rounder
Erving - drafted as a 1st rounder, but acquired by Chiefs for a 5th round pick
Morse - 2nd round
Laurent - 6th round pick
Schwartz - 2nd rounder by Browns, signed by Chiefs as FA for similar money to Zach Fulton

The Chiefs only highly invested in two guys, unless you consider Zach Fulton a heavy investment?

Rams
Whitworth - signed as a 35yo FA (13th highest paid OT)
Saffold - 2nd rounder
Sullivan - journeyman 6th round pick by Vikings, whom they eventually cut
Blythe - 7th rounder by Colts, which Rams picked up off waivers
Havenstein - 2nd rounder

The Rams don't have a 1st rounder in the group, plus two journeymen.

I can play this game too and make it sound like the Texans heavily invested in their OL last season to protect their rookie QB. The Texans last season (projected opening day)
Brown - 1st rounder
XSF - 2nd rounder
Martin - 2nd rounder
Allen - 2nd rounder (by Chiefs)
Clark - via trade
Click to expand...


You're wasting your time. He won't ever view the Texans like he does other teams.
 
steelbtexan said:
The point is the Rams went out and in 1 offseason fixed their OL by investing in 2 proven FA OL and drafted their RT in one offseason.

It's true though the Texans were terrible at picking in the draft and FA. Putrid. Hopefully that changes under Gaine.
Click to expand...

Well if your point is an OL can be fixed in one season, then you have to ask Gaine why he was unable to do just that? He did make 3 FA acquisitions, drafted one in the 3rd, and apparently offered Solder to be the highest paid lineman in the league... so he did give an effort, just not a very good one?

Havenstein was drafted in 2015 btw, while the FA acquisitions I believe you are referring to was 2017. Please correct if I'm wrong.
 
dream_team said:
Well if your point is an OL can be fixed in one season, then you have to ask Gaine why he was unable to do just that? He did make 3 FA acquisitions, drafted one in the 3rd, and apparently offered Solder to be the highest paid lineman in the league... so he did give an effort, just not a very good one?

Havenstein was drafted in 2015 btw, while the FA acquisitions I believe you are referring to was 2017. Please correct if I'm wrong.
Click to expand...

It was pretty hard to fix the OL in an avg yr for OL with no 1st or 2nd rd pick and having huge holes at the S/TE positions.

You're correct about Havenstein.

Let's give Gaine a full compliment of draft picks and see how he does. I'm confident he will do well. You?
 
Shishkabob said:
lol I just gave you 3 different sources that all ranked the Saints line in the top 10 last year, your father in laws opinion holds zero weight for me, or probably any one else for that matter. A line is not about individuals its about the sum of it's part. Clearly you don't realize this
Click to expand...


Lol and I guess you missed the part where I've said its basically the scheme, play calling and Drew HOF Breezy that has covered up a lot of deficiencies. Stats are not the be all.

Last season when we were leading the lead in points per game. Was it because the oline was dynamite or was it the QB factor?
 
steelbtexan said:
Let's give Gaine a full compliment of draft picks and see how he does. I'm confident he will do well. You?
Click to expand...

I did like this past season's draft, so I am optimistic on Gaine. I'm a patient fan, so of course I'm willing to give him & BOB another year. I'm not one of those fans that feels we should have won a Super Bowl by now.
 
JB said:
geez, there is some really blind homerisms going on in this thread
Click to expand...

Yep,

I guess some believe the Texans are going to win a SB this yr. They are really giving Gaine/BOB the same amount of time that they gave Ricky/Kubiak.

Crazy isn't it.

BTW, If they cant see the differences in draft/$$$$ in FA spent on the OL then I dont know what to tell them. These are the same people that think Davenport is or will become a good LT or it's the coaches fault. Of course they also think Os would've been good with better coaching. Nevermind the fact that he's on his 3rd team since leaving the Texans and still sucks. This just in sometimes players suck no matter who's coaching them.
 
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steelbtexan said:
Yep,

I guess some believe the Texans are going to win a SB this yr. They are really giving Gaine/BOB the same amount of time that they gave Ricky/Kubiak.

Crazy isn't it.

