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FIRE O'BRIEN NOW!!!

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As I recall, the scouting report on Watson was roughly:

- average to weak arm
-spread offense qb who will have trouble adapting to an nfl offense
- great character and team leader
-has ice water in his veins and no stage is to big for him

In the draft, I actually had my eyes on mahomes for the Texans. I'd read the scouting reports on him. I didn't know he'd be great, I just assumed Watson would be long gone by the time we picked and mahomes was projected by many to be there when we picked.

Is throwing someone open actually a thing or is it just anticipation? I feel like it's just gauging speed, leverage, and timing. I think we all know the window for an open reciever is much smaller in the nfl then it is in college. A crossing route might only be open for a half second. Maybe it takes 3 seconds before that opening? Where is the wr in Watson's progression? Does the ol allow that much time?

I think an efficient nfl passing game is infinitely more complex then people realize. What's the hot read in the event of a blitz? Does the same passing play have a route designed to beat man coverage and a route designed to beat zone coverage? Are the progressions or QB reads concrete or flexible based on the defense?


Good questions

As far as scouting reports,I actually read he had inconsistent accuracy but his anticipation was good
 
Rick Smith was at his best only average.

Between him and casserly this franchise has had little chance.


Tricky Rick had his good points and bad …. I just didn't agree (Nor did many others) with the importance , or lack thereof he put on some positions.

He was right when he said you can never have enough good DB's …. but he wasn't talking about DB's , he was talking about Corners. He was content with average talent at the safety spots which led us to another ownership mandate …. Ed Reed. Too bad we got the guy formerly known as Ed Reed and not the real Ed Reed.
 
If the Texans muck around and lose this game, I think I'm gonna hang it up with the Texans until he's gone. I can't take much more of this putrid "offense".
 
We can win out and I'm still holding Bill to the fire because of his 1-3 playoff record with all 3 being blowouts. He's being held to a different standard because of how long he's been here. He's not a 1st round pick with potential or a new HC trying to get his system to be bought in by the players. He's at the point to produce deep playoff runs and win it all. Anything short of that I don't care about at all
 
First, how can you NOT include Watson??? Folks who claim to be "in the know" all say O'Brien wanted Mahomes.

Second,
(and maybe this should be first), who should Smith have drafted that we missed out on from 2007 up until Watson?? And what are they doing now? I recall some folks wanting Teddy Two-Gloves Bridgewater and some wanted Jimmy G. But who else?
Apparently they wanted a QB in the 2013 draft. So their proof that Rick screwed up is that he drafted Hopkins instead of Geno Smith.

I don't think Rick Smith was a good GM, but sadly he is still the best one the Texans have ever had.
 
What interesting is how other coaches can do their jobs despite major injuries. Saints,Colts and KC continue to play well without their QB.

We know obrien would completely fall apart without Watson. Probably won't be able to win without Watt

Except Watt is not the best player on this team anymore.
 
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I noticed you didnt mention O'Brien for clock management?

Clock management OB...

original.jpg
 
I probably watched that one eyed TD like 50 times by now. Deshaun Watson is amazing! O’Brien doesn’t deserve him, and I just hope Cal wakes up and realizes all those amazing plays are ALL Watson! This team needs a competent HC that can utilize Watson to his full potential.
 
OBs body language has been terrible today. Yeah its not going your way but show some poise.

The only real positive that O'Brien supporters can and have leaned on is that he hasn't lost the locker room. Something's been brewing. His body language today was bad. What was more worrying was during the second half I finally told the tv "ISHT!" as Duke came back to the huddle. He wasn't happy with somebody, and that was the moment I felt like something hit a head. I'm 100% in favor of 53 losing patience with O'Brien, BYE! Not in favor of players turning on each other which I worry is one spark away from catching fire.
 
The only real positive that O'Brien supporters can and have leaned on is that he hasn't lost the locker room. Something's been brewing. His body language today was bad. What was more worrying was during the second half I finally told the tv "ISHT!" as Duke came back to the huddle. He wasn't happy with somebody, and that was the moment I felt like something hit a head. I'm 100% in favor of 53 losing patience with O'Brien, BYE! Not in favor of players turning on each other which I worry is one spark away from catching fire.
Where was Coutee today for instance? Unless I missed him on the injury report?

One bad play at the end of the game last week, but you replace him with Carter who made 1 (very) good play but was inneffectual otherwise at a time when you are already missing WFV to injury. Why spite yourself like that?
 
Another successful draft pick

@evansilva: Announcers during #Raiders #Texans said Bill O’Brien told them during the week that Keke Coutee was lacking “consistency,” essentially a kind way of saying Coutee fell into the doghouse.