BTW, If they cant see the differences in draft/$$$$ in FA spent on the OL then I don't know what to tell them. These are the same people that think Davenport is or will become a good LT or it's the coaches fault. Of course they also think Os would've been good with better coaching. Never mind the fact that he's on his 3rd team since leaving the Texans and still sucks. This just in sometimes players suck no matter who's coaching them.
Click to expand...
Os hasn't exactly sucked since he got starts in Miami. He does show some of the same issues that plagued him while he was with our Texans but I think he has been average overall while starting for the Dolphins. He sucked while he was with our Texans. Miami is one of those teams that have been lousy all the way around for a long time.

BO'b has to take some blame for all the Qb failures. Still, our team has been resilient and overcame obstacles a lot of other teams may not have overcome and that is in large part due to BO'b. As of now BO'b fits DW4 and he has done a remarkable job at least holding our team together through a lot of adversity. I in no way at this time think BO'b should be fired.
 
Texansballer74 said:
Lol and I guess you missed the part where I've said its basically the scheme, play calling and Drew HOF Breezy that has covered up a lot of deficiencies. Stats are not the be all.

Last season when we were leading the lead in points per game. Was it because the oline was dynamite or was it the QB factor?
Click to expand...

So why were they so dominate in the run game last season? Again they were a top 10 line last season by multiple metrics, not my fault you are to ignorant to see that. Brees was sacked 23 times which ranked 25th in the NFL(better to be lower than higher in this ranking), Brees had a pressure rate of 21.5% lowest in the NFL last year. I don't care about scheme, or how quickly you get the ball out, if your Oline is bad, like you said they were you don't hit those numbers. Like sorry your father in law doesn't no a good line from his own ass, but the Saints had a damn good oline last year.
 
steelbtexan said:
Chiefs OL

1st Fisher 1st Erving 2nd Morse 6th Laurent TD Schwartz 2nd

Rams OL

Witworth FA 2nd Saffold 2nd FA 6th Sullivan 7th Blythe 2nd Havenstein

They invested two 2nd rd picks and 2 FA's they hit on late rd pick Blythe

I would say these teams heavily invested in protecting their QB's.
Click to expand...

There was a point last year where the Texans had three second rounders and one first rounder penciled in on their starting OL. Three were drafted. One was a FA.

The question has never been about did the Texans invest. It has been did they invest correctly.
 
TxnsJuggernaut said:
Os hasn't exactly sucked since he got starts in Miami. He does show some of the same issues that plagued him while he was with our Texans but I think he has been average overall while starting for the Dolphins. He sucked while he was with our Texans. Miami is one of those teams that have been lousy all the way around for a long time.

BO'b has to take some blame for all the Qb failures. Still, our team has been resilient and overcame obstacles a lot of other teams may not have overcome and that is in large part due to BO'b. As of now BO'b fits DW4 and he has done a remarkable job at least holding our team together through a lot of adversity. I in no way at this time think BO'b should be fired.
Click to expand...

Os had a couple of good games throwing short passes with his feet set. All you have to do to throw Os off is make him move his feet and he loses accuracy. I guess you also have to give Cleveland/Denver/Miami some blame too.
 
sandman said:
There was a point last year where the Texans had three second rounders and one first rounder penciled in on their starting OL. Three were drafted. One was a FA.

The question has never been about did the Texans invest. It has been did they invest correctly.
Click to expand...

For what, like 2 games?

I guess that's why Ricky isn't here anymore.
 
steelbtexan said:
For what, like 2 games?

I guess that's why Ricky isn't here anymore.
Click to expand...

I'm saying that you continue to have a conversation around what they didn't do, when they actually did.

Last year they expected their line to be Brown-X-Martin-Allen in four of their five positions. That is a 1st Rounder and three 2nd Rounders.

I'm all for having a conversation about how their decisions worked out, because the results haven't been good.

But to say the Texans didn't invest high draft pics and go after FA's that were high draft pics simply isn't factual, and it would be great if we could finally move on from that false narrative. Because the conversations around not doing anything and executing poorly are completely different.
 
sandman said:
I'm saying that you continue to have a conversation around what they didn't do, when they actually did.

Last year they expected their line to be Brown-X-Martin-Allen in four of their five positions. That is a 1st Rounder and three 2nd Rounders.

I'm all for having a conversation about how their decisions worked out, because the results haven't been good.

But to say the Texans didn't invest high draft pics and go after FA's that were high draft pics simply isn't factual, and it would be great if we could finally move on from that false narrative. Because the conversations around not doing anything and executing poorly are completely different.
Click to expand...

What do they have starting on their OL this yr if you want to leave the past in the past and talk about the future?
 
steelbtexan said:
What do they have starting on their OL this yr if you want to leave the past in the past and talk about the future?
Click to expand...

I don't want to leave the past in the past. I want to talk about a factual narrative.

They invested draft picks and FA $$$ into the OL. It didn't bring the success that they thought it would.

Why? Did the scouting department do their job and the war room screwed up? Did the war room do their job right and the coaches screwed up? Did everyone do their job right and the player simply was a bust? Did multiple forays into the FA market bring the desired results? If not, why? What are the issues there?

These are all great questions to talk about. You know what isn't a great question to talk about? Why didn't McNair/Smith invest in the OL.
 
sandman said:
I don't want to leave the past in the past. I want to talk about a factual narrative.

They invested draft picks and FA $$$ into the OL. It didn't bring the success that they thought it would.

Why? Did the scouting department do their job and the war room screwed up? Did the war room do their job right and the coaches screwed up? Did everyone do their job right and the player simply was a bust? Did multiple forays into the FA market bring the desired results? If not, why? What are the issues there?

These are all great questions to talk about. You know what isn't a great question to talk about? Why didn't McNair/Smith invest in the OL.
Click to expand...

Nice long post.

The answer is, once again they didn't invest enough to lure top fa ol here. They needed to do this because they didn't have top draft picks. In short they failed and settled for leftovers which is why the ol looks like it does today. Plus i don't think Devlin is very good at his job either. Time will tell.

Let's move on like the McNair's have and see what Gaine can do with a full compliment of draft picks. But hey, you can choose to live in the past if you wish. There is a new GM in town and we will soon find out if BOB PR Ricky was the issue.
 
sandman said:
I don't want to leave the past in the past. I want to talk about a factual narrative.

They invested draft picks and FA $$$ into the OL. It didn't bring the success that they thought it would.

Why? Did the scouting department do their job and the war room screwed up? Did the war room do their job right and the coaches screwed up? Did everyone do their job right and the player simply was a bust? Did multiple forays into the FA market bring the desired results? If not, why? What are the issues there?

These are all great questions to talk about. You know what isn't a great question to talk about? Why didn't McNair/Smith invest in the OL.
Click to expand...


Great post with some very legitimate questions. But as you can see he will use the same argument. They didn't invest more.
 
Texansballer74 said:
You're wasting your time. He won't ever view the Texans like he does other teams.
Click to expand...

I think he's looking at results. If BO'b was able to field a top 10 offense last season where Watson played 16+ games with league low pressures & sacks, he'd be Rick Smith's biggest fan.

But BO'b couldn't.

It's either fixed or it ain't. We signed three FAs & drafted a guy in the third who can't crack the starting line up of an OL that has given up the most pressure in the league. It Rick's fault of course, but still not fixed.
 
thunderkyss said:
I think he's looking at results. If BO'b was able to field a top 10 offense last season where Watson played 16+ games with league low pressures & sacks, he'd be Rick Smith's biggest fan.

But BO'b couldn't.

It's either fixed or it ain't. We signed three FAs & drafted a guy in the third who can't crack the starting line up of an OL that has given up the most pressure in the league. It Rick's fault of course, but still not fixed.
Click to expand...

Wrong, it ain't fixed because

1. They didn't get the top FA's
2. They didn't have their top draft picks to try to fix the issues
3. They had to settle for a bunch of backups, who've shockingly performed like a bunch of backups.
4. It's Ricky's and McNair's fault DB isn't here. DB said he enjoyed playing for BOB. If DB was here the OL would probably be top 15. BTW, I was on board with letting DB go.
 
thunderkyss said:
I think he's looking at results. If BO'b was able to field a top 10 offense last season where Watson played 16+ games with league low pressures & sacks, he'd be Rick Smith's biggest fan.

But BO'b couldn't.

It's either fixed or it ain't. We signed three FAs & drafted a guy in the third who can't crack the starting line up of an OL that has given up the most pressure in the league. It Rick's fault of course, but still not fixed.
Click to expand...


Lol you tried. That dude just doesn't like Rick at all.
 
sandman said:
I don't want to leave the past in the past. I want to talk about a factual narrative.

They invested draft picks and FA $$$ into the OL. It didn't bring the success that they thought it would.

Why? Did the scouting department do their job and the war room screwed up? Did the war room do their job right and the coaches screwed up? Did everyone do their job right and the player simply was a bust? Did multiple forays into the FA market bring the desired results? If not, why? What are the issues there?