Coutee played 70% of snaps in Week 7, was benched for DeAndre Carter in Week 8.
 
Where was Coutee today for instance? Unless I missed him on the injury report?

One bad play at the end of the game last week, but you replace him with Carter who made 1 (very) good play but was inneffectual otherwise at a time when you are already missing WFV to injury. Why spite yourself like that?
Have you not caught on to O’Brien’s ineptitude/vindictiveness after 6 years? The dude has some f-kin attitude.
 
Another successful draft pick

@evansilva: Announcers during #Raiders #Texans said Bill O’Brien told them during the week that Keke Coutee was lacking “consistency,” essentially a kind way of saying Coutee fell into the doghouse.

Coutee played 70% of snaps in Week 7, was benched for DeAndre Carter in Week 8.

SMH.

Deshaun Watson is saving so many jobs its not even funny.

I wish Deshuan would come out and say that Bill O'Brien sucks, that would end this whole relationship fairly quick I would think (sad thing is he would never do that).

Even Martinas Rankin is now flourishing in KC after being traded there, he's already starting on their OL! LOL

How anyone can keep excusing and defending these guys is beyond me.
 
West coast teams struggling the farther they travel east is a well known phenomenon.

I would prefer them to have a longer adjustment period.
 
Even Martinas Rankin is now flourishing in KC after being traded there, he's already starting on their OL! LOL

Do you know if he won the job, or was promoted due to injury?

I ask because I thought the same thing about Sua'filo in Dallas. After they got their guy healthy he didn't win a starting spot this season.
 
The only real positive that O'Brien supporters can and have leaned on is that he hasn't lost the locker room. Something's been brewing. His body language today was bad. What was more worrying was during the second half I finally told the tv "ISHT!" as Duke came back to the huddle. He wasn't happy with somebody, and that was the moment I felt like something hit a head. I'm 100% in favor of 53 losing patience with O'Brien, BYE! Not in favor of players turning on each other which I worry is one spark away from catching fire.

Possible, it has to be a frustrating season for them to. I mean look at just us on this board, we won and looking at the mood around here you'd think we lost the damn thing. That's actually really something that worries me about Watt going out is now the locker room won't have his drive and passion pushing them the rest of the season. Watt is the kind of player who's value is greater than even his on field production and now both are gone. On top of that we've got the Jags next week who we barely beat before.

I'm just thankful we have the bye before we square off against the Ravens.
 
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With all the injuries to the Texans, the inconsistency in game planning and game management, and the Astros in the limelight, it is hard to have any mental or emotional investment in the team right now. The only thing holding me there is Watson, Hopkins, and Hyde. Add in Reader and Mercilus as honorable mentions, and that's about it. Makes me sad.
 
With all the injuries to the Texans, the inconsistency in game planning and game management, and the Astros in the limelight, it is hard to have any mental or emotional investment in the team right now. The only thing holding me there is Watson, Hopkins, and Hyde. Add in Reader and Mercilus as honorable mentions, and that's about it. Makes me sad.

Amen

You read about the Astros and how teams fear them and the sad part is there is no reason that the Texans couldn’t be the same way. Hell they could be better because the NFL has a salary cap to keep all teams pretty equal spending wise and you have the tag has a safety net. Granted you don’t have the minor leagues like MLB but you do have every college in the country with a football team.

I don’t think that’s its all on BoB but he’s not really making the changes to fix it. He doesn’t adjust at all or makes any of the coaches adjust. Howard went down and we had a guy that I’m pretty sure was just walking down the street when they asked him if he’d like to play football replace him at RT. What did BoB do, keep game planning just like he did when Howard was there. RAC will do the same thing now that Watt is out, keep calling plays like he was still there.

I do think BoB could win a SB, all it takes is for the team to have no major injuries, make no mistakes and basically for everything to go just like it was planned for all 16 games and then the post season.
 
Do you know if he won the job, or was promoted due to injury?

I ask because I thought the same thing about Sua'filo in Dallas. After they got their guy healthy he didn't win a starting spot this season.
https://www.cbssports.com/fantasy/football/news/chiefs-andrew-wylie-sitting-out-again/
****
Wylie(ankle) has been ruled out for Sunday's game against the Packers, Nate Taylor of The Athletic reports.
The Chiefs will be without their typical line, as both Wylie and starting left tackle Eric Fisher (sports hernia) have been ruled out. Martinas Rankin is expected to fill in at left guard in Wylie's place while Cameron Erving will start at left tackle.
 