These are all great questions to talk about. You know what isn't a great question to talk about? Why didn't McNair/Smith invest in the OL.
Click to expand...

Simple question....did any of those players go to other teams and become better? If they did, that clears the scouting team b/c those players are still in the NFL. I think the blame for these failures begin and end with coaching and scheme.
 
OptimisticTexan said:
Simple question....did any of those players go to other teams and become better? If they did, that clears the scouting team b/c those players are still in the NFL. I think the blame for these failures begin and end with coaching and scheme.
Click to expand...

And reverse. We've brought in FAs like Allen who played better elsewhere then came to the Texans and played worse. Once again, coaching & scheme.
 
steelbtexan said:
Wrong, it ain't fixed because

1. They didn't get the top FA's
2. They didn't have their top draft picks to try to fix the issues
3. They had to settle for a bunch of backups, who've shockingly performed like a bunch of backups.
4. It's Ricky's and McNair's fault DB isn't here. DB said he enjoyed playing for BOB. If DB was here the OL would probably be top 15. BTW, I was on board with letting DB go.
Click to expand...

Did you DB getting abused last night?
 
sandman said:
There was a point last year where the Texans had three second rounders and one first rounder penciled in on their starting OL. Three were drafted. One was a FA.

The question has never been about did the Texans invest. It has been did they invest correctly.
Click to expand...

Nope nope nope. The question is 'did the Texans make the most of their investments?'. How many positions did XSF play his first 2 years? What's still going on with Mancz? Martin is just a questionmark all around, like is there a bet to see which defensive tackle can drive him furthest? Why can't we make competent free agents competent Texans? We've paid enough for good free agents ... kinda weird that our line has gone from worst ever (on the team with that David Carr commercial), to actually being praised by a few as our escape artist QB gets more comfortable behind max-pro.
 
JB said:
Nope, Allen should never been at RG and X never should have been at LG... Mancz was injured so Martin had to start though he's been a disappointment. No OLman has improved until Lamm in year (4)?
Click to expand...

X should've ONLY been at left guard, Allen shouldn't have been signed (or put on the right side), and Brooks should've been at RG. Brooks wasn't properly diagnosed until his second year in Philly (playing all but 2 games at a very high level the first year), it's entirely possible that his condition continued to manifest similarly here to the point that correct evaluations and remedy were approached in the same timeline. Mancz started for the injured Martin. Lamm is getting praise right now, and he's not close to Derrick Newton level, who is behind Eric Winston ... as bordering decent. Being almost competent can't be worthy of praise. Hell it's why we're riding raw individual talent, Romeo Crennel, and a core still almost entirely created in the Kubiak era (6 years ago) ... and why this is the most active thread in spite of a 6 game win streak.
 
Scooter said:
X should've ONLY been at left guard, Allen shouldn't have been signed (or put on the right side), and Brooks should've been at RG. Brooks wasn't properly diagnosed until his second year in Philly (playing all but 2 games at a very high level the first year), it's entirely possible that his condition continued to manifest similarly here to the point that correct evaluations and remedy were approached in the same timeline. Mancz started for the injured Martin. Lamm is getting praise right now, and he's not close to Derrick Newton level, who is behind Eric Winston ... as bordering decent. Being almost competent can't be worthy of praise. Hell it's why we're riding raw individual talent, Romeo Crennel, and a core still almost entirely created in the Kubiak era (6 years ago) ... and why this is the most active thread in spite of a 6 game win streak.
Click to expand...

He should have been at Only 1 position, but I disagree that LG was the best position for him. We can agree to disagree on Allen... I think he would have excelled at LG as he did in KC. Mancz did start for an injured Martin, but Martin only got the starting gig because Mancz was injured early. Agree on Lamm
 
I meant Allen shouldn't have been put on the right side, and should've been at LG or LT. I wasn't very clear in my post.

XSF was scouted as a left guard and was drafted first in the 2nd round as a left guard, and should've been ONLY a left guard. Many like O'Brien want to make the game more complicated than it is, with the predictable result.
 