Amen

You read about the Astros and how teams fear them and the sad part is there is no reason that the Texans couldn’t be the same way. Hell they could be better because the NFL has a salary cap to keep all teams pretty equal spending wise and you have the tag has a safety net. Granted you don’t have the minor leagues like MLB but you do have every college in the country with a football team.

I don’t think that’s its all on BoB but he’s not really making the changes to fix it. He doesn’t adjust at all or makes any of the coaches adjust. Howard went down and we had a guy that I’m pretty sure was just walking down the street when they asked him if he’d like to play football replace him at RT. What did BoB do, keep game planning just like he did when Howard was there. RAC will do the same thing now that Watt is out, keep calling plays like he was still there.

I do think BoB could win a SB, all it takes is for the team to have no major injuries, make no mistakes and basically for everything to go just like it was planned for all 16 games and then the post season.

It always amazes me How clueless Texans' fans are. When Howard went down, Chris Clark was not the first option. Roderick Johnson was. The only reason Clark was playing is because Johnson got a stinger in the Colts game. They didn't want to play Clark, but had no choice. The other option was the guy signed last week off the Pats' PS. You cannot just run to one side because of a weakness. The other team will notice that. They adjusted game plan with a lot of those option rollouts for quick decisions. However, Clark has to block. Hopefully, Johnson will be back this week.

You say O'Brien and RAC don't adjust? Then why have the Texans have been a much better 2nd half team after halftime?
 
Apparently they wanted a QB in the 2013 draft. So their proof that Rick screwed up is that he drafted Hopkins instead of Geno Smith.

I don't think Rick Smith was a good GM, but sadly he is still the best one the Texans have ever had.


You didn't read the back and forth …

You had a healthy Schaub up until November of 2011. Really there was no dire need to use top draft capital from 07 up to that point , but from 2012 thru 2017 there's a significant need and the only investment made in the position during that time was Tom Savage at #135.. They drafted no other QB's between him and Watson.

Re- No QB's drafted in 15 or 16.

2012 being the first year of need at the position and picking 26th , they didn't have much of a shot at Luck or RG3 and really no one had Wilson on the radar.

2013 was a poor draft for QB needy teams EJ Manuel and Geno Smith - just no talent to be had there.

2014 was the year you had lots of options and the #1 pick which should have been parlayed into multiple picks. Bortles was a solid prospect that just didn't work out , Manziel was crazy but could play football , maybe in a different situation things are different ? Teddy needed seasoning but is a pretty solid QB now , HHWNBMV2.0 - No one wanted to deal with Daddy again but he's been good at times with a very poor team around him , Garoppolo was a good fit

Wasn't much talent in the 2015 draft beyond Winston and Mariota. Maybe take a shot at Hundley

2016 Goff , Wentz , Hackenberg , Brissett , Kessler , Cook , Dak.


They never showed any sense of urgency to fix the most important position in the entirety of professional sports. Never a trade up , never took a flyer on a second tier guy. Just kept recycling guys off the scrap heap. Just a guy will do - that was the philosophy.

You cant find and develop Brady , Wilson or Dak if you don't use some draft capital on them and not doing so when you have a glaring hole at the position for a 5 year period is just silly.

The main point was to show Smith's philosophy on the QB position - Just a guy will do , even if he's on one foot (Schaub extension).

They drafted only 3 QB's in his entire tenure here prior to Watson - 10 years. None higher than #135.
Remind us who started for this team the last three of those years ? …. and explain to us why they didn't at least take a shot at a later round guy instead of doing absolutely nothing when the need was so evident?

And if you read the above post - It shows your statement of drafting a QB in 13 to be totally false (Not Much Talent).


You added absolutely nothing with the above post.
 
SMH.

Deshaun Watson is saving so many jobs its not even funny.

I wish Deshuan would come out and say that Bill O'Brien sucks, that would end this whole relationship fairly quick I would think (sad thing is he would never do that).

Even Martinas Rankin is now flourishing in KC after being traded there, he's already starting on their OL! LOL

How anyone can keep excusing and defending these guys is beyond me.

Rankin is starting because of injury.

You don't like Hyde?

PS Watson ain't Jesusincleats
 
It always amazes me How clueless Texans' fans are. When Howard went down, Chris Clark was not the first option. Roderick Johnson was. The only reason Clark was playing is because Johnson got a stinger in the Colts game. They didn't want to play Clark, but had no choice. The other option was the guy signed last week off the Pats' PS. You cannot just run to one side because of a weakness. The other team will notice that. They adjusted game plan with a lot of those option rollouts for quick decisions. However, Clark has to block. Hopefully, Johnson will be back this week.

You say O'Brien and RAC don't adjust? Then why have the Texans have been a much better 2nd half team after halftime?

And it always amazes me how some posters think they are so much smarter and then turn around and then make such stupid posts. Wow, really the other guys were hurt? I had no clue, if only I had watched the games or read the thread or listened to the announcers or any of the other 300 things that talked about it. No sh!t Sherlock that the other guys were hurt doesn’t mean the guy they had was good and no they didn’t really adjust. They came into that raiders game playing like they came into every other game before.

Also they haven’t been a much better team in the second half. Let’s break it down why don’t we.

Saints: go into the second half with an 11 point lead then give up 27 points

Jags: go in with a 3 point lead and barely slip by with a 1 point win

Chargers: I’ll give you this one, they were much better second half.

Pants: go in trailing by 4 and lose by 6

Falcons: ok I’ll give you this one but it’s debatable, went in trailing by 1 and won but I’m not sure you can say the falcons even had a defense so yeah.

Chiefs: went in leading by 6 and kept it the lead, a well played and well planned game but they weren’t much better second half.

Colts: went in behind and just stayed there.

Raiders: went in behind and would have stayed there if Watson hadn’t of pulled a whole damn rabbit farm out of his hat. Nothing about BoB or RACs plan won that, it was business as usual for them.

So please enlighten me where all these great second half games can be found.
 
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Just like Rick Smith never allowed Kubiak to pick a QB in the 1st rnd once Schaub was damaged goods (as @ Corrosion could historically comment on since he was around then), he never allowed O'Brien to pick his own 1st rnd QB..........the parade of QBs O'Brien played were those that he was left to choose from..............thank you, Sir, may I have another?

You didn't read the back and forth …



The main point was to show Smith's philosophy on the QB position - Just a guy will do , even if he's on one foot (Schaub extension).

They drafted only 3 QB's in his entire tenure here prior to Watson - 10 years. None higher than #135.
Remind us who started for this team the last three of those years ? …. and explain to us why they didn't at least take a shot at a later round guy instead of doing absolutely nothing when the need was so evident?

And if you read the above post - It shows your statement of drafting a QB in 13 to be totally false (Not Much Talent).


You added absolutely nothing with the above post.
Thanks for the personal attack on the poster instead of the post.

Try following the back and forth... 2014 draft was too late for Smith to draft someone for Kubiak. Look at the next QB taken after the Texans picks in 2011 - Ponder, 2012 - Osweiler, 2013 - Geno Smith. I am not going to attack CND for his post, I'll leave it up to you what you choose to do.

But maybe you are right, and the Texans would be better off with Johnny Manziel instead of this Watson guy that tricky Rick drafted.
 
And it always amazes me how some posters think they are so much smarter and then turn around and then make such stupid posts. Wow, really the other guys were hurt? I had no clue, if only I had watched the games or read the thread or listened to the announcers or any of the other 300 things that talked about it. No sh!t Sherlock that the other guys were hurt doesn’t mean the guy they had was good and no they didn’t really adjust. They came into that raiders game playing like they came into every other game before.

Also they haven’t been a much better team in the second half. Let’s break it down why don’t we.

Saints: go into the second half with an 11 point lead then give up 27 points

Jags: go in with a 3 point lead and barely slip by with a 1 point win

Chargers: I’ll give you this one, they were much better second half.

Pants: go in trailing by 4 and lose by 6

Falcons: ok I’ll give you this one but it’s debatable, went in trailing by 1 and won but I’m not sure you can say the falcons even had a defense so yeah.

Chiefs: went in leading by 6 and kept it the lead, a well played and well planned game but they weren’t much better second half.

Colts: went in behind and just stayed there.

Raiders: went in behind and would have stayed there if Watson hadn’t of pulled a whole damn rabbit farm out of his hat. Nothing about BoB or RACs plan won that, it was business as usual for them.

So please enlighten me where all these great second half games can be found.


Yet, you ignored the part where you were wrong about the RT situation. The fact that you didn't know Johnson was the backup RT tells me a lot. Either you don't know the roster or you just wanted to attack BoB.

BTW...just because you lose games, doesn't mean adjustments are not being made. Panthers and Jags game, Watson didn't play well. The other games, there was a NOTICEABLE change in offensive strategy. Also, the defense played better by the 4th quarter.
 
Yet, you ignored the part where you were wrong about the RT situation. The fact that you didn't know Johnson was the backup RT tells me a lot. Either you don't know the roster or you just wanted to attack BoB.