Scooter said:
X should've ONLY been at left guard, Allen shouldn't have been signed (or put on the right side), and Brooks should've been at RG. Brooks wasn't properly diagnosed until his second year in Philly (playing all but 2 games at a very high level the first year), it's entirely possible that his condition continued to manifest similarly here to the point that correct evaluations and remedy were approached in the same timeline. Mancz started for the injured Martin. Lamm is getting praise right now, and he's not close to Derrick Newton level, who is behind Eric Winston ... as bordering decent. Being almost competent can't be worthy of praise. Hell it's why we're riding raw individual talent, Romeo Crennel, and a core still almost entirely created in the Kubiak era (6 years ago) ... and why this is the most active thread in spite of a 6 game win streak.
Click to expand...

We know why its the most active thread in here...& that ain't it.
 
sandman said:
There was a point last year where the Texans had three second rounders and one first rounder penciled in on their starting OL. Three were drafted. One was a FA.

The question has never been about did the Texans invest. It has been did they invest correctly.
Click to expand...

I would add did they invest correctly, coached correctly or had a string of bad luck. The narrative for many is that Rick Smith ignored the OL. No matter how ridiculous, Smith is the root cause for everything that ails the Texans.

However, if you look at the investments on the OL, it seems to be more bad luck and coaching than investing correctly.
  • Brooks is misdiagnosed by the medical staff
  • Brown becomes disgruntled with the organization
  • Newton gets juked out of his knee caps
  • Martin is injured his rookie year
  • They signed Allen based on his production as a LG and his production wasn't the same at RG
Mike Munchak is one of the greatest OL coaches in NFL history. To their credit, the Texans did try to sign him and he picked the Steelers over the Texans. With Munchak as the Texan's OL coach, I believe without a doubt many of the OL issues would have been addressed. Also, based on them moving Davenport to RT, starting an unprepared Rankin at LT, cannot figure out how to get Mancz more playing time, rushing an injured Fulton backed onto the field, and ignoring a limping Kelemente, I question the coaching more than the investment.
 
Earl34 said:
I would add did they invest correctly, coached correctly or had a string of bad luck. The narrative for many is that Rick Smith ignored the OL. No matter how ridiculous, Smith is the root cause for everything that ails the Texans.

However, if you look at the investments on the OL, it seems to be more bad luck and coaching than investing correctly.
  • Brooks is misdiagnosed by the medical staff
  • Brown becomes disgruntled with the organization
  • Newton gets juked out of his knee caps
  • Martin is injured his rookie year
  • They signed Allen based on his production as a LG and his production wasn't the same at RG
Mike Munchak is one of the greatest OL coaches in NFL history. To their credit, the Texans did try to sign him and he picked the Steelers over the Texans. With Munchak as the Texan's OL coach, I believe without a doubt many of the OL issues would have been addressed. Also, based on them moving Davenport to RT, starting an unprepared Rankin at LT, cannot figure out how to get Mancz more playing time, rushing an injured Fulton backed onto the field, and ignoring a limping Kelemente, I question the coaching more than the investment.
Click to expand...

Oooof. O'Brien has been here for 4 years he's had plenty of personnel input so it's literally impossible to say he's been dealt a bad hand with a rogue GM and now this new GM will make things all better! Hmm Munch would rather go to Pittsburgh with Tomlin than to work with Obrien. Maybe he saw the lack of talent and said no way? I think Munch would have loved the challenge to come back to Houston and get it done .. I think he just didnt want to work with Obrien.
 
infantrycak said:
And reverse. We've brought in FAs like Allen who played better elsewhere then came to the Texans and played worse. Once again, coaching & scheme.
Click to expand...
Actually, Allen suffered a high ankle sprain [characterized by Texans as a "minor ankle sprain"] in week 1 2017.......missed the next 2 games, and never was given the time to rehab adequately. He essentially played through the entire season with this injury......this along with a hand injury that plagued him through the middle of the season. He sustained a severe concussion in week 14 and was not cleared prior to the end of the season. In May of this season, he was still having problems with the high ankle sprain and was placed on PUP, rehab was not going well and the Texans released him in July with an injury settlement. It wasn't until mid Oct (3 month later that he had fully rehabbed his ankle and was cleared medically, at which time the Chiefs chose to pick him up again.
 
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Scooter said:
X should've ONLY been at left guard, Allen shouldn't have been signed (or put on the right side), and Brooks should've been at RG. Brooks wasn't properly diagnosed until his second year in Philly (playing all but 2 games at a very high level the first year), it's entirely possible that his condition continued to manifest similarly here to the point that correct evaluations and remedy were approached in the same timeline. Mancz started for the injured Martin. Lamm is getting praise right now, and he's not close to Derrick Newton level, who is behind Eric Winston ... as bordering decent. Being almost competent can't be worthy of praise. Hell it's why we're riding raw individual talent, Romeo Crennel, and a core still almost entirely created in the Kubiak era (6 years ago) ... and why this is the most active thread in spite of a 6 game win streak.
Click to expand...