BTW...just because you lose games, doesn't mean adjustments are not being made. Panthers and Jags game, Watson didn't play well. The other games, there was a NOTICEABLE change in offensive strategy. Also, the defense played better by the 4th quarter.

I didn't ignore anything and no I wasn't wrong about the RT situation, the fact that you completely missed the point of my post tells me a lot. By the time the Raiders game rolled around, you know the game I was talking about, they already knew Johnson would not play so the fact that it was a backup to the backup is no excuse. Hell CnD talked about it all week on the injury report so they knew Johnson wouldn't play, or at least they should have, long before game day. I'm not saying they were going to be able to do the same things they could with Howard or Johnson there, in fact that was my whole point that they were trying to do the same things. I know the roster just fine and I've defended BoB more than most, the fact that you make such asinine statements just shows that you just want to defend BoB no matter what.

Finally not sure if you were trying to help your argument with claiming that shows that they have made adjustments but still lost but if that is true then it just means that BoB and RAC are really bad at making adjustments which in some ways is even worse. I agree Pants and Jags games Watson didn't play well but tell me do you not see a problem in the fact that if Watson has a bad game, or even a average game, it means we lose or barely edge out a win? QB is the most important position but on the Texans its the position that decides everything just like it was with Osweiler, Hoyer, Mallet and Savage. Only difference is that Watson is good enough to make it work sometimes.

There was NO noticeable change in offensive strategy, it was the same call plays like you have a pocket passer and all pro Oline that we have always seen. You know the games where we saw a noticeable change, Chargers second half, Falcons, second half if you really want, and Chiefs all three of which I already pointed out. The rest it was crap in the first half and crap in the second just some times the other teams were bigger crap. Finally the defense doesn't play better in the 4th quarter its that other teams start slowing down and trying to kill the clock more because usually they know they can put us away. Hell JJ said himself the defense kept letting Watson down but hey what does he know right.
 
I didn't ignore anything and no I wasn't wrong about the RT situation, the fact that you completely missed the point of my post tells me a lot. By the time the Raiders game rolled around, you know the game I was talking about, they already knew Johnson would not play so the fact that it was a backup to the backup is no excuse. Hell CnD talked about it all week on the injury report so they knew Johnson wouldn't play, or at least they should have, long before game day. I'm not saying they were going to be able to do the same things they could with Howard or Johnson there, in fact that was my whole point that they were trying to do the same things. I know the roster just fine and I've defended BoB more than most, the fact that you make such asinine statements just shows that you just want to defend BoB no matter what.

Finally not sure if you were trying to help your argument with claiming that shows that they have made adjustments but still lost but if that is true then it just means that BoB and RAC are really bad at making adjustments which in some ways is even worse. I agree Pants and Jags games Watson didn't play well but tell me do you not see a problem in the fact that if Watson has a bad game, or even a average game, it means we lose or barely edge out a win? QB is the most important position but on the Texans its the position that decides everything just like it was with Osweiler, Hoyer, Mallet and Savage. Only difference is that Watson is good enough to make it work sometimes.

There was NO noticeable change in offensive strategy, it was the same call plays like you have a pocket passer and all pro Oline that we have always seen. You know the games where we saw a noticeable change, Chargers second half, Falcons, second half if you really want, and Chiefs all three of which I already pointed out. The rest it was crap in the first half and crap in the second just some times the other teams were bigger crap. Finally the defense doesn't play better in the 4th quarter its that other teams start slowing down and trying to kill the clock more because usually they know they can put us away. Hell JJ said himself the defense kept letting Watson down but hey what does he know right.

The bolded is the case for every team in the league....except probably the Pats.

Every offense has a lynchpin man & Just b/c you lose the game or the offense/defense keeps getting beat doesn't mean adjustments aren't/weren't made man. You're also not going to radically change your playbook & how you call games from half to half or game to game...that's not how adjustments work. Adjustments at half are more just tweeks to how to effectively run a plays that you always run. Offensive strategy doesn't change much for the most part either. Kubiak's scheme was heavily dependent on the establishing the run game and coming back with the play action boot. When Foster got bottled up in the 1st halves of games, Kubiak didn't come back in the 2nd half & completely abandon the run by doing 5-7 step drop backs with Schaub without the play action. He continued to try to run Foster b/c he expected the subtle adjustments that were made to o-line blocking calls and technique would eventually open things up for Foster to get loose.......& then he could go back to his play action boot game with Schaub.
 
I'd love to know how many times we ran off RT compared to LT before Sunday compared to the numbers we ran Sunday. Seemed to me we tried to make it a point to run off Clark. Even when he moved to LT we saw more runs to the left.

May be just my perception.
 
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