I agree. Except I think Newton was better tackle than Winston. Winston was a better run blocker by far. But his pass blocking was so poor, we had to move on.

& why the heck hasn't Mancz replaced Martin at Center yet? He should have started this year at Center. I'd have started Martin at LG before Kelemente.

But Martin at Center didn't make sense with Mancz on the team.
 
JB said:
Nope, Allen should never been at RG and X never should have been at LG... Mancz was injured so Martin had to start though he's been a disappointment. No OLman has improved until Lamm in year (4)?
Click to expand...


Exactly. That's why most of us are saying coaching.
 
Scooter said:
X should've ONLY been at left guard, Allen shouldn't have been signed (or put on the right side), and Brooks should've been at RG. Brooks wasn't properly diagnosed until his second year in Philly (playing all but 2 games at a very high level the first year), it's entirely possible that his condition continued to manifest similarly here to the point that correct evaluations and remedy were approached in the same timeline. Mancz started for the injured Martin. Lamm is getting praise right now, and he's not close to Derrick Newton level, who is behind Eric Winston ... as bordering decent. Being almost competent can't be worthy of praise. Hell it's why we're riding raw individual talent, Romeo Crennel, and a core still almost entirely created in the Kubiak era (6 years ago) ... and why this is the most active thread in spite of a 6 game win streak.
Click to expand...

Serious question

How does Kubiak's ass taste?
 
Uncle Rico said:
Oooof. O'Brien has been here for 4 years he's had plenty of personnel input so it's literally impossible to say he's been dealt a bad hand with a rogue GM and now this new GM will make things all better! Hmm Munch would rather go to Pittsburgh with Tomlin than to work with Obrien. Maybe he saw the lack of talent and said no way? I think Munch would have loved the challenge to come back to Houston and get it done .. I think he just didnt want to work with Obrien.
Click to expand...

Or he wanted to work with a more talented Steelers Ol to improve his chances of one day becoming a HC, which he became.

BTW, you do realize Manch was born and raised in Pennsylvania and went to Penis St.?
 
CloakNNNdagger said:
Actually, Allen suffered a high ankle sprain [characterized by Texans as a "minor ankle sprain"] in week 1 2017.......missed the next 2 games, and never was given the time to rehab adequately. He essentially played through the entire season with this injury......this along with a hand injury that plagued him through the middle of the season. He sustained a severe concussion in week 14 and was not cleared prior to the end of the season. In May of this season, he was still having problems with the high ankle sprain and was placed on PUP, rehab was not going well and the Texans released him in July with an injury settlement. It wasn't until mid Oct (3 month later that he had fully rehabbed his ankle and was cleared medically, at which time the Chiefs chose to pick him up again.
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Truth

This should help explain some things, but it wont.
 
Texansballer74 said:
Exactly. That's why most of us are saying coaching.
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Giants fans were beside themselves last year when Ben Mcadoo had the audacity to bench Eli b/c his play was so bad. They said all he needed was better protection and a run game & better playcalling. Exactly 1 year later under a new HC, 2 brand new o-linemen and a burgeoning young star at Rb later, Eli still looks like **** and fans are ready to put him out to pasture.

LBJ and Cleveland Cavalier fans got numerous HC coaches fired over the years for what has always been perceived as incompetence & not once did it wind up mattering once the cavaliers got to the finals and played teams that were just better.

last year Doug Marrone was praised by fans and media alike for figuring out how to be successful with Blake Bortles as his qb. This year fans are calling for his head....y? Basically b/c he hasn’t been able to hide Bortles like he did last year when it’s really not his fault the FO decided to re-up with a bad qb instead of drafting or acquiring a potentially better option.

What i’m getting at here is “coaching” is the go to blame for every teams’ fan base when their team/players underperform.....& most times fans are just flat out wrong...it’s almost always the players who just suck.
 
Mr teX said:
What i’m getting at here is “coaching” is the go to blame for every teams’ fan base when their team/players underperform.....& most times fans are just flat out wrong...it’s almost always the players who just suck.
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And some people are coach apologists.
 
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